Y Cyfarfod Llawn

Plenary

23/03/2022

Yn y fersiwn ddwyieithog, mae’r golofn chwith yn cynnwys yr iaith a lefarwyd yn y cyfarfod. Mae’r golofn dde yn cynnwys cyfieithiad o’r areithiau hynny.

In the bilingual version, the left-hand column includes the language used during the meeting. The right-hand column includes a translation of those speeches.

Cyfarfu'r Senedd yn y Siambr a thrwy gynhadledd fideo am 13:30 gyda'r Dirprwy Lywydd (David Rees) yn y Gadair. 

The Senedd met in the Chamber and by video-conference at 13:30 with the Deputy Presiding Officer (David Rees) in the Chair.

Datganiad gan y Dirprwy Lywydd
Statement by the Deputy Presiding Officer

Prynhawn da. Croeso, bawb, i'r Cyfarfod Llawn. Cyn i ni ddechrau, hoffwn nodi ychydig o bwyntiau. Cynhelir y cyfarfod hwn ar ffurf hybrid, gyda rhai Aelodau yn y Siambr ac eraill yn ymuno trwy gyswllt fideo. Bydd yr holl Aelodau sy'n cymryd rhan yn nhrafodion y Senedd, ble bynnag y bônt, yn cael eu trin yn gyfartal. Mae Cyfarfod Llawn a gynhelir drwy gynhadledd fideo, yn unol â Rheolau Sefydlog Senedd Cymru, yn gyfystyr â thrafodion y Senedd at ddibenion Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006. Bydd rhai o ddarpariaethau Rheol Sefydlog 34 yn gymwys ar gyfer Cyfarfod Llawn heddiw, ac mae'r rheini wedi eu nodi ar yr agenda.

Byddwn yn atgoffa'r holl Aelodau i sicrhau bod eu cwestiynau'n gryno ac o fewn amser, os gwelwch yn dda, ac i Weinidogion hefyd roi atebion cryno. 

Good afternoon and welcome to this Plenary session. Before we begin, I want to set out a few points. This meeting will be held in hybrid format, with some Members in the Chamber and others joining by video-conference. All Members participating in proceedings of the Senedd, wherever they may be, will be treated equally. A Plenary meeting held using video-conference, in accordance with the Standing Orders of the Welsh Parliament, constitutes Senedd proceedings for the purposes of the Government of Wales Act 2006. Some of the provisions of Standing Order 34 will apply for today's Plenary meeting, and these are set out on the agenda.

I would remind all Members to ensure that their questions are succinct and within time, please, and would urge Ministers to also give succinct answers. 

1. Cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi
1. Questions to the Minister for Economy

Yn gyntaf y prynhawn yma mae cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi, ac mae cwestiwn 1 gan Joyce Watson.

First this afternoon we have questions to the Minister for Economy, and the first question is from Joyce Watson.

Cyfleoedd Cyflogaeth i Bobl Anabl
Employment Opportunities for Disabled People

1. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i helpu i wella cyfleoedd cyflogaeth i bobl anabl? OQ57834

1. What is the Welsh Government doing to help improve employment opportunities for disabled people? OQ57834

Thank you for the question. We continue to take a range of measures to help improve economic opportunities for disabled people. That includes the establishment, in 2020, of a Welsh Government network of disabled people's employment champions to engage with employers to encourage the further employment of disabled people. 

Diolch am eich cwestiwn. Rydym yn parhau i gymryd ystod o gamau i helpu i wella cyfleoedd economaidd i bobl anabl. Mae hynny’n cynnwys sefydlu, yn 2020, rhwydwaith Llywodraeth Cymru o hyrwyddwyr cyflogaeth pobl anabl i ymgysylltu â chyflogwyr i hyrwyddo cyflogaeth i bobl anabl.

I thank you for your answer and I very much welcome the Welsh Government's employer incentive scheme for disabled apprentices. It's well documented that the employment rate of disabled people is much lower when compared to non-disabled people. Figures up until March 2020 showed that the employment rate for disabled people was 50 per cent, compared to 81 per cent for non-disabled people. It's absolutely crucial that, as a Government, everything is done that can be done to bridge that gap and tackle the inequality. Minister, I'm keen to know how you're advertising this scheme and where potential employers can find out about it. Also, is the Welsh Government encouraging employers to link up with organisations, like Leonard Cheshire Disability, which have a long and successful track record of helping disabled people find work?

Diolch am eich ateb, ac rwy'n croesawu cynllun cymhellion Llywodraeth Cymru i gyflogwyr ar gyfer prentisiaid anabl yn fawr. Ceir cryn dipyn o dystiolaeth fod cyfradd cyflogaeth pobl anabl yn llawer is o gymharu â phobl nad ydynt yn anabl. Mae ffigurau hyd at fis Mawrth 2020 yn dangos bod cyfradd gyflogaeth pobl anabl yn 50 y cant, o gymharu ag 81 y cant o bobl nad ydynt yn anabl. Mae'n gwbl hanfodol, fel Llywodraeth, y gwneir popeth y gellir ei wneud i gau'r bwlch hwnnw ac i fynd i'r afael â'r anghydraddoldeb. Weinidog, rwy’n awyddus i wybod sut yr ewch ati i hysbysebu’r cynllun hwn a lle y gall darpar gyflogwyr ddod i wybod amdano. Hefyd, a yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn annog cyflogwyr i gysylltu â sefydliadau, fel Leonard Cheshire Disability, elusen ag iddi hanes hir a llwyddiannus o helpu pobl anabl i ddod o hyd i waith?

Thank you for the question. You're right to point out the significant difference in economic outcomes for disabled people and people who don't have a disability. That's part of the reason why we shifted so much of our employability and skills plans to try to make sure that we helped people furthest from the labour market, including significant numbers of disabled people.

As to the service we broadly provide, we make sure that's advertised through a network of disabled people's organisations and employability providers, and the first port of call for anybody looking for help and support is the Business Wales service. It's a one-stop-shop. There is no wrong door—if you go to Business Wales, they will help you to find where that support is available. And Leonard Cheshire, which you mentioned specifically, are a member of our disabled people's employment working group. They help us with advice and guidance on emerging issues and priorities, and it's really important to listen to and to work with an organisation like Leonard Cheshire, which can not only tell us about their work, but the lived experience of people and whether we're really making the difference we want to.

Diolch am eich cwestiwn. Rydych yn llygad eich lle yn tynnu sylw at y gwahaniaeth sylweddol yn y canlyniadau economaidd i bobl anabl a phobl nad oes ganddynt anabledd. Dyna ran o'r rheswm pam y gwnaethom symud cymaint o'n cynlluniau cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau i geisio sicrhau ein bod yn helpu'r bobl sydd bellaf oddi wrth y farchnad lafur, gan gynnwys niferoedd sylweddol o bobl anabl.

Ar y gwasanaeth cyffredinol a ddarparwn, rydym yn sicrhau ei fod yn cael ei hysbysebu drwy rwydwaith o sefydliadau pobl anabl a darparwyr cyflogadwyedd, a'r man cyswllt cyntaf i unrhyw un sy'n chwilio am gymorth a chefnogaeth yw gwasanaeth Busnes Cymru. Mae'n siop un stop. Nid oes drws anghywir—os ewch at Busnes Cymru, byddant yn eich helpu i ddod o hyd i lle mae’r cymorth hwnnw ar gael. Ac mae Leonard Cheshire, a grybwyllwyd yn benodol gennych, yn aelod o'n gweithgor cyflogaeth pobl anabl. Maent yn ein cynorthwyo gyda chyngor ac arweiniad ar faterion a blaenoriaethau sy'n codi, ac mae'n bwysig iawn gwrando ar sefydliad fel Leonard Cheshire, a gweithio gyda hwy, gan eu bod yn gallu dweud wrthym am eu gwaith, a hefyd am brofiadau bywyd pobl ac a ydym o ddifrif yn gwneud y gwahaniaeth yr ydym eisiau ei wneud.

I recently had the opportunity to visit Carmarthenshire People First—a fantastic independent charity that's taking a leading role in supporting adults with learning disabilities by providing independent advocacy, training and support to individuals who need it. The charity is led by a fabulous team of dedicated and passionate staff, spearheaded by Sarah Mackintosh, the charity's manager. Time and time again, Sarah and her team have gone above and beyond the call of duty to offer support to those who need it, especially during the darkest times of the pandemic. Whether it's organising walks along the River Towy, bingo nights in their headquarters, or delivering winter well-being packages, they do brilliant things and I'm pleased to champion them in the Senedd today. But given this brilliant work that Carmarthenshire People First do, can the Minister outline what financial support is available to this charity and others to ensure they can continue to support individuals with learning disabilities with employment opportunities? Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd.

Yn ddiweddar, cefais gyfle i ymweld â Pobl yn Gyntaf sir Gaerfyrddin—elusen annibynnol wych sydd wedi chwarae rhan flaenllaw yn y gwaith o gefnogi oedolion ag anableddau dysgu drwy ddarparu hyfforddiant, cymorth ac eiriolaeth annibynnol i unigolion sydd eu hangen. Arweinir yr elusen gan dîm gwych o staff ymroddedig ac angerddol, dan arweiniad Sarah Mackintosh, rheolwr yr elusen. Dro ar ôl tro, mae Sarah a'i thîm wedi mynd y tu hwnt i'r galw i gynnig cymorth i'r rheini sydd ei angen, yn enwedig yn ystod cyfnodau tywyllaf y pandemig. Boed yn drefnu teithiau cerdded ar hyd afon Tywi, nosweithiau bingo yn eu pencadlys, neu ddosbarthu pecynnau llesiant dros y gaeaf, maent yn gwneud pethau gwych ac rwy’n falch o’u hyrwyddo yn y Senedd heddiw. Ond o ystyried y gwaith gwych y mae Pobl yn Gyntaf sir Gaerfyrddin yn ei wneud, a wnaiff y Gweinidog amlinellu pa gymorth ariannol sydd ar gael i’r elusen hon ac eraill i sicrhau y gallant barhau i gynorthwyo unigolion ag anableddau dysgu gyda chyfleoedd cyflogaeth? Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd.

Thank you for the question and for highlighting the work that People First do, not just in Carmarthen, but in other parts of the country. I have done work in my constituency role with Cardiff People First and, again, it's an organisation that actually has disabled people making their own choices and fronting a lot that the organisations do. So, I've had a very positive experience in seeing the difference they can make with and for disabled people.

Part of the challenge goes back to my response to Joyce Watson and about how, from a Business Wales point of view, to help people if they're looking for that experience, and there's a range of different areas where people can look for individual support. The challenge always is the resource we have directly available and the resource that other organisations have available too, whether local authorities or others. If People First are looking at a particular issue within Carmarthenshire, then I'd be more than pleased to receive correspondence and make sure that the right organisation, or the right part of Government, responds to you.

Diolch am eich cwestiwn ac am dynnu sylw at y gwaith y mae Pobl yn Gyntaf yn ei wneud, nid yn unig yng Nghaerfyrddin, ond mewn rhannau eraill o’r wlad. Rwyf wedi gwneud gwaith yn fy rôl etholaethol gyda Pobl yn Gyntaf Caerdydd, ac unwaith eto, mae'n sefydliad lle mae pobl anabl o ddifrif yn gwneud eu dewisiadau eu hunain ac yn arwain llawer o'r hyn y mae'r sefydliadau yn ei wneud. Felly, rwyf wedi cael profiad cadarnhaol iawn o weld y gwahaniaeth y gallant ei wneud gyda phobl anabl ac ar eu cyfer.

Mae rhan o’r her yn ymwneud â fy ymateb i Joyce Watson ac o safbwynt Busnes Cymru, sut i gynorthwyo pobl os ydynt yn chwilio am y profiad hwnnw, a cheir ystod o wahanol feysydd lle y gall pobl chwilio am gymorth unigol. Yr her bob amser yw'r adnoddau sydd gennym ar gael yn uniongyrchol a'r adnoddau sydd ar gael gan sefydliadau eraill hefyd, boed yn awdurdodau lleol neu'n eraill. Os yw Pobl yn Gyntaf yn edrych ar fater penodol yn sir Gaerfyrddin, byddwn yn fwy na pharod i dderbyn gohebiaeth a sicrhau bod y sefydliad cywir, neu’r rhan gywir o Lywodraeth, yn ymateb i chi.

13:35
Gorsaf Bŵer Aberddawan
Aberthaw Power Station

2. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cael gyda phrifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd ynghylch prynu gorsaf bŵer Aberddawan? OQ57832

2. What discussions has the Minister had with Cardiff capital region regarding its purchase of Aberthaw power station? OQ57832

Yes. I have discussed the recent purchase of Aberthaw with a number of members of the Cardiff capital region board. My officials continue to maintain a dialogue with the capital region on this and other matters as we look to exploit the potential for renewable energy in particular.

Iawn. Rwyf wedi trafod prynu Aberddawan yn ddiweddar gyda nifer o aelodau bwrdd prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd. Mae fy swyddogion yn parhau i gynnal trafodaethau gyda’r brifddinas-ranbarth ynglŷn â hyn a materion eraill wrth inni geisio manteisio ar y potensial ar gyfer ynni adnewyddadwy yn enwedig.

Thank you, Minister, for that answer. Obviously, this wasn't part of the original business plan, this purchase of Aberthaw power station, and the plans that have come forward are dynamic, in fairness, with the potential of 5,000 jobs to be created over the medium to long term. In your discussions, have you been assessing how much demand might be placed on Welsh Government resources—additional demand on Welsh Government resources—to allow the plans to come to fruition that would see the creation of these 5,000 jobs and the potential to develop green energy projects there? Because there's a lot of remediation work to go on on the site, but there'll be additional resource issues, I would suggest, about bringing new investment as well.

Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog. Yn amlwg, nid oedd hyn yn rhan o’r cynllun busnes gwreiddiol, prynu gorsaf bŵer Aberddawan, ac mae’r cynlluniau a gyflwynwyd yn ddeinamig, a bod yn deg, gyda photensial i greu 5,000 o swyddi yn y tymor canolig i’r tymor hir. Yn eich trafodaethau, a ydych wedi asesu faint o alw a allai fod ar adnoddau Llywodraeth Cymru—galw ychwanegol ar adnoddau Llywodraeth Cymru—i alluogi i'r cynlluniau ddwyn ffrwyth a fyddai’n arwain at greu’r 5,000 o swyddi hyn a’r potensial i ddatblygu prosiectau ynni gwyrdd yno? Oherwydd mae llawer o waith adfer i'w wneud ar y safle, ond byddwn yn awgrymu y bydd problemau ychwanegol gydag adnoddau mewn perthynas â denu buddsoddiad newydd hefyd.

So, this is part of where I think, actually—. There are areas where there's disagreement between the Welsh and the UK Governments, and, actually, the city deals and the regional deals that are taking place are an example of where we can work together. Of course, there's a wider investment fund, where the UK Government provided funds, as indeed have local authorities. The conversations my officials are having are exactly on the points that you raise—what's the potential, how close are we from potential, and the larger and the longer term investment opportunities being realised as to what we do now, and will there be a call on Welsh Government resources, and, if so, in what space. So, there isn't a finalised answer to the point you make, but that's exactly why conversations are taking place. And we're in a good place, with positive relationships with each of our economic regions—the four regions that are taking part, with their regional economic frameworks. And I'm hoping that we can make not just outline promises of what might be, but come with rather more practical measures to realise the significant and positive jobs impact this could have.

Felly, mae hyn yn rhan o lle rwy'n credu, mewn gwirionedd—. Ceir meysydd y mae Llywodraeth Cymru a Llywodraeth y DU yn anghytuno yn eu cylch, ac a dweud y gwir, mae’r bargeinion dinesig a’r bargeinion rhanbarthol yn enghraifft o lle y gallwn weithio gyda’n gilydd. Wrth gwrs, ceir cronfa fuddsoddi ehangach, lle mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi darparu arian, fel y gwnaeth yr awdurdodau lleol yn wir. Mae'r sgyrsiau y mae fy swyddogion yn eu cael yn ymwneud â'r union bwyntiau a godwch—beth yw'r potensial, pa mor agos ydym ni at botensial, a'r cyfleoedd buddsoddi mwy, a mwy hirdymor, sy'n cael eu gwireddu o ran yr hyn a wnawn ar hyn o bryd, ac a fydd galw am adnoddau Llywodraeth Cymru, ac os felly, ym mha ffordd. Felly, nid oes ateb terfynol i'r pwynt a wnewch, ond dyna'n union pam fod sgyrsiau'n cael eu cynnal. Ac rydym mewn lle da, gyda pherthynas gadarnhaol â phob un o'n rhanbarthau economaidd—y pedwar rhanbarth sy'n cymryd rhan, gyda'u fframweithiau economaidd. Ac rwy'n gobeithio y gallwn wneud addewidion amlinellol ynglŷn â'r hyn a allai fod, a hefyd y gallwn ddarparu mesurau ychydig yn fwy ymarferol i wireddu'r effaith sylweddol a chadarnhaol y gallai hyn ei chael o ran swyddi.

Cwestiynau Heb Rybudd gan Lefarwyr y Pleidiau
Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

Galwaf yn awr ar lefarwyr y pleidiau i holi'r Gweinidog. Yn gyntaf, llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Paul Davies.

I now call on the party spokespeople to question the Minister. First of all, the Welsh Conservatives' spokesperson, Paul Davies.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Minister, yesterday, I raised with you the Cardiff capital region brochure that boasted of relatively low rates of pay, and describes Cardiff as having lower graduate salaries than Birmingham, London, Edinburgh and Glasgow. Unsurprisingly, Cardiff capital region's approach has been labelled a destructive strategy that would push away young talent in south-east Wales by Nerys Lloyd-Pierce, chair of Cardiff Civic Society. And TUC general secretary, Shavanah Taj, has said that this is a depressing and divisive approach that risks locking in a low-wage economy for the many communities the Cardiff capital region represents. Minister, given that you have previously said that you don't have to get out to get on in Wales, can you tell us how the Cardiff capital region's marketing strategy works alongside the Welsh Government's approach for graduate retention?

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Weinidog, ddoe, codais fater taflen wybodaeth prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd gyda chi, sy'n brolio am gyfraddau cyflog cymharol isel, ac sy'n disgrifio Caerdydd fel man lle mae cyflogau graddedigion yn is nag yn Birmingham, Llundain, Caeredin neu Glasgow. Nid yw’n syndod fod Nerys Lloyd-Pierce, cadeirydd Cymdeithas Ddinesig Caerdydd, wedi labelu ymagwedd prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd fel strategaeth ddinistriol a fyddai’n gwthio talent ifanc ymaith yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru. Ac mae ysgrifennydd cyffredinol Cyngres Undebau Llafur Cymru, Shavanah Taj, wedi dweud bod hon yn ymagwedd ddigalon a chynhennus sy'n creu perygl o gaethiwo nifer o'r cymunedau ym mhrifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd mewn economi cyflogau isel. Weinidog, o gofio eich bod wedi dweud o’r blaen nad oes yn rhaid ichi adael Cymru er mwyn llwyddo, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym sut y mae strategaeth farchnata prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn gweithio ochr yn ochr â dull Llywodraeth Cymru o gadw graddedigion?

Well, I don't think it's fair to say that the capital region is looking to lock in depressed graduate salaries. Actually, the ambition of the capital region, which is made up, as you know, of a partnership between 10 local authorities, of differing political leaderships, and the UK and Welsh Governments, is to lever in and engineer further growth, improved productivity, and actually raise wages right across the region. That's why there are conversations about what can take place within the capital, as well as what takes place outside of Cardiff—whether it's at Aberthaw or whether it's in what we want to see in terms of improving economic performance and outcomes for people in the Valleys as well. So, this is really about wanting to raise the bar and see further growth and improvement in wages, including for graduates.

Wel, ni chredaf ei bod yn deg dweud bod y brifddinas-ranbarth yn ceisio cadw cyflogau graddedigion yn isel. Mewn gwirionedd, uchelgais y brifddinas-ranbarth, sy’n cynnwys partneriaeth rhwng 10 awdurdod lleol, fel y gwyddoch, a chanddynt arweinwyr o wahanol bleidiau gwleidyddol, a Llywodraeth y DU a Llywodraeth Cymru, yw ysgogi a sicrhau twf pellach, gwella cynhyrchiant, a chodi cyflogau ar draws y rhanbarth. Dyna pam y ceir y sgyrsiau hyn ynglŷn â beth a all ddigwydd yn y brifddinas, yn ogystal â’r hyn sy’n digwydd y tu allan i Gaerdydd—boed yn Aberddawan neu o ran yr hyn y dymunwn ei weld i wella perfformiad economaidd a chanlyniadau i bobl y Cymoedd hefyd. Felly, mae hyn yn ymwneud mewn gwirionedd â cheisio codi'r safon a sicrhau cynnydd a gwelliant pellach mewn cyflogau, gan gynnwys i raddedigion.

Well, I hope you'll condemn this brochure, Minister, because it's vital that Wales is not marketed to external investors as a low-wage economy, and this language certainly does nothing to retain graduates who feel that they do have to get out of Wales to get on in life. Now, of course, it's crucial that, as we develop the Welsh economy post pandemic, the Welsh Government harnesses the unique skills and sectors associated with local areas. And one way to do that is through enterprise zones. It's vital that the enterprise zones align with the priorities agreed in the regional economic frameworks that have recently been published, and it's important we see real outcomes and value for money from the enterprise zones. Minister, I understand that enterprise zones have been through a period of extensive review, which has been informed by discussions with key stakeholders, and which builds on the earlier review undertaken in 2018, according to a recent written statement that you have issued. Can you therefore tell us what the outcomes of that review have been, and can you also confirm today how you're ensuring that each of the enterprise zones is delivering value for money for the Welsh taxpayer?

Wel, rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch yn condemnio’r daflen wybodaeth hon, Weinidog, gan ei bod yn hollbwysig nad yw Cymru’n cael ei marchnata i fuddsoddwyr allanol fel economi cyflogau isel, ac yn sicr, nid yw’r iaith hon yn gwneud unrhyw beth i gadw graddedigion sy’n teimlo bod yn rhaid iddynt adael Cymru er mwyn llwyddo mewn bywyd. Nawr, wrth gwrs, wrth inni ddatblygu economi Cymru ar ôl y pandemig, mae'n hollbwysig fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn harneisio'r sgiliau unigryw a'r sectorau sy'n gysylltiedig ag ardaloedd lleol. Ac un ffordd o wneud hynny yw drwy ardaloedd menter. Mae'n hanfodol fod yr ardaloedd menter wedi'u halinio â'r blaenoriaethau y cytunwyd arnynt yn y fframweithiau economaidd rhanbarthol a gyhoeddwyd yn ddiweddar, ac mae'n bwysig ein bod yn gweld canlyniadau gwirioneddol a gwerth am arian drwy'r ardaloedd menter. Weinidog, deallaf fod ardaloedd menter wedi bod drwy gyfnod o adolygu helaeth wedi’i lywio gan drafodaethau gyda rhanddeiliaid allweddol, ac yn adeiladu ar yr adolygiad cynharach a gynhaliwyd yn 2018, yn ôl datganiad ysgrifenedig diweddar a gyhoeddwyd gennych. A wnewch chi ddweud wrthym, felly, beth yw canlyniadau’r adolygiad hwnnw, ac a wnewch chi gadarnhau heddiw hefyd sut yr ydych yn sicrhau bod pob un o’r ardaloedd menter yn darparu gwerth am arian i drethdalwyr Cymru?

13:40

Well, you're right to say that our enterprise zones strategy needs to make sure that it's aligned with the broader work we're undertaking with partners. And I think, actually, it's a real strength that we're able to have a joint conversation, where the Welsh Government and local authorities in those regional groups and business organisations have a single voice, and it's interesting that that unified and cohesive offer is something that a number of people find attractive, for growth within the UK as well as the potential for inward investment. 

The three enterprise zones that are continuing, based around the three potential port areas of Neath Port Talbot, around Pembrokeshire and, indeed, in north Wales around Holyhead, all have potentially different missions that could all be complementary, and are certainly complementary with the aspirations of each of the regional economic frameworks. And that's how we're looking to make sure we have a complementary approach, rather than a competitive or competing or contradictory approach between what the enterprise zones are doing and their line of sight with those regions. I can provide the Member with extra assurance because I met the three chairs of the enterprise zones that are continuing, and this was part of the discussion that we had. 

Wel, rydych chi'n iawn i ddweud bod angen i'n strategaeth ardaloedd menter sicrhau ei bod yn cyd-fynd â'r gwaith ehangach a wnawn gyda phartneriaid. A dweud y gwir, credaf mai cryfder yw'r ffaith y gallwn gynnal sgwrs ar y cyd, lle mae gan Lywodraeth Cymru ac awdurdodau lleol yn y grwpiau rhanbarthol a'r sefydliadau busnes hynny un llais, ac mae'n ddiddorol fod y cynnig unedig a chydlynol hwnnw'n rhywbeth deniadol iawn i nifer o bobl, ar gyfer twf o fewn y DU yn ogystal â’r potensial mewnfuddsoddi.

Mae'r tair ardal fenter sy’n parhau, sy’n seiliedig ar dair ardal borthladd bosibl yng Nghastell-nedd Port Talbot, o amgylch sir Benfro, ac yn wir, yn y gogledd o amgylch Caergybi, yn meddu ar dair cenhadaeth wahanol a allai ategu ei gilydd, ac maent yn sicr yn ategu'r dyheadau a geir ym mhob un o’r fframweithiau economaidd rhanbarthol. A dyna sut y bwriadwn sicrhau bod gennym ddull cydategol o weithredu, yn hytrach na dull cystadleuol neu wrthgyferbyniol rhwng yr hyn y mae'r ardaloedd menter yn ei wneud a'u dyheadau yn y rhanbarthau hynny. Gallaf roi sicrwydd ychwanegol i’r Aelod, gan imi gyfarfod â thri chadeirydd yr ardaloedd menter sy’n parhau, ac roedd hyn yn rhan o’r drafodaeth a gawsom.

Of course, Minister, it's vital that the enterprise zones, the Cardiff capital region, the regional skills partnerships and other key forums are working together effectively, and that we can see clear outcomes and value for money from them. The Welsh Government's regional economic frameworks are important in developing place-based approaches to economic development, and marketing the distinctive benefits of each of our regions. Of course, it's vital that we can see how these frameworks are not only improving prosperity in each region, but also how they are tackling some of the deep structural issues that have plagued some communities in Wales for far too long. Therefore, Minister, can you tell us what key performance indicators will be used to rate how effective the regional economic frameworks are in practice? Can you also tell us how you will ensure that these frameworks do not result in further bureaucracy and duplication, and will you also commit to providing an annual update on the outcomes of each of these frameworks so Members can determine their effectiveness?

Wrth gwrs, Weinidog, mae’n hanfodol fod yr ardaloedd menter, prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd, y partneriaethau sgiliau rhanbarthol a fforymau allweddol eraill yn cydweithio’n effeithiol, ac y gallwn weld canlyniadau clir a gwerth am arian yn deillio ohonynt. Mae fframweithiau economaidd rhanbarthol Llywodraeth Cymru yn bwysig ar gyfer datblygu dulliau datblygu economaidd sy’n seiliedig ar leoedd, a marchnata manteision unigryw pob un o’n rhanbarthau. Wrth gwrs, mae'n hanfodol ein bod yn gallu gweld sut y mae'r fframweithiau hyn nid yn unig yn gwella ffyniant ym mhob rhanbarth, ond hefyd, sut y maent yn mynd i'r afael â rhai o'r materion strwythurol dwfn sydd wedi bod yn bla ar rai cymunedau yng Nghymru ers llawer gormod o amser. Felly, Weinidog, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym pa ddangosyddion perfformiad allweddol a gaiff eu defnyddio i nodi pa mor effeithiol yw’r fframweithiau economaidd rhanbarthol yn ymarferol? A wnewch chi ddweud wrthym hefyd sut y byddwch yn sicrhau nad yw’r fframweithiau hyn yn arwain at fiwrocratiaeth a dyblygu pellach, ac a wnewch chi ymrwymo hefyd i ddarparu diweddariad blynyddol ar ganlyniadau pob un o’r fframweithiau hyn, er mwyn i’r Aelodau allu pennu eu heffeithiolrwydd?

Well, the regional economic frameworks actually set out how partners are going to work together and the priorities for investment in improvement in those regions. And they're not imposed by Welsh Government—far from it. It's joint work that's been undertaken between those economic regions, between the different partnerships that exist together in Wales, and, in each of them, there's been a different level of political leadership in each region with local authorities, but they've all recognised they can gain more by working together and having a sense of priorities. And the regional skills partnerships on the same footprint are helping to do that in a way that I think is consistent and adds value to each other. 

For each of the regions, you'll be able to see not just the areas of priority, but whether we are making progress in each of those areas as we go through each year. I'm not sure that a report from me annually is necessarily the right way to go, but I do think it would be helpful, between the Welsh Government and each of those economic regions, to be able to provide an update on a basis that would be shared, because this is the part of the challenge, isn't it—there's often a demand that the Minister does everything, and, in this area, we recognise we have to work alongside local authorities and the powers that they have, and it's actually about the Welsh Government not simply directing everything in this area, but working in a much more cohesive and effective partnership. I'd be more than happy to discuss with each of those regions how we provide a regular update so that the people that local authorities are accountable to, which is obviously a subject on everyone's mind given the elections at the start of May, together with the Government, know what we are doing together to improve economic fortunes and to make sure you can see the sort of progress that we are making. 

Wel, mae’r fframweithiau economaidd rhanbarthol yn nodi sut y mae'r partneriaid yn mynd i gydweithio a’r blaenoriaethau ar gyfer buddsoddi mewn gwelliannau yn y rhanbarthau hynny. Ac ni chânt eu gorfodi gan Lywodraeth Cymru—ddim o gwbl. Mae’n waith ar y cyd a wnaed rhwng y rhanbarthau economaidd hynny, rhwng y gwahanol bartneriaethau sy’n bodoli gyda’i gilydd yng Nghymru, ac ym mhob un ohonynt, cafwyd lefel wahanol o arweinyddiaeth wleidyddol ym mhob rhanbarth gydag awdurdodau lleol, ond mae pob un ohonynt wedi cydnabod y gallant elwa mwy drwy gydweithio a thrwy gael syniad o flaenoriaethau. Ac mae’r partneriaethau sgiliau rhanbarthol yn yr un ardaloedd yn helpu i wneud hynny mewn ffordd sy’n gyson yn fy marn i, ac sy’n ychwanegu gwerth ar y ddwy ochr.

Ar gyfer pob un o'r rhanbarthau, byddwch yn gallu gweld nid yn unig y meysydd blaenoriaeth, ond i ba raddau y gwnawn gynnydd ym mhob un o'r meysydd hynny wrth inni fynd drwy bob blwyddyn. Nid wyf yn siŵr mai adroddiad blynyddol gennyf fi yw’r ffordd gywir o'i wneud o reidrwydd, ond rhwng Llywodraeth Cymru a phob un o’r rhanbarthau economaidd hynny, credaf y byddai’n ddefnyddiol gallu rhoi’r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf ar sail y gellid ei rhannu, gan fod hyn yn rhan o'r her, onid yw—yn aml, mae galw ar y Gweinidog i wneud popeth, ac yn y maes hwn, rydym yn cydnabod bod yn rhaid inni weithio ochr yn ochr ag awdurdodau lleol a'r pwerau sydd ganddynt, ac mewn gwirionedd, mae a wnelo â Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio mewn partneriaeth fwy cydlynol ac effeithiol yn y maes yn hytrach na chyfarwyddo popeth. Rwy'n fwy na pharod i drafod gyda phob un o’r rhanbarthau hynny sut y darparwn ddiweddariad rheolaidd fel bod y bobl y mae'r awdurdodau lleol yn atebol iddynt, sy’n amlwg yn bwnc sydd ar feddwl pawb o ystyried yr etholiadau ddechrau mis Mai, ynghyd â'r Llywodraeth, yn gwybod beth a wnawn ar y cyd i wella ffyniant economaidd ac i sicrhau y gallwch weld y math o gynnydd a wnawn.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Minister, I listened with great interest to your response to Paul Davies, both yesterday and today, on the Cardiff capital region's absolutely shocking boast about relatively lower graduate pay in Cardiff compared to counterparts elsewhere in the UK. These comments, while supposedly to attract inward investors into the region, are ultimately insulting to our young talent, treating them merely as a cheap resource. Welsh graduates must be valued as more than cheap labour if the Welsh brain drain is to be rectified. I also noted the Minister didn't respond to Paul Davies's calls in his second question to condemn what was in the prospectus relating to wages. So, I wonder, then, does the Minister think this kind of rhetoric from Cardiff capital region is appropriate, and does he think that the promotion of a low-wage economy is the best way to further the Welsh economy.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Weinidog, gwrandewais â chryn ddiddordeb ar eich ymateb i Paul Davies, ddoe a heddiw, ar frolio cwbl warthus prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd fod cyflogau graddedigion yn gymharol is yng Nghaerdydd o gymharu â chymheiriaid mewn mannau eraill yn y DU. Er eu bod i fod i ddenu mewnfuddsoddwyr i'r rhanbarth, mae'r sylwadau hyn yn sarhau ein talent ifanc, gan eu trin fel dim mwy nag adnodd rhad. Rhaid ystyried graddedigion Cymru fel mwy na llafur rhad os am fynd i'r afael â draen dawn Cymru. Sylwais hefyd nad ymatebodd y Gweinidog i alwadau Paul Davies yn ei ail gwestiwn i gondemnio’r hyn a oedd yn y prosbectws ynglŷn â chyflogau. Felly, tybed a yw'r Gweinidog o'r farn fod rhethreg o'r fath gan brifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn briodol, ac a yw'n credu mai hyrwyddo economi cyflogau isel yw'r ffordd orau o hybu economi Cymru.

13:45

Well, I just don't think the Cardiff capital region are promoting a low-wage economy in what they're saying. I haven't read the exact text in the brochure, so I'm not going to say that I absolutely endorse or condemn what's there. I know from my conversations with the varied leadership of the region that they are not looking to promote this part of Wales as an area of cheap labour. They recognise there are significant skills. We have lots of graduates coming out of the universities, and that's very attractive for a range of businesses already here as well as people who might want to invest in this particular part of Wales. The fact that there is an economy that is growing, the fact that there are lots of graduate skills—and it's the skills that people are looking for—is attractive.

The ultimate end goal is to improve people's economic outcomes, to see wages rise, and that's particularly important given the cost-of-living crisis that we are still going through. So, in terms of the way it's been presented to me, that certainly isn't the way that I would present the plans for the Cardiff capital region, but I'm not entirely sure it's a faithful or fair representation of the way that the capital region themselves are looking to market the opportunities to improve productivity and wage growth here within the capital region.

Wel, ni chredaf fod prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn hyrwyddo economi cyflogau isel drwy'r hyn a ddywedant. Nid wyf wedi darllen yr union destun yn y daflen wybodaeth, felly nid wyf am ddweud fy mod yn llwyr gymeradwyo na chondemnio'r hyn sydd ynddi. O fy sgyrsiau â gwahanol arweinwyr y rhanbarth, rwy'n gwybod nad ydynt yn bwriadu hyrwyddo’r rhan hon o Gymru fel ardal llafur rhad. Maent yn cydnabod bod yno sgiliau sylweddol. Mae gennym lawer o raddedigion yn dod o'r prifysgolion, ac mae hynny'n ddeniadol iawn i amrywiaeth o fusnesau sydd yma eisoes yn ogystal â phobl a allai fod yn awyddus i fuddsoddi yn y rhan benodol hon o Gymru. Mae'r ffaith bod yno economi sy'n tyfu, y ffaith bod llawer o sgiliau graddedigion—a dyma'r sgiliau y mae pobl yn chwilio amdanynt—yn ddeniadol.

Y nod yn y pen draw yw gwella canlyniadau economaidd pobl, gweld cyflogau’n codi, ac mae hynny’n arbennig o bwysig o ystyried yr argyfwng costau byw yr ydym yn dal i fynd drwyddo. Felly, o ran y ffordd y'i cyflwynwyd i mi, yn sicr, nid dyna’r ffordd y byddwn i'n cyflwyno’r cynlluniau ar gyfer prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd, ond nid wyf yn gwbl siŵr ei fod yn crisialu'n ffyddlon a theg y ffordd y mae'r brifddinas-ranbarth eu hunain yn ceisio marchnata'r cyfleoedd i wella cynhyrchiant a thwf cyflogau yma yn y brifddinas-ranbarth.

I have to say I find it difficult to accept that the Cardiff capital region isn't promoting low wages, and of course the explanation given by yourself as well yesterday in response to Paul Davies that the way this has been reported has been miscast, I hope you'd forgive me in saying that I find this nothing more than a bit of spin. I'll read directly from the prospectus, and I quote here:

'We're competitive. The Cardiff Capital Region provides clear cost advantages with competitive operating costs in comparison with other major UK cities. With the security of a large and skilled workforce, the region has an extremely attractive proposition.'

It goes on to talk about salaries.

'Our workforce is distinctively younger than the UK average, well-educated and diverse, supported by three highly regarded universities. Salary costs across the region are very competitive.'

And it goes on to list then the salaries by city, with Cardiff being right at the bottom, highlighted. It further goes on to describe Cardiff as a low-risk, high-reward location that provides clear cost advantages compared with other major UK cities. I think that's pretty clear cut.

And then the reality is that this isn't the first time that something like this has happened. I remember in 2019 my colleague Rhun ap Iorwerth raising almost an identical issue where Trade and Investment Wales had hailed 30 per cent lower salary costs in Wales compared to the other parts of the UK as a reason to invest in Wales. This, sadly, I have to say—

Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud fy mod yn ei chael hi'n anodd derbyn nad yw prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn hyrwyddo cyflogau isel, ac wrth gwrs, yr esboniad a roddwyd gennych ddoe hefyd mewn ymateb i Paul Davies fod y ffordd yr adroddwyd ar y mater wedi'i gamliwio, maddeuwch i mi am ddweud fy mod yn credu nad yw hyn yn ddim byd mwy na thipyn o sbin. Fe ddarllenaf yn uniongyrchol o'r prosbectws:

'Rydym yn gystadleuol. Mae Prifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn darparu manteision cost clir gyda chostau gweithredu sylweddol is o’u cymharu â dinasoedd mawr eraill y DU. Gyda sicrwydd gweithlu mawr a medrus, mae gan y rhanbarth gynnig hynod ddeniadol.'

Mae'n mynd ymlaen i sôn am gyflogau.

'Mae ein gweithlu yn iau o lawer na chyfartaledd y DU, yn addysgedig ac yn amrywiol, wedi'i gefnogi gan dair prifysgol uchel eu parch. Mae costau cyflogau ar draws y rhanbarth yn gystadleuol iawn.'

Ac mae'n mynd rhagddo i restru'r cyflogau fesul dinas, gyda Chaerdydd ar y gwaelod, wedi'i huwcholeuo. Mae’n mynd rhagddo wedyn i ddisgrifio Caerdydd fel lleoliad risg isel, gwobr uchel sy’n darparu manteision amlwg o ran costau o gymharu â dinasoedd mawr eraill y DU. Credaf fod hynny'n eithaf clir.

