Y Cyfarfod Llawn
Plenary
23/01/2024Cynnwys
Contents
Yn y fersiwn ddwyieithog, mae’r golofn chwith yn cynnwys yr iaith a lefarwyd yn y cyfarfod. Mae’r golofn dde yn cynnwys cyfieithiad o’r areithiau hynny.
In the bilingual version, the left-hand column includes the language used during the meeting. The right-hand column includes a translation of those speeches.
Cyfarfu'r Senedd yn y Siambr a thrwy gynhadledd fideo am 13:30 gyda'r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair.
The Senedd met in the Chamber and by video-conference at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.
Prynhawn da a chroeso, bawb, i'r Cyfarfod Llawn. Yr eitem gyntaf y prynhawn yma fydd y cwestiynau i'r Prif Weinidog. Mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf gan Laura Anne Jones.
Good afternoon and welcome to this Plenary meeting. The first item this afternoon will be questions to the First Minister, and the first question is from Laura Anne Jones.
1. Pa asesiad y mae'r Prif Weinidog wedi'i wneud o nifer y lleoedd hyfforddi therapi lleferydd ac iaith sydd ar gael yng Nghymru? OQ60571
1. What assessment has the First Minister made of the number of speech and language therapy training places available in Wales? OQ60571
Llywydd, I thank Laura Anne Jones for that question. Health Education and Improvement Wales develop and submit an annual training plan based on information from partners and engagement with NHS organisations and stakeholders. That plan includes an annual assessment of speech and language training places. Funding for training has risen for nine consecutive years in Wales.
Llywydd, diolch i Laura Anne Jones am y cwestiwn yna. Mae Addysg a Gwella Iechyd Cymru yn datblygu ac yn cyflwyno cynllun hyfforddi blynyddol yn seiliedig ar wybodaeth gan bartneriaid ac ymgysylltu â sefydliadau rhanddeiliaid y GIG. Mae'r cynllun hwnnw yn cynnwys asesiad blynyddol o leoedd hyfforddi lleferydd ac iaith. Mae'r cyllid ar gyfer hyfforddiant wedi cynyddu am naw mlynedd yn olynol yng Nghymru.
Thank you, First Minister. After questioning the health and social services Deputy Minister on speech and language therapy support recently at committee level, the Deputy Minister stated in her response that there had been an 11 per cent increase in speech and language therapy training places in the past year. I accepted, of course, what was said on face value, but it has since become apparent from the Royal College of Speech and Language Therapists that this, perhaps, isn't actually the case. The training places for speech and language therapy have not increased since 2020, and the membership data suggests that we have fewer here in Wales than in other parts of the UK, and that the anticipated increase of 8 per cent in training places for 2024-25 is not now due to go ahead due to budget pressures. Both our higher education institutions and health boards believe that the expansion of the commissioning of places is both possible and necessary. So, First Minister, what urgent action will you be taking to ensure that Wales doesn't fall even further behind in this department, as we all know that, for the services here in Wales, the demand is increasing?
Diolch, Prif Weinidog. Ar ôl holi'r Dirprwy Weinidog iechyd a gwasanaethau cymdeithasol am gymorth therapi lleferydd ac iaith yn ddiweddar ar lefel pwyllgor, dywedodd y Dirprwy Weinidog yn ei hymateb y bu cynnydd o 11 y cant i leoedd hyfforddi therapi lleferydd ac iaith yn ystod y flwyddyn ddiwethaf. Derbyniais, wrth gwrs, yr hyn a ddywedwyd ar ei olwg, ond ers hynny mae wedi dod i'r amlwg gan Goleg Brenhinol y Therapyddion Iaith a Lleferydd nad yw hyn efallai'n wir mewn gwirionedd. Nid yw'r lleoedd hyfforddi ar gyfer therapi lleferydd ac iaith wedi cynyddu ers 2020, ac mae'r data aelodaeth yn awgrymu bod gennym ni lai yma yng Nghymru nag mewn rhannau eraill o'r DU, ac na ddisgwylir i'r cynnydd disgwyliedig o 8 y cant i leoedd hyfforddi ar gyfer 2024-25 ddigwydd bellach oherwydd pwysau cyllidebol. Mae ein sefydliadau addysg uwch a'n byrddau iechyd yn credu bod ehangu'r broses comisiynu lleoedd yn bosibl ac yn angenrheidiol. Felly, Prif Weinidog, pa gamau brys fyddwch chi'n eu cymryd i sicrhau nad yw Cymru yn disgyn hyd yn oed ymhellach ar ei hôl hi yn yr adran hon, gan ein bod ni i gyd yn gwybod, ar gyfer y gwasanaethau yma yng Nghymru, bod y galw yn cynyddu?
Well, Llywydd, first of all, just to be clear, there has been an 11 per cent increase in training places during this Senedd term. But I acknowledge the point the Member makes about the growth in demand for speech and language therapists, and we know that there are real calls for additional staff, particularly people able to offer speech and language services through the medium of the Welsh language, for example. So, there are genuine capacity issues in terms of the finance that we have, to go on— as we have for nine years in a row—expanding the number of people who are training for work in the Welsh NHS. But it's more than training and money. It's the fact that, to become a speech and language therapist requires an arduous path, with 525 hours of clinical practice required. Two thirds of those hours must be supervised by a registered speech and language therapist, and that means somebody who we urgently need to be providing services direct are spending their time supervising other people. So, it's a tension, isn't it, at the front line. We want more people to be speech and language therapists—it's why we have a whole new course opened at Wrexham Glyndŵr University—but, at the same time, we have to make the very best use of the time of the people we have providing that front-line service.
And can I just say to the Member as well—I read her exchange with the Minister—that we've also got to attend to those people who are already in the workplace? Eight out of 10 people who will work in the NHS in 10 years' time are the people who are already in work today. So, she makes important points about training new people, but we've also got to find better ways of retaining the staff we already have, investing in their skills as well, and making sure that, through flexible hours, part-time working and job sharing, and support for people in the workforce, we retain the people we've already got.
Wel, Llywydd, yn gyntaf oll, i fod yn eglur, bu cynnydd o 11 y cant i leoedd hyfforddi yn ystod tymor y Senedd hon. Ond rwy'n cydnabod y pwynt y mae'r Aelod yn ei wneud ynglŷn â'r twf yn y galw am therapyddion lleferydd ac iaith, ac rydym ni'n gwybod bod galwadau gwirioneddol am staff ychwanegol, yn enwedig pobl sy'n gallu cynnig gwasanaethau lleferydd ac iaith drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg, er enghraifft. Felly, mae problemau capasiti gwirioneddol o ran y cyllid sydd gennym ni, i barhau—fel yr ydym ni wedi eu wneud am naw mlynedd yn olynol—i ehangu nifer y bobl sy'n hyfforddi ar gyfer gwaith yn GIG Cymru. Ond mae'n fwy na hyfforddiant ac arian. Mae'n ymwneud â'r ffaith bod dod yn therapydd lleferydd ac iaith yn golygu dilyn llwybr caled, â 525 awr o ymarfer clinigol yn ofynnol. Mae'n rhaid i ddwy ran o dair o'r oriau hynny gael eu goruchwylio gan therapydd lleferydd ac iaith cofrestredig, ac mae hynny'n golygu bod rhywun y mae angen i ni fod yn darparu gwasanaethau uniongyrchol ar ei gyfer ar frys yn treulio ei amser yn goruchwylio pobl eraill. Felly, mae'n densiwn, onid ydyw, ar y rheng flaen? Rydym ni eisiau i fwy o bobl fod yn therapyddion lleferydd ac iaith—dyna pam mae gennym ni gwrs newydd llawn wedi'i agor ym Mhrifysgol Glyndŵr Wrecsam—ond, ar yr un pryd, mae'n rhaid i ni wneud y defnydd gorau posibl o amser y bobl sydd gennym ni'n darparu'r gwasanaeth rheng flaen hwnnw.
Ac a gaf i ddweud wrth yr Aelod hefyd—darllenais ei thrafodaeth gyda'r Gweinidog—bod yn rhaid hefyd i ni roi sylw i'r bobl hynny sydd eisoes yn y gweithle? Wyth o bob 10 o bobl a fydd yn gweithio yn y GIG ymhen 10 mlynedd yw'r bobl sydd eisoes mewn gwaith heddiw. Felly, mae'n gwneud pwyntiau pwysig am hyfforddi pobl newydd, ond mae'n rhaid i ni hefyd ddod o hyd i ffyrdd gwell o gadw'r staff sydd gennym ni eisoes, buddsoddi yn eu sgiliau hwythau hefyd, a gwneud yn siŵr ein bod ni, drwy oriau hyblyg, gweithio rhan-amser a rhannu swyddi, a chefnogaeth i bobl yn y gweithlu, yn cadw'r bobl sydd gennym ni eisoes.
First Minister, it is vitally important that we are able to train speech and language therapists in north Wales. As you say, it's really welcome news, First Minister, that my old university, Wrexham, are offering a new degree course in this very field. Can I ask, First Minister, therefore, what steps can the Welsh Government take to encourage as many students as possible to stay in north Wales on completion of their training?
Prif Weinidog, mae'n hanfodol bwysig ein bod ni'n gallu hyfforddi therapyddion lleferydd ac iaith yn y gogledd. Fel y dywedwch chi, mae'n newyddion i'w groesawu'n fawr, Prif Weinidog, bod fy hen brifysgol, Wrecsam, yn cynnig cwrs gradd newydd yn yr union faes hwn. A gaf i ofyn, felly, Prif Weinidog, pa gamau y gall Llywodraeth Cymru eu cymryd i annog cynifer o fyfyrwyr â phosibl i aros yn gogledd ar ôl cwblhau eu hyfforddiant?
Well, Llywydd, I thank Jack Sargeant for that, and, of course, I completely agree with him about the fact that we have a brand new speech and language therapy course at Wrexham Glyndwr University—its first intake in September 2022. We know that people are more likely to stay and work in places where they train, and, as I said in my original answer to Laura Anne, we know that there is a particular gap in being able to provide speech and language therapy for young children growing up through the medium of the Welsh language, and having a course in north Wales means there will be more opportunities for people whose qualification depends upon supervised practice in the workplace to be able to do just that. There will be many opportunities for those people who go on the Wrexham Glyndŵr University course, and, as I said in my original answer, we must make sure that the workplace continues to be an attractive option for them to use the skills that they will have acquired.
Wel, Llywydd, diolch i Jack Sargeant am hynna, ac, wrth gwrs, rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr ag ef am y ffaith bod gennym ni gwrs therapi lleferydd ac iaith newydd sbon ym Mhrifysgol Glyndŵr Wrecsam—ei dderbyniad cyntaf ym mis Medi 2022. Rydym ni'n gwybod bod pobl yn fwy tebygol o aros a gweithio mewn mannau lle maen nhw'n hyfforddi, ac, fel y dywedais i yn fy ateb gwreiddiol i Laura Anne, rydym ni'n gwybod bod bwlch penodol o ran gallu darparu therapi lleferydd ac iaith i blant ifanc sy'n cael eu magu drwy gyfrwng y Gymraeg, ac mae cael cwrs yn y gogledd yn golygu y bydd mwy o gyfleoedd i bobl y mae eu cymhwyster yn dibynnu ar ymarfer dan oruchwyliaeth yn y gweithle i allu gwneud yn union hynny. Bydd llawer o gyfleoedd i'r bobl hynny sy'n mynd ar gwrs Prifysgol Glyndŵr Wrecsam, ac fel y dywedais i yn fy ateb gwreiddiol, mae'n rhaid i ni wneud yn siŵr bod y gweithle yn parhau i fod yn opsiwn deniadol iddyn nhw ddefnyddio'r sgiliau y byddan nhw wedi eu caffael.
2. Pa ganllawiau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu rhoi i awdurdodau lleol ynghylch y rhesymeg y mae'n rhaid iddynt ei dilyn wrth baratoi eu cynlluniau datblygu lleol? OQ60560
2. What guidance does the Welsh Government issue to local authorities regarding the rationale they must follow in preparing their local development plans? OQ60560
Llywydd, the Welsh Government's development plan manual sets out detailed advice on how to prepare a local development plan. It identifies the key issues to be addressed and the level of evidence required to achieve an adopted LDP.
Llywydd, mae llawlyfr cynllun datblygu Llywodraeth Cymru yn cyflwyno cyngor manwl ar sut i baratoi cynllun datblygu lleol. Mae'n nodi'r materion allweddol y dylid mynd i'r afael â nhw a lefel y dystiolaeth sydd ei hangen i gyflawni CDLl mabwysiedig.
Thank you, First Minister. As you may be aware, last week, Rhondda Cynon Taf County Borough Council launched their consultation on their revised local development plan for 2022-37, and it made for some interesting reading. Despite recently receiving £8 million-worth of Cardiff capital region funding to regenerate the abandoned brownfield Cwm colliery site, and thus making it viable for house building, they have now determined that it is no longer a strategic site and have instead earmarked greenfield surrounding Llantwit Fardre and Efail Isaf as their preferred new site for residential development. And I have to declare an interest, Llywydd, as I live there. This change in position is bewildering at best, as the council will be well aware that these locations have been previously refused planning permission both by the council and by the Welsh Government for their lack of sustainability, for their high ecological value, and for the fact that they encompass a C2 floodplain, which the First Minister will know is the worst classification. With this in mind, how can the general public have confidence in the local development plan process when RCT council are yet again proposing to build houses on land that has so strenuously been refused in the past both by them and the Welsh Government? Thank you.
Diolch, Prif Weinidog. Fel efallai y byddwch chi'n gwybod, yr wythnos diwethaf, lansiodd Cyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Rhondda Cynon Taf eu hymgynghoriad ar eu cynllun datblygu lleol diwygiedig ar gyfer 2022-37, a roedd llawer o bethau diddorol ynddo. Er gwaethaf derbyn gwerth £8 miliwn o gyllid gan brifddinas-ranbarth Caerdydd yn ddiweddar i adfywio safle tir llwyd hen bwll glo Cwm, ac felly'n ei wneud yn ymarferol ar gyfer adeiladu tai, maen nhw bellach wedi penderfynu nad yw'n safle strategol mwyach ac yn hytrach wedi clustnodi maes glas o amgylch Llanilltud Faerdref ac Efail Isaf fel y safle newydd a ffefrir ganddyn nhw ar gyfer datblygiad preswyl. Ac mae'n rhaid i mi ddatgan buddiant, Llywydd, gan fy mod i'n byw yno. Mae'r newid safbwynt hwn yn ddryslyd ar y gorau, gan y bydd y cyngor yn gwbl ymwybodol bod y cyngor a Llywodraeth Cymru wedi gwrthod caniatâd cynllunio yn y lleoliadau hyn yn flaenorol oherwydd eu diffyg cynaliadwyedd, oherwydd eu gwerth ecolegol uchel, ac oherwydd y ffaith eu bod nhw'n cwmpasu gorlifdir C2, y bydd y Prif Weinidog yn gwybod yw'r dosbarthiad gwaethaf. Gyda hyn mewn golwg, sut all y cyhoedd fod yn hyderus yn y broses cynllun datblygu lleol pan fo cyngor Rhondda Cynon Taf unwaith eto yn cynnig adeiladu tai ar dir sydd wedi cael ei wrthod mor bendant yn y gorffennol ganddyn nhw a chan Lywodraeth Cymru? Diolch.
Well, Llywydd, I welcome RCT's decision to begin consultation on a replacement LDP preferred strategy. It is very important that local authorities in Wales have local development plans and that those development plans are up to date. There are a series of statutory processes that the local authority will have to go through and several stages of consultation. So, the points that the Member makes are, I'm sure, exactly the sort of points that will be covered during that consultation period. I hear what he says about specific sites, and I know the point that he makes about flooding, because I believe it was a Welsh Government decision to refuse planning permission for part of that site in the past because of flooding concerns. It will be for the council to explain how those concerns can be mitigated.
But I do say this to the Member: I've heard many contributions from Conservative Members in this Chamber criticising the rate of house building here in Wales. I remember a contribution from Janet Finch-Saunders, telling us that it was planning permission delays that were resulting in houses not being built. There was a Conservative Party motion saying that we needed 12,000 new houses to be built every year in Wales. All I'm saying to Members is that, if you have an ambition, you can't deny the means, and it's Nimbyism to say, 'We want this to happen, but it mustn't happen where I live, and it mustn't happen where people who are concerned about it'. So, there's a careful line to be trodden here between legitimate points—and Joel James raised a number of legitimate points—while at the same time recognising that, if the Conservative Party has an ambition, then it also has to will the means as well as the end.
Wel, Llywydd, rwy'n croesawu penderfyniad Rhondda Cynon Taf i ddechrau ymgynghoriad ar strategaeth a ffefrir ar gyfer CDLl newydd. Mae'n bwysig iawn bod gan awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru gynlluniau datblygu lleol a bod y cynlluniau datblygu hynny'n gyfredol. Ceir cyfres o brosesau statudol y bydd yn rhaid i'r awdurdod lleol fynd drwyddyn nhw a sawl cam ymgynghori. Felly, y pwyntiau y mae'r Aelod yn eu gwneud, rwy'n siŵr, yw'r union fath o bwyntiau a fydd yn cael sylw yn ystod y cyfnod ymgynghori hwnnw. Rwy'n clywed yr hyn y mae'n ei ddweud am safleoedd penodol, ac rwy'n ymwybodol o'r pwynt y mae'n ei wneud am lifogydd, oherwydd rwy'n credu mai penderfyniad Llywodraeth Cymru oedd gwrthod caniatâd cynllunio ar gyfer rhan o'r safle hwnnw yn y gorffennol oherwydd pryderon llifogydd. Mater i'r cyngor fydd esbonio sut y gellir lliniaru'r pryderon hynny.
Ond rwyf i yn dweud hyn wrth yr Aelod: Rwyf i wedi clywed llawer o gyfraniadau gan Aelodau Ceidwadol yn y Siambr hon yn beirniadu cyfradd adeiladu tai yma yng Nghymru. Rwy'n cofio cyfraniad gan Janet Finch-Saunders, yn dweud wrthym ni mai oedi gyda chaniatâd cynllunio oedd yn golygu nad oedd tai yn cael eu hadeiladu. Cafwyd cynnig gan y Blaid Geidwadol yn dweud ein bod ni angen i 12,000 o dai newydd gael eu hadeiladu bob blwyddyn yng Nghymru. Y cwbl yr wyf i'n ei ddweud wrth yr Aelodau yw, os oes gennych chi uchelgais, na allwch chi atal y modd, a mater o Nimbyaeth yw dweud, 'Rydym ni eisiau i hyn ddigwydd, ond ni ddylai ddigwydd lle'r wyf i'n byw, ac ni ddylai ddigwydd lle mae pobl sy'n poeni amdano'. Felly, mae llinell ofalus i'w throedio yma rhwng pwyntiau dilys—a chododd Joel James nifer o bwyntiau dilys—tra ar yr un pryd cydnabod, os oes gan y Blaid Geidwadol uchelgais, yna mae'n rhaid iddi hefyd gefnogi'r modd yn ogystal â'r canlyniad.
You will be aware that I and a number of my colleagues have raised with you and relevant Ministers regularly issues around the whole LDP process in Wrexham, which came to a head recently. And now that we find that that has come to some sort of resolution, on reflecting on the situation, many of the councillors and residents there are asking me, given that the Welsh Government was aware that Wrexham residents would face large cost risks, impacting services potentially, why the Government did not use your legal powers under section 71 of the Planning and Compulsory Purchase Act 2004 to impose the LDP plan, because it would have limited the costs in the case, and, of course, it would have achieved the identical outcome of imposing a local plan against the democratically decided wishes of the local council?
Byddwch yn ymwybodol fy mod i a nifer o fy nghyd-Aelodau wedi codi gyda chi a Gweinidogion perthnasol yn rheolaidd faterion yn ymwneud â'r holl broses CDLl yn Wrecsam, a ddaeth i ben yn ddiweddar. A nawr ein bod ni'n canfod bod honno wedi dod i ryw fath o benderfyniad, o fyfyrio ar y sefyllfa, mae llawer o'r cynghorwyr a'r trigolion yno yn gofyn i mi, o gofio bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn ymwybodol y byddai trigolion Wrecsam yn wynebu risgiau cost mawr, yn effeithio ar wasanaethau o bosibl, pam na ddefnyddiodd y Llywodraeth eich pwerau cyfreithiol o dan adran 71 Deddf Cynllunio a Phrynu Gorfodol 2004 i orfodi cynllun y CDLl, gan y byddai wedi cyfyngu'r costau yn yr achos, ac, wrth gwrs, byddai wedi cyflawni'r un canlyniad yn union o orfodi cynllun lleol yn erbyn dymuniadau'r cyngor lleol a benderfynwyd yn ddemocrataidd?
Well, I think that is a most absurd proposition, Llywydd. Here is a council, in Wrexham, that itself promotes an LDP, puts it through all the processes, has it endorsed by all the different groups that have to comment on an LDP, and, at the very last minute, it attempts not to implement the LDP that it itself has promoted. It's not for the Welsh Government to impose on them their own plan, and it's certainly not for the Welsh Government to bear the costs of doing so. That local authority was taken to the High Court. It said—the local authority said—in front of the High Court that it accepted that its actions had been illegal and had no rationality behind them, and then went on to deny the LDP a second time. People in Wrexham, looking at that very sad story, will know where the responsibility lies, and it doesn't lie here; it lies with those members of the council, and Plaid Cymru members were all part of that, that acted so irresponsibly and admitted as much—admitted as much—directly in the High Court.
Wel, rwy'n credu bod hwnna yn gynnig mwyaf hurt, Llywydd. Dyma gyngor, yn Wrecsam, sydd ei hun yn hyrwyddo CDLl, yn ei roi drwy'r holl brosesau, yn cael cymeradwyaeth iddo gan yr holl wahanol grwpiau y mae'n rhaid iddyn nhw wneud sylwadau ar CDLl, ac, ar y funud olaf un, mae'n ceisio peidio â gweithredu'r CDLl y mae ef ei hun wedi'i hyrwyddo. Nid mater i Lywodraeth Cymru yw gorfodi eu cynllun eu hunain arnyn nhw, ac yn sicr nid mater i Lywodraeth Cymru yw ysgwyddo'r costau o wneud hynny. Aethpwyd â'r awdurdod lleol hwnnw i'r Uchel Lys. Dywedodd—dywedodd yr awdurdod lleol—gerbron yr Uchel Lys ei fod yn derbyn bod ei weithredoedd wedi bod yn anghyfreithlon ac nad oedd unrhyw resymoldeb yn sail iddyn nhw, ac yna aeth ymlaen i atal y CDLl yr eildro. Bydd pobl yn Wrecsam, sy'n edrych ar y stori drist iawn honno, yn gwybod pwy sy'n gyfrifol, ac nid yma y mae’r cyfrifoldeb; mae gyda'r aelodau hynny o'r cyngor, ac roedd aelodau Plaid Cymru i gyd yn rhan o hynny, a weithredodd mor anghyfrifol ac a gyfaddefodd hynny—a gyfaddefodd hynny—yn uniongyrchol yn yr Uchel Lys.
First Minister, local authorities are increasingly, and rightly, I think, taking an expansive approach to their replacement local development plans, looking at placemaking, how quality life is achieved through encouraging outdoor activity, green space, active travel, a whole host of child-friendly and engaging children with the great outdoors initiatives. And I think that's absolutely right, but would you agree with me that one of the challenges they also face, First Minister, and with regard to which they need Welsh Government support, is ensuring that new housing is matched by public services? I know in Monmouthshire there's been a lot of new housing in Magor, Undy and Rogiet, but not a commensurate increase in health services and other public services. The Welsh Government has supported a community hub at Magor and Undy, which is very welcome, and there are proposals for a walkway train station at Magor, and this and much else requires Welsh Government support. So, where local authorities are ambitious and progressive, First Minister, would you agree that they do deserve that support from the Welsh Government and, indeed, partner organisations?
Prif Weinidog, mae awdurdodau lleol yn gynyddol, ac yn briodol, rwy'n credu, yn mabwysiadu dull eang o gyflawni eu cynlluniau datblygu lleol newydd, gan edrych ar greu lleoedd, sut y gellir sicrhau ansawdd bywyd drwy annog gweithgareddau awyr agored, mannau gwyrdd, teithio llesol, llu o fentrau ystyriol o blant ac ymgysylltu plant â'r awyr agored. Ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n gwbl briodol, ond a fyddech chi'n cytuno â mi mai un o'r heriau y maen nhw hefyd yn eu hwynebu, Prif Weinidog, ac y mae nhw angen cymorth Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei gyswllt, yw sicrhau bod tai newydd yn cael eu cyfateb gan wasanaethau cyhoeddus? Rwy'n gwybod yn sir Fynwy y bu llawer o dai newydd ym Magwyr, Gwndy a Llanfihangel Rogiet, ond nid cynnydd cymesur i wasanaethau iechyd a gwasanaethau cyhoeddus eraill. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cefnogi canolfan gymunedol ym Magwyr a Gwndy, sydd i'w groesawu'n fawr, a cheir cynigion ar gyfer gorsaf drenau llwybr cerdded ym Magwyr, ac mae hwn a llawer iawn arall angen cymorth Llywodraeth Cymru. Felly, lle mae awdurdodau lleol yn uchelgeisiol ac yn flaengar, Prif Weinidog, a fyddech chi'n cytuno eu bod nhw'n haeddu'r cymorth hwnnw gan Lywodraeth Cymru ac, yn wir, sefydliadau partner?
Well, Llywydd, I do agree with John Griffths that there are local authorities in south-east Wales, part of the south-east Wales national growth area, that are ambitious and progressive in wanting to provide housing for their local populations. Llywydd, in my own constituency, Cardiff Council is planning to build houses that are the equivalent of a town the size of Carmarthen within the boundaries of the constituency. And I'm well familiar with the point that the Member makes about the tension between needing to build houses and obtaining the section 106 money that comes with it, while providing the necessary education, health, transport and other facilities that are needed to support house building on that scale. It is a sign of the success of those areas in his constituency that people want to come and live in the Newport East area and that it has a council that is prepared to endorse those ambitions.
But the point that John Griffiths makes is a very important one to people who live locally. Local authorities, when they are bringing forward local development plans, have to be able to demonstrate that, as well as housing, there will be the public services that go alongside them, and that is both health, education and other local authority services. The promise of them in the future is not something to be enough to persuade people to go with the grain of what is needed in south-east Wales. And I agree with what John Griffiths said as well, Llywydd, that local authorities that already have LDPs and are now in the process of revising and updating them will have learnt from that previous process, and we can expect them to approach it in a way that takes account of the points that John Griffiths has made this afternoon.
Wel, Llywydd, rwy'n cytuno â John Griffiths bod awdurdodau lleol yn y de-ddwyrain, sy'n rhan o ardal twf cenedlaethol de-ddwyrain Cymru, sy'n uchelgeisiol ac yn flaengar o ran bod eisiau darparu tai ar gyfer eu poblogaethau lleol. Llywydd, yn fy etholaeth i fy hun, mae Cyngor Caerdydd yn bwriadu adeiladu tai sy'n cyfateb i dref o faint Caerfyrddin o fewn ffiniau'r etholaeth. Ac rwy'n gyfarwydd iawn â'r pwynt y mae'r Aelod yn ei wneud am y tensiwn rhwng angen adeiladu tai a chael yr arian adran 106 sy'n dod gydag ef, tra'n darparu'r cyfleusterau addysg, iechyd, trafnidiaeth ac eraill angenrheidiol sydd eu hangen i gefnogi adeiladu tai ar y raddfa honno. Mae'n arwydd o lwyddiant yr ardaloedd hynny yn ei etholaeth bod pobl eisiau dod i fyw yn ardal Dwyrain Casnewydd a bod ganddo gyngor sy'n barod i gymeradwyo'r uchelgeisiau hynny.
Ond mae'r pwynt y mae John Griffiths yn ei wneud yn un pwysig iawn i bobl sy'n byw yn lleol. Mae'n rhaid i awdurdodau lleol, pan fyddan nhw'n cyflwyno cynlluniau datblygu lleol, allu dangos, yn ogystal â thai, y bydd y gwasanaethau cyhoeddus sy'n mynd ochr yn ochr â nhw, ac mae hynny'n golygu iechyd, addysg a gwasanaethau awdurdod lleol eraill. Nid yw'r addewid ohonyn nhw yn y dyfodol yn rhywbeth i fod yn ddigon i berswadio pobl i fynd gyda graen yr hyn sydd ei angen yn y de-ddwyrain. Ac rwy'n cytuno â'r hyn a ddywedodd John Griffiths hefyd, Llywydd, y bydd awdurdodau lleol sydd â CDLlau eisoes ac sydd bellach wrthi'n eu diwygio a'u diweddaru wedi dysgu o'r broses flaenorol honno, a gallwn ddisgwyl iddyn nhw fynd i'r afael â hynny mewn ffordd sy'n cymryd i ystyriaeth y pwyntiau y mae John Griffiths wedi eu gwneud y prynhawn yma.
Cwestiynau nawr gan lefarwyr y pleidiau. Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Andrew R.T. Davies.
Questions now from the party leaders. The leader of the Welsh Conservatives, Andrew R.T. Davies.
Thank you, Presiding Officer. On Friday, we heard the devastating news about the closure of the blast furnaces at Port Talbot, First Minister. Nearly 3,000 jobs are going. Obviously, replacement arc furnaces are coming in their place. It is a fact that a transition board has been established, jointly, I understand, with the company and the UK Government, and the Welsh Government have a role, with the Minister for Economy sitting as vice-chairman on that transition board. Can you outline what the aspiration is and the hopes are of the Welsh Government for that transition board to make a real difference in transitioning to the new steel-making capacity at Port Talbot and, importantly, supporting the workforce in that journey?
Diolch, Llywydd. Ddydd Gwener, clywsom y newyddion trychinebus am gau'r ffwrneisi chwyth ym Mhort Talbot, Prif Weinidog. Mae bron i 3,000 o swyddi yn cael eu colli. Yn amlwg, mae ffwrneisi arc newydd yn dod yn eu lle. Mae'n ffaith bod bwrdd pontio wedi cael ei sefydlu, ar y cyd, rwy'n deall, â'r cwmni a Llywodraeth y DU, ac mae gan Lywodraeth Cymru swyddogaeth, gyda Gweinidog yr Economi yn eistedd fel is-gadeirydd ar y bwrdd pontio hwnnw. A allwch chi amlinellu beth yw dyhead a gobeithion Llywodraeth Cymru i'r bwrdd pontio hwnnw wneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol o ran trosglwyddo i'r capasiti cynhyrchu dur newydd ym Mhort Talbot ac, yn bwysig, cefnogi'r gweithlu ar y daith honno?
Well, Llywydd, I agree with the leader of the opposition that it was devastating news for that local economy. It's more than that, though; it's devastating news, I think, for the whole of the United Kingdom, because there will be no indigenous steel-making capacity in the United Kingdom if the company's plans go ahead. So, this Government is not signed up to the company's plan. We believe that there is a credible alternative that would sustain jobs at Port Talbot and would sustain indigenous steel making in the United Kingdom. That is the Syndex plan, which the trade unions have jointly funded to bring about. It was described as a credible plan by the company themselves. I say to the company what I know others have said: I hope they will not make any irreversible decisions, because, with a general election happening this year, there is an alternative future for the steel industry in the United Kingdom, and I want Port Talbot to be part of that.
Wel, Llywydd, rwy'n cytuno ag arweinydd yr wrthblaid ei fod yn newyddion trychinebus i'r economi leol honno. Ond mae'n fwy na hynny; mae'n newyddion trychinebus, rwy'n credu, i'r Deyrnas Unedig gyfan, oherwydd ni fydd unrhyw gapasiti cynhyrchu dur cynhenid yn y Deyrnas Unedig os bydd cynlluniau'r cwmni yn mynd yn eu blaen. Felly, nid yw'r Llywodraeth hon wedi ymrwymo i gynllun y cwmni. Rydym ni'n credu bod dewis arall hygred a fyddai'n cynnal swyddi ym Mhort Talbot ac a fyddai'n cynnal cynhyrchu dur cynhenid yn y Deyrnas Unedig. Cynllun Syndex yw hwn, y mae'r undebau llafur wedi ei ariannu ar y cyd i'w wireddu. Fe'i disgrifiwyd fel cynllun hygred gan y cwmni eu hunain. Dywedaf wrth y cwmni yr hyn y gwn fod pobl eraill wedi ei ddweud: rwy'n gobeithio na fyddan nhw'n gwneud unrhyw benderfyniadau na ellir eu gwrthdroi, oherwydd, gydag etholiad cyffredinol yn digwydd eleni, mae dyfodol amgen i'r diwydiant dur yn y Deyrnas Unedig, ac rwyf eisiau i Bort Talbot fod yn rhan o hynny.
First Minister, the question I asked you is dealing with what we have before us now. I can understand you obviously outlining where you think things should go, but ultimately we have before us an announcement from the company that is going to shut, regrettably, the two blast furnaces in Port Talbot. I disagree with that proposal. From the conversations I've had with Tata, I was always under the impression that at least one of those blast furnaces would continue in operation. And I still maintain that that is a feasible objective for the transition to arc furnaces. But we have this transition board. Could you outline what resources the Welsh Government have jointly, with the UK Government, put into the transition board so that it can begin its work as a matter of great importance and, ultimately, have the resources available to it so that the training opportunities and the remodelling that will be required to make sure that steel production does continue at Port Talbot are met in full by the transition board and its remit?
Prif Weinidog, mae'r cwestiwn a ofynnais i chi yn ymdrin â'r hyn sydd gennym ni o'n blaenau nawr. Gallaf eich ddeall yn amlwg yn amlinellu lle'r ydych chi'n meddwl y dylai pethau fynd, ond yn y pen draw mae gennym ni gyhoeddiad o'n blaenau gan y cwmni sy'n mynd i gau, yn anffodus, y ddwy ffwrnais chwyth ym Mhort Talbot. Rwy'n anghytuno â'r cynnig hwnnw. O'r sgyrsiau yr wyf i wedi eu cael gyda Tata, roeddwn i bob amser o dan yr argraff y byddai o leiaf un o'r ffwrneisi chwyth hynny yn parhau i weithredu. Ac rwy'n dal i ddadlau bod hwnnw'n amcan ymarferol ar gyfer pontio i ffwrneisi arc. Ond mae gennym ni'r bwrdd pontio hwn. A allwch chi amlinellu pa adnoddau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru ar y cyd, gyda Llywodraeth y DU, wedi eu cyfrannu at y bwrdd pontio fel y gall gychwyn ei waith fel mater o bwysigrwydd mawr ac, yn y pen draw, bod â'r adnoddau ar gael iddo fel bod y cyfleoedd hyfforddi a'r ailfodelu a fydd yn ofynnol i wneud yn siŵr bod cynhyrchu dur yn parhau ym Mhort Talbot yn cael eu cyflawni'n llawn gan y bwrdd pontio a'i gylch gwaith?
Well, Llywydd, first of all can I welcome what the leader of the opposition has said about his support for the continuation of blast furnace No. 4? I think everybody accepts—the trade unions accept—that blast furnace No. 5 will be decommissioned in relatively short order. But keeping blast furnace No. 4 going while the electric arc capacity can be built up is at the heart of that Syndex plan, and I'm very glad to hear what the leader of the opposition has said.
In the meantime, there is the transition board. It is attended by the Minister for Economy. I spoke to the Chancellor of the Exchequer back in September, when the £500 million investment was announced. I talked to him then about the transition arrangements. We will be at that table; we will work with the trade unions and other people at Port Talbot to do whatever we can in the meantime. But, for us, we're not going to do it on the basis that we have settled for the company's plan. We think there is a different future, a better future, a credible future for those people who will lose their jobs—and we know there will be fewer jobs in Port Talbot in the future. The transition board will be there to help to fund the training that is necessary, to do the other things that can be done, and the Welsh Government will play our part in that, as we always have. We are a long-term investor in the Tata site, particularly on the training side of things. So, we will be there, we will make our contribution, but we will do it against the background of continuing to advocate and make the case for a different pathway from where Tata is today to where it needs to be in the future.
Wel, Llywydd, yn gyntaf oll a gaf i groesawu'r hyn y mae arweinydd yr wrthblaid wedi ei ddweud am ei gefnogaeth i barhad ffwrnais chwyth Rhif 4? Rwy'n credu bod pawb yn derbyn—mae'r undebau llafur yn derbyn—y bydd ffwrnais chwyth Rhif 5 yn cael ei datgomisiynu yn gymharol fuan. Ond mae cadw ffwrnais chwyth Rhif 4 i fynd tra gellir datblygu'r capasiti arc trydan yn ganolog i'r cynllun Syndex hwnnw, ac rwy'n falch iawn o glywed yr hyn y mae arweinydd yr wrthblaid wedi ei ddweud.
Yn y cyfamser, ceir bwrdd pontio. Mae Gweinidog yr Economi yn ei fynychu. Siaradais â Changhellor y Trysorlys yn ôl ym mis Medi, pan gyhoeddwyd y buddsoddiad o £500 miliwn. Siaradais ag ef bryd hynny am y trefniadau pontio. Byddwn ni wrth y bwrdd hwnnw; byddwn yn gweithio gyda'r undebau llafur a phobl eraill ym Mhort Talbot i wneud beth bynnag y gallwn yn y cyfamser. Ond, i ni, nid ydym ni'n mynd i'w wneud ar y sail ein bod ni wedi setlo ar gynllun y cwmni. Rydym ni'n credu bod dyfodol gwahanol, dyfodol gwell, dyfodol hygred i'r bobl hynny a fydd yn colli eu swyddi—ac rydym ni'n gwybod y bydd llai o swyddi ym Mhort Talbot yn y dyfodol. Bydd y bwrdd pontio yno i helpu i ariannu'r hyfforddiant sy'n angenrheidiol, i wneud y pethau eraill y gellir eu gwneud, a bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn chwarae ein rhan yn hynny, fel yr ydym ni wedi ei wneud erioed. Rydym ni'n fuddsoddwr hirdymor yn safle Tata, yn enwedig ar ochr hyfforddi pethau. Felly, byddwn ni yno, byddwn ni'n gwneud ein cyfraniad, ond byddwn ni'n ei wneud yn erbyn y cefndir o barhau i eirioli a dadlau'r achos dros wahanol lwybr o le mae Tata heddiw i'r le mae angen iddo fod yn y dyfodol.
I've been quite open this afternoon in saying that I disagree with the company's proposal about shutting blast furnace No. 4. I do believe that there's an ability and a route to keep that blast furnace open, and, indeed, all the conversations I've had over recent years with Tata indicated that that was going to be the journey that they would undertake. I was as surprised as anyone when it came out that they were going to shut both blast furnaces, and, obviously, the job losses that would follow from that while in transition to the arc furnaces. But it is a fact that the company have set their sights on this journey. The UK Government has put £0.5 billion on the table, along with the company's £750 million, to retain steel-making capacity in Port Talbot, thus protecting 17,000 jobs in total in the wider economy.
I'll try it for the third time, if I may, First Minister. I understand that the Minister has a seat at the table. What I'm trying to understand is: what resource has the Welsh Government put in—and by resource I mean financial resource—in supporting the transition board's journey to make sure those training opportunities and other opportunities can be fully exploited, such as the free-port initiative, to make sure that there are opportunities in Port Talbot for those workers and the workers in the wider south Wales economy? How much money has been put in, First Minister?
Rwyf i wedi bod yn eithaf agored y prynhawn yma o ran dweud fy mod i'n anghytuno â chynnig y cwmni i gau ffwrnais chwyth Rhif 4. Rwy'n credu bod gallu a llwybr i gadw'r ffwrnais chwyth honno ar agor, ac, yn wir, roedd yr holl sgyrsiau yr wyf i wedi eu cael dros y blynyddoedd diwethaf gyda Tata yn nodi mai dyna fyddai'r daith y bydden nhw'n mynd arni. Cefais fy synnu cymaint ag unrhyw un pan gyhoeddwyd eu bod nhw'n mynd i gau'r ddwy ffwrnais chwyth, ac, yn amlwg, y colledion swyddi a fyddai'n dilyn o hynny wrth drosglwyddo i'r ffwrneisi arc. Ond mae'n ffaith bod y cwmni wedi gosod eu golygon ar y daith hon. Mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi rhoi £0.5 biliwn ar y bwrdd, ynghyd â £750 miliwn y cwmni, i gadw capasiti cynhyrchu dur ym Mhort Talbot, gan ddiogelu cyfanswm o 17,000 o swyddi yn yr economi ehangach.
Rhoddaf gynnig arni am y trydydd tro, os caf i, Prif Weinidog. Rwy'n deall bod gan y Gweinidog sedd wrth y bwrdd. Yr hyn yr wyf i'n ceisio ei ddeall yw: pa adnoddau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi eu cyfrannu—a thrwy adnodd rwy'n golygu adnoddau ariannol—i gefnogi taith y bwrdd pontio i wneud yn siŵr y gellir manteisio'n llawn ar y cyfleoedd hyfforddi hynny a chyfleoedd eraill, fel y fenter porthladd rhydd, i wneud yn siŵr bod cyfleoedd ym Mhort Talbot i'r gweithwyr hynny a'r gweithwyr yn economi ehangach y de? Faint o arian sydd wedi cael ei gyfrannu, Prif Weinidog?
Well, Llywydd, I don't think there's a great deal separating the leader of the opposition and the remarks that the Welsh Government has been making. I invite him, certainly, to put those views with us to his colleagues in the UK Government, because I don't think they are of the same view. I welcomed the £500 million when the Chancellor announced it back in September; I remember welcoming it here on the floor of the Senedd. What we are talking about is a just transition from today to where we all think Tata will need to be.
I don't have a figure right in front of me, but the Welsh Government has invested in Tata for years and years. I remember agreeing sums of money when I was finance Minister, and they were very much in that training space, making sure that there were opportunities for young people to get the training that they would need at that site, and we will go on playing our part in that way.
The bigger picture is the one that the leader of the opposition has referred to this afternoon. It is how we sustain steel making in one blast furnace over that period as we move to the electric arc future, and if we can say that jointly to the UK Government I'm sure that argument will carry even more weight.
Wel, Llywydd, nid wyf i'n credu bod llawer iawn yn gwahanu arweinydd yr wrthblaid a'r sylwadau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn eu gwneud. Rwy'n ei wahodd ef, yn sicr, i gyfleu'r safbwyntiau hynny gyda ni i'w gydweithwyr yn Llywodraeth y DU, oherwydd nid wyf i'n credu eu bod nhw o'r un farn. Croesawais y £500 miliwn pan gyhoeddodd y Canghellor ef yn ôl ym mis Medi; rwy'n cofio ei groesawu yma ar lawr y Senedd. Yr hyn yr ydym ni'n sôn amdano yw trosglwyddiad cyfiawn o heddiw i le'r ydym ni i gyd yn credu y bydd angen i Tata fod.
Nid oes gen i ffigur o fy mlaen ar hyn o bryd, ond mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi buddsoddi yn Tata ers blynyddoedd ar flynyddoedd. Rwy'n cofio cytuno ar symiau o arian pan oeddwn i'n Weinidog cyllid, ac roedden nhw'n sicr yn y maes hyfforddi hwnnw, gan wneud yn siŵr bod cyfleoedd i bobl ifanc gael yr hyfforddiant y byddai ei angen arnyn nhw ar y safle hwnnw, a byddwn yn parhau i chwarae ein rhan yn y ffordd honno.
Y darlun mwy yw'r un y mae arweinydd yr wrthblaid wedi cyfeirio ato y prynhawn yma. Dyma sut rydym ni'n cynnal cynhyrchu dur mewn un ffwrnais chwyth dros y cyfnod hwnnw wrth i ni symud i'r dyfodol arc trydan, ac os gallwn ni ddweud hynny ar y cyd wrth Lywodraeth y DU, rwy'n siŵr y bydd y ddadl honno yn gryfach fyth.
Arweinydd Plaid Cymru, Rhun ap Iorwerth.
Leader of Plaid Cymru, Rhun ap Iorwerth.
Diolch, Llywydd. Mae cyhoeddiad Tata am ddiswyddo 2,500 o weithwyr yn drasiedi, wrth gwrs, i bob un o'r unigolion a'u teuluoedd, i gymuned Port Talbot a thu hwnt. Mae o'n bygwth dwysau gwendidau economaidd Cymru, ac mae o'n amlygu agwedd ddirmygus Llywodraeth San Steffan tuag at Gymru, mae gen i ofn. Mae diffyg parodrwydd y Llywodraeth Geidwadol i gydnabod pwysigrwydd y diwydiant dur i Gymru yn syfrdanol.
Rŵan, dwi wedi siarad efo swyddogion Tata heddiw. Mi ges i gyfle i drafod sawl agwedd ar y sefyllfa a'r angen i bontio yn deg tuag at ddatgarboneiddio, i wneud popeth i arbed swyddi, wrth gwrs, i fuddsoddi yn nyfodol y gweithlu ac yn nyfodol y safle. Dwi'n falch o glywed gan y Prif Weinidog ei fod o'n cytuno efo fi na ddylem ni fod yn rhoi i fyny ar y gweithwyr rŵan, fod yna amser o hyd i ddod â gwahanol bartïon ynghyd i chwilio am ateb amgen, ond ydy o'n cytuno efo fi hefyd fod yn rhaid i Lywodraeth bresennol Prydain, ac, o bosib, Llywodraeth Lafur yn y dyfodol agos, roi ymrwymiad llawer cliriach o barodrwydd i fuddsoddi llawer, llawer mwy na'r hyn sydd ar y bwrdd gan y Llywodraeth bresennol na'r hyn sy'n cael ei addo gan Lafur pe baen nhw'n dod i rym?
Thank you, Llywydd. The Tata announcement on the 2,500 job losses is a tragedy for each of those individuals and their families, for the community of Port Talbot and beyond. It threatens to intensify the economic weaknesses of Wales, and it highlights the insulting attitude of the Westminster Government towards Wales. The lack of willingness of the Conservative Government to recognise the importance of the steel industry for Wales is quite shocking.
Now, I've spoken to Tata officials today, and I had an opportunity to discuss many aspects of the situation—the need to transition fairly towards decarbonisation, to do everything to save jobs, to invest in the future of the workforce and the site. I'm pleased to hear from the First Minister that he agrees with me that we shouldn't be giving up on the workforce now, that there is still time to bring the different parties together to find an alternative solution, but does he agree with me also that the current UK Government, and, perhaps, a Labour Government in the near future, must give a far clearer commitment of a willingness to invest far, far more than what's on the table from the current Government or what's being pledged by Labour were they to come into power?
Wel, Llywydd, dwi'n siŵr, os ydym ni yn mynd i gael pontio teg i'r dyfodol, bydd yn rhaid i ni gael mwy o arian ar y bwrdd i helpu yn y broses yna. Mae gan y Blaid Lafur—. Mae cynllun gyda ni: £3 biliwn yn nyfodol dur yma yn y Deyrnas Unedig. Dyna pam, pan atebais i'r cwestiwn cyntaf oddi wrth arweinydd yr wrthblaid, roeddwn i'n trio tynnu sylw at y ffaith, wrth gwrs, ei bod hi'n mynd i fod yn gyfnod anodd dros ben i bobl leol ym Mhort Talbot, ond mae hyn yn argyfwng i'r Deyrnas Unedig hefyd. Dydy hi jest ddim yn dderbyniol i ddibynnu ar bethau sydd ar gael dros y byd heb gael capasiti i greu dur yma yn y Deyrnas Unedig. Mae arian ar gael dan Lafur. Dyna pam mae'n bwysig i'r cwmni, mewn blwyddyn lle bydd etholiad cyffredinol, glywed beth sydd ar gael gan Blaid Lafur ac ystyried hwnna pan fyddan nhw'n cynllunio.
Well, Llywydd, if we are to have fair transition in future, we will need more money on the table to assist that process. The Labour Party—. We have a plan: £3 billion in the future of steel here in the United Kingdom. That's why, when I responded to the initial question from the leader of the opposition, I tried to draw attention to the fact that, of course, it is going to be a very difficult period for local people in Port Talbot, but this is a crisis for the entire UK. It's just not acceptable to depend upon those things that are available globally without having the capacity to produce steel here in the United Kingdom. Funding is available under Labour. That's why it's important that the company, in a year when there will be a general election, hears what is available and what is proposed by the Labour Party and considers that when they make their plans.
Thank you for the response. I want to make it clear I don't think £3 billion is near enough, either. It's better than the £0.5 billion that's on the table from the current Government, but the UK Government just isn't investing to help heavy industry prepare for a just transition to a cleaner future like Governments in other European countries do. There are subsidies of €50 billion available to help energy-intensive manufacturers in Germany transition to climate-neutral technologies; €2.6 billion is being invested in one region alone in decarbonising its steel industry with hydrogen. We have to be setting the bar so much higher.
Now, in a general election year, yes, the steel industry is looking for a signal that a potential future Government would commit in a way that the current Government has not, but, whilst money is of course top of the list in many, many ways, we also need a plan, and it's clear from the Tata announcement that the absence of an industrial strategy by either UK or Welsh Government is costing us dearly. Now, will the First Minister commit to making the creation of an industrial strategy, alongside industry, universities and others, a priority? Because, without a strategy, we're going to remain vulnerable.
Diolch am yr ymateb. Hoffwn ei gwneud hi'n eglur nad wyf i'n credu bod £3 biliwn yn agos at ddigon, chwaith. Mae'n well na'r £0.5 biliwn sydd ar y bwrdd gan y Llywodraeth bresennol, ond nid yw Llywodraeth y DU yn buddsoddi i helpu diwydiant trwm baratoi ar gyfer trosglwyddiad cyfiawn i ddyfodol glanach fel y mae Llywodraethau mewn gwledydd Ewropeaidd eraill yn ei wneud. Mae cymorthdaliadau gwerth €50 biliwn ar gael i helpu gweithgynhyrchwyr ynni-ddwys yn yr Almaen drosglwyddo i dechnolegau niwtral o ran yr hinsawdd; mae €2.6 biliwn yn cael ei fuddsoddi mewn un rhanbarth yn unig i ddatgarboneiddio ei ddiwydiant dur gyda hydrogen. Mae'n rhaid i ni osod y bar gymaint yn uwch.
Nawr, mewn blwyddyn etholiad cyffredinol, ydy, mae'r diwydiant dur yn chwilio am arwydd y byddai darpar Lywodraeth yn y dyfodol yn ymrwymo mewn ffordd nad yw'r Llywodraeth bresennol wedi ei wneud, ond, er bod arian, wrth gwrs, ar frig y rhestr mewn nifer fawr o ffyrdd, mae angen cynllun arnom ni hefyd, ac mae'n amlwg o gyhoeddiad Tata bod absenoldeb strategaeth ddiwydiannol gan naill ai Lywodraeth y DU neu Lywodraeth Cymru yn gostus dros ben i ni. Nawr, a wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ymrwymo i wneud llunio strategaeth ddiwydiannol, ochr yn ochr â diwydiant, prifysgolion ac eraill, yn flaenoriaeth? Oherwydd, heb strategaeth, rydym ni'n mynd i barhau i fod yn agored i niwed.
Llywydd, the leader of Plaid Cymru makes a number of important points there. I'll just take a moment, if I could, Llywydd, to rehearse a small bit of the history of this.
Back at the start of July 2022 the Minister for Economy and I came into Cathays Park on a Saturday morning to meet the chair of the Indian board of Tata, and he made to us then a series of points that Rhun ap Iorwerth has echoed this afternoon, about the unfairness of energy costs here in the United Kingdom and of the need for investment in green technologies that would support the steel industry of the future. I was sufficiently concerned about what we heard that day to arrange a call with Michael Gove, and I put a series of the points that had been put to us by the chair of the Tata board to him, because most of what we were talking about were actions that lay in the hands of the UK Government, and negotiations between the company and the UK Government had already been protracted. I wrote to the then Prime Minister, Boris Johnson, on 22 July 2022, setting out all these points for him as well, and he replied to me in mid August saying that these were all points that he recognised, that his Government was committed to supporting high-quality steel making across the United Kingdom, but that decisions about investment in Tata would have to await his successor. Well, it by-passed his immediate successor, and it took from July of 2022 to September of 2023 before there was an actual agreement between the company.
And if we're making these points, I'll just make this point as well, Llywydd, that, on Thursday of last week, when it became clear that the company were to make their announcement on the Friday, I wrote immediately to the Prime Minister asking for a telephone call with him on Friday so that we could jointly discuss how we could best respond to the emerging picture, and by eight o'clock, half-past eight in the morning, on Friday I'd had a reply from the Prime Minister saying that he couldn't find time to meet me or talk to me that day. I do think that is genuinely shocking. It contrasts very much—[Interruption.] It contrasts very much—[Interruption.] I hope you're—. I do hope you're not defending that. I do hope—[Interruption.] No, I think—[Interruption.]
Well, Llywydd, nobody outside this room will hear Members of the Conservative Party shouting at me, but let me make sure that people do know that they're shouting at me to defend the fact that their Prime Minister was unprepared to talk to the First Minister of Wales on that day. That contrasts, for me, very vividly with the actions of his predecessor, Theresa May, on the day that Ford announced that they were leaving Bridgend. My office contacted the office of the Prime Minister that day, and before the end of that day I was in a conversation with the Prime Minister about what we could do together to help people who were affected. That's what I was looking for from the Prime Minister and I am genuinely baffled that he did not feel it was a priority for him to find the small amount of time he would have needed that day to have that conversation. That conversation is necessary because if we are to attend to the points that the leader of Plaid Cymru makes, that will have to be a joint effort between the responsibilities that remain at Westminster and the responsibilities that are devolved to this Senedd.
Llywydd, mae arweinydd Plaid Cymru yn gwneud nifer o bwyntiau pwysig yn y fan yna. Hoffwn gymryd eiliad, os caf i, Llywydd, i fynd drwy rhan fach o hanes hyn.
Yn ôl ar ddechrau Gorffennaf 2022 daeth Gweinidog yr Economi a minnau i Barc Cathays ar fore Sadwrn i gyfarfod cadeirydd bwrdd Tata yn India, a gwnaeth gyfres o bwyntiau i ni bryd hynny y mae Rhun ap Iorwerth wedi eu hatseinio y prynhawn yma, am annhegwch costau ynni yma yn y Deyrnas Unedig a'r angen am fuddsoddiad mewn technolegau gwyrdd a fyddai'n cefnogi diwydiant dur y dyfodol. Roeddwn i'n ddigon pryderus am yr hyn a glywsom y diwrnod hwnnw i drefnu galwad gyda Michael Gove, a rhannais gyfres o'r pwyntiau a wnaed i ni gan gadeirydd bwrdd Tata ag ef, gan fod y rhan fwyaf o'r hyn yr oeddem ni'n sôn amdano yn gamau a oedd yn nwylo Llywodraeth y DU, ac roedd trafodaethau rhwng y cwmni a Llywodraeth y DU eisoes bod yn hirfaith. Ysgrifennais at Brif Weinidog y DU ar y pryd, Boris Johnson, ar 22 Gorffennaf 2022, gan nodi'r holl bwyntiau hyn iddo yntau hefyd, ac chefais ateb ganddo ganol mis Awst yn dweud bod y rhain i gyd yn bwyntiau yr oedd yn eu cydnabod, bod ei Lywodraeth wedi ymrwymo i gefnogi cynhyrchu dur o ansawdd uchel ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig, ond y byddai'n rhaid i benderfyniadau am fuddsoddi yn Tata aros am ei olynydd. Wel, fe wnaeth osgoi ei olynydd uniongyrchol, a chymerodd o fis Gorffennaf 2022 i fis Medi 2023 cyn bod cytundeb gwirioneddol rhwng y cwmni.
Ac os ydym ni'n gwneud y pwyntiau hyn, hoffwn wneud y pwynt hwn hefyd, Llywydd, sef, pan ddaeth yn amlwg, ddydd Iau yr wythnos diwethaf, y byddai'r cwmni'n gwneud eu cyhoeddiad ar y dydd Gwener, ysgrifennais yn syth at Brif Weinidog y DU yn gofyn am alwad ffôn gydag ef ddydd Gwener fel y gallem ni drafod ar y cyd sut y gallem ni ymateb orau i'r darlun a oedd yn dod i'r amlwg, ac erbyn wyth o'r gloch, hanner awr wedi wyth y bore, ddydd Gwener roeddwn i wedi cael ateb gan Brif Weinidog y DU yn dweud na allai ddod o hyd i amser i gyfarfod â mi na siarad â mi y diwrnod hwnnw. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n wirioneddol syfrdanol. Mae'n cyferbynnu'n fawr iawn—[Torri ar draws.] Mae'n cyferbynnu'n fawr iawn—[Torri ar draws.] Rwy'n gobeithio nad ydych chi'n—. Rwy'n gobeithio nad ydych chi'n amddiffyn hynny. Rwy'n gobeithio—[Torri ar draws.] Na, rwy'n credu—[Torri ar draws.]
Wel, Llywydd, ni fydd neb y tu allan i'r ystafell hon yn clywed Aelodau'r Blaid Geidwadol yn gweiddi arnaf i, ond gadewch i mi wneud yn siŵr bod pobl yn gwybod eu bod nhw'n gweiddi arnaf i amddiffyn y ffaith nad oedd eu Prif Weinidog yn barod i siarad â Phrif Weinidog Cymru ar y diwrnod hwnnw. Mae hynny'n cyferbynnu, i mi, yn fyw iawn gyda gweithredoedd ei ragflaenydd, Theresa May, ar y diwrnod y cyhoeddodd Ford eu bod nhw'n gadael Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr. Cysylltodd fy swyddfa i â swyddfa Prif Weinidog y DU y diwrnod hwnnw, a chyn diwedd y diwrnod hwnnw roeddwn i'n cael sgwrs gyda Phrif Weinidog y DU am yr hyn y gallem ni ei wneud gyda'n gilydd i helpu pobl a oedd wedi'u heffeithio. Dyna roeddwn i'n chwilio amdano gan Brif Weinidog presennol y DU ac rwyf i mewn penbleth gwirioneddol nad oedd yn teimlo ei fod yn flaenoriaeth iddo ddod o hyd i'r ychydig amser y byddai wedi bod ei angen arno y diwrnod hwnnw i gael y sgwrs honno. Mae'r sgwrs honno yn angenrheidiol oherwydd os ydym ni'n mynd i roi sylw i'r pwyntiau y mae arweinydd Plaid Cymru yn eu gwneud, bydd yn rhaid i hynny fod yn ymdrech ar y cyd rhwng y cyfrifoldebau sy'n dal i fod yn San Steffan a'r cyfrifoldebau sydd wedi'u datganoli i'r Senedd hon.
It is, of course, shameful, the attitude of UK Government towards industry in Wales as it's responded to this Tata announcement, and I'm not sure what's most disturbing, the refusal of the UK Prime Minister to speak with the Welsh First Minister on the issue or the defence of his actions by the Conservatives here in our national Parliament.
Now, waiting in vain for Westminster to do what's in Wales's best interests isn't confined to the issue of jobs in the steel industry, of course. Last week, the considered view of the Independent Commission on the Constitutional Future of Wales was that the status quo isn't sustainable. But it took all of four days for Labour's most senior Welsh MP to pour cold water on the report and go against the First Minister's official position. A commitment by shadow Welsh Secretary Jo Stevens to only explore the devolution of youth justice and probation goes against the political consensus in this Chamber, and ruling out the devolution of policing and justice before the ink was dry on the report is the most alarming signal yet, perhaps, that Wales's ambition will be held back by Keir Starmer's inner circle.
Now, this is the First Minister's opportunity to distance himself from those comments, reaffirm his support for the recommendations of the Thomas commission and restate his Government's intention to prepare the ground for the devolution of justice. And as I invite him to do so, will he confirm whether it's the First Minister in the Welsh Government or the shadow Secretary of State for Wales in Keir Starmer's team who has the final word on this issue?
Mae agwedd Llywodraeth y DU at ddiwydiant yng Nghymru, wrth gwrs, yn gywilyddus fel y mae wedi ymateb i'r cyhoeddiad hwn gan Tata, ac nid wyf i'n siŵr beth sydd fwyaf pryderus, gwrthodiad Prif Weinidog y DU i siarad â Phrif Weinidog Cymru am y mater neu'r amddiffyniad o'i ymddygiad gan y Ceidwadwyr yma yn ein Senedd genedlaethol.
Nawr, nid yw aros yn ofer i San Steffan wneud yr hyn sydd er budd pennaf Cymru wedi'i gyfyngu i fater swyddi yn y diwydiant dur, wrth gwrs. Yr wythnos diwethaf, barn ystyriol y Comisiwn Annibynnol ar Ddyfodol Cyfansoddiadol Cymru oedd nad yw'r sefyllfa fel y mae hi yn gynaliadwy. Ond cymerodd bedwar diwrnod cyfan i AS mwyaf blaenllaw Llafur yng Nghymru daflu dŵr oer am ben ar yr adroddiad a mynd yn groes i safbwynt swyddogol y Prif Weinidog. Mae ymrwymiad Ysgrifennydd Cymru yr wrthblaid, Jo Stevens, i archwilio datganoli cyfiawnder ieuenctid a'r gwasanaeth prawf yn unig yn mynd yn groes i'r consensws gwleidyddol yn y Siambr hon, a diystyru datganoli plismona a chyfiawnder cyn i'r inc sychu ar yr adroddiad yw'r arwydd mwyaf gofidus eto, efallai, y bydd uchelgais Cymru yn cael ei ddal yn ôl gan gylch mewnol Keir Starmer.
Nawr, dyma gyfle'r Prif Weinidog i ymbellhau ei hun oddi wrth y sylwadau hynny, i ailddatgan ei gefnogaeth i argymhellion comisiwn Thomas ac i ailddatgan bwriad ei Lywodraeth i baratoi'r tir ar gyfer datganoli cyfiawnder. Ac wrth i mi ei wahodd i wneud hynny, a wnaiff ef gadarnhau ai Prif Weinidog Llywodraeth Cymru neu Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru yr wrthblaid yn nhîm Keir Starmer sydd â'r gair olaf ar y mater hwn?
I'm very happy to confirm the Welsh Government's support for the policy of the Labour Party here in Wales—unanimously endorsed at our conference in March last year—in favour of the devolution of the criminal justice system as set out in the Thomas commission report—a former chief justice of England and Wales; as endorsed in the Brown report—the report of a former Prime Minister of the United Kingdom; and as endorsed in the Williams and McAllister report—a former Archbishop of Canterbury. These are hardly a bunch of tearaways suggesting wild ideas for consideration, are they? And they are the policy of the Welsh Government.
The shadow Secretary of State said that we would need to explore how devolution would take place, and of course she is right in that. For me, it is not an exploration of the principle; that is the policy of the Welsh Government. But if, shall we say, the probation service were to be devolved so that it became a responsibility of this Senedd, then there will be a lot to explore to make that happen. We will have to explore the governance arrangements, we will have to explore the financial arrangements, we will have to explore the interface between the probation service in Wales and its counterpart in England. So, there will be a lot to explore, but for me the destination is clear: it is the policy of this Government and has been unambiguously so for many, many months.
Rwy'n hapus iawn i gadarnhau cefnogaeth Llywodraeth Cymru i bolisi'r Blaid Lafur yma yng Nghymru—a gymeradwywyd yn unfrydol yn ein cynhadledd ym mis Mawrth y llynedd—o blaid datganoli'r system cyfiawnder troseddol fel y nodwyd yn adroddiad comisiwn Thomas—cyn brif ustus yng Nghymru a Lloegr; fel y'i cymeradwywyd yn adroddiad Brown—adroddiad cyn-Brif Weinidog y Deyrnas Unedig; ac fel y'i cymeradwywyd yn adroddiad Williams a McAllister—cyn-Archesgob Caergaint. Go brin fod y rhain yn griw o hwliganiaid sy'n awgrymu syniadau gwyllt i'w hystyried, onid ydyn nhw? A'r rhain yw polisi Llywodraeth Cymru.
Dywedodd Ysgrifennydd Gwladol yr wrthblaid y byddai angen i ni archwilio sut y byddai datganoli yn digwydd, ac wrth gwrs mae'n iawn yn hynny o beth. I mi, nid yw'n archwiliad o'r egwyddor; dyna bolisi Llywodraeth Cymru. Ond pe bai'r gwasanaeth prawf, gadewch i ni ddweud, yn cael ei ddatganoli fel ei fod yn dod yn gyfrifoldeb i'r Senedd hon, yna bydd llawer i'w archwilio i wneud i hynny ddigwydd. Bydd yn rhaid i ni archwilio'r trefniadau llywodraethu, bydd yn rhaid i ni archwilio'r trefniadau ariannol, bydd yn rhaid i ni archwilio'r rhyngwyneb rhwng y gwasanaeth prawf yng Nghymru a'r gwasanaeth cyfatebol yn Lloegr. Felly, bydd llawer i'w archwilio, ond i mi mae'r gyrchfan yn eglur: dyma bolisi'r Llywodraeth hon ac mae wedi bod yn ddiamwys felly ers misoedd lawer iawn.
3. Pa asesiad y mae'r Prif Weinidog wedi'i wneud o'r ymateb cyhoeddus i adolygiad Llywodraeth Cymru o 20mya? OQ60581
3. What assessment has the First Minister made of the public response to the Welsh Government's 20 mph review? OQ60581
Llywydd, my assessment is that the public wants roads to be safe and to have speed limits that help to keep them safe. They also expect consistent application of the Welsh Government policy and that’s why our review will cover both the guidance provided to highway authorities and its local implementation.
Llywydd, fy asesiad i yw bod y cyhoedd eisiau i ffyrdd fod yn ddiogel a chael terfynau cyflymder sy'n helpu i'w cadw'n ddiogel. Maen nhw hefyd yn disgwyl i bolisi Llywodraeth Cymru gael ei weithredu'n gyson a dyna pam y bydd ein hadolygiad yn ymdrin â'r canllawiau a ddarperir i awdurdodau priffyrdd a'u gweithrediad lleol.
Thank you for your response, First Minister. Of course, your tenure is soon coming to an end and any review won't be completed in your time as First Minister. And to give you credit, of course, you've stood nobly by this policy in recent years and months, but your two potential successors seem to be all over the shop. We heard from Mr Miles that he would commit to a review of the 20 mph policy within the first week of office, and then a few days later he announced that he is fully committed to 20 mph, which is quite a swift review considering his not being in office yet. And then Mr Gething, who has backed 20 mph all the way, all of a sudden wants a public conversation, and for the public to be front and centre of a review of the policy. Some might perhaps describe that as a cart before the horse. So, First Minister, I would like to know from you: which of the two leadership candidates do you endorse in their approach to this review?