A'r gwir amdani yw nad dyma'r tro cyntaf i rywbeth fel hyn ddigwydd. Cofiaf fy nghyd-Aelod, Rhun ap Iorwerth, yn codi mater bron yn union yr un fath yn 2019, pan nododd Masnach a Buddsoddi Cymru fod y ffaith bod costau cyflogau 30 y cant yn is yng Nghymru o gymharu â rhannau eraill o’r DU yn rheswm dros fuddsoddi yng Nghymru. Yn anffodus, mae'n rhaid imi ddweud bod hyn—

—reflects the ongoing trend where wages in Wales have stagnated for far too long under successive Labour Governments. But I do hope that the Minister in his time in this portfolio will buck that trend, and I sincerely mean that. But how does he propose we tackle the brain drain when there are public bodies in Wales promoting a low-wage economy, and how can we measure his success? Because I certainly don't want to come back to the Minister highlighting this again, and I'd hope none of my successors will need to either.

—yn adlewyrchu’r duedd barhaus lle mae cyflogau yng Nghymru wedi aros yn eu hunfan ers llawer gormod o amser o dan Lywodraethau Llafur olynol. Ond rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Gweinidog, yn ei gyfnod yn y portffolio, yn mynd yn groes i’r duedd hon, ac rwy'n golygu hynny o ddifrif. Ond sut y mae'n argymell y dylem fynd i'r afael â'r draen dawn pan fo cyrff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru yn hyrwyddo economi cyflogau isel, a sut y gallwn fesur ei lwyddiant? Oherwydd yn sicr, nid wyf i'n dymuno dod yn ôl at y Gweinidog i dynnu sylw at hyn eto, a byddwn yn gobeithio na fydd angen i unrhyw un o fy olynwyr wneud hynny ychwaith.

Well, look, when you actually think about what you've just read out, it doesn't simply say, 'We are marketing the capital region as a low-wage economy.' It's also about the aspirations. When you look at the wider economic framework, actually, they're very clear in the wider economic framework they want to see investment choices made that help to grow businesses and grow wages. And you also think of what's said about land values. Actually, land values are a really big issue for businesses that are looking to invest, as well as the skills in a population. When I recently met with other inward investors, they were most interested in the skills of the population and the future graduates—the future workforce where they were interested. So, this is about investing in the skills of our population. It's about investing in areas where we know we've got areas of strength. I don't accept that the capital region is being marketed as an area of low wages and wages to be kept low. It's actually about how do we ensure that we have advantages for the capital region, particularly with a younger population, which is a real advantage for a range of employers as well, but high levels of skill and the potential for real wage growth, which is what I want to see, and it's certainly what the capital region wants to see as well.

Wel, edrychwch, pan fyddwch yn meddwl am yr hyn yr ydych newydd ei ddarllen, nid yw'n dweud, 'Rydym yn marchnata'r brifddinas-ranbarth fel economi cyflogau isel.' Mae'n ymwneud â'r dyheadau hefyd. Pan edrychwch ar y fframwaith economaidd ehangach, maent yn glir iawn yno eu bod am weld dewisiadau buddsoddi sy'n helpu i dyfu busnesau a thyfu cyflogau. Ac ystyriwch hefyd yr hyn sy'n cael ei ddweud am werth tir. A dweud y gwir, mae gwerth tir yn fater pwysig iawn i fusnesau sy'n ystyried buddsoddi, yn ogystal â'r sgiliau mewn poblogaeth. Pan gyfarfûm yn ddiweddar â mewnfuddsoddwyr eraill, eu diddordeb pennaf oedd sgiliau’r boblogaeth a graddedigion y dyfodol—roedd ganddynt ddiddordeb yng ngweithlu'r dyfodol. Felly, mae hyn yn ymwneud â buddsoddi yn sgiliau ein poblogaeth. Mae'n ymwneud â buddsoddi mewn meysydd lle y gwyddom fod gennym gryfderau. Nid wyf yn derbyn bod y brifddinas-ranbarth yn cael ei marchnata fel ardal lle mae'r cyflogau'n isel a bod cyflogau i'w cadw'n isel. Mae’n ymwneud â sut rydym yn sicrhau bod gennym fanteision i’r brifddinas-ranbarth, yn enwedig gyda’r boblogaeth iau, sy’n fantais wirioneddol i amryw o gyflogwyr hefyd, ond lefelau uchel o sgiliau a photensial gwirioneddol i dyfu cyflogau, sef yr hyn rwyf am ei weld, ac yn sicr, dyma y mae'r brifddinas-ranbarth am ei weld hefyd.

Ardal Mersi a Dyfrdwy
The Mersey Dee Area

3. Sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi datblygu economaidd yn ardal Mersi a Dyfrdwy? OQ57825

3. How is the Welsh Government supporting economic development in the Mersey Dee area? OQ57825

Thank you for the question. We continue to support the region through our regional economic framework and our place-based approach to economic development. The Welsh Government is a founder member of the Mersey Dee Alliance, as the Member will know, and this is a partnership of organisations working to support the cross-border functional economic area between the north-east of Wales, west Cheshire and the Wirral.

Diolch am eich cwestiwn. Rydym yn parhau i gefnogi’r rhanbarth drwy ein fframwaith economaidd rhanbarthol a’n dull datblygu economaidd sy'n seiliedig ar leoedd. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn un o sylfaenwyr Cynghrair Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy, fel y gŵyr yr Aelod, ac mae hon yn bartneriaeth o sefydliadau sy’n gweithio i gefnogi’r ardal economaidd weithredol drawsffiniol rhwng gogledd ddwyrain Cymru, gorllewin Swydd Gaer a Wirral.

13:50

Well, can I thank the Minister for his answer to my question and also for his steadfast support for Wrexham's bid to be the UK City of Culture in 2025? The Minister's support has been noted across the county borough, and it's been incredibly valuable to be able to boast of to other bidders and obviously to the Department for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport and to the board. In the spirit of solidarity with our northern cousins, who have also supported the bid, would you join Mayors Rotherham and Burnham in calling for the FA Cup semi-final to be moved from Wembley to the north? And would you be able to outline how discussions with our partners across the Mersey Dee area are taking place, with a view of creating more high-quality jobs across the region?

Wel, a gaf fi ddiolch i’r Gweinidog am ei ateb i fy nghwestiwn ac am ei gefnogaeth ddiwyro i gais Wrecsam i fod yn Ddinas Diwylliant y DU yn 2025? Mae cefnogaeth y Gweinidog wedi’i nodi ar draws y fwrdeistref sirol, ac mae wedi bod yn hynod werthfawr gallu brolio yn ei chylch wrth ymgeiswyr eraill, ac yn amlwg, wrth yr Adran dros Dechnoleg Ddigidol, Diwylliant, y Cyfryngau a Chwaraeon ac wrth y bwrdd. Mewn ysbryd o undod gyda’n cefndryd gogleddol, sydd hefyd wedi cefnogi’r cais, a wnewch chi ymuno â Meiri Rotherham a Burnham i alw am symud rownd gynderfynol Cwpan FA Lloegr o Wembley i’r gogledd? Ac a allech chi amlinellu sut y mae trafodaethau gyda’n partneriaid ar draws ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy yn mynd rhagddynt, gyda golwg ar greu mwy o swyddi o ansawdd uchel ar draws y rhanbarth?

Yes. On both the first points, yes, I am very pleased to continue my stated support for Wrexham's bid to be the UK City of Culture. I know that the Member, and indeed the one-time director of Wrexham Supporters Trust, the constituency Member for Wrexham, have been very clear in their support for the bid as well, as indeed are people across the region and outside. It enjoys cross-party support.

And I also think it would be a very sensible move to ensure that Manchester City and Liverpool fans don't travel to London for the FA Cup semi-final, and that would have wider benefits as well.

And when it comes to developments in the Mersey Dee area, my officials continue to work directly with the counties on both sides of the border to try to understand how we maximise the opportunities that do exist in a range of sectors, from offshore wind to nuclear to marine energy, and of course a range of cross-border supply issues. So, I'm very optimistic about the strength of the partnership that exists, and a recognition that investment in this part of the UK, whether on the Welsh side of the border or the other side, will have a significant and positive impact. So, we'll continue to have those purposive, and what I hope will be productive, conversations.

Iawn. Ar y ddau bwynt cyntaf, ydw, rwy’n falch iawn o barhau â fy nghefnogaeth ddatganedig i gais Wrecsam i fod yn Brifddinas Diwylliant y DU. Gwn fod yr Aelod, a chyn-gyfarwyddwr Ymddiriedolaeth Cefnogwyr Wrecsam yn wir, yr Aelod etholaethol dros Wrecsam, wedi datgan eu cefnogaeth i’r cais yn glir iawn hefyd, fel y mae pobl ar draws y rhanbarth a thu hwnt wedi'i wneud, yn wir. Mae iddo gefnogaeth drawsbleidiol.

A chredaf hefyd y byddai'n gam synhwyrol iawn i sicrhau nad yw cefnogwyr Manchester City a Lerpwl yn teithio i Lundain ar gyfer rownd gynderfynol Cwpan FA Lloegr, ac y byddai manteision ehangach i hynny hefyd.

Ac ar ddatblygiadau yn ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy, mae fy swyddogion yn parhau i weithio’n uniongyrchol gyda’r siroedd ar ddwy ochr y ffin i geisio deall sut i sicrhau'r budd mwyaf o gyfleoedd sydd eisoes yn bodoli mewn ystod o sectorau, o ynni gwynt ar y môr i ynni niwclear i ynni'r môr, ac wrth gwrs, amrywiaeth o faterion cyflenwi trawsffiniol. Felly, rwy’n obeithiol iawn ynghylch cryfder y bartneriaeth sy’n bodoli, ac ynghylch cydnabyddiaeth y bydd buddsoddiad yn y rhan hon o’r DU, boed ar ochr Cymru i’r ffin neu’r ochr arall, yn cael effaith sylweddol a chadarnhaol. Felly, byddwn yn parhau i gael y sgyrsiau pwrpasol hynny a fydd hefyd, rwy'n gobeithio, yn gynhyrchiol.

In addition to UK Government-supported signalling renewals on the north Wales main line and over £1.2 billion UK Government funding for the Liverpool city region, benefiting rail service and inter-city transport and economies in the Mersey Dee area, including north-east Wales, the Mersey Dee area has received £59 million directly from the UK Government, including £2.6 million for the Wrexham-Bidston-Liverpool rail line, and £400,000 to further develop proposals for a new station at Deeside industrial park. Step-free access at Flint station is also in development. Network Rail is progressing the development of north Wales main line journey time improvements to outline business-case stage by summer 2022, following which a decision to design will be sought by the rail network enhancements pipeline. And £42.5 million development moneys for the union connectivity review, carried out for the UK Government, which recognised north Wales and north-west England as a highly integrated cross-border economy that will benefit from a programme of transport improvements, will be allocated soon. How will you and your officials therefore work with the UK Government to maximise the economic benefit of this for the Mersey Dee area?

Yn ogystal â gwaith adnewyddu signalau a gefnogir gan Lywodraeth y DU ar brif reilffordd gogledd Cymru a thros £1.2 biliwn o gyllid Llywodraeth y DU ar gyfer dinas-ranbarth Lerpwl, sydd o fudd i wasanaethau rheilffordd ac economïau a thrafnidiaeth rhwng dinasoedd yn ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy, gan gynnwys gogledd-ddwyrain Cymru, mae ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy wedi derbyn £59 miliwn yn uniongyrchol gan Lywodraeth y DU, gan gynnwys £2.6 miliwn ar gyfer rheilffordd Wrecsam-Bidston-Lerpwl, a £400,000 i ddatblygu cynigion ar gyfer gorsaf newydd ym mharc diwydiannol Glannau Dyfrdwy ymhellach. Mae mynediad di-risiau yng ngorsaf y Fflint hefyd yn cael ei ddatblygu. Mae Network Rail yn bwrw ymlaen â’r gwaith o ddatblygu gwelliannau i amseroedd teithio ar brif reilffordd gogledd Cymru i lefel y cam achos busnes amlinellol erbyn haf 2022, ac ar ôl hynny bydd ffrwd gwelliannau'r rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd yn gofyn am benderfyniad dylunio. A bydd £42.5 miliwn o arian datblygu ar gyfer yr adolygiad o gysylltedd yr undeb, a gynhaliwyd ar gyfer Llywodraeth y DU, ac a oedd yn cydnabod bod gogledd Cymru a gogledd-orllewin Lloegr yn economi drawsffiniol integredig iawn a fydd yn elwa o raglen o welliannau trafnidiaeth, yn cael ei ddyrannu’n fuan. Sut, felly, y byddwch chi a’ch swyddogion yn gweithio gyda Llywodraeth y DU i sicrhau’r budd economaidd mwyaf posibl yn sgil hyn i ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy?

Well, we'd like to be able to do just that. It does require, though, not just a level of honesty but a level of practical ability to work together, and that can't be on the basis that the UK Government decide what's going to happen and then demand that the Welsh Government falls into line. Now, in the Mersey Dee area you've got local authorities on both sides of the border who are having that productive conversation, and again including different political leadership, so it is about recognising the wider benefit to it.

But a range of the areas that you've mentioned in your statement and question actually come from reserved responsibilities. It's the UK Government's responsibility to invest in rail infrastructure and of course that investment can provide significant additional economic benefit. And of course the union connectivity review you mentioned, one of the things it highlighted, as indeed has the Conservative chair of the Welsh Affairs Select Committee, is that HS2 is going to be a problem for the economy of Wales. It should be seen as an England-only project, not England-and-Wales, and that would actually allow us to have significant additional investment within connectivity and transport infrastructure here in Wales, and I hope the Member will join with other people across the Chamber in calling for the UK Government to change its mind on the way that HS2 is categorised, because at the moment Wales will lose out.

Wel, hoffem allu gwneud yn union hynny. Er mwyn gwneud hynny, fodd bynnag, mae angen nid yn unig lefel o onestrwydd ond lefel o allu ymarferol i gydweithio, ac ni all hynny fod ar y sail fod Llywodraeth y DU yn penderfynu beth sy'n mynd i ddigwydd ac yna'n mynnu bod Llywodraeth Cymru'n ufuddhau. Nawr, yn ardal Mersi a’r Ddyfrdwy, mae gennych awdurdodau lleol ar y ddwy ochr i'r ffin sy’n cael y sgwrs gynhyrchiol honno, ac eto’n cynnwys arweinwyr o wahanol bleidiau gwleidyddol, felly mae’n ymwneud â chydnabod y budd ehangach i'r ardal.

Ond mewn gwirionedd, mae ystod o'r meysydd y sonioch chi amdanynt yn eich datganiad a'ch cwestiwn yn dod o gyfrifoldebau a gedwir yn ôl. Cyfrifoldeb Llywodraeth y DU yw buddsoddi yn y seilwaith rheilffyrdd, ac wrth gwrs, gall y buddsoddiad hwnnw ddarparu budd economaidd ychwanegol sylweddol. Ac wrth gwrs, yn yr adolygiad o gysylltedd yr undeb y sonioch chi amdano, un o'r pethau y tynnodd sylw ato, fel yn wir y mae cadeirydd Ceidwadol y Pwyllgor Dethol ar Faterion Cymreig wedi'i wneud, yw bod HS2 yn mynd i fod yn broblem i economi Cymru. Dylid ei ystyried yn brosiect Lloegr yn unig, nid prosiect Cymru a Lloegr, a byddai hynny'n caniatáu inni gael buddsoddiad ychwanegol sylweddol mewn cysylltedd a seilwaith trafnidiaeth yma yng Nghymru, ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd yr Aelod yn ymuno â phobl eraill ar draws y Siambr i alw ar Lywodraeth y DU i newid ei meddwl ynglŷn â'r ffordd y mae prosiect HS2 wedi'i gategoreiddio, oherwydd ar hyn o bryd bydd Cymru ar ei cholled.

Cyflogadwyedd a Sgiliau
Employability and Skills

4. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am gynllun Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau? OQ57817

4. Will the Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's plan for employability and skills? OQ57817

On 8 March, I launched the plan for employability and skills, and you'll recall that I also gave an oral statement in this Chamber, at which you were able to ask questions. I outlined our priorities to help more people in Wales to upskill, access and, hopefully, thrive in work, for a more equal economy that works for everyone.

Ar 8 Mawrth, lansiais y cynllun cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau, ac fe fyddwch yn cofio imi wneud datganiad llafar yn y Siambr hon hefyd, lle y cawsoch gyfle i ofyn cwestiynau. Amlinellais ein blaenoriaethau i helpu mwy o bobl yng Nghymru i uwchsgilio, i gael gwaith, ac i ffynnu mewn gwaith, gobeithio, er mwyn cael economi fwy cyfartal sy’n gweithio i bawb.

I'm grateful to you for that response, Minister. Now, the Welsh Government's plan for employability and skills commits to reviewing adult education and lifelong learning and improving quality and access to skills-based formal and informal adult learning, and I'm sure that you'll agree with me, Minister, that, sometimes, shorter courses can be more effective than other routes at filling skills gaps. Therefore, can you tell us when the review of adult education and lifelong learning will take place, and can you tell us what discussions have you had as the economy Minister with skills providers about how the adult education and lifelong learning sector can be strengthened in the future?

Diolch am eich ymateb, Weinidog. Nawr, mae cynllun cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau Llywodraeth Cymru yn ymrwymo i adolygu addysg oedolion a dysgu gydol oes a gwella ansawdd a mynediad at ddysgu ffurfiol ac anffurfiol i oedolion sy’n seiliedig ar sgiliau, ac rwy’n siŵr y byddwch yn cytuno â mi, Weinidog, y gall cyrsiau byrrach fod yn fwy effeithiol na llwybrau eraill weithiau am gau bylchau sgiliau. Felly, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym pryd y bydd yr adolygiad o addysg oedolion a dysgu gydol oes yn cael ei gynnal, ac a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym pa drafodaethau a gawsoch fel Gweinidog yr economi â darparwyr sgiliau ynglŷn â sut y gellir cryfhau’r sector addysg oedolion a dysgu gydol oes yn y dyfodol?

13:55

There are challenges in this area that I'm discussing with the Minister for education and lifelong learning, and our joint engagement with the further education sector in particular. It's both about the way that funding is still up in the air—and we've had this discussion more than once about people's ability to engage in skilled work—and replacement EU funds aren't being fully matched and replaced. The Minister for education and lifelong learning will give more detail about the finalisation of the review into adult and lifelong learning, but I do think the way that we've set out our employability and skills plan, with the priorities we've set about who we want to see that investment made in, to ensure that people can return to the labour market or get closer to the labour market, will actually have the ability to make a real difference, and that will be about understanding the individual needs of people, not a one-size-fits-all approach. So, I'm sure the Member will be interested when we have more detail provided in the near future.

Mae heriau yn y maes hwn rwy'n eu trafod â’r Gweinidog addysg a dysgu gydol oes, a’n hymgysylltiad ar y cyd â’r sector addysg bellach yn arbennig. Mae'n ymwneud â'r ffordd y mae cyllid yn dal i fod yn amhendant—ac rydym wedi cael y drafodaeth hon fwy nag unwaith am allu pobl i wneud gwaith crefftus—ac nid oes arian digonol yn cael ei ddarparu yn lle cronfeydd yr EU. Bydd y Gweinidog addysg a dysgu gydol oes yn darparu mwy o fanylion am gwblhau’r adolygiad o addysg oedolion a dysgu gydol oes, ond credaf y gellir gwneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol drwy'r ffordd y lluniwyd ein cynllun cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau, gyda’r blaenoriaethau a nodwyd gennym ynglŷn â phwy y dymunwn wneud y buddsoddiad hwnnw ynddynt er mwyn sicrhau y gall pobl ddychwelyd i’r farchnad lafur neu ddod yn nes at y farchnad lafur, a bydd hynny’n ymwneud â deall anghenion unigol pobl, nid cael un dull sy'n addas i bawb. Felly, rwy'n siŵr y bydd gan yr Aelod ddiddordeb pan fydd gennym fwy o fanylion yn y dyfodol agos.

Minister, generation after generation in Rhondda have been let down by consecutive Tory Westminster Governments. Time and time again, we have lost employment as a direct result of their decisions. Our forefathers lost their industry. More recently, we've lost the tax office, the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency jobs, Department for Work and Pensions offices and the local courts. We've lost police on our streets, among other public sector jobs, thanks to Tory austerity, and now Boris wants to shortchange Wales by £1 billion. If it wasn't for Welsh Government's investment in support of companies like E-Cycle and Flowtech, local businesses in our town centres in Treorchy and Ferndale, and initiatives like the Big Shed in Tonypandy, the remote working hub in Porth and the Court House in Llwynypia, we would see much higher unemployment figures in Rhondda. How will the employability and skills plan build on the success we are beginning to see in Rhondda, so we don't have to get out to get on?

Weinidog, mae cenhedlaeth ar ôl cenhedlaeth yn y Rhondda wedi cael eu siomi gan Lywodraethau Torïaidd olynol yn San Steffan. Dro ar ôl tro, rydym wedi colli cyflogaeth o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i'w penderfyniadau. Collodd ein cyndeidiau eu diwydiant. Yn fwy diweddar, rydym wedi colli’r swyddfa dreth, swyddi’r Asiantaeth Safonau Gyrwyr a Cherbydau, swyddfeydd yr Adran Gwaith a Phensiynau a’r llysoedd lleol. Rydym wedi colli heddlu ar ein strydoedd, ymhlith swyddi eraill yn y sector cyhoeddus, diolch i gyni'r Torïaid, ac yn awr, mae Boris yn dymuno twyllo Cymru allan o £1 biliwn. Oni bai am fuddsoddiad Llywodraeth Cymru i gefnogi cwmnïau fel E-Cycle a Flowtech, busnesau lleol yng nghanol ein trefi yn Nhreorci a Glynrhedynog, a mentrau fel y Big Shed yn Nhonypandy, yr hyb gweithio o bell yn y Porth a’r Court House yn Llwynypia, byddai'r ffigurau diweithdra yn y Rhondda yn llawer uwch. Sut y bydd y cynllun cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau yn adeiladu ar y llwyddiant yr ydym yn dechrau ei weld yn y Rhondda fel nad oes angen inni adael er mwyn llwyddo?

Thank you for the question and the reminder of some of the significant challenges we have, and the £1 billion shortchanging in Wales in replacement EU funds will make a big difference to what we're able to do and the speed at which we're able to do it. In setting out our economic mission and the employability and skills plan, we're focusing on what we can do, so that's why we're going to continue to work to help to bring people closer to the labour market, those people who aren't there already, and we know that there are significant and differential outcomes for people with disabilities, as Joyce Watson highlighted earlier, but also economic activity rates in communities like the ones that the Member represents. So, I'm confident that we will be able to make a difference, but my frustration is we could do so much more if we had a UK Government on our side. I hope that, during this term, we'll see a change in that respect from the UK, but we're determined to do everything we can to make sure there's a better story to tell for the Rhondda and other similar communities and make sure we really can be successful and you won't need to get out to get on.

Diolch am eich cwestiwn ac am ein hatgoffa o rai o'r heriau sylweddol yr ydym yn eu hwynebu, a bydd y diffyg o £1 biliwn o arian yn lle cronfeydd yr UE yng Nghymru yn gwneud gwahaniaeth mawr i'r hyn y gallwn ei wneud a pha mor gyflym y gallwn wneud hynny. Wrth nodi ein cenhadaeth economaidd a'r cynllun cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau, rydym yn canolbwyntio ar yr hyn y gallwn ei wneud, felly dyna pam y byddwn yn parhau i weithio i helpu i ddod â phobl yn nes at y farchnad lafur, y bobl hynny nad ydynt yno eisoes, a gwyddom fod canlyniadau sylweddol a gwahaniaethol i bobl ag anableddau, fel y nododd Joyce Watson yn gynharach, a chyfraddau gweithgarwch economaidd mewn cymunedau fel y rhai y mae’r Aelod yn eu cynrychioli hefyd. Felly, rwy'n hyderus y gallwn wneud gwahaniaeth, ond yr hyn sy'n rhwystredig i mi yw y gallem wneud cymaint mwy pe bai Llywodraeth y DU ar ein hochr. Yn ystod y tymor hwn, rwy'n gobeithio y gwelwn newid yn hynny o beth ar ran y DU, ond rydym yn benderfynol o wneud popeth a allwn i sicrhau bod stori well gan y Rhondda a chymunedau tebyg eraill i’w hadrodd ac i sicrhau y gallwn fod yn llwyddiannus ac na fydd angen ichi adael er mwyn llwyddo.

Y Sector Twristiaeth
The Tourism Sector

5. Pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n eu cymryd i gefnogi'r sector twristiaeth? OQ57830

5. What action is the Welsh Government taking to support the tourism sector? OQ57830

Our strategy, 'Welcome to Wales: Priorities for the visitor economy 2020-2025', sets our vision and ambition for the sector. We also, of course, have the shaping the vision recovery plan published a year ago. In the budget for 2022-23, we've indicated an allocation of £47 million over three years to deliver on those priorities.

Mae ein strategaeth, 'Croeso i Gymru: Blaenoriaethau i’r Economi Ymwelwyr 2020-2025', yn nodi ein gweledigaeth a'n huchelgais ar gyfer y sector. Hefyd wrth gwrs, mae gennym gynllun adfer llunio’r weledigaeth a gyhoeddwyd flwyddyn yn ôl. Yn y gyllideb ar gyfer 2022-23, rydym wedi nodi dyraniad o £47 miliwn dros dair blynedd i gyflawni'r blaenoriaethau hynny.

Thank you, Minister for your response and, as I'm sure you'd agree, the tourism sector is so important here in Wales, and that's why it's a pleasure to chair the Senedd's cross-party group on tourism. I look forward to seeing many Members attending the meeting next week.

But Minister, as you'll know, Wales welcomes around 11 million overnight domestic visitors, 87 million day visitors, around 1 million international visitors in normal years, and these people come to our country, spend their money, support local jobs and enjoy all that we have to offer, and, in my own patch in north Wales, this sector is worth around £3.5 billion a year to our economy.

One of the big concerns that the tourism sector are sharing with me is the Government's latest council tax empty dwellings regulations, and specifically the criteria for self-catering accommodation being aligned with business rates instead of council tax and the changes that would take place there, with properties now needing to be let for 182 days, which is a 160 per cent increase, and available to let for 252 days, which is an 80 per cent increase and, confusingly, quite different to HMRC's definition in terms of tax purposes. Many people in the tourism sector—

Diolch am eich ymateb, Weinidog, ac fel y byddech yn cytuno rwy'n siŵr, mae’r sector twristiaeth mor bwysig yma yng Nghymru, a dyna pam ei bod yn bleser cadeirio grŵp trawsbleidiol y Senedd ar dwristiaeth. Edrychaf ymlaen at weld llawer o Aelodau’n dod i'r cyfarfod yr wythnos nesaf.

Ond Weinidog, fel y gwyddoch, mae Cymru’n croesawu oddeutu 11 miliwn o ymwelwyr dros nos domestig, 87 miliwn o ymwelwyr undydd, oddeutu 1 filiwn o ymwelwyr rhyngwladol mewn blynyddoedd arferol, ac mae’r bobl hyn yn dod i’n gwlad, yn gwario eu harian, yn cefnogi swyddi lleol ac yn mwynhau’r cyfan sydd gennym i’w gynnig, ac yn fy ardal i yn y gogledd, mae’r sector hwn yn werth oddeutu £3.5 biliwn y flwyddyn i’n heconomi.

Un o’r pryderon mawr y mae’r sector twristiaeth yn eu rhannu gyda mi yw rheoliadau treth gyngor diweddaraf y Llywodraeth ar anheddau gwag, ac yn benodol, y meini prawf ar gyfer alinio llety hunanddarpar ag ardrethi busnes yn lle’r dreth gyngor a’r newidiadau a fyddai’n digwydd yn sgil hynny, gydag eiddo angen cael ei osod am 182 diwrnod bellach, sy’n gynnydd o 160 y cant, ac ar gael i’w osod am 252 o ddiwrnodau, sy’n gynnydd o 80 y cant, ac yn ddryslyd, mae hyn yn wahanol iawn i ddiffiniad CThEM at ddibenion treth. Mae llawer o bobl yn y sector twristiaeth—

14:00

You will need to ask your question now, please.

Bydd angen ichi ofyn eich cwestiwn yn awr, os gwelwch yn dda.

I'll come to it now. Many people in the tourism sector are shocked by these changes, and see them as being detrimental to their livelihoods. So, Minister, do you think these changes are good for the sector?

Fe ddeuaf ato yn awr. Mae llawer o bobl yn y sector twristiaeth wedi eu syfrdanu gan y newidiadau hyn, ac yn eu gweld yn niweidiol i'w bywoliaeth. Felly, Weinidog, a ydych yn credu bod y newidiadau hyn yn dda i'r sector?

Well, there was significant comment on exactly this subject yesterday with my colleague the Minister for Finance and Local Government, and in questions elsewhere. Look, I've actually met the visitor economy forum today and this is a subject they've raised. There are concerns around a number of areas. The challenge though is the balance in what we're trying to do, and the balance in what we're trying to do to have a successful and healthy visitor economy, with decent jobs and decent wages, that doesn't have an unacceptable impact on communities that host parts of the visitor economy as well. And the balance in all of this can't be struck successfully if we do nothing and simply carry on as we are. So, we'll continue to engage with all those businesses in the visitor economy. What we won't do is pretend that just business as usual, as it is now, is going to deliver the successful future we all want to see. And when you're in Government, you have to decide and you have to make choices about how that balance is going to be struck. I'm optimistic that we are on the path to another successful season for the visitor economy here in Wales, and more to come for both domestic and international visitors.

Wel, cafwyd sylwadau pwysig ar yr union bwnc hwn ddoe gyda fy nghyd-Weinidog, y Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol, ac mewn cwestiynau mewn mannau eraill. Edrychwch, cyfarfûm â'r fforwm economi ymwelwyr heddiw ac mae hwn yn bwnc y maent wedi'i godi. Ceir pryderon ynghylch nifer o feysydd. Yr her, fodd bynnag, yw'r cydbwysedd yn yr hyn y ceisiwn ei wneud, a'r cydbwysedd yn yr hyn y ceisiwn ei wneud i gael economi ymwelwyr lwyddiannus ac iach, gyda swyddi gweddus a chyflogau gweddus, nad yw'n cael effaith annerbyniol ar gymunedau sy'n cynnal rhannau o'r economi ymwelwyr hefyd. Ac ni ellir taro'r cydbwysedd yn hyn i gyd yn llwyddiannus os ydym yn parhau fel yr ydym a gwneud dim. Felly, byddwn yn parhau i ymgysylltu â'r holl fusnesau yn yr economi ymwelwyr. Yr hyn na fyddwn yn ei wneud yw esgus bod dal ati fel arfer, fel y mae pethau ar hyn o bryd, yn mynd i sicrhau'r dyfodol llwyddiannus y mae pawb ohonom am ei weld. A phan fyddwch mewn Llywodraeth, rhaid ichi benderfynu a rhaid ichi wneud dewisiadau ynglŷn â sut y bydd y cydbwysedd hwnnw'n cael ei daro. Rwy'n obeithiol ein bod ar y llwybr i dymor llwyddiannus arall i'r economi ymwelwyr yma yng Nghymru, a mwy i ddod i ymwelwyr domestig a rhyngwladol.

Iechyd a Lles yn y Gweithle
Health and Well-being in the Workplace

6. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cael gyda'r Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ynghylch annog busnesau i flaenoriaethu iechyd a lles yn y gweithle? OQ57836

6. What discussions has the Minister had with the Minister for Health and Social Services regarding encouraging businesses to prioritise health and well-being in the workplace? OQ57836

Welcome back. The health and well-being of workers is a priority for this Government. Last month, the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being and I announced £1.4 million of funding over the next three years for the Time to Change Wales programme to continue. We also work together on the Healthy Working Wales programme as well.

Croeso nôl. Mae iechyd a lles gweithwyr yn flaenoriaeth i'r Llywodraeth hon. Y mis diwethaf, cyhoeddodd y Dirprwy Weinidog Iechyd Meddwl a Llesiant a minnau £1.4 miliwn o gyllid dros y tair blynedd nesaf er mwyn i'r rhaglen Amser i Newid Cymru barhau. Rydym hefyd yn gweithio gyda'n gilydd ar raglen Cymru Iach ar Waith hefyd.

Thank you for that answer. The COVID pandemic has led to a dramatic change in the way we work. Whilst many will now be returning to the office, some workers will still be working from home and getting used to new, more flexible work practices. Whilst the flexibility is to be welcomed, this has led to a blurring of the lines between the work and the home environment in some cases. Countries like Portugal and Belgium are introducing right-to-disconnect legislation, which allows employees to disconnect from their work outside of office hours. Has there been any discussions within the Welsh Government or with the UK Government about introducing similar rules for Wales?

Diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw. Mae'r pandemig COVID wedi arwain at newid dramatig yn y ffordd yr ydym yn gweithio. Er y bydd llawer o bobl bellach yn dychwelyd i'r swyddfa, bydd rhai gweithwyr yn dal i weithio gartref ac yn dod i arfer ag arferion gwaith newydd a mwy hyblyg. Er bod yr hyblygrwydd i'w groesawu, mae hyn wedi arwain at gymylu'r ffin rhwng yr amgylchedd gwaith a'r cartref mewn rhai achosion. Mae gwledydd fel Portiwgal a Gwlad Belg yn cyflwyno deddfwriaeth hawl i ddatgysylltu, sy'n caniatáu i gyflogeion ddatgysylltu o'u gwaith y tu allan i oriau swyddfa. A fu unrhyw drafodaethau yn Llywodraeth Cymru neu gyda Llywodraeth y DU ynghylch cyflwyno rheolau tebyg i Gymru?

No, we're not at that point. We are having a conversation about what is a healthy balance in the way that the world of work has changed during the pandemic, and how much that change is going to be permanent. And actually, some of the challenges about the surveillance of people when they're working remotely—it's a matter that, of course, Sarah Murphy, the Member for Bridgend has consistently raised. There's a balance between those people who have seen a well-being improvement from being able to have some of their working life done remotely and those who have found it a struggle in not being as connected to the workplace as well. So, it isn't as simple as saying, 'Going back to the office is good for everybody's mental health', and it's not as simple as saying, 'People not working in an office is good for them as well.' So, there's the challenge in the balance. And interestingly, at yesterday's CIPD conference, this was part of the conversation being had.

In the visitor economy forum meeting that I had today, I made the offer that what I would like from the Government's point of view is a clear understanding, as the changing pattern emerges, between businesses and business organisations and trade unions, on what a better pattern of a working life is likely to mean, to make sure we balance some of these competing objectives in how you get on in your industry—actually, part of the practical business of learning on the job, as I did when I was a trainee solicitor; doing that was much easier when you were around other people—and at the same time, balancing other parts of your life and not necessarily having to be in a singular workplace five days a week for as many hours as possible. So, that's part of the challenge that we have, and I'm optimistic that we will get to a sensible place, because of the successful social partnership approach that we have. And that may mean that there is a case to change the reserved matters of employment law, and it may also mean we can do some of that, simply, with the successful partnership that we've already established here in Wales.

Na, nid ydym wedi cyrraedd y fan honno. Rydym yn cael sgwrs am yr hyn sy'n gydbwysedd iach yn y ffordd y mae byd gwaith wedi newid yn ystod y pandemig, a pha mor barhaol y bydd y newid hwnnw. Ac mewn gwirionedd, rhai o'r heriau ynghylch goruchwylio pobl pan fyddant yn gweithio o bell—mae'n fater y mae Sarah Murphy, yr Aelod dros Ben-y-bont ar Ogwr wrth gwrs, wedi'i godi'n gyson. Mae cydbwysedd rhwng y bobl sydd wedi gweld gwelliant yn eu llesiant o allu gwneud rhywfaint o'u bywyd gwaith o bell a'r rhai sydd wedi ei chael hi'n anodd peidio â bod mor gysylltiedig â'r gweithle hefyd. Felly, nid yw mor syml â dweud, 'Mae mynd yn ôl i'r swyddfa yn dda i iechyd meddwl pawb', ac nid yw mor syml â dweud, 'Mae'n dda i bobl beidio â bod yn gweithio mewn swyddfa hefyd.' Felly, mae'r her yn y cydbwysedd. Ac yn ddiddorol, yng nghynhadledd y Sefydliad Siartredig Personél a Datblygu ddoe, roedd hyn yn rhan o'r sgwrs a gafwyd.

Yng nghyfarfod y fforwm economi ymwelwyr a gefais heddiw, gwneuthum y cynnig mai'r hyn yr hoffwn ei gael o safbwynt y Llywodraeth yw dealltwriaeth glir, wrth i'r patrwm newidiol ddod i'r amlwg, rhwng busnesau a sefydliadau busnes ac undebau llafur, ar yr hyn y mae patrwm bywyd gwaith gwell yn debygol o olygu, er mwyn sicrhau ein bod yn cydbwyso rhai o'r amcanion hyn sy'n cystadlu o ran sut yr ydych yn camu ymlaen yn eich diwydiant—rhan o'r busnes ymarferol o ddysgu yn y swydd mewn gwirionedd, fel y gwneuthum pan oeddwn yn gyfreithiwr dan hyfforddiant; roedd gwneud hynny'n llawer haws pan oeddech chi o gwmpas pobl eraill—ac ar yr un pryd, cydbwyso rhannau eraill o'ch bywyd a pheidio â gorfod bod mewn un gweithle bum diwrnod yr wythnos am gynifer o oriau â phosibl. Felly, mae hynny'n rhan o'r her sydd gennym, ac rwy'n obeithiol y byddwn yn cyrraedd lle synhwyrol, oherwydd y dull partneriaeth gymdeithasol llwyddiannus sydd gennym. A gallai hynny olygu bod achos dros newid materion a gadwyd yn ôl fel cyfraith cyflogaeth, a gall hefyd olygu y gallwn wneud rhywfaint o hynny, yn syml, gyda'r bartneriaeth lwyddiannus yr ydym eisoes wedi'i sefydlu yma yng Nghymru.

I'm a proud ambassador of the 'Where's Your Head At?' mental health campaign, and the campaign has culminated in a Bill going through the UK Parliament to ensure that, within first aid training, mental health first aid training is incorporated, and to recognise that the physical and mental side of first aid training are equal. I'm just wondering what you are doing in the strategies that you've announced to ensure that we have mental health first aiders within all businesses across Wales, and don't you agree with me that it's important that we have champions within the workplace looking after the needs of people with mental ill health?

Rwy'n un o lysgenhadon balch yr ymgyrch iechyd meddwl 'Where's Your Head At?', ac mae'r ymgyrch wedi arwain at Fil sy'n mynd drwy Senedd y DU i sicrhau bod hyfforddiant cymorth cyntaf iechyd meddwl yn cael ei ymgorffori mewn hyfforddiant cymorth cyntaf, ac i gydnabod bod ochr gorfforol a meddyliol hyfforddiant cymorth cyntaf yn gyfartal. Rwy'n meddwl tybed beth a wnewch yn y strategaethau a gyhoeddwyd gennych i sicrhau bod gennym swyddogion cymorth cyntaf iechyd meddwl ym mhob busnes ledled Cymru, ac onid ydych yn cytuno â mi ei bod yn bwysig inni gael hyrwyddwyr yn y gweithle i ofalu am anghenion pobl â salwch meddwl ?