Diolch am eich ymateb, Prif Weinidog. Wrth gwrs, bydd eich cyfnod yn y swydd yn dod i ben yn fuan ac ni fydd unrhyw adolygiad yn cael ei gwblhau yn eich amser fel Prif Weinidog. Ac i roi clod i chi, wrth gwrs, rydych chi wedi glynu'n gadarn at y polisi hwn yn ystod y blynyddoedd a'r misoedd diwethaf, ond mae'n ymddangos bod eich dau darpar olynydd mewn dryswch llwyr. Clywsom gan Mr Miles y byddai'n ymrwymo i adolygiad o'r polisi 20 mya yn ystod ei wythnos gyntaf yn y swydd, ac yna ychydig ddiwrnodau'n ddiweddarach cyhoeddodd ei fod wedi ymrwymo'n llawn i 20 mya, sy'n adolygiad cyflym iawn o gofio nad yw yn y swydd eto. Ac yna, yn sydyn, mae Mr Gething, sydd wedi cefnogi 20 mya o'r cychwyn cyntaf, eisiau sgwrs gyhoeddus, ac i'r cyhoedd fod yn flaenllaw ac yn ganolog i adolygiad o'r polisi. Efallai y byddai rhai yn disgrifio hynny fel trol o flaen y ceffyl. Felly, Prif Weinidog, hoffwn wybod gennych chi: pa un o'r ddau ymgeisydd i fod yn arweinydd ydych chi'n ei gymeradwyo yn ei ddull o ymdrin â'r adolygiad hwn?
Well, Llywydd, I endorse the policy of the Welsh Government, as endorsed by both my colleagues. The Deputy Minister for Climate Change has written today—that letter is available—to all Members. It sets out details of the review. It sets out the people who will be involved in the review. It welcomes contributions from the public. Of course we do, because their views on the practical implementation of the policy in the places where they live will be material to the way in which we review the first six months of this policy in practice.
We will do it in the way that we always said that we would do. We will, first of all, gather experience. We will weigh up the evidence. And then, we will do two things. Where the guidance needs to be strengthened or clarified, that is what we will do. And then, we will make sure that local authorities have the assistance that they need to implement that guidance in a way that is consistent across the whole of Wales.
Wel, Llywydd, rwy'n cymeradwyo polisi Llywodraeth Cymru, fel y'i cymeradwyir gan fy nau gyd-Aelod. Mae'r Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd wedi ysgrifennu heddiw—mae'r llythyr hwnnw ar gael—at yr holl Aelodau. Mae'n nodi manylion yr adolygiad. Mae'n nodi'r bobl a fydd yn cymryd rhan yn yr adolygiad. Mae'n croesawu cyfraniadau gan y cyhoedd. Wrth gwrs ein bod ni, oherwydd bydd eu safbwyntiau ar weithrediad ymarferol y polisi yn y mannau lle maen nhw'n byw yn berthnasol i'r ffordd yr ydym ni'n adolygu chwe mis cyntaf y polisi hwn yn ymarferol.
Byddwn yn ei wneud yn y ffordd y gwnaethom ni ddweud o'r cychwyn y byddem ni'n ei wneud. Yn gyntaf oll, byddwn yn casglu profiadau. Byddwn yn pwyso a mesur y dystiolaeth. Ac yna byddwn yn gwneud dau beth. Lle mae angen cryfhau neu egluro'r canllawiau, dyna fyddwn ni'n ei wneud. Ac yna, byddwn yn gwneud yn siŵr bod gan awdurdodau lleol y cymorth sydd ei angen arnyn nhw i weithredu'r canllawiau hynny mewn ffordd sy'n gyson ar draws Cymru gyfan.
First Minister, I know from my experience as a cabinet member of Flintshire County Council when we did a speed limit review about five years ago, or six years ago maybe, that it took time and there were objections to overcome and anomalies that had to be revisited, as is happening now.
Last week, with thanks to the Minister for Climate Change, I facilitated a meeting between the Welsh Government and Flintshire council, and it was a very useful action in resolving conflict on interpretation of the criteria, in rolling out the exemption criteria going forward, with I think lessons learned on both sides. So, I felt that it was really positive. I later attended a community meeting, and although people raised concerns about 20 mph, there were also others who now want to retain it, and I suggested that they feed into the council's review. First Minister, would you agree with me that positive actions are now being taken in moving forward with this?
Prif Weinidog, rwy'n gwybod o'm profiad fel aelod o gabinet Cyngor Sir y Fflint pan wnaethom ni gynnal adolygiad terfynau cyflymder tua phum mlynedd yn ôl, neu chwe blynedd yn ôl efallai, ei fod wedi cymryd amser ac y bu gwrthwynebiadau i'w goresgyn ac anghysonderau y bu'n rhaid eu hailystyried, fel sy'n digwydd nawr.
Yr wythnos diwethaf, gyda diolch i'r Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd, fe wnes i hwyluso cyfarfod rhwng Llywodraeth Cymru a Chyngor Sir y Fflint, ac roedd yn gam defnyddiol iawn i ddatrys gwrthdaro ynghylch dehongli'r meini prawf, wrth gyflwyno'r meini prawf eithrio yn y dyfodol, a dysgwyd gwersi ar y ddwy ochr rwy'n credu. Felly, roeddwn i'n teimlo ei fod yn wirioneddol gadarnhaol. Yn ddiweddarach, roeddwn i'n bresennol mewn cyfarfod cymunedol, ac er i bobl godi pryderon am 20 mya, roedd eraill hefyd sydd bellach eisiau ei gadw, ac awgrymais iddyn nhw gyfrannu at adolygiad y cyngor. Prif Weinidog, a fyddech chi'n cytuno â mi bod camau cadarnhaol yn cael eu cymryd nawr i fwrw ymlaen â hyn?
Llywydd, I thank Carolyn Thomas for that. She's right, of course. There are different views among the population, and there certainly are people who have been writing to their local authorities, asking why their street was not included as a 20 mph street when the council implemented the guidance. That is why the sort of meeting to which Carolyn Thomas referred, between the Welsh Government and the local authority, directly in the same room, sharing experiences and perspectives, will mean that the review is both meaningful, well informed, and will produce outcomes that will be shared between all of the parties.
Llywydd, diolch i Carolyn Thomas am hynna. Mae'n iawn, wrth gwrs. Mae gwahanol safbwyntiau ymhlith y boblogaeth, ac yn sicr mae pobl sydd wedi bod yn ysgrifennu at eu hawdurdodau lleol, yn gofyn pam na chafodd eu stryd ei chynnwys fel stryd 20 mya pan roddodd y cyngor y canllawiau ar waith. Dyna pam y bydd y math o gyfarfod y cyfeiriodd Carolyn Thomas ato, rhwng Llywodraeth Cymru a'r awdurdod lleol, yn uniongyrchol yn yr un ystafell, gan rannu profiadau a safbwyntiau, yn golygu bod yr adolygiad yn ystyrlon, yn wybodus, ac yn cynhyrchu canlyniadau a fydd yn cael eu rhannu rhwng yr holl bartïon.
4. Pa gamau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i sicrhau nad yw toriadau i gyllid awdurdodau lleol yn effeithio'n anghymesur ar grwpiau sy'n agored i niwed? OQ60582
4. What steps will the Welsh Government take to ensure that local authority funding cuts don't disproportionately impact vulnerable groups? OQ60582
Llywydd, the draft budget maintains the previously promised uplift in local government funding for 2024-25. That decision reflects this Government’s commitment to front-line services, which disproportionally benefit vulnerable groups.
Llywydd, mae'r gyllideb ddrafft yn cynnal y cynnydd a addawyd yn flaenorol i gyllid llywodraeth leol ar gyfer 2024-25. Mae'r penderfyniad hwnnw yn adlewyrchu ymrwymiad y Llywodraeth hon i wasanaethau rheng flaen, sydd o fudd anghymesur i grwpiau agored i niwed.
Thank you, First Minister. However, local authorities across my region are outlining cuts to services provided to those vulnerable groups. It seems that, across all three local authorities, cutbacks are to be made to social services provision, public toilets are to close and, worst of all, cuts to additional learning needs support provision.
First Minister, the reality of your recent budget is that vulnerable children and older people will bear the brunt of the cuts. You are happy to spend millions of pounds on a commission on constitutional reform and increasing the number of politicians, but stand by when the most vulnerable in our society are let down by cuts to local services. Will you now admit that your budget is flawed and revise the local government settlement in order to protect vital services?
Diolch, Prif Weinidog. Fodd bynnag, mae awdurdodau lleol ar draws fy rhanbarth i yn amlinellu toriadau i wasanaethau a ddarperir i'r grwpiau agored i niwed hynny. Mae'n ymddangos, ar draws bob un o'r tri awdurdod lleol, y bydd toriadau yn cael eu gwneud i'r ddarpariaeth o wasanaethau cymdeithasol, y bydd toiledau cyhoeddus yn cau a, gwaethaf oll, toriadau i'r ddarpariaeth o gymorth anghenion dysgu ychwanegol.
Prif Weinidog, realiti eich cyllideb ddiweddar yw y bydd plant a phobl hŷn agored i niwed yn ysgwyddo baich y toriadau. Rydych chi'n hapus i wario miliynau o bunnoedd ar gomisiwn ar ddiwygio cyfansoddiadol a chynyddu nifer y gwleidyddion, ond yn sefyll o'r neilltu pan fydd y rhai mwyaf agored i niwed yn ein cymdeithas yn cael eu siomi gan doriadau i wasanaethau lleol. A wnewch chi gyfaddef nawr bod eich cyllideb yn ddiffygiol a diwygio'r setliad llywodraeth leol er mwyn diogelu gwasanaethau hanfodol?
Well, Llywydd, as I'm sure the Member must be aware, this has been the most difficult budget in the whole history of devolution, because our budget in real terms is worth £1.3 billion less than when Rishi Sunak himself set it. Back in 2021, he made an assessment of the funding that the Welsh Government needed. We didn't agree with that; we thought that he had underestimated the funds needed, but three years later, we are £1.3 billion short of what he himself had calculated was necessary to support public services here in Wales.
The Member trots out a series of matters that are a handful of millions of pounds when you add them all up together. We will be providing to local authorities in Wales this year a 3.1 per cent uplift, which comes on top of the 7.9 per cent that local authorities had last year, and 9.4 per cent that they had the year before, each of which has been baselined. Local authorities in England, where his party is in charge, cannot believe the extent to which local authorities in Wales have been protected. In an era when there is not enough money for everything that is needed, they too face some very challenging decisions. That is without any doubt. But this Welsh Government, year after year after year, has shown our determination to do whatever we can with the means we have available to support local authorities in the vital work that they carry out.
Wel, Llywydd, fel yr wyf i'n siŵr y bydd yr Aelod yn ymwybodol, hon fu'r gyllideb anoddaf yn holl hanes datganoli, gan fod ein cyllideb mewn termau real werth £1.3 biliwn yn llai na phan y'i gosodwyd gan Rishi Sunak ei hun. Yn ôl yn 2021, gwnaeth asesiad o'r cyllid yr oedd ei angen ar Lywodraeth Cymru. Nid oeddem ni'n cytuno â hynny; roeddem ni'n meddwl ei fod wedi tanamcangyfrif yr arian oedd ei angen, ond dair blynedd yn ddiweddarach, rydym ni £1.3 biliwn yn fyr o'r hyn yr oedd ef ei hun wedi'i gyfrifo a oedd yn angenrheidiol i gefnogi gwasanaethau cyhoeddus yma yng Nghymru.
Mae'r Aelod yn rhestru cyfres o faterion sy'n llond llaw o filiynau o bunnoedd pan fyddwch chi'n eu hadio nhw i gyd at ei gilydd. Byddwn yn darparu cynnydd o 3.1 y cant i awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru eleni, sy'n dod ar ben y 7.9 y cant a gafodd awdurdodau lleol y llynedd, a 9.4 y cant y cawson nhw y flwyddyn gynt, y mae pob un ohonynt yn amcangyfrifon gwaelodlin. Ni all awdurdodau lleol yn Lloegr, lle mae ei blaid ef wrth y llyw, gredu i ba raddau y mae awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru wedi cael eu diogelu. Mewn oes pan nad oes digon o arian ar gyfer popeth sydd ei angen, maen nhw hefyd yn wynebu rhai penderfyniadau anodd iawn. Mae hynny heb unrhyw amheuaeth. Ond mae'r Llywodraeth hon yng Nghymru, flwyddyn ar ôl blwyddyn, wedi dangos ein penderfyniad i wneud beth bynnag y gallwn gyda'r moddau sydd gennym ni ar gael i gynorthwyo awdurdodau lleol yn y gwaith hanfodol y maen nhw'n ei wneud.
First Minister, there's a very popular centre in the middle of Caerphilly that houses a coffee shop, a gallery and public toilets. Coffi Vista is used as a hub by vulnerable groups and the man who runs it, Martin, has a special table set aside for people who are lonely, so that they've got somewhere that's warm and welcoming to sit. The future of the centre is under threat because of cuts to local authority budgets. Now, I realise that councils are facing difficult circumstances and I wonder what support the Welsh Government can give to councils to ensure that community assets remain open. There was a public demonstration of support for the centre in Caerphilly just over a week ago. Hundreds of residents braved the cold to show how important the centre is to them. I think the town mayor, Mike Prew, said it was the largest demonstration in Caerphilly for almost 50 years, since the Sex Pistols played to the town in 1976. So, I'd ask what support could be given to help keep centres like this open and available for the people who rely on them so much.
Prif Weinidog, mae yna ganolfan boblogaidd iawn yng nghanol Caerffili sy'n gartref i siop goffi, oriel a thoiledau cyhoeddus. Mae Coffi Vista yn cael ei ddefnyddio fel canolfan gan grwpiau agored i niwed ac mae gan y gŵr sy'n ei redeg, Martin, fwrdd arbennig wedi'i neilltuo ar gyfer pobl sy'n unig, fel bod ganddyn nhw rywle sy'n gynnes ac yn groesawgar i eistedd. Mae dyfodol y ganolfan o dan fygythiad oherwydd toriadau i gyllidebau awdurdodau lleol. Nawr, rwy'n sylweddoli bod cynghorau yn wynebu amgylchiadau anodd ac rwy'n meddwl tybed pa gymorth y gall Llywodraeth Cymru ei roi i gynghorau i sicrhau bod asedau cymunedol yn aros ar agor. Roedd mynegiant cyhoeddus o gefnogaeth i'r ganolfan yng Nghaerffili ychydig dros wythnos yn ôl. Fe wnaeth cannoedd o drigolion fentro i'r oerfel i ddangos pa mor bwysig yw'r ganolfan iddyn nhw. Rwy'n credu bod maer y dref, Mike Prew, wedi dweud mai dyma'r brotest fwyaf yng Nghaerffili ers bron i 50 mlynedd, ers i'r Sex Pistols chwarae i'r dref ym 1976. Felly, byddwn yn gofyn pa gymorth y gellid ei roi i helpu i gadw canolfannau fel hyn ar agor ac ar gael i'r bobl sy'n dibynnu arnyn nhw gymaint.
I thank Delyth Jewell for that small part of Caerphilly history. [Laughter.] You heard me set out the extent to which we have protected and delivered what we said we would for local government in terms of revenue support grant support. On top of that, there are a series of grants that local authorities will receive, and Caerphilly will be a beneficiary of those as well. Just as we are going through the process here in the Senedd of having our budget scrutinised by different committees, so local authorities have published their budgets so that they can gauge the reaction of their local populations and see whether the decisions that they have made need to be fine-tuned to respond to that local concern. I'm quite sure that, in the difficult circumstances that Caerphilly council faces—and that's true of all our local authorities—I'm sure that it will be listening carefully to the views of its local population.
Diolch i Delyth Jewell am y rhan fach yna o hanes Caerffili. [Chwerthin.] Fe wnaethoch chi fy nghlywed i'n nodi i ba raddau yr ydym ni wedi diogelu a darparu'r hyn y gwnaethom ni ddweud y byddem ni'n ei wneud i lywodraeth leol o ran cymorth grant cymorth refeniw. Ar ben hynny, mae cyfres o grantiau y bydd awdurdodau lleol yn eu derbyn, a bydd Caerffili yn fuddiolwr o'r rheini hefyd. Yn union fel yr ydym ni'n mynd drwy'r broses yma yn y Senedd o graffu ar ein cyllideb gan wahanol bwyllgorau, felly hefyd y mae awdurdodau lleol wedi cyhoeddi eu cyllidebau fel y gallan nhw fesur ymateb eu poblogaethau lleol a gweld a oes angen mireinio'r penderfyniadau y maen nhw wedi eu gwneud i ymateb i'r pryder lleol hwnnw. Rwy'n gwbl sicr, o dan yr amgylchiadau anodd y mae cyngor Caerffili yn eu hwynebu—ac mae hynny'n wir am ein holl awdurdodau lleol—rwy'n siŵr y bydd yn gwrando'n astud ar farn ei boblogaeth leol.
Good afternoon, First Minister. I know that many of us in this Siambr are very committed to the lives of looked-after children and care-experienced children, including yourself and your Cabinet, and therefore, many of us were delighted to see the commitment in the programme for government to eliminate profit from care. Many local authorities are struggling in terms of providing placements for children, but we must remember what our looked-after children say. Youth parliamentarian Rosie Squires said that looked-after children are people and are not there for profits. The concern is that local authorities spend millions of their budgets on placements for looked-after children. Last year, it's estimated that Welsh local authorities spent £200 million on placements for looked-after children. Not only is eliminating profit from care the right thing to do, but I and many others actually believe that it will save money. So, I just wondered if you could give us a continued commitment to eliminating profit from care and a timeline for when we can see action in moving that forward. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Prynhawn da, Prif Weinidog. Gwn fod llawer ohonom ni yn y Siambr hon wedi ymrwymo'n llwyr i fywydau plant sy'n derbyn gofal a phlant â phrofiad o ofal, gan gynnwys chi eich hun a'ch Cabinet, ac felly, roedd llawer ohonom ni wrth ein boddau o weld yr ymrwymiad yn y rhaglen lywodraethu i ddileu elw o ofal. Mae llawer o awdurdodau lleol yn ei chael hi'n anodd o ran darparu lleoliadau i blant, ond mae'n rhaid i ni gofio'r hyn y mae ein plant sy'n derbyn gofal yn ei ddweud. Dywedodd y seneddwr ieuenctid, Rosie Squires bod plant sy'n derbyn gofal yn bobl ac nad ydyn nhw yno ar gyfer elw. Y pryder yw bod awdurdodau lleol yn gwario miliynau o'u cyllidebau ar leoliadau ar gyfer plant sy'n derbyn gofal. Y llynedd, amcangyfrifir bod awdurdodau lleol Cymru wedi gwario £200 miliwn ar leoliadau ar gyfer plant sy'n derbyn gofal. Nid yn unig y mae dileu elw o ofal y peth iawn i'w wneud, ond rwyf i a llawer o bobl eraill yn credu mewn gwirionedd y bydd yn arbed arian. Felly, roeddwn i'n meddwl tybed a allech chi roi ymrwymiad parhaus i ni i ddileu elw o ofal ac amserlen ar gyfer pryd y gallwn ni weld camau o ran bwrw ymlaen â hynny. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Well, Llywydd, I'm very pleased indeed to give that commitment. It's a very important part of our own programme for government to eliminate the pursuit of private profit in services for looked-after children. I'm confident that we will bring a Bill before this Senedd while I am still First Minister to begin the scrutiny process of those proposals.
I do not regret a single penny of the money that is spent in Wales on getting a better future for those children. We owe it to them, more than almost any other children in Wales, because public authorities have become those children's parents. But I want to see that money spent on those children, and not to leak out into private profit taking. The Member will know that the Competition and Markets Authority published two reports last year that criticised the sector for excessive profit taking. I don't think that making profits at the expense of young people, where that money could be invested in services for those young people, is a situation that we would want to see sustained into the future in Wales.
It will provide benefits for local authorities financially, because they'll have that money to invest in services, and, as I see it, to help prevent young people in the future being taken into the care of local authorities where families could be supported through the difficult times that families face. There's no more vulnerable group, to use the term of the original question, than those young people, and we will do better by them in Wales in future.
Wel, Llywydd, rwy'n falch iawn o roi'r ymrwymiad hwnnw. Mae'n rhan bwysig iawn o'n rhaglen lywodraethu ein hunain i ddileu mynd ar drywydd elw preifat mewn gwasanaethau ar gyfer plant sy'n derbyn gofal. Rwy'n hyderus y byddwn ni'n cyflwyno Bil gerbron y Senedd hon tra byddaf i'n dal yn Brif Weinidog i ddechrau'r broses o graffu ar y cynigion hynny.
Nid wyf i'n difaru un geiniog o'r arian sy'n cael ei wario yng Nghymru ar gael gwell dyfodol i'r plant hynny. Mae'n ddyled gennym ni iddyn nhw, yn fwy na bron unrhyw blant eraill yng Nghymru, gan fod awdurdodau cyhoeddus wedi dod yn rhieni i'r plant hynny. Ond rwyf i eisiau gweld yr arian hwnnw yn cael ei wario ar y plant hynny, ac i beidio â gollwng allan i bobl wneud elw preifat. Bydd yr Aelod yn gwybod bod yr Awdurdod Cystadleuaeth a Marchnadoedd wedi cyhoeddi dau adroddiad y llynedd a feirniadodd y sector am gymryd gormod o elw. Nid wyf i'n credu bod gwneud elw ar draul pobl ifanc, lle gellid buddsoddi'r arian hwnnw mewn gwasanaethau i'r bobl ifanc hynny, yn sefyllfa y byddem ni eisiau ei gweld yn cael ei chynnal i'r dyfodol yng Nghymru.
Bydd yn darparu buddion i awdurdodau lleol yn ariannol, oherwydd bydd yr arian hwnnw ganddyn nhw i'w fuddsoddi mewn gwasanaethau, ac, fel y gwelaf i hi, i helpu i atal pobl ifanc yn y dyfodol rhag cael eu cymryd i ofal awdurdodau lleol lle gellid cefnogi teuluoedd drwy'r cyfnodau anodd y mae teuluoedd yn eu hwynebu. Nid oes unrhyw grŵp mwy agored i niwed, i ddefnyddio term y cwestiwn gwreiddiol, na'r bobl ifanc hynny, a byddwn yn gwneud yn well ar eu rhan yng Nghymru yn y dyfodol.
5. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Prif Weinidog wedi'u cael gyda Llywodraeth y DU ynghylch adfer cyllideb Cymru yn unol â chwyddiant cynyddol yn y DU? OQ60575
5. What discussions has the First Minister had with the UK Government about restoring the Welsh budget in line with rising inflation in the UK? OQ60575
Rydyn ni wedi pwyso droeon ar Lywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig i gynyddu cyllideb Cymru yn unol â chwyddiant. Mae ein cyllideb werth £1.3 biliwn yn llai mewn termau real na phan ei gosodwyd hi yn 2021. Bydd y Gweinidog cyllid yn codi hyn eto pan fydd yn cwrdd â Phrif Ysgrifennydd y Trysorlys nes ymlaen yr wythnos hon.
We have repeatedly pressed the UK Government to increase the Welsh budget in line with inflation. Our budget is worth £1.3 billion less in real terms than when it was set in 2021. The Minister for finance will raise this once again when she meets the Chief Secretary to the Treasury later this week.
Diolch, Brif Weinidog. Rydych chi wedi ein hatgoffa ni ddwywaith y prynhawn yma fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn dlotach gan £1.3 biliwn mewn termau real. Mae cwestiynau blaenorol Altaf Hussain, Delyth Jewell a Jane Dodds wedi dangos impact diffyg cylliideb ar wasanaethau ac, yn bwysicach fyth, ar bobl ar lawr gwlad. Mae'n amlwg fod Cymru'n dlotach nawr nag y byddem ni pe byddem ni'n dal o fewn yr Undeb Ewropeaidd. Dyw cynlluniau Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig o gyllido didarged jest ddim yn gweithio. Datgelodd cais rhyddid gwybodaeth diweddar fod awdurdodau lleol yn Lloegr wedi gwario o leiaf £27 miliwn dim ond am gymorth i baratoi ceisiadau am arian levelling-up—£27 miliwn i gwmnïau ymgynghori mawr, gan gymryd arian prin o'r pwrs cyhoeddus. Pa gamau, felly, mae'r Prif Weinidog yn eu cymryd i sicrhau bod arian trethdalwyr Cymru yn cael ei ddefnyddio mewn ffordd effeithiol? Diolch yn fawr.
Thank you, First Minister. You've reminded us twice this afternoon that the Welsh Government is poorer by £1.3 billion in real terms. Altaf Hussain's previous question, and those from Delyth Jewell and Jane Dodds, demonstrate the impact of these cuts on our services and, more importantly, on people on the ground. It's clear now that Wales is poorer now than if we were still a member of the European Union. The plans of the UK Government of untargeted funding just aren't working. A freedom of information request recently revealed that local government in England had spent at least £27 million just for help preparing bids for levelling-up funding—£27 million for large consultancy companies, taking money that is limited from the public purse. What steps is the First Minister taking to ensure that taxpayers' money in Wales is used effectively? Thank you.
Daeth Paul Davies i’r Gadair.
Paul Davies took the Chair.
Diolch i Rhys ab Owen am y cwestiynau ychwanegol yna. Fel roedd Rhys ab Owen yn dweud, mae'r arian a oedd wedi dod i Gymru yn y gorffennol wedi cael ei dynnu nôl i Lundain, a nawr mae yn nwylo Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig. Ac mae'r ffordd maen nhw'n defnyddio'r arian yna yn gwastraffu arian—arian oedd yma yng Nghymru a dan gyfrifoldeb y Senedd. Beth dwi eisiau gweld gyda'r arian yna yw cael yr arian yna nôl yma yng Nghymru ble gallwn ni ddefnyddio'r arian mewn ffordd effeithiol trwy system o bartneriaeth gyda'r prifysgolion, yr awdurdodau lleol a busnesau preifat hefyd. Mae cynllun gyda ni yn barod, ac rydym ni wedi paratoi am y dyfodol gyda'r bobl yn Ewrop sy'n arbenigwyr yn y maes yma. Ac mae Keir Starmer wedi addo, os bydd Llywodraeth Lafur yn y dyfodol yn San Steffan, y bydd yr arian yna yn dod nôl i Gymru a nôl yn nwylo'r Senedd i'w ddefnyddio.
I thank Rhys ab Owen for those additional questions. As Rhys ab Owen said, this funding, which had come to Wales in the past, has been drawn back to London, and is now being held by the UK Government. The way that they're using that funding is wasteful. It was funding that sat here in Wales and was held by the Senedd. What I want to see is that funding being repatriated to Wales so that we can use it effectively through a system of partnership with universities, local authorities and private business. We do have a plan, and we've prepared for the future with people in Europe who are specialists in this field. Keir Starmer has pledged that if a Labour Government is elected to Westminster in future, that funding will be coming back to Wales and will be back in the hands of the Senedd for use.
First Minister, we would all agree that we would like to see more money, but unlike in Scotland, your party agreed to a comparable model of funding for Wales with a needs-based Barnett bonus. We know that this gives Wales at least 15 per cent extra funding per head, although we know that, at the moment, it sits higher than that. However, for many years, your Government has not been using this uplift in funding for its intended purpose. When the UK Government have invested in education and health, the Welsh Government have chosen to divert that money elsewhere, to things like the deals with Plaid Cymru. I know time has moved on, but, First Minister, in 2016, you said that the revised fiscal framework would, and I quote, ensure
'fair funding for Wales for the long term'.
You said that it
‘protects our budget from...undue risks that could arise’.
But now we see the Government blame the UK Government for honouring that agreement that you wanted, made and signed. In light of that agreement you signed, First Minister, will you now ensure that you work towards ensuring that Barnett additionality and consequential funding goes fully to its intended devolved area of responsibility?
Prif Weinidog, byddem ni i gyd yn cytuno yr hoffem weld mwy o arian, ond yn wahanol i'r Alban, cytunodd eich plaid chi i fodel cymharol o gyllid i Gymru gyda bonws Barnett yn seiliedig ar anghenion. Rydym yn gwybod bod hyn yn rhoi o leiaf 15 y cant o gyllid y pen yn ychwanegol i Gymru, er rydyn ni'n gwybod, ar hyn o bryd, ei fod yn uwch na hynny. Fodd bynnag, ers blynyddoedd lawer, nid yw'ch Llywodraeth chi wedi bod yn defnyddio'r cynnydd hwn mewn cyllid at y diben y'i bwriadwyd. Pan fo Llywodraeth y DU wedi buddsoddi mewn addysg ac iechyd, mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dewis dargyfeirio'r arian hwnnw i rywle arall, i bethau fel y cytundebau gyda Plaid Cymru. Rwy'n gwybod bod amser wedi symud ymlaen, ond, Prif Weinidog, yn 2016, gwnaethoch chi ddweud y byddai'r fframwaith cyllidol diwygiedig, ac rwy'n dyfynnu, yn sicrhau
'cyllid teg i Gymru ar gyfer y tymor hir'.
Gwnaethoch chi ddweud ei fod yn
'gwarchod ein cyllideb rhag...risgiau diangen a allai godi'.
Ond nawr rydyn ni'n gweld y Llywodraeth yn beio Llywodraeth y DU am gadw at y cytundeb hwnnw yr oeddech chi ei eisiau, y gwnaethoch chi ei wneud a'i lofnodi. Yng ngoleuni'r cytundeb hwnnw y gwnaethoch chi ei lofnodi, Prif Weinidog, a wnewch chi yn awr sicrhau eich bod chi'n gweithio tuag at sicrhau bod ychwanegedd Barnett a chyllid canlyniadol yn mynd yn gyfan gwbl i'r maes cyfrifoldeb datganoledig y'i bwriadwyd?
The Welsh Government spends more per head of the population on health, more per head of the population on education, more per head of the population on social services than where his party is in charge elsewhere. The argument is not about the fiscal framework; it’s about the amount of money that goes into the fiscal framework in the first place. That’s where we are short-changed by his Government. I’m proud of the revised fiscal framework; I think it has served Wales well. It needs to be revised to bring the figures in it up to the real terms that we see in managing our budget today. But the problem is not with the fiscal framework at all; it is the fact that the framework itself is starved of the resources that are needed to meet the needs of people in Wales.
Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gwario mwy y pen o'r boblogaeth ar iechyd, mwy y pen o'r boblogaeth ar addysg, mwy y pen o'r boblogaeth ar wasanaethau cymdeithasol na lle mae ei blaid ef wrth y llyw mewn man arall. Nid yw'r ddadl yn ymwneud â'r fframwaith cyllidol; mae'n ymwneud â faint o arian sy'n mynd i'r fframwaith cyllidol yn y lle cyntaf. Dyna lle'r ydyn ni'n cael ein trin yn annheg gan ei lywodraeth. Rwy'n falch o'r fframwaith cyllidol diwygiedig; rwy'n credu ei fod wedi gwasanaethu Cymru'n dda. Mae angen ei ddiwygio i ddod â'r ffigurau ynddo i'r telerau gwirioneddol yr ydyn ni'n eu gweld wrth reoli ein cyllideb heddiw. Ond nid yw'n broblem gyda'r fframwaith cyllidol o gwbl; y ffaith ydyw fod y fframwaith ei hun wedi'i eithriadol o brin o'r adnoddau sydd eu hangen arno i ddiwallu anghenion pobl yng Nghymru.
First Minister, the Independent Commission on the Constitutional Future of Wales, in its report published last week, recommended that the UK Government removes constraints on the Welsh Government’s budget management. Every council in Wales can move money into and out of reserves with no constraints whatsoever and can borrow to its prudential limit. The Welsh Government has neither of those powers. Would you agree with me that this commissioned report is a powerful endorsement of the argument, which the Welsh Government has long been making, that it should be allowed to move money into and out of reserves with no maximum and also to borrow prudentially?
Prif Weinidog, argymhellodd y Comisiwn Annibynnol ar Ddyfodol Cyfansoddiadol Cymru, yn ei adroddiad a gyhoeddwyd yr wythnos diwethaf, fod Llywodraeth y DU yn dileu'r cyfyngiadau ar reoli cyllideb Llywodraeth Cymru. Gall pob cyngor yng Nghymru symud arian i mewn ac allan o gronfeydd wrth gefn heb unrhyw gyfyngiadau o gwbl a gallan nhw fenthyca i'w terfyn darbodus. Nid oes gan Lywodraeth Cymru unrhyw un o'r pwerau hynny. A fyddech chi'n cytuno â mi fod yr adroddiad hwn a gomisiynwyd yn cymeradwyo'n bwerus y ddadl, y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn ei gwneud ers tro, y dylai fod caniatâd iddi symud arian i mewn ac allan o gronfeydd wrth gefn heb unrhyw derfyn a hefyd i fenthyca'n ddarbodus?
The conclusions of the commission echo the conclusions of the Institute for Fiscal Studies of two years ago, where they made exactly these points, and we have made them repeatedly. My colleague the finance Minister has made them repeatedly in the interactions we have with the UK Government. Scotland has been able to renegotiate the borrowing limits, the ability to carry money forward, the size of the reserve. All of those things are stuck where they were when the fiscal framework was agreed, and those figures are now worth 17 per cent less than when they were originally negotiated. All we have asked for is that they are just updated so that their real value is reflected today. I see that in Northern Ireland, they are being offered flexibilities in managing their budget that go even beyond what has been agreed in Scotland. So, it’s okay for Northern Ireland, it’s okay for Scotland, they do it themselves for England; Wales is the only part of the United Kingdom denied the sensible tools that are needed to manage the money that we have in the best possible way, and it’s high time it was put right.
Mae casgliadau'r comisiwn yn adleisio casgliadau'r Sefydliad Astudiaethau Cyllid ddwy flynedd yn ôl, lle gwnaethon nhw'r union bwyntiau hyn, ac rydyn ni wedi'u gwneud dro ar ôl tro. Mae fy nghyd-Aelod, y Gweinidog cyllid, wedi'u gwneud dro ar ôl tro yn y rhyngweithio sydd gennym â Llywodraeth y DU. Mae'r Alban wedi gallu ail-drafod y terfynau benthyca, y gallu i gario arian ymlaen, maint y gronfa wrth gefn. Mae'r holl bethau hynny'n sownd lle'r oedden nhw pan gafodd y cytunwyd ar y fframwaith cyllidol, ac mae'r ffigurau hynny nawr werth 17 y cant yn llai na phan gawson nhw eu trafod yn wreiddiol. Y cyfan yr ydyn ni wedi gofyn amdano yw eu bod yn cael eu diweddaru fel bod eu gwir werth yn cael ei adlewyrchu heddiw. Rwy'n gweld yng Ngogledd Iwerddon eu bod yn cael cynnig hyblygrwydd wrth reoli eu cyllideb sy'n mynd hyd yn oed y tu hwnt i'r hyn y cytunwyd arno yn yr Alban. Felly, mae'n iawn i Ogledd Iwerddon, mae'n iawn i'r Alban, maen nhw'n gwneud hynny eu hunain dros Loegr; Cymru yw'r unig ran o'r Deyrnas Unedig lle mae'r dulliau synhwyrol sydd eu hangen arnom i reoli'r arian sydd gennym ni yn y ffordd orau bosibl yn cael eu gwrthod, ac mae'n hen bryd i hynny gael ei gywiro.
6. Pa gynnydd y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i wneud tuag at gynnig adferiad cyflog teg i feddygon iau? OQ60568
6. What progress has the Welsh Government made towards offering a fair pay restoration to junior doctors? OQ60568
We have committed to the principle of pay restoration for all of our dedicated NHS workforce. Wales and the whole of the UK needs the funding required for restorative pay rises. Our budget this year allows only the offer currently on the table.
Rydyn ni wedi ymrwymo i'r egwyddor o adfer cyflogau ar gyfer ein holl weithlu GIG ymroddedig. Mae ar Gymru a'r DU gyfan angen yr arian sy'n ofynnol ar gyfer codiadau cyflog adferol. Mae ein cyllideb eleni yn caniatáu y cynnig sydd ar y bwrdd ar hyn o bryd yn unig.
Diolch am yr ateb, Brif Weinidog.
Thank you for the answer, First Minister.
Last Monday, as we all know, junior doctors began their 72-hour walkout, and we can expect more to come, as it was confirmed yesterday that strike ballots are now open for consultants and SAS doctors. Plaid Cymru was out on the picket lines with junior doctors last week and the strength of feeling was palpable. Pay erosion of almost a third since 2008 has been compounded by astronomical student debts. I was repeatedly told that it really is becoming less attractive to work and train in Wales because of sub-inflationary pay increases. The pay offer from the Welsh Government is the worst in the UK, and the NHS is facing a recruitment crisis. Before the First Minister asks me to find him more money, my question is this: given the challenges the Government has set out previously, and given the strength of feeling amongst doctors, how does the Government plan to resolve this dispute?
Ddydd Llun diwethaf, fel y gwyddom ni i gyd, dechreuodd meddygon iau eu streic 72 awr, a gallwn ni ddisgwyl mwy i ddod, gan y cadarnhawyd ddoe bod pleidleisiau am streicio ar agor nawr i feddygon ymgynghorol a meddygon arbenigedd ac arbenigol. Roedd Plaid Cymru allan ar y llinellau piced gyda meddygon iau'r wythnos diwethaf ac roedd cryfder y teimlad yn amlwg. Mae erydiad cyflog o bron i draean ers 2008 wedi'i waethygu gan ddyledion enfawr myfyrwyr. Clywais dro ar ôl tro ei bod hi'n dod yn llai deniadol i weithio a hyfforddi yng Nghymru oherwydd codiadau cyflog is na chwyddiant. Y cynnig cyflog gan Lywodraeth Cymru yw'r gwaethaf yn y DU, ac mae'r GIG yn wynebu argyfwng recriwtio. Cyn i'r Prif Weinidog ofyn i mi ddod o hyd i fwy o arian ar ei gyfer, fy nghwestiwn i yw hyn: o ystyried yr heriau y mae'r Llywodraeth wedi'u nodi yn flaenorol, ac o ystyried cryfder y teimladau ymhlith meddygon, sut mae'r Llywodraeth yn bwriadu datrys yr anghydfod hwn?
There's only one way in which disputes are ever resolved, and that's by being around the table. We remain open to discussing with junior doctors and other staff in the NHS a way forward that we could navigate together. That will not be easy, but it wasn't easy when we were negotiating with Agenda for Change staff in Wales earlier this year, where we did reach an agreement. It wasn't easy when we were negotiating with pharmacists, optometrists and dentists in primary care, but we've reached agreement with all of those as well. So, while there are no easy answers—because we absolutely understand the strength of feeling amongst junior doctors, we understand their frustration at seeing the real level of their pay eroded—what we lack is not understanding, nor shared ideas of what needs to be done; what we lack is the money to be able to pursue those ambitions. Being in the same room and continuing to talk is the only way, in the end, in which any dispute of the sort that we saw last week gets settled.
Dim ond un ffordd sydd o ddatrys anghydfod erioed, sef drwy fod o gwmpas y bwrdd. Rydyn ni'n parhau i fod yn agored i drafod gyda meddygon iau a staff eraill yn y GIG ffordd ymlaen y gallen ni ei llywio gyda'n gilydd. Ni fydd hynny'n hawdd, ond doedd hynny ddim yn hawdd pan oedden ni'n trafod â staff Agenda ar gyfer Newid yng Nghymru yn gynharach eleni, lle daethom ni i gytundeb. Nid oedd yn hawdd pan oedden ni'n trafod â fferyllwyr, optometryddion a deintyddion mewn gofal sylfaenol, ond rydyn ni wedi dod i gytundeb â phob un o'r rhain hefyd. Felly, er nad oes atebion hawdd—oherwydd rydyn ni'n deall yn llwyr cryfder y teimladau ymhlith meddygon iau, rydyn ni'n deall eu rhwystredigaeth o weld lefel wirioneddol eu cyflog yn cael ei erydu—nid ydym yn brin o ddealltwriaeth, na syniadau a rennir am yr hyn sydd angen ei wneud; yr hyn yr ydym ni'n brin ohono yw'r arian i allu bwrw ymlaen â'r uchelgeisiau hynny. Bod yn yr un ystafell a pharhau i siarad yw'r unig ffordd, yn y pen draw, y mae unrhyw anghydfod o'r math y gwelsom ni yr wythnos ddiwethaf yn cael ei ddatrys.
7. Pa sylwadau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu gwneud i Lywodraeth y DU ynghylch canllawiau drafft y Swyddfa Gartref a fyddai'n caniatáu i brotestwyr gwrth-erthyliad fynd at fenywod sy'n mynd i glinigau erthylu? OQ60584
7. What representations will the Welsh Government make to the UK Government regarding the Home Office draft guidance that would allow anti-abortion protestors to approach women attending abortion clinics? OQ60584
Women must be able to access healthcare services without interference or challenge from others. Parliament in the UK voted for 150m safe zones at abortion clinics, to prevent women from being subjected to harassment. That is exactly what now needs to happen.
Mae'n rhaid i fenywod allu cael mynediad at wasanaethau gofal iechyd heb ymyrraeth na her gan eraill. Pleidleisiodd y Senedd yn y DU dros barthau diogel o 150m ger clinigau erthylu, er mwyn atal menywod rhag dioddef aflonyddu. Dyna'n union sydd angen digwydd nawr.
Thank you, First Minister. Of course, most people throughout Wales and across the United Kingdom support women's right to choose to take on that very difficult lifelong commitment to having a child. Women who attend these clinics are at their most vulnerable making that difficult decision, and it is quite appalling that we are winding back the clock to enable people to be harassed at that most difficult moment. It is seriously disappointing that this draft guidance has already been given to police forces and local authorities despite this vote in the UK Parliament banning this practice. How on earth can we trust the UK Government to obey the wishes of its own Parliament? Is this is not a prime example of why policing and justice need to be devolved to Wales, as described by the Thomas commission, the Gordon Brown report and the Williams-McAllister report?
Diolch yn fawr, Prif Weinidog. Wrth gwrs, mae'r rhan fwyaf o bobl ledled Cymru ac ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig yn cefnogi hawl menywod i ddewis ymgymryd â'r ymrwymiad gydol oes anodd iawn hwnnw i gael plentyn. Mae menywod sy'n mynd i'r clinigau hyn ar eu hadeg fwyaf agored i niwed yn gwneud y penderfyniad anodd hwnnw, ac mae'n eithaf brawychus ein bod ni'n troi'r cloc yn ôl i alluogi aflonyddu ar bobl ar yr adeg fwyaf anodd honno. Mae'n siomedig iawn bod y canllawiau drafft hyn eisoes wedi'u rhoi i heddluoedd ac awdurdodau lleol er gwaethaf y bleidlais hon yn Senedd y DU yn gwahardd yr arfer hwn. Sut ar y ddaear y gallwn ni ymddiried yn Llywodraeth y DU i ufuddhau i ddymuniadau ei Senedd ei hun? Onid yw hyn yn enghraifft amlwg o pam mae angen datganoli plismona a chyfiawnder i Gymru, fel y cafodd ei ddisgrifio gan gomisiwn Thomas, adroddiad Gordon Brown ac adroddiad Williams-McAllister?
I see that the Home Secretary James Cleverly said that the guidance was drafted before he became Home Secretary, that he has agreed to meet MPs to discuss their concerns with it, and has given a commitment that all those views will be properly considered ahead of publishing the final version of the guidance. I certainly hope that that will be the case. Because you don't need to take my word for it, or even Jenny Rathbone's word for it; Sir Bernard Jenkin wrote, with a Labour colleague, to the Home Secretary saying that
'The framing of the guidance seems to us to very clearly discount the experiences and reports of women accessing abortion care, and instruct them that they should not feel harassed, alarmed, distressed, or influenced by behaviour which…is having precisely that impact.'
They said that the draft guidance
'would do nothing to address the ongoing issue of anti-abortion harassment outside clinics'.
I think that is clearly a view of Members of Parliament on both sides of the House of Commons; it's certainly my view. I agree with what the Member said that if these decisions were in the hands of this Senedd, we would have acted differently and acted already to put an end to that harassment. It's not too late for the UK Government to listen to Sir Bernard Jenkin and others, and I really hope that they do.
Rwy'n gweld i'r Ysgrifennydd Cartref James Cleverly ddweud bod y canllawiau wedi'u drafftio cyn iddo ddod yn Ysgrifennydd Cartref, ei fod wedi cytuno i gwrdd ag Aelodau Seneddol i drafod eu pryderon amdano, ac wedi rhoi ymrwymiad y bydd yr holl safbwyntiau hynny'n cael eu hystyried yn briodol cyn cyhoeddi fersiwn derfynol y canllawiau. Rydw i wir yn gobeithio mai dyna fydd yn digwydd. Oherwydd nid oes angen i chi gymryd fy ngair i amdano, na hyd yn oed gair Jenny Rathbone amdano; ysgrifennodd Syr Bernard Jenkin, gyda chydweithiwr Llafur, at yr Ysgrifennydd Cartref yn dweud
'Mae'n ymddangos bod ffurf y canllawiau yn amlwg iawn yn diystyru profiadau ac adroddiadau menywod sy'n cael mynediad at ofal erthylu, a'u cyfarwyddo na ddylen nhw deimlo eu bod yn cael eu haflonyddu, eu dychryn, eu brawychu na bod ymddygiad yn dylanwadu arnyn nhw sy'n...cael yr union effaith honno.1'
Dywedon nhw na fyddai'r canllawiau drafft
'yn gwneud dim byd i ymdrin â'r mater parhaus o aflonyddu gwrth-erthyliad y tu allan i glinigau'.
Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n amlwg yn farn Aelodau Seneddol ar ddwy ochr Tŷ'r Cyffredin; yn sicr, dyma yw fy marn i. Rwy'n cytuno â'r hyn y dywedodd yr Aelod, pe bai'r penderfyniadau hyn yn nwylo'r Senedd hon, byddem ni wedi gweithredu'n wahanol ac wedi gweithredu eisoes i roi diwedd ar yr aflonyddu hwnnw. Nid yw'n rhy hwyr i Lywodraeth y DU wrando ar Syr Bernard Jenkin ac eraill, ac rwy'n mawr obeithio y byddan nhw'n gwneud hynny.
Ac yn olaf, cwestiwn 8, Cefin Campbell.
And finally, question 8, Cefin Campbell.
8. A wnaiff y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad am gyllid Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol yng Nghanolbarth a Gorllewin Cymru? OQ60583
8. Will the First Minister make a statement on Welsh Government funding for local authorities in Mid and West Wales? OQ60583
Diolch i Cefin Campbell am y cwestiwn. Yn ogystal â grantiau penodol, bydd cynghorau yn y rhanbarth yn cael dros £935 miliwn drwy’r setliad llywodraeth leol ar gyfer 2024-25.
I thank Cefin Campbell for the question. In addition to specific grants, councils in this region will receive funding of over £935 million through the 2024-25 local government settlement.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Ddydd Gwener diwethaf, ces i gyfarfod gydag arweinwyr cynghorau sir yn y rhanbarth dwi'n ei gynrychioli. Ac mae'n wir i ddweud bod yr hwyliau yn ddigalon iawn, fel y byddech chi'n gallu disgwyl. Ond un o'r materion mwyaf gofidus oedd wedi cael ei godi gyda fi oedd y setliad cyflog athrawon, a'r ffordd y disgwylir, nawr, i awdurdodau lleol dalu am hyn. Achos pan gytunwyd ar gynnig tâl i athrawon nôl yn Chwefror 2023, fe gytunodd y Llywodraeth i dalu'r costau ychwanegol am y flwyddyn honno, ond ni chafwyd unrhyw ymrwymiad i barhau â'r taliadau cyflog am y blynyddoedd dilynol. Felly, mae'r cyfrifoldeb am dalu'r cyflogau hyn, felly, wedi cael ei basio i awdurdodau lleol, ac mae'r WLGA wedi gwneud achos cryf iawn i adfer hyn, ac maen nhw'n amcangyfrif cost o tua £21 miliwn y flwyddyn. Felly, heb yr arian hwn, mae awdurdodau lleol yn wynebu twll du ariannol, ac yn gorfod gwneud toriadau mewn mannau eraill sy'n mynd i effeithio'n uniongyrchol ar addysg dysgwyr. Felly, a gaf ofyn i'r Prif Weinidog: a ydych chi'n barod i adfer y cyllid blynyddol yma ar gyfer y setliad cyflog i athrawon?
Thank you very much. Last Friday, I had a meeting with leaders of county councils in the region that I represent. And it's true to say that the atmosphere was quite downhearted, as you'd expect. But one of the most worrying aspects that was raised with me was the teachers' pay settlement, and the way that local authorities are now expected to pay for this. Because when a pay deal was agreed for teachers back in February 2023, the Welsh Government agreed to pay the additional costs for that year, but no commitment was made to continue to cover those costs for the following years. So, the responsibility for paying these salaries has been passed on to local authorities, and the Welsh Local Government Association has made a very strong case to restore this, and they estimate the cost as being around £21 million per annum. So, without this funding, local authorities face a financial black hole, and are having to make cuts elsewhere that will have a direct impact on the education of learners. So, can I ask the First Minister whether you would restore this annual funding for the teachers' pay settlement?
Wel, Llywydd, dwi'n clywed y pwyntiau y mae'r Aelod yn eu gwneud, ac fel y dywedais i, mae pethau anodd yn wynebu awdurdodau lleol. Ond jest i fod yn glir, dydyn ni ddim wedi pasio'r cyfrifoldeb i'r awdurdodau lleol i gyflogi athrawon—nhw sydd yn gyfrifol am wneud hynny. Nhw sydd yn yr ystafell pan fyddan nhw'n cytuno ar lefel y cyflogau i'r athrawon, nid ni. Rŷn ni wedi'u helpu nhw yn y gorffennol. Mae'n anoddach inni wneud hynny nawr, ond beth dwi'n siarad am yw pethau y mae'r awdurdodau lleol yn cytuno, a nawr mae e lan iddyn nhw i dalu am beth maen nhw wedi cytuno i'w wneud.
Well, Llywydd, I hear the points that the Member makes, and, as I said, there are difficult decisions facing local authorities. But just to be clear, we haven't passed on the responsibility to local authorities to pay and employ teachers—they are responsible for doing that. They are in the room when they agree on the level of salaries for teachers, not us. We have helped them in the past. It's harder for us to do that now, but what we're talking about here is things that the local authorities have agreed, and now it's down to them to pay for what they have agreed to do.
Diolch i'r Prif Weinidog.
I thank the First Minister.
Fe symudwn ni ymlaen nawr i eitem 2 ar ein hagenda, sef y datganiad a chyhoeddiad busnes. A dwi'n galw ar y Trefnydd i wneud y datganiad hynny—Lesley Griffiths.
We'll move on now to item 2 on our agenda, which is the business statement and announcement. And I call on the Trefnydd to make that statement—Lesley Griffiths.
Thank you, temporary Presiding Officer. There are three changes to this week's Plenary business. A statement on Tata Steel has been added to today's agenda. As a result, the statement on the economy of the Heads of the Valleys has been postponed. Also withdrawn is a statement on the renewal of the memorandum of understanding with the World Health Organization Europe. This now will be issued as a written statement. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers available to Members electronically.
Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd dros dro. Mae tri newid i fusnes y Cyfarfod Llawn yr wythnos hon. Mae datganiad ar Tata Steel wedi'i ychwanegu at agenda heddiw. O ganlyniad, mae'r datganiad ar economi Blaenau'r Cymoedd wedi'i ohirio. Hefyd wedi'i dynnu nôl y mae datganiad ar adnewyddu'r memorandwm cyd-ddealltwriaeth â Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd Ewrop. Bydd hyn nawr yn cael ei gyhoeddi fel datganiad ysgrifenedig. Mae'r busnes drafft am y tair wythnos nesaf wedi'i nodi ar y cyhoeddiad a'r datganiad busnes, sydd i'w weld ymhlith papurau'r cyfarfod sydd ar gael i'r Aelodau yn electronig.
I would like to call for a statement, please, from the Deputy Minister for Climate Change regarding the blue badge application process. Sadly, the current application process is not working efficiently, and it's particularly difficult for those with a lifelong diagnosis. This has an impact on quality of life for many people in Wales, including many in my constituency. Currently, many people with lifelong conditions are experiencing difficulty reapplying for blue badges, with applications having to be submitted 12 weeks in advance, and the process fraught with delay. This sometimes leads to, as in the case of one constituent, a window in which they are without a blue badge.
Having met late last year with STAND North Wales, I was informed that we are also seeing an increase in people with severely limited mobility, and other comorbidities, having their application turned down. For many, the thought of having to reapply and complete the paperwork so frequently is stressful. Also, people require assistance in the application process, and many have lost faith in the system due to a lack of consistency.
The Deputy Minister has confirmed previously that there is no statutory appeals process, but I believe there should be at least a re-evaluation of this. I would like the Deputy Minister to address the concerns that have been raised, including by the more than 1,500 people who have signed a petition on whether the Welsh Government are committed to reviewing the application process and criteria for those needing a blue badge.
Can the Deputy Minister look into the possibility of introducing a lifelong blue badge for those who have a lifelong diagnosis, which would take the burden off a lot of people in Wales who live with a disability, and remove a lot of unnecessary administrative work? Thank you.
Hoffwn alw am ddatganiad, os gwelwch yn dda, gan y Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd ynghylch y broses ymgeisio am fathodynnau glas. Yn anffodus, nid yw'r broses ymgeisio bresennol yn gweithio'n effeithlon, ac mae'n arbennig o anodd i'r rhai sydd â diagnosis gydol oes. Mae hyn yn cael effaith ar ansawdd bywyd llawer o bobl yng Nghymru, gan gynnwys llawer yn fy etholaeth i. Ar hyn o bryd, mae llawer o bobl â chyflyrau gydol oes yn ei chael hi'n anodd ailymgeisio am fathodynnau glas, a cheisiadau yn gorfod cael eu cyflwyno 12 wythnos ymlaen llaw, a'r broses yn llawn oedi. Mae hyn weithiau'n arwain at, fel yn achos un etholwr, gyfnod pan nad oes ganddyn nhw fathodyn glas.
Ar ôl cyfarfod ddiwedd y llynedd gyda STAND Gogledd Cymru, fe gefais wybod ein bod ni hefyd yn gweld mwy o bobl â symudedd cyfyngedig iawn, a chydafiacheddau eraill, yn cael eu ceisiadau wedi'u gwrthod. I lawer, mae'r syniad o orfod ailymgeisio a llenwi'r gwaith papur mor aml yn achosi straen. Hefyd, mae angen cymorth ar bobl yn y broses ymgeisio, ac mae llawer wedi colli ffydd yn y system oherwydd diffyg cysondeb.
Mae'r Dirprwy Weinidog wedi cadarnhau yn flaenorol nad oes proses apelio statudol, ond rwy'n credu y dylai fod ail-werthusiad o leiaf o hyn. Hoffwn i'r Dirprwy Weinidog ymdrin â'r pryderon sydd wedi'u codi, gan gynnwys gan y mwy na 1,500 o bobl sydd wedi llofnodi deiseb ynghylch a yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ymrwymo i adolygu'r broses ymgeisio a'r meini prawf ar gyfer y rhai sydd angen bathodyn glas.
A all y Dirprwy Weinidog ystyried y posibilrwydd o gyflwyno bathodyn glas gydol oes i'r rhai sydd â diagnosis gydol oes, a fyddai'n tynnu'r baich oddi ar lawer o bobl yng Nghymru sy'n byw ag anabledd, ac yn dileu llawer o waith gweinyddol diangen? Diolch.
Thank you. Well, it is important that people who absolutely need a blue badge are able to access it. I am very well aware of the petition that you refer to, and, obviously, when that petition is closed, and the Petitions Committee has reviewed it and decided if they want it to be brought forward for a debate or not, that will be the time that the Deputy Minister for Climate Change would make a statement. You obviously referred to something specifically now, and I think it might be better—the Deputy Minister for Climate Change is in his place, and has heard you—if you write to the Deputy Minister, and he can respond directly to you.
Diolch. Wel, mae'n bwysig bod pobl y mae angen bathodyn glas arnyn nhw'n gallu cael gafael arno. Rwy'n ymwybodol iawn o'r ddeiseb yr ydych chi'n cyfeirio ati, ac, yn amlwg, pan fydd y ddeiseb honno ar gau, ac mae'r Pwyllgor Deisebau wedi ei hadolygu ac wedi penderfynu a ydyn nhw eisiau iddi gael ei chyflwyno ar gyfer dadl ai peidio, dyna'r amser y byddai'r Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd yn gwneud datganiad. Yn amlwg, rydych chi wedi cyfeirio at rywbeth penodol nawr, ac rwy'n credu y gallai fod yn well—mae'r Dirprwy Weinidog Newid Hinsawdd yn ei le, ac wedi'ch clywed chi—os gwnewch chi ysgrifennu at y Dirprwy Weinidog, a gall ef ymateb yn uniongyrchol atoch chi.
Gawn ni ddatganiad gennych chi fel y Gweinidog materion gwledig yn ymateb i'r eitem a ddarlledwyd ar y rhaglen Ffermio ar S4C neithiwr? Mi oedd Wyn ac Enid Davies o Gapel Isaac yn sir Gaerfyrddin yn esbonio sut y maen nhw wedi gorfod difa 180 o wartheg yn y tair blynedd ddiwethaf oherwydd TB, er bod ganddyn nhw fuches gaeedig, wrth gwrs, a heb fod wedi bod yn dod ag anifeiliaid ymlaen i'r fferm. Roedd hi'n ddirdynnol gweld y tor calon llwyr wrth iddyn nhw orfod difa anifeiliaid ar fuarth y fferm. Roedden nhw yn eu dagrau; roedd nifer ohonon ni, dwi'n siŵr, wrth wylio'r eitem yn ein dagrau hefyd. A beth sy'n rhaid inni ei gofio yw bod Wyn ac Enid Davies ddim ond yn un teulu o gannoedd lawer o deuluoedd sydd wedi gorfod profi yr erchyllter yna.
A wnewch chi, felly, adolygu y rheolau sy'n gorfodi pobl fel Wyn ac Enid i ddifa eu stoc ar fuarth y fferm, oherwydd mae hynny'n amlwg yn dwysáu yr effaith sylweddol y mae'n ei gael ar iechyd meddwl y teuluoedd rheini sy'n gorfod mynd trwy'r fath artaith? A wnewch chi hefyd adolygu methiant eich Llywodraeth chi i daclo TB mewn bywyd gwyllt? A wnewch chi hefyd roi esboniad pam y gwrthodwyd rhoi unrhyw un o'r Llywodraeth ymlaen i ymateb i'r eitem yna neithiwr—dim hyd yn oed y prif swyddog milfeddygol? Mae hynny yn codi cwestiynau ynglŷn ag atebolrwydd, ac yn sicr yn rhwbio halen yn y briw i'r rheini sydd wedi bod trwy'r profiad uffernol yma. Felly, datganiad, os cawn ni, yn esbonio sut nawr, yn wyneb yr eitem yna, ydych chi'n mynd i adolygu eich polisïau presennol, oherwydd mae'n rhaid ichi dderbyn bod y sefyllfa fel y mae hi, ac fel yr amlygwyd ar Ffermio neithiwr, nid yn unig yn anghynaladwy ond yn gwbl, gwbl annerbyniol.
May we have a statement from you as the Minister for rural affairs responding to the item that was broadcast on the programme Ffermio on S4C last night? Wyn and Enid Davies from Capel Isaac in Carmarthenshire explained how they have had to cull 180 cattle in the past three years due to TB, although they have a closed herd, of course, and they hadn't been bringing animals onto the farm. It was very powerful to see their heartbreak as they had to cull and slaughter the animals on the farm. They were in tears; I'm sure that many of us who watched the programme were also in tears. And what we have to remember is that Wyn and Enid Davies are just one family amongst hundreds of families who have had to experience this horrific situation.
So, will you review the rules that force people such as Wyn and Enid to cull their stock on their farm, because that obviously intensifies the significant impact on the mental health of those families who do have to go through such a torturous process? Will you also review your Government's failure to tackle TB in wildlife? Will you also explain why the Government refused to put any Government spokespeople forward to contribute to that item last night—not even the chief veterinary officer? That asks questions about accountability, and certainly rubs salt in the wounds of those who have had to face this hellish situation. So, a statement, please, explaining how now, in the face of that item, will you review your current policies, because you do have to accept that the situation as it currently stands, and as was drawn to our attention on Ffermio last night, isn't just unsustainable but is totally, totally unacceptable.
Well, I don't underestimate the distress of a TB breakdown on any farmer or their family, and I absolutely recognise that. You'll be very well aware that I make an annual statement on TB eradication and the delivery plan. I made a statement, I think it was in March last year, so we'll be coming up to the annual statement. I also really think it's important to stress that we are seeing a decline in the number of new herds of TB, so we are making significant progress. There is also going to be a technical advisory group, and one of the things I'm going to ask that group to look at as a matter of urgency is something that the farmers have requested I do, in relation to the slaughter of in-calf cattle on farms. I think it's very important that we work with the industry, because I think that is a particularly stressful time, and, obviously, that was highlighted in the programme last night.
Wel, nid wyf i'n bychanu gofid achosion o TB ar unrhyw ffermwr neu'i deulu, ac rwy'n cydnabod hynny'n llwyr. Byddwch chi'n ymwybodol iawn fy mod i'n gwneud datganiad blynyddol ar ddileu TB a'r cynllun cyflawni. Fe wnes i ddatganiad, ym mis Mawrth y llynedd, rwy'n credu, felly byddwn ni'n dod yn agos at y datganiad blynyddol. Rwyf hefyd yn credu ei bod yn bwysig pwysleisio ein bod ni'n gweld gostyngiad yn nifer y buchesi newydd o TB, felly rydyn ni'n gwneud cynnydd sylweddol. Bydd grŵp cynghori technegol hefyd, ac un o'r pethau yr wyf i'n mynd i ofyn i'r grŵp hwnnw ei ystyried ar frys yw rhywbeth y mae'r ffermwyr wedi gofyn i mi ei wneud, o ran lladd gwartheg cyflo ar ffermydd. Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig iawn ein bod ni'n gweithio gyda'r diwydiant, oherwydd rwy'n credu bod hwnnw'n gyfnod arbennig o straen, ac, yn amlwg, cafodd hyn ei amlygu yn y rhaglen neithiwr.
Three things. One is: there is a Holocaust memorial book of commitment upstairs in the Neuadd, which we can all sign in advance of Saturday's Holocaust Memorial Day, which of course is when the Russians liberated Auschwitz. We had a wonderful, wonderful testimony from Eva Clarke today. It was fantastic that the Minister for Social Justice was there to renew her commitment and the Government's commitment to combating antisemitism and making sure that we all continue to remember the Holocaust, even though most of those who were there have sadly passed away.
Secondly, this week is Cervical Cancer Prevention Week. I know Huw Irranca-Davies—my colleague, who normally sits next to me—made a wonderful reminder to us all about the collaboration between schools and the health service, to ensure that young people are taking up the HPV vaccine. I had a meeting with the head of Jo's Cervical Cancer Trust the other week, and our rates are still not high enough to ensure that we eliminate cervical cancer. I note that England has set a target of 2040 to eliminate cervical cancer, through expanding the vaccine programme. My question is when the Welsh Government might be in a position to set a date for our elimination of cervical cancer, because I hope it will be more ambitious than that of the UK Government.
Thirdly, earlier this month a national patient safety alert was sent out by NHS England, regarding a world shortage in the supply of the drug Ozempic, which used to be and still is treatment for those with diabetes. So much of the world's supply has now been diverted to be used as supposedly a miracle weight-loss drug. What assessment has the Welsh Government made of this shortage, as well as the risk that women are putting themselves under by using this drug for weight loss without any medical supervision? And how does the Government intend to ensure that Ozempic gets to those who truly need it?
Tri pheth. Un yw: mae llyfr coffa o ymgyflwyniad yr Holocost i fyny'r grisiau yn y Neuadd, y gallwn ni i gyd ei lofnodi cyn Diwrnod Cofio'r Holocost ddydd Sadwrn, sef wrth gwrs pan ryddhaodd y Rwsiaid Auschwitz. Cawsom dystiolaeth wych gan Eva Clarke heddiw. Roedd yn wych bod y Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol yno i adnewyddu ei hymrwymiad ac ymrwymiad y Llywodraeth i frwydro yn erbyn gwrthsemitiaeth a sicrhau ein bod ni i gyd yn parhau i gofio'r Holocost, er bod y rhan fwyaf o'r rhai a oedd yno yn anffodus wedi marw.
Yn ail, mae'r wythnos hon yn Wythnos Atal Canser Serfigol. Rwy'n gwybod bod Huw Irranca-Davies—fy nghyd-Aelod, sydd fel arfer yn eistedd wrth fy ochr i—wedi ein hatgoffa ni i gyd yn wych am y cydweithio rhwng ysgolion a'r gwasanaeth iechyd, er mwyn sicrhau bod pobl ifanc yn manteisio ar y brechlyn HPV. Cefais i gyfarfod gyda phennaeth Ymddiriedolaeth Canser Serfigol Jo yr wythnos o'r blaen, ac nid yw'n cyfraddau ni'n ddigon uchel eto i sicrhau ein bod ni'n dileu canser serfigol. Rwy'n sylwi bod Lloegr wedi gosod targed o 2040 i ddileu canser serfigol, drwy ehangu'r rhaglen frechu. Fy nghwestiwn i yw pryd allai Llywodraeth Cymru fod mewn sefyllfa i bennu dyddiad ar gyfer dileu canser serfigol, oherwydd rwy'n gobeithio y bydd yn fwy uchelgeisiol na Llywodraeth y DU.
Yn drydydd, yn gynharach y mis hwn cafodd rhybudd diogelwch cleifion cenedlaethol ei anfon gan GIG Lloegr, ynghylch prinder byd eang yng nghyflenwad y cyffur Ozempic, a arferai fod yn driniaeth i'r rhai â diabetes ac sydd yn dal yn cael ei ddefnyddio. Mae cymaint o gyflenwad y byd nawr wedi cael ei ddargyfeirio i'w ddefnyddio fel cyffur colli pwysau gwyrthiol. Pa asesiad y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i wneud o'r prinder hwn, yn ogystal â'r risg y mae menywod yn ei hwynebu wrth ddefnyddio'r cyffur hwn ar gyfer colli pwysau heb unrhyw oruchwyliaeth feddygol? A sut mae'r Llywodraeth yn bwriadu sicrhau bod Ozempic yn cyrraedd y rhai sydd wir ei angen?
Thank you. And thank you for reminding us that Saturday is the Holocaust Memorial Day and that the book is available for all Members to sign in the Neuadd.
With regard to improving cervical cancer outcomes, I know the Welsh Government is committed—. Due to the existence of the vaccination that you referred to, it is theoretically possible to largely eradicate cervical cancer over time. I'm not aware of when the Welsh Government is going to bring a target in, but I will certainly ask the Minister if that is something that she's considered, and perhaps she could write to you, if that is the case.
In relation to Ozempic, I think you raise a really important point. There are people, unfortunately, that require it for type 2 diabetes that have now not been able to access it, because it is being advertised and being put online, for instance, and off-label for people to use as a weight-loss drug. I know the Minister for Health and Social Services works closely with the UK Government, who, of course, do have a responsibility for maintaining the supply of medicines here in the UK. But it is really important that the Minister continues to work with them, work with NHS Wales, work with general practitioners, work with pharmacists to make sure that patients who do require it continue to receive it as it's needed. If any patient or any constituent is having difficulty in obtaining supplies of Ozempic, they really should discuss this as a matter of urgency with their doctor.
Diolch. A diolch am ein hatgoffa ni mai Dydd Sadwrn yw Diwrnod Cofio'r Holocost a bod y llyfr ar gael i bob Aelodau ei lofnodi yn y Neuadd.
O ran gwella canlyniadau canser serfigol, rwy'n gwybod bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ymrwymo—. Oherwydd bodolaeth y brechiad y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio ato, mae'n ddamcaniaethol bosibl dileu canser serfigol i raddau helaeth dros amser. Nid wyf i'n ymwybodol o bryd y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn mynd i gyflwyno targed, ond yn sicr, fe wnaf i ofyn i'r Gweinidog a yw hynny'n rhywbeth y mae hi wedi'i ystyried, ac efallai y gallai hi ysgrifennu atoch chi, os mai dyna yw'r sefyllfa.
O ran Ozempic, rwy'n credu eich bod chi'n codi pwynt pwysig iawn. Mae yna bobl, yn anffodus, y mae ei angen arnyn nhw ar gyfer diabetes math 2 nad ydyn nhw nawr wedi gallu cael gafael arno, oherwydd ei fod yn cael ei hysbysebu a'i roi ar-lein, er enghraifft, ac heb label i bobl ei ddefnyddio fel cyffur colli pwysau. Rwy'n gwybod bod y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol yn gweithio'n agos gyda Llywodraeth y DU, sydd, wrth gwrs, â chyfrifoldeb dros gynnal y cyflenwad o feddyginiaethau yma yn y DU. Ond mae'n bwysig iawn bod y Gweinidog yn parhau i weithio gyda nhw, i weithio gyda GIG Cymru, i weithio gyda meddygon teulu, i weithio gyda fferyllwyr i sicrhau bod cleifion y mae ei angen arnyn nhw'n parhau i'w gael yn ôl yr angen. Os yw unrhyw glaf neu unrhyw etholwr yn cael trafferth cael cyflenwadau o Ozempic, dylai drafod hyn ar frys gyda'i feddyg.
Trefnydd, could I request a statement from yourself, as the Minister for rural affairs, on an update on Government actions taken on food policy? We're coming up to eight months since the Food (Wales) Bill fell, and I, alongside sector stakeholders, are eagerly awaiting an update on the commitments made to the Senedd last May. Trefnydd, the Senedd were told that a cross-portfolio document for stakeholders would be published periodically to highlight joined-up Government food policies currently in motion and how they fit with well-being goals. When can we expect the first release of this document? Will we also see well-being indicators and milestones published, as recommended by the Economic, Trade and Rural Affairs Committee? And further commitments also included offering support to join up Welsh food producers with community-level action groups and the public sector. An update on the current support on offer and future initiatives would be welcomed by the food sector, as long-term planning is critical for the food sector. Trefnydd, I think we all agree the food sector in Wales is vital. Let's not merely acknowledge its importance, let's champion it, nurture it and ensure it thrives. I know that stakeholders across Wales will welcome that update.
Trefnydd, a gaf i ofyn am ddatganiad gennych chi, fel y Gweinidog dros faterion gwledig, ar yr wybodaeth ddiweddaraf ar y camau y mae Llywodraeth wedi'u cymryd ar bolisi bwyd? Rydyn ni'n dod yn agos at wyth mis ers i Fil Bwyd (Cymru) fethu, ac rydw i, ochr yn ochr â rhanddeiliaid y sector, yn aros yn eiddgar am yr wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am yr ymrwymiadau a gafodd eu gwneud i'r Senedd fis Mai diwethaf. Trefnydd, cafodd y Senedd wybod y byddai dogfen drawsbortffolio ar gyfer rhanddeiliaid yn cael ei chyhoeddi o bryd i'w gilydd i dynnu sylw at bolisïau bwyd cydgysylltiedig y Llywodraeth sydd ar waith ar hyn o bryd a sut maen nhw'n cyd-fynd â nodau llesiant. Pryd allwn ni ddisgwyl cyhoeddi'r ddogfen hon am y tro cyntaf? A fyddwn ni hefyd yn gweld dangosyddion llesiant a cherrig milltir yn cael eu cyhoeddi, fel yr argymhellwyd gan Bwyllgor yr Economi, Masnach a Materion Gwledig? Ac roedd ymrwymiadau eraill hefyd yn cynnwys cynnig cymorth i uno cynhyrchwyr bwyd o Gymru â grwpiau gweithredu lefel gymunedol a'r sector cyhoeddus. Byddai'r sector bwyd yn croesawu'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am y cymorth presennol sydd ar gael a mentrau'r dyfodol, gan fod cynllunio tymor hir yn hanfodol i'r sector bwyd. Trefnydd, rwy'n credu ein bod ni i gyd yn cytuno bod y sector bwyd yng Nghymru yn hanfodol. Gadewch i ni nid yn unig gydnabod ei bwysigrwydd, gadewch i ni ei hyrwyddo, ei feithrin a sicrhau ei fod yn ffynnu. Rwy'n gwybod y bydd rhanddeiliaid ledled Cymru yn croesawu'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf honno.
Thank you very much. Well, Peter Fox will know from my meetings with him that we are nearly ready to publish the cross-portfolio document to which he refers. I am due to have a meeting with the Minister for Social Justice—I think it's next week now—to finalise the document, and I do hope then to be able to publish it. I think you make a really important point and, again, as you know from our discussions, the future generations commissioner—this is something he is particularly interested in. And I know he's speaking at an event, and I think the Minister for Finance and Local Government is as well, in, actually, my constituency later this month, where public services boards will be having a look at this. Because I think there is so much good work going on right across Wales that we do need to draw it together, so it's not so spread out and scattergun, as, unfortunately, it does seem to be at the moment.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Wel, bydd Peter Fox yn gwybod o fy nghyfarfodydd gydag ef ein bod ni bron yn barod i gyhoeddi'r ddogfen drawsbortffolio y mae'n cyfeirio ati. Rwyf i fod i gael cyfarfod gyda'r Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol—rwy'n credu mai'r wythnos nesaf ydyw nawr—i gwblhau'r ddogfen, ac rwy'n gobeithio wedyn gallu ei chyhoeddi. Rwy'n credu eich bod chi'n gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn ac, unwaith eto, fel y gwyddoch chi o'n trafodaethau, y comisiynydd cenedlaethau'r dyfodol—mae hyn yn rhywbeth y mae ganddo ddiddordeb arbennig ynddo. Ac rwy'n gwybod ei fod yn siarad mewn digwyddiad, ac rwy'n credu bod y Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol hefyd, yn fy etholaeth i a dweud y gwir, yn ddiweddarach y mis hwn, lle bydd byrddau gwasanaethau cyhoeddus yn ystyried hyn. Oherwydd rwy'n credu bod cymaint o waith da yn digwydd ledled Cymru fel bod angen i ni ddod â hwn at ei gilydd, fel nad yw mor ar led a gwasgaredig, oherwydd, yn anffodus, mae'n ymddangos ei fod felly ar hyn o bryd.
I know that the Government produces statements it seems every time there's a storm. It might be helpful, given that we've endured another week of significant storms, if, perhaps on an annual basis, a statement regarding the storm impact and storm resilience is produced by the Government. And, Minister, would you take this opportunity to join me in thanking all of those road safety officers and emergency workers who keep roads, railways and communities safe during storms, such as that which we endured over the weekend, which saw the A5 closed for very good reasons?
Rwy'n gwybod ei bod yn ymddangos bod y Llywodraeth yn cynhyrchu datganiadau bob tro y mae yna storm. Efallai y byddai'n ddefnyddiol, o gofio ein bod ni wedi dioddef wythnos arall o stormydd sylweddol, pe byddai'r Llywodraeth, efallai, yn llunio datganiad, yn flynyddol, ynghylch effaith stormydd a chadernid rhag stormydd. A Gweinidog, a wnewch chi fanteisio ar y cyfle hwn i ymuno â mi i ddiolch i'r holl swyddogion diogelwch ffyrdd a gweithwyr brys sy'n cadw'r ffyrdd, rheilffyrdd a chymunedau'n ddiogel yn ystod stormydd, fel yr un y gwnaethom ei dioddef dros y penwythnos, a achosodd i'r A5 gau am resymau da iawn?
Thank you. I think Ken Skates makes a very important point. We've already had two storms this week alone, and we are very grateful as a Government to our emergency services, to Natural Resources Wales, to local authorities and many others who absolutely worked tirelessly during these storms and have just done it over the weekend to make sure that they minimise the impacts on communities, where possible.
Diolch. Rwy'n credu bod Ken Skates yn gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn. Rydyn ni eisoes wedi cael dwy storm dim ond yr wythnos hon, ac rydyn ni'n ddiolchgar iawn fel Llywodraeth i'n gwasanaethau brys, i Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, i awdurdodau lleol a llawer o rai eraill a weithiodd yn gwbl ddiflino yn ystod y stormydd hyn ac sydd newydd wneud hynny dros y penwythnos i sicrhau eu bod yn lleihau'r effeithiau ar gymunedau, lle bo hynny'n bosibl.
Good afternoon, Trefnydd. I'd like to ask for two statements, if I may, please. One is in relation to a constituent of mine, Fionna Ashman, who operates a small, family-run dog rescue sanctuary, called Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary in sir Gâr, in Carmarthenshire. Last year alone, she saw 43 flood events on her property forcing—wait for it—hazardous boat evacuations of vulnerable dogs. That must pull the heart strings, I'm sure. When I previously wrote to the Minister seeking support to protect the sanctuary, I was informed that NRW, as the risk management authority, has no statutory duty to mitigate flooding. So, I wondered if you might be able to pursue this in order to clarify NRW's responsibility and empower my constituents, particularly those who look after our animals, to push for the actions needed.
Secondly, I would like to request a statement from the Minister for Economy with regard to Nidec Control Techniques and their plans to cut jobs in Newtown. Last Friday, Control Techniques announced that it was planning cut 98 jobs at its factory in Newtown due to ongoing supply chain issues, and to move production probably towards Asia and North America. With Control Techniques deeply woven, as many of us know, into the fabric of the area, this is a really devastating blow. So, I would welcome a statement from the Minister for Economy about how the Welsh Government can support those employees and work with Control Techniques. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Prynhawn da, Trefnydd. Hoffwn i ofyn am ddau ddatganiad, os caf i, os gwelwch yn dda. Mae un am etholwr i mi, Fionna Ashman, sy'n gweithredu lloches fach achub cŵn o'r enw Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary, sy'n cael ei redeg gan y teulu, yn sir Gâr, yn sir Gaerfyrddin. Dim ond y llynedd, cafodd 43 o ddigwyddiadau llifogydd yn ei heiddo gan orfodi—arhoswch amdani—achub cŵn sy'n agored i niwed mewn cychod dan amodau peryglus. Rhaid bod hynny'n cyffwrdd â'r galon, rwy'n siŵr. Pan ysgrifennais i'n flaenorol at y Gweinidog yn gofyn am gymorth i ddiogelu'r lloches, cefais wybod nad oes gan Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, fel yr awdurdod rheoli risg, ddyletswydd statudol i liniaru llifogydd. Felly, tybed a allech chi fynd ar drywydd hyn er mwyn egluro cyfrifoldeb Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru a grymuso fy etholwyr, yn enwedig y rhai sy'n gofalu am ein hanifeiliaid, i bwyso am y camau gweithredu sydd eu hangen arnyn nhw.
Yn ail, hoffwn i ofyn am ddatganiad gan Weinidog yr Economi ar Nidec Control Techniques a'u cynlluniau i dorri swyddi yn y Drenewydd. Ddydd Gwener diwethaf, cyhoeddodd Control Techniques ei fod yn bwriadu torri 98 o swyddi yn ei ffatri yn y Drenewydd oherwydd problemau parhaus yn ymwneud â'r gadwyn gyflenwi, a symud cynhyrchu yn ôl pob tebyg tuag at Asia a Gogledd America. Gan fod Control Techniques yn rhan ddofn, fel y mae llawer ohonon ni'n gwybod, o wead yr ardal, mae hon yn ergyd ddinistriol iawn. Felly, byddwn i'n croesawu datganiad gan Weinidog yr Economi ynghylch sut y gall Llywodraeth Cymru gefnogi'r gweithwyr hynny a gweithio gyda Control Techniques. Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Thank you. Well, in relation to your first question, I'll certainly be happy to speak to the Minister for Climate Change. I am aware of the difficulties that have been faced at Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary, and I'm conscious that the Minister did write to you—I think it was last month—around the very difficult and devastating experiences the owner of Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary has had. And I will then write to the Member.
In relation to Nidec, the Minister for Economy's officials were informed that they would shortly be making the announcement—a very devastating announcement—of the loss of 98 manufacturing jobs. And the Minister has asked his officials to continue to meet with the company to offer employees support through ReAct, Business Wales and other Welsh Government support that's available to the impacted workers.
Diolch. Wel, o ran eich cwestiwn cyntaf, yn sicr, byddaf i'n hapus i siarad â'r Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd. Rwy'n ymwybodol o'r anawsterau y mae Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary wedi'u hwynebu, ac rwy'n ymwybodol i'r Gweinidog ysgrifennu atoch chi—rwy'n credu mai mis diwethaf ydoedd—o ran y profiadau anodd a dinistriol iawn y mae perchennog Lizzie's Barn Sanctuary wedi'u cael. Yna byddaf i'n ysgrifennu at yr Aelod.
O ran Nidec, cafodd swyddogion Gweinidog yr Economi wybod y bydden nhw'n gwneud y cyhoeddiad yn fuan—cyhoeddiad dinistriol iawn—o golli 98 o swyddi gweithgynhyrchu. Ac mae'r Gweinidog wedi gofyn i'w swyddogion barhau i gyfarfod â'r cwmni i gynnig cymorth i weithwyr drwy ReAct, Busnes Cymru a chymorth arall gan Lywodraeth Cymru sydd ar gael i'r gweithwyr y mae hyn yn effeithio arnyn nhw.
Minister, over a week ago, some significantly important broadband infrastructure by Ogi was criminally damaged in an attack in Pembroke Dock, leaving homes and businesses without a broadband connection for a number of days. Now, given that this is a UK legislation issue in terms of the security of this, I'm just wondering if the relevant Minister could make some representations to the UK Government on the need to strengthen the law around the criminal activity and the damage to critical infrastructure such as broadband, given (a) the importance of broadband infrastructure to our day-to-day lives, and, secondly, the speed at which broadband infrastructure has rolled out maybe means that the law hasn't kept pace as to the importance of it. Hopefully, the Welsh Government can make some notes to the UK Government on the need for that.
Gweinidog, dros wythnos yn ôl, cafodd rhywfaint o seilwaith band eang sylweddol bwysig gan Ogi ei ddifrodi'n droseddol mewn ymosodiad yn Noc Penfro, gan adael cartrefi a busnesau heb gysylltiad band eang am nifer o ddiwrnodau. Nawr, o ystyried bod hwn yn fater deddfwriaeth y DU o ran diogelwch hyn, meddwl ydw i tybed a allai'r Gweinidog perthnasol gyflwyno rhai sylwadau i Lywodraeth y DU ar yr angen i gryfhau'r gyfraith ynghylch y gweithgarwch troseddol a'r difrod i seilwaith critigol fel band eang, o ystyried (a) pwysigrwydd seilwaith band eang i'n bywydau o ddydd i ddydd, Ac, yn ail, mae'r cyflymder y mae seilwaith band eang wedi ei gyflwyno yn golygu nad yw'r gyfraith wedi cadw ar y blaen â'i bwysigrwydd. Gobeithio y gall Llywodraeth Cymru wneud rhai nodiadau i Lywodraeth y DU ar yr angen am hynny.
Thank you. I think you make a very important point about legislation keeping up with technology because, as you say, we know technology does improve and things happen very quickly, and maybe the legislation certainly isn't quite as fast. I would imagine it's for the Minister for Economy—who is in his seat; he has heard—and I will certainly ask him if he's prepared to write to the UK Government regarding security, because clearly this has a massive impact on businesses who need to rely on broadband, as we all do.
Diolch. Rwy'n credu eich bod chi'n gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn ynglŷn â deddfwriaeth yn cadw ar y blaen â thechnoleg oherwydd, fel y dywedwch chi, rydyn ni'n gwybod bod technoleg yn gwella ac mae pethau'n digwydd yn gyflym iawn, ac efallai nad yw'r ddeddfwriaeth yn digwydd mor gyflym. Byddwn i'n dychmygu mai ar gyfer Gweinidog yr Economi—sydd yn ei sedd; mae ef wedi clywed—ac yn sicr, gwnaf i ofyn iddo a yw'n barod i ysgrifennu at Lywodraeth y DU ynglŷn â diogelwch, oherwydd yn amlwg mae hyn yn cael effaith enfawr ar fusnesau sydd angen dibynnu ar fand eang, fel yr ydyn ni i gyd yn ei wneud.
Sam Rowlands.
Sam Rowlands.
Thank you temporary Deputy Presiding Officer—we need a snappier title for you, I suspect.
Trefnydd, I'd like to request a statement from the education Minister regarding progress in dealing with the presence of reinforced autoclaved aerated concrete in schools. Last week, we saw the BBC reporting that issues with RAAC has led to some children at a school in my region of north Wales never sitting formal exams. With the school in Holyhead, 60 per cent of it was shut in September due to RAAC and, incredibly, 40 per cent of it is still closed today. One pupil was quoted as saying that, at one point, they were doing maths on a hob in catering. That's no way to learn—I'm sure you would agree. So, it's damaging for pupils. They're still not being taught in an adequate learning environment, which will hamper their academic success. In light of this, Trefnydd, I'd welcome a statement from the education Minister to show what action the Welsh Government are taking to ensure that those children can fully get back to school as soon as possible.
Diolch i chi Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro—mae angen teitl mwy cynnil arnoch chi, rwy'n amau.
Trefnydd, hoffwn i ofyn am ddatganiad gan y Gweinidog addysg ynghylch cynnydd wrth ymdrin â phresenoldeb concrit awyredig awtoclafiedig cyfnerth mewn ysgolion. Yr wythnos diwethaf, gwnaeth y BBC adrodd bod materion gyda concrit awyredig awtoclafiedig cyfnerth wedi arwain at rai plant mewn ysgol yn fy rhanbarth i yn y gogledd byth yn sefyll arholiadau ffurfiol. O ran yr ysgol yng Nghaergybi, cafodd 60 y cant ohoni ei chau ym mis Medi oherwydd concrit awyredig awtoclafiedig cyfnerth ac, yn anhygoel, mae 40 y cant ohoni ar gau hyd heddiw. Cafodd un disgybl ei ddyfynnu'n dweud, ar un adeg, ei fod yn gwneud mathemateg ar hob yn yr adran arlwyo. Nid yw hynny'n ffordd o ddysgu—rwy'n siŵr y byddech chi'n cytuno. Felly, mae'n niweidiol i'r disgyblion. Nid ydyn nhw'n cael eu haddysgu mewn amgylchedd dysgu digonol o hyd, a fydd yn amharu ar eu llwyddiant academaidd. Yng ngoleuni hyn, Trefnydd, byddwn i'n croesawu datganiad gan y Gweinidog addysg i ddangos pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i sicrhau y gall y plant hynny ddychwelyd i'r ysgol yn llawn cyn gynted â phosibl.
Thank you. Well, the Minister continues to work very closely with local authorities to assess condition and safety risks, including structural integrity for all buildings within their school estate and to maintain those records. I know, with the specific school that you just referred to, that there is a follow-up meeting scheduled for the end of this month, so I'm assuming it will be this week or next week, between the headteacher and Qualifications Wales and WJEC, to discuss the options and the assessment of the school and learner circumstances. So, I will ask the Minister for education to update Members with a written statement following that meeting.
Diolch. Wel, mae'r Gweinidog yn parhau i weithio'n agos iawn gydag awdurdodau lleol i asesu risgiau cyflwr a diogelwch, gan gynnwys cadernid adeileddol ar gyfer pob adeilad o fewn eu hystad ysgol ac i gynnal y cofnodion hynny. Rwy'n gwybod, gyda'r ysgol benodol y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio ati, fod cyfarfod dilynol wedi'i drefnu ar gyfer diwedd y mis, felly rwy'n tybio y bydd yr wythnos hon neu'r wythnos nesaf, rhwng y pennaeth a Cymwysterau Cymru a CBAC, i drafod yr opsiynau ac asesu amgylchiadau'r ysgol a dysgwyr. Felly, gofynnaf i'r Gweinidog addysg roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau gyda datganiad ysgrifenedig yn dilyn y cyfarfod hwnnw.
Ac yn olaf, Russell George.
And finally, Russell George.
Thank you, acting Presiding Officer. Can I add to the statement requested by Jane Dodds, please, Trefnydd? Last week, I met, alongside my colleague Craig Williams MP, with Nidec Control Techniques and the officials in Newtown at their site. I was pleased—and I think we were both pleased—that at least there was a commitment to continuing to invest in the Newtown site, and that was demonstrated to us, and so I feel confident for the long-term operations at the site. Now, my colleague Craig Williams has been working with the Department for Work and Pensions to bring forward a taskforce to support those that are affected, but I would be very grateful, Minister, if the economy Minister could bring forward a statement to demonstrate what support the Welsh Government is going to be offering those families affected, and how it will also dovetail any support that is offered from the UK Government.
Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd dros dro. A gaf i ychwanegu at y datganiad y gofynnwyd amdano gan Jane Dodds, os gwelwch yn dda, Trefnydd? Yr wythnos diwethaf, cwrddais â fy nghydweithiwr Craig Williams AS, gyda Nidec Control Techniques a'r swyddogion yn y Drenewydd ar eu safle. Roeddwn i'n falch—ac rwy'n credu bod y ddau ohonom yn falch—fod o leiaf ymrwymiad i barhau i fuddsoddi yn safle'r Drenewydd, a dangoswyd hynny i ni, ac felly rwy'n teimlo'n hyderus ynghylch y gweithrediadau hirdymor ar y safle. Nawr, mae fy nghydweithiwr, Craig Williams, wedi bod yn gweithio gyda'r Adran Gwaith a Phensiynau i gyflwyno tasglu i gefnogi'r rhai yr effeithir arnynt, ond byddwn yn ddiolchgar iawn, Gweinidog, pe gallai Gweinidog yr economi gyflwyno datganiad i ddangos pa gefnogaeth y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei gynnig i'r teuluoedd hynny yr effeithir arnynt, a sut y bydd hefyd yn plethu ag unrhyw gymorth a gynigir gan Lywodraeth y DU.
Daeth y Llywydd i’r Gadair.
The Llywydd took the Chair.
Well, I did mention the support that the Minister for Economy is giving from the Welsh Government. He's ensured that his officials have continued to work with Nidec to make sure that the staff who are affected will get support. I mentioned ReAct, for example. So, as I say, the Minister for Economy is ensuring that Welsh Government support is available.
Wel, soniais i am y gefnogaeth y mae Gweinidog yr Economi yn ei rhoi gan Lywodraeth Cymru. Mae wedi sicrhau bod ei swyddogion wedi parhau i weithio gyda Nidec i wneud yn siŵr y bydd y staff yr effeithir arnynt yn cael cefnogaeth. Soniais am ReAct, er enghraifft. Felly, fel y dywedais i, mae Gweinidog yr Economi yn sicrhau bod cymorth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gael.
Diolch i'r Trefnydd.
I thank the Trefnydd.
Yr eitem nesaf, felly, fydd y datganiad gan Weinidog yr Economi ar Tata Steel. Y Gweinidog i wneud y datganiad—Vaughan Gething.
The next item, therefore, will be the statement by the Minister for Economy on Tata Steel. The Minister to make the statement—Vaughan Gething.
Diolch, Llywydd. The announcement made by Tata Steel UK on 19 January has caused enormous distress and anxiety for thousands of workers, their families and whole communities in Wales, especially in Port Talbot.
The steel industry is part of our nation's story and stands today as a marker of Welsh excellence. In 2024, it represents an economic asset with a global reach that is essential to meeting the demands of a greener and more secure future. Port Talbot boasts a workforce with the expertise, know-how and dedication to deliver the longer, fairer transition for steel that the Welsh and UK economies need. However, the proposals presented last week will not allow the industry to realise that ambitious future in Wales. Instead, it sets out a process that would rapidly see the UK become the only G20 economy to relinquish its virgin steel-making capabilities—all this at a time of rising global conflict and growing trade disruption. From cans to cars to construction, virgin steel is an essential element of the steel that we need today. If implemented in full, the plans would see the UK become more reliant upon imports produced to lower environmental standards and shipped thousands of miles to Wales on diesel-fuelled vessels.
Following a deal struck with the UK Government, Tata Steel now intends to close Port Talbot's two blast furnaces and coke ovens in a phased manner. The first blast furnace would close around mid 2024 and the remaining heavy-end assets would wind down to closure in the second half of 2024. Tata has announced that up to 2,800 direct jobs are expected to be lost as part of its proposals. Around 2,500 of those would be affected within the next 18 months. The company expects that a further 300 roles would be lost in two to three years’ time at Llanwern.
Diolch, Llywydd. Mae'r cyhoeddiad a wnaed gan Tata Steel UK ar 19 Ionawr wedi achosi gofid a phryder enfawr i filoedd o weithwyr, eu teuluoedd a chymunedau cyfan yng Nghymru, yn enwedig ym Mhort Talbot.
Mae'r diwydiant dur yn rhan o stori ein cenedl ac yn sefyll heddiw fel arwydd o ragoriaeth Cymru. Yn 2024, mae'n cynrychioli ased economaidd gyda chyrhaeddiad byd-eang sy'n hanfodol i fodloni gofynion dyfodol mwy gwyrdd a mwy diogel. Ym Mhort Talbot mae yna weithlu gyda'r arbenigedd, y gallu a'r ymroddiad i gyflawni'r trawsnewidiad hirach, tecach ar gyfer dur sydd ei angen ar economïau Cymru a'r DU. Fodd bynnag, ni fydd y cynigion a gyflwynwyd yr wythnos diwethaf yn caniatáu i'r diwydiant wireddu'r dyfodol uchelgeisiol hwnnw yng Nghymru. Yn hytrach, mae'n nodi proses a fyddai'n gweld y DU yn gyflym yn dod yr unig economi G20 i ildio ei galluoedd gwneud dur crai—hyn i gyd ar adeg o wrthdaro byd-eang cynyddol ac aflonyddwch masnach cynyddol. O ganiau i geir i adeiladu, mae dur crai yn elfen hanfodol o'r dur sydd ei angen arnom heddiw. Pe bai'r cynlluniau'n cael eu gweithredu'n llawn, byddai'r cynlluniau'n golygu y byddai'r DU yn dod yn fwy dibynnol ar fewnforion a gynhyrchir i safonau amgylcheddol is ac sy'n cael eu cludo miloedd o filltiroedd i Gymru ar longau tanwydd diesel.
Yn dilyn cytundeb â Llywodraeth y DU, mae Tata Steel bellach yn bwriadu cau dwy ffwrnais chwyth Port Talbot a'r ffyrnau golosg mewn modd graddol. Byddai'r ffwrnais chwyth gyntaf yn cau tua chanol 2024 a byddai'r asedau trwm sy'n weddill yn dirwyn i ben yn ail hanner 2024. Mae Tata wedi cyhoeddi y bydd hyd at 2,800 o swyddi uniongyrchol yn cael eu colli fel rhan o'i gynigion. Effeithir ar tua 2,500 o'r rhain o fewn y 18 mis nesaf. Mae'r cwmni'n disgwyl y byddai 300 o swyddi ychwanegol yn cael eu colli ymhen dwy i dair blynedd yn Llanwern.
Llywydd, this represents an economic loss of historic proportions for Wales within an industry that all of us will become increasingly reliant upon. Rather than providing a bridge to the future that sees us produce cleaner steel, the deal struck by UK Ministers offers a cliff edge and preventable hardship for those workers who are best placed to make the transition work. It is the firm view of this Welsh Government that a better deal could and should be struck to avoid an outcome that is preventable. UK Ministers have failed to set out the case for a £500 million subsidy that results in 2,800 job losses and the loss of virgin steel-making capacity. It is not clear what outcomes were prioritised by Ministers or why this specific level of financial support was chosen.
Llywydd, the UK Government and Tata Steel have the tools between them to secure a longer, fairer transition for a sector that is good for growth and essential to our collective security. It is in all of our interests to secure the best deal for steel, and not simply the cheapest deal. The Prime Minister could realise the need to take job losses of this scale off the table. He could enter into urgent talks with clear red lines based on an assessment of our economic needs and the role that steel must play in meeting them. I have written to successive Secretaries of State for business regarding Tata. I have made it clear that we were prepared to do what we can to support the company in the transition that will take place. Indeed, we have a long history of supporting the business, a fact that is recognised both by the company and, indeed, the workforce. I've also written to the current Secretary of State in the Department of Business and Trade on four occasions since 11 September. I have asked that we meet urgently to discuss the future of Tata Steel UK and the implications of any proposed plans for employees and the wider supply chain. Despite this, the UK Government has refused to allow the Welsh Government to play an active role in the negotiations undertaken with Tata Steel. Llywydd, it's important to place on record that we did refuse to participate in discussions with the UK Government on planning for the closure of the Port Talbot steelworks whilst being excluded from the ongoing negotiations. Following a briefing with Tata in advance of their announcement, the First Minister requested an urgent call with the Prime Minister on Friday to discuss the action that could still be taken to secure a more ambitious future for this important sovereign asset. However, the Prime Minister was not available to take a call, and no subsequent offer has been made to the First Minister's office.
Llywydd, as Tata Steel has stated, any agreement is subject to relevant regulatory approvals, information and consultation processes. The finalisation of detailed terms and conditions has yet to be reached. We urge the company not to make any irreversible choices based on the current level of UK Government support. There is a credible way forward for the business that does not require the planned loss of both blast furnaces and job losses on this eyewatering scale. The company has described itself a sense of ambition for the future. I believe that new possibilities can be unlocked if the policy of the UK Government were changed to allow for this. It is essential that Tata now builds on the dialogue that it has been having with the recognised trades unions to date. I have met with representatives from the three recognised steel trades unions: Community, Unite, and the GMB. I have met them regularly since the agreement reached between Tata Steel and the UK Government on 15 September. I visited Port Talbot to meet with the unions on 19 January, as well as meeting face to face with senior Tata executives. And once more, yesterday, I met and listened to 70 workforce representatives to understand their perspective and understand their view of a better alternative approach that could be pursued for this sector.
The First Minister and I have continued to meet with the company, and I welcome the company's commitment to maintain that dialogue. We have continually stressed the importance of proper consultation and full consideration of alternative options that the trade unions have presented. The company has yet to begin a formal consultation. I urge them to engage with the workforce at each stage to ensure a fair outcome. The Tata Steel transition board was established by the UK Government to provide advice on how to protect and grow the economic environment and to support and mitigate the impact upon the workforce, businesses and communities directly affected by Tata's proposals for a decarbonisation transition. We will continue to participate in the board to support areas of shared priority.
In addition, we will work closely with key partners such as Jobcentre Plus, Working Wales, local authorities and the trade unions to ensure that any people who do face redundancy as a consequence of these proposals are provided with information, advice and guidance on the support available to them. The Welsh Government's employability and skills programmes, ReAct+ and Communities for Work Plus, can provide support for training and mentoring to those who wish or require this support.
Llywydd, this support would be delivered as a consequence of the wrong deal for steel. The anger, the hurt and the fear that is felt by so many is compounded by the shared and reasonable understanding that this is preventable. There is still an opportunity to secure a better outcome that protects a sovereign asset that is also part of the social and economic fabric of Wales. I remain committed to working with the company, trade unions and the UK Government to prevent the scale of loss that we now risk. Wales and the UK will be better off and more secure if the products of the future that will power us towards a greener future are made here. I will, of course, continue to keep lines of communication open to all parties and keep Members informed. Thank you, Llywydd.
Llywydd, mae hyn yn cynrychioli colled economaidd ar raddfa hanesyddol i Gymru o fewn diwydiant y bydd pob un ohonom yn dod yn fwyfwy dibynnol arno. Yn hytrach na darparu pont i'r dyfodol a fyddai yn ein gweld yn cynhyrchu dur glanach, mae'r fargen a gafodd ei tharo gan Weinidogion y DU yn cynnig dibyn a chaledi y gellir ei atal i'r gweithwyr hynny sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i wneud i'r broses o drawsnewid weithio. Barn gadarn Llywodraeth Cymru yw y gellid ac y dylid taro bargen well er mwyn osgoi canlyniad y gellir ei atal. Mae Gweinidogion y DU wedi methu a gosod yr achos dros gymhorthdal o £500 miliwn sy'n arwain at golli 2,800 o swyddi a cholli capasiti gwneud dur crai. Nid yw'n glir pa ganlyniadau a gafodd flaenoriaeth gan Weinidogion na pham y dewiswyd y lefel benodol hon o gymorth ariannol.
Llywydd, mae gan Lywodraeth y DU a Tata Steel yr offer rhyngddynt i sicrhau trosglwyddiad hirach, tecach i sector sy'n dda ar gyfer twf ac sy'n hanfodol i'n diogelwch ar y cyd. Mae er ein budd ni i gyd i sicrhau'r fargen orau ar gyfer dur, ac nid dim ond y fargen rataf. Gallai Prif Weinidog y DU sylweddoli'r angen i dynnu colledion swyddi ar y raddfa hon oddi ar y bwrdd. Gallai ddechrau trafodaethau brys gyda llinellau coch clir yn seiliedig ar asesiad o'n hanghenion economaidd a'r rôl y mae'n rhaid i ddur ei chwarae wrth eu diwallu. Rwyf wedi ysgrifennu at Ysgrifenyddion Gwladol dros fusnes olynol ynghylch Tata. Rwyf wedi ei gwneud yn glir ein bod yn barod i wneud yr hyn a allwn i gefnogi'r cwmni yn y cyfnod trosglwyddo a fydd yn digwydd. Yn wir, mae gennym hanes hir o gefnogi'r busnes, ffaith sy'n cael ei chydnabod gan y cwmni ac, yn wir, y gweithlu. Rwyf hefyd wedi ysgrifennu at yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol presennol yn yr Adran Busnes a Masnach ar bedwar achlysur ers 11 Medi. Rwyf wedi gofyn am gyfarfod ar frys i drafod dyfodol Tata Steel UK a goblygiadau unrhyw gynlluniau arfaethedig ar gyfer gweithwyr a'r gadwyn gyflenwi ehangach. Er gwaethaf hyn, mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi gwrthod caniatáu i Lywodraeth Cymru chwarae rhan weithredol yn y trafodaethau a gynhaliwyd gyda Tata Steel. Llywydd, mae'n bwysig nodi ar gofnod ein bod wedi gwrthod cymryd rhan mewn trafodaethau gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar gynllunio ar gyfer cau gwaith dur Port Talbot wrth i ni gael ein gwahardd o'r trafodaethau a oedd yn parhau. Yn dilyn sesiwn friffio gyda Tata cyn eu cyhoeddiad, gofynnodd y Prif Weinidog am alwad frys gyda Phrif Weinidog y DU ddydd Gwener i drafod y camau y gellid eu cymryd o hyd i sicrhau dyfodol mwy uchelgeisiol i'r ased sofran pwysig hwn. Fodd bynnag, nid oedd Prif Weinidog y DU ar gael i gymryd galwad, ac nid oes cynnig wedi ei wneud ers hynny i swyddfa'r Prif Weinidog.
Llywydd, fel y dywedodd Tata Steel, mae unrhyw gytundeb yn amodol ar gymeradwyaeth reoleiddiol berthnasol, gwybodaeth a phrosesau ymgynghori. Nid yw'r gwaith o gwblhau telerau ac amodau manwl wedi'i gyrraedd eto. Rydym yn annog y cwmni i beidio â gwneud unrhyw ddewisiadau na ellir eu gwrthdroi yn seiliedig ar lefel bresennol cymorth Llywodraeth y DU. Mae ffordd gredadwy ymlaen i'r busnes pryd nad oes angen colli ffwrneisi chwyth a cholli swyddi ar y raddfa drawiadol hon. Mae'r cwmni wedi disgrifio'i hun ymdeimlad o uchelgais ar gyfer y dyfodol. Credaf y gellir datgloi posibiliadau newydd pe bai polisi Llywodraeth y DU yn newid i ganiatáu hyn. Mae'n hanfodol bod Tata bellach yn adeiladu ar y ddeialog y mae wedi bod yn ei chael gyda'r undebau llafur cydnabyddedig hyd yma. Rwyf wedi cwrdd â chynrychiolwyr o'r tri undeb llafur dur cydnabyddedig: Cymuned, Unite, a'r GMB. Rwyf wedi cwrdd â nhw'n rheolaidd ers y cytundeb rhwng Tata Steel a Llywodraeth y DU ar 15 Medi. Ymwelais â Phort Talbot i gyfarfod â'r undebau ar 19 Ionawr, yn ogystal â chwrdd wyneb yn wyneb ag uwch swyddogion gweithredol Tata. Ac unwaith eto, ddoe, cwrddais â 70 o gynrychiolwyr gweithlu a gwrando arnynt er mwyn deall eu safbwynt a deall eu barn am ddull amgen gwell y gellid ei ddilyn ar gyfer y sector hwn.
Mae'r Prif Weinidog a minnau wedi parhau i gyfarfod â'r cwmni, ac rwy'n croesawu ymrwymiad y cwmni i gynnal y ddeialog honno. Rydym wedi pwysleisio, yn barhaus, bwysigrwydd ymgynghori priodol ac ystyriaeth lawn o opsiynau amgen y mae'r undebau llafur wedi'u cyflwyno. Nid yw'r cwmni wedi dechrau ymgynghoriad ffurfiol eto. Rwy'n eu hannog i ymgysylltu â'r gweithlu ar bob cam i sicrhau canlyniad teg. Sefydlwyd bwrdd trawsnewid Tata Steel gan Lywodraeth y DU i roi cyngor ar sut i ddiogelu a thyfu'r amgylchedd economaidd ac i gefnogi a lliniaru'r effaith ar y gweithlu, busnesau a chymunedau y mae cynigion Tata ar gyfer trawsnewidiad datgarboneiddio yn effeithio'n uniongyrchol arnynt. Byddwn yn parhau i gymryd rhan yn y bwrdd i gefnogi meysydd o flaenoriaeth gyffredin.
Yn ogystal, byddwn yn gweithio'n agos gyda phartneriaid allweddol fel y Ganolfan Byd Gwaith, Cymru'n Gweithio, awdurdodau lleol a'r undebau llafur i sicrhau bod unrhyw bobl sy'n wynebu colli eu swyddi o ganlyniad i'r cynigion hyn yn cael gwybodaeth, cyngor ac arweiniad ynghylch y cymorth sydd ar gael iddynt. Gall rhaglenni cyflogadwyedd a sgiliau Llywodraeth Cymru, ReAct+ a Cymunedau am Waith a Mwy ddarparu cymorth ar gyfer hyfforddiant a mentora i'r rhai sy'n dymuno neu sydd angen y cymorth hwn.
Llywydd, byddai'r gefnogaeth hon yn cael ei darparu o ganlyniad i'r fargen anghywir i ddur. Mae'r dicter, y loes a'r ofn sy'n cael ei deimlo gan gymaint yn cael eu dwysáu gan y ddealltwriaeth gyffredin a rhesymol y gellir atal hyn. Mae cyfle o hyd i sicrhau gwell canlyniad sy'n diogelu ased sofran sydd hefyd yn rhan o wead cymdeithasol ac economaidd Cymru. Rwy'n parhau i fod yn ymrwymedig i weithio gyda'r cwmni, undebau llafur a Llywodraeth y DU i atal maint y golled yr ydym bellach yn ei hwynebu. Bydd Cymru a'r DU yn well eu byd ac yn fwy diogel pe bai cynhyrchion y dyfodol a fydd yn ein pweru tuag at ddyfodol mwy gwyrdd yn cael eu gwneud yma. Byddaf wrth gwrs yn parhau i gadw llinellau cyfathrebu ar agor i bob parti ac yn rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau. Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd.
Can I thank the Minister for his statement this afternoon? I very much agree with the Minister that this is a hugely distressing time for the workers at the Tata Steel plant. Workers and their families will be understandably anxious about what the future holds for them, and it's vitally important that there is support from Governments at all levels at this very difficult time. Anyone who has followed the development since the announcement was made can feel just how precarious this situation is for the site's workers. Now, today's statement refers to Tata's consultation on the job losses it's planning to make across its UK operations, and the company has promised that it will work with unions in the first instance, and, further to his statement today, can the Minister tell us what role the Welsh Government is playing in ensuring that the consultation results in the best possible outcomes for the workforce?
Now, the company has set out the phased manner in which it plans to close both of its blast furnaces, and it's vital that everything possible is done to support the workers and ensure that they're offered job and training opportunities, particularly for young people. Today's statement tells us that the Welsh Government is working with key partners like Jobcentre Plus and others to ensure people who are facing redundancy have the best possible information, and I'm pleased to hear that programmes, ReAct+ and Communities for Work Plus, are providing support for training. Following on from this, perhaps the Minister could tell us a bit more about some of the action that is being taken, and also tell us whether the Welsh Government has ring-fenced any funding to ensure that the workers can access work or training opportunities.
It's not just those directly employed by Tata, of course, that will be affected by the company's announcement; this will also have an impact on contractors, local businesses and the wider community. Make no mistake: this announcement will have ripples right across the south Wales corridor. Of course, it affects the local supply chain and the wider region, particularly across a manufacturing sector with ambitious plans for maximising the net-zero opportunities presented around the Celtic free port, so it's vital that the transition board engages with the people, businesses and communities affected by the transition. Whilst we know that the Welsh Government has been working with the unions to support workers, perhaps the Minister could tell us what engagement the Welsh Government has had with local businesses about the impact that this announcement will have on them, and tell us what support is being made available to them too.
Now, we know that the business model for Tata will significantly change as the company's blast furnaces are replaced by an electric arc furnace. Now, as you've heard from the leader of the opposition earlier, he and I believe that a blast furnace should be kept open during the transition period to help protect some of those jobs in the short to medium term, and it's vital we receive a full explanation why this isn't happening.
Today's statement confirms that the Minister has had significant discussions with senior executives, and so perhaps he can confirm that he has asked Tata to keep a blast furnace open in those discussions, and, if so, what response he received. And can he tell us whether the Welsh Government has offered any support to keep blast furnace 4 open, as the transition to greener technology takes place? Of course, the Minister is right to say that the transition should genuinely be a just transition that does not offshore jobs and emissions to other parts of the world.
In addition, the Minister said that other technologies need to be considered, such as direct reduced iron in the short to medium term and hydrogen in the longer term. Of course, in the discussions that the Minister has had with Tata about its plans to produce steel in a greener way, it's vital that all technologies have been considered. Therefore, I'd be grateful if the Minister tells us what support it's offering the company on its decarbonisation journey and clarifies the Welsh Government's position on the use of hydrogen. And more importantly, perhaps the Minister can clarify exactly what he wants to see for the sector, going forward. What is the Welsh Government's long-term plan when it comes to the steel industry?
Today's statement refers to the need to secure a longer, fairer transition for a sector that is good for green growth and essential to our collective security, and there are some big questions for both Governments about what the British steel sector should look like in the future. On the one hand, Governments are supportive of the sector decarbonising and embracing technology to produce greener steel, and, at the same time, it's also trying to protect jobs too. So, perhaps the Minister can tell us how he believes that balance should be struck and what is the Welsh Government's vision for steel production and what discussions has he had with the Secretary of State about how both Governments can work together on this issue.
And so in closing, Llywydd, can I say that my thoughts remain with those affected by Tata's announcement? And I urge Governments to work together to support the workforce and the wider community that will feel the effects of last week for some time to come. Diolch.
A gaf i ddiolch i'r Gweinidog am ei ddatganiad y prynhawn yma? Rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr â'r Gweinidog bod hwn yn gyfnod gofidus iawn i'r gweithwyr yng ngwaith Tata Steel. Bydd gweithwyr a'u teuluoedd yn ddealladwy yn bryderus am yr hyn y mae'r dyfodol yn ei gynnig iddyn nhw, ac mae'n hanfodol bwysig bod cefnogaeth gan lywodraethau ar bob lefel ar yr adeg anodd iawn hon. Gall unrhyw un sydd wedi dilyn y datblygiad ers i'r cyhoeddiad gael ei wneud deimlo pa mor ansicr yw'r sefyllfa hon i weithwyr y safle. Nawr, mae'r datganiad heddiw yn cyfeirio at ymgynghoriad Tata ar y swyddi y mae'n bwriadu eu colli ar draws ei weithrediadau yn y DU, ac mae'r cwmni wedi addo y bydd yn gweithio gydag undebau yn y lle cyntaf, ac, yn dilyn ei ddatganiad heddiw, a all y Gweinidog ddweud wrthym pa rôl y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei chwarae i sicrhau bod yr ymgynghoriad yn arwain at y canlyniadau gorau posibl i'r gweithlu?
Nawr, mae'r cwmni wedi nodi'r ffordd raddol y mae'n bwriadu cau ei ddwy ffwrnais chwyth, ac mae'n hanfodol bod popeth posibl yn cael ei wneud i gefnogi'r gweithwyr a sicrhau eu bod yn cael cynnig cyfleoedd gwaith a hyfforddiant, yn enwedig y bobl ifanc. Mae'r datganiad heddiw yn dweud wrthym fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gyda phartneriaid allweddol fel y Ganolfan Byd Gwaith ac eraill i sicrhau bod gan bobl sy'n wynebu colli eu swyddi yr wybodaeth orau bosibl, ac rwy'n falch o glywed bod rhaglenni ReAct+ a Cymunedau am Waith a Mwy, yn darparu cymorth ar gyfer hyfforddiant. Yn dilyn hyn, efallai y gallai'r Gweinidog ddweud ychydig mwy wrthym am rywfaint o'r camau sy'n cael eu cymryd, a dweud wrthym hefyd a yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi neilltuo unrhyw gyllid i sicrhau bod y gweithwyr yn gallu cael mynediad at gyfleoedd gwaith neu hyfforddiant.
Wrth gwrs bydd cyhoeddiad y cwmni nid yn unig yn effeithio ar y rhai a gyflogir yn uniongyrchol gan Tata; bydd hyn hefyd yn cael effaith ar gontractwyr, busnesau lleol a'r gymuned ehangach. Gallwch fod yn siŵr o un peth: bydd effaith y cyhoeddiad hwn i'w theimlo ar draws coridor de Cymru. Wrth gwrs, mae'n effeithio ar y gadwyn gyflenwi leol a'r rhanbarth ehangach, yn enwedig ar draws sector gweithgynhyrchu gyda chynlluniau uchelgeisiol ar gyfer gwneud y mwyaf o'r cyfleoedd sero net a gyflwynir o amgylch y porthladd rhydd Celtaidd, felly mae'n hanfodol bod y bwrdd trawsnewid yn ymgysylltu â'r bobl, busnesau a'r cymunedau y mae'r trawsnewid yn effeithio arnynt. Er ein bod yn gwybod bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn gweithio gyda'r undebau i gefnogi gweithwyr, efallai y gallai'r Gweinidog ddweud wrthym pa ymgysylltiad y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i gael â busnesau lleol ynghylch yr effaith y bydd y cyhoeddiad hwn yn ei chael arnynt, a dweud wrthym pa gymorth sydd ar gael iddynt hwythau hefyd.
Nawr, gwyddom y bydd y model busnes ar gyfer Tata yn newid yn sylweddol wrth i ffwrneisi chwyth y cwmni gael eu disodli gan ffwrnais arc trydan. Nawr, fel yr ydych wedi clywed gan arweinydd yr wrthblaid yn gynharach, mae ef a minnau'n credu y dylid cadw ffwrnais chwyth ar agor yn ystod y cyfnod trawsnewid i helpu i ddiogelu rhai o'r swyddi hynny yn y tymor byr i'r tymor canolig, ac mae'n hanfodol ein bod yn cael esboniad llawn pam nad yw hyn yn digwydd.
Mae'r datganiad heddiw yn cadarnhau bod y Gweinidog wedi cael trafodaethau sylweddol gydag uwch-swyddogion gweithredol, ac felly efallai y gall gadarnhau ei fod wedi gofyn i Tata gadw ffwrnais chwyth ar agor yn y trafodaethau hynny, ac, os felly, pa ymateb a gafodd. Ac a all ddweud wrthym a yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cynnig unrhyw gefnogaeth i gadw ffwrnais chwyth 4 ar agor, wrth i'r trawsnewid i dechnoleg fwy gwyrdd ddigwydd? Wrth gwrs, mae'r Gweinidog yn iawn i ddweud y dylai'r trawsnewid fod yn drawsnewid teg nad yw'n symud swyddi ac allyriadau i rannau eraill o'r byd.
Yn ogystal, dywedodd y Gweinidog fod angen ystyried technolegau eraill, megis lleihau haearn yn uniongyrchol yn y tymor byr i'r tymor canolig a hydrogen yn y tymor hwy. Wrth gwrs, yn y trafodaethau y mae'r Gweinidog wedi'u cael gyda Tata ynglŷn â'i gynlluniau i gynhyrchu dur mewn ffordd wyrddach, mae'n hanfodol bod pob technoleg wedi cael ei hystyried. Felly, byddwn yn ddiolchgar pe bai'r Gweinidog yn dweud wrthym pa gymorth y mae'n ei gynnig i'r cwmni ar ei daith ddatgarboneiddio ac egluro safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar ddefnyddio hydrogen. Ac yn bwysicach fyth, efallai y gall y Gweinidog egluro'n union yr hyn y mae eisiau ei weld ar gyfer y sector, wrth symud ymlaen. Beth yw cynllun hirdymor Llywodraeth Cymru o ran y diwydiant dur?
Mae'r datganiad heddiw yn cyfeirio at yr angen i sicrhau trosglwyddiad hirach, tecach i sector sy'n dda ar gyfer twf gwyrdd ac sy'n hanfodol i'n diogelwch ar y cyd, ac mae rhai cwestiynau mawr i'r ddwy Lywodraeth ynglŷn â sut y dylai sector dur Prydain edrych yn y dyfodol. Ar y naill law, mae Llywodraethau'n gefnogol i'r sector ddatgarboneiddio a chofleidio technoleg i gynhyrchu dur gwyrddach, ac, ar yr un pryd, maent hefyd yn ceisio diogelu swyddi. Felly, efallai y gall y Gweinidog ddweud wrthym sut mae'n credu y dylid taro'r cydbwysedd a beth yw gweledigaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer cynhyrchu dur a pha drafodaethau y mae wedi'u cael gyda'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol ynghylch sut y gall y ddwy Lywodraeth gydweithio ar y mater hwn.
Ac felly wrth gloi, Llywydd, a gaf fi ddweud bod fy meddyliau'n aros gyda'r rhai y mae cyhoeddiad Tata yn effeithio arnynt? Ac rwy'n annog Llywodraethau i weithio gyda'i gilydd i gefnogi'r gweithlu a'r gymuned ehangach a fydd yn teimlo effeithiau'r wythnos diwethaf am beth amser i ddod. Diolch.
Thank you for the comments and the questions, and I think we need to restate at the outset that we have a series of proposals, not guaranteed outcomes. I've seen far too much commentary that simply accepts that everything that has been announced is going to happen, and yet, actually, we don't yet know the detail of what's being proposed.
I'm trying not to collapse back into being an employment lawyer, but the company needs to file something called an HR1, which sets out the proposals on job losses and the time frames around them. At the moment, there's a broad statement outlining 2,500 direct job cuts around Port Talbot, up to 300 in Llanwern, and gives a rough 18-month time frame. There isn't actually a plan within that; it's setting out the end result of the proposals. To see that plan provided is actually really important for the consultation to be meaningful, and all of us will need to be engaged in and around that. Now, we are interested, and of course the recognised trade unions are interested, in seeing the detail around that plan, what it looks like and whether there is a further conversation we could, should and will have, and I hope that UK Ministers will look at that plan as well.
And I do welcome the contrast in the comments, where both Paul Davies and, to be fair to him, the leader of the opposition in this place, have said that they want to see a future with a blast furnace that remains open and a credible path to doing so. That is not the private and the public view of the Secretary of State for Wales. And if he has an honest disagreement about that, that's fine—people can disagree, of course. What I think is difficult is the attempt by the current Secretary of State for Wales to characterise our disagreement as playing politics with the future, when, actually, we disagree that this is the only choice available. I've also been clear that an alternative, where blast furnace 4 does remain open, would require more investment from the UK Government. I've been really clear about that, so I'm not saying that there is a cost-free option. It's whether or not we collectively think there is value in that, not just in the direct jobs and indirect jobs that would be saved, but the longer term transition and not becoming the only G20 country that cannot make virgin steel, with all of the requirements that a number of our metal sources do have. And when I talk about cans, cars and construction, that is because some grades of construction steel require virgin steel to be part of the mix. Some parts of the automotive industry require virgin steel to be part of the mix to create cars and other vehicles. And as the Member for Llanelli knows, every single tin of Heinz beans is made at Trostre. It requires virgin steel to be part of a mix for that metal. If it doesn't, that has to be imported, whether from the Netherlands or India, and there is an obvious question about longer-term viability if that happens. So, there is real risk in not doing this and what that does for our economic future.
Diolch am y sylwadau a'r cwestiynau, ac rwy'n credu bod angen i ni ailddatgan ar y dechrau bod gennym gyfres o gynigion, nid canlyniadau gwarantedig. Rwyf wedi clywed gormod o sylwadau sy'n derbyn bod popeth sydd wedi'i gyhoeddi yn mynd i ddigwydd, ac eto, mewn gwirionedd, nid ydym yn gwybod manylion yr hyn sy'n cael ei gynnig eto.
Rwy'n ceisio peidio â chwympo'n ôl i fod yn gyfreithiwr cyflogaeth, ond mae angen i'r cwmni ffeilio rhywbeth o'r enw HR1, sy'n nodi'r cynigion ynghylch colli swyddi a'r amserlenni cysylltiedig. Ar hyn o bryd, mae datganiad eang yn amlinellu 2,500 o doriadau swyddi uniongyrchol o amgylch Port Talbot, hyd at 300 yn Llanwern, ac mae'n rhoi amserlen fras o 18 mis. Nid oes cynllun o fewn hwnnw mewn gwirionedd; mae'n nodi canlyniad terfynol y cynigion. Mae gweld y cynllun a ddarperir yn bwysig iawn er mwyn i'r ymgynghoriad fod yn ystyrlon, a bydd angen i bob un ohonom ymgysylltu â hwnnw. Nawr, mae gennym ddiddordeb, ac wrth gwrs mae gan yr undebau llafur cydnabyddedig ddiddordeb mewn gweld manylion y cynllun hwnnw, sut mae'n edrych ac a oes sgwrs bellach y gallem ni ei chael, y dylem ei chael a byddwn yn ei chael, ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd Gweinidogion y DU yn edrych ar y cynllun hwnnw hefyd.
Ac rwy'n croesawu'r gwrthgyferbyniad yn y sylwadau, pan fo Paul Davies ac, i fod yn deg ag ef, arweinydd yr wrthblaid yn y lle hwn, wedi dweud eu bod eisiau gweld dyfodol gyda ffwrnais chwyth sy'n parhau ar agor a llwybr credadwy i wneud hynny. Nid dyna farn breifat a chyhoeddus Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru. Ac os oes ganddo anghytundeb gonest ynghylch hynny, mae hynny'n iawn—mae pobl yn gallu anghytuno, wrth gwrs. Yr hyn sy'n anodd yn fy marn i yw'r ymgais gan Ysgrifennydd Gwladol presennol Cymru i nodweddu ein hanghytundeb fel chwarae gwleidyddiaeth gyda'r dyfodol, pan, mewn gwirionedd, rydym yn anghytuno mai dyma'r unig ddewis sydd ar gael. Rwyf hefyd wedi bod yn glir y byddai dewis arall, lle mae ffwrnais chwyth 4 yn aros ar agor, yn gofyn am fwy o fuddsoddiad gan Lywodraeth y DU. Rwyf wedi bod yn glir iawn am hynny, felly nid wyf yn dweud bod opsiwn heb gost. P'un a ydym gyda'n gilydd yn credu bod gwerth yn hynny ai peidio, nid yn unig yn y swyddi uniongyrchol a'r swyddi anuniongyrchol a fyddai'n cael eu hachub, ond y cyfnod trawsnewid tymor hwy gan beidio â dod yr unig wlad G20 na all wneud dur crai, gyda'r holl ofynion sydd gan nifer o'n ffynonellau metel. A phan fyddaf yn siarad am ganiau, ceir ac adeiladu, mae hynny oherwydd bod rhai graddau o ddur adeiladu angen i ddur crai fod yn rhan o'r gymysgedd. Mae rhai rhannau o'r diwydiant modurol angen i ddur crai fod yn rhan o'r gymysgedd i greu ceir a cherbydau eraill. Ac fel y gŵyr yr Aelod dros Lanelli, mae pob tun o ffa pob Heinz yn cael ei wneud yn Nhrostre. Mae angen i ddur crai fod yn rhan o gymysgedd ar gyfer y metel hwnnw. Os nad ydyw, mae'n rhaid mewnforio hwnnw, boed o'r Iseldiroedd neu o India, ac mae cwestiwn amlwg am hyfywedd tymor hwy os bydd hynny'n digwydd. Felly, mae perygl gwirioneddol o beidio â gwneud hyn a beth mae hynny'n ei wneud ar gyfer ein dyfodol economaidd.
Now, I hope that when the plan, the detail of the plan, is available, UK Ministers will take the opportunity to look at that again. I would much rather see, before a general election, that there is an opportunity to reconsider and to save these jobs. That would deal with the uncertainty that you mention that families are facing, and it's understandable there's real anger from those families about proposals when the workforce has been adaptable, they've made moves on a whole range of issues, including changing their pensions in the past as well, to make sure the business can survive and have a future.
But on your broader points around work and training, that will depend on what the need is in terms of the end proposal. Because we have proposals now and they always can change, not just the end result we would like to see, we'll need to see the time frame as well as the end result in proposals for what there is then a training need for. I've already indicated that, if our current budgets don't meet the need that exists, we will look again in my department at how we could move budgets to meet the need. But the Member will know, particularly as I was in front of his committee last week on scrutiny, there is a finite resource available to us. But this is an area where we may need to move matters around, depending on the scale of need. And all of that is dependent on the consultation and the outcomes of it.
On the transition board work, again, it does depend on how money might be used, as depending on the final deal or the final decision actually reached. I've already made it clear that there is a need to engage with both the health service—if there are to be large-scale redundancies, there's always an additional healthcare need around that as well—with the council, Neath Port Talbot Council, looking at some local development work, but also the broader challenge and opportunity of working with the Swansea bay growth deal, because they're looking at different opportunities in and around the economy.
There would also definitely be a need for the transition board to recognise and respect the fact that a number of the areas where support will be required and will be delivered are devolved. Actually, in the past, when we've had other challenges around employment, for example, whether it was in Monmouthshire or Blaenau Gwent or Ynys Môn, we've had a practical working relationship between the council, the Welsh Government and, indeed, the Department for Work and Pensions on a local level. So, if there are redundancies, then I would expect us to take a grown-up and mature approach to making sure we help people as well as we can.
I had a conversation with business groups yesterday both about the direct and indirect impact of the potential job losses, and Professor David Worsley from Swansea University has confirmed that there are at least three additional jobs reliant on every one direct job in the steelworks, and, on some counts, potentially up to five. So, we really are talking about not just 2,800—we're talking about north of 10,000 jobs that are reliant on this decision within the Welsh economy. Part of the challenge is that other work may be available, but steelworkers are very well paid. So, people may find alternative work but not necessarily at the same rate. So, it's both the number of jobs and the quality and the outcomes in those jobs that matters to us.
We do believe that blast furnace 4 could be kept open with additional support. I also believe it would provide additional value. That is a case that we have continued to make with the company and will carry on doing so. On hydrogen and DRI and other forms of changes to the future of steel making, there is a contrast between the approach being taken in the UK and the approach being taken in the Netherlands, where Tata also have a significant steelworks. There, there is a different conversation, with incentives being discussed to develop a future, including hydrogen steel making as a possibility. So, that different conversation means that there are different outcomes for the future of steel making in the Netherlands.
Now, I think we can have the same ambition and we can have better outcomes here for Welsh steelworkers. It will involve electric arc steel making being part of the future, but I don't accept that the proposals that have been announced thus far are the only way to reach a future for the future of steel making in Wales and the UK, and all of the consequences for the economy of today and, indeed, the future.
Nawr, rwy'n gobeithio, pan fydd y cynllun, manylion y cynllun, ar gael, y bydd Gweinidogion y DU yn manteisio ar y cyfle i edrych ar hwnnw eto. Byddai'n llawer gwell gennyf weld, cyn etholiad cyffredinol, fod cyfle i ailystyried ac achub y swyddi hyn. Byddai hynny'n ymdrin â'r ansicrwydd rydych chi'n sôn amdano y mae teuluoedd yn ei wynebu, ac mae'n ddealladwy bod gwir ddicter ymhlith y teuluoedd hynny ynghylch cynigion pan fo'r gweithlu wedi bod mor hyblyg, maen nhw wedi gwneud camau ar ystod eang o faterion, gan gynnwys newid eu pensiynau yn y gorffennol hefyd, i sicrhau y gall y busnes oroesi a bod â dyfodol.
Ond ar eich pwyntiau ehangach ynghylch gwaith a hyfforddiant, bydd hynny'n dibynnu ar yr angen o ran y cynnig terfynol. Oherwydd mae gennym gynigion nawr a gallant newid o hyd, nid dim ond y canlyniad terfynol yw'r hyn yr hoffem ei weld, bydd angen i ni weld yr amserlen yn ogystal â'r canlyniad terfynol yn arwain at gynigion y bydd wedyn angen hyfforddiant ar eu cyfer. Rwyf eisoes wedi nodi, os nad yw ein cyllidebau presennol yn diwallu'r angen sy'n bodoli, byddwn yn edrych eto yn fy adran ar sut y gallem symud cyllidebau i ddiwallu'r angen. Ond bydd yr Aelod yn gwybod, yn enwedig gan i mi fod o flaen ei bwyllgor yr wythnos diwethaf ar graffu, mae'r adnodd sydd ar gael i ni yn gyfyngedig. Ond mae hwn yn faes lle mae'n bosibl y bydd angen i ni symud materion o gwmpas, yn dibynnu ar faint yr angen. Ac mae hynny i gyd yn dibynnu ar yr ymgynghoriad a'r canlyniadau a ddaw yn ei sgil.
Ar waith y bwrdd trawsnewid, unwaith eto, mae'n dibynnu ar sut y gellid defnyddio arian, gan ddibynnu ar y fargen derfynol neu'r penderfyniad terfynol a wneir mewn gwirionedd. Rwyf eisoes wedi ei gwneud yn glir bod angen ymgysylltu â'r gwasanaeth iechyd—os bydd diswyddiadau ar raddfa fawr, mae angen gofal iechyd ychwanegol bob amser ynghylch hynny hefyd—ac â'r cyngor, Cyngor Castell-nedd Port Talbot, gan edrych ar rywfaint o waith datblygu lleol, ond hefyd yr her ehangach a'r cyfle o weithio gyda bargen twf bae Abertawe, oherwydd eu bod yn edrych ar wahanol gyfleoedd o amgylch yr economi.
Yn sicr, byddai angen i'r bwrdd trawsnewid gydnabod a pharchu'r ffaith bod nifer o'r meysydd lle bydd angen cymorth ac y bydd yn cael ei ddarparu wedi'u datganoli. A dweud y gwir, yn y gorffennol, pan fu heriau eraill yn ymwneud â chyflogaeth, er enghraifft, boed hynny yn sir Fynwy neu Flaenau Gwent neu Ynys Môn, rydym wedi cael perthynas waith ymarferol rhwng y cyngor, Llywodraeth Cymru ac, yn wir, yr Adran Gwaith a Phensiynau ar lefel leol. Felly, os bydd diswyddiadau, yna byddwn yn disgwyl i ni feithrin dull gweithredu aeddfed i sicrhau ein bod yn helpu pobl cystal ag y gallwn.
Cefais sgwrs gyda grwpiau busnes ddoe am effaith uniongyrchol ac anuniongyrchol y colledion swyddi posibl, ac mae'r Athro David Worsley o Brifysgol Abertawe wedi cadarnhau bod o leiaf tair swydd ychwanegol yn dibynnu ar bob un swydd uniongyrchol yn y gwaith dur, ac weithiau, o bosibl hyd at bump. Felly, rydyn ni wir yn sôn am nid dim ond 2,800—rydyn ni'n sôn am dros 10,000 o swyddi sy'n ddibynnol ar y penderfyniad hwn o fewn economi Cymru. Rhan o'r her yw y gallai gwaith arall fod ar gael, ond mae gweithwyr dur yn cael eu talu'n dda iawn. Felly, efallai y bydd pobl yn dod o hyd i waith arall ond nid o reidrwydd ar yr un raddfa. Felly, nifer y swyddi a'r ansawdd a'r canlyniadau yn y swyddi hynny sy'n bwysig i ni.
Rydym yn credu y gellid cadw ffwrnais chwyth 4 ar agor gyda chefnogaeth ychwanegol. Rwy'n credu y byddai'n rhoi gwerth ychwanegol hefyd. Mae hynny'n achos yr ydym wedi parhau i'w wneud gyda'r cwmni a byddwn yn parhau i wneud hynny. O ran hydrogen a lleihau haearn yn uniongyrchol a mathau eraill o newidiadau i ddyfodol gwneud dur, mae cyferbyniad rhwng y dull sy'n cael ei ddefnyddio yn y DU a'r dull sy'n cael ei ddefnyddio yn yr Iseldiroedd, lle mae gan Tata hefyd waith dur sylweddol. Yno, mae yna sgwrs wahanol, gyda chymhellion yn cael eu trafod i ddatblygu dyfodol, gan gynnwys gwneud dur gyda hydrogen fel posibilrwydd. Felly, mae'r sgwrs wahanol honno'n golygu bod canlyniadau gwahanol ar gyfer dyfodol cynhyrchu dur yn yr Iseldiroedd.