14:05

Well, actually, the broader point about mental health is that it's something for all of us, in having some balance in what we do and to be able to be successful in work and outside work as well. It's not just a question of those people who are struggling with their mental health; maintaining good mental health is a matter for all of us. And actually, rather than having a specific point about wanting to try to mandate mental health first aiding that, actually, my own constituency office, for example, has undertaken and we've found it beneficial, but it's then also about what we do in our wider encouragement and leadership. And actually, in the Healthy Working Wales programme, that's part of what happens—looking at the mental health of a workforce, not just physical health. It's also part of our economic contract in one of the new pillars, in the promotion of people's physical and mental well-being as well. So, it's very definitely part of what we are looking for businesses to do and part of what we expect to see moving forward as a regular part of the way that every business and public service operates.

Wel, mewn gwirionedd, y pwynt ehangach am iechyd meddwl yw ei fod yn rhywbeth i bob un ohonom, o ran cael rhywfaint o gydbwysedd yn yr hyn a wnawn a gallu bod yn llwyddiannus yn y gwaith a'r tu allan i'r gwaith hefyd. Mae'n ymwneud â mwy na'r rheini sy'n cael trafferth gyda'u hiechyd meddwl; mae sicrhau iechyd meddwl da yn rhywbeth i bob un ohonom. Ac mewn gwirionedd, yn hytrach na chael pwynt penodol am geisio mandadu cymorth cyntaf iechyd meddwl, rhywbeth y mae fy swyddfa etholaeth fy hun, er enghraifft, wedi ymgymryd ag ef mewn gwirionedd, a rhywbeth yr ydym yn ei ystyried yn fuddiol, ond mae'n ymwneud hefyd â'r hyn a wnawn drwy annog a rhoi arweiniad yn ehangach. Ac mewn gwirionedd, yn rhaglen Cymru Iach ar Waith, mae hynny'n rhan o'r hyn sy'n digwydd—edrych ar iechyd meddwl gweithlu, nid iechyd corfforol yn unig. Mae hefyd yn rhan o'n contract economaidd yn un o'r pileri newydd, a hyrwyddo llesiant corfforol a meddyliol pobl hefyd. Felly, mae'n bendant yn rhan o'r hyn yr ydym eisiau i fusnesau ei wneud ac yn rhan o'r hyn y disgwyliwn ei weld wrth symud ymlaen fel rhan reolaidd o'r ffordd y mae pob busnes a gwasanaeth cyhoeddus yn gweithredu.

Busnesau Canol Trefi
Town-centre Businesses

7. Pa asesiad y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i wneud o effeithiau COVID ar fusnesau canol trefi yng Ngorllewin De Cymru? OQ57835

7. What assessment has the Welsh Government made of the effects of COVID on town-centre businesses in South Wales West? OQ57835

COVID has accelerated the trend we're seeing, with the change in the use of town and city centres and in particular, during the height of the pandemic, it obviously reduced demand for high-street retail. That's why, in January 2020, we launched the Transforming Towns programme to help support town-centre businesses, and that is now being led by my colleague the Deputy Minister for Climate Change.

Mae COVID wedi cyflymu'r duedd a welwn, gyda'r newid yn y defnydd o ganol trefi a dinasoedd ac yn arbennig, pan oedd y pandemig ar ei anterth, roedd hi'n amlwg ei fod yn lleihau'r galw am fanwerthu ar y stryd fawr. Dyna pam, ym mis Ionawr 2020, y gwnaethom lansio'r rhaglen Trawsnewid Trefi i helpu i gefnogi busnesau yng nghanol trefi, ac mae honno bellach yn cael ei harwain gan fy nghyd-Weinidog, y Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd.

Diolch, Weinidog. When prompted to rank what they would like to see in their local town centre or high street, thriving small, independent shops came out on top in a survey conducted by the Federation of Small Businesses for its recent report, 'A Vision for Welsh Towns'. Even before COVID, town centres in my region were struggling, and the pandemic has had an especially negative effect on small and family-run high-street retail businesses. The support given to these local businesses during the pandemic has, of course, helped them weather that particular storm, but now although restrictions are easing, footfall is still low and the bills are now really piling up.

One of my constituents has run a shop in Neath town centre for much of the last 10 years. He said that with support ending and high business rates on top of that, they're really having a tough time; as sky-rocketing energy bills are presenting another headache, he said lower business rates would really help. As high business rates are compounding the challenges that town centres face, will the Minister consider increasing rates relief for town-centre retail businesses and heed the FSB's call to urgently publish its review of the business rates system and outline proposals for substantive reform that works for small local businesses? Diolch.

Diolch, Weinidog. Pan ofynnwyd iddynt nodi'r hyn yr hoffent ei weld yng nghanol eu tref leol neu ar y stryd fawr yn lleol, daeth siopau bach annibynnol, ffyniannus i'r brig mewn arolwg a gynhaliwyd gan y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach ar gyfer eu hadroddiad diweddar, 'A Vision for Welsh Towns'. Hyd yn oed cyn COVID, roedd canol trefi yn fy rhanbarth yn ei chael hi'n anodd, ac mae'r pandemig wedi cael effaith arbennig o negyddol ar fusnesau manwerthu bach a theuluol ar y stryd fawr. Mae'r gefnogaeth a roddwyd i'r busnesau lleol hyn yn ystod y pandemig, wrth gwrs, wedi eu helpu i oroesi'r storm arbennig honno, ond erbyn hyn er bod y cyfyngiadau'n llacio, mae nifer yr ymwelwyr yn dal yn isel ac mae'r biliau bellach yn pentyrru go iawn.

Mae un o fy etholwyr wedi bod yn rhedeg siop yng nghanol tref Castell-nedd dros ran helaeth o'r 10 mlynedd diwethaf. Gyda chymorth yn dod i ben ac ardrethi busnes uchel ar ben hynny, dywedodd eu bod yn cael amser caled iawn; gan fod biliau ynni sy'n codi i'r entrychion yn gur pen arall, dywedodd y byddai ardrethi busnes is yn help mawr. Gan fod ardrethi busnes uchel yn dwysáu'r heriau y mae canol trefi'n eu hwynebu, a wnaiff y Gweinidog ystyried cynyddu rhyddhad ardrethi i fusnesau manwerthu yng nghanol trefi a gwrando ar alwad y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach i gyhoeddi eu hadolygiad o'r system ardrethi busnes ar frys ac amlinellu cynigion ar gyfer diwygio o sylwedd sy'n gweithio i fusnesau bach lleol? Diolch.

So, business rates reform is a matter for the Minister for Finance and Local Government. When it comes to the rates relief system, of course, we've announced rates relief for a range of businesses and we'd encourage businesses to make sure that they take up their entitlement to the 50 per cent rates relief. Now, having had, essentially, no business rates in a range of those areas to then having any business rates return will be a challenge for some businesses, compounded, of course, by the cost-of-living crisis, which is something for both the customers of those businesses as well as the businesses themselves, which will have their own energy bills as well.

So, the retail vision that we're working on is actually even more important, I think, about what we can do together to make sure that we do have a thriving and positive future for retail, both large and small. And, of course, when it comes to the business of how we have effective town centres, it's partly about a sense of place and what people think makes the place they live in special, as well as where you might visit as well. That's why we're trialling something called NearMeNow to provide small businesses and high streets with greater digital marketing capability. Because actually, as well as physical footfall, we know that lots of those businesses didn't have a digital presence pre the pandemic, and it's something that can generate footfall if people can collect items from those businesses and then look at other purchases while they're there. We continue to work with not just the FSB, but others on what the future vision for retail will be, and it's definitely entwined with the work that the Deputy Minister is leading on climate change, but also my portfolio on how we do generate a greater return for thriving high streets and places.

Mater i'r Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol yw diwygio ardrethi busnes. O ran y system rhyddhad ardrethi, wrth gwrs, rydym wedi cyhoeddi rhyddhad ardrethi i ystod o fusnesau a byddem yn annog busnesau i sicrhau eu bod yn manteisio ar eu hawl i'r rhyddhad ardrethi o 50 y cant. Nawr, mae'n her i rai busnesu newid i gael rhywfaint o ardrethi busnes ar ôl peidio â chael unrhyw ardrethi busnes yn y bôn mewn amryw o'r meysydd hynny, a chaiff hynny ei ddwysáu, wrth gwrs, gan yr argyfwng costau byw, sy'n rhywbeth i gwsmeriaid y busnesau hynny yn ogystal â'r busnesau eu hunain, a fydd â'u biliau ynni eu hunain hefyd.

Felly, mae'r weledigaeth fanwerthu yr ydym yn gweithio arni hyd yn oed yn bwysicach, rwy'n credu, o ran yr hyn y gallwn ei wneud gyda'n gilydd i sicrhau bod gennym ddyfodol ffyniannus a chadarnhaol ar gyfer manwerthu, yn siopau mawr a bach. Ac wrth gwrs, mae cael canol trefi effeithiol yn ymwneud yn rhannol ag ymdeimlad o le a'r hyn y mae pobl yn ei feddwl sy'n gwneud y lle y maent yn byw ynddo'n arbennig, yn ogystal â lle y gallech ymweld ag ef hefyd. Dyna pam ein bod yn treialu rhywbeth o'r enw NearMeNow i ddarparu mwy o allu marchnata digidol i fusnesau bach a strydoedd mawr. Oherwydd mewn gwirionedd, yn ogystal â'r nifer o ymwelwyr corfforol, gwyddom nad oedd gan lawer o'r busnesau hynny bresenoldeb digidol cyn y pandemig, ac mae'n rhywbeth a all gynhyrchu ymwelwyr os gall pobl gasglu eitemau o'r busnesau hynny ac edrych ar bryniannau eraill tra byddant yno. Rydym yn parhau i weithio nid yn unig gyda'r Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach, ond gydag eraill hefyd ar beth fydd y weledigaeth ar gyfer manwerthu yn y dyfodol, ac mae'n bendant yn cydgysylltu â'r gwaith y mae'r Dirprwy Weinidog yn ei arwain ar newid hinsawdd, ond hefyd fy mhortffolio i ar sut i greu mwy o elw ar gyfer strydoedd mawr a lleoedd ffyniannus.

Ansawdd Bywyd
Quality of Life

8. Pa flaenoriaeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei rhoi i wella ansawdd bywyd pobl wrth ddatblygu mentrau economaidd? OQ57837

8. What priority does the Welsh Government give to improving people's quality of life when developing economic initiatives? OQ57837

Our vision is for a well-being economy that drives prosperity, is environmentally sound and helps everyone to realise their potential. The principles of our groundbreaking Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 shape the decisions that we make in supporting our economic initiatives.

Ein gweledigaeth yw economi llesiant sy'n gyrru ffyniant, sy'n amgylcheddol gadarn ac yn helpu pawb i wireddu eu potensial. Mae egwyddorion ein Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015 arloesol yn llywio'r penderfyniadau a wnawn wrth gefnogi ein mentrau economaidd.

Diolch. The pandemic has left a lasting impression on the communities that I represent in South Wales East, and the impact has been more detrimental in the poorest places of the country, exacerbating inequalities that already existed. As we've marked two years since we first entered lockdown, has the Government considered how economic measures can incorporate measures that would encourage a healthier and fairer nation? For example, in our local government manifesto, Plaid Cymru will pledge to provide local government staff with access to occupational health services, leisure and sports facilities, as well as working with business providers to see how this access can be expanded to employees of SMEs. Is this something your Government will seek to work on in tandem with local authorities? Diolch.

Diolch. Mae'r pandemig wedi gadael argraff barhaol ar y cymunedau rwy'n eu cynrychioli yn Nwyrain De Cymru, ac mae'r effaith wedi bod yn fwy niweidiol yn y mannau tlotaf yn y wlad, gan waethygu'r anghydraddoldebau a oedd eisoes yn bodoli. Gan ein bod wedi nodi dwy flynedd ers inni ddechrau'r cyfyngiadau symud cyntaf, a yw'r Llywodraeth wedi ystyried sut y gall mesurau economaidd ymgorffori mesurau a fyddai'n hybu cenedl iachach a thecach? Er enghraifft, yn ein maniffesto llywodraeth leol, bydd Plaid Cymru yn addo rhoi mynediad i staff llywodraeth leol at wasanaethau iechyd galwedigaethol, cyfleusterau hamdden a chwaraeon, yn ogystal â gweithio gyda darparwyr busnes i weld sut y gellir ehangu'r mynediad hwn i gynnwys gweithwyr busnesau bach a chanolig. A yw hyn yn rhywbeth y bydd eich Llywodraeth yn ceisio gweithio arno ar y cyd ag awdurdodau lleol? Diolch.

14:10

Well, of course, every local authority will have its own mandate in the near future, and I hope to be working with an even greater number of Welsh Labour leaders in the future. But, as we have seen during the last two years, we've worked effectively with leaderships of varying political shades. In the Cardiff capital region, there's a Conservative leader, some independents and Labour leaders. When I think about north Wales and west Wales, we again work with people of varied political leadership. So, the challenge will be the mandate that each local authority has and their choices about how they want to exercise the powers and responsibilities that they have too.

But when it comes to a healthier and fairer Wales, that is very much in line with the aspirations and ambitions of this Government. If you think about the questions we've just previously heard, about the economic contract, about one of its main aspects now in terms of the call for an improvement in the physical and mental health of the workforce. If you think about, from a fairer work perspective, the fact that there's going to be a significant piece of legislation, where Members will be discussing what to do on social partnership procurement and including the central concept of fair work. So, that's central to what this Government's mission is: economic growth in a sustainable manner, and a genuine fair-work nation. So, I look forward to what I hope will be constructive conversations, regardless of the verdict of the electorate and the future leadership of local authorities across Wales.

Wel, wrth gwrs, bydd gan bob awdurdod lleol ei fandad ei hun yn y dyfodol agos, ac rwy'n gobeithio gweithio gyda nifer fwy byth o arweinwyr Llafur Cymru yn y dyfodol. Ond fel y gwelsom yn ystod y ddwy flynedd ddiwethaf, rydym wedi gweithio'n effeithiol gydag arweinwyr o wahanol liwiau gwleidyddol. Ym mhrifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd, ceir arweinydd Ceidwadol, aelodau annibynnol a Llafur. Pan feddyliaf am ogledd Cymru a'r gorllewin, rydym unwaith eto'n gweithio gydag arweinwyr gwleidyddol o bleidiau amrywiol. Felly, yr her fydd y mandad sydd gan bob awdurdod lleol a'u dewisiadau ynglŷn â sut y maent am arfer y pwerau a'r cyfrifoldebau sydd ganddynt hefyd.

Ond mae sicrhau Cymru iachach a thecach yn cyd-fynd â dyhead ac uchelgais y Llywodraeth hon. Os meddyliwch am y cwestiynau yr ydym newydd eu clywed, am y contract economaidd, am un o'i brif elfennau yn awr gyda'r alwad am wella iechyd corfforol a meddyliol y gweithlu. O safbwynt gwaith tecach, os meddyliwch y bydd deddfwriaeth sylweddol yn dod, lle bydd yr Aelodau'n trafod beth i'w wneud ar gaffael partneriaethau cymdeithasol ac yn cynnwys cysyniad canolog gwaith teg. Felly, mae hynny'n ganolog i genhadaeth y Llywodraeth hon: twf economaidd mewn modd cynaliadwy, a chenedl gwaith teg go iawn. Felly, edrychaf ymlaen at sgyrsiau adeiladol, gobeithio, beth bynnag fydd dyfarniad yr etholwyr ac arweinyddiaeth awdurdodau lleol Cymru yn y dyfodol.

Busnesau Canol Trefi yn Sir Gaerfyrddin
Town-centre Businesses in Carmarthenshire

9. Sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi adferiad busnesau canol trefi yn sir Gaerfyrddin? OQ57828

9. How is the Welsh Government supporting the recovery of town centre businesses in Carmarthenshire? OQ57828

Our £136 million Transforming Towns programme focuses on the diversification and sustainable growth of town and city centres, through interventions that include the reuse of derelict and empty buildings, increasing the variety of and access to services in towns and cities, and an emphasis on flexible working and living space, mixed-use space, improved green infrastructure, and, of course, services and leisure.

Mae ein rhaglen Trawsnewid Trefi gwerth £136 miliwn yn canolbwyntio ar arallgyfeirio a thwf cynaliadwy canol trefi a dinasoedd, drwy ymyriadau sy'n cynnwys ailddefnyddio adeiladau segur a gwag, cynyddu amrywiaeth a mynediad at wasanaethau mewn trefi a dinasoedd, a phwyslais ar ofod byw a gweithio hyblyg, mannau defnydd cymysg, gwell seilwaith gwyrdd, a gwasanaethau a hamdden wrth gwrs.

Fe glywon ni yn gynharach, wrth gwrs, yng nghwestiwn Sioned Williams, y cyfeiriad at adroddiad yr FSB, sy'n dangos sefyllfa heriol iawn ar gyfer siopau yn ein canol trefi, ac roedd 67 y cant o'r cyhoedd a oedd wedi cael eu cwestiynu yn disgrifio eu canol trefi nhw yn llwm neu yn wael o gymharu â dim ond 3 y cant yn sôn am ganol trefi ffyniannus. Ydy'r Gweinidog, yn y cyd-destun heriol hynny, yn croesawu'r buddsoddiad helaeth mae cyngor sir Caerfyrddin, o dan arweiniad Plaid Cymru, wedi'i gyhoeddi yn ei raglen trefi—y rhaglen 10 Tref—gan gynnwys buddsoddiad yn nhref Rhydaman yn fy etholaeth i? Ac, o feddwl am beth gall Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud ar lefel genedlaethol i hyrwyddo'r buddsoddiad lleol yma, ydych chi'n edrych ar ddiwygio, symud o'r system ardrethi busnes i sail newydd, ar sail gwerth tir, lle mae yna dystiolaeth y byddai newid hynny yn hyrwyddo, yn ysgogi, buddsoddiad gwell yn ein canol trefi ac yn decach o ran y mathau o siopau lleol annibynnol roedd Sioned Williams yn cyfeirio atyn nhw?

We heard earlier, in Sioned Williams's question, a reference to the FSB report, which demonstrates the very challenging circumstances facing shops in our town centres, and 67 per cent of the public questioned described their town centres as being bleak or in a poor state, with only 3 per cent talking about prosperous town centres. Now, in that challenging context, does the Minister welcome the significant investment that Plaid Cymru-led Carmarthenshire County Council has announced in its towns programme—its 10 Towns programme—including investment in Ammanford in my constituency? And in thinking of what the Welsh Government can do at a national level to promote local investment of this kind, are you looking at moving away from a business rates system to a new system based on land value, where there is evidence that changing that regime would promote and encourage better investment in our town centres and would be fairer in terms of the kind of independent local shops that Sioned Williams referred to?

Well, I welcome the Member's consistent call for land valuation to replace business rates, and, of course, as I've said earlier, the reform of business rates or otherwise is a matter for the Minister for Finance and Local Government.

But I continue to take an interest in the practical reality of where we are now and where we could be in the future, and that's why we have worked alongside towns in terms of a specific piece of work that we're doing, a specific funding, not just a Transforming Towns initiative, but the money we've given to the smart town centre, the towns into business fund, what we're looking to do to both measure and promote footfall within what we want to be thriving, living and working spaces. And when it comes to the work that Carmarthenshire council is doing, of course, they've had over £10 million from the Welsh Government in Transforming Towns grant funding, and that has helped with a range of transformation projects that the council is undertaking with that Welsh Government funding.

I do welcome the fact that, as I said earlier, local authorities of different political leaderships are looking to invest in their town centres, looking to invest in their future. I look forward to working with whoever the electors choose to continue leading and running Carmarthenshire County Council on the work that I think we will find a consensus for, in Carmarthenshire and across each of the economic regions, where, of course, local authorities are pooling and sharing a range of their resources.

Wel, rwy'n croesawu galwad gyson yr Aelod am weld prisio tir yn cymryd lle ardrethi busnes, ac wrth gwrs, fel y dywedais yn gynharach, mater i'r Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol yw a ddylid diwygio ardrethi busnes ai peidio.

Ond rwy'n parhau i ymddiddori yn realiti ymarferol y sefyllfa yr ydym ynddi yn awr a lle y gallem fod yn y dyfodol, a dyna pam ein bod wedi gweithio ochr yn ochr â threfi gyda gwaith penodol, cyllid penodol, nid menter Trawsnewid Trefi yn unig, ond yr arian yr ydym wedi'i roi i ganol trefi clyfar, y gronfa trefi i fusnes, yr hyn y bwriadwn ei wneud i fesur a chwyddo defnydd o fannau byw a gweithio ffyniannus. Ac ar y gwaith y mae Cyngor Sir Gâr yn ei wneud wrth gwrs, maent wedi cael dros £10 miliwn gan Lywodraeth Cymru drwy gyllid grant Trawsnewid Trefi, ac mae hynny wedi helpu gydag amrywiaeth o brosiectau trawsnewid y mae'r cyngor yn eu cyflawni gyda'r cyllid hwnnw gan Lywodraeth Cymru.

Fel y dywedais yn gynharach, rwy'n croesawu'r ffaith bod awdurdodau lleol dan arweinwyr gwleidyddol gwahanol yn bwriadu buddsoddi yng nghanol eu trefi, gan  fuddsoddi yn eu dyfodol. Edrychaf ymlaen at weithio gyda phwy bynnag y mae'r etholwyr yn ei ddewis i barhau i arwain a rhedeg Cyngor Sir Gâr ar y gwaith y credaf y down o hyd i gonsensws iddo, yn sir Gaerfyrddin ac ar draws pob un o'r rhanbarthau economaidd, lle mae awdurdodau lleol, wrth gwrs, yn cyfuno ac yn rhannu amryw o'u hadnoddau.

14:15
Cronfa Codi'r Gwastad
The Levelling-up Fund

10. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cael gyda phartneriaid i sicrhau nad yw Cymru ar ei cholled yn economaidd oherwydd cronfa codi'r gwastad? OQ57823

10. What discussions has the Minister had with partners to ensure that Wales does not lose out economically due to the levelling-up fund? OQ57823

As the Member will know, the UK Government has bypassed the Welsh Government and the Senedd on the way that this fund has operated in its pilot phase. It fails to address persistent regional inequalities across the UK as it is currently formed. I continue to have discussions with partners—not just Ministers within the Government, but outside of the Welsh Government—on how best to mitigate the disruption and substantial loss of overall funding, which includes, of course, the lost £1 billion that we will face over the next few years.

Fel y gŵyr yr Aelod, mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi diystyru Llywodraeth Cymru a'r Senedd gyda'r ffordd y mae'r gronfa hon wedi gweithredu yn ei chyfnod treialu. Nid yw'n mynd i'r afael ag anghydraddoldebau rhanbarthol parhaus ledled y DU fel y mae wedi'i ffurfio ar hyn o bryd. Rwy'n dal i gael trafodaethau gyda phartneriaid—nid Gweinidogion y Llywodraeth yn unig, ond y tu allan i Lywodraeth Cymru—ar y ffordd orau o liniaru'r aflonyddwch a cholli cyllid cyffredinol yn sylweddol, sy'n cynnwys, wrth gwrs, yr £1 biliwn o golled y byddwn yn ei hwynebu dros y blynyddoedd nesaf.

Diolch yn fawr, Weinidog. A few weeks ago, I visited the new Spark centre in Cardiff University, and I encourage all Members to visit that new research centre. They stressed to me, prior to Brexit, the amount of funding they were receiving from the European Union. Universities Wales received almost £570 million since the turn of the century. In the context of Cardiff University, that had a huge impact and it's been crucial with regard to their research and their main ventures, which have subsequently provided a huge impetus towards the local economy in Cardiff and beyond. But they were very concerned with the levelling-up proposals affecting universities in Wales. Therefore, in this context—I appreciate what you said, that you as a Government have been completely bypassed—what discussions has the Minister had with the education Minister and also with the UK Government and universities to ensure that Welsh universities do not miss out because of the UK Government's levelling-up fund? Diolch yn fawr.

Diolch yn fawr, Weinidog. Ychydig wythnosau yn ôl, ymwelais â chanolfan newydd Spark ym Mhrifysgol Caerdydd, ac rwy'n annog pob Aelod i ymweld â'r ganolfan ymchwil newydd honno. Fe wnaethant bwysleisio i mi, cyn Brexit, faint o arian a dderbynient gan yr Undeb Ewropeaidd. Derbyniodd Prifysgolion Cymru bron i £570 miliwn ers troad y ganrif. Yng nghyd-destun Prifysgol Caerdydd, cafodd hynny effaith enfawr ac mae wedi bod yn hollbwysig i'w hymchwil a'u prif fentrau, sydd wedi rhoi hwb enfawr yn sgil hynny i'r economi leol yng Nghaerdydd a thu hwnt. Ond roeddent yn pryderu'n fawr am y cynigion codi'r gwastad sy'n effeithio ar brifysgolion yng Nghymru. Felly, yn y cyd-destun hwn—rwy'n derbyn yr hyn a ddywedoch chi, eich bod chi fel Llywodraeth wedi cael eich diystyru'n llwyr—pa drafodaethau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cael gyda'r Gweinidog addysg a hefyd gyda Llywodraeth y DU a phrifysgolion i sicrhau nad yw prifysgolion Cymru ar eu colled oherwydd cronfa codi'r gwastad Llywodraeth y DU? Diolch yn fawr.

The reality is that we may not be able to ensure that universities, and, indeed, the further education sector, who also were significant beneficiaries of European funds, don't lose out. That's because of the choice that has been made. It's a clear-sighted choice not to include the Welsh Government and not to meet the clear manifesto pledge to replace every single penny of former European funds.

You are right to point out the several hundred millions of pounds that have gone into the further and higher education sectors, and that's a challenge—at this point in time, we don't have the budgets to make up for all of that loss. That can't be right for Wales. Actually, if you think about any party before the last Senedd election we had about a year ago, no-one went into that election pledging to remove funding from research, development and innovation. In fact, we were all talking about what more we wanted to do, and the same, indeed, for skills. But it's a direct consequence of what's happening that we don't have the budget to carry on even at the same level in that overall picture as a result of European funding.

I've made choices to prioritise skills investment, and that means I'll be able to do less in other areas. And when you think about some of the positive headlines that have come from the way that the levelling-up department has announced recent initiatives, they talk about a rise in the percentage of allocation of money into research, development and innovation. The problem with that is that that rise that's been announced amounts to £9 million of extra funding; you have to net that off, though, against the £60 million that we have lost from EU funding. So, it's still a net loss to Wales of £51 million every year. It's all of those things that are adding up, and that is the very real challenge that we will face.

I hope that people will take up the call that was almost made by the Conservative spokesman on this issue, where he said, just a few short weeks ago in this Chamber, that Wales should not lose out and the manifesto pledge should be kept. I hope we can have clarity on the matter right across the Chamber to make the case for Wales, to make sure there is no missing billion in the next three years.

Y realiti yw efallai na fyddwn yn gallu sicrhau nad yw prifysgolion, a'r sector addysg bellach yn wir, a oedd hefyd yn elwa'n sylweddol o gronfeydd Ewropeaidd, ar eu colled. Mae hynny oherwydd y dewis sydd wedi'i wneud. Mae'n ddewis clir i beidio â chynnwys Llywodraeth Cymru a pheidio â chyflawni'r addewid maniffesto clir i sicrhau arian yn lle pob ceiniog o'r hen gronfeydd Ewropeaidd.

Rydych yn iawn i dynnu sylw at y cannoedd o filiynau o bunnoedd sydd wedi mynd i'r sectorau addysg bellach ac uwch, ac mae honno'n her—ar hyn o bryd, nid oes gennym gyllidebau i wneud iawn am yr holl golled honno. Ni all hynny fod yn iawn i Gymru. Mewn gwirionedd, os meddyliwch am unrhyw blaid cyn etholiad diwethaf y Senedd a gawsom tua blwyddyn yn ôl, nid aeth neb i mewn i'r etholiad hwnnw gan addo dileu cyllid ymchwil, datblygu ac arloesi. Yn wir, roeddem i gyd yn sôn am beth arall y dymunem ei wneud, a'r un peth am sgiliau, yn wir. Ond canlyniad uniongyrchol yr hyn sy'n digwydd yw nad oes gennym gyllideb i barhau hyd yn oed ar yr un lefel yn y darlun cyffredinol hwnnw o ganlyniad i gyllid Ewropeaidd.

Rwyf wedi gwneud dewisiadau i flaenoriaethu buddsoddi mewn sgiliau, ac mae hynny'n golygu na fyddaf yn gallu gwneud cymaint mewn meysydd eraill. A phan feddyliwch am rai o'r penawdau cadarnhaol sydd wedi dod o'r ffordd y mae'r adran codi'r gwastad wedi cyhoeddi mentrau yn ddiweddar, maent yn sôn am gynnydd yng nghanran y dyraniad arian i ymchwil, datblygu ac arloesi. Y broblem gyda hynny yw bod y cynnydd sydd wedi'i gyhoeddi yn £9 miliwn o gyllid ychwanegol; serch hynny rhaid ichi netio hwnnw yn erbyn y £60 miliwn yr ydym wedi'i golli o gyllid yr UE. Felly, mae'n dal i fod yn golled net o £51 miliwn i Gymru bob blwyddyn. Mae'r holl bethau hynny gyda'i gilydd yn her wirioneddol y byddwn yn ei hwynebu.

Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd pobl yn lleisio'r alwad y bu bron i lefarydd y Ceidwadwyr ar y mater hwn ei gwneud, pan ddywedodd, ychydig wythnosau'n ôl yn unig yn y Siambr hon, na ddylai Cymru fod ar ei cholled ac y dylid cadw'r addewid maniffesto. Gobeithio y gallwn gael eglurder ar y mater ar draws y Siambr i gyflwyno'r achos dros Gymru, er mwyn sicrhau nad oes biliwn yn mynd ar goll yn y tair blynedd nesaf.

Cwestiynau Amserol
Topical Questions

Galwaf nawr ar Luke Fletcher i ofyn ei gwestiwn amserol i Weinidog yr Economi cyn inni symud ymlaen at eitem 2. 

I now call on Luke Fletcher to ask his topical question to the Minister for Economy before we move on to item 2. 

Parc Ynni Baglan
Baglan Energy Park

Pa asesiad y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i wneud o'r effaith y bydd penderfyniad yr Uchel Lys mewn perthynas â pharc ynni Baglan yn ei chael ar fusnesau? TQ611

What assessment has the Welsh Government made of the impact the High Court decision relating to Baglan energy park will have on businesses? TQ611

My officials and I are considering the judgment, including the Welsh Government's position with regard to a possible appeal from the High Court judgment. The Welsh Government is very mindful of the stress and uncertainty that customers of the energy park have experienced. We will continue to work with all relevant parties to try to secure a solution that protects the environment, public health and jobs. I of course have issued a written statement on this issue yesterday after Mike Hedges's request in questions to the Trefnydd. 

Mae fy swyddogion a minnau'n ystyried y dyfarniad, gan gynnwys safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru mewn perthynas ag apêl bosibl o ddyfarniad yr Uchel Lys. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ymwybodol iawn o'r straen a'r ansicrwydd y mae cwsmeriaid y parc ynni wedi'u profi. Byddwn yn parhau i weithio gyda'r holl bartïon perthnasol i geisio sicrhau ateb sy'n diogelu'r amgylchedd, iechyd y cyhoedd a swyddi. Wrth gwrs, cyhoeddais ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ar y mater ddoe ar ôl cais Mike Hedges mewn cwestiynau i'r Trefnydd. 

14:20

Diolch, Weinidog. I'm sure you'll be glad to know that this is my last question to you today. Jonathan Ridd, a director in the energy park, has said that small firms at the park will now have to foot the cost of diesel generators in order to continue operating, stating that given rising fuel costs some businesses will likely be paying up to eight times more for energy. This in turn puts pressure on firms' finances, with some potentially having no option but to potentially downsize, putting jobs at risk if this goes ahead. Has the Government specifically looked at how they can help businesses with the additional potential cost, and what support is on standby for any worker who might find themselves without a job?

Diolch, Weinidog. Rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn falch o wybod mai dyma fy nghwestiwn olaf i chi heddiw. Mae Jonathan Ridd, cyfarwyddwr yn y parc ynni, wedi dweud y bydd yn rhaid i gwmnïau bach yn y parc dalu cost generaduron diesel yn awr er mwyn parhau i weithredu, gan ddweud y bydd rhai busnesau yn talu hyd at wyth gwaith yn fwy am ynni o ystyried y costau tanwydd cynyddol. Mae hyn yn ei dro yn rhoi pwysau ar gyllid cwmnïau, gyda rhai o bosibl heb unrhyw ddewis ond lleihau, gan roi swyddi mewn perygl os bydd hynny'n digwydd. A yw'r Llywodraeth wedi edrych yn benodol ar sut y gallant helpu busnesau gyda'r gost ychwanegol bosibl, a pha gymorth wrth gefn sy'n bodoli i unrhyw weithiwr a allai golli ei swydd?

If workers do find themselves without a job, we have a range of support measures that we can take and have taken in the past. What we're actually trying to do, though, in a range of the steps that we're taking is to try to avoid a significant loss of jobs as a result of the proposed action to cut off the power supplies. What the judgment did say was that all businesses will have their power maintained until at least 4 April. That isn't a long distance into the future, and that means that there is a real imperative for my officials and I to make choices about whether we're going to appeal the judgment or whether, indeed, that can be put off because of the judicial review proceedings that I have served upon the Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy in the UK Government.

Yes, I am concerned, yes, I continue to work with my officials but also other partners including Neath Port Talbot Council and Dŵr Cymru, and yes, we're particularly concerned about the impact on jobs within the park. The challenge for this is, though, that if people do use diesel generators, it isn't just the cost to them—there is an environmental cost to that as well. This is an area that doesn't have great air quality, and significant use of diesel generators may be something that Natural Resources Wales would not be in a position to permit. We have a range of areas that we've asked the court to consider. As I say, I'll need to take further advice from my officials, including legal advice, and if there is to be any further action taken, I will, of course, update Members with another written statement. 

Os yw gweithwyr yn colli eu swyddi, mae gennym ystod o fesurau cymorth y gallwn eu rhoi ar waith ac a roddwyd ar waith gennym yn y gorffennol. Ond yr hyn y ceisiwn ei wneud mewn gwirionedd mewn amryw o'r camau yr ydym yn eu cymryd yw ceisio osgoi colli nifer sylweddol o swyddi o ganlyniad i'r camau arfaethedig i dorri'r cyflenwadau pŵer. Yr hyn a ddywedodd y dyfarniad oedd y bydd pŵer pob busnes yn cael ei gadw tan o leiaf 4 Ebrill. Nid yw hynny'n bell i ffwrdd, ac mae'n golygu bod gwir reidrwydd i fy swyddogion a minnau benderfynu a ydym yn mynd i apelio yn erbyn y dyfarniad neu'n wir a ellir gohirio hynny oherwydd achos yr adolygiad barnwrol a gyflwynais i'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Fusnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol yn Llywodraeth y DU.

Ydw, rwy'n pryderu, ydw, rwy'n parhau i weithio gyda fy swyddogion ond hefyd partneriaid eraill gan gynnwys Cyngor Castell-nedd Port Talbot a Dŵr Cymru, ac rydym yn pryderu'n arbennig am yr effaith ar swyddi yn y parc. Yr her i hyn, serch hynny, yw, os yw pobl yn defnyddio generaduron diesel, nid y gost iddynt hwy yn unig ydyw—mae cost amgylcheddol i hynny hefyd. Mae'n ardal heb ansawdd aer gwych, a gall defnydd sylweddol o generaduron diesel fod yn rhywbeth na fyddai Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru mewn sefyllfa i'w ganiatáu. Mae gennym amrywiaeth o feysydd yr ydym wedi gofyn i'r llys eu hystyried. Fel y dywedais, bydd angen imi gael cyngor pellach gan fy swyddogion, gan gynnwys cyngor cyfreithiol, ac os cymerir unrhyw gamau pellach, byddaf yn rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau gyda datganiad ysgrifenedig arall wrth gwrs. 

As mentioned by the Minister, I asked a question on this to the Trefnydd yesterday. Can I thank the Welsh Government for their very prompt action? I read the Minister's statement yesterday. I welcome the decision to serve proceedings via judicial review on BEIS. This has the potential to seriously affect the employment of people living in Swansea, Neath Port Talbot and Bridgend, as you know yourself, Deputy Presiding Officer. The inaction of the Westminster Government is shocking. Is there anything further that the Welsh Government or firms on the site can do to ensure a continuity of supply?

Fel y soniodd y Gweinidog, gofynnais gwestiwn am hyn i'r Trefnydd ddoe. A gaf fi ddiolch i Lywodraeth Cymru am weithredu'n gyflym? Darllenais ddatganiad y Gweinidog ddoe. Rwy'n croesawu'r penderfyniad i gyflwyno achos drwy adolygiad barnwrol i'r Adran Busnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol. Mae perygl i hyn effeithio'n ddifrifol ar gyflogaeth pobl sy'n byw yn Abertawe, Castell-nedd Port Talbot a Phen-y-bont ar Ogwr, fel y gwyddoch eich hun, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Mae diffyg gweithredu Llywodraeth San Steffan yn frawychus. A oes unrhyw beth pellach y gall Llywodraeth Cymru neu gwmnïau ar y safle ei wneud i sicrhau bod y cyflenwad yn parhau?

We've worked really hard over nearly a year now to try to regularise the supply since the official receiver was appointed and since there was a real threat to the power supply. There's a reason why the Deputy Presiding Officer can't ask this question even though it's in his constituency, and I've been able to update him on a range of matters outside of the Chamber. The power supply affects businesses on the park; it also affects the power supply to pumping stations operated by Neath Port Talbot Council and Dŵr Cymru. Part of our challenge is that if those pumping stations fail and there's a storm event, as we're all used to seeing on a more regular basis, there are potentially significant consequences for businesses, residents, and what it would mean for the nearby estuary environment if there was a foul water escape. That environmental and human harm is avoidable. That's why we're taking the judicial review action—because it's our contention that the Secretary of State in the UK Government does have the power to direct the official receiver. It's worth noting that, in open court, the legal representatives for the official receiver appeared to concede that that was their view too. The challenge is whether the Secretary of State will exercise the power that we say he has or whether, actually, we will end up spending lots of public money on going through another course of legal action rather than acting on what I would see as the most proportionate and least costly way of avoiding the significant harm that really could be done to jobs, public health and the environment. 