Nawr, rwy'n credu y gallwn gael yr un uchelgais a gallwn gael gwell canlyniadau yma i weithwyr dur Cymru. Bydd yn golygu gwneud dur arc trydan yn rhan o'r dyfodol, ond nid wyf yn derbyn mai'r cynigion sydd wedi'u cyhoeddi hyd yma yw'r unig ffordd i gyrraedd dyfodol, ar gyfer dyfodol cynhyrchu dur yng Nghymru a'r DU, a'r holl ganlyniadau i economi heddiw ac, yn wir, y dyfodol.
Of course, mine and Plaid Cymru’s solidarity is with the workers, the community of Port Talbot, surrounding communities throughout south-west Wales, from Llanelli right across to Bridgend and beyond, where many members of the workforce and their families live, and of course the trade unions who have worked incredibly hard to avoid the announcement made last week.
The announcement came while Tata Steel Ltd, the parent company of Tata Steel UK, is quite profitable. Tata Steel Ltd made £3 billion in earnings before interest, taxes and depreciation, and £900 million in net profits in 2022-23. Tata Steel Ltd also has reserves of £1.6 billion and paid dividends out to shareholders of £1.4 billion between 2019 and 2023. At the same time, Tata has sites in India and the EU that are already profiting from steel imports into the UK that potentially will now only stand to profit even more from the waning steel industry in the UK.
I think this is important background information for us to remember. Whilst we are told to welcome the £500 million from UK Government, in what situation is £500 million for 2,800 job losses, the loss of capacity to produce primary steel, and the potential to flood the UK market with foreign steel a good deal? There’s an important question that needs to be considered here. Are we comfortable with going down this path laid before us of potentially losing the ability to produce primary steel and, as the Minister has already said, the UK becoming the only member of the G20 unable to do so? There is no net zero, there is no green economy, without steel. Diversification of steel production is key, and putting everything into electric arc furnaces is not the right way forward. We’ve heard about direct reduced iron, we’ve heard about hydrogen already. So, how will Welsh Government proceed with the UK Government on this?
It was shocking but not surprising to learn over the weekend that UK Government, through the Prime Minister, once again has refused to engage constructively with the Welsh Government to protect jobs at Tata. Does the Minister agree with me that this is yet another indication that no UK Government can ultimately be trusted to stand up for Wales, and will he outline the steps he is taking to ensure that the Welsh Government has its rightful seat at the table?
Critically, will the Minister support our calls for the nationalisation of the Tata site in Port Talbot, especially if they choose to continue with their current proposal? Because, simply, we cannot continue on the path of throwing money at private entities, as we have been doing, only for them to then make decisions like this anyway, especially when it comes to strategic resources. Nationalisation is needed as a bridge to securing the long-term viability and diversity of domestic steel production in Wales. Investment is needed in the billions, like we’ve seen in Germany, like we’ve seen in France and Spain. Five-hundred million pounds doesn’t even touch the sides. So, I would hope that a Welsh Labour Minister would stand with us on this.
On what Welsh Government can do immediately, upskilling workers for the green steel sector and wider green economy will be essential. So, would the Minister consider further Plaid Cymru’s proposals for a national skills audit, so that we then have the data to identify those gaps in the green steel industry, in the green economy, and then use that data to decide how we fill them? We know that apprenticeships will also play a key part in this programme of upskilling, so will the Government also agree with calls to look again at the apprenticeship budget? He indicated that he would be willing to do this in an interview on Sunday morning. He indicated again that he would be potentially willing to do this in response to Paul Davies. But would this apply more broadly to the apprenticeship budget?
The reality is that if we don’t get this right, future generations will not thank us for our inaction to preserve the steel industry for them.
Wrth gwrs, mae undod Plaid Cymru a minnau â'r gweithwyr, cymuned Port Talbot, cymunedau cyfagos ledled de-orllewin Cymru, o Lanelli ar draws i Ben-y-bont ar Ogwr a thu hwnt, lle mae llawer o aelodau'r gweithlu a'u teuluoedd yn byw, ac wrth gwrs yr undebau llafur sydd wedi gweithio'n eithriadol o galed i osgoi'r cyhoeddiad a wnaed yr wythnos diwethaf.
Daeth y cyhoeddiad pan fo Tata Steel Ltd, rhiant-gwmni Tata Steel UK, yn eithaf proffidiol. Gwnaeth Tata Steel Ltd £3 biliwn mewn enillion cyn llog, trethi a dibrisiant, a £900 miliwn mewn elw net yn 2022-23. Mae gan Tata Steel Ltd gronfeydd wrth gefn o £1.6 biliwn hefyd, a thalwyd difidendau o £1.4 biliwn i gyfranddalwyr rhwng 2019 a 2023. Ar yr un pryd, mae gan Tata safleoedd yn India a'r UE sydd eisoes yn gwneud elw wrth fewnforio dur i'r DU a fydd o bosibl yn cynyddu hyd yn oed yn fwy ar draul diwydiant dur sy'n gwaethygu yn y DU.
Rwy'n credu bod hon yn wybodaeth gefndirol bwysig i ni ei chofio. Er y dywedir wrthym i groesawu'r £500 miliwn gan Lywodraeth y DU, ym mha sefyllfa y mae £500 miliwn ar gyfer colli 2,800 o swyddi, colli capasiti i gynhyrchu dur primaidd, a'r potensial i orlenwi marchnad y DU gyda dur tramor yn fargen dda? Mae yna gwestiwn pwysig sydd angen ei ystyried yma. A ydym yn gyfforddus ynghylch dilyn y llwybr hwn a osodwyd o'n blaenau a fydd o bosibl yn arwain at golli'r gallu i gynhyrchu dur primaidd ac, fel y mae'r Gweinidog eisoes wedi'i ddweud, y DU yw'r unig aelod o'r G20 nad yw'n gallu gwneud hynny? Nid oes sero net, nid oes economi werdd, heb ddur. Mae arallgyfeirio cynhyrchu dur yn allweddol, ac nid rhoi popeth mewn ffwrneisi arc trydan yw'r ffordd gywir ymlaen. Rydyn ni wedi clywed am leihau haearn yn uniongyrchol, rydyn ni wedi clywed am hydrogen yn barod. Felly, sut y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn symud ymlaen gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar hyn?
Roedd yn frawychus ond nid yn syndod dysgu dros y penwythnos bod Llywodraeth y DU, drwy ei Phrif Weinidog, unwaith eto, wedi gwrthod ymgysylltu'n adeiladol â Llywodraeth Cymru i ddiogelu swyddi yn Tata. A yw'r Gweinidog yn cytuno â mi fod hyn yn arwydd arall eto na ellir ymddiried mewn unrhyw Lywodraeth y DU yn y pen draw i sefyll dros Gymru, ac a wnaiff amlinellu'r camau y mae'n eu cymryd i sicrhau bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru ei sedd briodol wrth y bwrdd?
Yn allweddol, a wnaiff y Gweinidog gefnogi ein galwadau am wladoli safle Tata ym Mhort Talbot, yn enwedig os ydynt yn dewis parhau â'u cynnig presennol? Oherwydd, yn syml, ni allwn barhau ar y llwybr o daflu arian at endidau preifat, fel yr ydym wedi bod yn ei wneud, dim ond iddynt wneud penderfyniadau fel hyn beth bynnag, yn enwedig o ran adnoddau strategol. Mae angen gwladoli fel pont i sicrhau hyfywedd ac amrywiaeth hirdymor cynhyrchu dur domestig yng Nghymru. Mae angen buddsoddi biliynau, fel y gwelsom yn yr Almaen, fel y gwelsom yn Ffrainc a Sbaen. Mae pum can miliwn o bunnau yn hollol annigonol. Felly, byddwn yn gobeithio y byddai Gweinidog Llafur Cymru yn sefyll gyda ni ar hyn.
O ran yr hyn y gall Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud ar unwaith, bydd uwchsgilio gweithwyr ar gyfer y sector dur gwyrdd a'r economi werdd ehangach yn hanfodol. Felly, a fyddai'r Gweinidog yn ystyried cynigion Plaid Cymru ymhellach ar gyfer archwiliad sgiliau cenedlaethol, fel bod gennym y data wedyn i nodi'r bylchau hynny yn y diwydiant dur gwyrdd, yn yr economi werdd, ac yna defnyddio'r data hwnnw i benderfynu sut rydym yn eu llenwi? Rydym yn gwybod y bydd prentisiaethau hefyd yn chwarae rhan allweddol yn y rhaglen hon o uwchsgilio, felly a fydd y Llywodraeth hefyd yn cytuno â galwadau i edrych eto ar gyllideb prentisiaethau? Nododd y byddai'n fodlon gwneud hyn mewn cyfweliad fore Sul. Nododd eto y byddai o bosib yn fodlon gwneud hyn mewn ymateb i Paul Davies. Ond a fyddai hynny'n berthnasol yn fwy eang i'r gyllideb prentisiaethau?
Y gwir amdani yw, os na chawn hyn yn iawn, ni fydd cenedlaethau'r dyfodol yn diolch i ni am ein diffyg gweithredu i ddiogelu'r diwydiant dur ar eu cyfer.
Thank you for the comments and questions. I'll start with the final couple of points of detail, because on apprentices, we've already been clear that the big cliff edge has been thrust upon us because of the way that former EU funds have been taken away from us, and the way they've been deliberately designed to ensure they can't be used on a strategic all-Wales programme. I've been very clear that I want to see, when the funds are restored, a reinvestment into a strategic all-Wales programme around apprenticeships.
When it comes, though, to the current budget consultation, it is exactly that: that in making a proposal to spend more in one area we have to be able to find that money from somewhere else. Now, we're going through a scrutiny process. We had some of this conversation last week, before the Tata announcement, when I was in front of the committee chaired by Paul Davies. And again, we will look at any proposals that come from committees, but we have to balance and understand that there are other committees who are looking at subject areas who are also asking for additional spending commitments.
When I was in front of the committee chaired by Delyth Jewell, with Dawn Bowden, we went through some of the challenges in the arm's-length bodies, in the arts and culture field. There are really difficult budget choices being made there and the committee was urging us to find the money to do something different there as well. That's part of the honest challenge we have within the current budget round. We will, of course—because it is a genuine consultation—look at opportunities and avenues to move money around, but we don't have the ability to produce a significant amount of additional money that we don't yet have. So, any serious engagement around that, that looks at what each different committee is doing, will of course get taken seriously by the Government.
On your point around a skills audit, we're committed already to a net-zero skills plan and we're going through a consultation in a range of areas. So, we'll have the information, I think, about the skills needs in different parts of our economy and how to match the needs of workers around that, both with longer term courses like apprenticeships, but also shorter term courses where people need to, whilst in the world of work, continue to uprate and regain skills, as well as the support we provide for people who go through a period of unemployment. As the First Minister pointed out in relation to the NHS earlier, the great majority of the workforce of the future is with us already. In 10 years' time, most of our workforce will be people who are already in work today. So, yes, we need to focus on people coming into the labour market new at an early point in their life, but we also need to think about how we help people in the world of work today.
On your broader points about nationalisation, I think the honest truth is that nationalisation is a red herring. The future and the challenges that our workers face today in the steel industry are not going to be resolved by us running a campaign on nationalisation. We need to be able to either persuade the current UK Government to have a different investment perspective, or we need to be able to persuade a future UK Government to have a different investment perspective that can actually make sure that those blast furnaces are still alive at the end of this calendar year, and a different conversation about what that investment would look like.
Now, I think that's an honest conversation to be had and, actually, on the occasions that I've met shop stewards—I met about 40 shop stewards on the Friday when I was in Port Talbot, and there were about 70 shop stewards and other reps from across three different sites yesterday, when I was in Port Talbot as well—they understand that the campaign for the future is a practical one with the company and with the UK Government, and they also understand that a conversation around nationalisation may look good on a pamphlet, but it won't help to save those workers' jobs in the here and now. And I think we need to be intensely practical about what we are going to do to make sure that the hope is real and founded on the opportunity to invest in the future.
I know you made the point about, 'Can you trust any UK Government?', and I appreciate you're ideologically committed to that perspective and that's fine, you're entitled to be. I think a future UK Labour Government can be trusted. The £3 billion green steel transition fund is one of the significant, headline spending pledges that has been made and it's been made very clear by a number of different UK frontbench colleagues that actually this is a commitment that would be available for the transition that Tata want to undertake. And, actually, the plan that is there to keep a blast furnace alive for a generally just transition, you would not need all of the £3 billion fund to do that. So, actually, I think it is both a credible and an understood to be credible offer to the sector, and I do think that opens the way to a different future, not the one that is currently being discussed today.
But on your starting points about the only G20 economy not to make virgin steel, it's a point we have made in public and in private. I had that as part of a conversation today with Minister Ghani and David T.C. Davies. We think that there is a different future and one where UK security is not compromised. As I said, something as simple as cans, cars and construction all require virgin steel today for elements of them, never mind the opportunities for floating offshore wind. What I want: the steel that goes into those platforms to create that offshore wind, I want it to be made in Wales, with Welsh workers manufacturing that as well. That's an opportunity that we could have if we can save the sector for the future and have a genuinely just transition, that must be a longer one.
Diolch am y sylwadau a'r cwestiynau. Dechreuaf gyda'r ychydig bwyntiau olaf o ran manylion, oherwydd ar brentisiaid, rydym eisoes wedi bod yn glir bod ymyl y clogwyn mawr wedi'i wthio arnom oherwydd y ffordd y mae cronfeydd blaenorol yr UE wedi'u cymryd oddi arnom, a'r ffordd y cawsant eu cynllunio'n fwriadol i sicrhau na ellir eu defnyddio ar raglen strategol i Gymru gyfan. Rwyf wedi bod yn glir iawn fy mod eisiau gweld, pan fydd y cronfeydd yn cael eu hadfer, ail-fuddsoddi mewn rhaglen strategol i Gymru gyfan yn ymwneud â phrentisiaethau.
O ran yr ymgynghoriad cyllideb presennol serch hynny, dyna'n union sydd yma: wrth wneud cynnig i wario mwy mewn un maes mae'n rhaid i ni allu dod o hyd i'r arian hwnnw o rywle arall. Nawr, rydyn ni'n mynd trwy broses graffu. Cawsom rywfaint o'r sgwrs hon yr wythnos diwethaf, cyn cyhoeddiad Tata, pan oeddwn o flaen y pwyllgor dan gadeiryddiaeth Paul Davies. Ac eto, byddwn yn edrych ar unrhyw gynigion sy'n dod gan bwyllgorau, ond mae'n rhaid i ni gydbwyso a deall bod pwyllgorau eraill yn edrych ar feysydd pwnc sydd hefyd yn gofyn am ymrwymiadau gwario ychwanegol.
Pan oeddwn o flaen y pwyllgor dan gadeiryddiaeth Delyth Jewell, gyda Dawn Bowden, aethom drwy rai o'r heriau yn y cyrff hyd braich, ym maes y celfyddydau a diwylliant. Mae dewisiadau cyllidebol anodd iawn yn cael eu gwneud yno ac roedd y pwyllgor yn ein hannog i ddod o hyd i'r arian i wneud rhywbeth gwahanol yno hefyd. Mae hynny'n rhan o'r her onest sydd gennym o fewn rownd y gyllideb bresennol. Byddwn, wrth gwrs—oherwydd ei fod yn ymgynghoriad gwirioneddol—yn edrych ar gyfleoedd a llwybrau i symud arian o gwmpas, ond does gennym ni ddim y gallu i gynhyrchu swm sylweddol o arian ychwanegol nad oes gennym ni eto. Felly, bydd unrhyw ymgysylltiad difrifol ynghylch hynny, sy'n edrych ar yr hyn y mae pob pwyllgor gwahanol yn ei wneud, wrth gwrs, yn cael ei gymryd o ddifrif gan y Llywodraeth.
Ar eich pwynt ynghylch archwiliad sgiliau, rydym eisoes wedi ymrwymo i gynllun sgiliau sero net ac rydym yn mynd trwy ymgynghoriad mewn ystod o feysydd. Felly, bydd gennym yr wybodaeth, rwy'n credu, am anghenion sgiliau mewn gwahanol rannau o'n heconomi a sut i gyd-fynd ag anghenion gweithwyr yn gysylltiedig â hynny, gyda chyrsiau tymor hwy fel prentisiaethau, ond hefyd cyrsiau tymor byrrach lle mae angen i bobl, tra byddant yn y byd gwaith, barhau i wella ac adennill sgiliau, yn ogystal â'r cymorth a ddarparwn i bobl sy'n mynd trwy gyfnod o ddiweithdra. Fel y nododd y Prif Weinidog mewn cysylltiad â'r GIG yn gynharach, mae mwyafrif helaeth gweithlu'r dyfodol gyda ni eisoes. Ymhen 10 mlynedd, bydd y rhan fwyaf o'n gweithlu yn bobl sydd eisoes mewn gwaith heddiw. Felly, oes, mae angen i ni ganolbwyntio ar bobl sy'n dod i mewn i'r farchnad lafur sy'n newydd ac ar adeg gynnar yn eu bywyd, ond mae angen i ni hefyd feddwl am sut rydyn ni'n helpu pobl yn y byd gwaith heddiw.
O ran eich pwyntiau ehangach am wladoli, credaf mai'r gwir onest yw mai codi sgwarnogod yw gwladoli. Nid yw'r dyfodol na'r heriau y mae ein gweithwyr yn eu hwynebu heddiw yn y diwydiant dur yn mynd i gael eu datrys trwy gynnal ymgyrch ar wladoli. Mae angen i ni naill ai berswadio Llywodraeth bresennol y DU i fod â phersbectif buddsoddi gwahanol, neu mae angen i ni allu perswadio Llywodraeth y DU yn y dyfodol i fod â phersbectif buddsoddi gwahanol a all wneud yn siŵr bod y ffwrneisi chwyth hynny yn dal yn fyw ar ddiwedd y flwyddyn galendr hon, a sgwrs wahanol am sut olwg fyddai ar y buddsoddiad hwnnw.
Nawr, rwy'n credu bod honno'n sgwrs onest i'w chael ac, mewn gwirionedd, ar yr achlysuron pryd rwyf wedi cwrdd â stiwardiaid llawr gwaith—cwrddais â thua 40 o stiwardiaid llawr gwaith ar y dydd Gwener pan oeddwn ym Mhort Talbot, ac roedd tua 70 o stiwardiaid llawr gwaith a chynrychiolwyr eraill o dri safle gwahanol ddoe, pan oeddwn i ym Mhort Talbot hefyd—maen nhw'n deall bod yr ymgyrch ar gyfer y dyfodol yn un ymarferol gyda'r cwmni a gyda Llywodraeth y DU, ac maent hefyd yn deall y gallai sgwrs ynghylch gwladoli edrych yn dda ar bamffled, ond ni fydd yn helpu i achub swyddi'r gweithwyr hynny heddiw. Ac rwy'n credu bod angen i ni fod yn hynod ymarferol ynglŷn â'r hyn rydyn ni'n mynd i'w wneud i sicrhau bod y gobaith yn real ac yn seiliedig ar y cyfle i fuddsoddi yn y dyfodol.
Rwy'n gwybod eich bod wedi gwneud y pwynt 'A allwch chi ymddiried mewn unrhyw Lywodraeth y DU?', ac rwy'n gwerthfawrogi eich bod wedi ymrwymo'n ideolegol i'r safbwynt hwnnw ac mae hynny'n iawn, mae gennych hawl i wneud hynny. Rwy'n credu y gellir ymddiried mewn Llywodraeth Lafur y DU yn y dyfodol. Mae'r gronfa trawsnewid i ddur gwyrdd gwerth £3 biliwn yn un o'r prif addewidion gwariant sylweddol sydd wedi'u gwneud ac mae nifer o wahanol gydweithwyr mainc flaen y DU wedi ei gwneud yn glir iawn bod hyn mewn gwirionedd yn ymrwymiad a fyddai ar gael ar gyfer y trawsnewidiad y mae Tata eisiau ei wneud. Ac, mewn gwirionedd, y cynllun sydd yno i gadw ffwrnais chwyth yn fyw ar gyfer trawsnewidiad teg yn gyffredinol, ni fyddai angen y gronfa £3 biliwn gyfan arnoch i wneud hynny. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, credaf ei fod yn gynnig credadwy a dealladwy i'r sector, ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n agor y ffordd i ddyfodol gwahanol, nid yr un sy'n cael ei drafod heddiw.
Ond ynghylch eich pwyntiau cychwynol am yr unig economi G20 i beidio â gwneud dur crai, mae'n bwynt yr ydym wedi'i wneud yn gyhoeddus ac yn breifat. Roedd yn rhan o sgwrs heddiw gyda'r Gweinidog Ghani a David T.C. Davies. Credwn fod dyfodol gwahanol ac un pryd nad yw diogelwch y DU yn cael ei beryglu. Fel y dywedais i, mae rhywbeth mor syml â chaniau, ceir ac adeiladu i gyd angen dur crai heddiw ar gyfer elfennau ohonynt, heb sôn am y cyfleoedd ar gyfer gwynt arnofiol ar y môr. Yr hyn yr wyf yn dymuno: y dur sy'n mynd i mewn i'r llwyfannau hynny i greu'r gwynt ar y môr hwnnw, rwyf am iddo gael ei wneud yng Nghymru, gyda gweithwyr Cymru yn cynhyrchu hwnnw hefyd. Mae hynny'n gyfle y gallem ei gael os gallwn achub y sector ar gyfer y dyfodol a chael trawsnewidiad gwirioneddol gyfiawn, rhaid i hywnnw fod yn un hirach.
Minister, I'm standing here today representing my town, my communities, who have lived within sight of the steel works for the whole of their lives. In fact, for the whole of my life, I have lived within sight of the steelworks. We are devastated by the news that came last Friday from Tata about the closure, before the end of this year, of the blast furnaces and the heavy end in total, with thousands of jobs going. That puts a lot of people in fear of what their future is like—their families, and the whole community, as to what businesses—. Paul Davies highlighted the supply chain and the contractors that are likely to lose work as a consequence of this as well.
Minister, I agree with everything that you said in your statement, and I echo those comments and thank you very much. I want to thank you personally, and the First Minister, for your continued commitment to steel and the communities that we represent. That commitment is unquestionable. I have to say that I am disappointed that the UK Government's commitment is not the same. What we have seen is a deal that has been brokered that has no consideration of the future process of how we get there. A deal that didn't put commitments on Tata about making sure that the transition was just and fair, and allowed businesses to actually progress to a smooth transition, meaning that people could stay in work, be retrained while in work—not while unemployed, but while in work.
Do you agree with me, therefore, that the UK Government has failed our communities? It has failed those people who, so often, have worked hard to make sure that their lives were able to go on? And will you make sure that the message is clear? The leader of the opposition and Paul Davies can convey this message back to London. This is not the right path for steel making in the UK. They need to revisit their ideas. They need to put commitments to Tata, to say, 'We need primary steel making. We need blast furnace 4 continuing to the end.' I urge Tata to think about it. At the end of this year, there will be a different Government in place, and I hope that they don't make the wrong decision between now and then.
Gweinidog, rwy'n sefyll yma heddiw yn cynrychioli fy nhref, fy nghymunedau, sydd wedi byw o fewn golwg y gweithfeydd dur ar hyd eu hoes. Yn wir, ar hyd fy oes, rwyf wedi byw o fewn golwg y gwaith dur. Rydym wedi ein llorio gan y newyddion a ddaeth ddydd Gwener diwethaf gan Tata ynghylch cau, cyn diwedd eleni, y ffwrneisi chwyth a'r pen trwm i gyd, gyda miloedd o swyddi'n mynd. Mae hynny'n peri ofn i lawer o bobl ynghylch eu dyfodol—eu teuluoedd, a'r gymuned gyfan, o ran sut mae busnesau—. Tynnodd Paul Davies sylw at y gadwyn gyflenwi a'r contractwyr sy'n debygol o golli gwaith o ganlyniad i hyn hefyd.
Gweinidog, rwy'n cytuno â phopeth a ddywedoch yn eich datganiad, ac rwy'n adleisio'r sylwadau hynny a diolch yn fawr iawn. Hoffwn ddiolch i chi'n bersonol, a'r Prif Weinidog, am eich ymrwymiad parhaus i ddur a'r cymunedau yr ydym yn eu cynrychioli. Mae'r ymrwymiad hwn yn ddiamheuol. Mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud fy mod yn siomedig nad yw ymrwymiad Llywodraeth y DU yr un fath. Yr hyn yr ydym wedi'i weld yw cytundeb sydd wedi'i frocera nad yw'n ystyried y broses yn y dyfodol o sut rydym yn cyrraedd yno. Cytundeb nad oedd yn rhoi ymrwymiadau ar Tata ynghylch gwneud yn siŵr bod y trawsnewidiad yn deg, ac yn caniatáu i fusnesau symud ymlaen mewn gwirionedd i drawsnewidiad llyfn, sy'n golygu y gallai pobl aros mewn gwaith, cael eu hailhyfforddi tra eu bod mewn gwaith—nid tra eu bod yn ddi-waith, ond tra eu bod mewn gwaith.
A ydych chi'n cytuno â mi, felly, bod Llywodraeth y DU wedi siomi ein cymunedau? Mae wedi siomi'r bobl hynny sydd, mor aml, wedi gweithio'n galed i sicrhau bod eu bywyd yn gallu parhau? A wnewch chi sicrhau bod y neges yn glir? Gall arweinydd yr wrthblaid a Paul Davies gyfleu'r neges hon yn ôl i Lundain. Nid dyma'r llwybr cywir ar gyfer gwneud dur yn y Deyrnas Unedig. Mae'n rhaid iddyn nhw ailedrych ar eu syniadau. Mae angen iddyn nhw roi ymrwymiadau i Tata, i ddweud, 'Mae angen gwneud dur primaidd. Mae angen i ffwrnais chwyth 4 barhau hyd y diwedd.' Rwy'n pwyso ar Tata i feddwl am y peth. Ar ddiwedd y flwyddyn hon, bydd Llywodraeth wahanol yn ei lle, ac rwy'n gobeithio nad ydyn nhw'n gwneud y penderfyniad anghywir rhwng nawr a hynny.
Thank you, David. I think that David Rees is right, and you don't just need to take my word for it. It could not have been clearer. The shop stewards that I met from all three trade unions are steel workers on that site. I met them on Friday. I met a larger group yesterday as well. There is real anxiety for their communities' future, not just their individual families, and there is real anger. That is both directed at the company—and you can understand, and I think that the company understands, that people will be angry with proposals on that scale—but also at the UK Government.
There were lots of questions being asked about why there weren't commitments on a transition for the length of time that it would take. At the moment, the proposal is that all of those jobs will be lost within 18 months, but the electric arc furnace won't be ready to be switched on during that time. So, actually, you will find a significant period of time, under these proposals, as we understand them, where steel making would not exist and would be recreated in the future. There would have been an opportunity to roll steel that is made in other parts of the world.
Now, it's not difficult to understand why any steel worker who is currently working in Port Talbot, Llanwern or Trostre doesn't think that that's a great future for them. But that's the strategy that has been outlined thus far. And I really do welcome the fact that Paul Davies and Andrew R.T. Davies have been prepared to stand up, not just today but also yesterday as well, and to make clear that they want to see support for an alternative future. The challenge is whether the UK Government will do so. Because people won't forget if this choice goes ahead, and it goes ahead in the proposals that have been made before a general election.
I have been clear in direct conversations with the company, in addition to public statements—and I know that Keir Starmer has as well—not to make an irreversible choice this side of a general election. There would be a different conversation to be had, and a different level of co-investment that could be possible. And the point is that this is part of the UK's sovereign assets. It is part of UK security not to be reliant on competitor economies for imports of metal that we do not have an alternative for as we speak now. That may be possible in the future, but we need to get there.
And it's not just that, but every one of us will know: if you have supply chains that take place for four to five years on imports that take place, it will be very hard to displace those again in the future. I hope that the UK Government will pay attention to what has been said in this Chamber across more than one party, and also, importantly, will listen to real experts about the business of steel making. Because the workforce in Port Talbot have been flexible, adaptable and highly committed, and I think that that loyalty and ability deserves a better hearing than it has had so far.
Diolch yn fawr, David. Rwy'n credu bod David Rees yn iawn, ac nid oes angen i chi gymryd fy ngair i yn unig. Ni allai fod wedi bod yn gliriach. Gweithwyr dur ar y safle hwnnw yw'r stiwardiaid llawr gwaith y gwnes i gwrdd â nhw o'r tri undeb llafur. Cwrddais i â nhw ddydd Llun. Mi wnes i gyfarfod â grŵp mwy o bobl ddoe hefyd. Mae pryder gwirioneddol am ddyfodol eu cymunedau, nid dim ond eu teuluoedd unigol, ac mae gwir ddicter. Mae hynny'n cael ei gyfeirio at y cwmni—a gallwch ddeall, a chredaf fod y cwmni'n deall, y bydd pobl yn ddig gyda chynigion ar y raddfa honno—ond hefyd at Lywodraeth y DU.
Roedd llawer o gwestiynau yn cael eu gofyn ynghylch pam nad oedd ymrwymiadau ar drawsnewidiad, ynghylch faint o amser y byddai'n ei gymryd. Ar hyn o bryd, y cynnig yw y bydd yr holl swyddi hynny'n cael eu colli o fewn 18 mis, ond ni fydd y ffwrnais arc trydan yn barod i gael ei thanio yn ystod y cyfnod hwnnw. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, fe welwch gyfnod sylweddol o amser, o dan y cynigion hyn, fel yr ydym yn eu deall, pan na fyddai cynhyrchu dur yn bodoli ac y byddai'n cael ei ail-greu yn y dyfodol. Byddai cyfle wedi bod i rolio dur sy'n cael ei wneud mewn rhannau eraill o'r byd.
Nawr, nid yw'n anodd deall pam nad yw unrhyw weithiwr dur sydd ar hyn o bryd yn gweithio ym Mhort Talbot, Llanwern neu Drostre yn credu bod hynny'n ddyfodol gwych iddyn nhw. Ond dyna'r strategaeth sydd wedi'i hamlinellu hyd yn hyn. Ac rwyf wir yn croesawu'r ffaith bod Paul Davies ac Andrew R.T. Davies wedi bod yn barod i sefyll i fyny, nid yn unig heddiw ond ddoe hefyd, ac i egluro eu bod eisiau gweld cefnogaeth ar gyfer dyfodol amgen. Yr her yw a fydd Llywodraeth y DU yn gwneud hynny. Oherwydd ni fydd pobl yn anghofio pe bai'r dewis hwn yn mynd yn ei flaen, a bwrir ymlaen â'r cynigion sydd wedi'u gwneud cyn etholiad cyffredinol.
Rwyf wedi bod yn glir mewn sgyrsiau uniongyrchol gyda'r cwmni, yn ogystal â datganiadau cyhoeddus—a felly hefyd Keir Starmer—i beidio â gwneud dewis di-droi'n-ôl cyn yr etholiad cyffredinol. Byddai sgwrs wahanol i'w chael, a lefel wahanol o gyd-fuddsoddi a allai fod yn bosibl. A'r pwynt yw bod hyn yn rhan o asedau sofran y DU. Mae'n rhan o ddiogelwch y DU i beidio â dibynnu ar economïau cystadleuwyr am fewnforion metel nad oes gennym ddewis arall ar ei gyfer wrth i ni siarad nawr. Efallai y bydd hyn yn bosibl yn y dyfodol, ond mae'n rhaid i ni gyrraedd yno.
Ac nid dim ond hynny, ond bydd pob un ohonom yn gwybod: os oes gennych gadwyni cyflenwi sy'n digwydd am bedair i bum mlynedd ar fewnforion, bydd yn anodd iawn disodli'r rheini eto yn y dyfodol. Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd Llywodraeth y DU yn talu sylw i'r hyn a ddywedwyd yn y Siambr hon ar draws mwy nag un blaid, a hefyd, yn bwysig, yn gwrando ar arbenigwyr go iawn am fusnes cynhyrchu dur. Oherwydd mae'r gweithlu ym Mhort Talbot wedi bod yn hyblyg, yn barod i addasu ac yn ymroddedig iawn, a chredaf fod y teyrngarwch a'r gallu hwnnw yn haeddu gwell gwrandawiad nag y mae wedi'i gael hyd yn hyn.
Thank you for your statement, Minister. While the announcement on Friday was not a shock, it was still a devastating blow for my constituents. Minister, what is your plan for Port Talbot? Your statement is very critical of the deal struck by the UK Government, but contains no alternatives. Do you accept that Tata has wholly rejected the plan put forward by the unions, a plan, I might add, that not even the unions could agree upon? Therefore, if we are to minimise job losses, we need a credible alternative. Minister, your Westminster colleagues, and many colleagues here, talk about Labour's £3 billion plan for green steel, but you have yet to provide details. Can you elaborate, or is this more rhetoric rather than a credible alternative to steel recycling?
Diolch am eich datganiad, Gweinidog. Er nad oedd y cyhoeddiad ddydd Gwener yn sioc, roedd yn dal yn ergyd drom i fy etholwyr. Gweinidog, beth yw eich cynllun ar gyfer Port Talbot? Mae eich datganiad yn feirniadol iawn o'r fargen a gafodd ei tharo gan Lywodraeth y DU, ond nid yw'n cynnwys unrhyw ddewisiadau eraill. A ydych yn derbyn bod Tata wedi gwrthod yn llwyr y cynllun a gyflwynwyd gan yr undebau, cynllun, fe ddwedaf hefyd, na allai'r undebau hyd yn oed gytuno arno? Felly, os ydym am leihau'r colledion swyddi, mae angen dewis arall credadwy arnom. Gweinidog, mae eich cydweithwyr yn San Steffan, a llawer o gyd-Aelodau yma, yn sôn am gynllun Llafur gwerth £3 biliwn ar gyfer dur gwyrdd, ond nid ydych wedi darparu manylion eto. Allwch chi ymhelaethu, neu a yw hyn yn fwy o rethreg yn hytrach na dewis arall credadwy yn lle ailgylchu dur?
I think there's more to admire in party loyalty than in a grasp of the issues in that contribution. I've been very clear that there is an alternative. The company itself has been clear that it's a credible plan, but it's not affordable. With a different UK Government with a different mindset and a different commitment to co-investment in the future, there is very much a very different conversation to be had that would benefit workers in this sector of the economy, or the thousands of additional jobs that are reliant upon them as well, and, indeed, the sovereign asset that this steel making represents.
Rwy'n credu bod mwy i'w edmygu mewn teyrngarwch plaid nag mewn deall y materion yn y cyfraniad yna. Rwyf wedi bod yn glir iawn bod dewis arall. Mae'r cwmni ei hun wedi bod yn glir ei fod yn gynllun credadwy, ond nid yw'n fforddiadwy. Gyda Llywodraeth wahanol yn y DU gyda meddylfryd gwahanol ac ymrwymiad gwahanol i gyd-fuddsoddi yn y dyfodol, mae sgwrs wahanol iawn i'w chael a fyddai o fudd i weithwyr yn y sector hwn o'r economi, neu'r miloedd o swyddi ychwanegol sy'n dibynnu arnynt hefyd, ac, yn wir, yr ased sofran y mae'r dur hwn yn ei gynrychioli.
Diolch am y datganiad, Weinidog. Rwyf am ategu'r farn bod y diswyddiadau sylweddol a llawer rhy gyflym yma yn gwbl annerbyniol pan fod yna opsiynau hyfyw eraill ar gael inni. Dwi eisiau pwysleisio unwaith eto yr effaith gwbl drychinebus mae hyn yn ei gael ar y cymunedau ac ar y bobl dwi'n eu cynrychioli ym Mhort Talbot, ac ar draws y tair sir dwi'n eu cynrychioli yn y Senedd—Castell-nedd Port Talbot, Abertawe a Phen-y-bont.
Achos hefyd, fel dŷn ni wedi clywed, yn ychwanegol i'r miloedd sy'n mynd i golli eu swyddi ar y safle ei hun, mae miloedd ar filoedd yn fwy yn gweithio i gwmnïau sy'n dibynnu'n drwm ar waith dur Tata. Felly, pa gefnogaeth ymarferol fydd ar gael ar eu cyfer nhw? Ydy'r Llywodraeth yn cytuno bod angen cefnogi cwmnïau Cymreig lleol i helpu datblygu a chynnal rhaglenni hyfforddi ac ailsgilio mewn gwaith a fyddai'n cynnig bywoliaeth a dyfodol i weithwyr os fyddan nhw'n colli'u gwaith, a hefyd helpu'r cwmnïau bach hynny i ddatblygu fel y gallant elwa o gyfleon a ddaw gan y diwydiant ynni adnewyddol?
Ac yn olaf, pa mor hir ydyn ni'n mynd i ddioddef hyn, codi ein hysgwyddau a derbyn y sefyllfa ble rydym yn ddiymadferth i warchod ein gweithwyr, ein diwydiannau, ein heconomi, ein cymunedau rhag cwmnïau rhyngwladol sy'n methu â gweld nac yn hidio dim am les a llewyrch ein gweithwyr na'n cenedl, rhag Llywodraeth yn San Steffan sy'n fodlon gweld Cymru yn tyfu'n dlotach, yn colli ei phobl a'i doniau, yn gweld ein cymunedau yn dioddef ac yn dirywio?
Thank you for the statement, Minister. I want to echo the view that the significant redundancies, made far too swiftly, are unacceptable when there are other viable options available to us. I want to emphasise once again the devastating impact that this is having on the communities and the people I represent in Port Talbot, and across the three counties I represent at the Senedd—Neath Port Talbot, Swansea and Bridgend.
Because, as we've heard, in addition to the thousands who are set to lose their jobs at the site itself, thousands upon thousands more work for companies that are heavily dependent and reliant on the Tata steelworks. So, what practical support will be available to them? Does the Government agree that we need to support local Welsh companies to help to develop and maintain training programmes and upskilling in work that would provide a livelihood and a future for workers if they are made redundant, and to help those small companies to develop, so they can benefit from the opportunities offered by the renewable energy industry?
And finally, for how long will we put up with this, shrugging our shoulders and accepting a situation where we are powerless to protect our workers, our industries, our economy, and our communities from international corporations that fail to see, and couldn’t care less about, the welfare and prosperity of our workers and our nation, and from a Westminster Government that is willing to see Wales getting poorer, losing its people and their skills, and seeing its communities suffering and in decline?
There's certainly no shrugging of shoulders in this Welsh Government about the future for steelworking communities here in Wales, or, indeed, the future of the country as a whole. That is recognised by workers in this sector. They understand that they do, here, have a Government on their side. We look forward to having the ability to work with a Government on their side across the UK, with the financial ability to look at significant co-investment to ensure that we really can equip people for a future on the transition to lower carbon steel production that is essential for the greener economy that we want to have.
On your first point around skills, it really does depend on where we get to at the end of the consultation, when decisions are made, how they're made, and the pace at which decisions are made as well. We will do all we can to make sure that, if there are redundancies, we support people to find alternative careers. I'm also interested in our ability to actually take advantage of opportunities for growth in the future, because I want to see more people in Port Talbot, and right across south Wales, and north Wales, have opportunities to work in a Wales where our economy is growing. And that growth will be partly reliant on steel. It will also be partly reliant on other assets we have.
Earlier today, I visited the KLA expansion site in Newport. Again, much of the economy of the future will depend on the semiconductor products that they will produce. There are opportunities for us. Denuding our own steel sector—if that is a choice that is made by the company and the UK Government, in the manner they set out—will mean those opportunities are harder to realise, and other parts of the world will capitalise on the economic value that could otherwise be created here for the benefit of people in Wales and across Britain.
I'm very clear about where this Welsh Government is, and I'm certainly not going to throw the towel in, even while others may choose to do so.
Yn sicr, does dim codi ysgwyddau yn y Llywodraeth hon ynglŷn â'r dyfodol i gymunedau gwaith dur yma yng Nghymru, neu, yn wir, dyfodol y wlad gyfan. Mae hyn yn cael ei gydnabod gan weithwyr yn y sector hwn. Maen nhw'n deall bod ganddyn nhw, fan hyn, Lywodraeth ar eu hochr nhw. Rydym yn edrych ymlaen at allu gweithio gyda Llywodraeth ar eu hochr nhw ledled y DU, gyda'r gallu ariannol i edrych ar gyd-fuddsoddiad sylweddol i sicrhau y gallwn ni wir arfogi pobl ar gyfer dyfodol o drawsnewid i gynhyrchu dur carbon is sy'n hanfodol ar gyfer yr economi wyrddach yr ydym yn ei dymuno.
Ar eich pwynt cyntaf o ran sgiliau, mae'n dibynnu mewn gwirionedd ar beth fydd ein sefyllfa ar ddiwedd yr ymgynghoriad, pryd y gwneir penderfyniadau, sut y cânt eu gwneud, a pha mor gyflym y gwneir penderfyniadau hefyd. Byddwn yn gwneud popeth o fewn ein gallu i sicrhau, os oes diswyddiadau, ein bod yn cefnogi pobl i ddod o hyd i yrfaoedd amgen. Mae gennyf ddiddordeb hefyd yn ein gallu i fanteisio ar gyfleoedd ar gyfer twf yn y dyfodol, oherwydd rwyf eisiau gweld mwy o bobl ym Mhort Talbot, ac ar draws y de a'r gogledd, yn cael cyfleoedd i weithio mewn Cymru lle mae ein heconomi yn tyfu. A bydd y twf hwnnw'n rhannol ddibynnol ar ddur. Bydd hefyd yn dibynnu'n rhannol ar asedau eraill sydd gennym.
Yn gynharach heddiw, ymwelais â safle ehangu KLA yng Nghasnewydd. Unwaith eto, bydd llawer o economi'r dyfodol yn dibynnu ar y cynhyrchion lled-ddargludyddion y byddant yn eu cynhyrchu. Mae cyfleoedd ar gael i ni. Bydd erydu ein sector dur ein hunain—os yw hynny'n ddewis sy'n cael ei wneud gan y cwmni a Llywodraeth y DU, yn y modd y maen nhw yn nodi—yn golygu ei bod hi'n anoddach gwireddu'r cyfleoedd hynny, a bydd rhannau eraill o'r byd yn manteisio ar y gwerth economaidd y gellid fel arall ei greu yma er budd pobl yng Nghymru ac ar draws Prydain.
Rwy'n glir iawn ynglŷn â safbwynt y Llywodraeth hon yng Nghymru, ac yn sicr nid wyf am roi'r ffidil yn y to, hyd yn oed os yw eraill yn dewis gwneud hynny.
Minister, in my experience, people readily understand the strategic importance of the steel industry—for defence, for manufacturing, for construction and much else. They know it's an uncertain world, and our competitor countries seem to understand that as well. As you say, we need to find a bridge through somehow to the time when we will have a UK Labour Government that will also understand that and put the necessary investment into that steel industry. As far as I'm concerned, Minister, you know that Llanwern is still a very important part of the local economy in Newport. Some Newport people travel to Port Talbot to work at the moment, but we still have several hundred jobs at the Llanwern site. Obviously, the proposals to relocate the cold mill, even if it is in three years' time, are very concerning for local people. And it is also about the suppliers and the spend in the local economy. So, as always, really, from me, Minister, it's just a plea that, in the overall consideration of the future of the steel industry in Wales and the UK, Llanwern is very much factored into the consideration and decision making. It's part of that strategic approach that we need to see, and that bridge, that just transition that we need to see through to a UK Labour Government that will make that necessary investment in our jobs and our communities.
Gweinidog, yn fy mhrofiad i, mae pobl yn ddeall yn iawn bwysigrwydd strategol y diwydiant dur—ar gyfer amddiffyn, ar gyfer gweithgynhyrchu, ar gyfer adeiladu a llawer mwy. Maen nhw'n gwybod ei fod yn fyd ansicr, ac mae'n ymddangos bod y gwledydd sy'n cystadlu yn ein herbyn yn deall hynny hefyd. Fel y dywedwch, mae angen i ni ddod o hyd i bont drosodd rywsut i'r amser pan fydd gennym Lywodraeth Lafur y DU a fydd hefyd yn deall hynny ac yn rhoi'r buddsoddiad angenrheidiol yn y diwydiant dur hwnnw. Cyn belled ag yr wyf yn y cwestiwn, Gweinidog, gwyddoch fod Llanwern yn dal i fod yn rhan bwysig iawn o'r economi leol yng Nghasnewydd. Mae rhai pobl o Gasnewydd yn teithio i Bort Talbot i weithio ar hyn o bryd, ond mae gennym gannoedd o swyddi o hyd ar safle Llanwern. Yn amlwg, mae'r cynigion i adleoli'r felin oer, hyd yn oed os yw ymhen tair blynedd, yn peri pryder mawr i bobl leol. Ac mae hefyd yn ymwneud â'r cyflenwyr a'r gwariant yn yr economi leol. Felly, fel bob amser, mewn gwirionedd, gennyf i, Gweinidog, dim ond ple ydyw, wrth ystyried dyfodol y diwydiant dur yng Nghymru a'r DU, fod Llanwern yn cael ystyriaeth deg yn y broses o ystyried a gwneud penderfyniadau. Mae'n rhan o'r dull strategol hwnnw y mae angen i ni ei weld, a'r bont honno, y trawsnewidiad teg y mae angen i ni ei weld drwodd i Lywodraeth Lafur yn y DU a fydd yn gwneud y buddsoddiad angenrheidiol hwnnw yn ein swyddi a'n cymunedau.
The point is well made and understood, certainly here. I was concerned not just about the headline job losses at Port Talbot; I've always been concerned about the impact on downstream businesses, especially Trostre and Llanwern. I know that he will be worried about Shotton too. Llanwern, though, is directly affected by the headline proposals that have been made, the 300 job losses—again, they'd be well-paid jobs—lost at a site that has already seen a significant number of jobs shed from that site over the last generation. And it's a point worth making. I see you sat next to your fellow Newport Member, Jayne Bryant; there'll be lots of steelworkers within the city. But equally, I'm in discussions with my deputy ministerial colleague Lynne Neagle, and, indeed, with Hefin David, recognising that, on that site, there are more than 100 steelworkers from Torfaen and more than 150 steelworkers from Caerphilly. This is a significant employer within the region around Llanwern, not simply in the city and county of Newport. So, I'm committed to recognising that impact, and it again reinforces why we need to make clear that we're not throwing in the towel. We don't simply agree, as the Secretary of State for Wales wants us to, that there is no alternative. There is a credible alternative, and it could be affordable with more investment from a UK Government that actually sees the value of steel. Again, it comes back to understanding the price of everything and the value of nothing, and I'm afraid that is what we have in the current UK Government.
Mae'r pwynt wedi'i wneud yn dda ac wedi 'i ddeall, yn sicr yma. Roeddwn i'n poeni nid yn unig am y swyddi a gollir ym Mhort Talbot; rwyf wastad wedi bod yn poeni am yr effaith ar fusnesau ymhellach i lawr y gadwyn gyflenwi, yn enwedig Trostre a Llanwern. Rwy'n gwybod y bydd o'n poeni am Shotton hefyd. Er hynny, mae'r prif gynigion a wnaed wedi effeithio'n uniongyrchol ar Lanwern, y 300 o swyddi—eto, byddent yn swyddi â chyflog da—wedi eu colli ar safle sydd eisoes wedi gweld nifer sylweddol o swyddi yn cael eu colli o'r safle hwnnw dros y genhedlaeth ddiwethaf. Ac mae'n bwynt sy'n werth ei wneud. Gwelaf eich bod yn eistedd wrth ymyl eich cyd-Aelod o Gasnewydd, Jayne Bryant; bydd llawer o weithwyr dur yn y ddinas. Ond yn yr un modd, rwyf mewn trafodaethau gyda fy nirprwy gyd-Weinidog, Lynne Neagle, ac, yn wir, gyda Hefin David, yn cydnabod bod mwy na 100 o weithwyr dur o Dorfaen a mwy na 150 o weithwyr dur o Gaerffili ar y safle hwnnw. Mae hwn yn gyflogwr sylweddol yn y rhanbarth o amgylch Llanwern, nid yn ninas a sir Casnewydd yn unig. Felly, rwyf wedi ymrwymo i gydnabod yr effaith honno, ac mae'n atgyfnerthu eto pam mae angen i ni egluro nad ydym yn rhoi'r ffidil yn y to. Nid ydym yn cytuno, fel y mae Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru eisiau i ni wneud, nad oes dewis arall. Mae dewis arall credadwy, a gallai fod yn fforddiadwy gyda mwy o fuddsoddiad gan Lywodraeth y DU sy'n gweld gwerth dur mewn gwirionedd. Unwaith eto, mae'n dod yn ôl i ddeall pris popeth a gwerth dim, ac rwy'n ofni mai dyna sydd gennym yn Llywodraeth bresennol y DU.
Minister, I wanted to first of all acknowledge, obviously, what the town of Port Talbot is going through at the moment. Many workers there locally will be facing a degree of uncertainty. As a regional representative for the area, I know many local people who are employed at Tata Steel, and their families, and the wider community that benefit from it as well, but also the sense of pride, I think, in the town that the town is a steel-making town. I think the town of Port Talbot shows a lot of pride and a lot of passion for the industry.
We've talked a lot about the £500 million support package from the UK Government, but what we haven't talked about enough, in this session at least, is the £100 million fund that the UK Government has also put in place towards the transition board, which I know you're a member of. The leader of the opposition, Andrew R.T. Davies, three times during First Minister's questions pressed the First Minister to try and get an understanding of exactly the contribution the Welsh Government was willing to make towards that transition fund. We've heard that in other European countries, such as Germany, their regional Governments have supported their steel industry directly, but the Welsh Government hasn't put a single penny towards that transition fund—not one penny. Can the Minister explain why he is very quick, I think, during the last couple of weeks to run to a tv camera to give his two pennies' worth, but can't find one penny to support workers in Port Talbot?
Gweinidog, roeddwn i eisiau cydnabod yn gyntaf, yn amlwg, beth mae tref Port Talbot yn mynd drwyddo ar hyn o bryd. Bydd llawer o weithwyr yno'n lleol yn wynebu rhywfaint o ansicrwydd. Fel cynrychiolydd rhanbarthol ar gyfer yr ardal, rwy'n adnabod llawer o bobl leol sy'n cael eu cyflogi yn Tata Steel, a'u teuluoedd, a'r gymuned ehangach sy'n elwa arno hefyd, ond hefyd yr ymdeimlad o falchder, rwy'n credu, yn y dref sef ei bod yn dref sy'n gwneud dur. Rwy'n credu bod tref Port Talbot yn dangos llawer o falchder a llawer o angerdd am y diwydiant.
Rydym wedi siarad llawer am y pecyn cymorth o £500 miliwn gan Lywodraeth y DU, ond yr hyn nad ydym wedi siarad amdano ddigon, yn y sesiwn hon o leiaf, yw'r gronfa £100 miliwn y mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi'i rhoi ar waith ar gyfer y bwrdd trawsnewid, ac rwy'n gwybod eich bod yn aelod ohono. Fe wnaeth arweinydd yr wrthblaid, Andrew R.T. Davies, yn ystod cwestiynau'r Prif Weinidog bwyso deirgwaith ar y Prif Weinidog i geisio cael dealltwriaeth o'r union gyfraniad yr oedd Llywodraeth Cymru yn barod i'w wneud tuag at y gronfa drawsnewid honno. Rydyn ni wedi clywed, mewn gwledydd Ewropeaidd eraill fel yr Almaen, fod eu Llywodraethau rhanbarthol wedi cefnogi eu diwydiant dur yn uniongyrchol, ond nid yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi rhoi un geiniog tuag at y gronfa drawsnewid honno—nid un geiniog. A all y Gweinidog egluro pam ei fod yn ystod yr wythnosau diwethaf yn barod i redeg yn gyflym tuag at gamera teledu i roi ei farn, ond yn methu dod o hyd i un geiniog i gefnogi gweithwyr ym Mhort Talbot?
I think that contribution will land very poorly with directly affected workers. I don't often say this, but Andrew R.T. Davies understood much more clearly the mood of workers when he recognised that he wants to see a future where the blast furnace stays open. If you look at what we have done, we have supported the company over a number of years in its transition to reskilling its workforce: the apprenticeship programmes that have been run, the value of the wider skills transition that has taken place. The company understand the contribution that we have made alongside them for their future. The transition board knows and understands. Indeed, Michael Gove, who is—. I wouldn't describe us as friends or colleagues, but Michael Gove understood that the Welsh Government have programmes to support workers, whether it's ReAct+ or Communities for Work Plus. What we want to understand is how the transition board can work alongside devolved government intervention to support the workforce if there are redundancies of the scale that are now being proposed.
I think, actually, if the Member wants to make a constructive contribution to that future, there are plenty of opportunities to do so, because we'll be scrutinised, as this goes through, as we sit in front of committees. Indeed, I'm expecting the committee chaired by Paul Davies will want to talk again to Ministers as proposals come to crystallise, as change starts to take place on any journey to the future, about whether we are equipping and supporting people to seek alternative work if they need to leave the industry. We're not going to throw in the towel and we're not going to get involved in a fairly silly season story that suggests the Welsh Government isn't interested in the future, when, actually, we have plenty of skin in the game for the future of the steel sector and plenty of resource we have put into the steel sector in the past. We will go on doing that to help meet the skills needs for this vital sector of the future of the UK economy.
Rwy'n credu y byddai'r cyfraniad yna'n cael derbyniad gwael iawn gan weithwyr yr effeithir arnynt yn uniongyrchol. Nid wyf yn aml yn dweud hyn, ond roedd Andrew R.T. Davies yn deall yn llawer cliriach hwyliau gweithwyr pan wnaeth gydnabod ei fod eisiau gweld dyfodol lle mae'r ffwrnais chwyth yn aros yn agored. Os edrychwch ar yr hyn rydym wedi'i wneud, rydym wedi cefnogi'r cwmni dros nifer o flynyddoedd wrth iddo drawsnewid i ailsgilio ei weithlu: y rhaglenni prentisiaeth sydd wedi'u cynnal, gwerth y trawsnewid sgiliau ehangach sydd wedi digwydd. Mae'r cwmni'n deall y cyfraniad yr ydym wedi'i wneud ochr yn ochr â nhw ar gyfer eu dyfodol. Mae'r Bwrdd Trawsnewid yn gwybod ac yn deall. Yn wir, roedd Michael Gove, sydd yn—. Fyddwn i ddim yn ein disgrifio ni fel ffrindiau neu gydweithwyr, ond roedd Michael Gove yn deall bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru raglenni i gefnogi gweithwyr, boed yn ReAct+ neu'n Cymunedau am Waith a Mwy. Yr hyn yr ydym eisiau ei ddeall yw sut y gall y bwrdd trawsnewid weithio ochr yn ochr ag ymyrraeth ddatganoledig y llywodraeth i gefnogi'r gweithlu os bydd diswyddiadau o'r raddfa sydd bellach yn cael eu cynnig.
Rwy'n credu, mewn gwirionedd, os yw'r Aelod eisiau gwneud cyfraniad adeiladol at y dyfodol hwnnw, mae digon o gyfleoedd i wneud hynny, oherwydd bydd craffu arnom, wrth i hyn fynd drwodd, wrth i ni eistedd o flaen pwyllgorau. Yn wir, rwy'n disgwyl y bydd y pwyllgor dan gadeiryddiaeth Paul Davies eisiau siarad eto â Gweinidogion wrth i gynigion grisialu, wrth i newid ddechrau digwydd ar unrhyw daith i'r dyfodol, ynghylch a ydym yn arfogi ac yn cefnogi pobl i geisio gwaith amgen os oes angen iddynt adael y diwydiant. Dydyn ni ddim yn rhoi'r ffidil yn y to a dydyn ni ddim yn mynd i gymryd rhan mewn stori dyddiau'r cŵn sy'n awgrymu nad oes gan Lywodraeth Cymru ddiddordeb yn y dyfodol, pan ydym, mewn gwirionedd, wedi rhoi digon o fuddsoddiad er mwyn cyrraedd ein nod ar gyfer dyfodol y sector dur ac mae digon o adnoddau yr ydym wedi'u rhoi yn y sector dur yn y gorffennol. Byddwn yn parhau i wneud hynny i helpu i ddiwallu anghenion sgiliau'r sector hanfodol hwn yn nyfodol economi'r DU.
I'd like to share the sentiments expressed by colleagues across the Chamber about the devastating news on Port Talbot and express my solidarity with those workers and families affected by this news, both in the steelworks and also, as has been said by many people, in the upstream and downstream supply chains, including even local shops and pubs in that area that will be affected. It's truly devastating, and I know that many workers who live in my region will be concerned about their future after the news last week.
But in the same way as John expressed a concern about the way that Llanwern factors in to the wider picture, you will, of course, Minister, be aware of the Tata tinplate works in Llanelli, as you've already referred to, which uses steel from Port Talbot to make tinplate for goods packaging. It's been an incredibly important local employer for over 70 years, and it currently employs about 700 people, as well as hundreds of contractor staff. This is in an area where opportunities for work and training have steadily declined over many, many years, and the shadow of previous job losses within heavy industry weighs heavy on this area.
I understand there have been assurances given regarding the short-term future of the plant in Trostre, which is obviously good news for the Llanelli area, but there remains uncertainty locally about the medium and long-term security of jobs there. As such, I'd be grateful for any clarity or insight you can give us about any discussions you've had with Tata and other stakeholders regarding the situation in Llanelli and the potential impact on the plant.
Hoffwn rannu'r teimladau a fynegwyd gan gyd-Aelodau ar draws y Siambr am y newyddion trychinebus am Bort Talbot a mynegi fy undod â'r gweithwyr a'r teuluoedd hynny y mae'r newyddion hyn yn effeithio arnynt, yn y gwaith dur a hefyd, fel y dywedwyd gan lawer o bobl, ymhellach i fyny ac ymhellach i lawr y cadwyni cyflenwi, gan gynnwys siopau a thafarndai lleol hyd yn oed yn yr ardal honno yr effeithir arni. Mae'n wirioneddol ddinistriol, a gwn y bydd llawer o weithwyr sy'n byw yn fy rhanbarth i yn poeni am eu dyfodol ar ôl y newyddion yr wythnos diwethaf.
Ond yn yr un modd ag y mynegodd John bryder am y ffordd y mae Llanwern yn ffactor yn y darlun ehangach, byddwch, wrth gwrs, Gweinidog, yn ymwybodol o waith tunplat Tata yn Llanelli, fel rydych eisoes wedi cyfeirio ato, sy'n defnyddio dur o Bort Talbot i wneud tunplat ar gyfer pecynnau nwyddau. Mae wedi bod yn gyflogwr lleol hynod bwysig ers dros 70 mlynedd, ac ar hyn o bryd mae'n cyflogi tua 700 o bobl, yn ogystal â channoedd o staff contractwyr. Mae hwn mewn ardal lle mae cyfleoedd am waith a hyfforddiant wedi gostwng yn raddol dros nifer o flynyddoedd, ac mae cysgod colli swyddi blaenorol o fewn diwydiant trwm yn pwyso'n drwm ar yr ardal hon.
Rwy'n deall bod sicrwydd wedi'i roi ynglŷn â dyfodol tymor byr y gwaith yn Nhrostre, sy'n amlwg yn newyddion da i ardal Llanelli, ond mae ansicrwydd o hyd yn lleol am ddiogelwch swyddi yn y tymor canolig a'r tymor hir. O'r herwydd, byddwn yn ddiolchgar am unrhyw eglurder neu fewnwelediad y gallwch ei roi i ni am unrhyw drafodaethau rydych chi wedi'u cael gyda Tata a rhanddeiliaid eraill ynghylch y sefyllfa yn Llanelli a'r effaith bosibl ar y gwaith.
I've visited Trostre on more than one occasion in the past. Actually, in terms of the current make-up, the Unite full-time officer for steel in Wales, Jason Bartlett, worked at Trostre, and, indeed, whenever I go there, the Community representative, who is also a town councillor, Andrew Bragoli, always has an opinion, and it's a really welcoming place to go. They're really proud of what they do; they recognise the quality in what they do. If they did not, then they would not be the sole supplier for Heinz and others for the products that they have as a marker of quality. There is also a tinning plant in the Netherlands as well. If we don't make virgin steel, if we need to import part of the steel to secure the order book that Trostre has, that may well come from the Netherlands, and there is an understandable risk about how far into the future that steel will be made in the Netherlands to come to Trostre, as opposed to going into the tinplate plant in the Netherlands. So, it is not part of today's announcement, but no one should pretend that the steelworking community in Trostre is not concerned about its future and it understands the medium to longer term risk for itself. The good news is, as I said, that it's a really highly skilled workforce with a really high-quality product. Within the group, that's recognised as well. But this is about the future and not simply about today, which is why I have proactively raised the issue in meetings with the company, and I did so again on Friday. Again, it reinforces why we need a longer and a fairer march to the future in a genuinely just transition, which these proposals do not, in our view, amount to.
Rwyf wedi ymweld â Throstre ar fwy nag un achlysur yn y gorffennol. Mewn gwirionedd, o ran y cyfansoddiad presennol, bu Jason Bartlett, swyddog llawn amser Unite ar gyfer dur yng Nghymru, yn gweithio yn Nhrostre, ac, yn wir, pryd bynnag y byddaf yn mynd yno, mae gan gynrychiolydd y Gymuned, sydd hefyd yn gynghorydd tref, Andrew Bragoli, farn bob amser, ac mae'n lle croesawgar iawn i fynd iddo. Maen nhw'n falch iawn o'r hyn maen nhw'n ei wneud; maen nhw'n cydnabod yr ansawdd yn yr hyn maen nhw'n ei wneud. Pe na baent yn gwneud hynny, yna ni fyddent yn unig gyflenwr Heinz ac eraill ar gyfer y cynhyrchion sydd ganddynt fel nodwr ansawdd. Mae yna hefyd waith tunio yn yr Iseldiroedd. Os nad ydym yn gwneud dur crai, os oes angen i ni fewnforio rhan o'r dur i ddiogelu llyfr archebion Trostre, mae'n ddigon posibl y bydd hwnnw'n dod o'r Iseldiroedd, ac mae risg ddealladwy ynghylch pa mor bell i'r dyfodol y bydd dur sy'n cael ei wneud yn yr Iseldiroedd yn dal i ddod i Drostre, yn hytrach na mynd i'r gwaith tunplat yn yr Iseldiroedd. Felly, nid yw'n rhan o gyhoeddiad heddiw, ond ni ddylai unrhyw un gymryd arno nad yw'r gymuned gwaith dur yn Nhrostre yn poeni am ei dyfodol ac maen nhw'n deall y risg tymor canolig i dymor hwy yn iawn ei hunain. Y newyddion da, fel y dywedais, yw ei fod yn weithlu medrus iawn gyda chynnyrch o ansawdd uchel iawn. O fewn y grŵp, mae hynny'n cael ei gydnabod hefyd. Ond mae hyn yn ymwneud â'r dyfodol ac nid dim ond heddiw, a dyna pam rwyf wedi codi'r mater yn rhagweithiol mewn cyfarfodydd gyda'r cwmni, a gwnes hynny eto ddydd Gwener. Unwaith eto, mae'n atgyfnerthu pam mae arnom angen gorymdaith hirach a thecach i'r dyfodol mewn trawsnewidiad gwirioneddol gyfiawn, nad yw'r cynigion hyn, yn ein barn ni, yn gyfystyr â hynny.
Whilst I think the majority of us in this Siambr can see that the UK Westminster Government has, over decades, just not had a clear plan for our manufacturing business, I really hope that there is a sense of us working together across the Siambr to look at a positive future and an opportunity for us to save the jobs at Port Talbot. I cannot imagine what it must feel like to live in and be a part of that community in Port Talbot at the moment. It must be a devastating blow. This is an unjust transition for those workers. I'm really encouraged by some of the statements from the Welsh Conservatives, from Paul Davies and from Andrew R.T. Davies, and I really hope that we can all be adult in this and work together and look to the future, because this is affecting thousands of not just people but families, and it must be totally beyond anybody's imagination what must be going through their heads. But I guess my request to you is about those workers. Can you just tell us a little bit about what's in place to support them at the moment, particularly around mental health issues, around the stress that they must be suffering and about the questions that they must have? Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Er fy mod yn credu y gall y mwyafrif ohonom yn y Siambr hon weld na fu gan Lywodraeth San Steffan gynllun clir ar gyfer ein busnes gweithgynhyrchu ers degawdau, rwy'n gobeithio'n fawr bod yna ymdeimlad o gydweithio ar draws y Siambr er mwyn edrych ar ddyfodol cadarnhaol a bod cyfle i ni achub y swyddi ym Mhort Talbot. Ni allaf ddychmygu sut deimlad yw byw a bod yn rhan o'r gymuned honno ym Mhort Talbot ar hyn o bryd. Mae'n rhaid ei bod yn ergyd ddinistriol. Mae hwn yn drawsnewidiad annheg i'r gweithwyr hynny. Rwy'n cael fy nghalonogi'n fawr gan rai o'r datganiadau gan y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig, gan Paul Davies a chan Andrew R.T. Davies, ac rwy'n mawr obeithio y gallwn ni i gyd fod yn aeddfed yn hyn a chydweithio ac edrych i'r dyfodol, oherwydd mae hyn yn effeithio ar filoedd nid yn unig bobl ond teuluoedd, ac mae tu hwnt i ddychymyg beth sy'n mynd ymlaen yn eu meddyliau. Ond mae'n debyg bod fy nghais i chi am y gweithwyr hynny. A allwch chi ddweud ychydig wrthym am yr hyn sydd ar waith i'w cefnogi ar hyn o bryd, yn enwedig o ran materion iechyd meddwl, ynghylch y straen y mae'n rhaid eu bod yn ei ddioddef ac am y cwestiynau sydd ganddyn nhw? Diolch yn fawr iawn.
So, this has been part of the discussion that we've had at the transition board, where I have raised the issue that, if you're going to have large-scale redundancies, there is always a mental health impact. Often, it can be dealt with at a lower level. So, the health board have been in to present about what they would look to do. I have no reason to think that they won't be looking to remind people that there is an avenue for people to talk. Within a workplace like this, with a high level of trade union density, within a community that understands how commonplace steel making is and what it means to the economy, there are often people to talk to locally. The challenge is that not everyone feels they can do that. We still are not where we need to be within the country at large on having a conversation with people when we don't feel okay from a mental health perspective.
And I really do hope that the message will get through for the support that is available within the community, because this is not what a just transition looks like. There is additional fear and anxiety for the future. I think that is part of what the UK Government should consider in whether it wants to invest more. And they needn't take my word for it about whether this is a just transition, Greenpeace have said that this is not what a just transition looks like. So, there's an opportunity for the UK Government to take a step back and look again at what could be delivered, the value of that work for a period of time into the future, and the transition to a genuinely sustainable lower carbon form of steel making does not mean that we are reliant on imports from competitor economies into the future.
Felly, mae hyn wedi bod yn rhan o'r drafodaeth a gawsom yn y bwrdd trawsnewid, lle rwyf wedi codi'r mater, os ydych chi'n mynd i gael diswyddiadau ar raddfa fawr, mae yna effaith iechyd meddwl bob amser. Yn aml, gellir ymdrin ag ef ar lefel is. Felly, mae'r bwrdd iechyd wedi bod i mewn i gyflwyno yr hyn y byddent yn bwriadu ei wneud. Nid oes gen i reswm i feddwl na fyddan nhw'n ceisio atgoffa pobl bod yna ddull a modd i bobl siarad. O fewn gweithle fel hwn, gyda lefel uchel o ddwysedd undebau llafur, o fewn cymuned sy'n deall pa mor gyffredin yw gwneud dur a beth mae'n ei olygu i'r economi, yn aml mae yna bobl y gellir siarad â nhw'n lleol. Yr her yw nad yw pawb yn teimlo eu bod yn gallu gwneud hynny. Nid ydym wedi cyrraedd lle mae angen i ni fod o fewn y wlad yn gyffredinol o ran cael sgwrs gyda phobl pan nad ydym yn teimlo'n iawn o safbwynt iechyd meddwl.
Ac rwy'n gobeithio'n fawr y bydd y neges yn cyrraedd pawb ynghylch y gefnogaeth sydd ar gael yn y gymuned, oherwydd nid dyma sut mae trawsnewidiad teg i fod i edrych. Mae ofn a phryder ychwanegol ar gyfer y dyfodol. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhan o'r hyn y dylai Llywodraeth y DU ei ystyried o ran a yw am fuddsoddi mwy. Ac nid oes angen iddyn nhw gymryd fy ngair i ynghylch a yw hwn yn drawsnewidiad teg, mae Greenpeace wedi dweud nad dyma sut mae trawsnewidiad teg i fod i edrych. Felly, mae cyfle i Lywodraeth y DU gymryd cam yn ôl ac edrych eto ar yr hyn y gellid ei gyflawni, gwerth y gwaith hwnnw am gyfnod o amser i'r dyfodol, ac nid yw'r trawsnewidiad i ddull carbon is, wirioneddol gynaliadwy o wneud dur yn golygu ein bod yn dibynnu ar fewnforion o economïau ein cystadleuwyr i'r dyfodol.
Minister, as others have said already this afternoon, last week's news was a blow to us all. My community knows first-hand what it's like to lose skilled jobs in the steel sector. In my constituency, at Shotton steelworks, workers are also concerned about what their futures look like. It's the partnership between Port Talbot and Shotton—those two locations; that partnership is key. Can I ask you, Minister, therefore, what conversations you've had about the supply of green steel for the Shotton site, and also about securing the future of the highly skilled workforce at the Shotton site? We know Wales needs a vibrant steel industry in both Port Talbot and Shotton, and elsewhere, as colleagues have said this afternoon, and we must do all we can in this Senedd, and the Welsh Government, to protect the industry for the future. Diolch.
Gweinidog, fel y mae eraill wedi dweud eisoes y prynhawn yma, roedd newyddion yr wythnos diwethaf yn ergyd i ni i gyd. Mae fy nghymuned yn gwybod o lygad y ffynnon sut beth yw colli swyddi medrus yn y sector dur. Yn fy etholaeth i, yng ngwaith dur Shotton, mae gweithwyr hefyd yn poeni am sut olwg sydd ar eu dyfodol. Dyma'r bartneriaeth rhwng Port Talbot a Shotton—y ddau leoliad hynny; mae'r bartneriaeth hon yn allweddol. A gaf i ofyn i chi, Gweinidog, felly, pa sgyrsiau rydych chi wedi'u cael am gyflenwi dur gwyrdd ar gyfer safle Shotton, a hefyd am sicrhau dyfodol y gweithlu medrus iawn ar safle Shotton? Rydym yn gwybod bod angen diwydiant dur bywiog ar Gymru ym Mhort Talbot a Shotton, ac mewn mannau eraill, fel y dywedodd cyd-Aelodau y prynhawn yma, ac mae'n rhaid i ni wneud popeth o fewn ein gallu yn y Senedd hon, a Llywodraeth Cymru, i ddiogelu'r diwydiant ar gyfer y dyfodol. Diolch.
Thank you. Of course, I have visited the Shotton steelworks with the Member. It's a point worth mentioning that the current regional secretary of Unite used to work at Shotton when he was on the tools himself. So, look, it's an area with a long history and, again, you're right, it has gone through significant job losses in the past, and that is still felt today.
When we've had conversations with the company, they have been keen to stress that they don't think that there is any impact on Shotton, but our challenge is, as you go into the medium and longer term, whether the steel that is currently supplied from Port Talbot is going to be made available on a long-term sustainable basis. And some of this also depends on the change that we know is coming as well within a couple of years, because if steel were to be supplied from the Netherlands, at the moment there is no carbon mechanism. In the future, there will be additional costs to moving steel around, in and out of Europe. Now, if we're on the wrong side of that, that has a real impact on the cost of products and future investment choices. So, again, the risk is not so much in the next couple of years, but in the next five to 10 years, and choices made about reinvesting in plants, in the capital required, as well as reinvesting in the skills of a workforce. I think that's why we need to look at this decision not just through the lens of what is happening in Port Talbot—extraordinary as that context is, there is a much bigger lens to look through about the economic future of all steel-making communities and what the UK economy will undoubtedly need in the future that we have planned for us.
Diolch. Wrth gwrs, rwyf wedi ymweld â gwaith dur Shotton gyda'r Aelod. Mae'n werth nodi bu ysgrifennydd rhanbarthol presennol Unite yn gweithio yn Shotton pan oedd yn ymdrin â'r offer ei hun. Felly, edrychwch, mae'n ardal sydd â hanes hir ac, unwaith eto, rydych chi'n iawn, mae wedi gweld colli swyddi sylweddol yn y gorffennol, ac mae hynny'n dal i'w deimlo heddiw.
Pan gawsom sgyrsiau gyda'r cwmni, roedden nhw'n awyddus i bwysleisio nad ydynt yn credu bod unrhyw effaith ar Shotton, ond ein her ni yw, wrth i chi fynd i'r tymor canolig a'r tymor hwy, a fydd y dur sy'n cael ei gyflenwi ar hyn o bryd o Bort Talbot ar gael ar sail gynaliadwy hirdymor. Ac mae rhywfaint o hyn hefyd yn dibynnu ar y newid yr ydym yn gwybod sy'n dod hefyd o fewn cwpl o flynyddoedd, oherwydd pe bai dur yn cael ei gyflenwi o'r Iseldiroedd, ar hyn o bryd nid oes mecanwaith carbon. Yn y dyfodol, bydd costau ychwanegol i symud dur o gwmpas, i mewn ac allan o Ewrop. Nawr, os ydym ar yr ochr anghywir i hynny, mae hynny'n cael effaith wirioneddol ar gost cynhyrchion a dewisiadau buddsoddi yn y dyfodol. Felly, unwaith eto, nid yw'r risg gymaint yn ystod yr ychydig flynyddoedd nesaf, ond yn ystod y pump i 10 mlynedd nesaf, a dewisiadau a wneir ynghylch ailfuddsoddi mewn gweithfeydd, y cyfalaf sydd ei angen, yn ogystal ag ailfuddsoddi sgiliau gweithlu. Rwy'n credu mai dyna pam mae angen i ni edrych ar y penderfyniad hwn nid yn unig drwy lens yr hyn sy'n digwydd ym Mhort Talbot—er mor hynod yw'r cyd-destun hwnnw, mae yna lens llawer mwy i edrych drwyddo ynghylch dyfodol economaidd pob cymuned sy'n gwneud dur a'r hyn y bydd economi'r DU yn sicr o fod ei angen yn y dyfodol yr ydym wedi'i gynllunio ar ein cyfer.
This announcement has been absolutely heartbreaking for the workers and their families and the wider communities in Port Talbot. Minister, the impact of the devastating announcement is going to be felt far beyond Port Talbot as well, because this is a very concerning time for the future of the steel industry in Wales, including Llanwern steelworks in Newport. Steel has been so important to Newport's economy and we do have a long, proud history of the steel industry in Newport. It's already been highlighted today that a further 300 roles could be impacted there in the next two to three years. Whilst Llanwern is in my colleague John Griffiths's constituency, workers, families and businesses across Newport and the wider community are worried about the impact that future job losses would have on our local community.
I'd like to put on record my thanks to you and the First Minister for the work that you've been doing on this consistently. Under Tata's plans that were announced last week, Llanwern would no longer be fed by steel from Port Talbot, instead steel will be produced in blast furnaces abroad and imported on diesel ships, making a real mockery of the argument that this decision is driven by a push towards net zero. Can I ask the Minister to reassure people in Newport that the Welsh Government will continue to work closely with workers and trade unions at Llanwern in the coming months, and again re-emphasise Welsh Government's strong commitment to do all you can to find a credible way forward?
Mae'r cyhoeddiad hwn wedi bod yn gwbl dorcalonnus i'r gweithwyr a'u teuluoedd a'r cymunedau ehangach ym Mhort Talbot. Gweinidog, mae effaith y cyhoeddiad dinistriol yn mynd i gael ei deimlo ymhell y tu hwnt i Bort Talbot hefyd, oherwydd mae hwn yn gyfnod pryderus iawn i ddyfodol y diwydiant dur yng Nghymru, gan gynnwys gwaith dur Llanwern yng Nghasnewydd. Mae dur wedi bod mor bwysig i economi Casnewydd ac mae gennym hanes hir, balch o'r diwydiant dur yng Nghasnewydd. Amlygwyd eisoes heddiw efallai y bydd effaith ar 300 o swyddi ychwanegol yno yn ystod y ddwy i dair blynedd nesaf. Er bod Llanwern yn etholaeth fy nghyd-Aelod John Griffiths, mae gweithwyr, teuluoedd a busnesau ledled Casnewydd a'r gymuned ehangach yn poeni am yr effaith y byddai colli swyddi yn y dyfodol yn ei chael ar ein cymuned leol.
Hoffwn gofnodi fy niolch i chi a'r Prif Weinidog am y gwaith rydych chi wedi bod yn ei wneud ar hyn yn gyson. O dan gynlluniau Tata a gyhoeddwyd yr wythnos diwethaf, ni fyddai Llanwern bellach yn cael ei ddur o Bort Talbot, yn lle hynny byddai dur yn cael ei gynhyrchu mewn ffwrneisi chwyth dramor a'i fewnforio ar longau diesel, gan wneud y ddadl bod y penderfyniad hwn yn cael ei ysgogi gan yr ymdrech tuag at sero net yn gyff gwawd go iawn. A gaf i ofyn i'r Gweinidog dawelu meddyliau pobl yng Nghasnewydd drwy sicrhau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i weithio'n agos gyda gweithwyr ac undebau llafur yn Llanwern yn ystod y misoedd nesaf, ac unwaith eto, drwy bwysleisio ymrwymiad cryf Llywodraeth Cymru i wneud popeth o fewn eich gallu i ddod o hyd i ffordd gredadwy ymlaen?
Thank you. I'm really pleased that you've made the point around net zero. The 300 job losses that are being discussed and described for Llanwern in two to three years' time are a real issue for us now. As I said earlier, I know there is a significant number of steelworkers from Llanwern who are in Caerphilly and in Torfaen, as well as in Newport.
The journey to net zero will require us to use steel. We will have to make that steel, create that steel and use it to generate cleaner and greener power, which is also a big economic opportunity for us. The risk, of course, is that you could have floating offshore platforms made in Holland and floated to be deployed off our coast—great news for workers in the Netherlands, terrible news for workers here, where the steel need not be produced in Wales, where the manufacture need not be done in Wales. There is value, of course, in the maintenance and operational support that can only really be delivered close by, but the much greater value is further up in the chain, and that is what we are looking for. It underpins the free-port bid that is being delivered. So, actually, to get to that future, we need steel. The challenge is: will it be steel that is made here, or will it be steel that is made and generated in another part of the world, with all the economic value that goes into that? That's why I say that there isn't just a credible alternative, it's one that really should be afforded because of the much wider value that it will give not just to steel-making communities but to all of us in the future that we really could have.
Diolch. Rwy'n falch iawn eich bod wedi gwneud y pwynt ynghylch sero net. Mae colli 300 o swyddi sy'n cael ei drafod a'i ddisgrifio ar gyfer Llanwern ymhen dwy i dair blynedd yn fater go iawn i ni nawr. Fel y dywedais i yn gynharach, gwn fod nifer sylweddol o weithwyr dur Llanwern yng Nghaerffili ac yn Nhorfaen, yn ogystal ag yng Nghasnewydd.
Bydd y daith i sero net yn gofyn i ni ddefnyddio dur. Bydd yn rhaid i ni wneud y dur hwnnw, creu'r dur hwnnw a'i ddefnyddio i gynhyrchu pŵer glanach a gwyrddach, sydd hefyd yn gyfle economaidd mawr i ni. Y risg, wrth gwrs, yw y gallech chi gael llwyfannau arnofiol ar y môr wedi'u gwneud yn yr Iseldiroedd a'u harnofio i gael eu defnyddio oddi ar ein harfordir—newyddion gwych i weithwyr yn yr Iseldiroedd, newyddion ofnadwy i weithwyr yma, lle nad oes angen cynhyrchu'r dur yng Nghymru, lle nad oes angen gweithgynhyrchu yng Nghymru. Mae gwerth, wrth gwrs, yn y gwaith cynnal a chadw a'r cymorth gweithredol y gellir dim ond eu cyflawni'n agos atyn nhw mewn gwirionedd, ond mae'r gwerth mwy o lawer yn bellach i fyny yn y gadwyn, a dyna beth rydym yn chwilio amdano. Mae'n sail i'r cais porthladd rhydd sy'n cael ei gyflawni. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, i gyrraedd y dyfodol hwnnw, mae angen dur arnom. Yr her yw: a fydd yn ddur sy'n cael ei wneud yma, neu a fydd yn ddur sy'n cael ei wneud a'i gynhyrchu mewn rhan arall o'r byd, gyda'r holl werth economaidd sy'n mynd i mewn i hynny? Dyna pam rwy'n dweud nad yw'r dewis arall yn un credadwy yn unig, mae'n un y dylid ei fabwysiadu mewn gwirionedd oherwydd y gwerth llawer ehangach y bydd yn ei roi nid yn unig i gymunedau gwneud dur ond i bob un ohonom yn y dyfodol sy'n hollol bosibl i ni.
Minister, I'm very grateful for your statement today and for the complete attention that you're giving this matter right now. It is deeply unsettling for the workers involved. There are many workers travelling today to Westminster to lobby MPs, what would your message be from the Welsh Government to those workers who are travelling to Westminster to lobby Members of Parliament and Ministers?
Now, Port Talbot and the surrounding area really need every opportunity possible, especially in the area of apprenticeships. Is your economic mission designed in such a way as to promote as many opportunities as possible for people who may be facing redundancies and require retraining opportunities and employment opportunities? Minister, will you go on focusing, laser-like, along with the First Minister and your colleagues in Government, on taking this fight forward, because we're in this for the long haul, and you're on the side of the workers? Diolch.
Gweinidog, rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn am eich datganiad heddiw ac am y sylw llwyr rydych chi'n ei roi i'r mater hwn nawr. Mae'n peri pryder mawr i'r gweithwyr dan sylw. Mae yna lawer o weithwyr yn teithio heddiw i San Steffan i lobïo ASau, beth fyddai eich neges chi gan Lywodraeth Cymru i'r gweithwyr hynny sy'n teithio i San Steffan i lobïo Aelodau Seneddol a Gweinidogion?
Nawr, mae gwir angen pob cyfle posibl ar Bort Talbot a'r cyffiniau, yn enwedig ym maes prentisiaethau. A yw eich cenhadaeth economaidd wedi'i chynllunio mewn modd sy'n hyrwyddo cymaint o gyfleoedd â phosibl i bobl a allai fod yn wynebu diswyddiadau ac sydd angen cyfleoedd ailhyfforddi a chyfleoedd cyflogaeth? Gweinidog, a wnewch chi barhau i ganolbwyntio'n fanwl iawn, ynghyd â'r Prif Weinidog a'ch cyd-Weinidogion yn y Llywodraeth, ar barhau â'r frwydr hon, oherwydd bydd yn un hir, ac rydych chi ar ochr y gweithwyr? Diolch.
Thank you for the questions. I'll deal with your point around alternatives, because not only the work around the Swansea bay city deal, looking to grow the economy, but in particular you mentioned the Global Centre of Rail Excellence—. We know that there is an opportunity, if we can find further investment for that site, for a really healthy future where there'll be really high skills. It's a good example of a place-based intervention, investing in a place with a proposition that we are confident will be able to attract other people too. It will involve high-value jobs, university research-led jobs, and, actually, it's a part of the world where, if you don't intervene, the market won't direct investment to that part of the world. It's much the same point that Alun Davies makes about the need to have continued intervention across the Heads of the Valleys, to make sure that we actually bring the market somewhere where it otherwise would not go.
It underpins a choice I've made early in this term about remediating lots of land around Baglan, making sure that the great majority of that land is brought into economic use. It also underpins why we didn't collapse with the current UK Government of the time when there was a real threat to the power station and the possibility that we would have lost the use of a significant amount of the economic assets already there. It was bizarre that we had to take the UK Government to court to make sure that the power supply was maintained in place to make sure that we didn't have a wholly avoidable flood risk that would have destroyed not just economic assets, but a community and at least one primary school that would have been at risk of flooding. So, we've made those deliberate choices to intervene and will carry on doing so.
I think the real message for steelworkers and everyone who understands that there is a real, viable future for steel making here in Wales, is not to throw in the towel, not to collapse into some of the headlines that are generated or the fairly aggressive, 'There is no other future' line being promoted by the Secretary of State for Wales, but to understand there really is a different future available. With different investment, we could have the best deal for steel, not the cheapest deal for steel, and that is what this Government is committed to.
Diolch am y cwestiynau. Fe wnaf ymdrin â'ch pwynt ynghylch dewisiadau amgen, oherwydd nid yn unig y gwaith o amgylch bargen ddinesig bae Abertawe, gyda'r bwriad i dyfu'r economi, ond yn benodol fe wnaethoch chi sôn am y Ganolfan Ragoriaeth Fyd-eang ar gyfer Rheilffyrdd—. Rydym yn gwybod bod cyfle, os gallwn ddod o hyd i fuddsoddiad pellach ar gyfer y safle hwnnw, ar gyfer dyfodol iach iawn lle bydd sgiliau uchel iawn. Mae'n enghraifft dda o ymyrraeth yn seiliedig ar le, gan fuddsoddi mewn lle gyda chynnig yr ydym yn hyderus y bydd yn gallu denu pobl eraill hefyd. Bydd yn cynnwys swyddi â gwerth uchel, swyddi dan arweiniad ymchwil prifysgolion, ac, mewn gwirionedd, mae'n rhan o'r byd lle na fydd y farchnad, os na fyddwch yn ymyrryd, yn cyfeirio buddsoddiad i'r rhan honno o'r byd. Mae'r un pwynt ag y mae Alun Davies yn ei wneud ynglŷn â'r angen i barhau i ymyrryd ar draws Blaenau'r Cymoedd, i sicrhau ein bod mewn gwirionedd yn dod â'r farchnad i rywle lle na fyddai fel arall yn dod.
Mae'n sail i ddewis rydw i wedi'i wneud yn gynnar yn y tymor hwn ynglŷn ag adfer llawer o dir o amgylch Baglan, gan sicrhau bod y rhan fwyaf o'r tir hwnnw'n cael ei ddefnyddio'n economaidd. Mae hefyd yn sail i pam na wnaethom ddymchwel gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar y pryd pan oedd bygythiad gwirioneddol i'r orsaf bŵer a'r posibilrwydd y byddem wedi colli defnydd swm sylweddol o'r asedau economaidd a oedd yno'n barod. Roedd yn rhyfedd fod yn rhaid i ni fynd â Llywodraeth y DU i'r llys i sicrhau bod y cyflenwad pŵer yn cael ei gynnal i sicrhau nad oedd risg o lifogydd y gellid eu hosgoi a fyddai wedi dinistrio nid yn unig asedau economaidd, ond cymuned ac roedd o leiaf un ysgol gynradd a fyddai wedi bod mewn perygl o lifogydd. Felly, rydym wedi gwneud y dewisiadau bwriadol hynny i ymyrryd a byddwn yn parhau i wneud hynny.
Rwy'n credu mai'r neges wirioneddol i weithwyr dur a phawb sy'n deall bod dyfodol go iawn, hyfyw i wneud dur yma yng Nghymru, yw peidio â rhoi'r ffidil yn y to, peidio ag ildio i rai o'r penawdau sy'n cael eu creu na'r geiriau eithaf ymosodol, 'Does dim dyfodol arall' sy'n cael eu hyrwyddo gan Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru, Ond i ddeall bod dyfodol gwahanol ar gael mewn gwirionedd. Gyda buddsoddiad gwahanol, gallem gael y fargen orau ar gyfer dur, nid y fargen rataf ar gyfer dur, a dyna mae'r Llywodraeth hon wedi ymrwymo iddo.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
Thank you, Minister.
Yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.69, dwi wedi cytuno i'r cais gan Luke Fletcher i wneud cynnig ar gyfer dadl frys. Felly, Luke Fletcher i wneud y cynnig.
In accordance with Standing Order 12.69, I have accepted a request from Luke Fletcher to move a proposal for an urgent debate. I call on Luke Fletcher to move that proposal.
Cynnig
Cynnig bod y Senedd, o dan Reol Sefydlog 12.69, yn ystyried colli swyddi yn Tata Steel a dyfodol y diwydiant dur yng Nghymru fel mater brys sydd o bwys cyhoeddus.
Motion
To propose that the Senedd, under Standing Order 12.69, consider job losses at Tata Steel and the future of the steel industry in Wales as a matter of urgent public importance.
Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
Diolch, Llywydd, a diolch am y cyfle i alw am ddadl frys, nid yn unig ar y sefyllfa ym Mhort Talbot ond am drywydd dyfodol y diwydiant dur yma yng Nghymru hefyd.
Thank you, Llywydd, and thank you for the opportunity to call for an urgent debate, not just on the situation in Port Talbot but the future of the steel industry here in Wales too.
Now, of course, I fully recognise that the First Minister received questions from Members on Tata, and that we've just finished a statement from the Minister for Economy on Tata, but I still believe there is a need for us to consider an urgent debate on this issue as well as the future of the Welsh steel industry. It is a matter of urgent public importance. Whilst we've had time for Government to answer questions and be scrutinised on their own actions, given the gravity of the situation, there should be more time allocated through a more appropriate format, where the Senedd as a whole could be afforded the opportunity to discuss ideas and directions for the future of the steel industry on the record.
The issues of job losses on this scale in an industry widely recognised as crucial in our transition to net zero and important for our national security and the debate on where we go from here cannot be made just through asking specific time-limited questions from Members. This is not just a regional issue, by the way, tied only to Port Talbot, as I and other Members have consistently said, this is an issue of national consequence, not just for related industry jobs elsewhere in Wales, but also for our climate and infrastructure sectors and our national security. Now, MPs in Westminster will have the opportunity to discuss these issues in a debate in the Commons today; I believe MSs here in Wales need to be afforded the same opportunity. It's times like these that an opportunity to discuss a way forward as a Senedd is important, and I hope Members will agree to allocate time for an urgent debate tomorrow. Diolch.
Nawr, wrth gwrs, rwy'n cydnabod yn llwyr fod y Prif Weinidog wedi derbyn cwestiynau gan yr Aelodau ar Tata, ac ein bod newydd glywed datganiad gan Weinidog yr Economi ar Tata, ond rwy'n dal i gredu bod angen i ni ystyried dadl frys ar y mater hwn yn ogystal â dyfodol diwydiant dur Cymru. Mae'n fater o bwysigrwydd cyhoeddus brys. Er ein bod wedi cael amser i'r Llywodraeth ateb cwestiynau a bod yn destun craffu ar eu gweithredoedd eu hunain, o ystyried difrifoldeb y sefyllfa, dylid neilltuo mwy o amser drwy fformat mwy priodol, lle gellid rhoi'r cyfle i'r Senedd yn ei chyfanrwydd drafod syniadau a chyfarwyddiadau ar gyfer dyfodol y diwydiant dur ar y cofnod.
Ni ellir trafod materion colli swyddi ar y raddfa hon mewn diwydiant a gydnabyddir yn eang fel un hanfodol yn y trawsnewid i sero net ac yn bwysig i'n diogelwch cenedlaethol a'r ddadl ynghylch ble rydym yn mynd o'r fan hon drwy ofyn cwestiynau penodol â therfyn amser gan Aelodau. Nid mater rhanbarthol yn unig yw hwn, gyda llaw, sydd ynghlwm wrth Bort Talbot yn unig, fel y dywedais i ac Aelodau eraill yn gyson, mae hwn yn fater o bwysigrwydd cenedlaethol, nid yn unig ar gyfer swyddi cysylltiedig yn y diwydiant mewn mannau eraill yng Nghymru, ond hefyd ar gyfer ein sectorau hinsawdd a seilwaith a'n diogelwch cenedlaethol. Nawr, bydd ASau yn San Steffan yn cael cyfle i drafod y materion hyn mewn dadl yn Nhŷ'r Cyffredin heddiw; rwy'n credu bod angen rhoi'r un cyfle i Aelodau'r Senedd yma yng Nghymru. Ar adegau fel y rhain mae cael cyfle i drafod ffordd ymlaen fel Senedd yn bwysig, a gobeithiaf y bydd yr Aelodau'n cytuno i neilltuo amser ar gyfer dadl frys yfory. Diolch.
The Minister for Economy to respond.
Gweinidog yr Economi i ymateb.
We have no objection to the proposal.
Nid oes gennym unrhyw wrthwynebiad i'r cynnig.
Thank you.
Diolch.
Y cwestiwn, felly, yw: a ddylid derbyn y cynnig am ddadl frys? A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Na, does yna ddim gwrthwynebiad. Ac felly mae'r cynnig yna wedi ei dderbyn.
The proposal, therefore, is to agree the motion for an urgent debate. Does any Member object? No, there are no objections. And therefore the motion is agreed.
Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
Fe fyddaf i yn gosod y ddadl yna ar gyfer ei chlywed prynhawn fory yn dilyn eitem 5, sef y datganiadau 90 eiliad.
I will table the debate for tomorrow afternoon following item 5, the 90-second statements.
Eitem 4 sydd nesaf ar ein hagenda ni y prynhawn yma, a'r datganiad gan y Gweinidog dros Gyfiawnder Cymdeithasol yw hwn ar y strategaeth tlodi plant. Y Gweinidog, felly, i wneud y datganiad—Jane Hutt.
Item 4 is next on our agenda this afternoon, a statement by the Minister for Social Justice on the child poverty strategy. The Minister to make the statement—Jane Hutt.
Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Today, we are publishing the child poverty strategy for Wales as a cross-cutting, whole-of-Government policy document that sets out our priorities for meaningful action to tackle child poverty and improve the lived experience of children in Wales. I'm proud to say that the strategy was co-constructed with children, young people and families and the organisations that support them. The final content of the strategy has also been strengthened in line with the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child.
Ending child poverty must be an absolute priority for Governments at all levels. Welsh Ministers are committing to use all the levers we have available to their full extent, and we will take a leadership role in co-ordinating wider action to work towards eradicating child poverty and its impacts here in Wales. So, this is a cross-Government commitment, as will be demonstrated through the Plenary today by statements from the Minister for education and the Deputy Minister for Social Partnership.
Through our consultation on this strategy and our wider engagement work, we've heard about how poverty is impacting children, young people, families and communities across Wales. People also told us about the significant efforts under way in communities, third sector organisations, faith groups and public bodies to tackle the impacts of both the cost-of-living crisis and poverty more broadly.
We've heard clearly that many of the policies and plans we have in place are the right ones, but that, in order to maximise the difference we can make, we need to be more focused on delivery, and we need to be smarter about working together both across Government and with other partners to deliver made-in-Wales solutions. We also need to be clearer about how we will put in place robust monitoring and accountability mechanisms to track progress against key indicators on child poverty.
And I’d like to thank all of those who engaged on the development of the strategy and responded to the consultation, including the Equality and Social Justice Committee for their inquiry on the draft strategy and the valuable feedback that it produced. This strategy sets out an approach to be taken now and into the future, whatever the level of resource or range of powers available to us in Wales. It’s a strategy for the next decade, and it must be adaptable for Governments working in different financial and policy environments.
The publication of the strategy comes at a time when we face the most challenging budget settlement in the history of devolution, but, even in this context, we’re determined to protect those most in need and to target public money where it’s most effective. In my own portfolio, this has meant protecting in full the budgets for the discretionary assistance fund and the single advice fund, and there are examples throughout the draft budget of where Ministers have prioritised children in their decision making.
The child poverty strategy is based on five objectives, each accompanied by a priority for action. There are also a range of specific commitments listed under each objective, which are not intended as an exhaustive list, but as an illustration of a wider programme of work across Government.
Objective 1 is to reduce costs and maximise the income of families, and this must be first and foremost in our approach to tackling poverty and supporting those experiencing poverty. Free school meals, the school essentials grant, updated school uniform guidance, education maintenance allowance increased from £30 to £40, free prescriptions, free period products and our partnership with the Fuel Bank Foundation—all examples of work already under way to deliver on this objective. And there’s also the potential for further innovation through our pilots on basic income and baby bundles.
The creation of a coherent system of Welsh benefits is crucial to this objective, making it more straightforward for people and families to access support. I'm pleased to say we've taken a significant step towards such a system this week with the launch of the Welsh benefits charter, signed by all 22 local authorities in Wales. The charter has been delivered under the terms of the co-operation agreement with Plaid Cymru. At the launch event for the charter in Blaenavon yesterday, I was joined by the leader of Torfaen council and designated Member Sian Gwenllian, demonstrating the importance of the co-operation agreement in delivering on this important area of work.
We recognise the limits of the devolution settlement when it comes to income maximisation, with social security reserved. Sadly, we have all become used to the UK Government failing people living in poverty in Wales, but we are always prepared to tell them where they have got it wrong, and, Llywydd, we'll stand ready to work together constructively with a UK Government that is serious about supporting those most in need and ending poverty, and we are taking forward our work exploring the devolution of the administration of welfare.
Objective 2 is to create pathways out of poverty so that children and young people and their families have opportunities to realise their potential. Flying Start, the early years integration transformation programme, school holiday provision, the 'Talk With Me: Speech, Language and Communication (SLC) Delivery Plan', are all examples of how we are supporting children in the first 1,000 days of life on a pathway out of poverty. This continues at school and throughout the education system, with our national mission to close the attainment gap and give every child the best possible education, no matter where they come from.
Fair work and an economy that works for all parts of Wales are also crucial to creating pathways out of poverty. Our economic mission, the young person's guarantee, the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Act 2023, our expanded childcare offer—all part of a framework to build a more prosperous, greener and more equal economy, where people everywhere are connected with fair work. We'll hear more about these priorities from the Minister for education and the Deputy Minister for Social Partnership this afternoon.
Objective 3 is to support child and family well-being and make sure that work across the Welsh Government delivers for children living in poverty, including those with protected characteristics, so that they can enjoy their rights and have better outcomes. Housing is a key area for delivering on this objective. Members will already be aware of the wide range of work being taken forward by the Minister for Climate Change, for example, through implementing the Renting Homes (Wales) Act 2016, the White Paper on ending homelessness and the Warm Homes programme. This objective is also about supporting children and families with their mental health, as the Government prepares to consult on a mental health strategy following the independent review of the 'Together for Mental Health' strategy and 'Talk to me 2'.
Llywydd, it is important to recognise the experience of those with protected characteristics and the intersectional dimensions of poverty. Households with a disabled person or people are the most likely to live in poverty. Women are more likely to bear the burden of poverty. Black, Asian and minority ethnicity people often face additional barriers to accessing services. LGBTQ+ young people are at increased risk of homelessness. We must recognise this and ensure that we have a response that meets these different needs.
Objective 4 is to ensure children, young people and their families are treated with dignity and respect by the people and services who interact with and support them, and to challenge the stigma of poverty. So, there is a responsibility across Government and the public sector to ensure every interaction with individuals and families is delivered with compassion and understanding, closely linked to the well-being elements of Objective 3, but also a practical point about removing stigma as a barrier to accessing support.
Objective 5 is to ensure that effective cross-Government working at the national level enables strong collaboration at the regional and local level. This was a strong theme of engagement and consultation on the strategy, and I'm pleased that the Welsh Government is supporting a groundbreaking new example of what can be achieved through combining the efforts of Government, third sector and private sector. Last week, the First Minister and I visited the first multibank to be set up in Wales, Cwtch Mawr, in Swansea. The Welsh Government is proud to be contributing to this initiative, alongside Swansea council, private sector partners and Faith in Families as the third sector delivery lead—just one example of an approach that has great potential for innovation and delivery for those most in need.
Finally, Llywydd, I want to recognise the important feedback we've received about ensuring there are robust ways to measure our action on child poverty so that we can be held accountable. And I can confirm today that not only will we be producing a monitoring and impact framework, but this framework will be independently reviewed by academic expert Professor Rod Hick from Cardiff University. The framework will take account of the well-being of Wales national indicators and will ensure that our efforts are concentrated where they are most effective. Diolch.
Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Heddiw, rydym ni'n cyhoeddi strategaeth tlodi plant Cymru sy'n ddogfen bolisi drawsbynciol, i'r Llywodraeth gyfan i nodi ein blaenoriaethau ni ar gyfer gweithredu mewn ffordd ystyrlon i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant a gwella profiad bywyd plant yng Nghymru. Rwy'n falch o ddweud y cafodd y strategaeth ei llunio ar y cyd â phlant, pobl ifanc a'u teuluoedd a'r sefydliadau sy'n eu cefnogi nhw. Mae cynnwys terfynol y strategaeth wedi cael ei rymuso hefyd yn unol â Chonfensiwn y Cenhedloedd Unedig ar Hawliau'r Plentyn.
Mae'n rhaid i roi terfyn ar dlodi plant fod yn flaenoriaeth lwyr i bob ystod o Lywodraethau. Mae Gweinidogion Cymru yn ymrwymedig i ddefnyddio'r holl ysgogiadau sydd gennym ni ar gael i'w graddau llawn, ac fe fydd gennym ni swyddogaeth arweiniol o ran cydlynu camau ehangach i weithio tuag at ddileu tlodi plant a'i effeithiau yma yng Nghymru. Felly, mae hwn yn ymrwymiad trawslywodraethol, fel amlygir hynny yn y Cyfarfod Llawn heddiw yn natganiadau'r Gweinidog addysg a'r Dirprwy Weinidog Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol.
Trwy gyfrwng ein hymgynghoriad ni ar y strategaeth hon a'n gwaith ymgysylltu yn fwy eang, fe glywsom ni am y modd y mae tlodi yn effeithio ar blant, pobl ifanc, teuluoedd a chymunedau ledled Cymru. Roedd pobl yn sôn wrthym ni hefyd am yr ymdrechion sylweddol sydd ar y gweill mewn cymunedau, sefydliadau'r trydydd sector, grwpiau ffydd a chyrff cyhoeddus i fynd i'r afael ag effeithiau'r argyfwng costau byw a thlodi yn ehangach.
Fe glywsom ni'n glir fod llawer o'r polisïau a'r cynlluniau sydd gennym ni ar waith yn rhai addas, ond i sicrhau'r gwahaniaeth mwyaf posibl y gallwn ni ei weithredu, mae angen i ni ganolbwyntio mwy ar gyflawni, ac mae angen i ni fod yn ddoethach ynghylch cydweithio ar draws y Llywodraeth a chyda phartneriaid eraill i ddarparu datrysiadau yng Nghymru. Mae angen i ni fod yn fwy eglur hefyd ynghylch sut y byddwn ni'n rhoi mecanweithiau cadarn ar waith o ran monitro ac atebolrwydd ar gyfer olrhain cynnydd yn erbyn y dangosyddion allweddol o dlodi plant.
Ac fe hoffwn i ddiolch i bawb a gymerodd ran yn natblygiad y strategaeth ac sydd wedi ymateb i'r ymgynghoriad, gan gynnwys y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol am ei ymchwiliad i'r strategaeth ddrafft a'r adborth gwerthfawr a gynhyrchodd. Mae'r strategaeth hon yn nodi dull i'w ddefnyddio nawr ac i'r dyfodol, beth bynnag fyddo swm yr adnoddau neu'r ystod o bwerau a fydd ar gael i ni yng Nghymru. Mae hon yn strategaeth ar gyfer y degawd nesaf, ac mae'n rhaid iddi fod yn hyblyg ar gyfer Llywodraethau sy'n gweithio mewn amgylcheddau amrywiol o ran arian a pholisi.
Fe ddaw cyhoeddiad y strategaeth ar adeg yr ydym ni'n wynebu'r setliad cyllideb mwyaf heriol yn hanes datganoli, ond yn y cyd-destun hwn, hyd yn oed, rydym ni'n benderfynol o ddiogelu'r rhai mwyaf anghenus ac anelu arian cyhoeddus at y mannau lle gall fod yn fwyaf effeithiol. Yn fy mhortffolio fy hun, mae hyn wedi golygu diogelu'r cyllidebau ar gyfer y gronfa cymorth dewisol a'r gronfa gynghori sengl yn eu cyfanrwydd, ac mae enghreifftiau drwy gydol y gyllideb ddrafft o achosion o Weinidogion yn blaenoriaethu plant wrth wneud eu penderfyniadau.
Mae'r strategaeth tlodi plant yn seiliedig ar bum amcan, pob un yn cyd-fynd â blaenoriaeth ar gyfer gweithredu. Fe geir ystod o ymrwymiadau penodol hefyd a restrir o dan bob un o'r amcanion, na chawson nhw eu bwriadu i fod yn rhestr hollgynhwysfawr, ond ar gyfer darlunio rhaglen fwy eang o waith ar draws y Llywodraeth.
Amcan 1 yw lleihau costau a sicrhau'r incwm mwyaf i deuluoedd, ac mae'n rhaid i hyn fod yn gyfan gwbl flaenllaw yn ein hymagwedd ni wrth fynd i'r afael â thlodi a chefnogi'r rhai sy'n byw mewn tlodi. Prydau ysgol am ddim, grant hanfodion ysgol, canllawiau gwisg ysgol diweddaredig, cynyddu lwfans cynhaliaeth addysg o £30 i £40, presgripsiynau am ddim, cynhyrchion mislif am ddim a'n partneriaeth â'r Sefydliad Banc Tanwydd—pob un yn enghraifft o waith sydd ar y gweill eisoes i gyflawni'r amcan hwn. Ac fe geir posibiliadau hefyd i arloesi eto drwy ein cynlluniau treialu ar gyfer incwm sylfaenol a bwndeli babanod.
Mae creu cyfundrefn o fudd-daliadau i Gymru sy'n gydlynol yn hanfodol i'r amcan hwn, gan ei gwneud hi'n fwy syml i bobl a theuluoedd gael gafael ar gymorth. Rwy'n falch o ddweud ein bod ni wedi cymryd cam sylweddol tuag at gyfundrefn o'r fath yr wythnos hon gyda lansio Siarter Budd-daliadau Cymru, a lofnodwyd gan bob un o'r 22 awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru. Cafodd y siarter ei chyflwyno yn unol â thelerau'r cytundeb cydweithio gyda Phlaid Cymru. Yn y digwyddiad ar gyfer lansio'r siarter ym Mlaenafon ddoe, fe ymunodd arweinydd cyngor Torfaen a'r Aelod dynodedig Siân Gwenllian â mi, sy'n arddangos pwysigrwydd y cytundeb cydweithio o ran cyflawni yn y maes pwysig hwn o waith.
Rydym ni'n cydnabod cyfyngiadau'r setliad datganoli o ran codi incwm, gyda nawdd cymdeithasol yn fater a gedwir yn ôl. Yn anffodus, rydym ni i gyd wedi dod yn gyfarwydd â gweld Llywodraeth y DU yn siomi pobl sy'n byw mewn tlodi yng Nghymru, ond rydym ni bob amser yn barod i ddweud wrthyn nhw lle maen nhw'n cyfeiliorni, ac yn wir, Llywydd, fe fyddwn i'n barod iawn i gydweithio mewn ffordd adeiladol â Llywodraeth yn y DU sydd o ddifrif ynghylch cefnogi'r rhai mwyaf anghenus a diddymu tlodi, ac rydym ni'n bwrw ymlaen â'n gwaith ni o ran ymchwilio i ddatganoli gweinyddu lles.
Amcan 2 yw creu llwybrau allan o dlodi fel bydd plant a phobl ifanc a'u teuluoedd yn cael cyfleoedd i wireddu eu posibiliadau. Mae Dechrau'n Deg, rhaglen trawsnewid integreiddio blynyddoedd cynnar, darpariaeth ar gyfer gwyliau'r ysgol, 'Siarad gyda fi: Cynllun Cyflawni ar gyfer Lleferydd, Iaith a Chyfathrebu', i gyd yn enghreifftiau o sut rydym ni'n cefnogi plant yn ystod y 1,000 diwrnod cyntaf o fywyd ar lwybr allan o dlodi. Mae hyn yn parhau yn yr ysgol a thrwy'r system addysg, gyda'n cenhadaeth genedlaethol i gau'r bwlch cyrhaeddiad a chynnig yr addysg orau bosibl i bob plentyn, ni waeth o ble y daw.
Mae gwaith teg ac economi sy'n gweithio i bob rhan o Gymru yn hanfodol hefyd i greu llwybrau allan o dlodi. Ein cenhadaeth economaidd ni, y warant i bobl ifanc, Deddf Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol a Chaffael Cyhoeddus (Cymru) 2023, ein cynnig gofal plant estynedig—i gyd yn rhan o fframwaith ar gyfer meithrin economi fwy ffyniannus, sy'n wyrddach ac yn fwy cyfartal, lle gall pobl ym mhobman gysylltu â gwaith teg. Fe fyddwn ni'n clywed rhagor am y blaenoriaethau hyn gan y Gweinidog addysg a'r Dirprwy Weinidog Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol y prynhawn yma.
Amcan 3 yw cefnogi llesiant plant a theuluoedd a sicrhau bod gwaith ar draws Llywodraeth Cymru yn cyflawni ar gyfer plant sy'n byw mewn tlodi, gan gynnwys y rhai sydd â nodweddion gwarchodedig, er mwyn iddyn nhw ymarfer eu hawliau a chael canlyniadau gwell. Mae tai yn faes allweddol ar gyfer cyflawni'r amcan hwn. Mae'r Aelodau eisoes yn ymwybodol o'r ystod eang o waith sy'n cael ei wneud gan y Gweinidog Newid Hinsawdd, er enghraifft, drwy weithrediad Deddf Rhentu Cartrefi (Cymru) 2016, y Papur Gwyn ar weld diwedd ar ddigartrefedd a rhaglen Cartrefi Clyd. Mae'r amcan hwn hefyd yn ymwneud â chefnogi plant a theuluoedd gyda'u hiechyd meddwl, wrth i'r Llywodraeth baratoi i ymgynghori ar strategaeth iechyd meddwl yn dilyn yr adolygiad annibynnol o'r strategaeth 'Law yn Llaw at Iechyd Meddwl' a 'Beth am Siarad â Fi? 2'.
Llywydd, mae hi'n bwysig cydnabod profiad y rhai sydd â nodweddion gwarchodedig a'r agweddau croestoriadol sydd ar dlodi. Yr aelwydydd sy'n cynnwys unigolyn neu bobl anabl yw'r rhai mwyaf tebygol o fod mewn tlodi. Mae menywod yn fwy tebygol o fod yn ysgwyddo baich tlodi. Mae pobl ddu, Asiaidd a lleiafrifoedd ethnig yn aml yn wynebu rhwystrau ychwanegol rhag gallu cael gafael ar wasanaethau. Mae pobl ifanc LHDTC+ mewn mwy o berygl o fynd yn ddigartref. Mae'n rhaid i ni gydnabod hyn a sicrhau ein bod ni'n cael ymateb sy'n diwallu'r anghenion amrywiol hyn.
Amcan 4 yw sicrhau y bydd plant, pobl ifanc a'u teuluoedd yn cael eu trin ag urddas a pharch gan y bobl a'r gwasanaethau sy'n rhyngweithio â nhw ac yn eu cefnogi nhw, a herio stigma tlodi. Felly, mae cyfrifoldeb gan adrannau ar draws y Llywodraeth a'r sector cyhoeddus i sicrhau bod pob rhyngweithio ag unigolion a theuluoedd yn cael eu cyflwyno gyda thosturi a dealltwriaeth, gyda chysylltiad cryf ag elfennau Amcan 3 o ran llesiant, ond mae hwn hefyd yn bwynt ymarferol ynglŷn â symud rhwystr y stigma er mwyn i hwnnw beidio â bod yn rhwystr i bobl rhag cael gafael ar gymorth.
Amcan 5 yw sicrhau bod gweithio trawslywodraethol effeithiol ar haen genedlaethol yn caniatáu cydweithio cadarn ar haenau rhanbarthol a lleol. Roedd honno'n thema fawr o ymgysylltu ac ymgynghori yn y strategaeth, ac rwy'n falch fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn cefnogi'r enghraifft newydd arloesol hon o'r hyn y gellir ei gyflawni trwy gyfuno ymdrechion y Llywodraeth, y trydydd sector a'r sector preifat. Wythnos diwethaf, fe ymwelodd y Prif Weinidog a minnau â'r banc pob dim cyntaf i gael ei sefydlu yng Nghymru, Cwtch Mawr, yn Abertawe. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn falch o gyfrannu at y fenter hon, ochr yn ochr â chyngor Abertawe, partneriaid yn y sector preifat a Faith in Families yn arweinydd cyflawni yn y trydydd sector—dim ond un enghraifft o ddull sydd â photensial mawr i arloesi a chyflawni er mwyn y rhai sydd â'r angen mwyaf.
Yn olaf, Llywydd, fe hoffwn i gydnabod yr adborth pwysig a gawsom ni ynglŷn â sicrhau y bydd dulliau cadarn o fesur ein camau gweithredu ni ar dlodi plant ar gyfer ein dal ni'n atebol. Ac fe allaf i gadarnhau heddiw y byddwn ni, nid yn unig yn cynhyrchu fframwaith monitro ac effaith, ond bydd y fframwaith hwn yn cael ei adolygu yn annibynnol gan yr arbenigwr academaidd yr Athro Rod Hick o Brifysgol Caerdydd. Fe fydd y fframwaith yn ystyried llesiant dangosyddion cenedlaethol Cymru ac fe fydd yn sicrhau y bydd ein hymdrechion ni'n cael eu canolbwyntio yn y mannau y byddan nhw fwyaf effeithiol. Diolch.
Diolch, Llywydd. Welsh Government data, as you know, shows that 28 per cent of children were living in relative income poverty in Wales in 2022. Loughborough University analysis last summer found that more than one in five children are living in poverty in every local authority in Wales. The Bevan Foundation stated that this shows, quote, 'minimal progress has been made in reducing child poverty over the past decade.'
As stated in the Joseph Rowntree Foundation 'Monitoring poverty and social exclusion in Wales' report, in 2009, even before the recession—that recession—the problem of low income was already rising sharply, to the extent that half of the previous improvement in child poverty had already been lost. In other words, that was before the credit crunch and recession in 2008, when it reached the highest levels of any UK nation at 32 per cent. It is the case, is it not, Minister, that the Welsh Government has been responsible for economic development since 1999. Wales today has the lowest gross domestic product output per head, lowest pay packets and lowest gross disposable income amongst the UK nations, with employment below, and both unemployment and economic inactivity above, the UK level. The recommendations in the November 2022 Auditor General for Wales report, 'Time for change—Poverty in Wales', included to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of grant-funded programmes, noting that:
'All councils are dependent on grants but the short-term nature of grant programmes, overly complex administration, weaknesses in guidance and grant restrictions, and difficulties spending monies mean that funding is not making the impact it could.'
The auditor general's report went on to recommend that the Welsh Government
'provide longer timescales for announcing and receiving bids to enable better resource planning; move away from annual bidding cycles to multi-year allocations; enable funding to be more flexibly spent to avoid an emphasis on quicker projects'
and
'streamline and simplify processes and grant conditions to reduce the administrative burden'.
That report's recommendations also include local strategies, targets and performance reporting for tackling and alleviating poverty. So, what consideration did you and your ministerial colleagues give to the auditor general's recommendations when designing this strategy, and why does it appear that they've not been included?
This Welsh Government strategy does not include any measurable targets, instead using the generic national milestones within the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 and a so-called monitoring and impact framework. How do you therefore respond to the statement today by Barnardo's Cymru that it
'continues to be a disappointment that Welsh Government has not listened to numerous recommendations on the need for targets and an action plan attached to the strategy so that progress can be transparently and regularly monitored'?
Any objective person would recognise that they're right, wouldn't they, Minister? Commenting on the draft strategy three months ago, the Children's Commissioner for Wales stated that it lacked ambition, clarity and detail, that the lack of detail on actions, timescales and deliverables means that there was no way of holding the Welsh Government to account, and that it's a list of policy initiatives, which
'doesn't really spell out exactly what, how, when or who will actually deliver against those different policies in order to reduce and eradicate child poverty.'
Anyone who has ever successfully managed projects or strategies would know that she is correct, wouldn't they, Minister? How do you respond to the statement by the children's commissioner this morning that she was deeply disappointed by the new strategy and that
'we will not be able to determine whether public money being spent in Wales is reaching those children whose lives are being so severely affected'?
It is the case, is it not, that the Welsh Government has a number of levers to tackle child poverty under its control, so why hasn't it established real targets and milestones within the strategy, or is this just another case of Welsh Government dodging accountability?
We agree with the strategy's objective of maximising the incomes of families. For many years, service providers and researchers across the sector have been calling for a coherent and integrated Welsh benefits system for all the means-tested benefits the Welsh Government is responsible for, reflected in the recommendations of successive parliamentary committee reports, including one I was party to in 2019. So, why is your Welsh benefits charter, launched yesterday, only about further work to develop a Welsh benefits system, thereby apparently kicking the can down the road once again? What is your timescale for the actual introduction of a Welsh benefits system, and what targets will be in place to measure progress?
Finally, this strategy states that you will:
'Remove barriers to employment and career pathways for disabled people, women, carers and ethnic minority people'.
So, who, what, when, where and how? Diolch yn fawr.
Diolch, Llywydd. Mae data Llywodraeth Cymru, fel gwyddoch chi, yn dangos bod 28 y cant o blant yn byw mewn tlodi incwm cymharol yng Nghymru yn 2022. Roedd dadansoddiad gan Brifysgol Loughborough yr haf y llynedd yn canfod bod mwy nag un o bob pump o blant yn byw mewn tlodi ym mhob awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru. Roedd Sefydliad Bevan yn datgan bod hyn yn dangos, rwy'n dyfynnu, 'mai ychydig iawn o gynnydd a wnaethpwyd o ran lleddfu tlodi plant dros y degawd diwethaf.'
Fel nododd adroddiad Sefydliad Joseph Rowntree, 'Monitro tlodi ac allgáu cymdeithasol yng Nghymru', yn 2009, cyn y dirwasgiad, hyd yn oed—y dirwasgiad hwnnw—roedd y broblem gydag incwm isel yn cynyddu yn gyflym, i'r graddau bod hanner y gwelliant blaenorol o ran tlodi plant wedi mynd i'r gwellt eisoes. Mewn geiriau eraill, roedd hynny cyn y wasgfa gredyd a'r dirwasgiad yn 2008, pan gyrhaeddodd y cyfraddau mwyaf mewn unrhyw wlad yn y DU, sef 32 y cant. Yr achos yw, onid e, Gweinidog, mai Llywodraeth Cymru sydd wedi bod yn gyfrifol am ddatblygiad economaidd ers 1999. Cymru sydd â'r allbwn cynnyrch domestig gros isaf y pen heddiw, y pecynnau cyflog lleiaf a'r incwm gwario gros lleiaf ymhlith gwledydd y DU, gyda chyflogaeth islaw, a diweithdra ac anweithgarwch economaidd uwchlaw cyfradd y DU gyfan. Roedd yr argymhellion yn adroddiad Archwilydd Cyffredinol Cymru ym mis Tachwedd 2022, 'Amser am newid—Tlodi yng Nghymru', yn cynnwys gwella effeithlonrwydd ac effeithiolrwydd rhaglenni a ariennir gan grant, gan nodi:
'Mae pob cyngor yn ddibynnol ar grantiau ond mae natur fyrdymor rhaglenni grant, gweinyddiaeth rhy gymhleth, gwendidau mewn canllawiau a chyfyngiadau grantiau, ac anawsterau gwario arian yn golygu nad yw cyllid yn cael yr effaith y gallai ei chael.'
Aeth adroddiad yr archwilydd cyffredinol ymlaen i argymell bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn
'darparu graddfeydd amser hwy ar gyfer cyhoeddi a chael cynigion i'w gwneud yn bosibl cynllunio adnoddau'n well; newid o gylchoedd cynigion blynyddol i ddyraniadau amlflwyddyn; ei gwneud yn bosibl gwario cyllid yn fwy hyblyg er mwyn osgoi pwyslais ar brosiectau cyflymach.'
a
'symleiddio prosesau ac amodau grant i leihau’r baich gweinyddol;'.
Mae argymhellion yr adroddiad hwnnw yn cynnwys strategaethau, nodau ac adroddiadau perfformiad lleol hefyd i fynd i'r afael â thlodi a'i leddfu. Felly, pa ystyriaeth y gwnaethoch chi a'ch cydweithwyr gweinidogol ei rhoi i argymhellion yr archwilydd cyffredinol wrth ddylunio'r strategaeth hon, a pham mae hi'n ymddangos nad ydyn nhw wedi cael eu cynnwys yma?
Nid yw'r strategaeth hon gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn cynnwys unrhyw nodau y gellir eu mesur, ond yn hytrach na hynny'n defnyddio'r cerrig milltir cenedlaethol generig yn Neddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015 a'r fframwaith monitro ac effaith fel y'i gelwir. Sut ydych chi am ymateb, felly, i'r datganiad heddiw gan Barnardo's Cymru ei bod yn
'parhau i fod yn siomedig nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru wedi gwrando ar nifer o argymhellion ynglŷn â'r angen am nodau a chynllun gweithredu sydd ynghlwm wrth y strategaeth er mwyn monitro cynnydd mewn ffordd dryloyw ac yn rheolaidd'?
Fe fyddai unrhyw un di-duedd yn cydnabod ei bod nhw'n iawn, oni fyddai, Gweinidog? Wrth sôn am y strategaeth ddrafft dri mis yn ôl, fe ddywedodd Comisiynydd Plant Cymru ei fod yn brin o uchelgais, eglurder a manylion, a bod diffyg manylion ynglŷn â'r camau, yr amserlenni a'r cyflawniadau yn golygu nad oedd modd dwyn Llywodraeth Cymru i gyfrif, a'i bod yn rhestr o fentrau polisi,
'nad yw'n dweud yn union beth, sut, pryd na phwy fydd yn cyflawni o ran y gwahanol bolisïau hynny ar gyfer lleddfu a dileu tlodi plant.'
Fe fyddai unrhyw a fu'n rheoli prosiectau neu strategaethau yn llwyddiannus erioed yn gwybod ei bod hi'n iawn, oni fyddai, Gweinidog? Sut ydych chi am ymateb i'r datganiad gan y comisiynydd plant y bore yma ei bod hi wedi cael ei siomi yn fawr gan y strategaeth newydd ac
'ni fyddwn yn gwybod a yw arian cyhoeddus sy’n cael ei wario yng Nghymru yn cyrraedd y plant hynny y mae eu bywydau’n cael eu heffeithio mor ddifrifol.'?
Onid yr achos yw bod gan Lywodraeth Cymru nifer o ddulliau i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant sydd yn ei rheolaeth hi ei hun, felly pam nad yw hi wedi pennu nodau a cherrig milltir gwirioneddol yn y strategaeth, neu ai achos arall yn unig yw hwn o Lywodraeth Cymru yn osgoi atebolrwydd?
Rydym ni'n cytuno ag amcan y strategaeth o gynyddu incwm teuluoedd hyd yr eithaf. Ers blynyddoedd lawer, mae darparwyr gwasanaethau ac ymchwilwyr ar draws y sector wedi bod yn galw am system o fudd-daliadau i Gymru sy'n gydlynol ac yn integredig ar gyfer yr holl fudd-daliadau prawf modd y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gyfrifol amdanyn nhw, ac fe adlewyrchir hynny yn argymhellion adroddiadau pwyllgorau seneddol olynol, gan gynnwys un yr oeddwn i â rhan ynddo yn 2019. Felly, pam mae eich siarter budd-daliadau Cymru, a lansiwyd ddoe, yn ymwneud â dim ond gwaith pellach i ddatblygu system fudd-daliadau i Gymru, a thrwy wneud felly, dim ond gohirio'r peth tan rywbryd arall y bydd hynny'n ei wneud unwaith eto? Beth yw eich amserlen chi ar gyfer cyflwyno system o fudd-daliadau i Gymru mewn gwirionedd, a pha nodau a fydd ar waith i fesur cynnydd?
Yn olaf, mae'r strategaeth hon yn nodi y byddwch chi'n:
'Dileu'r rhwystrau i gyflogaeth a llwybrau gyrfa a wynebir gan bobl anabl, menywod, gofalwyr a phobl ethnig leiafrifol.'
Felly, pwy, beth, pryd, ym mha le, a sut? Diolch yn fawr.
Well, I have to say, I did start to wonder whether you'd actually read the child poverty strategy, Mark Isherwood, with your opening comments and points—they certainly weren't questions to me about the statement that I made this afternoon and the child poverty strategy that I’ve launched today. I think it's disrespectful to all the people who were engaged in the consultation—our co-construction with children and young people who told us what they wanted, and that is how we’ve responded, in terms of the strategy for tackling child poverty.
Wel, mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, roeddwn i'n dechrau meddwl tybed a oeddech chi wedi darllen y strategaeth tlodi plant mewn gwirionedd, Mark Isherwood, wrth i chi wneud eich sylwadau a'ch pwyntiau agoriadol—yn sicr nid cwestiynau i mi oedden nhw am y datganiad a wnes i'r prynhawn yma a'r strategaeth tlodi plant a lansiwyd gennyf i heddiw. Rwyf i o'r farn fod hynny'n arddangos diffyg parch i bawb a fu'n rhan o'r ymgynghoriad—ein hadeiladwaith ar y cyd â phlant a phobl ifanc a fynegodd eu dyheadau i ni, ac rydym ni wedi ymateb i hynny, o ran y strategaeth i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant.
Of course, the strategy sets out our ambitions for the longer term, outlines how we'll work across Government, with our partners, to maximise the impact of the levers available to us in the Welsh Government. I've said already there's an ambitious framework to deliver those policies and programmes, doing everything that we can with our powers to tackle child poverty, and working with our partners towards that Wales where we want to eradicate child poverty. Of course that's my ambition, Mark Isherwood—to eradicate child poverty in Wales.
I'm very glad you got to the point, Mark, where you did acknowledge, in the strategy, the most important point that came through, that we need to get money into people's pockets, that we need to maximise income. Of course, this is something that I've been reporting on for some time. I think that's why it was so important that yesterday we launched the Welsh benefits charter. What's really important is that's not just our charter—actually it’s launching a new Welsh benefits system, I believe. It's not just a charter. The charter is about how you deliver a Welsh benefits system. I'm going to do an oral statement later in the month—and I have agreed this with our co-operation agreement partners—on the Welsh benefits charter. We're going to do a lot more about that later this term.
At the heart of that Welsh benefits charter is work to develop a compassionate, person-centered and streamlined Welsh benefits system. When we went yesterday to Blaenavon resource centre, the leader of Torfaen council, on behalf of 22 local authorities, signed up to this charter, telling us how they were going to streamline that access to benefits. So this is a major breakthrough. They'll streamline it by starting with the funding we give to those benefits: council tax reduction scheme—thousands of people don't pay it, but a lot more could claim it; access to free school meals; access to the school essentials grant; access to the education maintenance allowance. These are Welsh benefits that we, with local government colleagues, are going to ensure can be streamlined—one application, not having to go through a whole range of applications, administration, red tape, in order to get those benefits into the pockets of the families who need this most.
I just want to quickly say that the monitoring framework is really important. I've said that in my statement. And actually, under the Children and Families (Wales) Measure 2010—and you were here, Mark, when we took that through—we've a duty to publish a report every three years on progress in achieving our child poverty objectives. We're held to account, of course. The last progress report was published in December 2022. Work on that robust monitoring framework is being taken forward at pace. I've already acknowledged that. But I think it is important that the framework is taking into account national indicators and national milestones we have in place under the well-being of future generations Act. The whole of the Senedd embraces, supports and endorses the well-being of future generations Act. Please let's use it and implement it appropriately.
One of the indicators is a commitment to reduce the poverty gap between people in Wales with certain key and protected characteristics—which mean they're most likely to be in poverty, and I've mentioned that in my statement today: disabled people, black, Asian and minority ethnic people and women—and those without characteristics by 2035, and committing to set a stretching target for 2050. Every year, we report on how we're progressing with those targets, through our 'Well-being of Wales' annual report.
But can I just also say this? I've said in my statement and listened patiently to you for you to acknowledge the role of the UK Government in this. Surely, the Tory spokesperson should acknowledge that its tax and benefits and social security system, which we're not responsible for—although we are developing our Welsh benefits system—are key levers to tackling poverty. We saw, in 10 years of Labour Government, child poverty going down because of the ways in which we used tax and benefits. In thirteen years of austerity, it's gone up.
Yesterday, you will have seen—[Interruption.] I'm responding to your question. You will have seen the report yesterday that indicates that the social security system is threadbare. And actually, just to say the Joseph Rowntree Foundation, which you commented on, states that current estimates show that universal credit levels are £35 per week short for a single person and £65 per week short for a couple. It is the bedroom tax, it's the two-child limit, all of the social security, and the UK Government not recognising their responsibilities. Today I think you will have heard Jeremy Hunt talking about tax cutting. How will he do that? Rishi Sunak says it'll be cuts to benefits. That's what they said in the last two weeks, and today we heard that people on prepayment meters won't be able to feed their meters. It was 800 last year; 2 million are predicted this year.
Wrth gwrs, mae'r strategaeth yn nodi ein huchelgeisiau ar gyfer y tymor hwy, gan amlinellu sut y byddwn ni'n gweithio ar draws y Llywodraeth, gyda'n partneriaid ni, i wneud y mwyaf posibl o effaith y dulliau sydd ar gael i ni yn Llywodraeth Cymru. Rwyf i wedi dweud eisoes bod fframwaith uchelgeisiol i gyflawni'r polisïau a'r rhaglenni hynny, gan wneud popeth sydd yn ein gallu gyda'n pwerau i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant, a gweithio gyda'n partneriaid tuag at y Gymru honno lle rydym ni'n llwyddo i ddileu tlodi plant. Wrth gwrs hwnnw yw fy uchelgais i, Mark Isherwood—dileu tlodi plant yng Nghymru.
Rwy'n falch iawn eich bod chi wedi cyrraedd y pwynt, Mark, lle roeddech chi'n cydnabod, yn y strategaeth, y pwynt pwysicaf a ddaeth i'r amlwg, bod angen i ni roi'r arian ym mhocedi pobl, a bod angen i ni sicrhau'r incwm mwyaf. Wrth gwrs, mae hyn yn rhywbeth yr wyf i wedi bod yn sôn amdano ers peth amser. Rwy'n credu mai dyna pam mae hi mor bwysig ein bod ni wedi lansio siarter budd-daliadau Cymru ddoe. Yr hyn sy'n wirioneddol bwysig yw nid ein siarter ni yn unig—lansio system fudd-daliadau newydd i Gymru, mewn gwirionedd, yn fy marn i. Nid dim ond cyflwyno siarter yn unig. Ystyr y siarter yw'r modd yr ydych chi'n rhedeg system fudd-daliadau yng Nghymru. Fe fyddaf i'n rhoi datganiad llafar yn ddiweddarach yn y mis—ac rwyf i wedi cytuno ar hynny gyda'n partneriaid yn y cytundeb cydweithio—ynglŷn â'r siarter budd-daliadau i Gymru. Fe fyddwn ni'n gwneud llawer mwy ynghylch hynny yn ddiweddarach yn y tymor hwn.
Wrth galon y siarter fudd-daliadau honno i Gymru y mae'r gwaith i ddatblygu system fudd-daliadau sy'n ystyriol, yn canolbwyntio ar yr unigolyn ac yn fwy syml. Pan aethom ni i ganolfan adnoddau Blaenafon ddoe, fe wnaeth arweinydd cyngor Torfaen, ar ran 22 o awdurdodau lleol, lofnodi'r siarter hon, gan ddweud wrthym ni sut yr oedden nhw am symleiddio'r ffordd y bydd pobl yn cael eu budd-daliadau. Felly, mae hwn yn gam mawr ymlaen. Maen nhw am symleiddio drwy ddechrau gyda'r cyllid yr ydym ni'n ei roi i'r budd-daliadau hynny: cynllun gostyngiadau'r dreth gyngor—nid yw miloedd o bobl yn ei thalu o gwbl, ond fe allai llawer mwy ei hawlio; prydau ysgol ar gael am ddim; mynediad i'r grant hanfodion ysgol; mynediad i'r lwfans cynhaliaeth addysg. Dyma fanteision i bobl yng Nghymru, gyda chydweithwyr yn llywodraeth leol, y byddwn ni'n sicrhau y gellir eu symleiddio nhw—cais unigol, heb orfod mynd trwy ystod eang o geisiadau, gweinyddu, biwrocratiaeth, ar gyfer rhoi'r budd-daliadau hynny ym mhocedi'r teuluoedd sydd â'r angen mwyaf.