Rydym wedi gweithio'n galed iawn dros bron i flwyddyn bellach i geisio rheoleiddio'r cyflenwad ers penodi'r derbynnydd swyddogol ac ers bod bygythiad gwirioneddol i'r cyflenwad pŵer. Mae rheswm pam na all y Dirprwy Lywydd ofyn y cwestiwn hwn er ei fod yn ei etholaeth, ac rwyf wedi gallu rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf iddo am amrywiaeth o faterion y tu allan i'r Siambr. Mae'r cyflenwad pŵer yn effeithio ar fusnesau yn y parc; mae hefyd yn effeithio ar y cyflenwad pŵer i orsafoedd pwmpio a weithredir gan Gyngor Castell-nedd Port Talbot a Dŵr Cymru. Rhan o'n her os bydd y gorsafoedd pwmpio hynny'n methu a bod storm, fel y mae pawb ohonom wedi arfer eu gweld yn fwy rheolaidd, yw y gallai fod canlyniadau sylweddol i fusnesau, trigolion, a'r hyn y byddai'n ei olygu i amgylchedd cyfagos yr aber pe bai dŵr budr yn gollwng. Gellir osgoi niwed i'r amgylchedd ac i bobl. Dyna pam ein bod yn cyflwyno achos yr adolygiad barnwrol—oherwydd ein dadl ni yw bod gan yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn Llywodraeth y DU bŵer i gyfarwyddo'r derbynnydd swyddogol. Mae'n werth nodi, mewn llys agored, ei bod yn ymddangos bod cynrychiolwyr cyfreithiol y derbynnydd swyddogol yn cyfaddef mai dyna oedd eu barn hwythau hefyd. Yr her yw a fydd yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yn arfer y pŵer y dywedwn sydd ganddo neu a fyddwn ni, mewn gwirionedd, yn gwario llawer o arian cyhoeddus ar ddilyn llwybr cyfreithiol arall yn hytrach na gweithredu ar yr hyn y gwelaf yw'r ffordd fwyaf cymesur a lleiaf costus o osgoi'r niwed sylweddol a allai ddigwydd i swyddi, iechyd y cyhoedd a'r amgylchedd. 

Minister, as you quite rightly pointed out in your written statement, there will be a very significant impact from the termination of the private wire energy supply to businesses and citizens in Baglan. In addition to the legal proceedings that have been launched by the Welsh Government, Dŵr Cymru and Neath Port Talbot Council, what else is being done to speed up the supply of energy to the site so that jobs can be secured and workers given the confidence they need to be reassured that the Welsh Government simply are not abandoning them in the mix of this situation?

Weinidog, fel y dywedoch chi'n gwbl briodol yn eich datganiad ysgrifenedig, bydd effaith sylweddol iawn yn sgil terfynu'r cyflenwad ynni gwifren breifat i fusnesau a dinasyddion ym Maglan. Yn ogystal â'r achosion cyfreithiol a gychwynnwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru, Dŵr Cymru a Chyngor Castell-nedd Port Talbot, beth arall sy'n cael ei wneud i gyflymu'r cyflenwad ynni i'r safle fel y gellir diogelu swyddi a bod gweithwyr yn cael yr hyder sydd ei angen arnynt i gael sicrwydd nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnu arnynt yn y sefyllfa hon?

14:25

I think the tone of your closing remark undoes some of the more positive points that you were making earlier. The Welsh Government has absolutely not abandoned workers. I've agreed to spend several million pounds—I've outlined this in previous written statements the Member will have had the opportunity to read—to actually regularise the supply. It's not a statutory responsibility of the Welsh Government to do that, but my choice to do that was because of the direct impact on significant numbers of jobs on that park. But also, as I pointed out in response to Mike Hedges and in the regular conversations that the constituency Member has had with me, if the pumping stations fail, there is the real potential for really significant harms to residents and businesses and the wider environment. That's why we are paying for a new connection to be put in place. Our challenge is that, whilst the connection to those pumping stations is due to be maintained until 18 April, we don't have certainty that Western Power will have regularised a supply to those places by then. Who on earth would want to be in a position where a week after Easter there's a storm event, there's a power supply that is intermittent, and those pumping stations were not to work effectively? We have taken the action we have done up to this point. It's why we think it is the right thing for the Secretary of State for BEIS to exercise the power that we say he has to direct the official receiver to a different course of action, taking proper account of the direct and unavoidable impact of ceasing the power supply at that point. As I say, once I've taken further advice from my officials, I'd be happy to update Members further when I do have more to say.

Credaf fod cywair eich sylw olaf yn dadwneud rhai o'r pwyntiau mwy cadarnhaol a wnaethoch yn gynharach. Nid yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cefnu ar weithwyr o gwbl. Rwyf wedi cytuno i wario sawl miliwn o bunnoedd—rwyf wedi amlinellu hyn mewn datganiadau ysgrifenedig blaenorol y bydd yr Aelod wedi cael cyfle i'w darllen—i reoleiddio'r cyflenwad mewn gwirionedd. Nid cyfrifoldeb statudol Llywodraeth Cymru yw gwneud hynny, ond rwy'n dewis ei wneud oherwydd yr effaith uniongyrchol ar nifer sylweddol o swyddi yn y parc hwnnw. Ond hefyd, fel y dywedais mewn ymateb i Mike Hedges ac yn y sgyrsiau rheolaidd y mae'r Aelod etholaeth wedi'u cael gyda mi, os bydd y gorsafoedd pwmpio'n methu, mae gwir berygl o niwed gwirioneddol sylweddol i drigolion a busnesau a'r amgylchedd ehangach. Dyna pam ein bod yn talu i osod cysylltiad newydd. Er bod y cysylltiad â'r gorsafoedd pwmpio i fod i gael ei gadw tan 18 Ebrill, ein her yw nad oes gennym sicrwydd y bydd Western Power wedi rheoleiddio cyflenwad i'r lleoedd hynny erbyn hynny. Pwy ar y ddaear a fyddai am fod mewn sefyllfa lle y ceir storm wythnos ar ôl y Pasg, gyda chyflenwad pŵer ysbeidiol, a'r gorsafoedd pwmpio heb fod yn gweithio'n effeithiol? Rydym wedi gweithredu'r camau a wnaethom hyd at y pwynt hwn. Dyna pam y credwn mai'r peth iawn i'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Fusnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol ei wneud yw arfer y pŵer y dywedwn sydd ganddo i gyfeirio'r derbynnydd swyddogol at lwybr gweithredu gwahanol, gan roi ystyriaeth briodol i effaith uniongyrchol ac anochel torri'r cyflenwad pŵer ar yr adeg honno. Fel y dywedais, wedi imi gael cyngor pellach gan fy swyddogion, rwy'n hapus i roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau pan fydd gennyf fwy i'w ddweud.

2. Cwestiynau i'r Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol
2. Questions to the Minister for Health and Social Services

Eitem 2 heddiw, cwestiynau i'r Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol. Mae cwestiwn 1 i'w ateb gan y Dirprwy Weinidog Iechyd Meddwl a Llesiant. Andrew R.T. Davies.

Item 2, questions to the Minister for Health and Social Services. The first question is to be answered by the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being and is to be asked by Andrew R.T. Davies.

Rhestrau Aros Iechyd Meddwl
Mental Health Waiting Lists

1. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i fynd i'r afael â rhestrau aros iechyd meddwl yng Nghymru? OQ57840

1. What is the Welsh Government doing to tackle mental health waiting lists in Wales? OQ57840

We are prioritising an additional £50 million, £75 million and £90 million ring-fenced funding for mental health for 2022‑23, 2023-24 and 2024-25 respectively. This is in addition to the £760 million invested annually in the local health board mental health ring fence, and will support the continued transformation of our mental health services to provide earlier intervention and to reduce the need for more specialist services.

Rydym yn blaenoriaethu £50 miliwn, £75 miliwn a £90 miliwn ychwanegol o gyllid wedi'i neilltuo ar gyfer iechyd meddwl ar gyfer 2022-23, 2023-24 a 2024-25 yn y drefn honno. Mae hyn yn ychwanegol at y £760 miliwn a fuddsoddir yn flynyddol o gyllid iechyd meddwl wedi'i neilltuo i fyrddau iechyd lleol, a bydd yn cefnogi'r gwaith parhaus o drawsnewid ein gwasanaethau iechyd meddwl er mwyn darparu ymyrraeth gynharach a lleihau'r angen am wasanaethau mwy arbenigol.

Thank you, Minister, for that response. Last year, I questioned you over the referral times in the Cardiff and Vale health board area, and in particular the woeful referral times of the 28-day assessment period, where Cardiff and Vale were only assessing a third of patients, as opposed to a Welsh average of two thirds of patients. Additional money has been made available by the Welsh Government—considerable additional money has been made available. Very often it's not just about the money, it's about how that's implemented. Can you update me as to what improvements patients within the Cardiff and Vale area have seen because of that money and, importantly, what are the latest up-to-date timings regarding referral times? Because a third in 28 days of patients presenting is just not good enough.  

Diolch am yr ymateb hwnnw, Weinidog. Y llynedd, gofynnais gwestiwn i chi ynglŷn â'r amseroedd atgyfeirio yn ardal bwrdd iechyd Caerdydd a'r Fro, ac yn enwedig amseroedd atgyfeirio truenus y cyfnod asesu 28 diwrnod, lle'r oedd Caerdydd a'r Fro ond yn asesu traean o gleifion, yn hytrach na chyfartaledd Cymru o ddwy ran o dair o gleifion. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi darparu arian ychwanegol—mae arian ychwanegol sylweddol wedi'i ddarparu. Yn aml iawn, mae'n ymwneud â mwy na'r arian, mae'n ymwneud â sut y caiff ei ddefnyddio. A wnewch chi roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf imi ynghylch pa welliannau y mae cleifion yn ardal Caerdydd a'r Fro wedi'u gweld oherwydd yr arian hwnnw ac yn bwysig, beth yw'r amseroedd atgyfeirio diweddaraf? Oherwydd nid yw asesu traean o gleifion o fewn 28 diwrnod yn ddigon da.  

Can I thank the Member for that supplementary question? I share his concerns about the continued difficulties with waiting times in Cardiff and Vale. I have met Cardiff and Vale three times separately to discuss, in detail, their approach to managing their waiting times. I think it is important to recognise that they face particular challenges in Cardiff and Vale. Two thirds of children who are waiting in Wales are actually on the Cardiff and Vale waiting list for specialist child and adolescent mental health services, and also Cardiff and Vale University Health Board is dealing with a unique set of circumstances.

In November 2021 the health board reported a 27 per cent increase in referrals for primary care CAMHS, and 17 per cent in specialist CAMHS. I know from my discussions with Cardiff and Vale—and I absolutely agree with you that it's not just about money—they are carrying a lot of vacancies still and, despite their best efforts, are finding it very difficult to recruit to those vacancies. They are now looking at different options to fill those posts. I've also asked the NHS delivery unit to specifically look at Cardiff and Vale and to look at what support can be made available. We're also looking at what other support we can provide as a Welsh Government and as part of the service improvement funding that we'll be investing over the next three years. I've also made it clear to all health boards that I expect them to provide a detailed plan setting out how they will reduce waiting times.

I should also add that Cardiff and Vale are taking other steps to try and manage their waiting times, in terms of accessing a digital offer to bring down waiting times. They're investing in the third sector and looking at more support through training peer support workers. So, there is lots of work in train, but more to be done. But, just to assure the Member, I will be meeting with Cardiff and Vale again in the not-too-distant future and I'm continuing to have that dialogue with them about their waiting times. 

A gaf fi ddiolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn atodol? Rwy'n rhannu ei bryderon ynghylch yr anawsterau sy'n parhau gydag amseroedd aros yng Nghaerdydd a'r Fro. Cyfarfûm â Chaerdydd a'r Fro dair gwaith i drafod, yn fanwl, eu dull o reoli eu hamseroedd aros. Credaf ei bod hi'n bwysig cydnabod eu bod yn wynebu heriau arbennig yng Nghaerdydd a'r Fro. Mae dwy ran o dair o'r plant sy'n aros yng Nghymru ar restr aros Caerdydd a'r Fro am wasanaethau iechyd meddwl plant a'r glasoed (CAMHS) arbenigol mewn gwirionedd, ac mae Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Caerdydd a'r Fro yn ymdrin â set unigryw o amgylchiadau.

Ym mis Tachwedd 2021 nododd y bwrdd iechyd 27 y cant o gynnydd yn nifer yr atgyfeiriadau am CAMHS gofal sylfaenol, a 17 y cant am CAMHS arbenigol. O fy nhrafodaethau gyda Chaerdydd a'r Fro—ac rwy'n cytuno'n bendant â chi nad yw'n ymwneud ag arian yn unig—gwn fod ganddynt lawer o swyddi gwag o hyd, ac er gwaethaf eu hymdrechion gorau, maent yn ei chael hi'n anodd iawn recriwtio i'r swyddi hynny. Maent yn edrych ar opsiynau gwahanol i lenwi'r swyddi gwag hynny erbyn hyn. Rwyf hefyd wedi gofyn i uned gyflawni'r GIG edrych yn benodol ar Gaerdydd a'r Fro a gweld pa gymorth y gellir ei ddarparu. Rydym hefyd yn edrych ar ba gymorth arall y gallwn ei ddarparu fel Llywodraeth Cymru ac fel rhan o'r cyllid gwella gwasanaeth y byddwn yn ei fuddsoddi dros y tair blynedd nesaf. Rwyf hefyd wedi dweud yn glir wrth bob bwrdd iechyd fy mod yn disgwyl iddynt ddarparu cynllun manwl yn nodi sut y byddant yn lleihau amseroedd aros.

Dylwn ychwanegu hefyd fod Caerdydd a'r Fro yn rhoi camau eraill ar waith i geisio rheoli eu hamseroedd aros, gyda'r defnydd o gynnig digidol i leihau amseroedd aros. Maent yn buddsoddi yn y trydydd sector ac yn edrych ar fwy o gymorth drwy hyfforddi gweithwyr cymorth gan gymheiriaid. Felly mae llawer o waith ar y gweill, ond mae rhagor i'w wneud. Ond i dawelu meddwl yr Aelod, byddaf yn cyfarfod â Chaerdydd a'r Fro eto yn weddol fuan ac rwy'n parhau i gael y drafodaeth honno gyda hwy ynglŷn â'u hamseroedd aros.

14:30

Thank you. I'm very interested in your answer and I appreciate the interest you're taking in Cardiff and the Vale. Talking to my constituents, I find that far too many patients who are approaching their doctor because they've got low mood, loneliness or anxiety are offered a script rather than other talking therapies or other things, which just masks the problem and it can lead to long-term issues like agoraphobia. So, what is your strategy for increasing the number of people offered social prescribing to promote well-being, which would then free up the time of the mental health experts that we're having such difficulty recruiting to concentrate on those acute and enduring mental health problems? 

Diolch. Mae gennyf ddiddordeb mawr yn eich ateb ac rwy'n gwerthfawrogi'r diddordeb yr ydych wedi'i ddangos yng Nghaerdydd a'r Fro. Wrth siarad â fy etholwyr, gwelaf fod llawer gormod o gleifion sy'n mynd at eu meddyg am eu bod yn teimlo iselder, unigrwydd neu bryder yn cael cynnig presgripsiwn yn hytrach na therapïau siarad eraill neu bethau eraill, sy'n cuddio'r broblem a gall arwain at broblemau hirdymor fel agoraffobia. Felly, beth yw eich strategaeth ar gyfer cynyddu nifer y bobl sy'n cael presgripsiwn cymdeithasol i hyrwyddo llesiant, a fyddai wedyn yn rhyddhau amser i'r arbenigwyr iechyd meddwl y cawn gymaint o anhawster yn eu recriwtio i ganolbwyntio ar y problemau iechyd meddwl acíwt a pharhaus hynny? 

Thank you very much for that question, Jenny, and I'm very supportive of social prescribing as a way of linking people to community-based, non-clinical support, and regard such support as a really key part of our preventative agenda. You'll be aware that we have a programme for government commitment to have an all-Wales framework to support social prescribing. That framework is going to outline what best practice looks like in Wales, but very importantly is not going to dictate what is delivered in different communities, because there is already some excellent practice out there. My officials are currently engaging with a range of stakeholders on the proposed model, and that will be published then for formal consultation in May. And you'll be pleased to know that also, from April, our new health and social care regional integration fund is going to continue to support the social prescribing models that we know are so important.

Also, we're continuing to invest very heavily as a Government in lower level, tier 0 support, because, as you say, lots of people who seek referrals for their mental health don't actually need specialist support. So, we're continuing to invest in the call helpline. We're actually expanding—we've announced £7 million to expand the online cognitive behavioural therapy, SilverCloud, including expanding that to children. And we're looking at what more we can do with our increased funding over the next three years to actually boost that tier 0, lower level support to avoid difficulties escalating.

Diolch yn fawr am y cwestiwn hwnnw, Jenny, ac rwy'n llwyr gefnogi presgripsiynu cymdeithasol fel ffordd o gysylltu pobl â chymorth anghlinigol yn y gymuned, ac rwy'n ystyried bod cymorth o'r fath yn rhan wirioneddol allweddol o'n hagenda ataliol. Fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol fod gennym ymrwymiad yn y rhaglen lywodraethu i gael fframwaith Cymru gyfan i gefnogi presgripsiynu cymdeithasol. Bydd y fframwaith hwnnw'n amlinellu'r arferion gorau yng Nghymru, ond yn bwysig iawn, ni fydd yn pennu'r hyn a ddarperir mewn gwahanol gymunedau, oherwydd mae arferion rhagorol i'w cael allan yno eisoes. Mae fy swyddogion ar hyn o bryd yn ymgysylltu ag amrywiaeth o randdeiliaid ar y model arfaethedig, a bydd hwnnw'n cael ei gyhoeddi ar gyfer ymgynghoriad ffurfiol ym mis Mai. Ac fe fyddwch yn falch o wybod hefyd, o fis Ebrill ymlaen, y bydd ein cronfa integreiddio ranbarthol newydd ar gyfer iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol yn parhau i gefnogi'r modelau presgripsiynu cymdeithasol hynny y gwyddom eu bod mor bwysig.

Hefyd, rydym yn parhau i fuddsoddi'n helaeth iawn fel Llywodraeth mewn cymorth haen 0 lefel is, oherwydd, fel y dywedwch, nid oes angen cymorth arbenigol ar lawer o bobl sy'n ceisio atgyfeiriadau ar gyfer eu hiechyd meddwl. Felly, rydym yn parhau i fuddsoddi yn llinell gymorth CALL. Rydym yn ehangu mewn gwirionedd—rydym wedi cyhoeddi £7 miliwn i ehangu'r therapi gwybyddol ymddygiadol ar-lein, SilverCloud, gan gynnwys ehangu hwnnw ar gyfer plant. Ac rydym yn edrych ar beth arall y gallwn ei wneud gyda'n cyllid ychwanegol dros y tair blynedd nesaf i roi hwb i'r cymorth haen 0 lefel is hwnnw er mwyn atal anawsterau rhag gwaethygu.

Adrannau Damweiniau ac Achosion Brys
Accident and Emergency Departments

2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am amseroedd aros mewn adrannau damweiniau ac achosion brys yn Nwyrain Caerfyrddin a Dinefwr? OQ57827

2. Will the Minister make a statement on accident and emergency waiting times in Carmarthen East and Dinefwr? OQ57827

Diolch yn fawr. Mae Bwrdd iechyd Hywel Dda yn gweithio'n gyflym i sicrhau bod pobl yn Nwyrain Caerfyrddin a Dinefwr yn cael mynediad amserol at ofal brys ac argyfwng. Rŷn ni'n cefnogi'r bwrdd iechyd trwy gyllid ychwanegol wedi'i dargedu fel bod modd gwella ansawdd ac amseroldeb y gofal yn yr adran damweiniau ac achosion brys yng Nglangwili.

Thank you. Hywel Dda health board is working at speed to ensure that people in Carmarthen East and Dinefwr have timely access to urgent and emergency care. We are supporting the health board through additional targeted funding to enable improvement in quality and timeliness of care at the A&E department at Glangwili.

Rŷn ni i gyd yn ymwybodol, wrth gwrs, o’r pwysau anhygoel sydd ar y gwasanaeth iechyd ar hyn o bryd, ond mae’n fy nharo i fod sefyllfa a oedd eisoes yn wael cyn y pandemig erbyn hyn wedi troi'n argyfyngus. Dwi wedi cael achosion yn ddiweddar o un etholwr yn gorfod aros mewn ambiwlans am 10 awr y tu fas i Glangwili, teulu arall, o Frynaman, yn gorfod aros saith awr i'w plentyn nhw weld doctor, ac mae aros am bum awr wedi troi'n gyffredin erbyn hyn. Ac mae'n rhaid cofio, wrth gwrs, oherwydd daearyddiaeth yr ardal, fod pobl yn aml iawn wedi aros yn hir iawn i ambiwlans ddod atyn nhw ac wedyn wrth gwrs wedi gorfod teithio'n bell yn aml i Langwili yn y lle cyntaf.

Ac wrth gwrs, rŷn ni'n ymwybodol o'r broblem trwy Gymru ar hyn o bryd. Dwi'n edrych ar A&E live ac rŷch chi'n gorfod aros ar hyn o bryd hyd at naw awr yn Wrecsam Maelor a hyd at wyth awr yn Ysbyty'r Tywysog Siarl. Cam cyntaf datrys argyfwng fel hyn, Weinidog, ydy cydnabod bod yna greisis. Ydych chi'n fodlon derbyn bod yna greisis o ran sefyllfa'r gwasanaeth ambiwlans yng Nghymru ar hyn o bryd?

We're all aware, of course, of the huge pressures on our health service at the moment, but it strikes me that a situation that was already bad before the pandemic is now critical. I've had cases recently of one constituent having to wait in an ambulance for 10 hours outside Glangwili, another family, from Brynaman, having to wait seven hours for their child to see a doctor, and waiting for five hours is commonplace now. And we must bear in mind that, because of the geography of the area, people very often will have waited a very long time for an ambulance to arrive and then will have had to travel long distances to Glangwili in the first instance. 

And, of course, we are aware that this is a problem across Wales at the moment. I'm looking at A&E live, and you have to wait up to nine hours in Wrexham Maelor and up to eight hours in Prince Charles Hospital. The first step in solving such a crisis, Minister, is to recognise that there is a crisis. Are you willing to accept that there is a crisis in terms of the ambulance service in Wales at the moment?

14:35

Dwi ddim yn derbyn bod yna greisis, ond dwi yn derbyn bod yna bwysau aruthrol ar y gwasanaeth ar hyn o bryd. Dwi wedi cael cyfarfod arall â phrif weithredwr y gwasanaeth ambiwlans y bore yma, fel dwi'n cael yn aml, achos ein bod ni'n benderfynol o wella'r sefyllfa. Wrth gwrs, y peth i'w gofio yw'r ffaith bod hwn yn rhan o system gyflawn, a'r ffaith, ar hyn o bryd, yw bod yna 129 o bobl yn Hywel Dda sydd yn barod i gael eu hanfon allan o'r ysbyty, ond mae hwnna'n anodd achos bod y sefyllfa yn y gwasanaeth gofal mor fregus. Ac mae'n dda ein bod ni'n gweithio gyda'n gilydd ar ddatrys y broblem yma. Ond dyw hi ddim yn broblem y byddwn ni'n ei datrys dros nos. Mae hefyd rhaid cofio bod yna 118 o bobl sydd yn yr ysbyty ar hyn o bryd yn Hywel Dda yn dioddef o COVID, ac mae hwnna'n dod â phwysau ychwanegol.

Mae'n dda gen i ddweud bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn rhoi arian ychwanegol i helpu'r sefyllfa—£25 miliwn. Bydd Hywel Dda yn derbyn o leiaf £1 filiwn o'r arian yma i helpu i ddatblygu canolfannau ar gyfer primary care. Hefyd, bues i'n ymweld â Glangwili yn ddiweddar, gan fynd i'r gwasanaeth yna—y same-day emergency care unit. Ac mae'n werth mynd i weld y gwasanaeth yna, achos beth maen nhw'n trial gwneud yw sicrhau bod pobl â ffordd arall i gael eu gweld ar yr un diwrnod, yn hytrach na'u bod nhw'n mynd i'r accident and emergency service.

I don't accept that there's a crisis, but I do accept that there is huge pressure on the service at present. I've had another meeting with the chief executive of the ambulance service this morning, as I have regularly, because we are determined to improve the situation. Of course, the thing to remember is the fact that this is part of a whole system, and the fact is that, at present, there are 129 people in Hywel Dda who are ready to be discharged from hospital, but that's difficult because the situation in the care service is so challenging. And it's good that we're working together on solving that particular problem. But it isn't one that we can solve overnight. We have to remember that there are 118 people currently in hospitals in the Hywel Dda area who are suffering from COVID, and that brings additional pressure.

I'm pleased to say that the Welsh Government has been providing additional funding to assist the situation—£25 million. Hywel Dda will receive at least £1 million of this funding to develop centres for primary care. Also, I visited Glangwili recently, and I went to see that same-day emergency care unit. It's worth seeing that service, because what they're trying to do is ensure that people have another means of being seen the same day, rather than their having to go to A&E.

Minister, the major hospital service in both Adam Price's constituency and my own, on the eastern border, is Glangwili hospital. And I'm sure you will agree with me that the A&E waiting times at this hospital are simply unacceptable. The latest figures available show that 46.5 per cent of patients are spending more than four hours in A&E before admission, transfer or discharge, and 16.5 per cent—a sixth of all patients—are spending more than 12 hours waiting, the worst in the whole of the Hywel Dda health board region. One of the contributing factors to these rates is the difficulties that hospitals are facing in discharging patients, with backlogs being seen all through the hospital journey—something that I know that the Health and Social Care Committee are currently looking into. With today marking the second anniversary of the nation being locked down due to COVID-19, it is important we recognise the enormous pressure that our healthcare professionals have been working under for the last 24 months and to thank the NHS staff for their service. But what actions are you as the Minister, and this Welsh Government, taking to address these worrying figures and improve the hospital experience for patients throughout Carmarthenshire?

Weinidog, y prif wasanaeth ysbyty yn etholaeth Adam Price a fy etholaeth i, ar y ffin ddwyreiniol, yw ysbyty Glangwili. Ac rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn cytuno â mi fod amseroedd aros yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn yr ysbyty hwn yn annerbyniol. Mae'r ffigurau diweddaraf sydd ar gael yn dangos bod 46.5 y cant o gleifion yn treulio mwy na phedair awr yn yr adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys cyn cael eu derbyn, eu trosglwyddo neu eu rhyddhau, ac mae 16.5 y cant—un rhan o chwech o'r holl gleifion—yn treulio mwy na 12 awr yn aros, y gwaethaf yn rhanbarth bwrdd iechyd Hywel Dda i gyd. Un o'r ffactorau sy'n cyfrannu at y cyfraddau hyn yw'r anawsterau y mae ysbytai'n eu hwynebu wrth ryddhau cleifion, gyda'r ôl-groniadau i'w gweld drwy gydol y daith drwy'r ysbyty—rhywbeth y gwn fod y Pwyllgor Iechyd a Gofal Cymdeithasol yn ymchwilio iddo ar hyn o bryd. Gyda'i bod hi'n ddwy flynedd heddiw ers gosod y cyfyngiadau symud COVID-19  ar y wlad, mae'n bwysig ein bod yn cydnabod y pwysau aruthrol a fu ar ein gweithwyr gofal iechyd proffesiynol am y 24 mis diwethaf a'n bod yn diolch i staff y GIG am eu gwasanaeth. Ond pa gamau yr ydych chi fel y Gweinidog, a Llywodraeth Cymru, yn eu cymryd i fynd i'r afael â'r ffigurau pryderus hyn a gwella profiad ysbyty i gleifion ledled sir Gaerfyrddin?

Diolch yn fawr, Sam—thanks very much for that. And I'd like to join with you in thanking all of our NHS and, indeed, our care workers for the incredible work they've done over the past two years. And I think it is worth reflecting on the pressure that they've been under for that prolonged period.

Part of the issue that we have, of course, in Glangwili is actually the fact that we have trouble recruiting, and there is an over-reliance on agency and bank and overtime in terms of what happens in Glangwili. And that, of course, means that they have to pay more money, which pushes the health board into even more debt. So, all of those things are issues, and, of course, I guess that's one of the reasons why the health board is suggesting consolidating A&E into a new hospital, so that you can recruit easier. That is certainly something that they're suggesting and, obviously, that is something that my officials are working through at the moment.

I do think that there is a whole-system issue here. The fact that we have now introduced the real living wage, from April, and have established a bridge for those who are in the service already to get to that real living wage, with additional support, we hope will encourage people to stay in the service, so that we can get those people that you set out, who are in hospital, who shouldn't be there, who need to be discharged but there's nowhere for them to be discharged to because of the fragility of that system—. So, we do have to address that issue. We've started doing that through the real living wage. We have a care commission that I know Julie Morgan is working very closely with, but this is a whole-system issue and certainly something that I'll be bringing up with the chairs when I meet them tomorrow. 

Diolch yn fawr, Sam—diolch yn fawr am hynny. A hoffwn ymuno â chi i ddiolch i'n GIG cyfan ac yn wir, i'n gweithwyr gofal am y gwaith anhygoel y maent wedi'i wneud dros y ddwy flynedd ddiwethaf. A chredaf ei bod yn werth myfyrio ar y pwysau a fu arnynt am y cyfnod hir hwnnw.

Rhan o'r broblem sydd gennym yng Nglangwili mewn gwirionedd yw'r ffaith ein bod yn cael trafferth recriwtio, ac mae gorddibyniaeth ar weithwyr asiantaeth a banc a goramser o ran yr hyn sy'n digwydd yng Nglangwili. Ac mae hynny, wrth gwrs, yn golygu bod yn rhaid iddynt dalu mwy o arian, sy'n gwthio'r bwrdd iechyd i fwy fyth o ddyled. Felly, mae'r holl bethau hynny'n broblemau, ac rwy'n tybio mai dyna un o'r rhesymau pam y mae'r bwrdd iechyd yn awgrymu cyfuno'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys mewn ysbyty newydd, fel y gellir recriwtio'n haws. Mae hynny'n sicr yn rhywbeth y maent yn ei awgrymu ac yn amlwg, mae hynny'n rhywbeth y mae fy swyddogion yn gweithio arno ar hyn o bryd.

Credaf fod problem system gyfan yma. Rydym bellach wedi cyflwyno'r cyflog byw gwirioneddol, o fis Ebrill ymlaen, ac wedi sefydlu pont i'r rheini sydd yn y gwasanaeth eisoes i gyrraedd y cyflog byw gwirioneddol hwnnw, gyda chymorth ychwanegol, a gobeithiwn y bydd hynny'n annog pobl i aros yn y gwasanaeth, fel y gallwn ymdrin â'r bobl a nodwyd gennych, sydd yn yr ysbyty, na ddylent fod yno, pobl y mae angen eu rhyddhau ond nad oes unman iddynt gael eu rhyddhau iddo oherwydd breuder y system honno—. Felly, mae'n rhaid inni fynd i'r afael â'r mater hwnnw. Rydym wedi dechrau gwneud hynny drwy'r cyflog byw gwirioneddol. Mae gennym gomisiwn gofal y gwn fod Julie Morgan yn gweithio'n agos iawn ag ef, ond mae hwn yn fater system gyfan ac yn sicr mae'n rhywbeth y byddaf yn ei godi gyda'r cadeiryddion pan fyddaf yn cyfarfod â hwy yfory. 

14:40

Morriston Hospital A&E is the main A&E centre for eastern Carmarthenshire, especially the Amman valley, as well as Neath Port Talbot and Swansea. A&E in Morriston is very busy and there are regularly several ambulances waiting outside. Does the Minister agree that we need to get those who are not accidents or emergencies seen by either their GP or a pharmacist, and can the Minister indicate what percentage of A&E patients are returned home either immediately after being seen or within 24 hours of being admitted?

Adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys Ysbyty Treforys yw prif ganolfan ddamweiniau ac achosion brys dwyrain sir Gaerfyrddin, yn enwedig dyffryn Aman, yn ogystal â Chastell-nedd Port Talbot ac Abertawe. Mae'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys yn Nhreforys yn brysur iawn ac mae sawl ambiwlans yn aros y tu allan yn rheolaidd. A yw'r Gweinidog yn cytuno bod angen inni sicrhau bod y rheini nad ydynt yn ddamweiniau neu'n achosion brys yn cael eu gweld naill ai gan eu meddyg teulu neu eu fferyllydd, ac a all y Gweinidog ddweud pa ganran o gleifion damweiniau ac achosion brys sy'n cael eu rhyddhau adref naill ai'n syth ar ôl cael eu gweld neu o fewn 24 awr i gael eu derbyn?

Thanks very much, Mike, and I absolutely agree that we do need to provide alternatives to A&E, which is one of the reasons why we've invested an additional £25 million and set out six priority actions that we expect health boards and the ambulance service to deliver on. 

We're hoping that urgent primary care centres—there's £7 million earmarked for those—will provide a new model for service delivery. I know that Swansea is likely to get at least £0.5 million of this funding. And we're anxious to see more same-day emergency care services, and shortly we'll be publishing national guidance on that in order to improve patient flow.

But, on top of that, I am absolutely delighted to say, at last, we have a national 111 service where people can phone up for an alternative view before they go to A&E so that they can be sent to the appropriate service for them. Cardiff introduced their new 111 service on 16 March, and because of that now we will be able to promote that service as a national service that is available to everybody in Wales. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Mike, ac rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr fod angen inni ddarparu dewisiadau amgen yn lle'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys, sef un o'r rhesymau pam ein bod wedi buddsoddi £25 miliwn ychwanegol ac wedi nodi chwe cham blaenoriaethol yr ydym yn disgwyl i fyrddau iechyd a'r gwasanaeth ambiwlans eu cyflawni. 

Rydym yn gobeithio y bydd canolfannau gofal sylfaenol brys—mae £7 miliwn wedi'i glustnodi ar gyfer y rheini—yn darparu model newydd ar gyfer darparu gwasanaethau. Gwn fod Abertawe'n debygol o gael o leiaf £0.5 miliwn o'r cyllid hwn. Ac rydym yn awyddus i weld mwy o wasanaethau gofal brys ar yr un diwrnod, a chyn bo hir byddwn yn cyhoeddi canllawiau cenedlaethol ar hynny er mwyn gwella llif cleifion.

Ond ar ben hynny, rwy'n falch iawn o allu dweud, o'r diwedd, fod gennym wasanaeth 111 cenedlaethol lle y gall pobl ffonio i gael barn arall cyn iddynt fynd i'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys fel y gellir eu hanfon at y gwasanaeth priodol ar eu cyfer. Cyflwynodd Caerdydd eu gwasanaeth 111 newydd ar 16 Mawrth, ac oherwydd hynny rydym bellach yn gallu hyrwyddo'r gwasanaeth hwnnw fel gwasanaeth cenedlaethol sydd ar gael i bawb yng Nghymru. 

Cwestiynau Heb Rybudd gan Lefarwyr y Pleidiau
Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

Galwaf yn awr ar lefarwyr y plediau ac, yn gyntaf, Russell George. 

I now call on the party spokespeople. First of all, Russell George. 

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Minister, on this second anniversary of COVID restrictions being introduced across Wales and across the UK, certainly on behalf of the Welsh Conservatives, I think we can all agree across this Chamber—. I want to thank everyone who has kept us safe, and our thoughts are, of course, today particularly with the friends and families of those who have lost loved ones during the course of the pandemic. 

Today is also a year and a day since your predecessor published the health and social care recovery plan. Can I ask, Minister, what progress you consider has been made since that recovery plan was published a year ago?

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Weinidog, mae dwy flynedd ers inni gyflwyno cyfyngiadau symud COVID ledled Cymru a ledled y DU, ac yn sicr ar ran y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig, credaf y gallwn i gyd gytuno ar draws y Siambr hon—. Hoffwn ddiolch i bawb sydd wedi ein cadw'n ddiogel, ac rydym yn cydymdeimlo, wrth gwrs, heddiw yn enwedig, â ffrindiau a theuluoedd y rhai sydd wedi colli anwyliaid yn ystod y pandemig. 

Yn ogystal â hynny, mae blwyddyn a diwrnod ers i'ch rhagflaenydd gyhoeddi'r cynllun adfer iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol. A gaf fi ofyn, Weinidog, pa gynnydd sydd wedi'i wneud yn eich barn chi ers cyhoeddi'r cynllun adfer hwnnw flwyddyn yn ôl?

Thanks very much, Russell, and I'd like to join you in thanking our health and care workers who have worked so diligently to keep us safe and to protect the people in their care over that very difficult period, but also to extend my sympathies to those who have lost loved ones in very difficult circumstances, where they weren't even able to give them the kind of send-offs that they may have wanted for them, to celebrate their lives. 

The health and social care recovery plan is being implemented. It is part of a programme that is ongoing. Part of that has been the implementation of things like the real living wage, to make sure, and that's gone quicker that we'd hoped. That was set out within that health and care recovery plan. Also, you'll be aware that we set out some expectations for the service in terms of delivery. We'll be hardening up some of those expectations in the planned care recovery programme that we will be publishing in the next few weeks. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Russell, a hoffwn ymuno â chi i ddiolch i'n gweithwyr iechyd a gofal sydd wedi gweithio mor ddiwyd i'n cadw'n ddiogel ac i ddiogelu'r bobl yn eu gofal dros y cyfnod anodd iawn hwnnw, ond hefyd i gydymdeimlo â'r rhai sydd wedi colli anwyliaid mewn amgylchiadau anodd iawn, lle nad oeddent hyd yn oed yn gallu ffarwelio â hwy yn y ffordd y byddent wedi'i ddymuno, i ddathlu eu bywydau. 

Mae'r cynllun adfer iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol yn cael ei roi ar waith. Mae'n rhan o raglen sy'n mynd rhagddi. Mae rhan o hynny wedi cynnwys gweithredu pethau fel y cyflog byw gwirioneddol, i wneud yn siŵr, ac mae hynny wedi digwydd yn gyflymach nag y gobeithiem. Nodwyd hynny yn y cynllun adfer iechyd a gofal hwnnw. Hefyd, fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol ein bod wedi nodi rhai disgwyliadau ar gyfer y gwasanaeth o ran cyflawniad. Byddwn yn cryfhau rhai o'r disgwyliadau hynny yn y rhaglen adfer gofal wedi'i gynllunio y byddwn yn ei chyhoeddi yn ystod yr wythnosau nesaf. 

Thank you for your answer, Minister, and I attach myself to the first part of your answer there. 

In regard to the recovery plan, I noticed that Nick Bennett, the Public Services Ombudsman for Wales, today talks about NHS waiting times in Wales causing a public health crisis. So, it's certainly my view that we are a long way from even getting on to a recovery plan. And a recovery plan, to me, should be significantly about reducing the backlogs in our Welsh NHS, and that's not something you did address in your answer. When I mentioned this to you a couple of weeks ago, you talked about, 'We only saw an increase of 0.2 per cent in December for Welsh NHS waiting lists', but it's my view that we should not be celebrating that kind of—. Well, it's not an achievement at all. What we do need to do is absolutely focus on significantly reducing the waiting times backlog, and of course the Welsh NHS and health boards should be supported at every level to eat into those backlogs. And of course, behind every stat—. We talk about stats, don't we, Minister? I know you'll agree with me that behind every stat there are real people that are in pain waiting for months and for years for treatment, and I know that you'll find that unacceptable yourself. But this is about how we reduce those significant backlogs.

I understand, Minister, you've asked health boards to ensure that none of their patients are waiting more than two years by the end of February, just gone, and also waiting for more than a year for urgent outpatient appointments by the end of January, January just gone. So, can I ask you, Minister, have these targets been met, and what direct actions are you going to take to ensure that health boards and the health service are urgently reducing these shocking—and they are shocking—health times so that we are not in that public health crisis?

Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog, ac rwy'n ategu rhan gyntaf eich ateb yno. 

Ar y cynllun adfer, sylwais fod Nick Bennett, Ombwdsmon Gwasanaethau Cyhoeddus Cymru, wedi sôn heddiw fod amseroedd aros y GIG yng Nghymru yn achosi argyfwng iechyd cyhoeddus. Felly, yn sicr, fy marn i yw bod gennym ffordd bell i fynd cyn dechrau ar gynllun adfer hyd yn oed. Ac i mi, dylai cynllun adfer ymwneud yn helaeth â lleihau'r ôl-groniadau yn ein GIG yng Nghymru, ac ni wnaethoch roi sylw i hynny yn eich ateb. Pan soniais wrthych am hyn ychydig wythnosau yn ôl, fe ddywedoch chi, 'Dim ond cynnydd o 0.2 y cant a welsom ym mis Rhagfyr ar gyfer rhestrau aros GIG Cymru', ond fy marn i yw na ddylem fod yn dathlu'r math hwnnw—. Wel, nid yw'n gyflawniad o gwbl. Mae angen inni ganolbwyntio'n bendant iawn ar leihau'r ôl-groniadau amseroedd aros yn sylweddol, ac wrth gwrs dylid cynorthwyo GIG Cymru a'r byrddau iechyd ar bob lefel i leihau'r ôl-groniadau hynny. Ac wrth gwrs, y tu ôl i bob ystadegyn—. Rydym yn sôn am ystadegau, onid ydym, Weinidog? Rwy'n gwybod y byddwch yn cytuno â mi fod yna bobl go iawn y tu ôl i bob ystadegyn, pobl go iawn sy'n aros mewn poen am fisoedd a blynyddoedd am driniaeth, a gwn y byddwch yn ystyried hynny'n annerbyniol eich hun. Ond mae hyn yn ymwneud â sut rydym yn mynd i leihau'r ôl-groniadau sylweddol hynny.

Weinidog, rwy'n deall eich bod wedi gofyn i fyrddau iechyd sicrhau nad oes yr un o'u cleifion yn aros mwy na dwy flynedd erbyn diwedd mis Chwefror, sydd newydd fod, a sicrhau hefyd nad oes yr un o'u cleifion yn aros am fwy na blwyddyn am apwyntiadau cleifion allanol brys erbyn diwedd mis Ionawr, y mis Ionawr sydd newydd fod. Felly, a gaf fi ofyn ichi, Weinidog, a yw'r targedau hyn wedi'u cyrraedd, a pha gamau uniongyrchol y bwriadwch eu cymryd i sicrhau bod byrddau iechyd a'r gwasanaeth iechyd yn lleihau'r amseroedd aros iechyd brawychus hyn—ac maent yn frawychus—ar frys, er mwyn inni allu cefnu ar yr argyfwng iechyd cyhoeddus hwn?

14:45

Thanks very much. I am extremely concerned about the backlog; it keeps me awake at night. The fact is that I'm spending most of my time these days trying to make sure that we have a very clear recovery plan. That planned care programme will, as I say, be published in the next couple of weeks. We're just trying to finalise the details on that.

Tomorrow, you'll be aware that new waiting lists will come out, those results. I've been absolutely clear and open and honest. I think it's really important that we manage expectations here. The fact is that we've just had an omicron variant that is now again increasing, and we're seeing more people in our hospitals at a time when, frankly, we were hoping we'd be able to really go at this with vigour.

We're just finalising and looking through the integrated medium term plan proposals from the health boards, where they set out what they hope to have as targets. We know that targets haven't been met. We're not the only country in the world that hasn't seen targets met. I don't think there's any country in the world that has met targets in the face of the COVID crisis. So, I don't think there are any surprises there. The challenge now is how do we get back on track. And part of what we're doing is to make sure that we've got the staffing in place to make sure we can address that backlog, particularly when we know that the staff at the moment are already exhausted. We published the fact that, actually, we've invested £0.25 billion in training new people, something that they missed out entirely from the English plan, and I think it's really important that we understand that we can't address this backlog without the right skills and the right people to help us out.

Diolch yn fawr. Rwy'n pryderu'n fawr am yr ôl-groniadau; maent yn fy nghadw'n effro yn y nos. Y gwir amdani yw fy mod yn treulio'r rhan fwyaf o fy amser y dyddiau hyn yn ceisio sicrhau bod gennym gynllun adfer clir iawn. Bydd y rhaglen gofal wedi'i gynllunio, fel y dywedais, yn cael ei chyhoeddi yn ystod yr wythnosau nesaf. Rydym yn ceisio cwblhau'r manylion ar hynny.

Yfory, fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol y bydd rhestrau aros newydd yn cael eu cyhoeddi, y canlyniadau hynny. Rwyf wedi bod yn gwbl glir ac agored a gonest. Rwy'n credu ei bod yn bwysig iawn ein bod yn rheoli disgwyliadau yma. Y gwir amdani yw ein bod newydd gael amrywiolyn omicron sydd bellach ar gynnydd eto, ac rydym yn gweld mwy o bobl yn ein hysbytai ar adeg pan oeddem, a bod yn onest, wedi gobeithio y gallem fwrw iddi'n egnïol ar hyn.

Rydym ar fin cwblhau ac edrych drwy argymhellion y cynllun tymor canolig integredig gan y byrddau iechyd, lle maent yn nodi'r targedau y maent yn gobeithio eu gosod. Gwyddom nad yw targedau wedi'u cyrraedd. Nid ni yw'r unig wlad yn y byd sydd heb gyrraedd ei thargedau. Nid wyf yn credu bod unrhyw wlad yn y byd wedi cyrraedd targedau yn wyneb argyfwng COVID. Felly, nid wyf yn credu bod hynny'n unrhyw syndod. Yr her yn awr yw canfod sut y gallwn fynd yn ôl ar y trywydd cywir. A rhan o'r hyn a wnawn yw sicrhau bod gennym staff ar waith i sicrhau y gallwn fynd i'r afael â'r ôl-groniadau hynny, yn enwedig a ninnau'n gwybod bod y staff eisoes wedi ymlâdd. Fe wnaethom gyhoeddi'r ffaith ein bod, mewn gwirionedd, wedi buddsoddi £0.25 biliwn i hyfforddi pobl newydd, rhywbeth a gafodd ei adael allan yn llwyr o gynllun Lloegr, a chredaf ei bod yn bwysig iawn ein bod yn deall na allwn fynd i'r afael â'r ôl-groniadau hyn heb y sgiliau cywir a'r bobl iawn i'n helpu.

Thank you for your answer, Minister. I would of course understand that you were put in a very difficult position when you became the health Minister, because your predecessor left the position in a very, very difficult state. We were in a difficult position well before we entered the pandemic, and I appreciate the difficult task that you've now got in front of you, Minister.

When I talked about targets being met, you referred to, 'No-one's meeting targets; targets aren't met around the world', but these are targets that you brought forward yourself—as I understand it, but correct me if I'm wrong—to health boards just in recent months, or certainly last year, to make sure that targets were met by January and February just gone, as I outlined. So, I think it's completely reasonable for me to ask have those targets been met and to understand the position in that regard.

You have talked about the new figures for waiting times coming out tomorrow, and I understand that's of course the case. As it stands at the moment, the last figures published show us nearly 50,000 patients in Wales are waiting over two years for treatment—over two years for treatment. And that figure is double—double—that of people waiting in the entirety of England, and England has a population 18 times the size of Wales. So, can I ask you—and this goes back to my earlier point about you being put in a very difficult position and we were in a difficult position before we entered the pandemic—can you explain how this utterly dire comparison ever came into being in the first place?

Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog. Rwy'n deall wrth gwrs eich bod wedi cael eich rhoi mewn sefyllfa anodd iawn pan ddaethoch yn Weinidog iechyd, oherwydd gadawodd eich rhagflaenydd y swydd mewn cyflwr anodd tu hwnt. Roeddem mewn sefyllfa anodd ymhell cyn inni wynebu'r pandemig, ac rwy'n deall pa mor anodd yw'r dasg sy'n eich wynebu yn awr, Weinidog.

Pan soniais am gyrraedd targedau, fe ddywedoch chi 'Nid oes neb yn cyrraedd targedau; nid yw targedau'n cael eu cyrraedd ledled y byd', ond mae'r rhain yn dargedau a gyflwynwyd gennych chi eich hun—yn ôl yr hyn a ddeallaf, ond dywedwch os ydw i'n anghywir—i fyrddau iechyd yn ystod y misoedd diwethaf, neu'n sicr y llynedd, i sicrhau bod targedau'n cael eu cyrraedd erbyn y mis Ionawr a'r mis Chwefror sydd newydd fod, fel yr amlinellais. Felly, rwy'n credu ei bod yn gwbl resymol imi ofyn a yw'r targedau hynny wedi'u cyrraedd a deall y sefyllfa o ran hynny.

Rydych wedi sôn am y ffigurau newydd ar gyfer amseroedd aros a fydd yn cael eu cyhoeddi yfory, a deallaf hynny wrth gwrs. Fel y mae ar hyn o bryd, mae'r ffigurau diwethaf a gyhoeddwyd yn dangos bod bron i 50,000 o gleifion yng Nghymru yn aros dros ddwy flynedd am driniaeth—dros ddwy flynedd am driniaeth. Ac mae'r ffigur hwnnw'n ddwbl—dwbl—nifer y bobl sy'n aros yn Lloegr gyfan, ac mae gan Loegr boblogaeth 18 gwaith maint Cymru. Felly, a gaf fi ofyn i chi—ac mae hyn yn mynd yn ôl at fy mhwynt cynharach eich bod wedi cael eich rhoi mewn sefyllfa anodd iawn a'n bod ni mewn sefyllfa anodd cyn dechrau'r pandemig—a wnewch chi egluro sut y cododd y gymhariaeth gwbl enbyd hon yn y lle cyntaf?

I can explain it. And first of all I'd like to correct you on something, and that is that actually we were working through that challenging backlog. In fact, we only had 9,000 people waiting for 36 weeks prior to the pandemic. And, yes, we set out some targets, but, actually, that was before delta hit us and before omicron hit us and before BA2 hit us. So, all of those things of course are going to throw out whatever plans that we had. We had to divert people to make sure that people had the booster in order to protect them. It makes perfect sense that, when you're confronted with that kind of situation, you change tack and you try and do the best you can under the circumstances.

And I can explain why our waiting lists are longer than in England. First of all, we include diagnostics and therapy in the way we count; we include follow-up appointments after diagnostic tests—again, not something they include in England. We count people if they are transferred between consultants and they start a new pathway. So, all of those are good reasons why actually we count in a far more honest way, I think—an open and transparent way—than they do in England.

Fe allaf ei egluro. Ac yn gyntaf oll hoffwn eich cywiro ar rywbeth, sef ein bod mewn gwirionedd yn mynd i'r afael â'r ôl-groniadau heriol hynny. Yn wir, dim ond 9,000 o bobl oedd yn aros am 36 wythnos cyn y pandemig. A do, fe wnaethom nodi rhai targedau, ond mewn gwirionedd, roedd hynny cyn i delta ein taro a chyn i omicron ein taro a chyn i BA2 ein taro. Felly, mae'r holl bethau hynny wrth gwrs wedi taflu pa gynlluniau bynnag a oedd gennym ar y domen. Roedd yn rhaid inni ddargyfeirio pobl i sicrhau bod pobl yn cael y pigiad atgyfnerthu er mwyn eu diogelu. Mae'n gwneud synnwyr perffaith, pan fyddwch yn wynebu'r math hwnnw o sefyllfa, eich bod yn newid eich tacteg a cheisio gwneud eich gorau o dan yr amgylchiadau.

A gallaf egluro pam fod ein rhestrau aros yn hwy na rhai Lloegr. Yn gyntaf oll, rydym yn cynnwys diagnosteg a therapi yn y ffordd yr ydym yn cyfrif; rydym yn cynnwys apwyntiadau dilynol ar ôl profion diagnostig—unwaith eto, ni chânt eu cynnwys yn Lloegr. Rydym yn cyfrif pobl os cânt eu trosglwyddo rhwng meddygon ymgynghorol ac os ydynt yn dechrau ar lwybr newydd. Felly, mae'r rhain i gyd yn rhesymau da pam ein bod yn cyfrif mewn ffordd lawer mwy gonest, rwy'n credu—ffordd agored a thryloyw—nag y maent yn ei wneud yn Lloegr.

14:50

Peredur Owen Griffiths ar ran Plaid Cymru. 

Peredur Owen Griffiths on behalf of Plaid Cymru. 

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Deputy Minister, last month, Wales recorded its worst ever results for mental health provision for young people. Your own figures showed that 78 per cent of patients referred to specialist child and adolescent mental health services were left waiting for over four weeks for their first appointment. I hope you agree that that is unacceptable. I would like to hear what steps have been taken to improve matters. I'd also like to hear more about the commitment in the co-operation agreement on testing the sanctuary model. This would support young people in crisis or with an urgent mental health issue by providing community facilities run by trained third sector staff, with clear referral pathways into NHS services if needed. Diolch. 

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Ddirprwy Weinidog, fis diwethaf, cofnododd Cymru ei chanlyniadau gwaethaf erioed ar gyfer y ddarpariaeth iechyd meddwl i bobl ifanc. Dangosodd eich ffigurau eich hun fod 78 y cant o gleifion a atgyfeiriwyd at wasanaethau iechyd meddwl arbenigol i blant a'r glasoed wedi gorfod aros dros bedair wythnos am eu hapwyntiad cyntaf. Rwy'n gobeithio eich bod yn cytuno bod hynny'n annerbyniol. Hoffwn glywed pa gamau sydd wedi'u cymryd i wella'r sefyllfa. Hoffwn glywed mwy hefyd am yr ymrwymiad yn y cytundeb cydweithio ar brofi'r model noddfa. Byddai hyn yn cefnogi pobl ifanc sydd mewn argyfwng neu sydd â phroblem iechyd meddwl brys drwy ddarparu cyfleusterau cymunedol yn cael eu rhedeg gan staff hyfforddedig y trydydd sector, gyda llwybrau atgyfeirio clir i wasanaethau'r GIG lle bydd angen. Diolch. 

Thank you, Peredur, for that question. And as I said in response to Andrew R.T. Davies, of course I'm concerned that we've got young people waiting longer than they should. I do think that the waiting times situation is distorted slightly by Cardiff and the Vale. As I said to Andrew, two thirds of the children who are waiting in Wales are actually on the waiting list in Cardiff and the Vale. But we are taking a wide range of steps to bring waiting times down. We've made it very clear to all health boards that we expect them to take action to reduce waiting times. We are backing that up with funding, for which we're expecting to see developed plans setting out how they will bring waiting times down. I think it's very important to recognise too, though, that lots of the young people who are referred to specialist mental health services won't actually need a specialist service, and that's why we're also investing in those lower level services so that we can intervene much more quickly. It would be really helpful if all Members could encourage their constituents who contact them to take advantage of that lower level support that is available, because, unfortunately and understandably, some families do see specialist CAMHS as the gold ticket, really, and we really want families to access the support earlier on. I should say as well that, as well as the steps that health boards are taking to reduce waiting times, they should all have measures in place to make sure that young people are triaged appropriately, so that, if young people's needs change, they will be seen more quickly.

You asked about the commitment in the Labour-Plaid Cymru co-operation agreement. As you've highlighted, that commitment is to test sanctuary provision for young people in Wales. We currently have sanctuary provision for adults, but none for young people, and the development of those models are very important as part of our crisis care pathway for children and young people. So, as part of the agreement, we will be taking forward those pilots in different parts of Wales, so that we can examine them. But I should be very clear as well that what we want is for young children and young people not to be reaching crisis point, and that's why we are investing so much money and also focusing so much effort on our whole system reform, so our whole-school approach to mental health, and there's been another £12 million for that announced just today. That links to the early help and enhanced support in our NEST/NYTH initiative. So, the numbers we expect to use the sanctuary provision will be small, and we should be aiming for them to be even smaller, because we don't want young people's difficulties escalating.

Diolch am y cwestiwn hwnnw, Peredur. Ac fel y dywedais mewn ymateb i Andrew R.T. Davies, wrth gwrs fy mod yn pryderu bod gennym bobl ifanc yn aros yn hwy nag y dylent. Credaf fod y sefyllfa gydag amseroedd aros yn cael ei hystumio rhywfaint gan Gaerdydd a'r Fro. Fel y dywedais wrth Andrew, mae dwy ran o dair o'r plant sy'n aros yng Nghymru ar y rhestr aros yng Nghaerdydd a'r Fro mewn gwirionedd. Ond rydym yn rhoi ystod eang o gamau ar waith i leihau amseroedd aros. Rydym wedi dweud yn glir iawn wrth bob bwrdd iechyd ein bod yn disgwyl iddynt roi camau ar waith i leihau amseroedd aros. Rydym yn cefnogi hynny gyda chyllid, ac am hynny rydym yn disgwyl gweld cynlluniau datblygedig i nodi sut y byddant yn lleihau amseroedd aros. Credaf ei bod yn bwysig iawn cydnabod hefyd, serch hynny, na fydd angen gwasanaeth arbenigol ar lawer o'r bobl ifanc sy'n cael eu hatgyfeirio at wasanaethau iechyd meddwl arbenigol, a dyna pam ein bod hefyd yn buddsoddi yn y gwasanaethau lefel is hynny fel y gallwn ymyrryd yn gyflymach o lawer. Byddai'n ddefnyddiol iawn pe gallai pob Aelod annog eu hetholwyr sy'n cysylltu â hwy i fanteisio ar y cymorth lefel is hwnnw sydd ar gael, oherwydd, yn anffodus ac yn ddealladwy, mae rhai teuluoedd yn gweld CAMHS arbenigol fel y tocyn aur, mewn gwirionedd, ac rydym yn awyddus iawn i deuluoedd gael y cymorth yn gynharach. Dylwn ddweud hefyd, yn ogystal â'r camau y mae byrddau iechyd yn eu cymryd i leihau amseroedd aros, y dylai pob un ohonynt gael mesurau ar waith i sicrhau bod pobl ifanc yn cael eu brysbennu'n briodol, fel eu bod yn cael eu gweld yn gyflymach os bydd eu hanghenion yn newid.

Roeddech yn gofyn am yr ymrwymiad yng nghytundeb cydweithio Llafur-Plaid Cymru. Fel yr amlinelloch chi, yr ymrwymiad hwnnw yw i brofi darpariaeth noddfa i bobl ifanc yng Nghymru. Ar hyn o bryd mae gennym ddarpariaeth noddfa i oedolion, ond nid ar gyfer pobl ifanc, ac mae datblygu'r modelau hynny'n bwysig iawn fel rhan o'n llwybr gofal mewn argyfwng i blant a phobl ifanc. Felly, fel rhan o'r cytundeb, byddwn yn bwrw ymlaen â'r cynlluniau peilot hynny mewn gwahanol rannau o Gymru, fel y gallwn eu harchwilio. Ond dylwn fod yn glir iawn hefyd mai'r hyn yr ydym ei eisiau yw i blant ifanc a phobl ifanc beidio â chyrraedd pwynt argyfwng, a dyna pam ein bod yn buddsoddi cymaint o arian a hefyd yn canolbwyntio cymaint o ymdrech ar ddiwygio ein system gyfan, felly ein dull ysgol gyfan o ymdrin ag iechyd meddwl, a chyhoeddwyd £12 miliwn arall ar gyfer hynny heddiw. Mae hynny'n cysylltu â'r cymorth cynnar a'r gefnogaeth ychwanegol yn ein menter NEST/NYTH. Felly, bydd y niferoedd y disgwyliwn eu gweld yn defnyddio'r ddarpariaeth noddfa yn fach, a dylem anelu i sicrhau eu bod hyd yn oed yn llai, oherwydd nid ydym eisiau i anawsterau pobl ifanc waethygu.

14:55

Diolch am yr ateb yna, Dirprwy Weinidog.

Thank you for that response, Deputy Minister.

Very soon, Ukrainians will be arriving in Wales in significant numbers as the UK finally pulls its finger out and does its bit for refugees resulting from Putin's aggression. Understandably, many of these people fleeing their homeland will be traumatised as a result of what they have experienced in the last month, and will require specialist help to deal with what they have seen and experienced. There will be children fleeing Ukraine. Can you update the Senedd about the preparations that have been undertaken ahead of the arrival of Ukrainian refugees? These poor people have already been let down by the Tory Government due to the slow and abject response to the refugee crisis. I hope they will not be let down once again when they arrive on these shores. Diolch.

Yn fuan iawn, bydd niferoedd sylweddol o Wcreiniaid yn cyrraedd Cymru wrth i'r DU dynnu ei bys allan o'r diwedd a gwneud ei rhan dros ffoaduriaid sy'n dianc rhag rhyfelgarwch Putin. Yn ddealladwy, bydd llawer o'r bobl hyn sy'n ffoi o'u gwlad wedi dioddef trawma o ganlyniad i'r hyn y maent wedi'i brofi yn ystod y mis diwethaf, a bydd angen cymorth arbenigol arnynt i ymdrin â'r hyn y maent wedi'i weld a'i brofi. Bydd plant yn ffoi o Wcráin. A wnewch chi roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Senedd am y paratoadau a wnaed cyn i ffoaduriaid Wcráin gyrraedd? Mae'r bobl druenus hyn eisoes wedi cael cam gan y Llywodraeth Dorïaidd oherwydd yr ymateb araf a thruenus i'r argyfwng ffoaduriaid. Gobeithio na chânt gam eto pan fyddant yn cyrraedd y glannau hyn. Diolch.

Thank you, Peredur. We've all been horrified by what we are seeing, and the trauma that people are experiencing in Ukraine is unthinkable, really. I'm pleased that we are taking a different approach in Wales with our supersponsor programme, which will mean that, when Ukrainian refugees arrive in Wales, they will be linked up with appropriate services. We'll be making sure that they register with a GP, and they'll be able to access all mainstream health services. That will include mental health support. The health support for those arriving in Wales will be provided in line with the guidance that we issued in 2018 on the health and well-being of asylum seekers and refugees. I'm also pleased to report that we've already translated materials into Ukrainian and Russian to support the mental health of those arriving from Ukraine on initial stabilisation, which will be really important when people are traumatised. You can't expect people to come in and be ready to have therapy; they're going to have to be feeling safe and stabilised. So, that's been done, and the Royal College of Psychiatrists have also published specific support materials to help with stabilisation during the initial resettlement phase. We've also got our CALL mental health helpline—that's also available to support people arriving in Wales and their families, and CALL has access to something called Language Line, which means that, if somebody wants to access services through a language like Russian or Ukrainian, they'll be able to do so.

Diolch, Peredur. Rydym i gyd wedi cael ein dychryn gan yr hyn a welwn, ac mae'r trawma y mae pobl yn ei brofi yn Wcráin yn rhywbeth na allwn ei ddychmygu mewn gwirionedd. Rwy'n falch ein bod yn mabwysiadu ymagwedd wahanol yng Nghymru gyda'n rhaglen uwch-noddwr, a fydd yn golygu, pan fydd ffoaduriaid Wcráin yn cyrraedd Cymru, y byddant yn cael eu cysylltu â gwasanaethau priodol. Byddwn yn sicrhau eu bod yn cofrestru gyda meddyg teulu, a byddant yn gallu cael mynediad at yr holl wasanaethau iechyd prif ffrwd. Bydd hynny'n cynnwys cymorth iechyd meddwl. Bydd y cymorth iechyd i'r rhai sy'n cyrraedd Cymru yn cael ei ddarparu yn unol â'r canllawiau a gyhoeddwyd gennym yn 2018 ar iechyd a llesiant ceiswyr lloches a ffoaduriaid. Rwyf hefyd yn falch o nodi ein bod eisoes wedi cyfieithu deunyddiau i Wcreineg a Rwsieg ar sefydlogi cychwynnol i gefnogi iechyd meddwl y rhai sy'n cyrraedd o Wcráin, deunyddiau a fydd yn bwysig iawn pan fydd pobl wedi dioddef trawma. Ni allwch ddisgwyl i bobl ddod i mewn a bod yn barod i gael therapi; bydd yn rhaid iddynt fod yn teimlo'n ddiogel a sefydlog. Felly, mae hynny wedi'i wneud, ac mae Coleg Brenhinol y Seiciatryddion hefyd wedi cyhoeddi deunyddiau cymorth penodol i helpu gyda sefydlogi yn ystod y cyfnod adsefydlu cychwynnol. Mae gennym hefyd ein llinell gymorth iechyd meddwl CALL—mae honno hefyd ar gael i gefnogi pobl sy'n cyrraedd Cymru a'u teuluoedd, ac mae gan CALL fynediad at rywbeth o'r enw Llinell Iaith, sy'n golygu y bydd modd i rywun ddod o hyd i wasanaethau drwy ddefnyddio iaith fel Rwsieg neu Wcreineg os ydynt eisiau gwneud hynny.

Cleifion Canser
Cancer Patients

3. Sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi cleifion canser i gael y driniaeth gywir? OQ57818

3. How is the Welsh Government supporting cancer patients to receive the correct treatment? OQ57818

Cancer treatments should be provided in line with National Institute for Health and Care Excellence guidelines. National optimal pathways have now been published in Wales across a range of cancer types. This means that expert clinicians have set out what should be delivered for different types of cancer, no matter where in Wales someone is diagnosed.

Dylid darparu triniaethau canser yn unol â chanllawiau'r Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal. Mae'r llwybrau cenedlaethol gorau bellach wedi'u cyhoeddi yng Nghymru ar draws amryw o fathau o ganser. Golyga hyn fod clinigwyr arbenigol wedi nodi'r hyn y dylid ei ddarparu ar gyfer gwahanol fathau o ganser, lle bynnag yng Nghymru y caiff rhywun ddiagnosis.

Thank you very much, Minister, for your answer. I wrote to you back in September regarding access to cytoreductive surgery, and at the time you outlined that the reason why treatment wasn't routinely available in Wales was following the advice from NICE, as you've just pointed out in your answer to me. But, since that letter and your response, I'm sure you'll be aware of two high-profile cases across Wales, where one lady moved to England to receive the relevant surgery, and another took legal action in order to receive treatment after being refused twice for treatment in Wales. Now, as I understand it, the treatment is available to patients in England, Scotland and Northern Ireland, but only in exceptional circumstances in Wales. Of course, I hear your answer in terms of following the advice of NICE, but I would be grateful for your assessment of why there is a different approach in Wales, and why is it that cytoreductive surgery is being denied, or is certainly less routinely available, in Wales to Welsh patients who have peritoneal cancer, and I would ask you would you be willing to review the access to this type of treatment.

Diolch yn fawr iawn am eich ateb, Weinidog. Ysgrifennais atoch yn ôl ym mis Medi ynglŷn â mynediad at lawdriniaeth cytoleihaol, ac ar y pryd fe sonioch chi mai cyngor y Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal oedd na ddylid darparu triniaeth fel mater o drefn yng Nghymru, fel yr ydych newydd ei nodi yn eich ateb i mi. Ond ers y llythyr hwnnw a'ch ymateb, rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn ymwybodol o ddau achos proffil uchel yng Nghymru, lle'r oedd un ddynes wedi symud i Loegr i gael y llawdriniaeth berthnasol, ac roedd un arall wedi rhoi camau cyfreithiol ar waith er mwyn cael triniaeth ar ôl iddi gael ei gwrthod ddwywaith am driniaeth yng Nghymru. Nawr, yn ôl yr hyn a ddeallaf, mae'r driniaeth ar gael i gleifion yn Lloegr, yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon, ond dim ond mewn amgylchiadau eithriadol yng Nghymru. Wrth gwrs, clywais eich ateb ynglŷn â dilyn cyngor y Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal, ond byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe baech yn egluro pam fod dull gwahanol wedi'i fabwysiadu yng Nghymru, a pham y gwrthodir llawdriniaethau cytoleihaol, neu'n sicr pam nad ydynt ar gael yn fwy eang fel mater o drefn yng Nghymru i gleifion o Gymru sydd â chanser peritoneol, ac a fyddech yn fodlon adolygu'r mynediad at y math hwn o driniaeth.

Thanks very much. Well, I think it is important that we set out those national optimal pathways, and they have been developed for different tumour sites. And what we're trying to do is to make sure that we have value-based intervention. Of course, we have a unique approach in Wales, in the sense that we have a single, unified waiting time, which is different from the way they do it in England.

So, there are different kinds of cancers, and certainly when it comes to pancreatic cancer, for example, it's one of the six least survivable cancers. It is important that people understand that there are prescriptions, like pancreatic enzyme replacement therapy, which are available for all health boards in Wales, and they should apply that locally. So, where it is available, part of what we're trying to do is to disseminate awareness and produce materials to inform clinicians throughout Wales of the importance of prescribing the appropriate medicines. So, I hope that gives some clarification. 

Diolch yn fawr. Wel, credaf ei bod yn bwysig inni nodi'r llwybrau cenedlaethol gorau hynny, ac maent wedi'u datblygu ar gyfer gwahanol safleoedd tiwmor. A'r hyn y ceisiwn ei wneud yw sicrhau bod gennym ymyrraeth sy'n seiliedig ar werthoedd. Wrth gwrs, mae gennym ddull gweithredu unigryw yng Nghymru, yn yr ystyr fod gennym un amser aros unedig, sy'n wahanol i'r ffordd y maent yn ei wneud yn Lloegr.

Felly, mae gwahanol fathau o ganserau, ac yn sicr yn achos canser y pancreas, er enghraifft, mae'n un o'r chwe chanser lleiaf goroesadwy. Mae'n bwysig fod pobl yn deall bod yna bresgripsiynau, fel therapi amnewid ensymau pancreatig, sydd ar gael i bob bwrdd iechyd yng Nghymru, a dylent gymhwyso hynny'n lleol. Felly, lle mae ar gael, rhan o'r hyn y ceisiwn ei wneud yw lledaenu ymwybyddiaeth a chynhyrchu deunyddiau i roi gwybod i glinigwyr ledled Cymru am bwysigrwydd presgripsiynu'r meddyginiaethau priodol. Felly, rwy'n gobeithio bod hynny'n rhoi rhywfaint o eglurhad. 

15:00

Mae cwestiwn 4 [OQ57841] wedi ei dynnu nôl, felly cwestiwn 5, Delyth Jewell.

Question 4 [OQ57841] is withdrawn, so question 5, Delyth Jewell.

Canserau Prin
Rare Cancers

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I note Russell George's question just now. Minister, you'll be familiar with the case of my constituent, Maria Wallpott—

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Nodaf y cwestiwn a ofynnodd Russell George yn awr. Weinidog, fe fyddwch yn gyfarwydd ag achos fy etholwr, Maria Wallpott—

No, can you ask the question first of all, please?

Na, a allwch ofyn y cwestiwn yn gyntaf, os gwelwch yn dda?

Oh, forgive me, Dirprwy Lywydd. Forgive me for that. 

O, maddeuwch i mi, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Maddeuwch i mi am hynny.

5. Beth yw'r egwyddorion y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn disgwyl i Bwyllgor Gwasanaethau Iechyd Arbenigol Cymru eu dilyn wrth wneud penderfyniadau ynghylch a ddylid darparu triniaeth ar gyfer canserau prin? OQ57851

5. What are the principles the Welsh Government expects the Welsh Health Specialised Services Committee to follow when making decisions about whether to provide treatment for rare cancers? OQ57851

Forgive me, again, for not asking that. 

Maddeuwch i mi, eto, am beidio â gofyn y cwestiwn.

Thank you very much. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Dŷn ni'n disgwyl i Bwyllgor Gwasanaethau Iechyd Arbenigol Cymru ddarparu pob triniaeth, gan gynnwys y rhai ar gyfer canserau prin, os ydyn nhw'n cael eu hargymell gan y Sefydliad Cenedlaethol dros Ragoriaeth mewn Iechyd a Gofal—NICE—neu'r Grŵp Strategaeth Meddyginiaethau Cymru Gyfan.

We expect the Welsh Health Specialised Services Committee to provide all treatments, including those for rare cancers, if they are recommended by the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence—NICE—or the All Wales Medicines Strategy Group.

Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. Diolch. Forgive me, Minister, it's because it's on a very similar—well, the same topic. You'll be familiar with the case of my constituent, Maria Wallpott. Earlier this year, she won her case in the High Court to be allowed potentially life-saving cancer treatment. The treatment would have been automatically available to patients elsewhere in the UK, but she was refused by a committee that is tasked with taking into account economic factors when deciding whether to approve treatments in Wales. Several similar cases have been raised with me; most recently, a constituent whose father has a cancer that needs treatment but was told that funding was, again, unavailable in Wales. Mrs Wallpott's case has shown that the decision to refuse that treatment was unlawful. Now, other patients are being refused cancer treatments that could save their lives, and I'm concerned that decisions are being made based on funding instead of on only clinical deliberations. So, Minister, could you tell me, again, in addition to what you've said already on this, why the situation is so different in Wales? And will the outcome of Maria Wallpott's case have any effect on how these decisions are made, please?

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Diolch. Maddeuwch i mi, Weinidog, mae ar bwnc tebyg iawn—wel, yr un pwnc. Fe fyddwch yn gyfarwydd ag achos fy etholwr, Maria Wallpott. Yn gynharach eleni, enillodd ei hachos yn yr Uchel Lys i gael triniaeth canser a allai achub bywyd. Byddai’r driniaeth wedi bod ar gael yn awtomatig i gleifion mewn mannau eraill yn y DU, ond cafodd ei gwrthod gan bwyllgor sydd â’r dasg o ystyried ffactorau economaidd wrth benderfynu a ddylid cymeradwyo triniaethau yng Nghymru. Cafodd sawl achos tebyg eu dwyn i fy sylw; yn fwyaf diweddar, etholwr y mae gan ei dad ganser sydd angen triniaeth ond unwaith eto, dywedwyd wrtho nad oedd cyllid ar gael yng Nghymru. Mae achos Mrs Wallpott wedi dangos bod y penderfyniad i wrthod y driniaeth honno'n anghyfreithlon. Nawr, mae triniaethau canser a allai achub bywydau'n cael eu gwrthod i gleifion eraill, ac rwy'n pryderu bod penderfyniadau'n cael eu gwneud ar sail cyllid yn hytrach nag ar ystyriaethau clinigol yn unig. Felly, Weinidog, a wnewch chi ddweud wrthyf, unwaith eto, yn ychwanegol at yr hyn yr ydych eisoes wedi’i ddweud ar hyn, pam fod y sefyllfa mor wahanol yng Nghymru? Ac a fydd canlyniad achos Maria Wallpott yn cael unrhyw effaith ar sut y gwneir y penderfyniadau hyn, os gwelwch yn dda?

Well, the Member will understand that I can't comment on individual cases, but I am keen that WHSSC considers the finding of the judicial review and that they ensure that the individual patient funding requests policy is adopted fairly, consistently and equitably. So, whilst Welsh Ministers can generally direct local health boards in Wales as to the functions they exercise, responsibility for individual patient funding requests ultimately rests with LHBs and with health specialised services. We have intervened in the past to make sure that they speed up the handling of IPFRs by the NHS, and I'm pleased to say that we have seen good progress. But, of course, I am anxious that we learn from any case where judicial reviews have come against and worked against the Welsh Government. 

Wel, bydd yr Aelod yn deall na allaf wneud sylw ar achosion unigol, ond rwy’n awyddus i Bwyllgor Gwasanaethau Iechyd Arbenigol Cymru ystyried dyfarniad yr adolygiad barnwrol a’u bod yn sicrhau bod y polisi ar geisiadau cyllido cleifion unigol yn cael ei roi ar waith yn deg, yn gyson ac yn gyfartal. Felly, er y gall Gweinidogion Cymru gyfarwyddo byrddau iechyd lleol yng Nghymru yn gyffredinol ynghylch y swyddogaethau y maent yn eu harfer, yn y pen draw, y byrddau iechyd lleol a’r gwasanaethau iechyd arbenigol sy’n gyfrifol am geisiadau cyllido cleifion unigol. Rydym wedi ymyrryd yn y gorffennol i sicrhau eu bod yn cyflymu’r broses o ymdrin â cheisiadau cyllido cleifion unigol gan y GIG, ac rwy’n falch o ddweud ein bod wedi gweld cynnydd da. Ond wrth gwrs, rwy’n awyddus inni ddysgu o unrhyw achos lle mae adolygiadau barnwrol wedi dyfarnu a gweithio yn erbyn Llywodraeth Cymru.

As the Senedd will know, it is a sub-committee of WHSSC that holds delegated joint committee authority to consider and make decisions on requests to fund NHS healthcare for individual patients who fall outside the range of services and treatments that a health board has agreed to routinely provide. For us in north Wales, this has seen patients go to Manchester and Liverpool for cancer treatment, Oswestry for orthopaedic operations and Liverpool for heart treatment. When the national health service was founded, it could not have been envisaged that there would now be, with devolution, bureaucratic borders between treatments offered in the four corners of the United Kingdom. There are severe delays in access to treatment by requesting that the panel sees written evidence, a request form, other documentary evidence, and it is so complex, Minister. And for the Member that's muttering over there, during my first—

Fel y gŵyr y Senedd, un o is-bwyllgorau Pwyllgor Gwasanaethau Iechyd Arbenigol Cymru sydd â'r awdurdod cydbwyllgor dirprwyedig i ystyried a gwneud penderfyniadau ar geisiadau i gyllido gofal iechyd y GIG ar gyfer cleifion unigol nad ydynt yn gymwys i dderbyn yr ystod o wasanaethau a thriniaethau y mae bwrdd iechyd wedi cytuno i'w darparu fel mater o drefn. I ni yn y gogledd, golyga hyn fod cleifion wedi gorfod mynd i Fanceinion a Lerpwl i gael triniaeth canser, i Groesoswallt am lawdriniaethau orthopedig ac i Lerpwl i gael triniaethau ar y galon. Pan sefydlwyd y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol, ni ellid bod wedi rhagweld y byddai ffiniau biwrocrataidd yn bodoli bellach, yn sgil datganoli, rhwng y triniaethau a gynigir ym mhedair gwlad y Deyrnas Unedig. Ceir oedi difrifol o ran mynediad at driniaeth drwy ofyn i’r panel weld tystiolaeth ysgrifenedig, ffurflen gais, tystiolaeth ddogfennol arall, ac mae hyn mor gymhleth, Weinidog. Ac i'r Aelod sy'n mwmian draw yn y fan acw, yn ystod fy—

15:05

You have less time to ask the question, so focus on the question.

Mae gennych lai o amser i ofyn y cwestiwn, felly canolbwyntiwch ar y cwestiwn.

During my first term in this Senedd and in the Health and Social Care Committee, concerns were raised about these delays and this complex bureaucracy around WHSSC. Could you, Minister, have a look at reviewing the bureaucratic delays on treatments? And will you liaise with all Welsh health boards to ensure that they do have agreements in place with health boards elsewhere in the UK that provide treatments that we do not, and just make it more of a seamless way of going about things? Because I have many, many constituents now in Aberconwy who are really caught up in the bureaucracy of all this. Thank you.