Dim ond gair bach cyflym i ddweud bod y fframwaith ar gyfer monitro yn wirioneddol bwysig. Fe ddywedais i hynny yn fy natganiad i. A dweud y gwir, o dan Fesur Plant a Theuluoedd (Cymru) 2010—ac roeddech chi yn y fan hon, Mark, pan wnaethom ni ddwyn hwnnw drwodd—mae dyletswydd arnom ni i gyhoeddi adroddiad bob tair blynedd ar gynnydd o ran cyflawni ein hamcanion ynghylch tlodi plant. Rydym ni'n cael ein dwyn i gyfrif, wrth gwrs. Fe gyhoeddwyd yr adroddiad cynnydd diwethaf ym mis Rhagfyr 2022. Mae gwaith ynglŷn â'r fframwaith monitro cadarn hwnnw'n cael ei ddatblygu ar gyflymder. Rwyf i wedi cydnabod hynny eisoes. Ond rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig fod y fframwaith yn ystyried dangosyddion cenedlaethol a cherrig milltir cenedlaethol sydd gennym ni ar waith yn unol â Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol. Mae'r Senedd gyfan yn anwesu, yn cefnogi ac yn cymeradwyo Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol. Gadewch i ni ei defnyddio hi a'i rhoi hi ar waith mewn ffordd briodol.
Un o'r dangosyddion yw'r ymrwymiad i lenwi'r bwlch tlodi rhwng pobl yng Nghymru sydd â nodweddion allweddol a gwarchodedig arbennig—sy'n golygu eu bod nhw'n fwyaf tebygol o fod mewn tlodi, ac fe soniais i am hynny yn fy natganiad i heddiw: pobl anabl, pobl ddu, Asiaidd ac ethnig leiafrifol a menywod—a'r rhai heb nodweddion erbyn 2035, ac ymrwymo i bennu nod ymestynnol ar gyfer 2050. Yn flynyddol, fe fyddwn ni'n adrodd ar ein hynt gyda'r nodau hynny, drwy gyfrwng ein hadroddiad blynyddol 'Llesiant Cymru'.
A gaf i ddweud hyn hefyd? Fe ddywedais i hyn yn fy natganiad ac fe wrandewais i'n amyneddgar arnoch chi er mwyn i chi gydnabod swyddogaeth Llywodraeth y DU yn hyn o beth. Yn sicr, fe ddylai llefarydd y Torïaid gydnabod bod ei system treth a budd-daliadau a nawdd cymdeithasol, nad y ni sy'n gyfrifol amdani hi—er ein bod ni'n datblygu ein system budd-daliadau ni i Gymru—yn ysgogiadau allweddol i fynd i'r afael â thlodi. Fe welsom ni, yn ystod 10 mlynedd o Lywodraeth Lafur, dlodi plant yn prinhau oherwydd y ffyrdd yr oeddem ni'n defnyddio trethiant a budd-daliadau. Mewn tair blynedd ar ddeg o gyni, fe gynyddodd.
Ddoe, fe welsoch chi—[Torri ar draws.] Rwy'n ymateb i'ch cwestiwn chi. Fe welsoch chi'r adroddiad ddoe a oedd yn dangos bod y system nawdd cymdeithasol yn denau iawn. Ac mewn gwirionedd, dim ond gair i ddweud ynglŷn â Sefydliad Joseph Rowntree, y gwnaethoch chi sôn amdano, bod yr amcangyfrifon cyfredol yn dangos bod cyfraddau credyd cynhwysol £35 yr wythnos yn rhy isel i unigolyn sengl a £65 yr wythnos yn rhy isel i ddau. Dyna i chi'r dreth ystafell wely, dyna i chi'r terfyn dau blentyn, y nawdd cymdeithasol i gyd, ac nid yw Llywodraeth y DU yn cydnabod ei chyfrifoldebau. Heddiw, rwy'n credu y byddwch chi wedi clywed Jeremy Hunt yn sôn am dorri treth. Sut y bydd ef yn gwneud hynny? Mae Rishi Sunak yn dweud mai drwy doriadau i fudd-daliadau y bydd hynny'n digwydd. Dyna'r hyn y gwnaethon nhw ei ddweud yn ystod y pythefnos diwethaf, ac fe glywsom ni heddiw na fydd pobl sydd â mesuryddion rhagdalu yn gallu rhoi arian yn eu mesuryddion nhw. 800 y llynedd; rhagwelir 2 filiwn eleni.
After months—no, actually, years—of asking—pleading, actually—Plaid Cymru is glad to see the publication, at last, of a new child poverty strategy. That is welcome. What is also welcome is that this is an improvement on the draft we received last year, which was roundly and rightly criticized as weak and incoherent, and, in the view of the children's commissioner, did not match the gravity of the situation facing children and young people in Wales, a view with which we agreed.
The Equality and Social Justice Committee, of which I'm a member, scrutinised the draft strategy and made recommendations on how to shift the dial on the scandalously high levels of child poverty in Wales. We looked at approaches that work in terms of action and in terms of delivery, because what good is a strategy if you can't see if it's successful or not? Delivery is absolutely key. Experts like Chris Burt, an associate director in the Joseph Rowntree Foundation, and former head of the Scottish First Minister's policy and delivery unit, and others from Wales and around the world that we took evidence from, all illustrated to us why targets are crucial, and that they work.
While we can all agree on the high-level objectives and priorities set out in the strategy—there's little to argue with—and those objectives and priorities have now been set out more clearly and coherently, with a better regard, yes, to children's rights and mention at last of important key policy areas like health and transport, I am afraid that this strategy is still light on how those objectives will be achieved, what actions will be taken, what outcomes can we expect, who they will help, how many, how quickly, how will they be delivered, who will be responsible for them, who will be held to account. Because why have you not been brave enough to, in the words of the Chair of the Equality and Social Justice Committee, overcome your aversion to setting targets, when we know that targets work? Not targets for the sake of targets; targets that will drive delivery and ensure ownership. Why did you make that decision, Minister?
It's good to see, at least, that you have set a date for a progress report—December 2025—but, as yet, we haven't got the detail of the monitoring framework you've mentioned, so more clarity on that would be welcome. I say 'welcome'—actually, it's absolutely crucial, because how can you know if you're delivering, if this strategy is actually making a difference to the lives of children living in poverty, when there are no clear interim—and that's really crucial, interim—and long-term targets to drive that change? And the last progress report that we had, Minister, in December 2022, was a real cut-and-paste job; it listed actions, not outcomes.
There are lost opportunities here even in terms of the new welcome initiatives. The Welsh benefits charter, although a welcome first step to creating that Welsh benefits system, without a statutory footing doesn't ensure that all those 22 local authorities will prioritise it, ensuring those crucial changes to the overcomplicated processes that will make sure that every £1 of support reaches the families as quickly and easily as possible. So, what assessment has been made of the effect of the acute pressures on local authority budgets, and how that could have an effect on the creation of that seamless and effective income maximisation system?
And then there is the lack of steps to ensure the current policies aren't undermined. In its recently published report on the Welsh benefits system, the Bevan Foundation used the school essentials grant as an example of this. Only requiring schools to have regard to the guidance on school uniform doesn't ensure that the grant goes as far as it could. I'd also like to know, Minister, how the draft budget was influenced by the strategy, because in our committee session yesterday, in our budget scrutiny session with you, the budget lines we saw for things like period dignity and digital inclusion were being cut, while both those things are mentioned as important issues under objective 1. So, could you give examples of how the strategy directly manifests itself in the budget decisions made, like those?
In the same way, we see no mention of some of the measures recommended by the Government's own expert group on the cost-of-living crisis. The strategy notes that 31 per cent of children who lived in a family where there was a disabled person were in relative income poverty, compared with 26 per cent of those in families where no-one was disabled. But there's no consideration of a cost-of-living payment to disabled families, as recommended by the expert group; nothing about a child payment or even preparatory work for instituting one, although the group and the committee had evidence of how that could be central to be making a real dent in those child poverty levels. Similarly, on food poverty, it's noted that a lack of access to affordable healthy food is directly related to health inequalities, but there are no measures to address this, although calls by the expert group for free school meals for all secondary school children from households in receipt of universal credit would be a huge preventative investment. I could go on.
You say, in your introduction, that the Welsh Government is committed to tackling child poverty as an absolute priority, but the strategy doesn't actually evidence that, Minister. Llywydd, we're halfway through a Senedd term. We will not get a progress report until a few months before the next election. I would contend that's not a way to ensure that action is prioritised, funded and delivered. I have no doubt, Minister, that you want to see child poverty eradicated, as do we all here, but we need a clearer road map and signposts to know that we are nearing that goal.
Ar ôl misoedd—nage, blynyddoedd mewn gwirionedd—o ofyn—erfyn, mewn gwirionedd—mae Plaid Cymru yn falch o weld cyhoeddi strategaeth tlodi plant newydd o'r diwedd. Mae hynny i'w groesawu. Rhywbeth sydd i'w groesawu hefyd yw bod hwn yn welliant ar y drafft a gawsom ni'r llynedd, a gafodd ei feirniadu yn gyffredinol ac yn briodol felly am iddo fod yn wan ac ar chwâl, ac, ym marn y comisiynydd plant, nid oedd yn cydweddu â difrifoldeb y sefyllfa sy'n wynebu plant a phobl ifanc yng Nghymru, ac roeddem ninnau'n cytuno â'r farn honno.
Fe wnaethom ni, yn y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol yr wyf i'n aelod ohono, graffu ar y strategaeth ddrafft ac argymell sut i newid y duedd o fod â chyfraddau gwarthus o uchel o dlodi plant yng Nghymru. Fe wnaethom edrych ar ddulliau sy'n gweithio o ran camau a chyflawni, oherwydd pa les yw strategaeth os na allwch chi wybod a yw hi'n llwyddiannus ai peidio? Mae ei chyflwyniad yn gwbl allweddol. Roedd arbenigwyr fel Chris Burt, cyfarwyddwr cyswllt yn Sefydliad Joseph Rowntree, a chyn-bennaeth uned polisi a chyflawni Prif Weinidog yr Alban, ac eraill o Gymru a ledled y byd y cawsom ni dystiolaeth ganddyn nhw, i gyd yn darlunio i ni pam mae nodau mor hanfodol, a'u bod nhw'n gweithio.
Er ein bod ni i gyd yn gallu cytuno â'r amcanion a'r blaenoriaethau lefel uchel a nodir yn y strategaeth—ni cheir llawer i ddadlau ynglŷn ag ef—ac mae'r amcanion a'r blaenoriaethau hynny cael eu nodi yn fwy eglur a chydlynol erbyn hyn, gyda gwell ystyriaeth, ie, i hawliau plant a sôn am feysydd polisi allweddol pwysig o'r diwedd fel iechyd a thrafnidiaeth, mae arnaf i ofn fod y strategaeth hon yn parhau i fod yn ddisylwedd o ran sut y bydd yr amcanion hynny'n cael eu cyflawni, pa gamau a gymerir a pha ganlyniadau y gallwn ni eu disgwyl, i bwy y byddan nhw o gymorth, pa niferoedd, pa mor gyflym, y wedd ar eu cyflawniad, pwy fydd yn gyfrifol amdanyn nhw, pwy fydd yn cael eu dwyn i gyfrif. Oherwydd pam nad ydych chi wedi bod yn ddigon dewr, yng ngeiriau Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol, i oresgyn eich gwrthwynebiad i bennu targedau, a ninnau'n gwybod bod targedau'n gweithio? Nid bod â thargedau er eu mwyn eu hunain; ond targedau a fydd yn ysgogi'r ddarpariaeth ac yn sicrhau perchnogaeth ohoni. Pam wnaethoch chi'r penderfyniad hwnnw, Gweinidog?
Mae hi'n dda gweld, o leiaf, eich bod chi wedi pennu dyddiad ar gyfer adrodd cynnydd—mis Rhagfyr 2025—ond, hyd yma, nid oes manylion gennym ni ynglŷn â'r fframwaith monitro y gwnaethoch chi sôn amdano, felly fe fyddai croeso mawr i fwy o eglurder ynglŷn â hynny. Rwy'n dweud 'croeso'—a dweud y gwir, mae hynny'n gwbl hanfodol, oherwydd sut allwch chi wybod a ydych chi'n cyflawni, a yw'r strategaeth hon yn gwneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol i fywydau plant sy'n byw mewn tlodi, heb dargedau yn y cyfamser—ac mae hynny'n gwbl allweddol, yn y cyfamser—a hirdymor sy'n eglur ar gyfer ysgogi'r newid hwnnw? Ac roedd yr adroddiad cynnydd diwethaf a gawsom ni, Gweinidog, ym mis Rhagfyr 2022, yn ymarfer o dorri a gludo, mewn gwirionedd; rhestru camau yr oedd hwnnw, ac nid canlyniadau.
Mae cyfleoedd wedi mynd ar goll yma hyd yn oed o ran y mentrau newydd y mae croeso iddyn nhw. Nid yw siarter budd-daliadau Cymru, er bod cam y cyntaf i'w groesawu sef llunio system fudd-daliadau fel hon yng Nghymru, heb unrhyw sail statudol yn ddigon i sicrhau y bydd pob un o'r 22 awdurdod lleol yn ei blaenoriaethu hi, a sicrhau'r newidiadau hanfodol hynny i'r prosesau gorgymhleth ar gyfer gwneud yn siŵr fod pob £1 o gymorth yn cyrraedd y teuluoedd mor gyflym a rhwydd â phosibl. Felly, pa asesiad a gafodd ei wneud o effaith y pwysau eithriadol ar gyllidebau'r awdurdodau lleol, a sut y gallai hynny fod ag effaith ar greu'r system ddi-dor ac effeithiol honno o uchafu incwm?
Ac yna fe geir prinder o gamau ar gyfer sicrhau nad yw'r polisïau cyfredol yn cael eu tanseilio. Yn ei adroddiad a gyhoeddwyd yn ddiweddar ar system fudd-daliadau Cymru, roedd Sefydliad Bevan yn defnyddio grant hanfodion ysgol yn enghraifft o hyn. Nid yw dim ond mynnu bod yr ysgolion yn rhoi sylw i'r canllawiau ar wisg ysgol yn sicrhau y bydd y grant yn ymestyn cyn belled ag y gallai. Fe hoffwn i wybod hefyd, Gweinidog, sut y cafodd y gyllideb ddrafft ei dylanwadu arni gan y strategaeth, oherwydd yn sesiwn ein pwyllgor ddoe, yn ein sesiwn graffu ar y gyllideb gyda chi, roedd y llinellau o gyllideb a welsom ni ar gyfer pethau fel urddas mislif a chynhwysiant digidol yn cael eu torri, er bod y ddau beth hynny'n cael eu hystyried yn faterion pwysig yn ôl amcan 1. Felly, a wnewch chi roi enghreifftiau i ni o sut y mae'r strategaeth yn ei hamlygu ei hun yn uniongyrchol mewn penderfyniadau ynglŷn â'r gyllideb, fel rhain?
Yn yr un modd, nid oes unrhyw sôn am rai o'r mesurau a argymhellwyd gan grŵp arbenigol y Llywodraeth ei hun ynghylch yr argyfwng costau byw. Mae'r strategaeth yn nodi bod 31 y cant o blant a oedd yn byw mewn teulu lle ceir unigolyn anabl mewn tlodi incwm cymharol, o gymharu â 26 y cant o'r rhai mewn teuluoedd lle nad oedd unrhyw unigolyn anabl. Ond nid oes unrhyw ystyriaeth i daliad costau byw i deuluoedd anabl, fel roedd y grŵp arbenigol yn ei argymell; nid oes unrhyw sôn am daliad plentyn nac unrhyw waith i baratoi ar gyfer sefydlu hynny, er bod tystiolaeth gan y grŵp a'r pwyllgor o sut y gallai hynny fod yn ganolog i wneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol i'r cyfraddau hyn o dlodi plant. Yn yr un modd, o ran tlodi bwyd, fe nodir bod methu â chael gafael ar fwyd iach sy'n fforddiadwy yn gysylltiedig yn uniongyrchol ag anghydraddoldebau o ran iechyd, ond nid oes unrhyw fesurau i fynd i'r afael â hyn, er y byddai galwadau gan y grŵp arbenigol am brydau ysgol am ddim i bob plentyn ysgol uwchradd sydd o aelwydydd sy'n cael credyd cynhwysol yn fuddsoddiad ataliol enfawr. Fe allwn i fynd yn fy mlaen.
Yn eich cyflwyniad chi, rydych chi'n dweud bod ymrwymiad Llywodraeth Cymru i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant yn flaenoriaeth lwyr, ond nid yw'r strategaeth yn arddangos hynny, Gweinidog. Llywydd, rydym ni hanner ffordd drwy dymor Seneddol. Ni fyddwn ni'n cael adroddiad ar gynnydd tan ychydig fisoedd cyn yr etholiad nesaf. Fe fyddwn i'n dadlau nad yw honno'n ffordd o sicrhau blaenoriaeth i gyllido a chyflawni'r camau hyn. Nid oes unrhyw amheuaeth gennyf i, Gweinidog, eich bod chi'n dymuno gweld tlodi plant yn cael ei ddileu, fel gwna pawb ohonom ni yma, ond mae angen map ffordd sy'n fwy eglur ac arwyddbyst arnom ni i wybod ein bod ni'n nesáu at yr amcan hwnnw.
Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams, and thank you for your comments and questions today. I'm glad that you do recognise that some of the key points that were raised in the consultation, and, indeed, in the inquiry by the Equality and Social Justice Committee—and can I say I was also very pleased that the Children, Young People and Education Committee engaged in that as well—are addressed in the strategy.
I do want to go back to just a bit of the history lines about this issue, about how we monitor the action we're taking in terms of tackling child poverty. In fact, in 2015—I appreciate you weren't all here at that time—the child poverty strategy moved towards an approach that did align our ambitions for tackling child poverty with the national indicators under the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. You will be aware of it, and I hope you will go back and look at them. If you haven't, if you're not aware of them, the strategy included this set of key indicators to help measure progress in achieving our child poverty objectives. In fact, there are 12 national milestones, 22 national indicators, which help us measure our progress as a nation in improving outcomes for children and their families.
Our approach to the new child poverty strategy builds on this established approach. Every year, you're going to get—. And, indeed, I shall circulate it again, the 'Well-being of Wales' report from last year. It does take account of what impact we've had and what progress we've made on those indicators. So, we do believe that a framework, based on a range of measures, including the national indicators and other data sources—. I've mentioned the intersectional issues, the protected characteristics. We've already got a target; I've given you the dates already: 2035 to 2050. This is going to help us accurately reflect the impact of our approach. This is about what the Government is doing and what it means to people's lives and how it has an impact—whether they get a free school meal, as a result of our co-operation agreement.
One of the first things that was said to me when I became Minister for Social Justice by the then children's commissioner was, 'Roll out free school meals, increase the take-up of Healthy Start vouchers'—I think that came from the Bevan Foundation. Isn't it good to hear from Lynne Neagle, the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being, that Wales now has the highest take-up of Healthy Start vouchers? This isn't as a result of targets; this is because of Government action that actually enabled health visitors to have training to ensure that they could help people on the front line, those young mothers, get access to a Healthy Start voucher. The target-based approach risks being oversimplistic, detracts from the evidence of lived-experience poverty, detracts, actually, from good government and ways in which we can deliver on policies.
I'll give you some of the tackling poverty action plan targets, and I'll circulate these again for you to see: by 2016, increase the proportion of three-year-olds receiving Flying Start sessions that have achieved exceeding their developmental milestones by 5 per cent. Fifty-five per cent of children in the Flying Start programme reached or exceeded their developmental milestone at age three. Now, this has been checked. This has been in the children and young people's plan. We're checking this. This is an indicator that shows we're making progress. Another indicator: narrowing the gap in attainment levels between learners aged seven eligible for free school meals. Another indicator: healthy life expectancy at birth, representing the number of years a person can expect to live in good health. Another indicator: to generate £8 million in additional confirmed benefits for individuals per year through advice services.
So, I'll go to your point about the draft budget. Yes, I did come before scrutiny yesterday in the Equality and Social Justice Committee, and I was very pleased that I could say—and this was a difficult task—£1.3 billion out of our budget as a result of UK Government cuts, as a result of Liz Truss crashing our economy. So, we then are left with having to take very difficult decisions. So, keeping that discretionary assistance fund at its level of £38.5 million was a crucial achievement across Welsh Government, keeping the single advice fund. And yesterday we met Citizens Advice up in Torfaen in Blaenavon who are there four days a week, funded by the Welsh Government, to give the kind of advice that people need to take. I think it is very important, when we look at the work that we have done as a result of the cost-of-living expert committee. And I'm also reporting on that this afternoon.
It's about publishing the Welsh benefit charter, as I said, endorsed by the Welsh Local Government Association. Indeed, I said yesterday in my written statement that we've appointed Fran Targett to chair an external implementation group with local government, the Welsh Local Government Association, so that they can work to make sure that this is delivered. And it is about a new system of delivering Welsh benefits here today, but also there are many other recommendations that we're reviewing, not only rolling out free school meals as part of the co-operation agreement. Shouldn't we recognise that more than 15 million additional free school meals have been served since the launch? We should be proud of that. That is helping people, with Government, now, and it is actually Government as a result of us working together. But also extending the Nest scheme as we procure the new Warm Homes scheme for April, and calling on the UK Government—. This is important as well—and I know that you would recognise this—that we cannot do this all on our own. Social security is reserved. But we can do what we can do with our levers, and that is our responsibility. And, obviously, I hope that you will then endorse the changes and the important progress that we've made as a result of this consultation.
Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams, a diolch i chi am eich sylwadau a'ch cwestiynau heddiw. Rwy'n falch eich bod chi'n cydnabod bod rhai o'r pwyntiau allweddol a godwyd yn yr ymgynghoriad, ac, yn wir, yn yr ymchwiliad gan y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol—ac a gaf i ddweud fy mod i'n falch iawn hefyd fod y Pwyllgor Plant, Pobl Ifanc ac Addysg wedi cyfranogi yn hynny hefyd—yn cael sylw yn y strategaeth.
Fe hoffwn i fynd yn ôl am ychydig at gefndir hanesyddol y mater hwn, ynghylch sut yr ydym ni'n monitro'r camau yr ydym yn eu cymryd o ran mynd i'r afael â thlodi plant. Mewn gwirionedd, yn 2015—rwy'n gwerthfawrogi nad oeddech chi i gyd yma ar yr adeg honno—fe aeth y strategaeth tlodi plant i gyfeiriad dull a oedd yn cyd-fynd â'n huchelgeisiau ni i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant â'r dangosyddion cenedlaethol yn ôl Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015. Rydych chi'n ymwybodol o hyn, ac rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch chi'n mynd yn ôl ac yn edrych ar hyn. Os nad ydych chi wedi gwneud felly, os nad ydych chi'n ymwybodol o'r materion hyn, roedd y strategaeth yn cynnwys y set hon o ddangosyddion allweddol i helpu i fesur cynnydd o ran cyflawni ein hamcanion gyda thlodi plant. Mewn gwirionedd, mae 12 carreg filltir genedlaethol, 22 o ddangosyddion cenedlaethol, sy'n ein helpu i fesur cynnydd ein cenedl o ran gwella canlyniadau i blant a'u teuluoedd nhw.
Mae ein hymagwedd ni tuag at y strategaeth tlodi plant newydd yn adeiladu ar y dull sefydledig hwn. Bob blwyddyn, fe gewch chi—. Ac, yn wir, rwyf i am ei rannu unwaith eto, adroddiad 'Llesiant Cymru' y llynedd. Mae hwnnw'n ystyried pa effaith a gawsom ni a pha gynnydd a wnaethom ni yn unol â'r dangosyddion hynny. Felly, rydym ni o'r farn fod fframwaith i'w gael, ar sail ystod o fesurau, gan gynnwys y dangosyddion cenedlaethol a ffynonellau eraill o ddata—. Fe soniais i am y materion croestoriadol, y nodweddion gwarchodedig. Mae targed gennym ni eisoes; fe roddais i'r dyddiadau i chi eisoes: 2035 hyd 2050. Fe fydd hyn yn ein helpu ni i adlewyrchu dylanwad ein dull o weithredu yn gywir. Mae hyn yn ymwneud â'r hyn y mae'r Llywodraeth yn ei wneud a'r hyn y mae'n ei olygu ym mywydau pobl a sut y mae'n cael effaith—a ydyn nhw'n cael pryd ysgol am ddim, o ganlyniad i'n cytundeb cydweithio.
Un o'r pethau cyntaf a ddywedodd y comisiynydd plant ar y pryd pan ddes i yn Weinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol oedd, 'Cyflwynwch brydau ysgol am ddim, cynyddwch y niferoedd sy'n manteisio ar dalebau Cychwyn Iach'—rwy'n credu bod hynny wedi dod oddi wrth Sefydliad Bevan. Onid peth da yw clywed gan Lynne Neagle, y Dirprwy Weinidog Iechyd Meddwl a Llesiant, mai Cymru sydd â'r niferoedd mwyaf sy'n manteisio ar dalebau Cychwyn Iach erbyn hyn? Nid o ganlyniad i dargedau y mae hynny; ond oherwydd camau'r Llywodraeth a alluogodd ymwelwyr iechyd i gael eu hyfforddi i sicrhau y gallent helpu pobl ar y rheng flaen, mewn gwirionedd, y mamau ifanc hynny, wrth allu cael talebau Cychwyn Iach. Mae perygl i ddull ar sail targedau fod yn orsyml, gan dynnu oddi wrth y dystiolaeth ynglŷn â phrofiad bywyd tlodi, yn tynnu sylw, mewn gwirionedd, oddi wrth lywodraeth dda a'r ffyrdd y gallwn ni gyflawni polisïau.
Rwyf i am roi rhai o'r targedau o ran cynllun gweithredu trechu tlodi i chi, ac rwyf i am eu rhannu unwaith eto er mwyn i chi eu gweld nhw: erbyn 2016, i weld cynydd yng nghyfran y plant tair oed sy'n cael sesiynau Dechrau'n Deg a gyflawnodd 5 y cant dros ben eu cerrig milltir datblygiadol. Fe gyrhaeddodd 55 y cant o blant yn rhaglen Dechrau'n Deg eu carreg filltir ddatblygiadol neu ragori arnyn nhw'n deirblwydd oed. Nawr, fe gafodd hyn ei wirio. Mae hyn wedi bod yn y cynllun plant a phobl ifanc. Rydym ni'n gwirio hyn. Mae hwn yn ddangosydd sy'n dangos ein bod ni'n gwneud cynnydd. Dangosydd arall: llenwi'r bwlch o ran cyrhaeddiad rhwng dysgwyr saith oed sy'n gymwys i gael prydau ysgol am ddim. Dangosydd arall: y disgwyliad oes iach ar enedigaeth plentyn, sy'n rhoi'r nifer o flynyddoedd y gall unigolyn ddisgwyl byw gydag iechyd da. Dangosydd arall: i greu £8 miliwn mewn budd-daliadau ychwanegol a gadarnhawyd i unigolion bob blwyddyn drwy gyfrwng gwasanaethau cynghori.
Felly, i droi at eich pwynt chi ynglŷn â'r gyllideb ddrafft. Roeddwn yn destun craffu ddoe yn y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol, ac roeddwn i'n falch iawn y gallwn i ddweud—ac roedd honno'n dasg anodd—£1.3 biliwn yn mynd o'n cyllideb o ganlyniad i doriadau Llywodraeth y DU, o ganlyniad i Liz Truss yn dinistrio ein heconomi. Felly, roedd rhaid i ni wneud penderfyniadau anodd iawn wedyn. Felly, roedd cadw'r gronfa cymorth dewisol honno ar ei chyfradd o £38.5 miliwn yn gyflawniad hanfodol ar draws Llywodraeth Cymru, gan gadw'r gronfa gynghori sengl. A ddoe, fe wnaethom ni gwrdd â Chyngor ar Bopeth lan yn Nhorfaen ym Mlaenafon sydd yno bedwar diwrnod yr wythnos, sy'n cael ei ariannu gan Lywodraeth Cymru, i roi'r math o gyngor y mae angen i bobl ei gael. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n bwysig iawn, wrth ystyried y gwaith a wnaethom ni o ganlyniad i gyngor y pwyllgor arbenigol costau byw. Ac fe fyddaf i'n adrodd ar hynny hefyd y prynhawn yma.
Mae hyn yn ymwneud â chyhoeddi siarter budd-daliadau Cymru, fel dywedais i, a gafodd ei gymeradwyo gan Gymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru. Yn wir, fe ddywedais i yn fy natganiad ysgrifenedig ddoe ein bod ni wedi penodi Fran Targett i gadeirio grŵp gweithredu allanol gyda llywodraeth leol, Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, ar gyfer gweithio i sicrhau y bydd hyn yn cael ei gyflawni. Ac mae hyn yn ymwneud â system newydd o ddarparu manteision i Gymru yma heddiw, ond fe geir llawer o argymhellion eraill yr ydym ni'n eu hadolygu hefyd, nid yn unig cyflwyno prydau ysgol am ddim fel rhan o'r cytundeb cydweithio. Oni ddylem ni gydnabod bod mwy na 15 miliwn o brydau ysgol am ddim ychwanegol wedi cael eu rhoi ers y lansiad? Fe ddylem ni fod yn falch o hynny. Mae hynny'n helpu pobl, gyda'r Llywodraeth, nawr, ac mewn gwirionedd Llywodraeth o ganlyniad i ni fod yn gweithio gyda'n gilydd yw hon. Ond ymestyn y cynllun Nyth hefyd wrth i ni gaffael y cynllun Cartrefi Clyd newydd ar gyfer mis Ebrill, a galw ar Lywodraeth y DU—. Mae hyn yn bwysig hefyd—ac fe wn i y byddech chi'n cydnabod hyn—na allwn ni wneud hyn i gyd ar ein pennau ein hunain. Mae nawdd cymdeithasol yn fater a gedwir yn ôl. Ond fe allwn ni wneud yr hyn y gallwn ni ei wneud gyda'r ysgogiadau sydd gennym ni, a hwnnw yw ein cyfrifoldeb ni. Ac wedyn, yn amlwg, rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch chi'n cymeradwyo'r newidiadau a'r cynnydd pwysig a wnaethom ni o ganlyniad i'r ymgynghoriad hwn.
Thank you, Minister, for bringing forward this child poverty strategy for Wales today. I'm speaking today in my capacity as the Chair of the Children, Young People and Education Committee, and, as you mentioned, in this capacity I was involved in the recent work of the Equality and Social Justice Committee on the draft child poverty strategy, which was debated in Plenary only two weeks ago. Again, I'd like to put on record my thanks to the Chair of that committee for inviting me to their work on that.
During the debate, most of the contributors referenced the impact that poverty has on children and young people and their families, and I think as we discuss this strategy today, it's important that we remember the significant and pervasive impacts that are being felt across Wales by far too many children and young people and their families every single day. And I know that was why the Equality and Social Justice Committee called for the strategy to include those targets on reducing child poverty, and to be underpinned by a detailed action plan. I was really pleased to hear you say today, and the words that you used, and the determination, that eradicating child poverty must be an absolute priority for all governments.
As I did two weeks ago, though, I would like to focus my questions on two particular groups who are more likely to be affected by poverty—care-experienced children and disabled children and young people. As a committee, we have spent the last 18 months speaking to those two groups of children and young people to inform our work. I and the rest of the committee have been inspired by their insight, strength and desire to change things for the better for those children and young people who follow in their footsteps. Our work has been better and stronger for being clearly informed by their experiences and their suggestions for change that will have a real and positive impact on children and young people across Wales. With this experience at the forefront of my mind, I want to ask the Minister how you have specifically taken the needs of these two groups into account when developing the strategy.
Finally, the strategy sets out that you have undertaken engagement work, which has included care-experienced young people, disabled and neurodivergent people, and people with additional learning needs. Perhaps you could give us some more detail about this engagement work and how their opinions have shaped and influenced the strategy. Diolch.
Diolch i chi, Gweinidog, am gyflwyno'r strategaeth tlodi plant hon i Gymru heddiw. Heddiw, rwy'n siarad yn rhinwedd fy swydd yn Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Plant, Pobl Ifanc ac Addysg, ac, fel roeddech chi'n sôn, yn y swydd hon, roeddwn i â rhan yng ngwaith diweddar y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol ynglŷn â'r strategaeth tlodi plant ddrafft, a drafodwyd yn y Cyfarfod Llawn bythefnos yn ôl. Unwaith eto, fe hoffwn i ddiolch ar goedd i Gadeirydd y pwyllgor hwnnw am fy ngwahodd i'w gwaith hi ar hynny.
Yn ystod y ddadl, fe gyfeiriodd y rhan fwyaf o'r cyfraniadau at yr effaith y mae tlodi yn ei chael ar blant a phobl ifanc a'u teuluoedd nhw, ac rwy'n credu, wrth i ni drafod y strategaeth hon heddiw, ei bod hi'n bwysig ein bod ni'n cofio'r effeithiau sylweddol a threiddiol sydd yn cael eu teimlo ledled Cymru gan lawer gormod o blant a phobl ifanc a'u teuluoedd nhw bob dydd. Ac rwy'n gwybod mai dyna pam roedd y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol yn galw am i'r strategaeth gynnwys y targedau hynny o ran lliniaru tlodi plant, a bod cynllun gweithredu manwl yn sail i hynny. Roeddwn i'n falch iawn o'ch clywed chi'n dweud heddiw, a'r geiriau y gwnaethoch chi eu defnyddio, a'ch penderfyniad chi, bod rhaid i ddileu tlodi plant fod yn flaenoriaeth bennaf i bob llywodraeth.
Eto i gyd, fel gwnes i bythefnos yn ôl, fe hoffwn i ganolbwyntio fy nghwestiynau ar ddau grŵp arbennig y bydd tlodi yn fwy tebygol o effeithio arnyn nhw—plant â phrofiad o ofal a phlant a phobl ifanc anabl. Yn y pwyllgor, rydym ni wedi treulio'r 18 mis diwethaf yn siarad â'r ddau grŵp hyn o blant a phobl ifanc ar gyfer llywio ein gwaith ni. Mae gweddill y pwyllgor a minnau wedi cael ein hysbrydoli gan eu dealltwriaeth nhw, eu cryfder nhw a'u hawydd nhw i newid pethau er gwell i'r plant a'r bobl ifanc hynny a fydd yn dilyn yn ôl eu traed nhw. Mae ein gwaith ni wedi bod yn fwy caboledig a chadarn am iddo gael ei lywio mor eglur gan eu profiadau a'u hawgrymiadau ar gyfer newid ac fe fydd hyn ag effaith wirioneddol a chadarnhaol ar blant a phobl ifanc ledled Cymru. Gyda'r profiad hwn yn flaenllaw yn fy ystyriaethau i, fe hoffwn i ofyn i'r Gweinidog sut y gwnaethoch chi ystyried anghenion y ddau grŵp hyn yn benodol wrth ddatblygu'r strategaeth.
Yn olaf, mae'r strategaeth yn nodi eich bod chi wedi ymgymryd â gwaith ymgysylltu, sydd wedi cynnwys pobl ifanc â phrofiad o ofal, pobl anabl a niwroamrywiol, a phobl ag anghenion dysgu ychwanegol. Efallai y gwnewch chi roi mwy o fanylion i ni ynglŷn â'r gwaith ymgysylltu hwn a sut mae eu barn nhw wedi ffurfio a dylanwadu ar y strategaeth. Diolch.
Thank you very much indeed, Jayne Bryant, for your contributions, and indeed in responding to the debate of the important Equality and Social Justice Committee. I think you do focus on key aspects of work in terms of your inquiries. I’ll pick up first of all with our looked-after children improvement, particularly in terms of improving educational outcomes, because this is about the ways in which we can tackle child poverty. And recognising, in fact, that including care-experienced children in that excellent education right is crucial to them in terms of their progress and development. And the fact that we’ve got start-up grant funding for local authorities across Wales to implement a virtual schools model, which you may be aware of, which aims to improve the education experience and outcomes of looked-after children. And of course also—and I’m sure the education Minister will comment on this later on—supporting the looked-after children in education by £5.7 million annually through the pupil development grant for LAC and the regional education consortia administering that grant. But also, I think the school essentials grant is crucial, because that is available for all care-experienced children, regardless of their circumstances, and when I referred to the importance of the Welsh benefits charter, I think that will help us see the way forward with that.
I would also like to just say that the basic income pilot I think is a recognition of the fact that we want this child poverty strategy, and, indeed, something I didn’t respond to Sioned—protecting the basic income pilot was a big decision in our budget, where we had to find 10 per cent of a very small budget line of £139 million. I was determined to protect our basic income pilot for care leavers, who often have suffered a great deal of child poverty. This is giving them a new hope, new prospects and of course the 97 per cent uptake of this groundbreaking scheme—which is being evaluated, and we’re going to hear about that evaluation very shortly—is so important.
I think the work that you’re doing with disabled children and young people is critically important, and I was glad to give evidence to that. Just to say that I hope Members will take the opportunity to look at the document that was issued with this child poverty strategy about the consultation and who we reached out to. And we did commission Children in Wales, Save the Children, Voices from Care, including care-experienced young people, but also community groups, groups of disabled, neurodivergent young people, LGBQT+ young people, young people with experience of homelessness, Traveller, Roma, Gypsy young people, and we gave grants to organisations to reach out to children and young people, and you’ll see we’ve actually—. I hope you will also make use of our children and young people’s version on this in terms of involving people. We also included parents, carers and families, and they came up with very straightforward responses, and it is about the strategy that will help to reduce poverty and help people in poverty. And, of course, they talk about the cost of school uniforms, trips and activities. They say the benefits system can be difficult to use. That's why the child poverty strategy is addressing those issues. So, I look forward to the outcome of your review that I'm sure will form a very important part of the response that we have to widening, of course, all our actions across Government in terms of tackling child poverty.
Diolch yn fawr iawn wir i chi, Jayne Bryant, am eich cyfraniadau chi, ac yn wir am ymateb i ddadl y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol pwysig. Rwy'n credu eich bod chi wedi canolbwyntio ar agweddau allweddol ar y gwaith gyda'ch ymholiadau hi. Rwyf i am ymdrin yn gyntaf i gyd â'n gwelliant ni ar gyfer plant sy'n derbyn gofal, yn enwedig o ran gwella eu canlyniadau addysgol nhw, oherwydd mae hynny'n ymwneud â'r ffyrdd y gallwn ni fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant. A chydnabod, mewn gwirionedd, bod cynnwys plant sydd â phrofiad o ofal yn yr hawl honno i addysg ragorol yn hanfodol iddyn nhw o ran eu cynnydd a'u datblygiad. A'r ffaith fod cyllid grant cychwynnol gennym ni ar gyfer awdurdodau lleol ledled Cymru i'w galluogi i redeg model ysgolion rhithwir, efallai eich bod yn ymwybodol o hyn, sy'n ceisio gwella profiad addysg a chanlyniadau plant sy'n derbyn gofal. Ac wrth gwrs hefyd—ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog addysg yn gwneud sylw ar hyn yn nes ymlaen—cefnogi'r plant sy'n derbyn gofal mewn addysg gyda £5.7 miliwn bob blwyddyn drwy'r grant datblygu disgyblion ar gyfer plant sy'n derbyn gofal a'r consortia addysg rhanbarthol sy'n gweinyddu'r grant hwnnw. Ond yn ogystal â hynny, rwy'n credu bod grant hanfodion ysgol yn allweddol, oherwydd mae hwnnw ar gael i bob plentyn â phrofiad o ofal, heb ystyriaeth i'w amgylchiadau, a phan oeddwn i'n cyfeirio at bwysigrwydd siarter budd-daliadau Cymru, rwy'n credu y bydd honno'n ein helpu i weld y ffordd ymlaen yn hynny o beth.
Fe hoffwn i ddweud hefyd fod y cynllun treialu incwm sylfaenol yn fy marn i'n cydnabod y ffaith ein bod ni'n dymuno i'r strategaeth tlodi plant hon, ac, yn wir, rhywbeth na ddywedais i wrth ymateb i Sioned—roedd diogelu'r cynllun treialu incwm sylfaenol yn benderfyniad mawr yn ein cyllideb, lle bu'n rhaid i ni ddod o hyd i 10 y cant o linell gyllideb fechan iawn o £139 miliwn. Roeddwn i'n benderfynol o amddiffyn ein cynllun treialu incwm sylfaenol ar gyfer pobl sy'n gadael gofal, sydd yn aml wedi profi llawer iawn o dlodi plant. Mae hyn yn rhoi gobaith newydd a rhagolygon newydd iddyn nhw ac wrth gwrs mae'r gyfradd o 97 y cant sydd wedi manteisio ar y cynllun arloesol hwn—sy'n cael ei werthuso, ac fe fyddwn ni'n cael clywed am y gwerthusiad hwnnw'n fuan iawn—mor bwysig.
Rwy'n credu bod y gwaith yr ydych chi'n ei wneud gyda phlant a phobl ifanc anabl yn hanfodol bwysig, ac roeddwn i'n falch o ddwyn tystiolaeth gerbron hwnnw. Dim ond dweud fy mod i'n gobeithio y bydd yr Aelodau yn elwa ar y cyfle i fwrw golwg ar y ddogfen a gyhoeddwyd gyda'r strategaeth tlodi plant hon ynglŷn â'r ymgynghoriad a'r rhai y gwnaethom estyn allan atyn nhw. Ac fe wnaethon ni gomisiynu Plant yng Nghymru, Achub y Plant, Voices from Care, gan gynnwys pobl ifanc â phrofiad o ofal, ond hefyd grwpiau cymunedol, grwpiau o bobl ifanc anabl, niwrowahanol, pobl ifanc LHDTC+, pobl ifanc sydd â phrofiad o ddigartrefedd, Teithwyr, Roma, pobl ifanc y Sipsiwn, a rhoi grantiau i sefydliadau ar gyfer estyn allan at blant a phobl ifanc, ac fe welwch chi ein bod ni mewn gwirionedd—. Rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch chi'n defnyddio safbwynt ein plant a phobl ifanc yn hyn o beth o ran cynnwys pobl. Fe wnaethom ni gynnwys rhieni, gofalwyr a theuluoedd hefyd, ac fe wnaethon nhw ymateb yn uniongyrchol iawn, ac ystyr hyn yw bod â strategaeth a fydd yn helpu i leihau tlodi ac o gymorth i bobl mewn tlodi. Ac, wrth gwrs, maen nhw'n sôn am bethau fel cost dillad ysgol, tripiau a gweithgareddau. Maen nhw'n dweud bod y system fudd-daliadau yn gallu bod yn anodd ei defnyddio. Dyna pam mae'r strategaeth tlodi plant yn mynd i'r afael â'r materion hynny. Felly, rwy'n edrych ymlaen at ganlyniad eich adolygiad chi a fydd, rwy'n siŵr, yn rhan bwysig iawn o'r ymateb a fydd gennym ni wrth ehangu, wrth gwrs, ein camau gweithredu i gyd ar draws y Llywodraeth o ran mynd i'r afael â thlodi plant.
Of course, today, Minister, we recognise what is being done, obviously, through the co-operation agreement—the free school meals have been crucially important—and also we recognise the limitations because of inaction by the UK Government. But I think we do need to recognise the voices that have been part of shaping the strategy published today that are also critical of the fact that there are no targets. And I wondered, can you please clarify—questions that our inboxes have been flooded with in terms of the statement today—when the framework will be published and what you expect it to contain that are measurable?
I also note, today, that we've had a written statement following the expert recommendations—things that are within the Welsh Government's control—yet we don't have a response set out to each of the recommendations. This is despite the First Minister saying in the response to me back in November that he had seen such a document. So, can you please clarify when we'll get to know exactly what the Welsh Government response is to each of the proposals made by the expert group, and when will we see that framework so we can measure progress? It's children in our communities that are seeing their situation get worse, despite the things that are being put in place. And it's important we unite and see that progress, so that their futures change for the better.
Wrth gwrs, heddiw, Gweinidog, rydym ni'n cydnabod yr hyn sy'n cael ei wneud, yn amlwg, trwy'r cytundeb cydweithio—fe fu'r prydau ysgol am ddim yn hanfodol bwysig—ac rydym ni'n cydnabod y cyfyngiadau oherwydd diffyg gweithredu gan Lywodraeth y DU hefyd. Ond rwy'n credu bod angen i ni gydnabod y lleisiau sydd wedi bod yn rhan o lunio'r strategaeth a gyhoeddwyd heddiw a fu'n feirniadol hefyd o'r ffaith nad oes targedau wedi cael eu pennu. Ac a wnewch chi egluro tybed—cwestiynau sydd wedi gorlethu ein mewnflychau o ran datganiad heddiw—pryd caiff y fframwaith ei gyhoeddi a'r hyn yr ydych chi'n disgwyl iddo ei gynnwys y gellir ei fesur?
Rwy'n nodi heddiw hefyd ein bod ni wedi cael datganiad ysgrifenedig yn dilyn yr argymhellion arbenigol—pethau sy'n cael eu rheoli gan Lywodraeth Cymru—ac eto nid oes ymateb wedi bod gennym ni i bob un o'r argymhellion. Mae hyn er gwaethaf y ffaith i'r Prif Weinidog ddweud yn yr ymateb i mi nôl ym mis Tachwedd ei fod ef wedi bwrw golwg ar ddogfen o'r fath. Felly, a wnewch chi egluro pryd y byddwn ni'n dod i wybod beth yn union yw ymateb Llywodraeth Cymru i bob un o'r cynigion a wnaeth y grŵp arbenigol, a phryd y byddwn ni'n gweld y fframwaith hwnnw er mwyn i ni allu mesur unrhyw gynnydd? Plant yn ein cymunedau ni yw'r rhai sy'n gweld eu sefyllfa yn dirywio, er gwaethaf y pethau sy'n cael eu rhoi ar waith. Ac mae hi'n bwysig ein bod ni'n dod at ein gilydd ac yn gweld y cynnydd hwnnw, er mwyn i'w dyfodol nhw newid er gwell.
Thank you, Heledd Fychan. I have said this in answer to more than one Senedd Member today, but we are developing a robust monitoring framework based on the national indicators of the well-being of future generations Act, as I've outlined. I've given you some examples of the targets already laid down in that. I've said that the target-based approach does risk being oversimplistic. It doesn't take into account all those who also have a responsibility for delivering on tackling child poverty—principally the UK Government.
But I think an important update today, having listened to not just the committee but other partners, is that we've appointed this independent academic expert, Professor Rod Hick, to come in and help us to hopefully convince you and convince all of us that the way forward to actually delivering on this child poverty strategy is to show ways in which we can demonstrate the outcomes of all of those objectives and priorities. So, that is work that's not just going to happen with Welsh Government—I want Professor Hicks to come to the committee. I think he's already been once to give evidence, so I think if you can respect the fact that this is now, today, an important announcement—that we want to bring in that independent expertise. We've always said we wanted to do that—to look at ways in which we can create that credible framework—and it will be a framework for monitoring how we are delivering on the child poverty strategy, how we, with our powers and our responsibilities and our commitment, today, are delivering.
Diolch i chi, Heledd Fychan. Fe ddywedais i hyn wrth ateb mwy nag un o Aelodau'r Senedd heddiw, ond rydym ni'n datblygu fframwaith cadarn ar gyfer monitro ar sail dangosyddion cenedlaethol Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol, fel yr amlinellais i. Fe roddais i rai enghreifftiau i chi eisoes o'r targedau a bennwyd yn hynny o beth. Fe ddywedais i fod dull ar sail targedau mewn perygl o orsymleiddio materion. Ni fyddai'n ystyried pawb sydd â chyfrifoldebau eraill i gyflawni wrth fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant—Llywodraeth y DU yn bennaf.
Ond rwy'n credu mai diweddariad pwysig heddiw, a ninnau wedi bod yn gwrando nid yn unig ar y pwyllgor ond ar bartneriaid eraill, yw ein bod ni wedi penodi'r arbenigwr academaidd annibynnol hwn, yr Athro Rod Hick, i ddod i mewn a'n helpu ni i'ch argyhoeddi chi gobeithio ac argyhoeddi pob un ohonom ni mai'r ffordd ymlaen at gyflawni'r strategaeth hon ynglŷn â thlodi plant mewn gwirionedd yw dangos ffyrdd y gallwn ni arddangos canlyniadau'r amcanion a'r blaenoriaethau hynny i gyd. Felly, mae hwnnw'n waith a fydd nid yn unig yn digwydd gyda Llywodraeth Cymru—fe hoffwn i'r Athro Hicks ddod i'r pwyllgor. Rwy'n credu iddo fod un waith i roi tystiolaeth, felly rwy'n credu os gallwch chi barchu'r ffaith fod hwn nawr, heddiw, yn gyhoeddiad o bwys—sef ein bod ni'n awyddus i gynnwys yr arbenigedd annibynnol hwn. Rydyn ni wedi dweud bob amser ein bod ni'n dymuno gwneud hynny—edrych ar ffyrdd y gallwn ni saernïo'r fframwaith credadwy hwnnw—ac fe fydd yn fframwaith ar gyfer monitro sut yr ydym ni'n cyflawni'r strategaeth tlodi plant, sut yr ydym ni'n cyflawni gyda'r pwerau a'r cyfrifoldebau a'r ymrwymiad sydd gennym ni, heddiw.
Thank you, Minister, for your statement today. It's a point I made during the debate last week on the Equality and Social Justice Committee's report, but I do think it's important that we note that relative child poverty in Wales declined from 2012-13 to 2021-22 in contrast to the UK average. However, I'm sure that we all do agree that the current levels are far too high and that our shared goal is the eradication of child poverty. So, I'm pleased to see this refreshed commitment from Welsh Government to work across Government, using all levers within its control to drive this down further.
I've got two questions for you today: firstly, yesterday's announcement of a Welsh benefits charter, ensuring children and families get the support to which they're entitled, is really welcome and I'm pleased that all 22 local authorities in Wales have signed up in support of it. This is already generating lots of interest in my constituency of Cynon Valley and I appreciate that you plan to make a statement next week. How do you envisage people accessing the support the charter will provide, and what would be the interplay with the reserved social security system?
And, secondly, quickly, I visited the Bwl Baby Bank, which provides families in Ynysybwl and Coed-y-Cwm who are in need due to the cost-of-living crisis with access to essentials such as nappies and formula. Local voluntary initiatives such as this play a key role in ensuring that children and families in our communities receive the support that they need. So, what role do you envisage similar schemes playing in ensuring that your strategy achieves its goals?
Diolch i chi, Gweinidog, am eich datganiad heddiw. Mae hwn yn bwynt a wnes i yn ystod dadl yr wythnos diwethaf ynglŷn ag adroddiad y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol, ond rwyf i o'r farn ei bod hi'n bwysig inni nodi bod y gyfradd gymharol o dlodi plant yng Nghymru wedi gostwng rhwng 2012-13 a 2021-22 mewn cyferbyniad â'r cyfartaledd yn y DU. Serch hynny, rwy'n siŵr ein bod ni i gyd yn cytuno bod y cyfraddau yn llawer rhy uchel ar hyn o bryd ac mai ein nod cyffredin ni yw dileu tlodi plant. Felly, rwy'n falch o weld yr ymrwymiad newydd hwn gan Lywodraeth Cymru i weithio ar draws y Llywodraeth, gan ddefnyddio pob ysgogiad yn ei rheolaeth i gyfyngu rhagor ar hyn.
Mae gennyf i ddau gwestiwn i chi heddiw: yn gyntaf, mae croeso gwirioneddol i gyhoeddiad ddoe ynglŷn â siarter budd-daliadau i Gymru, a fydd yn sicrhau bod plant a theuluoedd yn cael y gefnogaeth y mae'r hawl ganddyn nhw i'w chael, ac rwy'n falch fod pob un o'r 22 awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru wedi rhoi cefnogaeth i hyn. Mae hyn wedi ennyn llawer o ddiddordeb eisoes yn fy etholaeth i yng Nghwm Cynon ac rwy'n gwerthfawrogi eich bod chi'n bwriadu gwneud datganiad wythnos nesaf. Sut ydych chi'n rhagweld y bydd pobl yn cael gafael ar y gefnogaeth y bydd y siarter yn ei rhoi, a beth fyddai'r cydadwaith gyda'r system nawdd cymdeithasol a gedwir yn ôl?
Ac, yn ail, yn gyflym, fe ymwelais i â Banc Babanod Bwl, sy'n galluogi teuluoedd yn Ynysybwl a Choed-y-Cwm sydd mewn angen oherwydd yr argyfwng costau byw i gael gafael ar hanfodion fel cewynnau a llaeth fformiwla. Mae mentrau gwirfoddol lleol fel hyn yn chwarae rhan allweddol wrth sicrhau bod plant a theuluoedd yn ein cymunedau ni'n cael y cymorth sydd ei angen arnyn nhw. Felly, pa swyddogaeth yr ydych chi'n ei rhagweld bydd gan gynlluniau tebyg o ran sicrhau bod eich strategaeth chi'n cyflawni ei hamcanion?
Well, thank you very much, Vikki Howells, and thank you for that recognition that this is a tough challenge, isn't it, in terms of tackling levels of child poverty, which of course are far too high. Reports and statistics are showing that this is across the UK that child poverty levels are too high, and there's plenty of evidence of the reasons for that, which can also directly be laid at the doorstep of the UK Government, in terms of their cuts and an inadequate social security system.
I think that developing our Welsh benefits system is an important step—the charter for Welsh benefits. I will be doing an oral statement on that later this month. All local authorities have signed up to it; so, in your constituency, Rhondda Cynon Taf. Yesterday, in Torfaen, we met with people who are on the front line, the revenue and benefits officers. What's important with Welsh local government is that many are already streamlining their benefits, access to benefits. I've mentioned the key ones: the council tax reduction scheme, access to free school meals eligibility, the school essentials grant, the education maintenance allowance. So, they have committed to work together to ensure that the best practice applies to every local authority in Wales. Citizens Advice, alongside them—. Fran Targett, who used to be director of Citizens Advice in Wales, is leading the external implementation group. So, I'm very happy. I hope to say more in the oral statement in a few weeks' time.
Also, I think that your other, second, point is really important. Because I'm very conscious, with the Deputy Minister for Services, of how much alignment there is between our child poverty strategy and the children and young people's plan, which very much addresses all of the issues, and in which we're ensuring the rights-based approach of supporting children and young people and communities, families and communities, and, actually, through Flying Start, which is really in terms of the early years—that's so important—access to free childcare.
The strategy, what's important—and I hope that Members will look at the strategy in detail—virtually every Minister here, every Government department, is committed to and delivering on this child poverty strategy, from education to employment to health to social services. What's important about our milestones under the well-being of future generations Act, which I hope people will revisit—and I'll certainly circulate these—is that it is about tackling health inequalities, education inequalities, housing inequalities. And that is how we will tackle child poverty.
Wel, diolch yn fawr iawn, Vikki Howells, a diolch am y gydnabyddiaeth honno bod hon yn her anodd, onid ydyw, o ran mynd i'r afael â lefelau tlodi plant, sydd wrth gwrs yn llawer rhy uchel. Mae adroddiadau ac ystadegau yn dangos bod lefelau tlodi plant yn rhy uchel ar draws y DU, ac mae digon o dystiolaeth o'r rhesymau dros hynny, y gellir eu gosod yn uniongyrchol hefyd wrth garreg drws Llywodraeth y DU, o ran eu toriadau a system nawdd cymdeithasol annigonol.
Rwy'n credu bod datblygu ein system fudd-daliadau yng Nghymru yn gam pwysig—siarter budd-daliadau Cymru. Byddaf yn gwneud datganiad llafar ar hynny yn ddiweddarach y mis hwn. Mae pob awdurdod lleol yn ei gefnogi; felly, yn eich etholaeth chi, Rhondda Cynon Taf. Ddoe, yn Nhorfaen, fe wnaethom gwrdd â phobl sydd ar y rheng flaen, y swyddogion refeniw a budd-daliadau. Yr hyn sy'n bwysig gyda llywodraeth leol Cymru yw bod llawer eisoes yn symleiddio eu budd-daliadau, mynediad at fudd-daliadau. Rwyf wedi sôn am y rhai allweddol: cynllun gostyngiadau'r dreth gyngor, mynediad at gymhwysedd prydau ysgol am ddim, grant hanfodion ysgol, y lwfans cynhaliaeth addysg. Felly, maen nhw wedi ymrwymo i gydweithio i sicrhau bod yr arfer gorau yn berthnasol i bob awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru. Cyngor ar Bopeth, ochr yn ochr â nhw—. Fran Targett, a arferai fod yn gyfarwyddwr Cyngor ar Bopeth yng Nghymru, sy'n arwain y grŵp gweithredu allanol. Felly, rwy'n hapus iawn. Rwy'n gobeithio dweud mwy yn y datganiad llafar ymhen ychydig wythnosau.
Hefyd, credaf fod eich pwynt arall, yr ail, yn bwysig iawn. Oherwydd, rwy'n ymwybodol iawn, gyda'r Dirprwy Weinidog Gwasanaethau, o faint o aliniad sydd rhwng ein strategaeth tlodi plant a chynllun plant a phobl ifanc, sy'n mynd i'r afael â'r holl faterion yn fawr iawn, ac rydym yn sicrhau'r dull sy'n seiliedig ar hawliau o gefnogi plant a phobl ifanc a chymunedau, teuluoedd a chymunedau, ac, a dweud y gwir, drwy Dechrau'n Deg, sydd mewn gwirionedd o ran y blynyddoedd cynnar—mae hynny mor bwysig—mynediad at ofal plant am ddim.
Y strategaeth, beth sy'n bwysig—a gobeithio y bydd yr Aelodau yn edrych ar y strategaeth yn fanwl—mae bron pob Gweinidog yma, pob adran o'r Llywodraeth, wedi ymrwymo i'r strategaeth tlodi plant hon a'i chyflawni, o addysg i gyflogaeth i iechyd i wasanaethau cymdeithasol. Yr hyn sy'n bwysig am ein cerrig milltir o dan Ddeddf llesiant cenedlaethau'r dyfodol, a gobeithiaf y bydd pobl yn ailymweld â nhw—a byddaf yn sicr yn rhannu'r rhain—yw ei fod yn ymwneud â mynd i'r afael ag anghydraddoldebau iechyd, anghydraddoldebau addysg, anghydraddoldebau tai. A dyna sut y byddwn yn mynd i'r afael â thlodi plant.
I also want to put on record my thanks to you. I'm absolutely aware that you and your team are committed to eradicating child poverty. Thank you for the strategy and also for the Welsh benefits charter. There is much to be welcomed there. However, none of us in this Siambr who've spoken about targets have conferred this afternoon on what we are going to cover, because that is the common theme. I guess that we are hearing everything that you are doing, and have done, but it's still resulting in 28 per cent of the children in Wales living in poverty. I came into politics in order to try and change child poverty, and I'm sure that many of us in this Siambr did as well. My plea to you is—. I understand that a Government statement is an opportunity for you to hear from us around the Siambr what our views and thoughts are. This has been set out in the ESJ report as well. My plea to you is: if the things that you say are going to work, we have to do it urgently. And if you say that they are going to work, then my question is: why not have targets? Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Hoffwn gofnodi fy niolch i chi hefyd. Rwy'n gwbl ymwybodol eich bod chi a'ch tîm wedi ymrwymo i ddileu tlodi plant. Diolch am y strategaeth a hefyd am siarter budd-daliadau Cymru. Mae llawer i'w groesawu yno. Fodd bynnag, nid oes yr un ohonom yn y Siambr hon sydd wedi siarad am dargedau wedi sôn y prynhawn yma am yr hyn yr ydym yn mynd i'w gwmpasu, oherwydd dyna'r thema gyffredin. Mae'n debyg ein bod ni'n clywed popeth rydych chi'n ei wneud, ac wedi'i wneud, ond mae'n dal i arwain at 28 y cant o blant Cymru yn byw mewn tlodi. Fe ddes i mewn i wleidyddiaeth er mwyn ceisio newid tlodi plant, ac rwy'n siŵr bod llawer ohonom ni yn y Siambr hon wedi gwneud hynny hefyd. Fy mhle i chi yw—. Deallaf fod datganiad gan y Llywodraeth yn gyfle i chi glywed gennym ni o amgylch y Siambr beth yw ein barn a'n meddyliau. Mae hyn wedi'i nodi yn adroddiad y Pwyllgor cydraddoldeb a chyfiawnder cymdeithasol hefyd. Fy mhle i chi yw: os yw'r pethau rydych chi'n dweud yn mynd i weithio, mae'n rhaid i ni eu gwneud ar frys. Ac os ydych chi'n dweud eu bod nhw'n mynd i weithio, yna fy nghwestiwn i yw: beth am gael targedau? Diolch yn fawr iawn.
Well, I hope that you will welcome Professor Rod Hick's independent academic advice. He is an expert worldwide—a globally recognised expert—on how you measure poverty. And that's really what the nub of this is about, isn't it: how do we measure the actions that we're taking in this child poverty strategy with our powers and levers? How do we measure them, so that people can feel that the outcomes are going to be forthcoming?
I'm not going to go through again all of the indicators under the well-being of future generations Act, but there are many, many more, which are all about children and I'm going to circulate them again—clearly, they need to be. But, of course, we do have other targets in relation to the funding that we're giving, and I'll just give one example from the 'Claim what's yours' campaign—this is what we fund under our single advice fund. So, in terms of the targets for that campaign, the 'Here to help' and cost of living, which is crucially important in tackling child poverty, our targets are an average 50 per cent increase in people who contact Advicelink Cymru, when compared to a typical month—so, we've got that target, a 50 per cent increase—people who contact Advicelink Cymru will gain a total of £2 million in additional household income—these are all targets for our single advice givers—and also 120,000 visits to Welsh Government's self-help pages.
Now, those are very specific to a job of work that needs to be done, which is going to help tackle child poverty. But, in terms of the whole child poverty strategy and the ways in which we can monitor it, we have the duty to publish the report every three years—it's going to happen; it's in statute. We're developing this robust monitoring framework, and I've given you the history: in 2015, we all agreed, it was accepted in this Senedd, that we were moving towards aligning our child poverty strategy with our Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, so that we can measure progress in achieving our child poverty objectives.
So, clearly, we've got a job of work to do in terms of hearing from Rod Hick, with his independent expertise. But I hope you will revisit the national milestones, the indicators. I'm very encouraged by just looking at the children and young people's plan, because that—. Actually, Julie Morgan has just done an update on it and, in that update, she says, 'This is the progress we've made', and she's also using—we are using—the indicators there. So, I hope that the Senedd will look at this in a positive way.
Wel, rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch chi'n croesawu cyngor academaidd annibynnol yr Athro Rod Hick. Mae'n arbenigwr ledled y byd—arbenigwr a gydnabyddir yn fyd-eang—ar sut rydych chi'n mesur tlodi. A dyna hanfod y cwestiwn hwn: sut rydym yn mesur y camau yr ydym yn eu cymryd yn y strategaeth tlodi plant hon gyda'n pwerau a'n hysgogiadau? Sut ydyn ni'n eu mesur, fel y gall pobl deimlo bod y canlyniadau'n mynd i ddod?
Dydw i ddim yn mynd i fynd drwy'r holl ddangosyddion eto o dan Ddeddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol, ond mae yna lawer iawn mwy, sydd i gyd yn ymwneud â phlant ac rydw i'n mynd i'w rhannu eto—yn amlwg, mae eisiau iddyn nhw gael eu rhannu. Ond, wrth gwrs, mae gennym ni dargedau eraill mewn perthynas â'r cyllid rydyn ni'n ei roi, a byddaf yn rhoi un enghraifft yn unig o'r ymgyrch 'Hawliwch yr hyn sy'n ddyledus i chi'—dyma rydyn ni'n ei ariannu o dan ein cronfa gynghori sengl. Felly, o ran y targedau ar gyfer yr ymgyrch honno, 'Yma i helpu â chostau byw', sy'n hanfodol bwysig wrth fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant, mae ein targedau yn gynnydd o 50 y cant ar gyfartaledd yn nifer y bobl sy'n cysylltu ag Advicelink Cymru, o'i gymharu â mis arferol—felly, mae gennym y targed hwnnw, cynnydd o 50 y cant—bydd pobl sy'n cysylltu ag Advicelink Cymru yn ennill cyfanswm o £2 filiwn mewn incwm ychwanegol i'r cartref—mae'r rhain i gyd yn dargedau ar gyfer ein rhoddwyr cyngor sengl—a hefyd 120,000 o ymweliadau â thudalennau hunangymorth Llywodraeth Cymru.
Nawr, mae'r rheini'n benodol iawn i waith y mae angen ei wneud, sy'n mynd i helpu i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant. Ond, o ran y strategaeth tlodi plant gyfan a'r ffyrdd y gallwn ei fonitro, mae dyletswydd arnom i gyhoeddi'r adroddiad bob tair blynedd—mae'n mynd i ddigwydd; mae'n statudol. Rydym yn datblygu'r fframwaith monitro cadarn hwn, ac rwyf wedi rhoi'r hanes i chi: yn 2015, cytunodd pob un ohonom, derbyniwyd yn y Senedd hon, ein bod yn symud tuag at alinio ein strategaeth tlodi plant â'n Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015, fel y gallwn fesur cynnydd o ran cyflawni ein hamcanion tlodi plant.
Felly, yn amlwg, mae gennym waith i'w wneud o ran clywed gan Rod Hick, gyda'i arbenigedd annibynnol. Ond rwy'n gobeithio y byddwch yn ailedrych ar y cerrig milltir cenedlaethol, y dangosyddion. Rwy'n cael fy nghalonogi'n fawr wrth edrych ar gynllun y plant a'r bobl ifanc yn unig, oherwydd hynny—. A dweud y gwir, mae Julie Morgan newydd wneud diweddariad arno ac, yn y diweddariad hwnnw, mae'n dweud, 'Dyma'r cynnydd rydyn ni wedi'i wneud', ac mae hi hefyd yn defnyddio—rydyn ni'n defnyddio—y dangosyddion yno. Felly, rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Senedd yn edrych ar hyn mewn ffordd gadarnhaol.
There is much to celebrate in the new strategy, and, particularly, I welcome the reinforcement of children's rights. Children don't choose to be born into poverty and it is absolutely right that they have legal recourse to ensuring that their rights are enforced.
I welcome very much the progress that the Minister is making on this benefits charter. I wouldn't want to be the local authority standing in front of you who didn't want to take part in the benefits charter. I'm sure that that would be a very difficult conversation. But we have to ensure that this is an important step forward that can quickly be used as the vehicle for ensuring that the leaders amongst local authorities who automatically passport those who are eligible for one benefit onto others for which they are already assessed as having been eligible for, that that that is translated across to the laggards who are not doing this at the moment. So, I would like to see a target for how we measure the progress that local authorities are making. I want to see some statistics around how much this benefits charter is going to increase the uptake of benefits that people are entitled to. This is coming out of their taxes and then they are entitled to that money. So, therefore, the local authority and others should be actively ensuring that that is happening.