Yn ystod fy nhymor cyntaf yn y Senedd hon ac yn y Pwyllgor Iechyd a Gofal Cymdeithasol, lleisiwyd pryderon am yr oedi hwn a’r fiwrocratiaeth gymhleth mewn perthynas â Phwyllgor Gwasanaethau Iechyd Arbenigol Cymru. Weinidog, a wnewch chi ystyried adolygu’r oedi biwrocrataidd ar driniaethau? Ac a wnewch chi gysylltu â holl fyrddau iechyd Cymru i sicrhau bod ganddynt gytundebau ar waith gyda byrddau iechyd mewn mannau eraill yn y DU sy'n darparu triniaethau nad ydym ni yn eu darparu, a gwneud pethau'n fwy llyfn? Oherwydd mae gennyf lawer iawn o etholwyr yn Aberconwy y mae'r fiwrocratiaeth hon wedi amharu arnynt. Diolch.

Thanks. Well, I think that it's fair to say that there have been issues in the past, and I think that we've made good progress since 2016. The fact is that the total number of IPFR requests is decreasing, while the proportion of those approved is increasing. So, those are the facts. So, things are definitely improving. I do think that it's fair to say—. Look, we're never going to have a situation where highly, highly specialised medicine, that you can do all of that within the confines of Wales. Frankly, if you have a very, very rare condition, then wouldn't you want to go to the best place possible in order to get that sorted? And if that's in England, so be it. That's fine. So, I think that we've just got to be realistic about getting the best care for individuals within Wales. Certainly, of course we want to try to get those treatments done as quickly as possible, but I do think that the situation has improved quite dramatically since 2016.

Diolch. Wel, credaf ei bod yn deg dweud y bu problemau yn y gorffennol, a chredaf ein bod wedi gwneud cynnydd da ers 2016. Y ffaith yw bod cyfanswm nifer y ceisiadau cyllido cleifion unigol yn gostwng, tra bo cyfran y rheini a gymeradwyir yn cynyddu. Felly, dyna’r ffeithiau. Felly, mae pethau'n sicr yn gwella. Credaf ei bod yn deg dweud—. Edrychwch, nid ydym byth yn mynd i fod mewn sefyllfa lle mae meddygaeth arbenigol iawn, lle y gallwch wneud hynny i gyd o fewn ffiniau Cymru. A dweud y gwir, os oes gennych gyflwr prin iawn, oni fyddai'n well gennych fynd i'r lle gorau posibl i'w drin? Ac os mai yn Lloegr y ceir y driniaeth honno, boed hynny fel y bo. Mae hynny'n iawn. Felly, credaf fod yn rhaid inni fod yn realistig ynglŷn â chael y gofal gorau i unigolion yng Nghymru. Wrth gwrs ein bod yn awyddus i geisio cyflawni’r triniaethau hynny cyn gynted â phosibl, ond credaf fod y sefyllfa wedi gwella’n eithaf sylweddol ers 2016.

Ysbyty Cymunedol Gogledd Sir Ddinbych
North Denbighshire Community Hospital

6. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am ysbyty cymunedol gogledd sir Ddinbych? OQ57839

6. Will the Minister provide an update on the north Denbighshire community hospital? OQ57839

The full business case for the Royal Alexandra Hospital scheme has been received by the Welsh Government. I will make a final decision on the scheme, and the health board and local Members of the Senedd will be informed as soon as that decision is made.

Mae achos busnes llawn cynllun Ysbyty Brenhinol Alexandra wedi'i gyflwyno i Lywodraeth Cymru. Byddaf yn gwneud penderfyniad terfynol ar y cynllun, a chaiff y bwrdd iechyd ac Aelodau lleol o'r Senedd wybod cyn gynted ag y gwneir y penderfyniad hwnnw.

Thank you for that answer, Minister. My constituents have been promised this improvement to community health for years and years—nearly for a decade now. You keep telling us, time and time again, that the restoration of the Royal Alex is always just around the corner, without a spade going in the ground or anything tangible for the residents of Rhyl and Prestatyn to see. When I raise this issue with the Welsh Government, they pin the delays on Betsi, and then Betsi lay the blame at the door of the Welsh Government. My constituents don't care who is to blame. They just want clear answers and their services up and running. Minister, how will you work with the local health board to remove any road blocks and ensure that the north Denbighshire community hospital is delivered in the shortest possible time frame? Thank you.

Diolch am eich ateb, Weinidog. Mae'r gwelliant hwn i iechyd cymunedol wedi'i addo i fy etholwyr ers blynyddoedd lawer—ers bron i ddegawd bellach. Rydych yn dweud wrthym dro ar ôl tro fod y gwaith o adfer Ysbyty Brenhinol Alexandra bob amser ar y gorwel, heb i'r un rhaw gael ei rhoi yn y ddaear nac unrhyw beth diriaethol i drigolion y Rhyl a Phrestatyn ei weld. Pan godaf y mater hwn gyda Llywodraeth Cymru, maent yn beio bwrdd Betsi am yr oedi, ac yna mae bwrdd Betsi'n beio Llywodraeth Cymru. Nid oes ots gan fy etholwyr pwy sydd ar fai. Mae arnynt eisiau atebion clir a gwasanaethau gweithredol. Weinidog, sut y byddwch yn gweithio gyda’r bwrdd iechyd lleol i gael gwared ar unrhyw rwystrau a sicrhau bod ysbyty cymuned gogledd sir Ddinbych yn cael ei ddarparu yn y ffrâm amser fyrraf bosibl? Diolch.

Well, thanks very much, Gareth. You'll be aware that the restraints on our capital funding are very real, not just for the next coming year, but also for the three years after that. I think that it's probably worth also pointing out that the initial costs of the scheme were estimated to be £22 million—

Wel, diolch yn fawr iawn, Gareth. Fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol fod y cyfyngiadau ar ein cyllid cyfalaf yn real iawn, nid yn unig ar gyfer y flwyddyn nesaf, ond ar gyfer y tair blynedd ar ôl hynny hefyd. Credaf ei bod hefyd yn werth nodi, mae'n debyg, mai £22 miliwn oedd yr amcangyfrif o gostau cychwynnol y cynllun—

They've doubled in that time.

Maent wedi dyblu yn yr amser hwnnw.

—and then the outline business case, when that was produced, that increased to £51 million, and now the full business case is £72 million. So, we are in a very different situation from when the proposal was initially put before us, but obviously, I will let you know once that decision has been made.

—ac yna’r achos busnes amlinellol, pan luniwyd hwnnw, cynyddodd y ffigur i £51 miliwn, a bellach, mae'r achos busnes llawn yn £72 miliwn. Felly, rydym mewn sefyllfa wahanol iawn i pan gyflwynwyd y cynnig ger ein bron yn wreiddiol, ond yn amlwg, byddaf yn rhoi gwybod i chi pan fydd y penderfyniad hwnnw wedi’i wneud.

Mynediad at Ddeintydd GIG
Access to an NHS Dentist

7. Beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n ei wneud i helpu trigolion Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy i gael mynediad at ddeintydd GIG? OQ57849

7. What is the Welsh Government doing to help residents in Alyn and Deeside access an NHS dentist? OQ57849

We are working on system reform in dentistry and moving forward collaboratively with the reform programme in 2022. This includes working with practices to improve access, experience and quality of dental care.

Rydym yn gweithio ar ddiwygio'r system ddeintyddiaeth ac yn bwrw ymlaen ar y cyd â’r rhaglen ddiwygio yn 2022. Mae hyn yn cynnwys gweithio gyda phractisau i wella mynediad, profiad ac ansawdd gofal deintyddol.

Diolch yn fawr, Weinidog, for the answer there. The First Minister explained just yesterday the challenges that we're facing in dentistry at the moment in Wales and across the United Kingdom. But residents in Alyn and Deeside are very much feeling the pinch of those challenges, and they are coming to me, as their directly elected Member of the Senedd, because they are struggling to see an NHS dentist. Will you commit today, Minister, to your officials speaking with not only the practices but also the health board, to work out a route-map to ensure that everyone who wants to see and needs to see a dentist in Alyn and Deeside can access an NHS dentist in Alyn and Deeside? 

Diolch yn fawr am eich ateb, Weinidog. Ddoe, eglurodd y Prif Weinidog yr heriau yr ydym yn eu hwynebu ym maes deintyddiaeth ar hyn o bryd yng Nghymru a ledled y Deyrnas Unedig. Ond mae trigolion Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy yn teimlo effaith yr heriau hynny'n fawr, ac maent yn dod ataf, fel eu Haelod etholedig uniongyrchol o’r Senedd, am eu bod yn cael trafferth gweld deintydd y GIG. A wnewch chi ymrwymo heddiw, Weinidog, i sicrhau bod eich swyddogion yn siarad nid yn unig â’r practisau ond â’r bwrdd iechyd hefyd, er mwyn llunio cynllun i wneud yn siŵr fod pawb sydd eisiau gweld ac sydd angen gweld deintydd yn Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy yn gallu cael mynediad at ddeintydd y GIG yn Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy?

Well, thanks very much, Jack. You'll be aware that there is real pressure on dental services, partly because of COVID and the fact that that aerosol spray really means that the spread of COVID is more likely. Recovery is happening, but obviously that is very difficult and very slow, and I acknowledge that there are areas where it's more difficult to access dental care than others.

I will be speaking and meeting with the health board chairs tomorrow, and the chief executives, and this is certainly something that I've very much got on the agenda, and I'll be making sure that they address this issue in their integrated medium-term plan proposals.

Wel, diolch yn fawr, Jack. Fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol fod pwysau gwirioneddol ar wasanaethau deintyddol, yn rhannol oherwydd COVID a’r ffaith bod chwistrellu aerosol yn golygu bod lledaeniad COVID yn fwy tebygol. Mae adferiad yn digwydd, ond yn amlwg, mae hynny'n anodd iawn ac yn araf iawn, ac rwy'n cydnabod bod yna ardaloedd lle mae'n anos cael mynediad at ofal deintyddol nag eraill.

Byddaf yn siarad ac yn cyfarfod â chadeiryddion y byrddau iechyd yfory, a'r prif weithredwyr, ac mae hyn yn sicr yn rhywbeth sydd gennyf ar yr agenda, a byddaf yn sicrhau eu bod yn mynd i'r afael â'r mater hwn yng nghynigion eu cynllun tymor canolig integredig.

15:10

I have relatives in Flintshire who themselves have struggled to access an NHS dentist, who thankfully recently received treatment after weeks in great pain. We know that, in January, Betsi Cadwaladr insisted that action is needed to address dentistry in north Wales, after 83 dental posts were lost in Wales during the year, and the British Dental Association warned that significant numbers of dentists were planning on leaving the NHS, saying that NHS dentistry is hanging by a thread because without NHS dentists there would be no NHS dentistry. And earlier this month, Bupa Dental Care handed in notice of termination for their Flint branch, adjacent to Alyn and Deeside. It's 16 years since the North Wales Regional Committee raised concerns about a forthcoming NHS dental crisis in Wales, and here we are, all these years later, in these circumstances.

So, what action will the Welsh Government now take to engage with the British Dental Association to address their concerns with the dentistry contracts, that these reduce focus on regular check-ups, force dentists to choose between old and new patients, and fund dentists by 15 per cent less than six years ago?

Mae gennyf berthnasau yn sir y Fflint sydd wedi cael trafferth cael mynediad at ddeintydd y GIG, a chawsant driniaeth yn ddiweddar, diolch byth, ar ôl wythnosau mewn cryn dipyn o boen. Gwyddom fod Betsi Cadwaladr, ym mis Ionawr, wedi mynnu bod angen cymryd camau i fynd i’r afael â deintyddiaeth yn y gogledd, ar ôl i 83 o swyddi deintyddol gael eu colli yng Nghymru yn ystod y flwyddyn, a rhybuddiodd Cymdeithas Ddeintyddol Prydain fod nifer sylweddol o ddeintyddion yn bwriadu gadael y GIG, gan ddweud bod deintyddiaeth y GIG yn y fantol, oherwydd heb ddeintyddion y GIG, ni fyddai deintyddiaeth y GIG yn bodoli. Ac yn gynharach y mis hwn, cyflwynodd Bupa Dental Care hysbysiad o derfyniad ar gyfer eu cangen yn y Fflint, sy'n ffinio ag Alun a Glannau Dyfrdwy. Mae 16 mlynedd ers i Bwyllgor Rhanbarth Gogledd Cymru fynegi pryderon fod argyfwng ar y ffordd ym maes deintyddiaeth y GIG yng Nghymru, a dyma ni, yr holl flynyddoedd hyn yn ddiweddarach, yn y sefyllfa hon.

Felly, pa gamau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd yn awr i ymgysylltu â Chymdeithas Ddeintyddol Prydain er mwyn mynd i’r afael â’u pryderon ynghylch y contractau deintyddiaeth, fod y rhain yn lleihau’r ffocws ar archwiliadau rheolaidd, yn gorfodi deintyddion i ddewis rhwng hen gleifion a chleifion newydd, ac yn ariannu deintyddion 15 y cant yn llai na chwe blynedd yn ôl?

Well, thanks very much. We're continuing to work with the British Dental Association to explore how the reform of the national dental contract can encourage dental practices to collaborate at a local level. I'm sure you'll be pleased to hear, in relation to Bupa in Flint, that the health board plans to recommission replacement services in the area as early as possible.

It is probably worth emphasising that we have provided an additional £3 million this financial year, and what we're seeing is, actually, dentists are not picking up that money. We're putting the money on the table, but they would rather work in their private practices, and that's a very difficult challenge for us, but we are making a longer term commitment: £2 million additional funding recurrently to support increased provision. We've also given almost £0.5 million to health boards to support dental practices to provide NHS services and to install new ventilation equipment. So, we're doing all we can. At some point—. There's more we can do. There's always more that we can do, and certainly that's one of the reasons why I have got this as one of my key points on the agenda to discuss with the health boards tomorrow.

Wel, diolch yn fawr. Rydym yn parhau i weithio gyda Chymdeithas Ddeintyddol Prydain i archwilio sut y gall diwygio'r contract deintyddol cenedlaethol annog practisau deintyddol i gydweithio ar lefel leol. Rwy’n siŵr y byddwch yn falch o glywed, mewn perthynas â Bupa yn y Fflint, fod y bwrdd iechyd yn bwriadu ailgomisiynu gwasanaethau i gymryd eu lle yn yr ardal cyn gynted â phosibl.

Mae'n debyg ei bod yn werth pwysleisio ein bod wedi darparu £3 miliwn yn ychwanegol yn y flwyddyn ariannol hon, a'r hyn a welwn, mewn gwirionedd, yw nad yw deintyddion yn manteisio ar yr arian hwnnw. Rydym yn rhoi'r arian ar y bwrdd, ond byddai'n well ganddynt weithio yn eu practisau preifat, ac mae honno'n her anodd iawn i ni, ond rydym yn gwneud ymrwymiad mwy hirdymor: £2 filiwn o gyllid rheolaidd ychwanegol i gefnogi mwy o ddarpariaeth. Rydym hefyd wedi rhoi bron i £0.5 miliwn i fyrddau iechyd i gynorthwyo practisau deintyddol i ddarparu gwasanaethau GIG ac i osod offer awyru newydd. Felly, rydym yn gwneud popeth a allwn. Ar ryw bwynt—. Mae mwy y gallwn ei wneud. Mae mwy y gallwn ei wneud bob amser, ac yn sicr, dyna un o'r rhesymau pam fod hyn yn un o fy mhwyntiau allweddol ar yr agenda i'w trafod gyda'r byrddau iechyd yfory.

Mae cwestiwn 8 [OQ57838] wedi ei dynnu yn ôl, felly, yn olaf, cwestiwn 9, Sam Rowlands.

Question 8 [OQ57838] is withdrawn, so, finally, question 9, Sam Rowlands.

Gofalwyr Di-dâl
Unpaid Carers

9. Pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i gefnogi gofalwyr di-dâl yng ngogledd Cymru? OQ57831

9. What action is the Welsh Government taking to support unpaid carers in north Wales? OQ57831

Today I announced a £500 payment for over 57,000 unpaid carers across Wales who are in receipt of carers allowance. Also, unpaid carers in north Wales continue to benefit from the additional £10 million we allocated for a range of carer support services in 2021-22, including £3 million for respite.

Heddiw, cyhoeddais daliad o £500 ar gyfer dros 57,000 o ofalwyr di-dâl ledled Cymru sy’n cael lwfans gofalwr. Hefyd, mae gofalwyr di-dâl yng ngogledd Cymru yn parhau i elwa ar y £10 miliwn ychwanegol a ddyrannwyd gennym ar gyfer ystod o wasanaethau cymorth i ofalwyr yn 2021-22, gan gynnwys £3 miliwn ar gyfer gofal seibiant.

I thank the Deputy Minister for her response, and if only every question I asked had such a quick resolution in terms of support, and giving those unpaid carers that £500. But, in all seriousness, this payment clearly recognises the incredible role that unpaid carers have played through the pandemic and I'm sure it is welcomed by all.

If I may, though, I'd like to ask you about the restoration of services for carers as well, though. So, as we know, unpaid carers save the NHS and taxpayers billions of pounds a year by providing this important care. But despite nearly all COVID-19 restrictions easing, the services unpaid carers rely on have not been prioritised, with services still significantly reduced or even closed entirely. And recent research by Carers Wales found that just 8 per cent of carers say that day services and care homes for respite breaks have been fully reopened, and only 16 per cent said sitting services were fully operational. So, what action will you take to urgently prioritise and monitor the restoration of these much needed services for carers? Thank you.

Diolch i’r Dirprwy Weinidog am ei hymateb, ac o na bai pob cwestiwn a ofynnaf yn cael ei ddatrys mor gyflym o ran cymorth, a rhoi’r £500 hwnnw i’r gofalwyr di-dâl hynny. Ond o ddifrif, mae'r taliad hwn yn amlwg yn cydnabod y rhan anhygoel y mae gofalwyr di-dâl wedi'i chwarae drwy gydol y pandemig, ac rwy'n siŵr ei fod yn cael croeso gan bawb.

Fodd bynnag, os caf, hoffwn ofyn i chi ynglŷn ag adfer gwasanaethau i ofalwyr hefyd. Felly, fel y gwyddom, mae gofalwyr di-dâl yn arbed biliynau o bunnoedd y flwyddyn i’r GIG a threthdalwyr drwy ddarparu’r gofal pwysig hwn. Ond er gwaethaf llacio’r holl gyfyngiadau COVID-19 fwy neu lai, nid yw’r gwasanaethau y mae gofalwyr di-dâl yn dibynnu arnynt wedi’u blaenoriaethu, gyda gwasanaethau’n dal i fod wedi'u lleihau’n sylweddol neu hyd yn oed ar gau yn gyfan gwbl. A chanfu ymchwil ddiweddar gan Gofalwyr Cymru mai 8 y cant yn unig o ofalwyr sy’n dweud bod gwasanaethau dydd a chartrefi gofal ar gyfer seibiant wedi’u hailagor yn llawn, ac 16 y cant yn unig sy’n dweud bod gwasanaethau eistedd gyda phobl yn gwbl weithredol. Felly, pa gamau brys y byddwch yn eu cymryd i flaenoriaethu a monitro'r gwaith o adfer y gwasanaethau hyn y mae mawr eu hangen ar ofalwyr? Diolch.

Thank you very much for that question, and thank you for your recognition of the importance of the £500 payment to the carers who will be eligible for it. I think that the point you raised is very important, because we know that unpaid carers did manage, in some cases, through the whole of the pandemic without having any additional support at all. In fact, some of them didn't take any support, because they were so anxious to look after their loved ones. I have been approached by a number of Members of the Senedd about their concern about the lack of the quick recommencing of the local services.

I'm very well aware of this situation, as are the officials, and we have approached the local authorities, in particular local authorities where we've been alerted to the fact that carers are aware that the services they used have not been reopened, particularly day services, and have urged them to do so. I'm aware that many of them have still not opened, so the officials have regular meetings with the directors of social services and we'll be continuing to urge them to reopen. I think we understand that local authorities and the staff have had a very tough time and many of them were redeployed to help carry out some of the essential services that have been needed during this period, but we do know, of course, that the support for unpaid carers is absolutely essential. The Welsh Government is trying to build in as much support as it possibly can with the hardship fund and with respite funding. It is crucial that we do get those services up and running again, so I can assure the Member that I will be redoubling my efforts to try and encourage local authorities to open those services. Thank you.

Diolch yn fawr iawn am eich cwestiwn, a diolch am gydnabod pwysigrwydd y taliad o £500 i’r gofalwyr a fydd yn gymwys i'w gael. Credaf fod y pwynt a godwyd gennych yn bwysig iawn, gan y gwyddom fod gofalwyr di-dâl wedi ymdopi, mewn rhai achosion, drwy gydol y pandemig cyfan heb unrhyw gymorth ychwanegol o gwbl. Yn wir, ni dderbyniodd rhai ohonynt unrhyw gymorth am eu bod mor awyddus i edrych ar ôl eu hanwyliaid. Mae nifer o Aelodau’r Senedd wedi cysylltu â mi ynglŷn â’u pryderon ynghylch y methiant i ailddechrau gwasanaethau lleol yn gyflym.

Rwy’n ymwybodol iawn o’r sefyllfa hon, fel y mae’r swyddogion, ac rydym wedi cysylltu â’r awdurdodau lleol, yn enwedig awdurdodau lleol lle'r ydym wedi cael gwybod bod gofalwyr yn ymwybodol nad yw’r gwasanaethau a ddefnyddiwyd ganddynt wedi’u hailagor, yn enwedig gwasanaethau dydd, ac wedi eu hannog i wneud hynny. Rwy’n ymwybodol fod llawer ohonynt heb agor o hyd, felly mae’r swyddogion yn cael cyfarfodydd rheolaidd gyda chyfarwyddwyr gwasanaethau cymdeithasol, a byddwn yn parhau i’w hannog i ailagor. Credaf ein bod yn deall bod awdurdodau lleol a’r staff wedi cael amser anodd iawn a chafodd llawer ohonynt eu hadleoli i helpu i gyflawni rhai o’r gwasanaethau hanfodol yr oedd eu hangen yn ystod y cyfnod hwn, ond rydym yn gwybod, wrth gwrs, fod y cymorth hwnnw i ofalwyr di-dâl yn gwbl hanfodol. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru'n ceisio cynnwys cymaint o gymorth â phosibl gyda’r gronfa galedi a chyllid seibiant. Mae'n hanfodol ein bod yn rhoi'r gwasanaethau hynny ar waith eto, felly gallaf roi sicrwydd i'r Aelod y byddaf yn dyblu fy ymdrechion i geisio annog awdurdodau lleol i agor y gwasanaethau hynny. Diolch.

15:15

Diolch i'r Gweinidog ac i'r Dirprwy Weinidogion. 

I thank the Minister and the Deputy Ministers.

3. Cwestiynau Amserol
3. Topical Questions

Symudwn ymlaen at yr ail gwestiwn amserol y prynhawn yma, a galwaf ar Mark Isherwood.

We move on now to the second topical question this afternoon, and I call on Mark Isherwood to ask the question.

Ffoaduriaid o Wcráin
Ukrainian Refugees

2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am y cynnydd sy'n cael ei wneud o ran lletya ffoaduriaid o Wcráin yng Nghymru? TQ610

2. Will the Minister make a statement on the progress being made to accommodate Ukrainian refugees in Wales? TQ610

Significant progress has been made to prepare to receive people fleeing the war in Ukraine so that they can seek sanctuary and safety in Wales. The UK Homes for Ukraine scheme is now open and the Welsh Government supersponsor route will be live from Friday.

Mae cynnydd sylweddol wedi’i wneud i baratoi i dderbyn pobol sy’n ffoi rhag y rhyfel yn Wcráin fel y gallant geisio noddfa a diogelwch yng Nghymru. Mae cynllun Cartrefi i Wcráin y DU bellach ar agor a bydd llwybr uwch-noddwr Llywodraeth Cymru yn weithredol o ddydd Gwener.

I thank the Minister for ringing me on Monday on the train to brief me on this, and I also note the update issued by the Welsh Government this morning, which states that they continue to work closely with local authorities, the NHS, other public services and the third sector to ensure support is available for people fleeing the conflict and arriving in Wales through the Homes for Ukraine scheme.

As you say, the Welsh Government will become a supersponsor under this scheme. On 13 March, the First Ministers of Wales and Scotland sent a joint letter to the UK Government proposing the Welsh and Scottish Governments as the overall supersponsors for the schemes in Wales and Scotland. However, although the UK Government launched the Homes for Ukraine portal on 18 March, whereby an organisation could be selected as a sponsor, when the option is selected, the only listed organisation still is the Scottish Government. Although you've stated that the Welsh Government will also be able to sponsor people directly and people arriving via this route will be directed to one of the welcome centres being set up across Wales before going on to medium and long-term accommodation, why does the Welsh Government still not appear as a sponsor option on the Homes for Ukraine portal, and can the Minister outline if and when people will be able to select the Welsh Government as a sponsor option on this?

Further, what support can you provide to people like the Flintshire constituent whose wife went to Poland to bring back her Ukrainian mum—thankfully successfully, and she's now in Flintshire—but who has been told that they can't access the cash card for refugees because of a lack of information and funds, that the £350 rehome scheme doesn't apply to his mum-in-law, that she can't access pension credits until she has a full visa, which will take two months, and that she can't register with their GP, despite having health issues? I fully appreciate some of those are reserved matters for the UK Government and some are the responsibility of the Welsh Government, but given your overall role as a supersponsor, I'd be grateful for your response.

Diolch i’r Gweinidog am fy ffonio ar y trên ddydd Llun i roi cyfarwyddyd imi ar hyn, a nodaf hefyd y diweddariad a gyhoeddwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru y bore yma, sy’n datgan eu bod yn parhau i weithio’n agos gydag awdurdodau lleol, y GIG, gwasanaethau cyhoeddus eraill a’r trydydd sector i sicrhau bod cymorth ar gael i bobl sy’n ffoi rhag y gwrthdaro ac sy’n cyrraedd Cymru drwy gynllun Cartrefi i Wcráin.

Fel y dywedwch, bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn dod yn uwch-noddwr o dan y cynllun hwn. Ar 13 Mawrth, anfonodd Prif Weinidogion Cymru a’r Alban lythyr ar y cyd at Lywodraeth y DU yn cynnig mai Llywodraethau Cymru a’r Alban fyddai’r uwch-noddwyr cyffredinol ar gyfer y cynlluniau yng Nghymru a’r Alban. Fodd bynnag, er bod Llywodraeth y DU wedi lansio porth Cartrefi i Wcráin ar 18 Mawrth, lle y gellid dewis sefydliad fel noddwr, pan ddewisir yr opsiwn, yr unig sefydliad sydd wedi'i restru o hyd yw Llywodraeth yr Alban. Er eich bod wedi nodi y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru hefyd yn gallu noddi pobl yn uniongyrchol ac y bydd pobl sy’n cyrraedd drwy'r llwybr hwn yn cael eu cyfeirio at un o’r canolfannau croeso sy’n cael eu sefydlu ledled Cymru cyn mynd ymlaen i lety tymor canolig a hirdymor, pam nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn dal i ymddangos fel noddwr ar y porth Cartrefi i Wcráin, ac a wnaiff y Gweinidog ddweud a fydd pobl yn gallu dewis Llywodraeth Cymru fel noddwr, a phryd?

Ymhellach, pa gymorth y gallwch ei roi i bobl fel yr etholwr o sir y Fflint yr aeth ei wraig i Wlad Pwyl i ddod â'i mam Wcreinaidd yn ôl—yn llwyddiannus, diolch byth, ac mae hi bellach yn sir y Fflint—ond sydd wedi cael gwybod na allant gael mynediad at y cerdyn arian parod ar gyfer ffoaduriaid oherwydd diffyg gwybodaeth a chyllid, nad yw’r cynllun ailgartrefu £350 yn berthnasol i’w fam-yng-nghyfraith, na all gael mynediad at gredydau pensiwn hyd nes y bydd ganddi fisa llawn, a fydd yn cymryd dau fis, ac na all gofrestru gyda'u meddyg teulu, er bod ganddi broblemau iechyd? Rwy’n deall yn iawn fod rhai o’r rheini’n faterion a gedwir yn ôl gan Lywodraeth y DU a bod rhai'n gyfrifoldeb i Lywodraeth Cymru, ond o ystyried eich rôl gyffredinol fel uwch-noddwr, byddwn yn ddiolchgar am eich ymateb.

Thank you very much for the questions, Mark Isherwood. As I've said and as has been made very clear in the information that we've provided on our bespoke page on the Welsh Government website about what we're doing to support Ukrainian refugees, we are due to become a supersponsor under the UK Government's Homes for Ukraine scheme this Friday. We wanted to make sure we were ready and able and prepared for that, to go live, and that, of course, is going to happen on Friday. But actually, we've been ready over the last weeks, certainly last weekend when the UK Government scheme went live, in case people came to us and needed us. We were ready and we had accommodation available. But the full scheme, as a supersponsor, with all the preparedness that has had to take place, commences on Friday.

I think it's important just for colleagues and for Members to know that this will initially involve up to 1,000 people actually skipping the need to identify a UK-based sponsor, and instead being sponsored directly by the Welsh Government. We won't be selecting those eligible to apply; people fleeing Ukraine will be able to select the Welsh Government from the system until our initial cap of refugees is met. As you know, we're opening welcome centres across Wales—and they are all across Wales—to ensure that all of those we're directly sponsoring can receive a high-quality welcome and are directly supported from the moment they arrive. And then, from the welcome centres, people will be moved into longer term accommodation across Wales.

There's a huge amount of work, 24/7, by local authorities, by our officials in the Welsh Government, the NHS and the third sector. I've had a really important meeting today with a range of Ukrainian community support, including the north Wales link that you drew to our attention, Mark, and many groups and Ukrainian voices who are going to actually also respond and help in the ways that were raised in terms of supporting children and young people in earlier questions to Lynne Neagle. So, it is all in place and it's all going to operate from Friday throughout Wales. It's going to be crucial that they just can come direct. The Welsh Government scheme will enable them to come direct to us for that support. 

On the second question, the points you raised are reserved matters, but we can make representations on behalf of you and constituents to the UK Government. We're working very closely with the UK Government, clearly, in terms of all Ukrainian refugees who come to us. If it's the Homes for Ukraine scheme, and that direct matching, obviously, we are going to get the data from the UK Government to ensure that we can get everything in place. Can I just say one point that is important in terms of the arrangements? Quite a few people are coming through the family visa route. That might be the route, in fact, that your constituent has mentioned. We don't actually know yet—we've asked the Home Office—how many are coming through that route, but I suspect that may be where your constituent has come through. So, it is very valuable to have from Members today some of their experiences in terms of what is happening to them and to their constituents. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn am eich cwestiynau, Mark Isherwood. Fel y dywedais ac fel sydd wedi’i nodi'n glir iawn yn yr wybodaeth a ddarparwyd gennym ar ein tudalen bwrpasol ar wefan Llywodraeth Cymru ynglŷn â'r hyn a wnawn i gefnogi ffoaduriaid o Wcráin, rydym ar fin dod yn uwch-noddwr o dan gynllun Cartrefi i Wcráin Llywodraeth y DU ddydd Gwener. Roeddem yn awyddus i sicrhau ein bod yn gallu gwneud hynny ac yn barod ar gyfer hynny, i roi'r cynllun ar waith, ac mae hynny, wrth gwrs, yn mynd i ddigwydd ddydd Gwener. Ond mewn gwirionedd, rydym wedi bod yn barod dros yr wythnosau diwethaf, yn sicr y penwythnos diwethaf, pan ddaeth cynllun Llywodraeth y DU yn weithredol, rhag ofn i bobl ddod atom a bod ein hangen. Roeddem yn barod, ac roedd gennym lety ar gael. Ond mae'r cynllun llawn, fel uwch-noddwr, gyda'r holl waith paratoi y bu'n rhaid ei wneud, yn dechrau ddydd Gwener.

Credaf ei bod yn bwysig i gyd-Aelodau wybod y bydd hyn yn golygu y bydd hyd at 1,000 o bobl i ddechrau yn osgoi'r angen i nodi noddwr yn y DU, ac yn hytrach, byddant yn cael eu noddi'n uniongyrchol gan Lywodraeth Cymru. Ni fyddwn yn dewis y rheini sy'n gymwys i wneud cais; bydd pobl sy’n ffoi o Wcráin yn gallu dewis Llywodraeth Cymru o’r system hyd nes bod ein cap cychwynnol o ffoaduriaid wedi’i gyrraedd. Fel y gwyddoch, rydym yn agor canolfannau croeso ledled Cymru—ac maent i'w cael ym mhob rhan o Gymru—i sicrhau bod pob un o'r rheini yr ydym yn eu noddi'n uniongyrchol yn gallu cael croeso o ansawdd uchel ac yn cael eu cefnogi'n uniongyrchol o'r funud y byddant yn cyrraedd. Ac yna, o'r canolfannau croeso, bydd pobl yn cael eu symud i lety mwy hirdymor ledled Cymru.

Mae llawer iawn o waith yn mynd rhagddo, 24/7, gan awdurdodau lleol, gan ein swyddogion yn Llywodraeth Cymru, y GIG a'r trydydd sector. Rwyf wedi cael cyfarfod hynod bwysig heddiw gydag ystod o gymorth cymunedol Wcreinaidd, gan gynnwys y cyswllt gogledd Cymru y tynnoch chi ein sylw ato, Mark, a llawer o grwpiau a lleisiau Wcreinaidd sydd hefyd yn mynd i ymateb a helpu yn y ffyrdd a godwyd o ran cefnogi plant a phobl ifanc mewn cwestiynau cynharach i Lynne Neagle. Felly, mae’r cyfan yn ei le, a bydd y cyfan yn weithredol ledled Cymru o ddydd Gwener ymlaen. Bydd y ffaith y byddant yn gallu dod yn uniongyrchol yn hollbwysig. Bydd cynllun Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu galluogi i ddod atom yn uniongyrchol i gael y cymorth hwnnw.

Ar yr ail gwestiwn, mae’r pwyntiau a godwyd gennych yn faterion a gedwir yn ôl, ond gallwn gyflwyno sylwadau ar eich rhan chi ac etholwyr i Lywodraeth y DU. Rydym yn gweithio'n agos iawn gyda Llywodraeth y DU, yn amlwg, mewn perthynas â'r holl ffoaduriaid o Wcráin a ddaw atom. Os bydd hynny drwy gynllun Cartrefi i Wcráin, a’r paru uniongyrchol, yn amlwg, byddwn yn cael y data gan Lywodraeth y DU i sicrhau y gallwn gael popeth yn ei le. A gaf fi nodi un pwynt sy'n bwysig am y trefniadau? Mae cryn dipyn o bobl yn dod drwy lwybr fisa teulu. Efallai mai dyna’r llwybr a nododd eich etholwr mewn gwirionedd. Nid ydym yn gwybod eto—rydym wedi gofyn i'r Swyddfa Gartref—faint sy'n dod drwy'r llwybr hwnnw, ond rwy'n tybio mai drwy'r llwybr hwnnw y daeth eich etholwr. Felly, mae’n werthfawr iawn clywed gan yr Aelodau heddiw am rai o’u profiadau o ran yr hyn sy’n digwydd iddynt hwy ac i’w hetholwyr.

15:20

Minister, the University of New Europe, a collective of academics from across Europe and the US, has published a comprehensive document that contains emergency contact details and funding opportunities for scholars, students, artists, cultural workers, journalists, lawyers and human rights activists fleeing Ukraine, Russia and Belarus. As we accommodate and welcome refugees fleeing the crisis and its effects in Ukraine, our universities, educational and cultural institutions have the chance to offer a breadth of opportunity and support for those coming to Wales. Providing this would help refugees settle in and feel involved in their communities, as well, of course, as enhancing the diversity in thought at our universities and among our academic and cultural networks. Would the Government consider co-ordinating a response from our universities and cultural institutions so a similar guide and system of support could be provided? How is the Minister currently working with our universities and cultural institutions to provide support and opportunity to refugees, and will the Government provide financial support for this response?

Weinidog, mae'r University of New Europe, grŵp o academyddion o Ewrop a’r Unol Daleithiau, wedi cyhoeddi dogfen gynhwysfawr sy’n cynnwys manylion cyswllt brys a chyfleoedd ariannu ar gyfer ysgolheigion, myfyrwyr, artistiaid, gweithwyr diwylliannol, newyddiadurwyr, cyfreithwyr a gweithredwyr hawliau dynol sy’n ffoi o Wcráin, Rwsia a Belarws. Wrth inni roi cartref a chroeso i ffoaduriaid sy’n ffoi rhag yr argyfwng a’i effeithiau yn Wcráin, mae cyfle i'n prifysgolion, sefydliadau addysgol a diwylliannol gynnig ystod eang o gyfleoedd a chymorth i’r rheini a ddaw i Gymru. Byddai darparu hyn yn helpu ffoaduriaid i ymgartrefu a theimlo’n rhan o’u cymunedau, yn ogystal, wrth gwrs, â gwella amrywiaeth syniadau yn ein prifysgolion ac ymhlith ein rhwydweithiau academaidd a diwylliannol. A wnaiff y Llywodraeth ystyried cydgysylltu ymateb gan ein prifysgolion a’n sefydliadau diwylliannol fel y gellid darparu canllawiau a system gymorth debyg? Sut y mae’r Gweinidog yn gweithio gyda’n prifysgolion a’n sefydliadau diwylliannol ar hyn o bryd i roi cymorth a chyfleoedd i ffoaduriaid, ac a wnaiff y Llywodraeth ddarparu cymorth ariannol ar gyfer yr ymateb hwn?

Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams. It's really important that you've drawn attention to yet another inspiring network that is working across Europe, and I would be grateful for those contacts so that we can make links with them. Our universities are rising up to the challenge. Many of them already have links with Ukrainian students, Ukrainian universities, and those links are actually being forged now. Indeed, just in terms of across universities in Wales, I think you'll find pretty much every one of the main universities is already linking up. And then we bring all of the universities together. So, they are looking to how they can, themselves, link with their own partnerships with Ukrainian universities, but also what they could offer to other young people and, indeed, families coming through.

I do think, also, that your point about the cultural institutions of Wales is very important. This is a cross-Government response. You can see from the answers in terms of health and social services, from housing, that all departments of the Welsh Government are engaged in this, but particularly the cultural institutions. This will also be the offer, the welcome, that we're giving to Ukrainian refugees as they come to Wales. We have a welcome pack that's being developed. I think it was interesting, when I met with many of those from, for example, Voice of Ukraine Wales, how they've got resources. Also the children's commissioner is linking up with the Ukrainian children's commissioner; we met with her today. There are lots of educational resources that have been brought together as well. But I think in terms of the cultural and higher education institutions and the ways in which we can bring their links together and when Ukrainian refugees arrive, this is part of the welcome offer to them as they come and we support them here in Wales.

Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams. Mae'n bwysig iawn eich bod wedi tynnu sylw at rwydwaith ysbrydoledig arall sy'n gweithio ledled Ewrop, a byddwn yn ddiolchgar am y manylion cyswllt er mwyn inni allu creu cysylltiadau â hwy. Mae ein prifysgolion yn ymateb i'r her. Mae gan lawer ohonynt gysylltiadau â myfyrwyr o Wcráin eisoes, â phrifysgolion Wcráin, ac mae'r cysylltiadau hynny'n cael eu creu yn awr, mewn gwirionedd. Yn wir, o safbwynt prifysgolion Cymru, credaf y gwelwch fod pob un o'r prif brifysgolion fwy neu lai yn cysylltu â'i gilydd eisoes. Ac yna, deuwn â'r holl brifysgolion ynghyd. Felly, maent yn edrych i weld sut y gallant, eu hunain, gysylltu â'u partneriaethau eu hunain â phrifysgolion Wcráin, ond hefyd, yr hyn y gallent ei gynnig i bobl ifanc eraill, ac yn wir, i deuluoedd a ddaw yma.

Credaf, hefyd, fod eich pwynt ynglŷn â sefydliadau diwylliannol Cymru yn bwysig iawn. Mae hwn yn ymateb trawslywodraethol. Gallwch weld o’r atebion o ran iechyd a gwasanaethau cymdeithasol, o ran tai, fod pob adran o Lywodraeth Cymru yn ymwneud â hyn, ond yn enwedig y sefydliadau diwylliannol. Dyma hefyd fydd y cynnig, y croeso, yr ydym yn ei roi i ffoaduriaid o Wcráin wrth iddynt ddod i Gymru. Mae gennym becyn croeso sy'n cael ei ddatblygu. Roedd yn ddiddorol clywed, pan gyfarfûm â llawer o'r rheini, er enghraifft, yn Llais Wcráin Cymru, sut y mae ganddynt adnoddau. Mae'r comisiynydd plant hefyd yn cysylltu â chomisiynydd plant Wcráin; gwnaethom gyfarfod â hi heddiw. Mae llawer o adnoddau addysgol wedi'u dwyn ynghyd hefyd. Ond o ran y sefydliadau diwylliannol ac addysg uwch a’r ffyrdd y gallwn ddod â’u cysylltiadau ynghyd a phan fydd ffoaduriaid o Wcráin yn cyrraedd, rwy'n credu bod hyn yn rhan o’r cynnig croeso wrth iddynt ddod yma ac wrth i ninnau eu cefnogi yma yng Nghymru.

15:25

The generosity of spirit demonstrated by people in Wales, across the United Kingdom and across our European continent contrasts quite disappointedly with the mean-spirited approach from the United Kingdom Government. Minister, what impact will the Nationality and Borders Bill have on our ability to reach out to Ukrainian families? You will be aware that yesterday Tory MPs in the House of Commons voted to impose a potential four-year prison sentence on any Ukrainian refugee who arrives in the United Kingdom without having the right papers. At the same time, the Nationality and Borders Bill rips up the international convention on refugees, which was written in the aftermath of the second world war and led by the British Government. What we've got in London is a Government turning its back on the human impact of war, and a Government that is more concerned with its own propaganda on its own right wing than reaching out and taking care of families who've been affected by war. What will we do, as a Welsh Government, to demonstrate that here in Wales the nation of sanctuary isn't simply a rhetoric but a reality?

Mae’r haelioni a ddangoswyd gan bobl yng Nghymru, ledled y Deyrnas Unedig a ledled cyfandir Ewrop yn cyferbynnu’n eithaf siomedig â dull crintachlyd Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig o weithredu. Weinidog, pa effaith a gaiff y Bil Cenedligrwydd a Ffiniau ar ein gallu i estyn cymorth i deuluoedd o Wcráin? Fe fyddwch yn ymwybodol fod ASau Torïaidd yn Nhŷ’r Cyffredin wedi pleidleisio ddoe i orfodi dedfryd bosibl o bedair blynedd o garchar i unrhyw ffoadur o Wcráin sy’n cyrraedd y Deyrnas Unedig heb y papurau cywir. Ar yr un pryd, mae’r Bil Cenedligrwydd a Ffiniau yn rhwygo’r confensiwn rhyngwladol ar ffoaduriaid yn ddarnau, confensiwn a ysgrifennwyd yn dilyn yr ail ryfel byd ac a arweiniwyd gan Lywodraeth Prydain. Yr hyn sydd gennym yn Llundain yw Llywodraeth sy’n troi ei chefn ar effaith ddynol rhyfel, a Llywodraeth a chanddi fwy o ddiddordeb yn ei phropaganda ar ei hasgell dde ei hun nag mewn estyn cymorth a gofalu am deuluoedd y mae rhyfel wedi effeithio arnynt. Beth a wnawn, fel Llywodraeth Cymru, i ddangos nad rhethreg yn unig yw cenedl noddfa yma yng Nghymru, ond realiti?

Thank you very much for that very topical question, Alun Davies. The First Minister has reported in past weeks that, when he wrote to the Prime Minister at the end of February, making sure that we were offering to play our part in terms of being a nation of sanctuary and being very clear about our position in terms of Putin's aggression, he did actually take the opportunity, in his correspondence, to emphasise that the Welsh Government believed that the UK Government should reconsider the proposals in the Nationality and Borders Bill, which we believe creates a two-tier system between asylum seekers depending on their route of entering into the UK. We quite clearly made that point to the Prime Minister. So, we have to recognise the point that Alun Davies makes today. It was, in fact, the UK shadow Home Secretary who said yesterday in the debate that the Nationality and Borders Bill will make it a criminal offence, as you say, for Ukrainian families to arrive in the UK without the right papers, with a penalty of up to four years in prison, at a time when the British people have made it clear that we need to help Ukrainian refugees. This is deeply shameful—those were her words. But we here in Wales, as a nation of sanctuary, want to provide a quick, safe and warm welcome to Ukrainians in Wales. I do believe that our supersponsor route, which we're working on alongside our Scottish colleagues, will eliminate a key bottleneck in the UK system. That's crucial to ensure that those coming to Wales don't need to already know a household in Wales who can sponsor them.

Diolch yn fawr iawn am eich cwestiwn amserol iawn, Alun Davies. Mae’r Prif Weinidog wedi nodi yn ystod yr wythnosau diwethaf, pan ysgrifennodd at Brif Weinidog y DU ddiwedd mis Chwefror i sicrhau ein bod yn cynnig chwarae ein rhan fel cenedl noddfa a nodi ein safbwynt ar ymddygiad ymosodol Putin yn glir iawn, ei fod wedi manteisio ar y cyfle, yn ei ohebiaeth, i bwysleisio bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn credu y dylai Llywodraeth y DU ailystyried y cynigion yn y Bil Cenedligrwydd a Ffiniau, sydd, yn ein barn ni, yn creu system ddwy haen rhwng ceiswyr lloches yn dibynnu ar sut y dônt i mewn i'r DU. Gwnaethom nodi'r pwynt hwnnw’n gwbl glir i Brif Weinidog y DU. Felly, mae'n rhaid inni gydnabod y pwynt y mae Alun Davies yn ei wneud heddiw. Ysgrifennydd Cartref yr wrthblaid yn y DU, mewn gwirionedd, a ddywedodd ddoe yn y ddadl y bydd y Bil Cenedligrwydd a Ffiniau yn ei gwneud yn drosedd, fel y dywedwch, i deuluoedd o Wcráin gyrraedd y DU heb y papurau cywir, gyda chosb o hyd at bedair blynedd o garchar, ar adeg pan fo pobl Prydain wedi nodi'n glir fod angen inni gynorthwyo ffoaduriaid o Wcráin. Mae hyn yn gywilyddus—dyna oedd ei geiriau. Ond yma yng Nghymru, fel cenedl noddfa, rydym yn dymuno rhoi croeso cyflym, diogel a chynnes i Wcreiniaid yng Nghymru. Credaf y bydd ein llwybr uwch-noddwr, yr ydym yn gweithio arno ochr yn ochr â’n swyddogion cyfatebol yn yr Alban, yn cael gwared ar dagfa allweddol yn system y DU. Mae hynny'n hollbwysig er mwyn sicrhau nad oes angen i'r rheini sy'n dod i Gymru wybod ymlaen llaw am aelwyd yng Nghymru a all eu noddi.

15:30
4. Datganiadau 90 eiliad
4. 90-second Statements

Yr eitem nesaf y prynhawn yma yw'r datganiadau 90 eiliad ac, yn gyntaf, Janet Finch-Saunders.

The next item this afternoon is the 90-second statements and, first of all, we have Janet Finch-Saunders.

Diolch. Llywydd and Members of the Senedd, during a visit to the Great Orme Bronze Age copper mines in Llandudno on Friday, I was absolutely amazed to learn how, 4,000 years ago, copper and copper axes made there were exported from Llandudno to places as far away as the Netherlands, Sweden and Poland. Uncovered in 1987, during a scheme to landscape an area of the Great Orme, the copper mines' discovery changed the way that we understand, in ancient Britain, a civilised and structured society 2,000 years before the Roman invasion existed. Our town's most famous headland provided almost 98 per cent of the metal in Britain and was home to the largest prehistoric copper mines in the world.

It's also worth noting that this mine had some of the harshest of conditions, with the belief that very small children would have to crawl through the very tunnels that I saw just to retrieve the malachite green copper. I hope that the Senedd will agree with me that it is incredible that metal from Aberconwy armed the armies of the ancients, and that the constituency, and therefore north Wales, had a key role in connecting people across our continent thousands of years ago. This incredible story really does highlight the unique history we have in Wales. The team at the Bronze Age mines should be extremely proud of the incredible contribution they have made to the story of Wales, Britain and Europe. And as Llandudno welcomes, on average, 10 million visitors every year, I hope each and every one of you will visit this constituency, where you can learn more about our fascinating history. Diolch.

Diolch. Lywydd ac Aelodau'r Senedd, yn ystod ymweliad â'r mwynfeydd copr o'r Oes Efydd ar Ben y Gogarth yn Llandudno ddydd Gwener, rhyfeddais wrth glywed sut y câi copr a bwyeill copr a wnaed yno 4,000 o flynyddoedd yn ôl eu hallforio o Landudno i leoedd mor bell i ffwrdd â'r Iseldiroedd, Sweden a Gwlad Pwyl. Daeth y mwynfeydd copr i olau dydd ym 1987 yn ystod cynllun i dirlunio rhan o Ben y Gogarth, a newidiodd y darganfyddiad ein dealltwriaeth o gymdeithas war a strwythuredig y Brydain fore 2,000 o flynyddoedd cyn y goresgyniad Rhufeinig. Roedd pentir enwog ein tref yn darparu bron i 98 y cant o'r metel ym Mhrydain ac yn gartref i'r mwynfeydd copr cynhanesyddol mwyaf yn y byd.

Mae'n werth nodi hefyd yr amodau enbyd iawn yn y gwaith mwyn, a'r gred yw bod rhaid i blant bach iawn gropian drwy'r union dwneli a welais i adfer y copr gwyrdd malaceit. Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Senedd yn cytuno â mi ei bod yn anhygoel fod metel o Aberconwy wedi arfogi byddinoedd pobl yr henfyd, a bod yr etholaeth, a gogledd Cymru yn sgil hynny, wedi chwarae rhan allweddol yn cysylltu pobl ar draws ein cyfandir filoedd o flynyddoedd yn ôl. Mae'r stori anhygoel hon yn dangos yr hanes unigryw sydd gennym yng Nghymru. Dylai'r tîm yn y mwynfeydd Oes Efydd fod yn hynod falch o'r cyfraniad anhygoel a wnaethant i stori Cymru, Prydain ac Ewrop. A chan fod Llandudno yn croesawu 10 miliwn o ymwelwyr bob blwyddyn ar gyfartaledd, rwy'n gobeithio y bydd pob un ohonoch chi'n ymweld â'r etholaeth hon, lle y gallwch ddysgu mwy am ein hanes diddorol. Diolch.

Today in the Senedd I wanted to highlight the fantastic work of a mental health support group called the Walking Men of Mid Wales, and the group does exactly what it says. And the group was set up by Andy Coppin and is run each week by a number of volunteers. And it was set up in a bid to support those who were struggling with anxiety or isolation, but also as a mechanism just to allow men to meet and talk with each other as well and become friends with each other. The group was set up as a result of, sadly, a number of men taking—younger men taking—their own lives across the area. The group meets on a fortnightly basis in Welshpool, in Newtown, and the walk routes are planned in advance, and men walk around together, chatting and talking and sharing their experiences of life and their own life experiences, as well, in order to support each other. I've been on the walks myself, and it's encouraging to see the walks growing in numbers week by week. So, I'd like to thank Andy for setting up the group and for his commitment and dedication and his passion, but also I'd like to encourage others to get involved in setting up an initiative in their area as well. It's such a simple initiative but a great initiative, just facilitating men gathering together and walking and talking and sharing life experiences with each other.

Heddiw yn y Senedd roeddwn am dynnu sylw at waith gwych grŵp cymorth iechyd meddwl o'r enw Walking Men of Mid Wales, ac mae'r grŵp yn gwneud yn union yr hyn y mae'n ei ddweud. Sefydlwyd y grŵp gan Andy Coppin ac mae'n cael ei gynnal bob wythnos gan nifer o wirfoddolwyr. Ac fe'i sefydlwyd mewn ymgais i gefnogi'r rhai a oedd yn cael trafferth gyda gorbryder neu unigedd, ond hefyd fel ffordd o ganiatáu i ddynion gyfarfod a siarad â'i gilydd a dod yn ffrindiau. Sefydlwyd y grŵp o ganlyniad i'r ffaith drist fod nifer o ddynion—dynion iau—wedi cyflawni hunanladdiad ar draws yr ardal. Mae'r grŵp yn cyfarfod bob pythefnos yn y Trallwng, yn y Drenewydd, gyda llwybrau cerdded a gynlluniwyd ymlaen llaw, ac mae dynion yn cerdded o gwmpas gyda'i gilydd, yn sgwrsio ac yn siarad ac yn rhannu eu profiadau o fywyd a'u profiadau bywyd eu hunain hefyd, er mwyn cefnogi ei gilydd. Rwyf wedi bod ar y teithiau cerdded fy hun, ac mae'n galonogol gweld nifer y dynion sy'n mynd ar y teithiau cerdded yn cynyddu o wythnos i wythnos. Felly, hoffwn ddiolch i Andy am sefydlu'r grŵp ac am ei ymrwymiad a'i ymroddiad a'i angerdd, ond hoffwn annog eraill hefyd i gymryd rhan a sefydlu menter yn eu hardal hwythau. Mae'n fenter mor syml ond yn un wych, i'w gwneud hi'n haws i ddynion ymgynnull gyda'i gilydd a cherdded a siarad a rhannu profiadau bywyd gyda'i gilydd.

Daeth Joyce Watson i’r Gadair.

Joyce Watson took the Chair.

5. Dadl Aelodau o dan Reol Sefydlog 11.21(iv): Adeiladau Crefyddol
5. Member Debate under Standing Order 11.21(iv): Religious buildings

Right. We'll move on now to the Member debate under Standing Order 11.21, on religious buildings, and I call on Mike Hedges.

Iawn. Symudwn ymlaen yn awr at ddadl Aelodau o dan Reol Sefydlog 11.21, ar adeiladau crefyddol, a galwaf ar Mike Hedges.

Cynnig NDM7953 Mike Hedges, Darren Millar, Jane Dodds, Rhys ab Owen

Cefnogwyd gan Alun Davies, Russell George, Sam Rowlands

Cynnig bod y Senedd:

1. Yn nodi bod adeiladau crefyddol, gan gynnwys eglwysi a chapeli, yn parhau i gael eu cau ledled Cymru.

2. Yn galw ar Lywodraeth Cymru i weithio gyda'r gwahanol enwadau yng Nghymru i drafod dyfodol yr adeiladau hyn.

Motion NDM7953 Mike Hedges, Darren Millar, Jane Dodds, Rhys ab Owen

Supported by Alun Davies, Russell George, Sam Rowlands

To propose that the Senedd:

1. Notes the continuing closure of religious buildings, including churches and chapels, throughout Wales.

2. Calls upon the Welsh Government to work with the different denominations in Wales to discuss the future of these buildings.

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Thank you, acting Presiding Officer. I would like to thank my co-sponsors and those who supported the motion for this debate. Jane Dodds will be responding to the debate.

This debate is not about religion, it's about our built heritage. It's about the importance of church and chapel buildings in our community. Members cannot have failed to notice the continuing closure of religious buildings, including churches and chapels, in their own constituencies. In recent decades, we have seen a gradual and continual decline in what can be referred to as the two great traditions of the nineteenth and early twentieth-century Welsh society: that being the tradition of attending the local chapel and the local public house.

Wales is often considered the land of castles, but we have substantially more chapels, churches and other religious buildings across Wales than we have castles. We have some great church buildings and chapels, such as St David's cathedral and Tabernacle chapel in Morriston, which has been described as the cathedral of nonconformity, as well as many others of historical significance and architectural merit. Wales’s ecclesiastical history and heritage is an incredibly significant part of our built and cultural heritage. Many who do not attend the chapels or churches of Wales attach a huge significance to their architectural merit and the status they carry within their communities. Ask someone about St David's, and they will mention the cathedral. Ask people about Morriston, and the most likely response will be Tabernacle chapel.

Diolch yn fawr, Lywydd dros dro. Hoffwn ddiolch i fy nghyd-gyflwynwyr a'r rhai a gefnogodd y cynnig ar gyfer y ddadl hon. Bydd Jane Dodds yn ymateb i'r ddadl.

Nid yw'r ddadl hon yn ymwneud â chrefydd, mae'n ymwneud â'n treftadaeth adeiledig. Mae'n ymwneud â phwysigrwydd adeiladau eglwysi a chapeli yn ein cymuned. Ni all yr Aelodau fod wedi methu sylwi ar nifer yr adeiladau crefyddol sy'n parhau i gau, gan gynnwys eglwysi a chapeli, yn eu hetholaethau eu hunain. Dros y degawdau diwethaf, gwelsom ddirywiad graddol a pharhaus yn yr hyn y gellir cyfeirio ato fel dau draddodiad mawr y gymdeithas Gymreig yn y bedwaredd ganrif ar bymtheg a dechrau'r ugeinfed ganrif, sef y traddodiad o fynychu'r capel lleol a'r tafarndy lleol.

Yn aml, ystyrir mai gwlad y cestyll yw Cymru, ond mae gennym lawer mwy o gapeli, eglwysi ac adeiladau crefyddol eraill ledled Cymru nag sydd gennym o gestyll. Mae gennym eglwysi a chapeli gwych, megis eglwys gadeiriol Tyddewi a chapel y Tabernacl yn Nhreforys, a ddisgrifiwyd fel eglwys gadeiriol anghydffurfiaeth, yn ogystal â llawer o adeiladau eraill o arwyddocâd hanesyddol a gwerth pensaernïol. Mae hanes a threftadaeth eglwysig Cymru yn rhan hynod bwysig o'n treftadaeth adeiledig a diwylliannol. Mae llawer o bobl nad ydynt yn mynychu capeli neu eglwysi Cymru yn gweld arwyddocâd enfawr i'w gwerth pensaernïol a'r statws sydd iddynt yn eu cymunedau. Gofynnwch i rywun am Dewi Sant, a byddant yn sôn am yr eglwys gadeiriol. Gofynnwch i bobl am Dreforys, a'r ymateb mwyaf tebygol fydd capel y Tabernacl.

As you look around Wales, it is obvious that, in this day and age, Wales now has a huge excess of chapels and churches for its current religious needs. What we have seen in response to this overprovision is the closure of many, in an attempt to not only save money, but also to save some of the really magnificent buildings of the same denomination.

The upkeep of these remarkable buildings has fallen on the shoulders of the remaining members of the congregation, most of whom vary from the elderly to the very elderly. As one deacon said to me, 'We inherited this chapel from our parents, but our children do not want to inherit it from us.' The same deacon said, 'What I like most about going to chapel is that it's the only place where I, as someone over 60, am considered one of the young members.' The congregations are declining, and you have got to remember how many chapels there still are. According to Blwyddiadur Undeb yr Annibynwyr, there are over 600 independent chapels in Wales and four independent Welsh chapels in England, but that number will almost certainly continue to decline.

We have witnessed former chapels being sympathetically adapted or converted for a number of different uses, ranging from flats, which are the most common, to houses, businesses, restaurants, offices, community centres, and, in some cases, converted to places of worship for other religions. Unfortunately, others have become derelict, burned down, or have fallen down. One notable example of a former Swansea chapel that has been sympathetically adapted is the chapel of Christmas Evans, which now hosts the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children Swansea offices, but they allow people to visit and see its plaque commemorating Christmas Evans. It is amazing how many people visit, despite the fact it is not advertised, you have to engage in substantial research to find out where it is, and, after having done that, you have to arrange with the NSPCC to visit.

There are people, such as Daniel James—better known as Gwyrosydd—the composer of 'Calon Lân', buried at Mynyddbach chapel, and Evan Roberts, the preacher who led the great revival from Moriah chapel in Loughor. These were just two of the great preachers and hymn writers from Wales. I could fill the whole speech going through famous Welsh hymn writers and—[Interruption.] More worryingly, I might start mentioning relatives of other Members in here. [Laughter.]

But, as I say, most of the smaller chapels and churches have been sympathetically changed into housing or offices. Within Swansea East, concentrating on Morriston, where I live, and Plasmarl, where I was born, I will take you through the position of the chapels and churches. Philadelphia chapel in Morriston, a former Methodist chapel, has been converted into offices and flats. Calfaria chapel, Soar chapel and Seion merged to form Seion Newydd, which I attend. Calfaria chapel has fallen down. All you can actually see where Calfaria chapel was is stones on the ground, and that was a chapel in use up until 50 years ago. And now all you've got is stones on the ground, at the top of Banwell Street in Morriston.

Soar has become a part of the Catholic Church, and is used as a centre for small concerts and events. St John's church, known locally as the church in the middle of the road—it's the only building on the roundabout—is undergoing renovation to become a cafe, gallery and commercial unit on the ground floor and mezzanine floor, with three loft-style flats above it. I used to describe it as the only Welsh-speaking Church in Wales church, but I've apparently been told there are others. But it's one of the very few Welsh-speaking Church in Wales churches in Wales. It's a phenomenal building, but it's been left for 10, 15 years; it's now coming back into use. Grove mission has been turned into flats.

Most of the other chapels have been sympathetically turned into flats or houses, or, in the case of one, turned into a care home for people with learning difficulties. Some of these renovations, such as Grove mission, have been excellent, leaving the outer facade and sympathetically remodelling inside. Mynyddbach chapel has been restored after several years of being empty, and is now the Daniel James Gwyrosydd centre. Both the church in Bonymaen and the church in Portmead have been turned into Faith in Families centres, and are doing an excellent job working with parents and children. And can I just say what a good job Faith in Families do in my constituency?

This is where the good news ends. Horeb chapel in Morriston was demolished, and a housing association built flats on the site. St Paul’s church in Landore has been empty for several years. It is a large church, and whilst there have been several suggestions of use, nothing has happened. Libanus chapel in Cwmbwrla, after being empty for several years, burned down, and was partially demolished on the grounds of safety. It has two walls currently left standing, which of course Cadw still list. Cwm chapel, which was also the scene of a fire, has been demolished, despite being listed by Cadw. Aenon in Heol Las has closed, with no imminent plans for it coming back into an alternative use. The same is true of Bethania in Morriston town centre. Moriah chapel, where my father-in-law was the only remaining deacon, closed, has been sold several times and has planning permission for conversion into flats, but no development has taken place.

There are far more chapels and church buildings than there are people wanting to use them for worship. It takes us to what happens next. Now it is mainly the larger churches and chapels that remain. They cannot easily be converted into flats or offices as the smaller ones were. Most are listed, including Tabernacle in Morriston, which is a grade I listed building. The smaller churches and chapels, they've closed. There's no problem. The easy low-lying fruit, the easy changes, that's actually happened. And can I just I say, there's generally been a good job done? Not everywhere, but, in general, a good job done. 

The action I am asking that the Welsh Government works on with the different denominations in Wales is to discuss the future of these buildings. Cadw listing buildings is not the answer, and sometimes it's part of the problem, in that you cannot make changes to the building, it will sit there until it falls down or is burned down, and far too many buildings end up being burned down when they're left empty for long periods of time. 

Wales has a huge reputation for its preachers, church and chapel buildings, which is something we need to build on. I think we need to look at the American tourism market; we need to produce denominational tours in Wales. It's not just America, but countries in east Asia, such as Singapore. We have got the situation where New Siloh in Landore, one of the largest nineteenth century chapels, used to sit over 1,000 people, but they were a lot thinner in those days—[Laughter.]—so now it only sits about 600. But it has been taken over by a church in Singapore. Prior to being taken over, it had a congregation of seven, but it only had that large congregation because two chapels had merged into it to give it five and two to give it seven.

So, the question is: should we in Wales be aiming at the American tourist market? Should we be aiming some of our tourism advertising to promote our great religious history, its people and its buildings? I think there is a huge opportunity to promote tourism relating to our chapels, churches and the great preachers and hymn writers. This is an opportunity that we in Wales need to take before it is too late. We can save some. It is not possible to save them all. I urge the Welsh Government to talk to the different denominations and produce a strategy for the churches and chapels of Wales.

Firstly, we need a priority list. Secondly, we need a plan of how buildings can be used in the future—offices, flats and houses are all possible. This will work, as I have illustrated earlier. Turning them into community buildings must be an option. This will need financial support and community buy-in. What we cannot do is leave a large number of elderly people as the sole guardians of our heritage. We protect the castles of our Norman conquerors; we should do the same for the major chapels of what was for many of us our grandparents and great grandparents a place of worship and a major community centre. If this motion is passed and the Government does nothing, or it fails to pass, what will happen is that more and more of these buildings will close. More will become derelict, and a large part of our history will be lost. Now is the time for action. In 10 years’ time it will be too late for many of these buildings.

Can I also ask for a national museum for our religious history? We've got a wool museum, an industrial and maritime museum, we've got a slate museum. I just think that we ought to be having a museum to carry on and show our religious history, because, although it's been a living history for many of us, in 50 years' time, it won't be the living history for the people then. So, please can I urge the Government to think of that? And if they're looking for a site, can I throw in Tabernacle?

Wrth ichi edrych o gwmpas Cymru, mae'n amlwg yn yr oes sydd ohoni fod gan Gymru bellach ormodedd enfawr o gapeli ac eglwysi ar gyfer ei hanghenion crefyddol presennol. Mewn ymateb i'r orddarpariaeth hon, gwelsom gau nifer ohonynt mewn ymgais nid yn unig i arbed arian, ond hefyd i achub rhai o'r adeiladau gwirioneddol wych o'r un enwad.

Mae'r gwaith o gynnal a chadw'r adeiladau hynod hyn wedi disgyn ar ysgwyddau yr aelodau sy'n weddill, gyda'r rhan fwyaf ohonynt yn amrywio o fod yn oedrannus i fod yn oedrannus iawn. Fel y dywedodd un diacon wrthyf, 'Fe etifeddom ni'r capel hwn gan ein rhieni, ond nid yw ein plant am ei etifeddu gennym ni.' Dywedodd yr un diacon, 'Yr hyn rwy'n ei hoffi fwyaf am fynd i'r capel yw mai dyma'r unig le rwyf fi, fel rhywun dros 60 oed, yn cael fy ystyried yn un o'r aelodau ifanc.' Mae'r cynulleidfaoedd yn teneuo, a rhaid ichi gofio faint o gapeli sydd i'w cael o hyd. Yn ôl Blwyddiadur Undeb yr Annibynwyr, ceir dros 600 o gapeli annibynwyr yng Nghymru a phedwar capel annibynwyr Cymraeg yn Lloegr, ond bydd y nifer bron yn sicr yn parhau i ostwng.

Rydym wedi gweld hen gapeli'n cael eu haddasu neu eu newid mewn modd addas at nifer o wahanol ddibenion, yn amrywio o fflatiau, sef y defnydd mwyaf cyffredin, i dai, busnesau, bwytai, swyddfeydd, canolfannau cymunedol, ac mewn rhai achosion, eu troi'n addoldai ar gyfer crefyddau eraill. Yn anffodus, mae eraill wedi mynd yn adfeilion, wedi'u llosgi i lawr, neu wedi cwympo. Un enghraifft nodedig o hen gapel yn Abertawe sydd wedi'i addasu mewn modd sensitif yw capel Christmas Evans, sydd bellach yn gartref i swyddfeydd y Gymdeithas Genedlaethol er Atal Creulondeb i Blant yn Abertawe, ond maent yn caniatáu i bobl ymweld a gweld ei blac sy'n coffáu Christmas Evans. Mae'n rhyfeddol faint o bobl sy'n ymweld, er nad yw'n cael ei hysbysebu, ac mae'n rhaid ichi wneud cryn dipyn o ymchwil i ganfod y lle, ac ar ôl gwneud hynny, rhaid ichi drefnu gyda'r NSPCC i ymweld.

Mae pobl, megis Daniel James—a adwaenir yn well fel Gwyrosydd—cyfansoddwr 'Calon Lân', wedi'i gladdu yng nghapel Mynyddbach, ac Evan Roberts, y pregethwr a arweiniodd yr adfywiad mawr o gapel Moriah yng Nghasllwchwr. Dau yn unig o'r pregethwyr mawr a'r cyfansoddwyr emynau o Gymru oedd y rhain. Gallwn lenwi'r araith gyfan yn mynd drwy gyfansoddwyr emynau enwog o Gymru ac—[Torri ar draws.] Yn fwy pryderus, efallai y dechreuaf sôn am berthnasau Aelodau eraill yma. [Chwerthin.]

Ond fel y dywedais, mae'r rhan fwyaf o'r capeli a'r eglwysi llai wedi cael eu troi mewn modd addas yn dai neu'n swyddfeydd. Yn Nwyrain Abertawe, gan ganolbwyntio ar Dreforys lle rwy'n byw, a Phlas-marl lle y cefais fy ngeni, af â chi drwy sefyllfa'r capeli a'r eglwysi. Mae capel Philadelphia yn Nhreforys, hen gapel Methodistaidd, wedi'i droi'n swyddfeydd a fflatiau. Unodd capel Calfaria, capel Soar a Seion i ffurfio Seion Newydd, y capel rwy'n ei fynychu. Mae capel Calfaria wedi cwympo. Y cyfan y gallwch ei weld mewn gwirionedd lle'r oedd capel Calfaria yw cerrig ar y ddaear, ac roedd hwnnw'n gapel a gâi ei ddefnyddio hyd at 50 mlynedd yn ôl. A bellach, y cyfan sydd gennych yw cerrig ar y ddaear, ar ben uchaf Stryd Banwell yn Nhreforys.

Mae Soar wedi dod yn rhan o'r Eglwys Gatholig, a chaiff ei ddefnyddio fel canolfan ar gyfer cyngherddau a digwyddiadau bach. Mae eglwys Sant Ioan, a adwaenir yn lleol fel yr eglwys yng nghanol y ffordd—dyma'r unig adeilad ar y gylchfan—yn cael ei adnewyddu i fod yn gaffi, oriel ac uned fasnachol ar y llawr gwaelod a'r llawr mesanîn, gyda thri fflat llofft uwch ei ben. Roeddwn i'n arfer ei disgrifio fel yr unig eglwys Gymraeg ei hiaith yn yr Eglwys yng Nghymru, ond cefais wybod bod yna rai eraill. Ond mae'n un o ychydig iawn o eglwysi Cymraeg eu hiaith yr Eglwys yng Nghymru. Mae'n adeilad rhyfeddol, ond bu'n segur ers 10, 15 mlynedd; mae bellach yn cael ei ailddefnyddio. Mae addoldy Grove wedi'i droi'n fflatiau.

Mae'r rhan fwyaf o'r capeli eraill wedi cael eu troi mewn modd addas yn fflatiau neu'n dai, neu, yn achos un, yn gartref gofal i bobl ag anawsterau dysgu. Mae peth o'r gwaith adnewyddu, megis addoldy Grove, wedi bod yn rhagorol, gan gadw'r ffasâd allanol ac ailfodelu mewn modd sensitif ar y tu mewn. Mae capel Mynyddbach wedi'i adfer ar ôl sawl blwyddyn o fod yn wag, ac mae bellach yn ganolfan Daniel James Gwyrosydd. Mae'r eglwys ym Môn-y-maen a'r eglwys yn Portmead wedi'u troi'n ganolfannau Ffydd mewn Teuluoedd, ac maent yn gwneud gwaith rhagorol gyda rhieni a phlant. Ac a gaf fi ddweud cystal gwaith y mae Ffydd mewn Teuluoedd yn ei wneud yn fy etholaeth?

Dyma lle y daw'r newyddion da i ben. Dymchwelwyd capel Horeb yn Nhreforys, ac adeiladwyd fflatiau ar y safle gan gymdeithas dai. Mae eglwys Sant Paul yng Nglandŵr wedi bod yn wag ers sawl blwyddyn. Mae'n eglwys fawr, ac er y cafwyd sawl awgrym ynglŷn â sut y dylid ei defnyddio, nid oes unrhyw beth wedi digwydd. Cafwyd tân yng nghapel Libanus yng Nghwmbwrla ar ôl iddo fod yn wag am nifer o flynyddoedd, ac fe'i dymchwelwyd yn rhannol ar sail diogelwch. Mae dwy wal yn dal i sefyll ar hyn o bryd, ac wrth gwrs mae Cadw yn dal i'w rhestru. Mae capel Cwm, lleoliad arall lle bu tân, wedi cael ei ddymchwel, er ei fod yn dal wedi'i restru gan Cadw. Mae Aenon yn Heol Las wedi cau, heb unrhyw gynlluniau ar y gorwel i'w ddefnyddio eto at ddibenion gwahanol. Mae'r un peth yn wir am Bethania yng nghanol tref Treforys. Mae capel Moriah, lle roedd fy nhad-yng-nghyfraith yn unig ddiacon ar ôl, bellach wedi cau, mae wedi'i werthu sawl gwaith a cheir caniatâd cynllunio ar gyfer ei droi'n fflatiau, ond nid oes unrhyw ddatblygiad wedi digwydd.

Ceir llawer mwy o adeiladau eglwysi a chapeli nag a geir o bobl sydd eisiau eu defnyddio ar gyfer addoli. Mae'n mynd â ni at beth sy'n digwydd nesaf. Erbyn hyn, yr eglwysi a'r capeli mwy o faint yn bennaf sydd ar ôl. Ni ellir troi'r rheini'n fflatiau neu'n swyddfeydd yn hawdd fel y gwnaed i'r rhai llai o faint. Mae'r rhan fwyaf wedi'u rhestru, gan gynnwys y Tabernacl yn Nhreforys, sy'n adeilad rhestredig gradd I. Mae'r eglwysi a'r capeli llai wedi cau. Nid oes problem. Mae'r newidiadau hawdd eisoes wedi digwydd mewn gwirionedd. Ac os caf fi ddweud, yn gyffredinol, mae'r gwaith a wnaed yn dda? Nid ym mhobman, ond yn gyffredinol, fe wnaed gwaith da. 

Rwy'n gofyn i Lywodraeth Cymru drafod dyfodol yr adeiladau hyn gyda'r gwahanol enwadau yng Nghymru. Nid rhestru adeiladau gan Cadw yw'r ateb, ac weithiau mae'n rhan o'r broblem, gan na allwch wneud newidiadau i'r adeilad; bydd yn eistedd yno hyd nes y bydd yn dymchwel ohono'i hun neu'n cael ei losgi, ac mae llawer gormod o adeiladau'n cael eu llosgi pan gânt eu gadael yn wag am gyfnodau hir. 

Mae gan Gymru enw da iawn am ei phregethwyr, ei hadeiladau eglwysig a'i chapeli, sy'n rhywbeth y mae angen inni ei ddatblygu. Credaf fod angen inni edrych ar farchnad dwristiaeth America; mae angen inni gynhyrchu teithiau enwadol yng Nghymru. Nid America yn unig, ond gwledydd yn nwyrain Asia, fel Singapore. Mae gennym sefyllfa lle'r arferai Seilo Newydd yng Nglandŵr, un o gapeli mwyaf y bedwaredd ganrif ar bymtheg, fod â lle i dros 1,000 o bobl, ond roeddent yn llawer teneuach yn y dyddiau hynny—[Chwerthin.]—felly dim ond lle i tua 600 o bobl sydd yno erbyn hyn. Ond aeth i ddwylo eglwys yn Singapore. Cyn hynny, roedd ganddo saith o aelodau, a hynny ond am fod dau gapel wedi uno i roi pump o un a dau o'r llall i wneud saith.

Felly, y cwestiwn yw: a ddylem ni yng Nghymru dargedu marchnad dwristiaeth America? A ddylem dargedu rhai o'n hysbysebion twristiaeth i hyrwyddo ein hanes crefyddol gwych, ei bobl a'i adeiladau? Credaf fod cyfle enfawr i hyrwyddo twristiaeth sy'n gysylltiedig â'n capeli, ein heglwysi a'r pregethwyr mawr a'r cyfansoddwyr emynau. Dyma gyfle y mae angen i ni yng Nghymru fanteisio arno cyn ei bod yn rhy hwyr. Gallwn achub rhai. Nid yw'n bosibl eu hachub i gyd. Rwy'n annog Llywodraeth Cymru i siarad â'r gwahanol enwadau a llunio strategaeth ar gyfer eglwysi a chapeli Cymru.

Yn gyntaf, mae angen rhestr o flaenoriaethau. Yn ail, mae angen cynllunio'r modd y gellid defnyddio adeiladau yn y dyfodol—mae swyddfeydd, fflatiau a thai i gyd yn bosibl. Bydd hyn yn gweithio, fel y dangosais yn gynharach. Rhaid cael opsiwn i'w troi'n adeiladau cymunedol. Bydd angen cymorth ariannol a chefnogaeth gymunedol i wneud hyn. Ni allwn adael i nifer fawr o bobl oedrannus fod yn unig warcheidwaid ein treftadaeth. Rydym yn gwarchod cestyll ein goresgynwyr Normanaidd; dylem wneud yr un peth i'r prif gapeli a oedd, i neiniau a theidiau a hen neiniau a hen deidiau llawer ohonom, yn fannau addoli a chanolfannau cymunedol pwysig. Os caiff y cynnig hwn ei basio ac os na wnaiff y Llywodraeth weithredu, neu os na fydd yn pasio, bydd mwy a mwy o'r adeiladau hyn yn cau. Bydd mwy a mwy'n mynd yn adfail, a bydd rhan fawr o'n hanes yn cael ei cholli. Dyma'r amser i weithredu. Ymhen 10 mlynedd fe fydd yn rhy hwyr i lawer o'r adeiladau hyn.

A gaf fi ofyn hefyd am amgueddfa genedlaethol ar gyfer ein hanes crefyddol? Mae gennym amgueddfa wlân, amgueddfa ddiwydiannol a morol, mae gennym amgueddfa lechi. Credaf y dylem gael amgueddfa i barhau a dangos ein hanes crefyddol, oherwydd, er ei fod wedi bod yn hanes byw i lawer ohonom, ymhen 50 mlynedd, ni fydd yn hanes byw i'r bobl yr adeg honno. Felly, a gaf fi annog y Llywodraeth i feddwl am hynny? Ac os ydynt yn edrych am safle, a gaf fi awgrymu'r Tabernacl?

15:40

Thank you, and first I'd like to put on record my thanks to Mike Hedges for submitting this extremely important Member's debate on religious buildings, and also my thanks to Darren Millar, Jane Dodds and Rhys ab Owen for co-submitting. I'd also like to highlight my register of interests—I'm a trustee of a church as well. 