I'm very pleased that, in the new strategy, you talk about the lack of access to affordable, healthy food. I'm sure that you're fully aware of my interest in this subject, but I think a great deal of work still needs to be done on this. I absolutely share your applause for the work done by Lynne Neagle, who set out to address a scandalously low uptake of Healthy Start vouchers—a mere 40 per cent. Through Lynne Neagle's work, it's gone up to 70 per cent, but that still leaves 30 per cent of a targeted group of people who automatically get to see a midwife as well as a health visitor as part of their their transition to motherhood. How is it possible that there are still 30 per cent who are missing out of a group of people? So, 30 per cent of those who are on a low income. I would like to see a new target of 100 per cent of all those low-income families taking up the Healthy Start voucher.
I think local authorities—. When money is so short, and, as you say £1.3 billion less than we actually were assessed as needing in 2021, I want local authorities to start thinking about the other money that's available to them that they're not taking up at the moment. So, I'd like a target on the number of homes that are benefiting from ECO4 or ECO Flex. At the moment, I think it's probably zero in Wales. I also want to understand what support local authorities are giving to eligible households who are eligible to get the benefit from the community benefits funds from windfarms. It's obviously not money that goes to local authorities, but local authorities should be supporting communities to ensure that that money is used not just on nice-to-have issues, but really crucial issues like having a warm home, when, at the moment, the Welsh Government has had to stall the roll-out of the new Warm Homes programme.
So, I wondered if you could say a little bit more about what milestones you've set yourself for the number of community-focused schools. So, I want to know how many community-focused schools are there today—
Mae llawer i'w ddathlu yn y strategaeth newydd, ac, yn arbennig, rwy'n croesawu atgyfnerthu hawliau plant. Nid yw plant yn dewis cael eu geni i dlodi ac mae'n gwbl briodol bod ganddynt hawl gyfreithiol i sicrhau bod eu hawliau'n cael eu gorfodi.
Rwy'n croesawu'n fawr y cynnydd y mae'r Gweinidog yn ei wneud ar y siarter budd-daliadau hon. Ni fyddwn eisiau bod yr awdurdod lleol yn sefyll o'ch blaen nad oedd am gymryd rhan yn y siarter budd-daliadau. Rwy'n siŵr y byddai honno'n sgwrs anodd iawn. Ond mae'n rhaid i ni sicrhau bod hwn yn gam pwysig ymlaen y gellir ei ddefnyddio'n gyflym fel cyfrwng i sicrhau bod yr arweinwyr ymhlith awdurdodau lleol sy'n trosglwyddo'n awtomatig y rhai sy'n gymwys i gael un budd i rai eraill y maent eisoes wedi'u hasesu fel rhai cymwys ar eu cyfer, bod hynny'n cael ei gyfleu ar draws i'r llusgwyr traed nad ydynt yn gwneud hyn ar hyn o bryd. Felly, hoffwn weld targed ar gyfer sut rydym yn mesur y cynnydd y mae awdurdodau lleol yn ei wneud. Rwyf eisiau gweld rhai ystadegau ynghylch faint y mae'r siarter budd-daliadau hon yn mynd i gynyddu'r nifer sy'n manteisio ar fudd-daliadau y mae gan bobl hawl iddynt. Mae hyn yn dod allan o'u trethi ac yna mae ganddyn nhw hawl i'r arian hwnnw. Felly, oherwydd hyn, dylai'r awdurdod lleol ac eraill fod wrthi'n sicrhau bod hynny'n digwydd.
Rwy'n falch iawn, yn y strategaeth newydd, eich bod yn siarad am y diffyg mynediad at fwyd fforddiadwy ac iach. Rwy'n siŵr eich bod yn gwbl ymwybodol o'm diddordeb yn y pwnc hwn, ond rwy'n credu bod angen gwneud llawer iawn o waith o hyd ar hyn. Rwy'n rhannu eich cymeradwyaeth yn llwyr am y gwaith a wnaed gan Lynne Neagle, a aeth ati i fynd i'r afael â nifer warthus o isel o dalebau Cychwyn Iach—dim ond 40 y cant. Trwy waith Lynne Neagle, mae wedi mynd i fyny i 70 y cant, ond mae hynny'n dal i adael 30 y cant o grŵp o bobl wedi'u targedu sy'n cael gweld bydwraig yn awtomatig yn ogystal ag ymwelydd iechyd fel rhan o'r pontio i fod yn fam. Sut mae'n bosibl bod 30 y cant o grŵp o bobl yn dal ar eu colled? Felly, 30 y cant o'r rhai sydd ar incwm isel. Hoffwn weld targed newydd o 100 y cant o'r holl deuluoedd incwm isel hynny yn derbyn y daleb Cychwyn Iach.
Dwi'n meddwl bod awdurdodau lleol—. Pan fydd arian mor fyr, ac, fel ydych chi'n ddweud £1.3 biliwn yn llai nag yr aseswyd bod angen arnom yn 2021, rwyf eisiau i awdurdodau lleol ddechrau meddwl am yr arian arall sydd ar gael iddynt nad ydynt yn ei gymryd ar hyn o bryd. Felly, hoffwn gael targed ar nifer y cartrefi sy'n elwa ar ECO4 neu ECO Flex. Ar hyn o bryd, rwy'n credu ei fod yn sero yng Nghymru. Rwyf hefyd eisiau deall pa gymorth y mae awdurdodau lleol yn ei roi i aelwydydd cymwys i gael y budd o'r arian buddion cymunedol o ffermydd gwynt. Yn amlwg, nid yw'n arian sy'n mynd i awdurdodau lleol, ond dylai awdurdodau lleol fod yn cefnogi cymunedau i sicrhau bod yr arian hwnnw'n cael ei ddefnyddio nid yn unig ar faterion y byddai'n braf eu cael, ond materion hanfodol iawn fel cael cartref cynnes, pan, ar hyn o bryd, fo Llywodraeth Cymru wedi gorfod atal cyflwyno'r rhaglen Cartrefi Clyd newydd.
Felly, tybed a allech chi ddweud ychydig mwy am ba gerrig milltir rydych chi wedi'u gosod ar gyfer nifer yr ysgolion bro. Felly, rwyf eisiau gwybod faint o ysgolion bro sydd yna heddiw—
I've been very generous with time. I'm really sorry, but this needs to draw to a close.
Rydw i wedi bod yn hael iawn gydag amser. Mae'n ddrwg gen i, ond mae angen i hyn ddod i ben.
Thank you, I'm going to. But I welcome discussing all this with Rod Hick so that we can ensure that we have clear milestones.
Diolch, yr wyf yn mynd i orffen. Ond rwy'n croesawu trafod hyn i gyd gyda Rod Hick fel y gallwn sicrhau bod gennym gerrig milltir clir.
Thank you. Minister.
Diolch. Gweinidog.
Thank you very much, Jenny. I think it is really helpful that you've recognised there have been changes as a result of all the impacts of your committee report consultation, the reinforcement of children's rights. Just to say on the Welsh benefits charter, very quickly, all 22 leaders attended the local government partnership council where I was, with the Minister for Finance and Local Government, and they all endorsed it, so they've all signed up to it. But, actually, and it's a point that Sioned has made about—and others—how are you going to monitor delivery. And Vikki. So, actually, I think this is the role of the external implementation group chaired by Fran Targett, so we'll take that point back to them in terms of how can we engage them in measuring the impact of their work.
I've given some examples of very specific targets, like 'Claim what's yours', and we've got this really—. We didn't have a target for Healthy Start vouchers; it was a Government commitment. This does take me back to the point: if you read all of the strategy, you will see the commitments in every plan every Minister has got to deliver and monitor what that delivery is. Of course, I'm sure you'll be questioning the Minister for education later on about this in terms of attainment.
I'll finally say that the food poverty issue—. Again, questioned about the draft budget, we protected this in the draft budget, but it's not just about putting money into foodbanks, is it, as you know. It's the work that we're doing, and we mentioned it earlier on this afternoon, that I'm doing with the Minister for rural affairs about the community food strategy, food sourcing, rolling out healthy schools meals, which is quite a question at the moment. So, that, I think, is a really important area.
Just finally, on Warm Homes and the fact that Nest is moving into the Warm Homes from 1 April in terms of the procurement—housing is critical to tackling child poverty, so I'm really glad that we've managed to mention housing this afternoon.
Diolch yn fawr iawn, Jenny. Rwy'n credu ei bod yn ddefnyddiol iawn eich bod wedi cydnabod bod newidiadau wedi digwydd o ganlyniad i holl effeithiau ymgynghoriad eich adroddiad pwyllgor, atgyfnerthu hawliau plant. O ran siarter budd-daliadau Cymru, yn gyflym iawn, aeth pob un o'r 22 arweinydd i'r cyngor partneriaeth llywodraeth leol lle roeddwn i, gyda'r Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol, ac fe wnaethon nhw i gyd ei gymeradwyo, felly maen nhw i gyd yn ei gefnogi. Ond, mewn gwirionedd, ac mae'n bwynt y mae Sioned wedi ei wneud amdano—ac eraill—sut ydych chi'n mynd i fonitro cyflawniad. A Vikki. Felly, mewn gwirionedd, rwy'n credu mai dyma rôl y grŵp gweithredu allanol a gadeirir gan Fran Targett, felly byddwn yn mynd â'r pwynt hwnnw yn ôl atynt o ran sut y gallwn eu cynnwys wrth fesur effaith eu gwaith.
Rwyf wedi rhoi rhai enghreifftiau o dargedau penodol iawn, fel 'Hawliwch yr Hyn sy'n Ddyledus i Chi', ac mae gennym ni hyn mewn gwirionedd—. Doedd gennym ni ddim targed ar gyfer talebau Cychwyn Iach; roedd yn ymrwymiad gan y Llywodraeth. Mae hyn yn mynd â mi yn ôl at y pwynt: os ydych yn darllen yr holl strategaeth, byddwch yn gweld yr ymrwymiadau ym mhob cynllun y mae'n rhaid i bob Gweinidog ei gyflawni a monitro beth yw'r cyflawniad hwnnw. Wrth gwrs, rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn holi'r Gweinidog addysg yn nes ymlaen ynglŷn â hyn o ran cyrhaeddiad.
Dywedaf i orffen fod y mater tlodi bwyd—. Unwaith eto, holwyd am y gyllideb ddrafft, gwnaethom ddiogelu hyn yn y gyllideb ddrafft, ond nid yw'n ymwneud â rhoi arian i fanciau bwyd yn unig, nac ydyw, fel y gwyddoch. Dyma'r gwaith rydyn ni'n ei wneud, ac fe wnaethom sôn amdano yn gynharach y prynhawn yma, yr wyf ei wneud gyda'r Gweinidog dros faterion gwledig am y strategaeth bwyd cymunedol, cyrchu bwyd, cyflwyno prydau ysgol iach, sy'n dipyn o gwestiwn ar hyn o bryd. Felly mae hwnnw, rwy'n credu, yn faes pwysig iawn.
Yn olaf, Cartrefi Clyd a'r ffaith fod Nyth yn symud i'r Cartrefi Clyd o 1 Ebrill o ran caffael—mae tai yn hanfodol i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant, felly rwy'n falch iawn ein bod wedi llwyddo i sôn am dai y prynhawn yma.
I'll mention two things before I get on to my substantive point. First of all, Vikki Howells mentioned the brilliance of the baby bundles policy, and it is fantastic, but it's sad to see that the current draft budget suggests releasing £6 million from that budget, which will, obviously, impact on children's potential as they go on in their life. And then, the Minister talked about the two-child cap policy that she mentioned is a bad policy in England, and we're in agreement there, but we're not seeing Keir Starmer, the leader of the Labour Party, proposing to repeal that policy. So, it would be good to see the Welsh Government put pressure on the Labour Party, soon to be Government, in Westminster to repeal that policy.
But on that final point that the Minister mentioned on housing, I'm really glad to see housing mentioned 15 times, I think, in this strategy. When we look at individual people's health, and children especially, in terms of hospital treatment for people with respiratory illnesses, some 20 per cent of those appointments and treatments are to do with poor housing. So, we absolutely need to get to grips with housing if we're going to tackle poverty. But if we're looking at the current state of things, it will only get worse, unfortunately. A third of the people in temporary accommodation currently are children, and they don't get the same chances in life because of that. So, if we're serious about tackling child poverty, we absolutely need to tackle housing.
As I said, it'll only get worse, because currently those people on the front line helping people who are facing homelessness are now leaving the sector. We're seeing people leaving local authority employment and other organisations. That's because we haven't seen an uplift in the housing support grant. As things stand currently with the draft budget, we still won't see that. So, my challenge is, if we are serious about tackling child poverty, then in this immediate short term we need to see an uplift in the housing support grant. I see and I listened to the Minister's comments that she is supportive of making sure that housing is a priority, so can we count on the Minister to support the call for an increase in the housing support grant in this year's budget? Diolch.
Fe wnaf sôn am ddau beth cyn i mi fynd ymlaen at fy mhwynt sylweddol. Yn gyntaf oll, soniodd Vikki Howells am ragoriaeth y polisi bwndeli babanod, ac mae'n wych, ond mae'n drist gweld bod y gyllideb ddrafft bresennol yn awgrymu rhyddhau £6 miliwn o'r gyllideb honno, a fydd, yn amlwg, yn effeithio ar botensial plant wrth iddynt fynd ymlaen yn eu bywydau. Ac yna, soniodd y Gweinidog am y polisi cap dau blentyn gan ddweud ei fod yn bolisi gwael yn Lloegr, ac rydym yn cytuno ar hynny, ond nid ydym yn gweld Keir Starmer, arweinydd y Blaid Lafur, yn cynnig diddymu'r polisi hwnnw. Felly, byddai'n dda gweld Llywodraeth Cymru yn rhoi pwysau ar y Blaid Lafur, a fydd cyn bo hir yn Llywodraethu, yn San Steffan, i ddiddymu'r polisi hwnnw.
Ond ar y pwynt olaf hwnnw y soniodd y Gweinidog o ran tai, rwy'n falch iawn o weld tai yn cael eu crybwyll 15 gwaith, rwy'n credu, yn y strategaeth hon. Pan edrychwn ar iechyd pobl unigol, a phlant yn enwedig, o ran triniaeth ysbyty ar gyfer pobl ag afiechydon anadlol, mae tua 20 y cant o'r apwyntiadau a'r triniaethau hynny yn ymwneud â thai gwael. Felly, mae gwir angen i ni fynd i'r afael â thai os ydym yn mynd i fynd i'r afael â thlodi. Ond os ydyn ni'n edrych ar y sefyllfa bresennol, dim ond gwaethygu y bydd, yn anffodus. Mae traean o'r bobl mewn llety dros dro yn blant, ac nid ydynt yn cael yr un cyfleoedd mewn bywyd oherwydd hynny. Felly, os ydym o ddifrif am drechu tlodi plant, mae gwir angen i ni fynd i'r afael â thai.
Fel y dywedais, bydd ond yn gwaethygu, oherwydd ar hyn o bryd mae'r bobl hynny ar y rheng flaen sy'n helpu pobl sy'n wynebu digartrefedd bellach yn gadael y sector. Rydym yn gweld pobl yn gadael cyflogaeth awdurdod lleol a sefydliadau eraill. Mae hynny oherwydd nad ydym wedi gweld cynnydd yn y grant cymorth tai. Fel mae pethau'n sefyll gyda'r gyllideb ddrafft ar hyn o bryd, ni fyddwn yn gweld hynny o hyd. Felly, fy her yw, os ydym o ddifrif ynghylch mynd i'r afael â thlodi plant, yna yn y tymor byr iawn hwn mae angen i ni weld cynnydd yn y grant cymorth tai. Gwelaf, a gwrandewais ar sylwadau'r Gweinidog, ei bod yn gefnogol i sicrhau bod tai yn flaenoriaeth, felly a allwn ni ddibynnu ar y Gweinidog i gefnogi'r alwad am gynnydd yn y grant cymorth tai yn y gyllideb eleni? Diolch.
Diolch am eich amynedd.
Thank you for your patience.
Diolch. I do apologise, because I didn’t properly respond to Vikki Howells on the baby bundles pilot, and now I’m able to respond properly to you, Mabon. Thank you for that, because I think Bwndel Babi is really important, very much led by Julie Morgan, Deputy Minister for Social Services, in terms of the piloting of it. I think my answer to this question, and indeed on the housing question as well, does go back to our draft budget and the difficulty and the pressures that we’ve faced because of the £1.3 billion that was pulled out of our budget resource. So, through scrutiny—and I’m sure scrutiny is taking place with the Local Government and Housing Committee as well as with the Equality and Social Justice Committee—it is about priorities, isn’t it, and how we can ensure that we can reflect those priorities in terms of the child poverty strategy.
But just to say on Bwndel Babi, I know that the Minister is looking at a range of options for the delivery of the commitment next year. It is about ensuring that more families in Wales have those essentials. They’re not getting the essentials through universal credit or social security. Working-age benefits are 13 per cent lower this year than they were in 2009, pre austerity. How can people possibly live on that? So, what we need to do, then, is build on the pilot, evaluate it, and look at research on where we can deliver positive benefits to new and expectant parents.
Diolch. Rwy'n ymddiheuro, oherwydd wnes i ddim ymateb yn iawn i Vikki Howells ar y cynllun treialu bwndel babi, a nawr rydw i'n gallu ymateb yn iawn i chi, Mabon. Diolch am hynny, oherwydd credaf fod Bwndel Babi yn bwysig iawn, dan arweiniad Julie Morgan, Dirprwy Weinidog Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol, o ran ei dreialu. Rwy'n credu bod fy ateb i'r cwestiwn hwn, ac yn wir y cwestiwn tai hefyd, yn mynd yn ôl at ein cyllideb ddrafft a'r anhawster a'r pwysau rydyn ni wedi'u hwynebu oherwydd y £1.3 biliwn a dynnwyd allan o'n hadnodd cyllidebol. Felly, drwy graffu—ac rwy'n siŵr bod craffu yn digwydd gyda'r Pwyllgor Llywodraeth Leol a Thai yn ogystal â gyda'r Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol—mae'n ymwneud â blaenoriaethau, onid ydyw, a sut y gallwn sicrhau y gallwn adlewyrchu'r blaenoriaethau hynny o ran y strategaeth tlodi plant.
Ond o ran Bwndel Babi, gwn fod y Gweinidog yn edrych ar ystod o opsiynau ar gyfer cyflawni'r ymrwymiad y flwyddyn nesaf. Mae'n ymwneud â sicrhau bod mwy o deuluoedd yng Nghymru yn meddu ar yr hanfodion hynny. Nid ydynt yn cael yr hanfodion trwy gredyd cynhwysol neu nawdd cymdeithasol. Mae budd-daliadau oedran gweithio 13 y cant yn is eleni nag yr oeddent yn 2009, cyn cyni. Sut y gall pobl fyw ar hynny? Felly, yr hyn y mae angen i ni ei wneud, yw adeiladu ar y cynllun treialu, ei werthuso, ac edrych ar ymchwil ar ble y gallwn ddarparu buddion cadarnhaol i rieni newydd a darpar rieni.
Finally, John Griffiths.
Yn olaf, John Griffiths.
Diolch, Llywydd, Thank you very much for your statement today, Minister. In the last Senedd term, the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee, which I chaired, made, I think, some important recommendations and did some important work in this area, including the need for a Welsh benefits system. The Bevan Foundation itself has done some very good work, I think, in supporting that and explaining the value in terms of putting over £70 million into the pockets of the most vulnerable households here in Wales.
Of course, as a committee, we also suggested that the administration of UK benefits be devolved to Wales so that we could have a policy based around dignity, efficacy and compassion, which unfortunately is not the approach of the current UK Government. So I just wonder, Minister, to what extent you see your statement today as signalling sufficient progress on those matters, and to what extent automaticity will be built in to some of these initiatives, so that if you claim one benefit and that makes you eligible for others, you don’t have to go through a series of applications.
And just two other things very quickly, Llywydd. Obviously, delivering on the Welsh Government's strategy to tackle child poverty relies on partners. Would you agree that some of the initiatives I came across just this morning, Minister, are very important? Firstly, at Maindee Primary School, which was visited by Jeremy Miles, the education Minister, this morning, they serve a very diverse population and they work with a huge range of partners to tackle whatever issues their pupils, their families and their community have. Much of that, of course, is about tackling poverty and the effects of poverty.
Also there was the leader of Newport City Council, Jane Mudd, who referred to a Newport City Council meeting today where they will be taking forward a proposal to recognise care-experienced children's issues and treat them as if they had protected characteristics. So, in the development and the implementation of policy, children who have that experience of care would be on that footing, and obviously that would deliver very important benefits for them.
Diolch, Llywydd, diolch yn fawr iawn am eich datganiad heddiw, Gweinidog. Yn nhymor y Senedd ddiwethaf, gwnaeth y Pwyllgor Cymunedau, Cydraddoldeb a Llywodraeth Leol, a gafodd ei gadeirio gennyf i, rai argymhellion pwysig yn fy marn i, a gwneud rhywfaint o waith pwysig yn y maes hwn, gan gynnwys yr angen am system fudd-daliadau i Gymru. Mae Sefydliad Bevan ei hun wedi gwneud gwaith da iawn, rwy'n credu, wrth gefnogi hynny ac egluro'r gwerth o ran rhoi dros £70 miliwn ym mhocedi'r aelwydydd mwyaf agored i niwed yma yng Nghymru.
Wrth gwrs, fel pwyllgor, awgrymwyd hefyd y dylid datganoli gweinyddiaeth budd-daliadau'r DU i Gymru fel y gallem gael polisi yn seiliedig ar urddas, effeithiolrwydd a thosturi, ac yn anffodus nid dyna ddull Llywodraeth bresennol y DU. Felly, Gweinidog, i ba raddau yr ydych yn gweld eich datganiad heddiw yn arwydd o gynnydd digonol ar y materion hynny, ac i ba raddau y bydd awtomatigrwydd yn cael ei gynnwys mewn rhai o'r mentrau hyn, er enghraifft, os ydych yn hawlio un budd-dal ac mae hynny yn eich gwneud yn gymwys i eraill, nid oes rhaid i chi fynd trwy gyfres o geisiadau.
A dim ond dau beth arall yn gyflym iawn, Llywydd. Yn amlwg, mae cyflawni strategaeth Llywodraeth Cymru i fynd i'r afael â thlodi plant yn dibynnu ar bartneriaid. A fyddech chi'n cytuno bod rhai o'r mentrau y des i ar eu traws y bore yma, Gweinidog, yn bwysig iawn? Yn gyntaf, yn Ysgol Gynradd Maendy, a gafodd ymweliad gan Jeremy Miles, y Gweinidog addysg, y bore yma, maent yn gwasanaethu poblogaeth amrywiol iawn ac maent yn gweithio gydag ystod enfawr o bartneriaid i fynd i'r afael â pha bynnag broblemau sydd gan eu disgyblion, eu teuluoedd a'u cymuned. Mae llawer o hynny, wrth gwrs, yn ymwneud â mynd i'r afael â thlodi ac effeithiau tlodi.
Hefyd roedd arweinydd Cyngor Dinas Casnewydd, Jane Mudd, a gyfeiriodd at gyfarfod Cyngor Dinas Casnewydd heddiw lle byddant yn bwrw ymlaen â chynnig i gydnabod problemau plant â phrofiad o ofal a'u trin fel pe bai ganddynt nodweddion gwarchodedig. Felly, wrth ddatblygu a gweithredu polisi, byddai plant sydd â'r profiad hwnnw o ofal yn cael eu trin felly, ac yn amlwg byddai hynny'n sicrhau buddion pwysig iawn iddynt.
Diolch yn fawr, John Griffiths. Can I thank you for all that work you did way back, as Chair of the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee? I've still got the report you produced, which was calling for devolving the administration of benefits. In a sense, this is partly the next step, isn't it, that we're announcing today, developing a coherent, streamlined, Welsh benefits system. It's central to objective 1 in delivering our child poverty strategy.
This is also the work that we're doing to look at the devolution and administration of welfare benefits. Of course, you need the agreement from the UK Government to amend primary legislation, and we actually have had a rejection from the UK Government—to the Welsh Affairs Committee, not just to the Senedd and the Welsh Government. They recommended that the UK Government should work with the Welsh Government to assess the potential merits of devolving the administration of the same benefits to Wales as have been devolved to Scotland. I've asked the Welsh Affairs Committee to go back to that, and I hope Members in different political parties will bring them in on that as well. So, that work is proceeding.
On what you described, I also have been to Maindee Primary School, and the Minister for education went to Maindee Primary School this morning. It is an extraordinary example of leadership—school based, at community level, and also leadership from the local authority. When I visited Maindee Primary School, the leadership was tackling not only child poverty in terms of making sure that children got everything they were entitled to, but tackling the stigma of child poverty by empowering those children to feel wanted, loved, empowered, recognised in all their tremendous abilities, their skills and their diversity. I was also very pleased to see that Big Bocs Bwyd, which came from Cadoxton school in Barry, led by dynamic headteacher Janet Hayward, has got a box in Maindee Primary School.
Diolch yn fawr, John Griffiths. A gaf i ddiolch i chi am yr holl waith a wnaethoch bell yn ôl, fel Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Cymunedau, Cydraddoldeb a Llywodraeth Leol? Mae gen i'r adroddiad a gynhyrchwyd gennych o hyd, a oedd yn galw am ddatganoli gweinyddu budd-daliadau. Ar un ystyr, dyma'r cam nesaf yn rhannol, onid e, yr ydym yn ei gyhoeddi heddiw, yn datblygu system fudd-daliadau gydlynol, syml, i Gymru. Mae'n ganolog i amcan 1 wrth gyflawni ein strategaeth tlodi plant.
Dyma'r gwaith rydym yn ei wneud hefyd i edrych ar ddatganoli a gweinyddu budd-daliadau lles. Wrth gwrs, mae angen y cytundeb gan Lywodraeth y DU arnoch i ddiwygio deddfwriaeth sylfaenol, ac rydym mewn gwirionedd wedi cael ein gwrthod gan Lywodraeth y DU—y Pwyllgor Materion Cymreig, nid yn unig y Senedd a Llywodraeth Cymru. Fe wnaethon nhw argymell y dylai Llywodraeth y DU weithio gyda Llywodraeth Cymru i asesu rhinweddau posibl datganoli gweinyddiaeth yr un budd-daliadau i Gymru ag sydd wedi'u datganoli i'r Alban. Rwyf wedi gofyn i'r Pwyllgor Materion Cymreig fynd yn ôl at hynny, ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd Aelodau mewn gwahanol bleidiau gwleidyddol yn mynd yn ôl at hynny hefyd. Felly, mae'r gwaith hwnnw'n mynd rhagddo.
O ran yr hyn a ddisgrifiwyd gennych, rwyf hefyd wedi bod i Ysgol Gynradd Maendy ac aeth y Gweinidog addysg i Ysgol Gynradd Maendy y bore yma. Mae'n enghraifft eithriadol o arweinyddiaeth—yn yr ysgol, ar lefel gymunedol, a hefyd arweinyddiaeth gan yr awdurdod lleol. Pan ymwelais ag Ysgol Gynradd Maendy, roedd yr arweinyddiaeth yn mynd i'r afael nid yn unig â thlodi plant o ran sicrhau bod plant yn cael popeth yr oedd ganddynt hawl iddo, ond yn mynd i'r afael â stigma tlodi plant trwy rymuso'r plant hynny i deimlo eu bod yn bwysig, yn cael eu caru, yn cael eu grymuso, a'u cydnabod o ran eu holl alluoedd aruthrol, eu sgiliau a'u hamrywiaeth. Roeddwn hefyd yn falch iawn o weld bod gan Big Bocs Bwyd, a ddaeth o ysgol Tregatwg yn y Barri, dan arweiniad y pennaeth deinamig Janet Hayward, focs yn Ysgol Gynradd Maendy.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
Thank you, Minister.
Mae eitem 5, y datganiad ar Flaenau'r Cymoedd, wedi'i ohirio.
Item 5, the statement on the Heads of the Valleys, has been postponed.
Eitem 6 fydd nesaf, datganiad gan y Dirprwy Weinidog Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol ar weithredu Deddf Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol a Chaffael Cyhoeddus (Cymru) 2023. Dwi'n galw ar Hannah Blythyn i wneud y datganiad.
Item 6 will be next, which is a statement by the Deputy Minister for Social Partnership on the implementation of the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Act 2023. I call on Hannah Blythyn to make that statement.
Diolch, Llywydd. Yn union flwyddyn yn ôl i'r diwrnod, rôn i'n eistedd gerbron y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol yn gweithio drwy 115 o welliannau Cyfnod 2 i'r Bil Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol a Chaffael Cyhoeddus (Cymru).
Thank you, Llywydd. Exactly 12 months ago to the day, I was sat before the Equality and Social Justice Committee painstakingly working through all 115 Stage 2 amendments to what was then the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Bill.
Fast-forward to January 2024 and the first meeting of the social partnership council is just a week away. Preparations for the commencement of the social partnership duties on 1 April are well advanced, and work on the regulations and guidance that will support our socially responsible procurement provisions are moving forward at pace.
We have come a long way in what is a relatively short space of time since the Royal Assent in late May last year, but we’re now very much focused on the practical implementation. The speed at which we've been able to progress is in no small part thanks to the support and enthusiasm we have received from our social partners, who have worked with us tirelessly throughout the development and the passage of the legislation. This work has continued since the Act made the statute book, as we work collectively to prepare the way for the new duties to take effect so that the legislation can begin to make a real difference.
Ymlaen yn gyflym at fis Ionawr 2024 a chyfarfod cyntaf y cyngor partneriaeth gymdeithasol wythnos yn unig i ffwrdd. Mae'r paratoadau ar gyfer dechrau'r dyletswyddau partneriaeth gymdeithasol ar 1 Ebrill wedi datblygu'n dda, ac mae gwaith ar y rheoliadau a'r canllawiau a fydd yn cefnogi ein darpariaethau caffael sy'n gyfrifol yn gymdeithasol yn symud ymlaen yn gyflym.
Rydym wedi dod yn bell mewn cyfnod cymharol fyr ers y Cydsyniad Brenhinol ddiwedd Mai y llynedd, ond rydym bellach yn canolbwyntio'n fawr ar weithredu'n ymarferol. Diolch i'r gefnogaeth a'r brwdfrydedd a gawsom gan ein partneriaid cymdeithasol, sydd wedi gweithio'n ddiflino gyda ni drwy gydol y gwaith o ddatblygu a phasio'r ddeddfwriaeth, rydym wedi gallu symud ymlaen yn gyflym. Mae'r gwaith hwn wedi parhau ers i'r Ddeddf gyrraedd y llyfr statud, wrth i ni weithio gyda'n gilydd i baratoi'r ffordd i'r dyletswyddau newydd ddod i rym fel y gall y ddeddfwriaeth ddechrau gwneud gwahaniaeth go iawn.
Daeth Paul Davies i’r Gadair.
Paul Davies took the Chair.
I would also like to again acknowledge the constructive and productive way in which our Plaid Cymru partners have engaged with us in taking forward the procurement aspects of the Act in particular. I look forward to continuing to work in the same spirit as we implement our shared commitments on socially responsible procurement.
Members last received an update on the implementation of the Act in December, when the First Minister issued a written statement confirming that all 18 of the worker and employer representative members had been appointed to the social partnership council and that the council would be meeting for the first time in early 2024. That meeting will be taking place next week on 1 February and will, amongst other matters, include an opportunity for partnership council members to discuss the draft budget with Ministers. The Act places a duty on us as Welsh Ministers to consult the partnership council on decisions of a strategic nature about the reasonable steps we take to deliver our well-being objectives, and, on present plans, my intention is to bring that duty into force on 1 April this year.
Having the draft budget on the agenda for the partnership council's first meeting further supports social partnership, even though the social partnership duty on the Welsh Ministers has not yet been commenced. As we move forward, we will ensure that the partnership council continues to be engaged in a meaningful way on other strategic decisions that we as Ministers are considering, so that the choices we make and the actions we take are informed by the expertise and experience of our worker and employer representatives.
The Act also places a duty on public bodies in Wales, insofar as is reasonable, to seek compromise and consensus with their trade unions or other representatives of their staff when setting their well-being objectives under the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, and when they are making decisions of a strategic nature about the reasonable steps they intend to take to deliver those objectives. Put simply, this is about engaging the expertise of the people who provide our public services in what those services should look like, as well as in helping to promote wider well-being. This duty will come into force in April this year, with public bodies required to report each year thereafter on the steps they have taken to comply with the duty in the preceding 12 months.
We have been working closely with both public sector employers and trade unions to ensure that they are in the best possible position to implement the social partnership duty as seamlessly and constructively as possible. To support this, between August and November last year my officials led a series of regional workshops, and will shortly be complementing these with online learning packages to further support awareness raising. I will also be hosting a conference in St Asaph in March, which will discuss 'Social Partnership: The Welsh Way'. The conference will offer public bodies a key opportunity to meet and talk with counterparts and to hear from experts in the field of social partnership.
Finally, I'd like to provide an update on the socially responsible procurement duties that the Act places on many of our public bodies in Wales. These duties will require, amongst other things, contracting authorities to include socially responsible clauses in construction contracts over £2 million, and outsourced services contracts wherever possible. There is much detailed work to be done to ensure that our public sector partners are prepared before we bring these procurement duties into force. For example, we are currently working with our stakeholders to develop the model clauses, and making progress on the other guidance that contracting authorities will need in advance of the duties coming into effect. We are also working on the measures and the data requirements to be included in the regulations we will need to make in relation to annual reports.
During scrutiny of the Bill, I made clear that our intention was that these procurement provisions would not be enacted until the necessary groundwork had been undertaken and contracting authorities were in a position to be compliant. I indicated then that this preparatory work would take time, and that the duties would not be brought into force until the end of this year at the earliest—potentially on an incremental basis. I can confirm that that remains our intention, and I will of course further update Members on this later in the year.
I hope that Members today will welcome the progress that we are making in putting this important Act into practice. Indeed, the Act is a part of the Welsh Government's ambition to create a stronger, fairer and greener Wales, and its provisions connect to the objectives of the child poverty strategy, particularly around fair work.
The Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Act is landmark legislation that puts our Welsh way of working on a statutory footing. Here in Wales, we are working together in partnership to make a difference for our communities, our economy and our country, ensuring workers' voices are front and centre through their trade unions, and bringing together the collective expertise of social partners to lead to better outcomes for people right across Wales—not just changing legislation, but changing lives.
Hoffwn gydnabod unwaith eto y ffordd adeiladol a chynhyrchiol y mae ein partneriaid Plaid Cymru wedi ymgysylltu â ni i fwrw ymlaen ag agweddau caffael y Ddeddf yn benodol. Edrychaf ymlaen at barhau i weithio yn yr un ysbryd wrth i ni weithredu ein hymrwymiadau cyffredin ar gaffael sy'n gyfrifol yn gymdeithasol.
Cafodd yr aelodau yr wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am weithredu'r Ddeddf ym mis Rhagfyr, pan gyhoeddodd y Prif Weinidog ddatganiad ysgrifenedig yn cadarnhau bod pob un o'r 18 aelod sy'n cynrychioli gweithwyr a chyflogwyr wedi'u penodi i'r cyngor partneriaeth gymdeithasol ac y byddai'r cyngor yn cyfarfod am y tro cyntaf yn gynnar yn 2024. Bydd y cyfarfod hwnnw'n cael ei gynnal yr wythnos nesaf ar 1 Chwefror a bydd, ymhlith materion eraill, yn cynnwys cyfle i aelodau'r cyngor partneriaeth drafod y gyllideb ddrafft gyda Gweinidogion. Mae'r Ddeddf yn gosod dyletswydd arnom ni fel Gweinidogion Cymru i ymgynghori â'r cyngor partneriaeth ar benderfyniadau o natur strategol ynghylch y camau rhesymol a gymerwn i gyflawni ein hamcanion llesiant, ac, ar y cynlluniau presennol, fy mwriad yw dod â'r ddyletswydd honno i rym ar 1 Ebrill eleni.
Mae cael y gyllideb ddrafft ar yr agenda ar gyfer cyfarfod cyntaf y cyngor partneriaeth yn cefnogi partneriaeth gymdeithasol ymhellach, er nad yw'r ddyletswydd partneriaeth gymdeithasol ar Weinidogion Cymru wedi'i chychwyn eto. Wrth i ni symud ymlaen, byddwn yn sicrhau bod y cyngor partneriaeth yn parhau i gymryd rhan mewn ffordd ystyrlon ar benderfyniadau strategol eraill yr ydym ni fel Gweinidogion yn eu hystyried, fel bod y dewisiadau a wnawn a'r camau a gymerwn yn cael eu llywio gan arbenigedd a phrofiad ein gweithwyr a'n cynrychiolwyr cyflogwyr.
Mae'r Ddeddf hefyd yn gosod dyletswydd ar gyrff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru, i'r graddau y bo'n rhesymol, i geisio cyfaddawd a chonsensws gyda'u hundebau llafur neu gynrychiolwyr eraill o'u staff wrth bennu eu hamcanion llesiant o dan Ddeddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015, a phan fyddant yn gwneud penderfyniadau o natur strategol ynghylch y camau rhesymol y maent yn bwriadu eu cymryd i gyflawni'r amcanion hynny. Yn syml, mae hyn yn ymwneud â defnyddio arbenigedd y bobl sy'n darparu ein gwasanaethau cyhoeddus i benderfynu sut y dylai'r gwasanaethau hynny edrych, yn ogystal â helpu i hyrwyddo llesiant ehangach. Daw'r ddyletswydd hon i rym ym mis Ebrill eleni, ac mae'n ofynnol i gyrff cyhoeddus adrodd bob blwyddyn ar ôl hynny ar y camau y maent wedi'u cymryd i gydymffurfio â'r ddyletswydd yn ystod y 12 mis blaenorol.
Rydym wedi bod yn gweithio'n agos gyda chyflogwyr sector cyhoeddus ac undebau llafur i sicrhau eu bod yn y sefyllfa orau bosibl i weithredu'r ddyletswydd partneriaeth gymdeithasol mor ddi-dor ac adeiladol â phosibl. I gefnogi hyn, rhwng Awst a Thachwedd y llynedd, arweiniodd fy swyddogion gyfres o weithdai rhanbarthol, a chyn bo hir byddant yn ategu'r rhain gyda phecynnau dysgu ar-lein i gefnogi codi ymwybyddiaeth ymhellach. Byddaf hefyd yn cynnal cynhadledd yn Llanelwy ym mis Mawrth, a fydd yn trafod 'Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol: Y Ffordd Gymreig'. Bydd y gynhadledd yn cynnig cyfle allweddol i gyrff cyhoeddus gyfarfod a siarad â chymheiriaid a chlywed gan arbenigwyr ym maes partneriaeth gymdeithasol.
Yn olaf, hoffwn roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am y dyletswyddau caffael cymdeithasol gyfrifol y mae'r Ddeddf yn eu gosod ar lawer o'n cyrff cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Bydd y dyletswyddau hyn yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol i awdurdodau contractio, ymhlith pethau eraill, gynnwys cymalau cymdeithasol gyfrifol mewn contractau adeiladu dros £2 filiwn, a chontractau gwasanaethau allanol lle bo hynny'n bosibl. Mae llawer o waith manwl i'w wneud i sicrhau bod ein partneriaid yn y sector cyhoeddus yn cael eu paratoi cyn i ni ddod â'r dyletswyddau caffael hyn i rym. Er enghraifft, rydym yn gweithio gyda'n rhanddeiliaid ar hyn o bryd i ddatblygu'r cymalau enghreifftiol, ac yn gwneud cynnydd ar y canllawiau eraill y bydd eu hangen ar awdurdodau contractio cyn i'r dyletswyddau ddod i rym. Rydym hefyd yn gweithio ar y mesurau a'r gofynion data sydd i'w cynnwys yn y rheoliadau y bydd angen i ni eu gwneud mewn perthynas ag adroddiadau blynyddol.
Wrth graffu ar y Bil, dywedais yn glir mai ein bwriad oedd na fyddai'r darpariaethau caffael hyn yn cael eu deddfu nes bod y sylfeini angenrheidiol wedi'u gwneud a bod awdurdodau contractio mewn sefyllfa i gydymffurfio â nhw. Nodais bryd hynny y byddai'r gwaith paratoi hwn yn cymryd amser, ac na fyddai'r dyletswyddau'n dod i rym tan ddiwedd eleni ar y cynharaf—o bosibl ar sail gynyddrannol. Gallaf gadarnhau mai dyna yw ein bwriad o hyd, a byddaf wrth gwrs yn rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau am hyn yn ddiweddarach yn y flwyddyn.
Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd yr Aelodau heddiw yn croesawu'r cynnydd yr ydym yn ei wneud wrth roi'r Ddeddf bwysig hon ar waith. Yn wir, mae'r Ddeddf yn rhan o uchelgais Llywodraeth Cymru i greu Cymru gryfach, decach a gwyrddach, ac mae ei darpariaethau'n cysylltu ag amcanion y strategaeth tlodi plant, yn enwedig o ran gwaith teg.
Mae Deddf Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol a Chaffael Cyhoeddus (Cymru) yn ddeddfwriaeth nodedig sy'n rhoi ein ffordd Gymreig o weithio ar sail statudol. Yma yng Nghymru, rydym yn gweithio gyda'n gilydd mewn partneriaeth i wneud gwahaniaeth i'n cymunedau, ein heconomi a'n gwlad, gan sicrhau bod lleisiau gweithwyr yn flaenllaw ac yn ganolog trwy eu hundebau llafur, ac yn dwyn ynghyd arbenigedd cyfunol partneriaid cymdeithasol i arwain at ganlyniadau gwell i bobl ledled Cymru—nid yn unig yn newid deddfwriaeth, ond yn newid bywydau.
Thank you, Deputy Minister, for your statement today, and I was glad to hear that you have recognised and taken on board some of the criticisms laid out by the future generations commissioner in implementing the well-being of future generations Act, in particular the need to make public bodies fully aware of the legislation and its implications. I welcome the effort to have workshops, online learning and the conferences you have mentioned in order to help increase awareness. But with these in mind, are they a one-off, or are you looking to have them or similar as part of an ongoing engagement programme? If so, what budget have you allocated for this?
In your statement, you mentioned, Deputy Minister, that you are waiting until public bodies are able to meet compliance before enforcing the duty to report, which you expect to be towards the end of the year. What assessment have you made of the cost implications for public bodies to be able to comply with the duties of the Act? And have you made any funds available for them to do this?
As you will be aware, Deputy Minister, in some public bodies, resources are so limited that having a stand-alone procurement function is not feasible, and purchasing is made by non-procurement staff as and when their needs dictate. How do you propose that these public bodies progress with the Act? Will specific training be provided for non-procurement staff to help public bodies meet the obligations? And if so, will money be made available for them to recruit and train staff to meet compliance? Likewise, what specific resources will be made available to help promote procurement and procurement officers as a viable career pathway?
As mentioned, you highlighted the use of workshops and online courses to make public bodies aware of the Act, but what specific training is now being offered so that procurement staff are able to assess, for instance, the carbon impact of their purchases, or if it supports the growth of jobs and skills in the local economy? Also, is the Deputy Minister aware of any specific software that is to be made available to help public bodies to do this, and what are the cost implications of this?
Furthermore, I presume that public bodies will start to analyse their procurement procedures after they've carried out their first assessment and, as mentioned, Deputy Minister, there may be significant transition periods, and implementation may have to be staggered for public bodies to become compliant. I also expect that it will take time for public bodies to reorientate their procurement because of existing contractual obligations and commitments. Therefore, what time frame are you expecting for every public procurement contract in Wales to have met the requirements of the Act? Public bodies could well make the assessment and produce the report, but, due to budget restraints, may not be able to afford to change suppliers or source goods locally, which could be more expensive. They're then put into a position of not being able to make changes to improve their procurement policy to meet the duties of the Act. How will you ensure that they actually make all the procurement changes they can?
As you know, Deputy Minister, implementation of policy has been a real problem for the Welsh Government and, sadly, this legislation has the same potential for failure, in that public bodies do not have resources to make the changes needed and therefore will not end up implementing them, especially if they believe that there will be no consequences. If a public body, for one reason or another, fails to comply with the new legislation, what enforcement action will be taken, and will this be punitive?
Finally, Deputy Minister, you are in a unique position at the start of this Act's implementation to start collecting data that will help you assess the overall success or failure of this legislation. With this in mind, what baseline metrics are you now going to measure? For example, will you look at the change in numbers of products sourced from Welsh companies, or the amount of food locally sourced? And, crucially, will you be setting targets for public bodies to meet? And if so, how will you determine these targets? Thank you.
Diolch, Dirprwy Weinidog, am eich datganiad heddiw, ac roeddwn yn falch o glywed eich bod wedi cydnabod ac ystyried rhai o'r beirniadaethau a nodwyd gan gomisiynydd cenedlaethau'r dyfodol wrth weithredu Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol, yn enwedig yr angen i wneud cyrff cyhoeddus yn gwbl ymwybodol o'r ddeddfwriaeth a'i goblygiadau. Rwy'n croesawu'r ymdrech i gynnal gweithdai, dysgu ar-lein a'r cynadleddau rydych chi wedi'u crybwyll er mwyn helpu i gynyddu ymwybyddiaeth. Ond gyda'r rhain mewn golwg, a ydyn nhw'n rhai unwaith yn unig, neu a ydych chi'n bwriadu iddyn nhw, neu rai tebyg fod yn rhan o raglen ymgysylltu barhaus? Os felly, pa gyllideb ydych chi wedi'i dyrannu ar gyfer hyn?
Yn eich datganiad, fe sonioch, Dirprwy Weinidog, eich bod yn aros nes bod cyrff cyhoeddus yn gallu cydymffurfio cyn gorfodi'r ddyletswydd i adrodd, yr ydych yn disgwyl iddo fod tua diwedd y flwyddyn. Pa asesiad ydych chi wedi'i wneud o'r goblygiadau cost i gyrff cyhoeddus allu cydymffurfio â dyletswyddau'r Ddeddf? Ac a ydych chi wedi darparu unrhyw arian iddyn nhw wneud hyn?
Fel y gwyddoch, Dirprwy Weinidog, mewn rhai cyrff cyhoeddus, mae adnoddau mor gyfyngedig fel nad yw cael swyddogaeth gaffael annibynnol yn ymarferol, a bod staff nad ydynt yn caffael yn cael eu prynu pan fydd eu hanghenion yn pennu hynny. Sut ydych chi'n cynnig bod y cyrff cyhoeddus hyn yn symud ymlaen gyda'r Ddeddf? A fydd hyfforddiant penodol yn cael ei ddarparu i staff nad ydynt yn staff caffael i helpu cyrff cyhoeddus i gyflawni'r rhwymedigaethau? Ac os felly, a fydd arian ar gael iddynt recriwtio a hyfforddi staff i fodloni cydymffurfiaeth? Yn yr un modd, pa adnoddau penodol fydd ar gael i helpu i hyrwyddo caffael a swyddogion caffael fel llwybr gyrfa hyfyw?
Fel y soniwyd, fe wnaethoch chi dynnu sylw at y defnydd o weithdai a chyrsiau ar-lein i wneud cyrff cyhoeddus yn ymwybodol o'r Ddeddf, ond pa hyfforddiant penodol sy'n cael ei gynnig nawr fel bod staff caffael yn gallu asesu, er enghraifft, effaith carbon eu pryniannau, neu a yw'n cefnogi twf swyddi a sgiliau yn yr economi leol? Hefyd, a yw'r Dirprwy Weinidog yn ymwybodol o unrhyw feddalwedd benodol sydd ar gael i helpu cyrff cyhoeddus i wneud hyn, a beth yw goblygiadau cost hyn?
Ar ben hynny, rwy'n tybio y bydd cyrff cyhoeddus yn dechrau dadansoddi eu gweithdrefnau caffael ar ôl iddynt gynnal eu hasesiad cyntaf ac, fel y crybwyllwyd, Dirprwy Weinidog, efallai y bydd cyfnodau pontio sylweddol, ac efallai y bydd yn rhaid darwahanu gweithredu er mwyn i gyrff cyhoeddus gydymffurfio. Rwyf hefyd yn disgwyl y bydd yn cymryd amser i gyrff cyhoeddus ailgyfeirio eu caffael oherwydd rhwymedigaethau ac ymrwymiadau cytundebol presennol. Felly, o fewn pa amserlen ydych chi'n disgwyl i bob contract caffael cyhoeddus yng Nghymru fod wedi bodloni gofynion y Ddeddf? Mae'n ddigon posibl y gallai cyrff cyhoeddus wneud yr asesiad a chynhyrchu'r adroddiad, ond, oherwydd cyfyngiadau cyllidebol, efallai na fyddant yn gallu fforddio newid cyflenwyr neu ddod o hyd i nwyddau yn lleol, a allai fod yn ddrutach. Yna cânt eu rhoi mewn sefyllfa o fethu â gallu gwneud newidiadau i wella eu polisi caffael i gyflawni dyletswyddau'r Ddeddf. Sut y byddwch yn sicrhau eu bod yn gwneud yr holl newidiadau caffael y gallant mewn gwirionedd?
Fel y gwyddoch, Dirprwy Weinidog, mae gweithredu polisi wedi bod yn broblem wirioneddol i Lywodraeth Cymru ac, yn anffodus, mae gan y ddeddfwriaeth hon yr un potensial i fethu pe na bai gan gyrff cyhoeddus adnoddau i wneud y newidiadau sydd eu hangen ac felly ni fyddant yn eu rhoi ar waith yn y pen draw, yn enwedig os ydynt yn credu na fydd unrhyw ganlyniadau. Os bydd corff cyhoeddus, am ryw reswm neu'i gilydd, yn methu â chydymffurfio â'r ddeddfwriaeth newydd, pa gamau gorfodi fydd yn cael eu cymryd, ac a fydd yna gosb?
Yn olaf, Dirprwy Weinidog, rydych mewn sefyllfa unigryw ar ddechrau gweithrediad y Ddeddf hon i ddechrau casglu data a fydd yn eich helpu i asesu llwyddiant cyffredinol neu fethiant y ddeddfwriaeth hon. Gyda hyn mewn golwg, pa fetrigau sylfaenol ydych chi'n mynd i'w mesur nawr? Er enghraifft, a wnewch chi edrych ar y newid yn nifer y cynhyrchion sy'n dod o gwmnïau o Gymru, neu faint o fwyd sy'n dod o ffynonellau lleol? Ac, yn hollbwysig, a fyddwch chi'n gosod targedau i gyrff cyhoeddus eu cyrraedd? Os felly, sut fyddwch chi'n penderfynu ar y targedau hyn? Diolch.
Can I thank Joel James for his contribution? I know, whilst we had the passage of legislation, we didn't agree on many things, but I do remember you memorably saying, Joel, that you had enjoyed the experience of taking through the legislation. But I welcome the questions you raised today and the interest in the important procurement aspects of the legislation. As you know, we spend £9 million of public money on procurement annually, and it's where we do have those levers in Wales to really drive those outcomes that we want to see.
And if I touch, briefly, around implementation, this is why we are actually having—. Ideally, we would want to be using those levers as soon as possible to make those differences as soon as possible. But, as you say, we recognise that asking local authorities and other contracting authorities to actually be able to grasp and best use these new procurement duties, we need to work with them and support them to be in the best possible position, as I outlined in my statement. It's why we will allow time between the publication of guidance and, actually, the duties coming into effect, so those contracting authorities have an opportunity and a time frame to familiarise themselves with that guidance prior to those duties commencing. So, that's why we'll probably look at an incremental time frame, and, actually, we are really grateful that social partners and wider members of the procurement business and third sector communities have actually been contributing to the development of the material, by attending the workshops and commenting on draft documents. So, we'll continue to work in that same way to ensure that any concerns, questions, or a range of things that the range of partners actually feed into the development—like I said, to reassure you and to assume that we're in the strongest possible position for us all to achieve the best outcomes we can in terms of the procurement aspect of this legislation.
Also, oversight and support: this piece of the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Act was the first time we've legislated on procurement in Wales, but since then we've seen the Health Service Procurement (Wales) Bill and also there is the UK Procurement Act 2023 as well. So, I know we touched on that during the scrutiny process of this legislation, so there will be broader oversight and support through the new procurement centre of excellence and other operational arrangements.
As I said in my statement, I recognise that other aspects of the legislation have been active first—first the social partnership council, then the social partnership duty on public bodies and Welsh Ministers. And as the procurement side of it and the guidance develops, I will, of course, continue to update Members, both within here and I'm always open to perhaps establishing meetings with officials to perhaps talk through the more technical side of the guidance as we progress that moving forward. Diolch.
A gaf i ddiolch i Joel James am ei gyfraniad? Rwy'n gwybod, er y cawsom hynt y ddeddfwriaeth, nid oeddem yn cytuno ar lawer o bethau, ond rwy'n eich cofio chi'n dweud, Joel, eich bod wedi mwynhau'r profiad o fynd â deddfwriaeth ar ei hynt. Ond rwy'n croesawu'r cwestiynau a godwyd gennych heddiw a'r diddordeb yn agweddau caffael pwysig y ddeddfwriaeth. Fel y gwyddoch, rydym yn gwario £9 miliwn o arian cyhoeddus ar gaffael bob blwyddyn, a dyna lle mae gennym yr ysgogiadau hynny yng Nghymru i ysgogi'r canlyniadau hynny yr ydym eisiau eu gweld mewn gwirionedd.
Ac i sôn yn fyr, am weithredu, dyma pam rydyn ni mewn gwirionedd yn cael—. Yn ddelfrydol, byddem eisiau defnyddio'r ysgogiadau hynny cyn gynted â phosibl i wneud y gwahaniaethau hynny cyn gynted â phosibl. Ond, fel y dywedwch, rydym yn cydnabod bod gofyn i awdurdodau lleol ac awdurdodau contractio eraill allu deall a defnyddio'r dyletswyddau caffael newydd hyn yn y ffordd orau, mae angen i ni weithio gyda nhw a'u cefnogi i fod yn y sefyllfa orau bosibl, fel yr amlinellais yn fy natganiad. Dyna pam y byddwn yn caniatáu amser rhwng cyhoeddi canllawiau ac, mewn gwirionedd, y dyletswyddau sy'n dod i rym, fel bod yr awdurdodau contractio hynny yn cael cyfle a ffrâm amser i ymgyfarwyddo â'r canllawiau hynny cyn i'r dyletswyddau hynny ddechrau. Felly, dyna pam y byddwn yn edrych ar amserlen gynyddrannol fwy na thebyg, ac, mewn gwirionedd, rydym yn ddiolchgar iawn bod partneriaid cymdeithasol ac aelodau ehangach o fusnesau caffael a chymunedau'r trydydd sector wedi bod yn cyfrannu at ddatblygu'r deunydd, trwy fynychu'r gweithdai a gwneud sylwadau ar ddogfennau drafft. Felly, byddwn yn parhau i weithio yn yr un modd i sicrhau bod unrhyw bryderon, cwestiynau, neu ystod o bethau y mae'r ystod o bartneriaid yn cyfrannu at y datblygiad—fel y dywedais, i'ch sicrhau ac i dybio ein bod yn y sefyllfa gryfaf bosibl i ni i gyd gyflawni'r canlyniadau gorau y gallwn o ran agwedd gaffael y ddeddfwriaeth hon.
Hefyd, goruchwylio a chefnogi: y darn hwn o Ddeddf Partneriaeth Gymdeithasol a Chaffael Cyhoeddus (Cymru) oedd y tro cyntaf i ni ddeddfu ar gaffael yng Nghymru, ond ers hynny rydym wedi gweld Bil Caffael y Gwasanaeth Iechyd (Cymru) a hefyd mae Deddf Caffael y DU 2023 hefyd. Felly, rwy'n gwybod ein bod wedi cyffwrdd â hynny yn ystod proses graffu ar y ddeddfwriaeth hon, felly bydd goruchwyliaeth a chymorth ehangach drwy'r ganolfan ragoriaeth newydd ar gyfer caffael a threfniadau gweithredol eraill.
Fel y dywedais yn fy natganiad, rwy'n cydnabod bod agweddau eraill ar y ddeddfwriaeth wedi bod yn weithredol yn gyntaf—y cyngor partneriaeth gymdeithasol yn gyntaf, yna'r ddyletswydd partneriaeth gymdeithasol ar gyrff cyhoeddus a Gweinidogion Cymru. Ac wrth i'r ochr gaffael a'r canllawiau ddatblygu, byddaf wrth gwrs yn parhau i ddiweddaru'r Aelodau yma ac rwyf bob amser yn agored i sefydlu cyfarfodydd gyda swyddogion efallai i siarad drwy ochr fwy technegol y canllawiau wrth i ni fwrw ymlaen a hynny. Diolch.
Diolch am y diweddariad, Weinidog.
Thank you for the update, Minister.
Plaid Cymru recognises the importance of this Act, specifically, as you said, as regards socially responsible procurement, of course, but also for strengthening the rights of our workers and unions, and we were glad to work, of course, with the Government on the legislation as part of our co-operation agreement.
However, with the strikes Act that was passed by Westminster last year—in other words, the anti-strike Act—Plaid Cymru are concerned with the implications this will have, perhaps, on the implementation of the social partnership Act, because it seems that Westminster's anti-strike legislation does conflict with this work, and in particular the aims of the Act to make Wales a fair work nation. As we've mentioned numerous times in the Siambr, the supremacy of Westminster and the disregard of this Tory Government for devolution places, perhaps, this fair work agenda here in Wales under jeopardy. So, do you agree that this is the case, Minister? Have you seen any evidence of that so far? As you say, you're working through the implementation now of these technical details and processes that need to be put in place to underpin the objectives of the Act. We express solidarity, of course, with public sector workers throughout Wales who feel they need to take industrial action in response to years of real-term cuts to their wages, and the most recent example, of course, being the junior doctors. So, I'd also like to know specifically how the implementation of the Act will play a role in the discussions between the British Medical Association and the Welsh Government to resolve that action.
Finally, then, in the scrutiny session we had yesterday in the Equality and Social Justice Committee, you stated that the reduction in the budget would have no effect on the practical implementations of the Act. So, can you outline if and how any of the draft budget proposals will delay or hamper any of the progress you've so far outlined? Diolch.
Mae Plaid Cymru yn cydnabod pwysigrwydd y Ddeddf hon, yn benodol, fel y dywedoch, o ran caffael cymdeithasol gyfrifol, wrth gwrs, ond hefyd am gryfhau hawliau ein gweithwyr a'n hundebau, ac roeddem yn falch o weithio, wrth gwrs, gyda'r Llywodraeth ar y ddeddfwriaeth fel rhan o'n cytundeb cydweithio.
Fodd bynnag, gyda'r Ddeddf Streicio a basiwyd gan San Steffan y llynedd—mewn geiriau eraill, y Ddeddf gwrth-streicio—mae Plaid Cymru yn pryderu am oblygiadau hon efallai ar weithredu'r Ddeddf partneriaeth gymdeithasol, oherwydd ymddengys fod deddfwriaeth gwrth-streicio San Steffan yn gwrthdaro â'r gwaith hwn, ac yn arbennig nodau'r Ddeddf i wneud Cymru'n wlad o waith teg. Fel yr ydym wedi sôn sawl gwaith yn y Siambr, goruchafiaeth San Steffan a'r Llywodraeth Dorïaidd hon yn diystyru lleoedd datganoli, efallai, yn rhoi'r agenda gwaith teg hon yma yng Nghymru dan fygythiad. Felly, a ydych chi'n cytuno mai dyma'r achos, Gweinidog? Ydych chi wedi gweld unrhyw dystiolaeth o hynny hyd yn hyn? Fel y dywedwch, rydych chi'n gweithio trwy weithredu'r manylion a'r prosesau technegol hyn yn awr y mae angen eu rhoi ar waith i ategu amcanion y Ddeddf. Rydym yn mynegi undod, wrth gwrs, gyda gweithwyr sector cyhoeddus ledled Cymru sy'n teimlo bod angen iddynt weithredu'n ddiwydiannol mewn ymateb i flynyddoedd o doriadau tymor real i'w cyflogau, a'r enghraifft fwyaf diweddar, wrth gwrs, yw'r meddygon iau. Felly, hoffwn hefyd wybod yn benodol sut y bydd gweithredu'r Ddeddf yn chwarae rhan yn y trafodaethau rhwng Cymdeithas Feddygol Prydain a Llywodraeth Cymru i ddod â'r gweithredu i ben.
Yn olaf, felly, yn y sesiwn graffu a gawsom ddoe yn y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb a Chyfiawnder Cymdeithasol, dywedoch na fyddai'r gostyngiad yn y gyllideb yn cael unrhyw effaith ar weithrediad ymarferol y Ddeddf. Felly, a allwch amlinellu a fydd unrhyw un o'r cynigion cyllideb drafft yn gohirio neu'n rhwystro unrhyw ran o'r cynnydd rydych wedi'i amlinellu hyd yma? Diolch.
Diolch, Sioned, for your contribution. Again, thank you to Plaid Cymru for their support in taking through this legislation, and also the constructive challenge in terms of, actually, where we went to on the procurement side of it as well. I hope, as I said in my statement, that we continue to work in that spirit as we develop the guidance that supports and sits around the legislation as we move forward.
Actually, the legislation not only, as we've discussed, really strengthens what we can do with procurement in Wales—. I have said many times that I never dreamed that I'd be standing here or sitting somewhere saying that I thought procurement was really exciting, but there is huge potential there in terms of what we can achieve, and, as I said, the outcomes that we can gain from it. But like you said, the other side of the legislation is actually strengthening a voice for workers through their trade unions within the public sector workplaces in Wales. When we talk about the social partnership duty, and the language around it, around those reasonable steps and setting and delivering your well-being objectives, essentially what that means in practice is, isn't it, that we recognise that the people who provide our public services are experts by experience and, actually, they should have more of a say and a stake in what those services look like.
I know, as my time—I was going to say 'as a trade unionist'; I'm still a trade unionist—before being elected to this place, the amount of times those conversations in workplaces—. People could tell you, they could give you the ideas how you could improve the services, and, actually, it's a way in terms of how we can begin to do that and build on it, which is in, as you say, direct contrast to the approach of the UK Conservative Government, who, like you say, want to ride roughshod over workers' rights and over Wales as well. And in fact, that it is in direct contrast and is, ultimately, in conflict with the way we would want to work in Wales. But I do think that that basis that we've had, that Welsh way of working, that meaningful social partnership that we still need to build on, and we can always improve on—I think that gives us a better basis, a better foundation, to work around. And actually it's those relationships that, when it gets to those difficult times that we've experienced of late, mean we do have those foundations to work around and build upon and, hopefully, resolve and move forward collectively as well.
Diolch, Sioned, am eich cyfraniad. Unwaith eto, diolch i Blaid Cymru am eu cefnogaeth i fynd â'r ddeddfwriaeth hon drwodd, a hefyd yr her adeiladol o ran lle aethom ati ar ochr gaffael hefyd. Gobeithiaf, fel y dywedais yn fy natganiad, ein bod yn parhau i weithio yn yr ysbryd hwnnw wrth i ni ddatblygu'r canllawiau sy'n cefnogi ac yn eistedd o amgylch y ddeddfwriaeth wrth inni symud ymlaen.
A dweud y gwir, mae'r ddeddfwriaeth nid yn unig, fel rydyn ni wedi trafod, wir yn cryfhau'r hyn y gallwn ni ei wneud gyda chaffael yng Nghymru—. Rwyf wedi dweud droeon na freuddwydiais erioed y byddwn i'n sefyll yma nac yn eistedd yn rhywle yn dweud fy mod yn credu bod caffael yn gyffrous iawn, ond mae potensial enfawr yno o ran yr hyn y gallwn ei gyflawni, ac, fel y dywedais, y canlyniadau y gallwn eu hennill ohono. Ond fel y dywedoch, mae ochr arall y ddeddfwriaeth mewn gwirionedd yn cryfhau llais i weithwyr drwy eu hundebau llafur o fewn gweithleoedd y sector cyhoeddus yng Nghymru. Pan fyddwn yn siarad am y ddyletswydd partneriaeth gymdeithasol, a'r iaith o'i chwmpas, o amgylch y camau rhesymol hynny a gosod a chyflawni eich amcanion llesiant, yn y bôn yr hyn y mae hynny'n ei olygu yn ymarferol, yw ein bod yn cydnabod bod y bobl sy'n darparu ein gwasanaethau cyhoeddus yn arbenigwyr drwy brofiad ac, mewn gwirionedd, dylent gael mwy o lais a chyfran o ran sut olwg sydd ar y gwasanaethau hynny.
Gwn, fel fy amser—roeddwn i'n mynd i ddweud 'fel undebwr llafur'; rwy'n dal yn undebwr llafur—cyn cael fy ethol i'r lle yma, faint o weithiau mae'r sgyrsiau hynny mewn gweithleoedd—. Gallai pobl ddweud wrthych, gallent roi'r syniadau i chi sut y gallech wella'r gwasanaethau, ac, mewn gwirionedd, mae'n ffordd o ran sut y gallwn ddechrau gwneud hynny ac adeiladu arno, sydd yn, fel y dywedwch, yn gyferbyniad uniongyrchol i ddull Llywodraeth Geidwadol y DU, sydd, fel y dywedwch, eisiau sathru ar hawliau gweithwyr ac ar Gymru hefyd. Ac mewn gwirionedd, mae hyn mewn cyferbyniad uniongyrchol ac yn y pen draw, yn gwrthdaro â'r ffordd y byddem eisiau gweithio yng Nghymru. Ond rwy'n credu bod y sail honno a gawsom ni, y ffordd Gymreig honno o weithio, y bartneriaeth gymdeithasol ystyrlon honno y mae angen i ni adeiladu arni o hyd, a gallwn ni wella arni bob amser—rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhoi gwell sylfaen i ni weithio arni. Ac mewn gwirionedd mae'r perthnasoedd hynny, pan gawn ni'r cyfnodau anodd hynny yr ydym wedi'u profi'n ddiweddar, yn golygu bod gennym y sylfeini hynny i weithio arnynt ac adeiladu arnynt a, gobeithio, datrys a symud ymlaen gyda'n gilydd hefyd.