It's a pleasure, of course, to be called as a supporter to this motion and to speak here today. As the motion states, it's extremely concerning that we continue to see the closure of religious buildings up and down Wales, and I'm sure all Members here today will agree that faith is an important aspect of Welsh life. Religious buildings are often the heart of communities, and, at times, bring all parts of our community together. Even for non-believers, faith is what many people reach out to in times of need, and it's often these buildings that symbolise the importance of this faith and the support that faith has to offer. 

As someone who has been brought up through church, as the son of a church minister, I know that, whilst these buildings are merely structures to hold the church, the significance is beyond bricks and mortar—it's what they represent. It's these buildings that so often hold important family and community memories of celebration, memories of grief, and every emotion in between. It's these buildings that so often have been the gathering place through generations, the support in dark times and good times, and I argue they'll need to be in place for future generations too.

But, sadly, as we know, and mentioned by Mike Hedges already, the future of many buildings of religion and of faith across Wales is not secure. And it's also sadly the case in my own region of North Wales, with many important buildings having an uncertain future. For example, St Mary's cathedral in Wrexham, a grade ll listed building, is currently facing a worrying time with the cathedral hall needing a full refurbishment and the heating system needing to be replaced. Also coming to mind is Llanrhychwyn church in the beautiful Conwy valley, which many people claim is the oldest church in Wales, although I'm sure Mike Hedges may argue with that for a place somewhere in his patch, but that dates back to the sixth century originally. 

I mention this because these buildings aren't just important for our faith here and now, they're important to highlight our history and they are our nation's landmarks as well. The amount of history in these places is spectacular, telling the story of a significant part of our lives and culture here in Wales. It's important that people can continue to use these buildings and understand our culture and history in the future as well. 

So, as point 2 of today's motion states, now is the time for Welsh Government to work with all denominations in Wales to discuss the future of religious buildings, and most importantly ensure they're here to stay for our future generations. I want to thank all Members for submitting this really important debate and I call on the Welsh Government and Members across the political spectrum today to support today's motion. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Diolch, ac yn gyntaf hoffwn gofnodi fy niolch i Mike Hedges am gyflwyno'r ddadl Aelodau hynod bwysig hon ar adeiladau crefyddol, a diolch hefyd i Darren Millar, Jane Dodds a Rhys ab Owen am gyd-gyflwyno. Hoffwn dynnu sylw hefyd at fy nghofrestr buddiannau—rwy'n ymddiriedolwr eglwys hefyd. 

Mae'n bleser, wrth gwrs, cael fy ngalw'n gefnogwr i'r cynnig hwn a siarad yma heddiw. Fel y dywed y cynnig, mae'n destun pryder mawr ein bod yn parhau i weld cau adeiladau crefyddol ar hyd a lled Cymru, ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd pob Aelod yma heddiw yn cytuno bod ffydd yn agwedd bwysig ar fywyd Cymru. Mae adeiladau crefyddol yn aml yn galon cymunedau, ac ar adegau, yn dod â phob rhan o'n cymuned at ei gilydd. Hyd yn oed i bobl nad ydynt yn credu, ffydd yw'r hyn y mae llawer o bobl yn chwilio amdano ar adegau o angen, ac yn aml, mae'r adeiladau hyn yn symbol o bwysigrwydd y ffydd hon a'r gefnogaeth sydd gan ffydd i'w chynnig. 

Fel rhywun a fagwyd yn yr eglwys, fel mab i weinidog eglwys, er mai strwythurau i ddal yr eglwys yn unig yw'r adeiladau hyn, a gwn mai y tu hwnt i'r brics a'r morter y mae eu harwyddocâd—yr hyn y maent yn ei gynrychioli sy'n bwysig. Yr adeiladau hyn sydd mor aml yn dal atgofion teuluol a chymunedol pwysig o ddathlu, o alaru, a phob emosiwn yn y canol rhyngddynt. Yr adeiladau hyn sydd mor aml wedi bod yn fannau ymgynnull dros genedlaethau, yn gefnogaeth ar adegau tywyll ac ar adegau da, ac rwy'n dadlau y bydd angen iddynt fod yno ar gyfer cenedlaethau'r dyfodol hefyd.

Ond yn anffodus, fel y gwyddom, ac fel y crybwyllodd Mike Hedges eisoes, nid yw dyfodol llawer o adeiladau crefydd a ffydd ledled Cymru yn ddiogel. Ac mae hefyd yn anffodus iawn yn fy rhanbarth i yng Ngogledd Cymru, gyda'r dyfodol yn ansicr i lawer o adeiladau pwysig. Er enghraifft, mae eglwys gadeiriol y Santes Fair yn Wrecsam, adeilad rhestredig gradd ll, yn wynebu cyfnod pryderus ar hyn o bryd gyda'r angen i adnewyddu neuadd yr eglwys gadeiriol yn llwyr ac mae angen system wresogi newydd. Hefyd, daw eglwys Llanrhychwyn yn nyffryn Conwy i'r meddwl, ac mae llawer o bobl yn honni mai honno yw'r eglwys hynaf yng Nghymru, er fy mod yn siŵr y gall Mike Hedges ddadlau dros hynny yn ei ardal ef, ond mae honno'n dyddio'n ôl i'r chweched ganrif yn wreiddiol. 

Rwy'n sôn am hyn oherwydd mae'r adeiladau hyn yn bwysig, nid yn unig i'n ffydd yma yn awr, maent yn bwysig er mwyn tynnu sylw at ein hanes a hwy yw tirnodau ein gwlad hefyd. Mae maint yr hanes yn y lleoedd hyn yn anhygoel, gan adrodd stori rhan sylweddol o'n bywyd a'n diwylliant yma yng Nghymru. Mae'n bwysig i bobl allu parhau i ddefnyddio'r adeiladau hyn a deall ein diwylliant a'n hanes yn y dyfodol hefyd. 

Felly, fel y dywed pwynt 2 o'r cynnig heddiw, dyma'r adeg i Lywodraeth Cymru weithio gyda phob enwad yng Nghymru i drafod dyfodol adeiladau crefyddol, ac yn bwysicaf oll, i sicrhau eu bod yma i aros ar gyfer cenedlaethau'r dyfodol. Hoffwn ddiolch i'r holl Aelodau am gyflwyno'r ddadl wirioneddol bwysig hon a galwaf ar Lywodraeth Cymru a'r Aelodau ar draws y sbectrwm gwleidyddol heddiw i gefnogi'r cynnig heddiw. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

15:45

Diolch yn fawr i fy nghyfaill Mike Hedges am ddod â'r ddadl yma. Ble arall yn y byd fyddem ni'n cael dadl fel hon? Wel, efallai yng nghynulliad talaith Chubut, o bosib. Mae'n hyfryd, onid yw e? Mae'n quintessentially Welsh i gael dadl fel hyn ar gapeli Cymru. Efallai bod Mike Hedges a fi yn Aelodau o bleidiau gwleidyddol gwahanol, ond mae llawer gyda ni'n gyffredin, ac un o'r pethau hyn yw bod y ddau ohonom ni'n gyd-aelodau o Undeb Bedyddwyr Cymru. Croeso i chi 'cheer-io' ar y pwynt yna.

Un hen enw ar gapeli oedd 'tŷ cwrdd', yn llythrennol yn golygu dyna lle roedd y gymuned yn dod at ei gilydd. Heb or-sentimentaleiddio, yn aml iawn, ceiniogau prin y werin adeiladodd ein capeli ni, o Salem Rhydcymerau yn etholaeth fy nghyfaill Mabon ap Gwynfor, a gafodd ei anfarwoli gan Curnow Vosper ac Endaf Emlyn, i Dabernacl Treforys, eglwys gadeiriol anghydffurfiaeth Gymraeg, fel mae Mike Hedges yn ein hatgoffa ni yn gyson.

Gwir am gapeli Cymru yw geiriau englyn hyfryd Williams Parry am y neuadd ym Mynytho:

'Adeiladwyd gan dlodi;—nid cerrig / ond cariad yw'r meini; / cyd-ernes yw'r coed arni; / cyd-ddyheu a'i cododd hi.'

Fel saer coed yn y Rhondda—Buffy Williams—yn negawdau olaf y bedwaredd ganrif ar bymtheg, fe wnaeth fy hen dad-cu weithio ar nifer o gapeli, gan gynnwys ei gapel ef ei hun, sef capel Noddfa Treorci. Roedd y capel yn dal dros 1,500 o bobl—mwy hyd yn oed na Thabernacl Treforys, Mike—ac wrth ymweld â’r lle ar ddiwedd y 1970au fe wnaeth Penri Jones, awdur Jabas a golygydd Lol, ddweud hyn am Noddfa Treorci: 'Mae'r capel fel arena maes chwaraeon a'r pulpud fel llwyfan mawr.' Ac wrth ymweld â’r festri, dywedodd fod gwell cyfleusterau yno nag mewn nifer o ysgolion cyfoes. Yno roedd y cyfansoddwr John Hughes yn organydd. Yno roedd man cyfarfod cyntaf y byd-enwog côr meibion Treorci.

Ond, am amryw o resymau—yn gymdeithasol, yn economaidd, yn wleidyddol—ciliodd y tyrfaoedd o Noddfa, fel sawl Noddfa, Tabernacl a Salem arall. Mae Penri Jones yn terfynu ei ymweliad trwy ddweud hyn: 'Bu yma unwaith lawenydd, ond rhaid bod rhyw ddiofalwch trychinebus i beri bod y cyfan yn diflannu mewn modd mor derfynol.' Gwir oedd geiriau y proffwyd ffraeth, oherwydd o fewn ychydig flynyddoedd, o fewn pum mlynedd, llosgwyd Noddfa i lawr. Fe ddiflannodd y cyfan yn y modd mor derfynol roedd Penri Jones wedi rhagweld, yr holl adnoddau cymunedol a cherddorol wedi mynd yn llwyr.

Dywedodd Huw T. Edwards, yr undebwr Llafur a gafodd ei ddisgrifio yn Brif Weinidog answyddogol Cymru,

And thank you very much to my friend and colleague Mike Hedges for tabling this debate. Where else in the world would we have a debate like this? Well, perhaps in Chubut state assembly. It's lovely, isn't it? It's quintessentially Welsh to have this kind of debate on the chapels of Wales. Mike Hedges and myself might be Members of different political parties, but we have a great deal in common, and one of those things is that we're both members of the Baptist Union of Wales. I welcome you to cheer that point.

One name given to chapels in the past was 'tŷ cwrdd', which literally means meeting house—that's where the community came together. And without being too sentimental about it, very often, it was the few pennies saved by the people that built our chapels, from Salem Rhydcymerau in the constituency of my friend Mabon ap Gwynfor, which was immortalised by Curnow Vosper and Endaf Emlyn, to Morriston's Tabernacle, the cathedral of Welsh non-conformity, as Mike Hedges often reminds us.

The truth about our nation’s chapels is the wonderful poem by Williams Parry about the hall in Mynytho:

'It is built of poverty;—not stones / but love is its masonry; / shared aspirations are its timber; and shared commitment is what raised it up.'

As a carpenter in the Rhondda—Buffy Williams—in the final decades of the nineteenth century, my great grandfather worked on a number of chapels, including his own chapel, namely Noddfa Treorchy. This chapel held over 1,500 people—more even than Morriston's Tabernacle, Mike—and during a visit in the late 1970s Penri Jones, the author of Jabas and the editor of Lol, said this about Noddfa Treorchy: 'The chapel is as a sporting arena and the pulpit as a stage.' Visiting the vestry, he said that there were better facilities in that vestry than in many modern schools. It was here that the composer John Hughes played the organ. And it was the first meeting place of the world-famous Treorchy male voice choir.

But, for a number of reasons—be they social, political and economic—the congregation at Noddfa, like many other chapels, declined. Penri Jones ends his visit by saying: 'There was once joy here, but there must have been some catastrophic neglect to cause it all to disappear with such finality.' The prophet's words came true, because within a few years, within five years, indeed, Noddfa was burnt to the ground. It all disappeared in such a final way, as Penri Jones foresaw, all of the resources, the community and musical resource, had gone.

Huw T. Edwards, the Labour trade unionist who was described as Wales's unofficial Prime Minister, said,

'I want to see at least seventy-five per cent of the places of worship in Wales pulled down or used in a more effective way.'

'Rwyf am weld o leiaf 75 y cant o'r addoldai yng Nghymru yn cael eu tynnu i lawr neu eu defnyddio mewn ffordd fwy effeithiol.'

Wel, dwi'n cytuno, i raddau, gyda Huw T. Edwards. Mae angen eu defnyddio nhw mewn ffordd llawer mwy effeithiol. Ond cytunaf hefyd gyda'r Huw Edwards arall, a pha ddadl ar gapeli allem ni ei chael heb Huw Edwards y BBC? Huw Edwards yn dweud hyn:

Well, I agree, to some extent, with Huw T. Edwards. We need to use these buildings in a much more effective way. But I also agree with the other Huw Edwards, and what debate on chapels could we have without the BBC's Huw? He said this:

Places of worship have made an immeasurable contribution to Welsh life: they taught thousands of children to read and write; they fostered the strongest possible sense of community; they provided an essential platform for Welsh culture; they often campaigned for workers' rights and provided welfare services when government offered next to nothing.

Mae addoldai wedi gwneud cyfraniad anfesuradwy i fywyd Cymru: maent wedi dysgu miloedd o blant i ddarllen ac ysgrifennu; roeddent yn meithrin yr ymdeimlad cryfaf posibl o gymuned; roeddent yn darparu llwyfan hanfodol ar gyfer diwylliant Cymru; roeddent yn aml yn ymgyrchu dros hawliau gweithwyr ac yn darparu gwasanaethau lles pan oedd llywodraeth yn cynnig y nesaf peth i ddim.

Ddwy flynedd yn ôl, fe gaewyd drysau holl fannau—

Two years ago, the doors of all places—

15:50

Thank you, Rhys, and I am enjoying listening to your speech here, but isn't it a fact that Sunday school itself—we're talking about the education of young people through chapels, myself going to Sunday school—is another form of education, which I think is incredibly important? Do you agree that Sunday school is an important part of these chapels as well?

Diolch, Rhys, ac rwy'n mwynhau gwrando ar eich araith yma, ond onid yw'n ffaith bod yr ysgol Sul ei hun—rydym yn sôn am addysg pobl ifanc drwy'r capeli, ac roeddwn innau'n mynd i'r ysgol Sul—yn fath arall o addysg, sydd, yn fy marn i, yn eithriadol o bwysig? A ydych chi'n cytuno bod yr ysgol Sul yn rhan bwysig o'r capeli hyn hefyd?

Yn sicr, cytuno, Sam, 100 y cant gyda ti.

Caeodd y drysau'n llwyr ddwy flynedd yn ôl, ac i nifer am y tro olaf. Gallaf feddwl am dair enghraifft yng Nghwm Cynon: Siloa Aberdâr, y man lle cynhaliwyd cyfarfod cyhoeddus tanllyd i ymateb i frad y llyfrau gleision, y man lle cafodd y cyfarfod cyntaf i sefydlu'r Wladfa ei gynnal, y man lle cafodd yr emyn dôn hyfryd 'Rhys' ei chyfansoddi ar yr organ; y capel Cymraeg yn Hirwaun, lle dechreuodd Jennie Eirian ac Eirian Davies eu bywyd priodasol, a lle, meddai Penri Jones, roedd aelodau yr ysgol Sul yn gallu dyfynnu Gwenallt y bardd a Karl Marx mewn un frawddeg; Bethesda Abercwmboi, man lle sefydlodd yr awdures Kate Roberts cangen gyntaf Plaid Cymru tu fas i sir Gaernarfon yn 1925, capel a fu’n cynorthwyo yn ymarferol yn streic gyffredinol 1926, ac hefyd yn streic y glowyr yn yr 1980au. Y cyfan wedi cau yn ystod COVID.

Mae’r sefyllfa yn gymhleth, fel mae Gethin Matthews yn dweud yn ei erthygl yn Barn, oherwydd  gweithredoedd—title deeds—capeli a hefyd cyfraith elusennol. Ond, a dwi'n gorffen gyda hyn, Llywydd dros dro, lle mae’r ewyllys mae modd i lwyddo. Yng ngogledd sir Benfro, mae ymgyrch ddiweddaraf y Cynghorydd Cris Tomos ac eraill wedi sicrhau bod capel Brynmyrnach nawr yn ymuno â'r nifer fawr o asedion cymunedol sydd yno, fel Tafarn Sinc—un o fy hoff dafarndai, Mike. Y bwriad yw agor canolfan dreftadaeth yno a dwy fflat i bobl leol yn yr hen gapel. Mae’r lleoliadau yma yn bwysig, nid yn unig i'n treftadaeth, nid yn unig yn bensaernïol, maen nhw'n bwysig fel man sy’n perthyn i’r gymuned i gyd, i'r bobl i gyd. Felly, braint yw cefnogi cynnig fy nghyfaill Mike Hedges. Diolch yn fawr. 

Yes, certainly, I agree, Sam, 100 per cent. 

Two years ago, all of the places of worship closed their doors due to COVID, and for many of them their doors never reopened. I can think of three examples in the Cynon Valley: Siloa Aberdare, the place where a fiery public meeting was held to protest against the betrayal of the blue books, the venue for the first meeting to discuss establishing Y Wladfa, and the location of the organ on which the beautiful hymn 'Rhys' was composed; the Welsh chapel in Hirwaun, where Jennie Eirian and Eirian Davies started their married lives, and where, according to Penri Jones, the Sunday school members could quote the poet Gwenallt and Karl Marx in one sentence; Bethesda Abercwmboi, where the author Kate Roberts established the first Plaid Cymru branch outside Caernarfonshire in 1925, and the chapel provided practical support during the general strike in 1926 and also the miners' strike in the 1980s. All closed during COVID. 

The situation is complex, as Gethin Matthews says in his Barn article, because of the title deeds of chapels and also charity law. And, I'll finish with this, acting Llywydd, where there is a will there is a way. In north Pembrokeshire, we see the latest campaign by Councillor Cris Tomos and others has ensured that Brynmyrnach chapel has been added to the number of local community assets there, such as the Tafarn Sinc—one of my favourite pubs, Mike. The intention is to open a heritage centre there and provide two flats for local people in the old chapel. These places are important, not just to our heritage and not just architecturally, but they're important as locations that belong to the community and to the people themselves. Therefore, it's an honour to support my colleague Mike Hedges' motion. Thank you very much. 

It's five minutes, actually, not six. I call Alun Davies. 

Pum munud ydyw, mewn gwirionedd, nid chwech. Galwaf ar Alun Davies. 

It's a real privilege to join this debate and to follow such strong and powerful contributions to this, a Parliament, which in itself forms a part of a continuum of our history. We talk about our chapels and our churches, but we can also talk about our synagogues, mosques and temples, a part of the tapestry of who we are. And when I think about our religious history, I also, like others here today, think about our social history, our cultural history. The nation that was born in the shadow of Rome and built chapels that exist today, like St Govan's, is as important as perhaps St David's is more recognisable.

And, then, as the nation took on its political identity, Mike Hedges spoke about the competition, if you like, or near warfare in some cases, between chapels and pubs at the beginning of the last century. And when I read about the social history of Tredegar, there was that stirring conflict if you like. The temperance movement was born of our chapels and the trade union movement tried to ride two horses, and I'm not sure how successful it always was at different times. But it is a part of who we are, because we can all talk about these things. But there's no other country in the world that would have built Soar y Mynydd where it was built and stands today—I think one of the most evocative places in our country. But we can all talk about our local chapel and our local places.

Members here will know that I've lost both my parents over the last few years, and reading through some of the papers of my local chapel, Ebenezer, Sirhowy, what you see in the minutes of the chapel is a history, a social history of Sirhowy and a social history of Tredegar, and the place of the Welsh language. The debate: should we have our services in the Welsh or the English languages? They decided, first of all, certainly, that they would preach in English but pray in Welsh. If there isn't a metaphor for Wales and for Tredegar, that probably is it.

But this also stretches back and informs who we are today. When Griffith Jones introduced his circulating schools, he didn't just preach the Bible, but he ended illiteracy; he created a literate nation in the medium of Welsh, and that led to reaching out again and creating a different cultural experience. And Evan Roberts, competing in 1905 with the Welsh Rugby Union for who should be remembered as the winner in 1905. The revival led to an explosion in an identity that was built upon our chapels. And what we did there, of course, was to create a very different Wales, because the Wales that had existed before was the Wales of somewhere like St Martin's in Cwmyoy. I think it's one of the most beautiful churches in the country, and those of you who know it, up in the hills above Abergavenny, will know that you walk through that crooked nave and you look at how the geology and the geography of that place have created a church in use today, but somewhere that is uniquely Welsh and also a unique and beautiful place, and a very evocative place. But we read through our churches and our chapels and our religious buildings our history of our country.

I agree with the points made by Mike Hedges in introducing this debate, and I hope that the Minister will be able to respond to those. She will know that the heritage centre that is being built in Merthyr, from the synagogue, speaks about the history of the Jewish community in the south Wales Valleys. And I think we still have to come to terms with parts of our history, and certainly the anti-Jewish riots in Tredegar at the beginning of the last century are something that we haven't come to terms with yet today. I think, in the way that we protect the bricks and mortar, what we have to do is to translate that into the present as well and into who we are as a people and who we want to be as a nation.

I would also seek to ask the Minister how she believes that the Historic Environment (Wales) Act that was passed by this place, I think, back in 2016 can be used to provide protection for these places, because until we have protected these places, we literally will not have the bricks upon which we can build this future. So, we have, in this debate this afternoon, stretched our minds back to the shadow of the Roman empire, where we built our nation, and where that nation was forged, both in the industrial revolution and all the other parts of our history that we are familiar with, but also in the chapels and the churches. What happened there was not that a Government created a people, but that a people created a culture.

Mae'n fraint wirioneddol cael ymuno â'r ddadl hon a dilyn cyfraniadau mor gryf a phwerus i'r Senedd hon sydd ynddi'i hun yn rhan o gontinwwm ein hanes. Rydym yn sôn am ein capeli a'n heglwysi, ond gallwn hefyd siarad am ein synagogau, ein mosgiau a'n temlau, rhan o wead yr hyn ydym ni. A phan feddyliaf am ein hanes crefyddol, rwyf innau hefyd, fel eraill yma heddiw, yn meddwl am ein hanes cymdeithasol, ein hanes diwylliannol. Mae'r genedl a aned yng nghysgod Rhufain ac a adeiladodd gapeli sy'n bodoli heddiw, fel Sant Gofan, yr un mor bwysig er mor adnabyddus yw Dewi Sant.

Ac felly, wrth i'r genedl fabwysiadu ei hunaniaeth wleidyddol, siaradodd Mike Hedges am y gystadleuaeth, os mynnwch, neu'n agos at ryfela mewn rhai achosion, rhwng capeli a thafarndai ar ddechrau'r ganrif ddiwethaf. A phan ddarllenais am hanes cymdeithasol Tredegar, roedd y gwrthdaro hwnnw i'w weld. Ganwyd y mudiad dirwest yn ein capeli a cheisiodd mudiad yr undebau llafur wneud y gorau o ddau fyd, ac nid wyf yn siŵr pa mor llwyddiannus oedd hynny bob amser ar wahanol adegau. Ond mae'n rhan o'r hyn ydym ni, oherwydd gallwn i gyd siarad am y pethau hyn. Ond nid oes unrhyw wlad arall yn y byd a fyddai wedi adeiladu Soar y Mynydd lle y cafodd ei adeiladu a lle mae'n sefyll heddiw—yn un o'r lleoedd mwyaf hudol yn ein gwlad. Ond gallwn i gyd siarad am ein capel lleol a'n lleoedd lleol.

Bydd yr Aelodau yma'n gwybod fy mod wedi colli fy nau riant dros yr ychydig flynyddoedd diwethaf, ac wrth ddarllen drwy rai o bapurau fy nghapel lleol, Ebenezer, Sirhywi, yr hyn a welwch yng nghofnodion y capel yw hanes, hanes cymdeithasol Sirhywi a hanes cymdeithasol Tredegar, a lle'r Gymraeg. Y ddadl: a ddylem gael ein gwasanaethau yn y Gymraeg neu'r Saesneg? Penderfynasant, yn gyntaf oll yn sicr, y byddent yn pregethu yn Saesneg ond yn gweddïo yn Gymraeg. Os bu trosiad erioed am Gymru ac am Dredegar, mae'n debyg mai dyna fe.

Ond mae hyn hefyd yn ymestyn yn ôl ac yn rhoi gwybod i ni pwy ydym ni heddiw. Pan gyflwynodd Griffith Jones ei ysgolion cylchynol, nid pregethu'r Beibl yn unig a wnâi, daeth ag anllythrennedd i ben; creodd genedl lythrennog drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg, ac arweiniodd hynny at estyn allan eto a chreu profiad diwylliannol gwahanol. Ac Evan Roberts, yn cystadlu yn 1905 gydag Undeb Rygbi Cymru am bwy a ddylai gael ei gofio fel yr enillydd yn 1905. Arweiniodd y diwygiad at ffrwydrad mewn hunaniaeth a adeiladwyd ar sylfaen ein capeli. A'r hyn a wnaethom yno, wrth gwrs, oedd creu Cymru wahanol iawn, oherwydd y Gymru a fodolai cyn hynny oedd Cymru rhywle fel Sant Martin yng Nghwm-iou. Rwy'n credu mai dyna un o'r eglwysi harddaf yn y wlad, a bydd y rhai ohonoch sy'n ei hadnabod, i fyny yn y bryniau uwchben y Fenni, yn gwybod eich bod yn cerdded drwy gorff cam yr eglwys honno ac yn edrych ar sut y mae daeareg a daearyddiaeth y lle wedi creu eglwys sy'n cael ei defnyddio heddiw, ond rhywle sy'n unigryw Gymreig a hefyd yn lle unigryw a hardd, a lle hudol iawn. Ond rydym yn darllen hanes ein gwlad drwy ein heglwysi a'n capeli a'n hadeiladau crefyddol.

Rwy'n cytuno â'r pwyntiau a wnaeth Mike Hedges wrth gyflwyno'r ddadl hon, ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Gweinidog yn gallu ymateb i'r rheini. Fe fydd yn gwybod bod y ganolfan dreftadaeth sy'n cael ei hadeiladu ym Merthyr, o'r synagog, yn sôn am hanes y gymuned Iddewig yng Nghymoedd de Cymru. A chredaf fod yn rhaid inni ddod i delerau â rhannau o'n hanes o hyd, ac yn sicr mae'r terfysgoedd gwrth-Iddewig yn Nhredegar ar ddechrau'r ganrif ddiwethaf yn rhywbeth nad ydym wedi dod i delerau â hwy eto heddiw. Yn y ffordd y diogelwn y brics a'r morter, credaf mai'r hyn y mae'n rhaid inni ei wneud yw trosi hynny i'r presennol hefyd ac i bwy ydym ni fel pobl a phwy ydym am fod fel cenedl.

Hoffwn ofyn i'r Gweinidog hefyd sut y mae'n credu y gellir defnyddio Deddf yr Amgylchedd Hanesyddol (Cymru) a basiwyd gan y lle hwn yn ôl yn 2016, rwy'n credu, i ddiogelu'r lleoedd hyn, oherwydd hyd nes y byddwn wedi diogelu'r lleoedd hyn, yn llythrennol ni fydd gennym frics i allu adeiladu'r dyfodol hwn. Felly, yn y ddadl hon y prynhawn yma, rydym wedi ymestyn yn ôl i gysgod yr ymerodraeth Rufeinig, pan wnaethom adeiladu ein cenedl, ac i lle y cafodd y genedl honno ei ffurfio, yn y chwyldro diwydiannol a'r holl rannau eraill o'n hanes yr ydym yn gyfarwydd â hwy, ond hefyd yn y capeli a'r eglwysi. Nid Llywodraeth yn creu pobl oedd yr hyn a ddigwyddodd yno, ond pobl yn creu diwylliant.

15:55

I'd like to thank my fellow Members for bringing this item to debate. As many here already know, I'm disheartened to see so many historical buildings across Wales being abandoned and then, consequently, torn down and demolished to be replaced by newer, nondescript buildings that do not contribute to the identity of an area. Removing buildings such as former churches and chapels ultimately changes our urban landscape, and, in my mind, is having a negative effect on the way we relate and identify ourselves with the place we live. Moreover, we are losing our tangible connection to our own history. Whilst museums do provide appropriate examples, as we develop our urban areas, we risk eroding the identity of our communities.

Personally, and as has already been said, religious buildings are very much a part of our community, and they have provided a place of security and hope for generations of people through some of the most troubling times of our nation's history. As we remove our places of worship, we are unintentionally signalling that our loss of religiosity is a good thing, which in my mind is a sad state of affairs, because it normalises the view that our spirituality and connection to a higher power are no longer relevant.

In my home village of Llantwit Fardre, the Bethesda Calvinistic Methodist chapel and the green corrugated iron St Andrew's church are now but distant memories. I'll never forget Trinity Calvinistic Methodist chapel and the impact that it had on me when I drove around the corner one day to see the building that had been in my community since 1913 was, without warning to the rest of us in the village, just a pile of bricks on the ground. All of these buildings contributed to the history of my village and shaped it in one way or another, and now I fear that the next generation and people moving into the area will see my home village as just one massive housing estate without a history or distinct identity of its own.

I believe that, whilst communities may have moved away from worshipping in these buildings, and so their original use has faded, we should not be so ready to allow their destruction, because there's no doubt in my mind that communities still want and would welcome them being saved and repurposed, still serving the community in the spirit in which they were built. I would also argue that organisations that own these religious buildings would welcome their reuse rather than their demolition and would be willing to offer their help and services to do so in one way or another. With this in mind, I want to emphasise that as a nation that recognises the importance of the well-being of our communities, we need to do more to help them repurpose these religious and other historic buildings. Recently, I met with a housing association concerning their plans to demolish an old school in my region, and one of the reasons why they're doing this instead of renovating it is because of the building's poor energy efficiency and the lack of financial support to do anything to improve it. Given this and the unprecedented need to build an energy-efficient future, we need to provide a more suitable level of public resource for communities, agencies and religious groups to upgrade the energy efficiency of these buildings and to help them meet decarbonisation targets. 

Finally, as has already been mentioned, I think that given the value of religious buildings to the community and their potential value to tourism, such as pilgrimage routes and historic trails, we should be providing clear evidence and support that communities can repurpose or rejuvenate their religious buildings and enable them to continue to serve their communities before any more are lost. Thank you, acting Llywydd, and I would urge my fellow Members to support this motion. Thank you.

Hoffwn ddiolch i fy nghyd-Aelodau am gyflwyno'r eitem hon i'w thrafod. Fel y gŵyr nifer yma eisoes, rwy'n siomedig o weld cynifer o adeiladau hanesyddol ledled Cymru yn cael eu gadael yn segur ac yna, o ganlyniad, yn cael eu chwalu a'u dymchwel er mwyn codi adeiladau mwy newydd a mwy dinod yn eu lle, adeiladau nad ydynt yn cyfrannu at hunaniaeth ardal. Mae cael gwared ar adeiladau fel hen eglwysi a chapeli yn newid ein tirwedd drefol yn y pen draw, ac yn fy marn i, mae'n cael effaith negyddol ar y ffordd yr ydym yn cysylltu ac yn uniaethu â'r mannau lle'r ydym yn byw. At hynny, rydym yn colli ein cysylltiad diriaethol â'n hanes ein hunain. Er bod amgueddfeydd yn darparu enghreifftiau priodol, wrth inni ddatblygu ein hardaloedd trefol, mae perygl inni erydu hunaniaeth ein cymunedau.

Yn bersonol, ac fel y dywedwyd eisoes, mae adeiladau crefyddol yn rhan bwysig iawn o'n cymuned, ac maent wedi darparu lloches a gobaith i genedlaethau o bobl drwy rai o'r adegau mwyaf cythryblus yn hanes ein cenedl. Wrth inni gael gwared ar ein mannau addoli, rydym yn dynodi'n anfwriadol fod colli ein crefydd yn beth da, sydd yn fy marn i yn sefyllfa drist, oherwydd mae'n normaleiddio'r farn nad yw ein hysbrydolrwydd a'n cysylltiad â phŵer uwch yn berthnasol mwyach.

Yn y pentref lle rwy'n byw, Llanilltud Faerdref, mae capel Methodistiaid Calfinaidd Bethesda ac eglwys haearn rhychiog gwyrdd Sant Andrew bellach yn atgofion pell. Nid anghofiaf gapel Methodistiaid Calfinaidd Trinity a'r effaith a gafodd arnaf pan yrrais rownd y gornel un diwrnod i weld yr adeilad a fu yn fy nghymuned ers 1913, heb rybudd i'r gweddill ohonom yn y pentref, yn ddim byd ond pentwr o frics ar y ddaear. Cyfrannodd pob un o'r adeiladau hyn at hanes fy mhentref a'i siapio mewn rhyw ffordd neu'i gilydd, a bellach rwy'n ofni y bydd y genhedlaeth nesaf a phobl sy'n symud i'r ardal yn gweld fy mhentref fel dim mwy nag ystâd enfawr o dai heb hanes na hunaniaeth unigryw ei hun.

Er bod cymunedau o bosibl wedi cefnu ar addoli yn yr adeiladau hyn, a bod y rheswm dros eu defnydd gwreiddiol wedi pylu, ni ddylem fod mor barod i ganiatáu iddynt gael eu dinistrio, oherwydd nid oes amheuaeth yn fy meddwl i fod cymunedau'n dal i fod eu heisiau ac y byddent yn falch o'u gweld yn cael eu hachub a'u haddasu at ddibenion gwahanol, gan barhau i wasanaethu'r gymuned yn yr ysbryd y cawsant eu hadeiladu. Byddwn hefyd yn dadlau y byddai sefydliadau sy'n berchen ar yr adeiladau crefyddol hyn yn croesawu eu gweld yn cael eu hailddefnyddio yn hytrach na'u dymchwel ac y byddent yn barod i gynnig eu cymorth a'u gwasanaethau i wneud hynny mewn rhyw ffordd neu'i gilydd. Gyda hyn mewn golwg, hoffwn bwysleisio bod angen inni wneud mwy fel cenedl sy'n cydnabod pwysigrwydd llesiant ein cymunedau i'w helpu i addasu'r adeiladau crefyddol a hanesyddol eraill hyn at ddibenion gwahanol. Yn ddiweddar, cyfarfûm â chymdeithas dai ynglŷn â'u cynlluniau i ddymchwel hen ysgol yn fy rhanbarth, ac un o'r rhesymau pam y maent yn gwneud hyn yn hytrach na'i hadnewyddu yw oherwydd defnydd aneffeithlon yr adeilad o ynni a'r diffyg cymorth ariannol i wneud unrhyw beth i'w wella. O ystyried hyn a'r angen digynsail i adeiladu dyfodol sy'n defnyddio ynni'n effeithlon, mae angen inni ddarparu lefel fwy addas o adnoddau cyhoeddus i gymunedau, asiantaethau a grwpiau crefyddol allu uwchraddio effeithlonrwydd ynni'r adeiladau hyn a'u helpu i gyrraedd targedau datgarboneiddio. 

Yn olaf, fel y soniwyd eisoes, o ystyried gwerth adeiladau crefyddol i'r gymuned a'u gwerth posibl i dwristiaeth, fel teithiau pererindod a llwybrau hanesyddol, rwy'n credu y dylem ddarparu tystiolaeth a chefnogaeth glir y gall cymunedau addasu neu adfywio eu hadeiladau crefyddol a'u galluogi i barhau i wasanaethu eu cymunedau cyn y caiff rhagor eu colli. Diolch, Lywydd dros dro, a hoffwn annog fy nghyd-Aelodau i gefnogi'r cynnig hwn. Diolch.

16:00

Doeddwn i ddim yn mynd i siarad yn y ddadl hon, ond roedd Mike wedi cysylltu ac roeddwn i'n meddwl am ba mor bwysig mae adeiladau crefyddol wedi bod i fy nheulu i, felly roeddwn i eisiau dweud gair. 

I wasn't going to speak in this debate originally, but Mike got in touch and inspired me to think about how important religious buildings have been to my family, so I did want to say a word or two.

I remember a priest writing a little snippet in a parish newsletter, and it said, 'The church is not a museum for saints, but a hospital for sinners.' That's always stuck with me—that these religious buildings we have in Wales were constructed not just to the glory of their God, but as a balm for the congregation, a place of solace, worship and peace. These buildings are to be found on nearly every street in Valleys towns, as in the old joke that each village in Wales will have the chapel you go to as well as all the chapels you don't go to, though more and more these days, they're the chapels very few attend.

These buildings—the point has been made—are more than masonry; they're cathedrals of our collective memory, our connection to our past. There's a church in Partrishow with a fifteenth-century rood screen. In the churchyard a cross marks the place where Gerallt Gymro preached the third crusade. When you stand there, you can imagine that you hear the words. The synagogue in Merthyr shows the tell-tale fairytale architectural tenets of nearby Cyfarthfa castle and Castell Coch, a building that reflects our more recent history and the face it gives to the world. If buildings like this were lost, how much of our history would be buried with them? Only the foundations remain of Abaty Ystrad Fflur, where legend has it Dafydd ap Gwilym was laid to rest. Of Abaty Cwm Hir, nothing remains almost at all. Too many grand, illustrious spaces call to mind the Harri Webb line that 'nettles grow on the altar where the saints fasted and the pilgrims prayed.' 

These buildings are not only important to our past. They play a central role in community life as hubs for coffee mornings, bazaars, collection points, foodbanks. Throughout COVID-19, chapels, churches, synagogues, mosques, gurdwaras and temples have been used for outreach, connecting members of the community, organising food runs, Zoom choirs, buddy schemes. They offer a lifeline for residents of all faiths and none. I'd love to see more religious buildings getting support, getting guaranteed funding so that they can keep their doors open and heating on. I know the Catholic Bishops' Conference of England and Wales has written to Members ahead of today's debate to point out that funding, be it from the National Lottery or the cultural recovery fund, will vary year on year, and less funding is available in Wales as compared with England.

Lots of dioceses and lots of congregations do rely on donations from the people who go and are associated with their congregations, and this will be true of all faiths. But, because of the pandemic, fewer people attend services or mass or prayer. They aren't there to put the money in the basket. What more certainty can the Government, I wonder, give to religious communities in Wales that their buildings can be not just protected, but strengthened and supported? Because I'd repeat again that they are not just monuments to the divine, but a living testament to the goodwill of residents in our communities—those of all religions, those without any religion, those who come together to support people who need it, to provide solace to strangers and, to those needing it, peace.

Rwy'n cofio offeiriad yn ysgrifennu darn yng nghylchlythyr y plwyf, a dywedodd, 'Nid amgueddfa i seintiau yw'r eglwys, ond ysbyty i bechaduriaid.' Mae'r frawddeg honno wastad wedi aros yn y cof—fod yr adeiladau crefyddol hyn sydd gennym yng Nghymru wedi'u hadeiladu nid yn unig i ddathlu gogoniant eu Duw, ond fel balm i'r gynulleidfa, lle i gael cysur, i addoli ac i gael heddwch. Mae'r adeiladau hyn i'w gweld ar bron bob stryd yn nhrefi'r Cymoedd, ac fel y dywed yr hen jôc, byd