You say in your statement that the other procurement rules, apart from construction, will need a great deal more work before you're ready to implement them. I'm particularly interested in the issue of getting our public sector food cleaned up, because ultra-processed food, unfortunately, is killing us all. Now, as Kevin Morgan points out, in a document that he wrote for Welsh Government, it's only 1 per cent of the £7 billion that is spent on public procurement, so it should be perfectly possible to do this. And the conversations I had, over the weekend, with a couple of individuals at a Farmers Union of Wales breakfast, makes me think that this is something that urgently needs to be addressed. Because I'm compiling a list of examples of people admitted to hospital with things like ulcerated colitis, who find that the hospital food they are getting is actually making them sicker, and they are only getting better when they're getting food brought in from home, which is freshly produced. So, this is something that we really do need to get our heads around, because, at the moment, this is our children and people in hospitals who are getting this food, as well as us, in the food we get, the sandwiches we get, in the cafe around the corner. So, this is really urgent, and I'd like some timescales on what work you're doing on it.
Rydych chi'n dweud yn eich datganiad y bydd angen llawer mwy o waith ar y rheolau caffael eraill, ar wahân i'r gwaith adeiladu, cyn i chi fod yn barod i'w gweithredu. Mae gen i ddiddordeb arbennig yn y mater o gael glanhau ein sector bwyd cyhoeddus, oherwydd mae bwyd sydd wedi'i uwch brosesu, yn anffodus, yn ein lladd ni i gyd. Nawr, fel y mae Kevin Morgan yn nodi, mewn dogfen a ysgrifennodd ar gyfer Llywodraeth Cymru, dim ond 1 y cant o'r £7 biliwn sy'n cael ei wario ar gaffael cyhoeddus, felly dylai fod yn berffaith bosibl gwneud hyn. Ac mae'r sgyrsiau a gefais i, dros y penwythnos, gyda chwpl o unigolion mewn brecwast Undeb Amaethwyr Cymru, yn gwneud i mi feddwl bod hyn yn rhywbeth y mae angen mynd i'r afael ag ef ar frys. Oherwydd rydw i'n llunio rhestr o enghreifftiau o bobl sy'n cael eu derbyn i'r ysbyty gyda phethau fel colitis briwiol, sy'n gweld bod y bwyd ysbyty maen nhw'n ei gael yn eu gwneud nhw'n fwy sâl mewn gwirionedd, ac maen nhw ond yn gwella pan fyddan nhw'n cael bwyd sy'n dod i mewn o gartref, sy'n cael ei gynhyrchu'n ffres. Felly, mae hyn yn rhywbeth y mae gwir angen i ni ei ystyried, oherwydd, ar hyn o bryd, ein plant ni a'n pobl ni mewn ysbytai sy'n cael y bwyd hwn, yn ogystal â ni, bwyd rydyn ni'n ei gael, y brechdanau rydyn ni'n eu cael, yn y caffi rownd y gornel. Felly, mae hyn yn fater brys, a hoffwn gael ychydig o amserlenni o ran pa waith rydych chi'n ei wneud arno.
I thank Jenny Rathbone, both for the role you play as committee Chair, scrutinising this legislation just a year ago, in Stage 2 committee, but also in terms of I know this is something you're a passionate advocate on, and particularly around food procurement, and the opportunities that procurement does offer to actually meet those challenges, as you say. Socially responsible procurement is about seeking to maximise achieving the well-being goals, through those public contracts and the power of the public purse. And, as you said—I think you touched on all of this, Jenny—food is a category of procurement spend, where all of those well-being goals are important. So, whether that's improving health outcomes, supporting the local economies, taking global responsibility for reducing carbon in our carbon footprint, safeguarding biodiversity, and also, ultimately, protecting employment rights of the people that are there producing the food that we all depend on as well.
So, we are in the process of developing that statutory guidance and regulations to support the social responsible procurement duties in the Act, and that will include case studies to share good practice in socially responsible food procurement. So, that will progress over the next months, while we continue to work in the same way, in partnership. So, I'll be more than happy, Jenny, if you're interested, to pick up outside of the Siambr, to actually, perhaps, set up a meeting with you and other interested Members, to talk through the aspects that you're most interested in as well.
Diolch i Jenny Rathbone, am y rôl rydych chi'n ei chwarae fel Cadeirydd y pwyllgor, yn craffu ar y ddeddfwriaeth hon flwyddyn yn ôl, yng Ngham 2, ond hefyd o ran fy mod i'n gwybod bod hyn yn rhywbeth rydych chi'n frwd drosto, ac yn enwedig o ran caffael bwyd, a'r cyfleoedd y mae caffael yn eu cynnig i gwrdd â'r heriau hynny mewn gwirionedd, Fel rydych chi'n ei ddweud. Mae caffael cymdeithasol gyfrifol yn ymwneud â cheisio sicrhau'r nodau llesiant mwyaf posibl, trwy'r contractau cyhoeddus hynny a phŵer y pwrs cyhoeddus. Ac, fel y dywedoch—rwy'n credu eich bod wedi cyffwrdd â hyn i gyd, Jenny—mae bwyd yn gategori o wariant caffael, lle mae'r holl nodau llesiant hynny yn bwysig. Felly, p'un a yw hynny'n gwella canlyniadau iechyd, cefnogi'r economïau lleol, cymryd cyfrifoldeb byd-eang dros leihau carbon yn ein hôl troed carbon, diogelu bioamrywiaeth, a hefyd, yn y pen draw, diogelu hawliau cyflogaeth y bobl sydd yno yn cynhyrchu'r bwyd yr ydym i gyd yn dibynnu arno hefyd.
Felly, rydym wrthi'n datblygu'r canllawiau a'r rheoliadau statudol hynny i gefnogi'r dyletswyddau caffael cyfrifol cymdeithasol yn y Ddeddf, a bydd hynny'n cynnwys astudiaethau achos i rannu arfer da mewn caffael bwyd cymdeithasol gyfrifol. Felly, bydd hynny'n symud ymlaen dros y misoedd nesaf, wrth i ni barhau i weithio yn yr un ffordd, mewn partneriaeth. Felly, byddaf yn fwy na hapus, Jenny, os oes gennych ddiddordeb, i barhau y tu allan i'r Siambr, i, efallai, sefydlu cyfarfod gyda chi ac Aelodau eraill sydd â diddordeb, i siarad am yr agweddau y mae gennych y diddordeb mwyaf ynddynt hefyd.
Like you, Minister, we got very interested in public procurement about a year ago, but, obviously, the Act came into force. As you remember, we had a lively discussion around public procurement targets. Could you give us an update as to where you're at with that now? There was a debate about whether or not public procurement was 52 per cent currently. Do we know if that's improving in Wales? Do we know if that's going up in Wales, or not? Is it helping to create more jobs? Are we using the Welsh pound and Welsh public procurement to be able to increase that spending locally? And also, with the level of data that you're collecting now and part of the reporting that you'll be doing, are you building up a place to be able to properly monitor how public procurement is happening in Wales? Diolch.
Fel chi, Gweinidog, roedd gennym ddiddordeb mawr mewn caffael cyhoeddus tua blwyddyn yn ôl, ond, yn amlwg, daeth y Ddeddf i rym. Fel y cofiwch, cawsom drafodaeth fywiog ynghylch targedau caffael cyhoeddus. A allech chi roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i ni o beth yw eich sefyllfa o ran hynny nawr? Cafwyd dadl ynghylch a oedd caffael cyhoeddus yn 52 y cant ar hyn o bryd ai peidio. Ydyn ni'n gwybod os yw hynny'n gwella yng Nghymru? Ydyn ni'n gwybod a yw hynny'n mynd i fyny yng Nghymru, ai peidio? A yw'n helpu i greu mwy o swyddi? Ydyn ni'n defnyddio punt Cymru a chaffael cyhoeddus Cymru i allu cynyddu'r gwariant hwnnw'n lleol? A hefyd, gyda lefel y data rydych chi'n ei gasglu nawr a rhan o'r adrodd y byddwch chi'n ei wneud, a ydych chi'n adeiladu lle i allu monitro'n iawn sut mae caffael cyhoeddus yn digwydd yng Nghymru? Diolch.
Diolch, Peredur. As you said, there was lively discussion throughout the process of this legislation, and amendments were made to the Bill during scrutiny to strengthen the annual reporting process and the requirements in the legislation to publish the information that contract authorities will need and those metrics that you talk about in terms of Welsh suppliers and being able to monitor that impact and grow the impact and the benefits. So, defining what is meant by 'Welsh supplier' and measuring the local economic impact of our procurement spend, as we've talked about before, are things that we aspire to, but they're not necessarily straightforward tasks. So, I can update that a range of collaborative work is under way and proposals for embedding the data requirements into regulations, alongside the other well-being metrics, is being taken forward in social partnership, as you would expect, and consultation with those affected by the requirements.
This is also going to involve things around actually looking at—. So, we want to measure spend with Welsh suppliers and the impact beyond that first tier of spend on our local economies. That's being developed, and that work also involves colleagues working on changes to the IT systems, which are under way, to support the UK-led Procurement Act 2023 and procurement colleagues in the public sector. So, this is going to bring together the outcome of further collaborative work and wider well-being metrics to inform the development of regulations. As it sounds, it is complex and challenging work, but work that we're very much committed to. And I know that I'm due to meet the designated Member very soon, with my colleague the Minister for Finance and Local Government, to talk through the next steps. But, obviously, we're happy that we could have a broader meeting as well, if you wish to have a broader meeting to talk that through with those who perhaps are more technical experts in it and working on it than I am. Diolch.
Diolch, Peredur. Fel y dywedoch chi, bu trafodaeth fywiog drwy gydol proses y ddeddfwriaeth hon, a gwnaed gwelliannau i'r Bil yn ystod y broses graffu i gryfhau'r broses adrodd flynyddol a'r gofynion yn y ddeddfwriaeth i gyhoeddi'r wybodaeth y bydd ei hangen ar awdurdodau contract a'r metrigau hynny yr ydych yn siarad amdanynt o ran cyflenwyr Cymru a gallu monitro'r effaith honno a thyfu'r effaith a'r manteision. Felly, mae diffinio'r hyn a olygir gan 'gyflenwr o Gymru' a mesur effaith economaidd leol ein gwariant caffael, fel yr ydym wedi siarad amdanynt o'r blaen, yn bethau yr ydym yn dyheu amdanynt, ond nid ydynt o reidrwydd yn dasgau syml. Felly, gallaf ddiweddaru bod ystod o waith cydweithredol ar y gweill ac mae cynigion ar gyfer ymgorffori'r gofynion data mewn rheoliadau, ochr yn ochr â'r metrigau llesiant eraill, yn cael eu datblygu mewn partneriaeth gymdeithasol, fel y byddech yn ei ddisgwyl, ac ymgynghori â'r rhai y mae'r gofynion yn effeithio arnynt.
Mae hyn hefyd yn mynd i gynnwys pethau yn ymwneud ag edrych mewn gwirionedd ar—. Felly, rydym am fesur gwariant gyda chyflenwyr Cymru a'r effaith y tu hwnt i'r haen gyntaf honno o wariant ar ein heconomïau lleol. Mae hynny'n cael ei ddatblygu, ac mae'r gwaith hwnnw hefyd yn cynnwys cydweithwyr sy'n gweithio ar newidiadau i'r systemau TG, sydd ar y gweill, i gefnogi Deddf Caffael 2023 dan arweiniad y DU a chydweithwyr caffael yn y sector cyhoeddus. Felly, mae hyn yn mynd i ddod â chanlyniad rhagor o waith cydweithredol a metrigau llesiant ehangach at ei gilydd i lywio'r gwaith o ddatblygu rheoliadau. Fel mae'n swnio, mae'n waith cymhleth a heriol, ond yn waith yr ydym wedi ymrwymo'n gryf iddo. Ac rwy'n gwybod fy mod i i fod i gwrdd â'r Aelod dynodedig yn fuan iawn, gyda fy nghyd-Weinidog, y Gweinidog Cyllid a Llywodraeth Leol, i drafod y camau nesaf. Ond, yn amlwg, rydym yn hapus y gallem gael cyfarfod ehangach hefyd, os ydych chi eisiau cael cyfarfod ehangach i drafod hynny gyda'r rhai sydd efallai yn arbenigwyr mwy technegol na fi er fy mod yn gweithio ar hynny. Diolch.
Diolch i'r Dirprwy Weinidog.
I thank the Deputy Minister.
Mae eitem 7 wedi ei ohirio.
Item 7 has been postponed.
Felly, symudwn ni ymlaen at eitem 8, sef datganiad gan Weinidog y Gymraeg ac Addysg: mynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi ar gyrhaeddiad. Dwi'n galw ar y Gweinidog i wneud y datganiad. Jeremy Miles.
So, we'll move on to item 8, which is a statement by the Minister for Education and the Welsh Language on tackling the impact of poverty on attainment. I call on the Minister to make his statement. Jeremy Miles.
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro. Mae mynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi ar gyrhaeddiad addysgol yn ganolog i'n cenhadaeth genedlaethol ym maes addysg. Rydyn ni wedi gwneud cynnydd, a dwi am roi ar gof a chadw fy niolch i'r gweithlu addysg am eu holl waith. Er bod y Sefydliad ar gyfer Cydweithrediad a Datblygiad Economaidd wedi nodi’n ddiweddar fod y bwlch rhwng pobl o ran cyfleoedd a thegwch yn llai yng Nghymru nag mewn rhannau eraill o'r Deyrnas Unedig, neu wledydd eraill yr OECD, dwi’n gwybod mai cynyddu y mae’r bwlch wedi ei wneud, nid lleihau, ers y pandemig. Mae mwy eto i'w wneud, a heddiw, wrth inni gyhoeddi ein strategaeth tlodi plant, dwi am roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am y gwaith hwnnw i ddangos y cynnydd sydd wedi'i wneud, a'r heriau sy'n dal i'n hwynebu.
Yn ganolog i'r Cwricwlwm i Gymru a'r system anghenion dysgu ychwanegol mae galluogi pob dysgwr i wneud cynnydd i'w lawn botensial. Rydyn ni'n gwybod bod addysgu a dysgu o ansawdd yn hanfodol i wella lefelau cyrhaeddiad. Gan gydnabod hyn, fe wnaethon ni sicrhau bod athrawon dan hyfforddiant yn deall y cysylltiadau rhwng tlodi a chyrhaeddiad; fe wnaethon ni adnewyddu'r meini prawf ar gyfer rhaglenni addysg gychwynol athrawon, gan ddechrau o fis Medi eleni; ac fe wnaethon ni hefyd gynnwys gofynion i ddatblygu gwerthoedd, gwybodaeth, sgiliau ac agweddau i fodloni blaenoriaethau fel mynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi ar gyrhaeddiad. Gwnaethon ni sefydlu'r radd Feistr genedlaethol mewn addysg, â modiwlau penodol ar degwch ac effaith tlodi ar gyrhaeddiad. Datblygodd prifysgolion y llwybr a gafodd ei achredu ym mis Rhagfyr 2022 ac a oedd ar gael i'w addysgu o fis Medi llynedd.
Gwnaethon ni benodi saith pennaeth eithriadol yn hyrwyddwyr cyrhaeddiad, gan weithio gydag ysgolion i fynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi a datblygu ein model cydweithredol o welliant. Fe ddangosodd y cynllun peilot byr ei werth, a dwi am ystyried nawr sut i ehangu ac ymestyn y peilot ar gyfer y flwyddyn academaidd nesaf, er mwyn profi’n llawn rai o’r canfyddiadau cychwynnol. Ac i gefnogi ein gwaith, gwnaethon ni lunio contract gyda'r Sefydliad Gwaddol Addysgol, sy'n cael ei gydnabod am ei arferion gorau rhyngwladol o ran mynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi ar gyflawniad addysgol.
Ochr yn ochr â hyn, fe wnaethom ni gomisiynu gwaith ymchwil i ailedrych ar anawsterau recriwtio athrawon i ardaloedd mwy heriol, ac ystyried hyd a lled y defnydd o addysgu cyrhaeddiad cymysg a'i effaith. Mae'r adroddiadau hyn nawr wedi dod i law, ac fe fyddwn ni'n ystyried eu canfyddiadau nhw a'r camau nesaf dros y misoedd i ddod.
Thank you, acting Deputy Presiding Officer. Tackling the impact of poverty on educational attainment is central to our national mission in education. We have made progress, and I want to put on record my thanks to the education workforce for all their work. While the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development have recently highlighted that the equity gap in Wales is smaller than in other parts of the United Kingdom, or other OECD countries, I know that the gap has grown, rather than narrowed, since the pandemic. There remains more to be done, and today, as we publish our child poverty strategy, I want to provide an update on that work to show the progress that has been made and the challenges that we still face.
Central to the Curriculum for Wales and the additional learning needs system is that every learner is enabled to make progress to their full potential. We know that high-quality teaching and learning are critical to improving attainment. And recognising this, we ensured that student teachers understand the links between poverty and attainment; we refreshed the criteria for initial teacher training programmes, starting from September 2024; and we also included requirements for them to develop values, knowledge, skills and attitudes to meet priorities such as tackling the impact of poverty on attainment. We established the national Master’s in education, with specific modules on equity and the impact of poverty on attainment. Universities developed the pathway, which received accreditation in December 2022, and was available for teaching from September 2023.
We appointed seven exceptional headteachers as attainment champions, working with schools in order to tackle the impact of poverty and to develop our co-operative model of improvement. The brief pilot scheme showed its value, and I now want to consider how we can extend and expand the pilot for the next academic year, in order to fully test some of the initial findings. And, to support our work, we formed a contract with the Education Endowment Foundation, which is recognised for its international best practice on tackling the impact of poverty on educational achievement.
Alongside this, we commissioned research to review the difficulties of recruiting teachers into more challenging areas, and to scope the impact of mixed attainment teaching. These reports have now been received, and we will be considering their findings and the next steps over coming months.
Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro, to support children to grow, aspire and thrive we need to ensure that they are rooted in a strong learning environment, with affirmation at school, at home and in their community. Our ambition is for all schools to be community focused. This year, we are investing £6.5 million to increase the number of family engagement officers in schools, and continue to fund a trial of community focused schools managers, supporting engagement between schools and communities. We also published guidance to support schools to develop their own community-focused school approaches, and I started my day today at Maindee Primary School in Newport, in the constituency of my friend John Griffiths, seeing the outstanding work that they do there to create partnerships to support parents and the wider community, enjoying a parents affordable cookery class as part of the extensive offer at the school.
Alongside this, we support children and families with some of the wider costs they face. We've continued the roll out of universal free school meals for all primary pupils, and we've undertaken a communications campaign on ‘Claim what's yours’ as part of the roll-out of universal primary free school meals. We also expanded our school holiday enrichment programme, which saw 175 schemes run during the summer.
The pupil development grant also has a key role to play in tackling the impact of poverty. Year on year, we extended it to reflect increases in eligible for free school meals learners. Funding of £128 million has been allocated in 2023-24, with a further £13.6 million for the school essentials grant, making a huge difference to lower income families.
As we strive towards high standards and aspirations for all learners, it’s important that we retain our focus on improving literacy and numeracy. In March last year, we published a toolkit to support schools and settings to develop and embed their own whole-school approach to achieving high standards of oracy and reading. In November, we updated this toolkit, clarifying our commitment to the systematic and consistent teaching of phonics. At the same time, we published a mathematics and numeracy plan, setting out actions to support meaningful improvement in learning. Our whole-school approach to emotional and mental well-being also continues to be a priority, recognising the link between well-being and learning.
Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro, the facts and figures on the appalling numbers of children living in poverty are well known. It is not a unique issue for Wales; the cost-of-living crisis and austerity measures imposed by the UK Government affect all parts of the UK. And whilst the Welsh Government does not hold all the levers to tackle the problem, we have placed tackling poverty at the heart of our programme for government. Our policies and activity, including across education, are scrutinised through this lens, and I am pleased that closing the attainment gap is central to our child poverty strategy.
Building on the work already under way, the strategy includes commitments to: accelerate work with Estyn and school improvement partners to ensure education is a cost-neutral experience; re-focus work with Estyn and partners to tackle barriers to implementing approaches that poverty-proof children’s experience of school, creating inclusive education environments; support schools to develop as community-focused schools, responding to the needs of their community and building a strong partnership with families; and work with regional partnership boards to achieve a whole-system approach to mental health and well-being across education and other sectors.
In late spring, the Welsh Government will publish further information on reading and numeracy attainment, including information on demographic differences, following on from the high-level analysis that I published in the autumn. And I commit to continuing to track and to be transparent about our national progress. This Government will always strive to ensure that our children and young people get the best start in life, and are supported to reach their potential. Every single child deserves high standards and aspirations, and we are determined to deliver that for them.
Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro, i gefnogi plant i dyfu, dyheu a ffynnu, mae angen i ni sicrhau eu bod nhw wedi'u gwreiddio mewn amgylchedd dysgu cryf, gyda chadarnhad yn yr ysgol, gartref ac yn eu cymuned. Ein huchelgais yw i bob ysgol ganolbwyntio ar y gymuned. Eleni, rydym yn buddsoddi £6.5 miliwn i gynyddu nifer y swyddogion ymgysylltu â theuluoedd mewn ysgolion, ac yn parhau i ariannu treial o reolwyr ysgolion sy'n canolbwyntio ar y gymuned, gan gefnogi ymgysylltiad rhwng ysgolion a chymunedau. Gwnaethom hefyd gyhoeddi canllawiau i gefnogi ysgolion i ddatblygu eu dulliau ysgol eu hunain sy'n canolbwyntio ar y gymuned, a dechreuais fy niwrnod heddiw yn Ysgol Gynradd Maendy yng Nghasnewydd, yn etholaeth fy ffrind John Griffiths, gan weld y gwaith rhagorol y maen nhw'n ei wneud yno i greu partneriaethau i gefnogi rhieni a'r gymuned ehangach, gan fwynhau dosbarth coginio fforddiadwy i rieni fel rhan o'r arlwy helaeth yn yr ysgol.
Ochr yn ochr â hyn, rydym yn cefnogi plant a theuluoedd gyda rhai o'r costau ehangach y maen nhw'n eu hwynebu. Rydym wedi parhau i gyflwyno prydau ysgol am ddim cyffredinol ar gyfer pob disgybl cynradd, ac rydym wedi cynnal ymgyrch gyfathrebu ar 'Hawlio'r Hyn sy'n ddyledus i chi' fel rhan o'r broses o gyflwyno prydau ysgol am ddim cyffredinol mewn ysgolion cynradd. Gwnaethom hefyd ehangu ein rhaglen cyfoethogi gwyliau ysgol, a welodd 175 o gynlluniau yn cael eu cynnal dros yr haf.
Mae gan y grant datblygu disgyblion rôl allweddol i'w chwarae hefyd wrth fynd i'r afael ag effaith tlodi. O flwyddyn i flwyddyn, gwnaethom ei ymestyn i adlewyrchu cynnydd mewn dysgwyr sy'n gymwys i gael prydau ysgol am ddim. Mae cyllid o £128 miliwn wedi'i ddyrannu yn 2023-24, a £13.6 miliwn arall ar gyfer y grant hanfodion ysgol, gan wneud gwahaniaeth enfawr i deuluoedd incwm is.
Wrth i ni ymgeisio tuag at safonau uchel a dyheadau ar gyfer pob dysgwr, mae'n bwysig ein bod yn cadw ein ffocws ar wella llythrennedd a rhifedd. Ym mis Mawrth y llynedd, fe wnaethom gyhoeddi pecyn cymorth i gefnogi ysgolion a lleoliadau i ddatblygu ac ymgorffori eu dull ysgol gyfan eu hunain o gyflawni safonau uchel o lefaredd a darllen. Ym mis Tachwedd, gwnaethom ddiweddaru'r pecyn cymorth hwn, gan egluro ein hymrwymiad i addysgu ffoneg yn systematig ac yn gyson. Ar yr un pryd, gwnaethom gyhoeddi cynllun mathemateg a rhifedd, sy'n nodi camau i gefnogi gwelliant ystyrlon mewn dysgu. Mae ein dull ysgol gyfan o ymdrin â lles emosiynol a meddyliol hefyd yn parhau i fod yn flaenoriaeth, gan gydnabod y cysylltiad rhwng lles a dysgu.
Dirprwy Lywydd dros dro, mae'r ffeithiau a'r ffigurau ar y niferoedd echrydus o blant sy'n byw mewn tlodi yn gyfarwydd. Nid yw'n fater unigryw i Gymru; mae'r argyfwng costau byw a'r mesurau cyni a orfodwyd gan Lywodraeth y DU yn effeithio ar bob rhan o'r DU. Ac er nad yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn dal yr holl ysgogiadau i fynd i'r afael â'r broblem, rydym wedi rhoi trechu tlodi wrth wraidd ein rhaglen lywodraethu. Mae ein polisïau a'n gweithgareddau, gan gynnwys ar draws addysg, yn cael eu craffu drwy'r lens hon, ac rwy'n falch bod cau'r bwlch cyrhaeddiad yn ganolog i'n strategaeth tlodi plant.
Gan ategu'r gwaith sydd eisoes ar y gweill, mae'r strategaeth yn cynnwys ymrwymiadau i: gyflymu gwaith gydag Estyn a phartneriaid gwella ysgolion i sicrhau bod addysg yn brofiad cost-niwtral; gwaith ail-bwysleisio gydag Estyn a phartneriaid i fynd i'r afael â rhwystrau i weithredu dulliau sy'n atal tlodi fel nad yw'n effeithio ar brofiadau plant o'r ysgol, gan greu amgylcheddau addysg cynhwysol; cefnogi ysgolion i ddatblygu fel ysgolion sy'n canolbwyntio ar y gymuned, gan ymateb i anghenion eu cymuned a datblygu partneriaeth gref gyda theuluoedd; a gweithio gyda byrddau partneriaeth rhanbarthol i gyflawni dull system gyfan o ymdrin ag iechyd meddwl a lles ar draws sectorau addysg a sectorau eraill.
Ddiwedd y gwanwyn, bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn cyhoeddi rhagor o wybodaeth am gyrhaeddiad darllen a rhifedd, gan gynnwys gwybodaeth am wahaniaethau demograffig, yn dilyn y dadansoddiad lefel uchel a gyhoeddais yn yr hydref. Ac rwy'n ymrwymo i barhau i olrhain a bod yn dryloyw ynghylch ein cynnydd cenedlaethol. Bydd y Llywodraeth hon bob amser yn ymdrechu i sicrhau bod ein plant a'n pobl ifanc yn cael y dechrau gorau mewn bywyd, ac yn cael eu cefnogi i gyrraedd eu potensial. Mae pob plentyn yn haeddu safonau a dyheadau uchel, ac rydym yn benderfynol o gyflawni hynny ar eu cyfer.
Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd (David Rees) i’r Gadair.
The Deputy Presiding Officer (David Rees) took the Chair.
Thank you for your statement, Minister. Poverty, of course, has a massive impact on attainment, with us seeing attainment gaps of 34 per cent at key stage 4 between pupils receiving free school meals and those who don't. The relationship between poverty and education is complex, with a large number of variables of course influencing attainment at school. Education, as we know, is the prime route out of poverty, and a good education can improve life outcomes. A good education can break that cycle of generational poverty. But coming from poverty immediately sets you at that disadvantage from your peers. Unfortunately, this Government has presided over ever-increasing child poverty numbers, as a direct result of not having tackled the root causes of poverty in Wales now for decades. So, I’m sure that we’re all confused as to why a Welsh Labour Government dropped their previous target in 2016 to eradicate poverty in Wales by 2020.
Minister, research from the Education Policy Institute into the impact of educational inequalities across England and Wales, published two years ago, revealed that Welsh schools suffer a wider disadvantage gap that English schools. In Wales, learners are 23 months behind where they should be educationally. Today we’ve seen the release of the Welsh Government’s plan to tackle poverty, and that is welcome, but considering that statistics showed yesterday that child poverty is rising faster in Swansea, Newport and Cardiff than any other city in the UK, it is clear to me, and many others that have commented on today’s plan earlier, that you need to set targets alongside it. Without targets and monitoring, we will not be able to determine whether public money that’s being spent in Wales is reaching those children whose lives are being blighted by it. Can you today commit to setting targets and a monitoring framework, so that we can better track the poverty and its relationship with attainment levels in schools, and which initiatives are working?
Minister, at a time when teachers are having more directives and more added pressures on them than ever before, your statement today outlines how you’re expecting them to do even more now without the substantial funding to follow, and further increasing their workload. You’re now expecting teachers to be experts in tackling children that have poverty issues. Recruitment and retention within the teaching profession is almost at crisis point, and putting even more expectations on teachers will only serve to have a negative impact on this. Wouldn’t you agree that what we need to look at is developing a proper national plan to address attainment, incorporating within it a real need for more counselling and wraparound support to support learners in need, which takes pressure off teachers having to fill those roles that they weren’t employed to do? Wouldn’t you agree that we need some more money direct to school budgets for this outside help and for more staff to help catch up with attainment in reading and core subjects, and of course to address the rise in additional learning needs?
Minister, your whole-school approach to mental health, which you mentioned, has so far been an extraordinarily big let-down, and a lack of a proper plan has led to 22 different approaches to it, and within that, different school-by-school approaches. Even though, of course, you’d expect a degree of that, there’s been no sharing of best practice and what is working and what is not, to help our children and young people. You have failed to address a rise in mental health needs in our schools, which has inadvertently led to an increase in learners skipping school and widening that attainment gap.
I’m also very concerned about the proposed move to all learners being on public transport, which they’ll now be expected to pay for, and which of course will have a massive knock-on effect on attendance and therefore attainment again, particularly for those from less well-off backgrounds. It’s crucial that learners are able to get to school, so they at least have a chance, Minister. Is this something you’re looking to address? Thank you.
Diolch am eich datganiad, Gweinidog. Mae tlodi, wrth gwrs, yn cael effaith enfawr ar gyrhaeddiad, ac rydym yn gweld bylchau cyrhaeddiad o 34 y cant yng nghyfnod allweddol 4 rhwng disgyblion sy'n derbyn prydau ysgol am ddim a'r rhai nad ydynt. Mae'r berthynas rhwng tlodi ac addysg yn gymhleth, ac mae nifer fawr o newidynnau wrth gwrs yn dylanwadu ar gyrhaeddiad yn yr ysgol. Addysg, fel y gwyddom, yw'r prif lwybr allan o dlodi, a gall addysg dda wella canlyniadau bywyd. Gall addysg dda dorri'r cylch hwnnw o dlodi o un cenhedlaeth i'r nesaf. Ond mae dod o dlodi yn eich gosod ar unwaith ar yr anfantais honno o gymharu â'ch cyfoedion. Yn anffodus, mae'r Llywodraeth hon wedi llywyddu dros nifer cynyddol o dlodi plant, o ganlyniad uniongyrchol i beidio â mynd i'r afael ag achosion sylfaenol tlodi yng Nghymru ers degawdau. Felly, rwy'n siŵr ein bod ni i gyd wedi drysu ynghylch pam y gostyngodd Llywodraeth Lafur Cymru eu targed blaenorol yn 2016 i ddileu tlodi yng Nghymru erbyn 2020.
Gweinidog, datgelodd ymchwil gan y Sefydliad Polisi Addysg i effaith anghydraddoldebau addysgol ledled Cymru a Lloegr, a gyhoeddwyd ddwy flynedd yn ôl, fod ysgolion Cymru yn dioddef bwlch anfantais ehangach o'i gymharu ag ysgolion Lloegr. Yng Nghymru, mae dysgwyr 23 mis ar ei hôl hi o ran lle dylen nhw fod yn addysgol. Heddiw rydym wedi gweld cynllun Llywodraeth Cymru yn cael ei ryddhau i fynd i'r afael â thlodi, ac mae hynny i'w groesawu, ond o ystyried bod ystadegau yn dangos ddoe bod tlodi plant yn cynyddu'n gyflymach yn Abertawe, Casnewydd a Chaerdydd nag unrhyw ddinas arall yn y DU, mae'n amlwg i mi, a llawer o rai eraill sydd wedi gwneud sylwadau ar y cynllun heddiw yn gynharach, bod angen i chi osod targedau ochr yn ochr ag ef. Heb dargedau a monitro, ni fyddwn yn gallu penderfynu a yw arian cyhoeddus sy'n cael ei wario yng Nghymru yn cyrraedd y plant hynny y mae eu bywydau yn cael eu difetha ganddo. A allwch chi ymrwymo heddiw i osod targedau a fframwaith monitro, fel y gallwn olrhain tlodi a'i berthynas â lefelau cyrhaeddiad mewn ysgolion yn well, a pha fentrau sy'n gweithio?
Gweinidog, ar adeg pan fo athrawon yn cael mwy o gyfarwyddebau a phwysau ychwanegol arnynt mwy nag erioed o'r blaen, mae eich datganiad heddiw yn amlinellu sut rydych chi'n disgwyl iddyn nhw wneud hyd yn oed yn fwy nawr heb y cyllid sylweddol i'w ddilyn, a chynyddu eu llwyth gwaith ymhellach. Rydych chi nawr yn disgwyl i athrawon fod yn arbenigwyr ar fynd i'r afael â phlant sydd â phroblemau tlodi. Mae recriwtio a chadw o fewn y proffesiwn addysgu bron mewn argyfwng, a bydd rhoi hyd yn oed mwy o ddisgwyliadau ar athrawon ond yn cael effaith negyddol ar hyn. Oni fyddech chi'n cytuno mai'r hyn y mae angen i ni edrych arno yw datblygu cynllun cenedlaethol priodol i fynd i'r afael â chyrhaeddiad, gan ymgorffori ynddo angen gwirioneddol am fwy o gwnsela a chefnogaeth gofleidiol i gefnogi dysgwyr mewn angen, sy'n cymryd pwysau oddi ar athrawon yn gorfod llenwi'r rolau hynny nad oedden nhw'n cael eu cyflogi i'w gwneud? Oni fyddech chi'n cytuno bod angen mwy o arian arnom yn uniongyrchol i gyllidebau ysgolion ar gyfer y cymorth allanol hwn ac i fwy o staff helpu i ddal i fyny â chyrhaeddiad mewn darllen a phynciau craidd, ac wrth gwrs i fynd i'r afael â'r cynnydd mewn anghenion dysgu ychwanegol?
Gweinidog, mae eich dull ysgol gyfan o ymdrin ag iechyd meddwl, y sonioch amdano, hyd yma wedi bod yn eithriadol o siomedig, ac mae diffyg cynllun priodol wedi arwain at 22 dull gwahanol o ymdrin ag ef, ac o fewn hynny, gwahanol ddulliau fesul ysgol. Er y byddech chi, wrth gwrs, yn disgwyl rhywfaint o hynny, ni fu unrhyw rannu arfer gorau a beth sy'n gweithio a beth sydd ddim, i helpu ein plant a'n pobl ifanc. Rydych wedi methu â mynd i'r afael â chynnydd mewn anghenion iechyd meddwl yn ein hysgolion, sydd wedi arwain yn anfwriadol at gynnydd yn nifer y dysgwyr sy'n hepgor ysgol ac ehangu'r bwlch cyrhaeddiad hwnnw.
Rwyf hefyd yn bryderus iawn am y symudiad arfaethedig i bob dysgwr fod ar drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, y disgwylir iddynt dalu amdano nawr, ac a fydd wrth gwrs yn cael sgil-effaith enfawr ar bresenoldeb ac felly cyrhaeddiad eto, yn enwedig i'r rhai o gefndiroedd llai cefnog. Mae'n hanfodol bod dysgwyr yn gallu cyrraedd yr ysgol, fel eu bod o leiaf yn cael cyfle, gweinidog. A yw hyn yn rhywbeth rydych chi'n bwriadu mynd i'r afael ag ef? Diolch.
Well, I think I agreed with the Member up until the end of the first paragraph of her question. There were a number of statements with which I disagree fundamentally. I'll limit my response to a few of the key examples.
In relation to the attainment gap, she makes a point in relation to data that she read, I think, from a couple of years ago, and whilst that data does reflect our understanding as well and the basis of our own analysis in Wales, I know how fond she is of the PISA results, and being able to cite those in the Chamber, so I'm sure she will have read in those results that Wales was closing the attainment gap in distinction to other parts of the UK. I imagine she would welcome that. I actually wouldn't rest on my laurels in relation to that, because I don't think that would reflect the lived experience of many of our young people, coming off the back of COVID in particular, but I think it is worth making that point in the discussion today.
She made a number of points that I think were probably better addressed to my colleague the Minister for Social Justice, and indeed, the Minister for Social Justice addressed that in her contributions earlier, so I'll refer her to those discussions in the Chamber.
She made an important point about wraparound support to ensure that our young people have that additional support for the particular needs that they have. She'll remember the Miller Research project, which analysed interventions right across the UK, in terms of the investment the Welsh Government had made to support our young people providing that additional, as she called it, wraparound support. I think in distinction to other parts of the UK, it's been regarded as very effective here in Wales, and I can give her the assurance that the funding that we had anticipated having to reduce this year, because of the UK Government's austerity budget—the Recruit, Recover and Raise Standards funding, which I know she'll be familiar with, is the fund that supports the employment of temporary teachers—has in fact been increased, rather than decreased this year. So, I'm sure she will welcome that. It makes some contribution, I think, to addressing the needs of young people and it's been particularly well spent, as I'm sure she'll acknowledge, by heads being able to provide a tailored set of interventions and a tailored programme of support for young people in school.
Wel, rwy'n credu fy mod yn cytuno â'r Aelod hyd at ddiwedd paragraff cyntaf ei chwestiwn. Roedd nifer o ddatganiadau yr wyf yn anghytuno â nhw yn sylfaenol. Byddaf yn cyfyngu fy ymateb i rai o'r enghreifftiau allweddol.
O ran y bwlch cyrhaeddiad, mae hi'n gwneud pwynt mewn perthynas â data a ddarllenodd, rwy'n credu, o ychydig flynyddoedd yn ôl, ac er bod y data hwnnw'n adlewyrchu ein dealltwriaeth hefyd ac yn sail i'n dadansoddiad ein hunain yng Nghymru, gwn pa mor hoff yw hi o ganlyniadau PISA, a gallu dyfynnu'r rhain yn y Siambr, felly rwy'n siŵr y bydd hi wedi darllen yn y canlyniadau hynny bod Cymru'n cau'r bwlch cyrhaeddiad yn wahanol i rannau eraill o'r DU. Rwy'n credu y byddai hi'n croesawu hynny. Ni fyddwn yn hunanfodlon ynghylch hynny, oherwydd nid wyf yn credu y byddai hynny'n adlewyrchu profiad byw llawer o'n pobl ifanc, gan ddod ar ôl COVID yn benodol, ond rwy'n credu ei bod yn werth gwneud y pwynt hwnnw yn y drafodaeth heddiw.
Gwnaeth nifer o bwyntiau y mae'n debyg y byddai'n well eu cyfeirio at fy nghyd-Aelod, y Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol, ac yn wir, fe wnaeth y Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol fynd i'r afael â hynny yn ei chyfraniadau yn gynharach, felly fe wnaf ei chyfeirio at y trafodaethau hynny yn y Siambr.
Gwnaeth bwynt pwysig am gefnogaeth gofleidiol i sicrhau bod gan ein pobl ifanc y gefnogaeth ychwanegol honno ar gyfer yr anghenion penodol sydd ganddyn nhw. Bydd hi'n cofio prosiect Miller Research, a ddadansoddodd ymyriadau ledled y DU, o ran y buddsoddiad yr oedd Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'i wneud i gefnogi ein pobl ifanc gan ddarparu'r gefnogaeth gofleidiol ychwanegol hwnnw, fel y galwodd hi ef. Rwy'n credu yn wahanol i rannau eraill o'r DU, mae wedi ei ystyried yn effeithiol iawn yma yng Nghymru, a gallaf roi'r sicrwydd iddi bod yr arian yr oeddem wedi rhagweld y byddai'n rhaid ei leihau eleni, oherwydd cyllideb gyni Llywodraeth y DU—y cyllid Recriwtio, Adfer a Chodi Safonau, y gwn y bydd hi'n gyfarwydd ag ef, y gronfa sy'n cefnogi cyflogi athrawon dros dro—wedi cynyddu mewn gwirionedd, yn hytrach na gostwng eleni. Felly, rwy'n siŵr y bydd hi'n croesawu hynny. Mae'n gwneud rhywfaint o gyfraniad, rwy'n credu, at fynd i'r afael ag anghenion pobl ifanc ac mae wedi ei wario'n arbennig o dda, fel yr wyf yn siŵr y bydd hi'n ei gydnabod, gan benaethiaid yn gallu darparu set o ymyriadau a rhaglen gymorth wedi'i theilwra i bobl ifanc yn yr ysgol.
Diolch, Weinidog, am y datganiad heddiw. Dwi'n croesawu'r cyfle i allu ymateb ar ran Plaid Cymru.
Yn amlwg, mi rydyn ni wedi trafod nifer o weithiau y bwlch cyrhaeddiad hwn. Fel soniodd Laura Anne Jones, mae absenoldeb disgyblion yn parhau yn rhywbeth dwi'n gwybod rydych chi, Weinidog, hefyd yn pryderu'n fawr amdano fo. Ac fel dwi wedi sôn, droeon, mae gen i waith achos o ran y rhanbarth, a dwi'n gwybod am ddysgwyr sydd yn methu â chyrraedd yr ysgol oherwydd bod cost bws yn anfforddiadwy i'w rhieni, ac felly'n colli'r ysgol yn gyson. Dwi'n dal yn clywed am wisg ysgol, bod hwnna'n gallu bod yn rhwystr yn aml iawn. Felly, mae yna nifer o bethau sydd yn trio dod ynghlwm efo'r strategaeth tlodi plant yma, oherwydd rydyn ni'n gwybod o ran dyfodol ein plant fod yna gymaint o bethau ar y funud sydd yn rhwystrau i'n plant a'n pobl ifanc ni.
Rydych chi wedi cyfeirio at nifer o bethau cadarnhaol mae'r Llywodraeth yn eu gwneud ar y funud. Beth fyddwn i'n hoffi gwybod ydy beth ydy effaith rhai o'r pethau sydd wedi bod yn cael eu rhoi ar waith, er enghraifft, yr ymgyrch gyfathrebu y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio ati. A ydy hynny wedi gweld cynnydd yn y nifer o bobl sydd yn hawlio'r hyn y dylen nhw fod yn ei hawlio, ac os felly, faint o gynnydd? Neu, os dydych chi ddim efo'r wybodaeth yna, a oes modd derbyn y wybodaeth?
Hefyd, o ran y cynlluniau yn y gwyliau ac ati, faint wnaeth fynychu, a beth oedd effaith hynny ar y rheini sy'n byw mewn tlodi? Beth ydyn ni wedi'i ddysgu o'r cynlluniau hynny? A oedd yna rwystrau i'r rhai sydd fwyaf angen y gefnogaeth i fedru cael mynediad atyn nhw? Yr un peth efo pethau fel y grant datblygu ysgolion, y grant hanfodion ysgol. Ydyn, maen nhw'n bodoli, ond faint sydd yn cael ei wario o'r arian sydd ar gael? A hefyd, sut ydyn ni'n gweld i ddeall pam fod y rhwystrau yna'n bodoli? Dyw e ddim jest ynglŷn â chyfathrebu, ond pam dydy pobl ddim yn mynd am yr hyn y ddylen nhw fod yn ei gael.
Rydych chi'n sôn am sicrhau bod cost ysgol yn niwtral. Mae yna yn amlwg ganllawiau o ran gwisg ysgol, ond mae o'n amrywio'n fawr ledled Cymru o ran beth mae llywodraethwyr ac ysgolion yn credu sydd yn fforddiadwy. Ydych chi wedi rhoi unrhyw ystyriaeth o ran gwneud y canllawiau'n statudol? Ac yn yr un modd, o ran costau sydd ynghlwm efo pethau sydd yn dod yn fwyfwy poblogaidd y dyddiau hyn fel y prom a rhai tripiau ysgol ac ati, sicrhau bod y cyfle cyfartal yna i bob un o'n dysgwyr ni.
Mae yna rhai ysgolion yn gwneud gwaith gwych o ran ailgylchu gwisg ysgol er mwyn sicrhau bod dysgwyr ddim o dan bwysau i fod yn gwario'n ddrud ar bethau fel Diwrnod y Llyfr, oherwydd rydyn ni'n gwybod bod lot o deuluoedd tlawd ddim yn gyrru'u plant i'r ysgol ar ddyddiau fel yna, oherwydd eu bod nhw methu fforddio gwisgoedd. Wel, mae o'n hollol wirion, onid ydy, ein bod ni mewn sefyllfa lle mae plant yn colli allan ar rywbeth sydd i fod i gyfoethogi eu profiad nhw o fod mewn ysgol oherwydd bod costau ynghlwm â hynna.
Mae yna gymaint sydd yn digwydd, ac yn amlwg rydych chi wedi cyfeirio at brydau ysgol am ddim. Un o'r argymhellion, wrth gwrs, gan y grŵp arbenigol a gomisiynwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru oedd ynglŷn ag ymestyn y ddarpariaeth prydau ysgol am ddim i flynyddoedd 7 i 11 ar gyfer yr aelwydydd hynny sy'n derbyn credyd cynhwysol. Dwi'n deall, wrth gwrs, sefyllfa economaidd Llywodraeth Cymru, ond oes yna gamau'n cael eu cymryd i edrych ar a fydd hyn yn bosib? Oherwydd, yn amlwg, o ran sicrhau bod plant yn cael bwyd yn yr ysgol, a hynny yn yr ysgol uwchradd hefyd, mae hwnnw i’w weld yn rhywbeth sydd yn allweddol bwysig.
Rydych chi hefyd wedi cyfeirio at nifer o adroddiadau ac ymchwil sydd wedi'i gomisiynu, gan ddweud y byddwch chi’n eu hystyried nhw yn y man a dros y misoedd nesaf. A fydd yr ymchwil hwnnw’n cael ei gyhoeddi, oherwydd rydych chi hefyd yn sôn am fod yn dryloyw? Ac, os felly, a fyddwch chi hefyd yn rhoi amserlen yn ei lle o ran pryd i ddisgwyl ymateb y byddwch chi wedi gallu ystyried hynny, er mwyn mynd â’r camau a’r hyn sydd wedi’i ddysgu ymlaen?
Thank you for your statement today, Minister. I welcome the opportunity to respond on behalf of Plaid Cymru.
Clearly, we have discussed this attainment gap many times. As Laura Anne Jones mentioned, pupil absence continues to be something that I know that you, Minister, are also very concerned about. And as I've mentioned many times, I have casework in my region where I'm aware of pupils who can't get to school because the cost of bus travel is not affordable to their parents, so they are regularly missing school. And I still hear that the cost of school uniform can often be a barrier too. So, there are a number of things that relate to the child poverty strategy, because we know in terms of the future of our children that there are so many things that are barriers currently for our children and young people.
You have made reference to a number of positive things that the Government is currently doing. What I would like to know is what is the impact of some of the programmes that have been put in place, for example, the communications campaign that you referred to. Has that led to an increase in the number of people claiming what they're entitled to, and if so, how much progress has been made? Or, if you don't have that information, could you provide it to us?
Also, in terms of holidays schemes, how many did attend and what was the impact of that on those living in poverty? What have we learned from those schemes? Were there any barriers for those who most needed that support in being able to access it? Likewise with the schools development grant, the schools essentials grant. Yes, they do exist, but how much is actually being spent of the funding made available for them? And how can we understand why those barriers exist? It's not just a matter of communication, but why don't people claim what they're entitled to.
You mentioned ensuring that school attendance should be cost neutral. Now, clearly, there is guidance on school uniforms, but it does vary a great deal across Wales in terms of what governors and schools believe is affordable. Have you given any consideration to putting these guidelines on a statutory basis? And, likewise, with costs related to things that are becoming more and more popular these days, such as proms and certain school trips and so on, ensuring that there is equality of opportunity for all of our learners.
There are some schools who do excellent work in recycling school uniforms in order to ensure that learners aren't under pressure to be spending a lot on things like World Book Day, because we know that many of our poorest families don't send their children to school on those days, because they can't afford costumes. Well, it's absurd, isn't it, that we are in a situation where children are missing out on something that's supposed to enhance their experience of being at school because the costs are a barrier to that.
There is so much happening, and obviously you have made reference to free school meals. One of the recommendations, of course, of the expert group commissioned by the Welsh Government was on extending the provision of free school meals to years 7 to 11 for those families in receipt of universal credit. I understand the economic position that the Welsh Government is in, but are any steps being taken to look at whether this will be possible? Because, clearly, in terms of ensuring that children are fed in school, and in secondary school too, that does appear to be something that is crucially important.
You have also referred to a number of reports and research that has been commissioned, and that you will be considering those over the next few months. Will that research be published, because you also mentioned transparency? And, if so, will you be putting a timetable in place, in terms of when we should expect a response once you have considered that, so that we can take those steps and the lessons learned forward?
Diolch i Heledd Fychan am y cwestiynau hynny. Rwy’n credu fy mod i’n cytuno gyda bron bob pwynt y mae hi wedi’i wneud. Mae’r cwestiynau yn rhai teg. Felly, beth rŷn ni’n ei wneud o ran gwisg ysgol? Mae hynny’n gallu bod yn rhwystr, fel rŷn ni’n gwybod. Felly, cyfuniad o ymestyn y grant hanfodion—a byddaf yn hapus i rannu’r rhifau hynny gyda’r Aelod; fe wnaf i ysgrifennu ati am hynny—ond hefyd y canllawiau roedd hi’n sôn amdanyn nhw.
Mae’n rhaid taro rhyw fath o gydbwysedd, os hoffwch chi, o ran y canllawiau hynny. Yn nwylo’r llywodraethwyr a’r penaethiaid yn ein hysgolion ni y mae’r penderfyniadau yma, ond mae disgwyliad eu bod nhw’n mynd i ddilyn y canllawiau rŷn ni’n eu cynnig. Un o’r canllawiau pwysig yna yw ailgylchu gwisgoedd ysgol, a sicrhau bod honno’n ddarpariaeth sydd ar gael ym mhob ysgol. Yn fy mhrofiad personol i, mae hwn yn rhywbeth sy’n gynyddol bresennol yn ein hysgolion ni, bod mwy a mwy ohonyn nhw’n gweld bod hyn yn bwysig, a bod hyn yn aml yn dod oddi wrth y disgyblion eu hunain, lle mae ganddyn nhw rôl efallai, o bryd i’w gilydd, yn cyfrannu at y ddarpariaeth honno. Mae’n un o’r gofynion yn y canllawiau bod hyn yn rhywbeth sydd ar gael ym mhob ysgol.
Gwnaeth yr Aelod ofyn cwestiynau penodol ynglŷn ag effaith cynlluniau cyfathrebu o ran y grant hanfodion ac ymyraethau eraill. Mae’r cynlluniau yma yn ymateb i sylw ar ein rhan ni, efallai bod cyfle i gynyddu’r ddarpariaeth, i gynyddu'r rheini sy’n cynnig am y gefnogaeth yma, y cymorth yma. Rŷn ni yn gweld ei fod e wedi bod yn gadarnhaol.
O ran y cynlluniau dros yr haf, mae darn o waith eisoes yn digwydd ar y cyd rhyngof i a’r Dirprwy Weinidog Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol i edrych ar sut y gallwn ni alinio’r cynlluniau sy’n digwydd o fewn ei phortffolio hi â’r hyn sydd gen i yn fy mhortffolio i, fel ein bod ni’n sicrhau bod cynifer o blant â phosibl yn cael mynediad at hyn, a sicrhau nad ydym yn dyblygu darpariaeth, er enghraifft, a bod alinio pethau yn fwy strategol yn gyfle. Felly, mae’r gwaith yna eisoes yn digwydd, a byddwn i'n disgwyl gweld bod hynny’n sicrhau impact sydd hyd yn oed yn fwy cadarnhaol o’r rhaglenni hynny.
O ran y pwynt y gwnaeth yr Aelod ofyn amdano ynghylch prydiau bwyd am ddim, mae hi’n gwybod mai polisi’r Llywodraeth yw cadw trosolwg dros y canllawiau hynny. Pan fyddwn ni mewn cyfnod pan fydd mwy o adnoddau ar gael i’r Llywodraeth, byddwn yn gallu edrych wedyn ar ymestyn ymhellach. Rŷn ni’n gwybod, fodd bynnag, fod y gost o ymestyn mewn ysgolion uwchradd yn agos at £30 miliwn. Felly mae’n gost sylweddol. Nid oes adnoddau o’r fath gyda ni ar hyn o bryd, ond mae hyn yn un o'r ymyraethau sydd gyda ni yn yr ystod o bethau rŷn ni’n eu gwneud.
Gwnaeth yr Aelod bwynt pwysig am sut rŷn ni’n sicrhau, yn gyffredinol, fod teuluoedd yn gwybod am fudd-daliadau, ac yn cael cyfle i gynnig amdanynt, a bod y profiad o gynnig am fudd-daliadau yn rhywbeth sydd yn barchus. Mae hyn wrth wraidd y gwaith y mae’r Gweinidog Cyfiawnder Cymdeithasol wedi bod yn ei wneud gyda’n cynghorau ni ar draws Cymru, i greu siarter o ran buddiannau Cymreig, fel bod safonau yn cael eu dilyn yn gyson ar draws Cymru, i sicrhau bod y ddarpariaeth yn cael ei hysbysebu ac yn cael ei diwallu a’i darparu mewn ffordd sy’n addas ac yn ofalus o anghenion pobl.
I thank Heledd Fychan for those questions. I agree with almost every point that she made. The questions are fair ones. So, what are we doing in terms of school uniforms? That can be a barrier, as we know. So, it's a combination of extending the essentials grant—and I'll be happy to share the numbers on that with the Member; I'll write to her on that point—but also the guidelines that she talked about.
We do have to strike a kind of balance in those guidelines. It is up to the school headteachers and the governors to make these decisions, but there is an expectation that they do follow the guidelines that we offer. One of the important guidelines is to recycle school uniforms, and to ensue that that's a provision that's available in every school. In my personal experience, this is something that is increasingly present in our schools, that more and more of them see that this is important, and this often comes from the pupils themselves, where they have a role, on occasion, in contributing to that provision. It is one of the requirements in the guidelines that this is available in every school.
The Member asked specific questions about the impact of communication plans in terms of the essentials grant and other interventions. These plans respond to what we have noticed, that there is scope to increase the provision and to increase the numbers applying for this support, this assistance. We have seen that that has been positive.
In terms of schemes over the summer, a piece of work is already under way on a joint basis between myself and the Deputy Minister for Social Services, to see how we can align the schemes within her portfolio with what I have within my portfolio, so that we can ensure that as many children as possible do have access to this provision, and that we don't duplicate provision, for example, and that we align things on a more strategic basis, as an opportunity for us. So, that work is already under way, and I would expect to see that that ensures and delivers an even more positive impact from those programmes.
In terms of the point that the Member raised on free school meals, she knows that the Government's policy is to keep a weather eye on those guidelines. When we are in a position where more resources are available to the Government, we'll be able to look at extending that provision further. We do know, however, that the cost of extending the programme in secondary schools is approaching £30 million. So, it's a significant cost. It's not the kind of resource that we have at present, but this is one of the interventions that we have among a range of things that we are already doing.
The Member made an important point about how we ensure, in general terms, that families know about benefits, and have an opportunity to access them, and that the experience of applying for benefits is a respectable one. This is at the heart of the work that the Minister for Social Justice has been doing with councils across Wales, to create a charter for Welsh benefits, so that standards are applied consistently across Wales, to ensure that the provision is advertised, and is fulfilled and provided in a way that is appropriate and is careful of people's needs.
I'm fascinated that we got 175 school holiday enrichment schemes last summer, and I'm very pleased that we have protected that sum of money in this year's draft budget, but, inevitably, the same amount of money doesn't buy as many bangs for the bucks because of inflation. So, I just wondered whether you think that it's still going to be possible to run as many school schemes, and how we could encourage other agencies or charities that have the interests of children at heart to get involved in this. I find it one of the most wonderful ways of ensuring that all children have some summer holiday, because there's nothing more desperate than when children come back to school in September and they're only able to recount the holiday programme that they experienced while they were with the school in the summer term.
So, the other issue that I think is really crucial to closing the attainment gap is the ability to read, which is an incredibly adult-intensive activity to help children learn to read. We know that these numbers are declining; the numbers of adults who read with children, as far as I can see from the National Literacy Trust, continue to be lower amongst people who have been less well educated themselves. So, it's really important that we bring other adults into school to help teachers ensure that every child learns to read, and I just wondered what we're doing on that.
Finally, what evaluation—
Rwy'n rhyfeddu y cawsom ni 175 o gynlluniau cyfoethogi gwyliau ysgol yr haf diwethaf, ac rwy'n falch iawn ein bod ni wedi diogelu'r swm hwnnw o arian yn y gyllideb ddrafft eleni, ond, yn anochel, nid yw'r un swm o arian yn cael cymaint o gleciau i'r geiniog oherwydd chwyddiant. Felly, tybed a ydych chi'n credu y bydd hi'n dal yn bosibl cynnal cymaint o gynlluniau ysgol, a sut y gallem ni annog asiantaethau neu elusennau eraill sydd â buddiannau plant yn ganolog iddynt i gymryd rhan yn hyn. Gwelaf fod hyn yn un o'r ffyrdd mwyaf rhyfeddol o sicrhau bod pob plentyn yn cael rhywfaint o wyliau haf, oherwydd does dim byd mwy anobeithiol na phan ddaw plant yn ôl i'r ysgol ym mis Medi a'r cwbl y medran nhw gofio yw'r rhaglen wyliau a brofwyd ganddyn nhw pan oedden nhw gyda'r ysgol yn nhymor yr haf.
Felly, y mater arall rwy'n credu sy'n hanfodol iawn i gau'r bwlch cyrhaeddiad yw'r gallu i ddarllen, sy'n weithgaredd anhygoel o ddwys i oedolion i helpu plant i ddysgu darllen. Gwyddom fod y niferoedd hyn yn gostwng; mae nifer yr oedolion sy'n darllen gyda phlant, hyd y gwelaf i gan yr Ymddiriedolaeth Llythrennedd Genedlaethol, yn parhau i fod yn is ymhlith pobl na chawson nhw addysg gystal eu hunain. Felly, mae'n bwysig iawn ein bod ni'n dod ag oedolion eraill i'r ysgol i helpu athrawon i sicrhau bod pob plentyn yn dysgu darllen, a meddwl oeddwn i tybed beth rydym ni'n ei wneud ynghylch hynny.
Yn olaf, pa werthusiad—
Jenny, you've gone way over.
Jenny, rydych chi ymhell y tu hwnt i'ch amser.
What evaluation is planned of the success of the 'Claim what's yours' publicity campaign, to drive up the uptake of benefits?
Pa werthusiad sydd wedi'i gynllunio o lwyddiant yr ymgyrch gyhoeddusrwydd 'Hawliwch yr hyn sy’n ddyledus i chi', er mwyn cynyddu'r nifer sy'n manteisio ar fudd-daliadau?
Well, I thank Jenny Rathbone for those three questions. In relation to the school holiday enrichment programme, I should have responded to Heledd Fychan with this figure—apologies. Last year, the 175 schemes that ran were able to offer just over 11,000 places to children each day. And then, we have, she may remember, increased that budget from, I think, two years ago, so that the provision is quite significantly more extensive now than it was. But the point that she makes is correct, about making sure that we get as much value out of that as possible. That's part of the thinking behind the work that Julie Morgan and I are doing together about how SHEP and the Playworks scheme can work hand in hand. But there is, I think, also an opportunity to make sure that we are able to co-ordinate a number of other provisions that happen at a local level in different communities—there are several in my own constituency and I'm sure that there will be in hers as well. I think there's an opportunity for us to try and align our provision with some of those as well, to make sure that the coverage is there in the way that we need it, and I think that's something I feel very strongly about, certainly.
The point she made about reading, I think, is correct and I do agree with it. We are trialling a number of different approaches to meet the point that she mentioned. So, we're piloting, at the moment, a reading mentoring programme where university students are partnered with primary schools in areas of high deprivation in particular, to encourage, as she was saying, that enjoyment. You know, the motivation to read is the critical thing, isn't it, really? And she's right to say that there is evidence that learners in areas of deprivation are likely to have lower levels of literacy and find reading more challenging. So, we're targeting learners in years 5 and 6 in areas of deprivation and then, through that, hoping to reverse that trend. And that is a pilot at the moment, but I'll want to look closely at that and if there is an opportunity to extend that, I think that would be a very good thing for us to be able to do.
Wel, rwy'n diolch i Jenny Rathbone am y tri chwestiwn hynny. O ran rhaglen gwella gwyliau'r haf, dylwn i fod wedi ymateb i Heledd Fychan gyda'r ffigwr hwn—ymddiheuriadau. Y llynedd, gallodd y 175 o gynlluniau a gynhaliwyd gynnig ychydig dros 11,000 o lefydd i blant bob dydd. Ac yna, rydym ni, mae'n bosib ei bod hi'n cofio, wedi cynyddu'r gyllideb honno o, rwy'n credu, ddwy flynedd yn ôl, fel bod y ddarpariaeth gryn dipyn yn fwy helaeth nawr nag yr oedd. Ond mae'r pwynt mae'n ei wneud yn gywir, ynglŷn â sicrhau ein bod ni'n cael cymaint o werth â phosib o hynny. Mae hynny'n rhan o'r syniad y tu ôl i'r gwaith y mae Julie Morgan a minnau yn ei wneud gyda'n gilydd ynglŷn â sut y gall y Rhaglen Gwella Gwyliau'r Haf a'r cynllun Gwaith Chwarae weithio law yn llaw. Ond mae cyfle hefyd, rwy'n credu, i wneud yn siŵr ein bod yn gallu cydlynu nifer o ddarpariaethau eraill sy'n digwydd yn lleol mewn gwahanol gymunedau—mae sawl un yn fy etholaeth i ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd yna rai yn ei hetholaeth hi hefyd. Rwy'n credu bod cyfle i ni geisio cysoni ein darpariaeth â rhai o'r rheini hefyd, i sicrhau bod y ddarpariaeth yno yn y ffordd y mae ei hangen arnom ni, ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhywbeth rwy'n teimlo'n gryf iawn amdano, yn sicr.
Mae'r pwynt a wnaeth am ddarllen, rwy'n credu, yn gywir ac rwyf yn cytuno ag ef. Rydym yn arbrofi gyda sawl ffordd wahanol i fynd i'r afael â'r pwynt y soniodd amdano. Felly, ar hyn o bryd, rydym ni'n arbrofi gyda rhaglen fentora darllen lle caiff myfyrwyr prifysgol eu paru ag ysgolion cynradd mewn ardaloedd o amddifadedd uchel yn benodol, i annog, fel yr oedd hi'n ei ddweud, y mwynhad hwnnw. Wyddoch chi, y cymhelliant i ddarllen yw'r peth tyngedfennol, onid e, mewn gwirionedd? Ac mae hi'n gywir yn dweud bod tystiolaeth bod dysgwyr mewn ardaloedd difreintiedig yn debygol o fod â lefelau llythrennedd is a chanfod bod darllen yn fwy heriol. Felly, rydyn ni'n targedu dysgwyr ym mlynyddoedd 5 a 6 mewn ardaloedd difreintiedig ac yna, drwy hynny, yn gobeithio gwrthdroi'r duedd honno. Ac mae hynny'n gynllun arbrofol ar hyn o bryd, ond mi fydd arna i eisiau edrych yn fanwl ar hynny ac os oes cyfle i ymestyn hynny, credaf y byddai hynny'n beth da iawn i ni allu ei wneud.
Ac yn olaf, John Griffiths.
And finally, John Griffiths.
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Minister, thank you very much for visiting Maindee Primary School this morning, I thought it was a great way to start the working day. You will have seen first-hand, Minister, the great ethnic diversity of the school and I'm sure that seeing, first-hand, the good work going on and meeting the school team, the pupils and their families will have been a very strong demonstration of the value of that school in tackling attainment issues connected with poverty. I think it's very well recognised actually, Minister, just what good work Maindee primary does, and what great school leadership there is in that primary school. I just wonder, Minister, what Welsh Government is doing to address some of the issues around structures and systems and succession. Because, when you have exceptional leadership, obviously, you do look to the future and how that can be sustained over a period of time, and it's really important that there are structures in place, with Welsh Government working with local authorities and other key partners, so that we can be confident that that progress will not be lost when there is a different school leadership team.
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Gweinidog, diolch yn fawr iawn am ymweld ag Ysgol Gynradd Maendy y bore yma, roeddwn i'n meddwl ei fod yn ffordd wych o ddechrau'r diwrnod gwaith. Byddwch wedi gweld o lygad y ffynnon, Gweinidog, amrywiaeth ethnig wych yr ysgol ac rwy'n siŵr y bu gweld, drosoch chi eich hun, y gwaith da sy'n digwydd a chwrdd â thîm yr ysgol, y disgyblion a'u teuluoedd yn dystiolaeth gref iawn o werth yr ysgol honno wrth fynd i'r afael â materion cyrhaeddiad sy'n gysylltiedig â thlodi. Rwy'n credu fod cryn gydnabyddiaeth mewn gwirionedd, Gweinidog, cymaint o waith da y mae Ysgol Gynradd Maendy yn ei wneud, a pha mor wych yw arweinyddiaeth yr ysgol yn yr ysgol gynradd honno. Tybed beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i fynd i'r afael â rhai o'r materion sy'n ymwneud â strwythurau a systemau ac olyniaeth. Oherwydd, pan fydd gennych chi arweinyddiaeth eithriadol, yn amlwg, rydych chi yn edrych i'r dyfodol a sut y gellir cynnal hynny dros gyfnod o amser, ac mae'n bwysig iawn bod strwythurau ar waith, gyda Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gydag awdurdodau lleol a phartneriaid allweddol eraill, fel y gallwn ni fod yn hyderus na chollir y cynnydd hwnnw pan fydd tîm arweinyddiaeth ysgol gwahanol.
Well, can I just echo the point that John Griffiths has made? It was a fantastic way to start the day at Maindee primary, seeing the work of the young interpreters, who are an incredibly passionate group of young people, who interpret school guidance for parents and families in home languages, and themselves learning new languages in the course of that, which was just fantastic to hear, and the passion they brought to that. Also, I thought this was particularly exciting. When I became education Minister, one of the opportunities, I felt, in the area of community-focused schools was how schools could reach out to parents to bring them into the school in a range of different ways to engage them, yes, in the learning of the children, but also to give them confidence themselves in, perhaps, learning new skills or making new relationships. The two things I set myself as a picture of how this would work well were people coming in to use the libraries and using the IT kit, but also people coming in to use the school kitchens to learn how to cook. That's what we saw this morning, wasn't it—a group of adults learning to cook affordable meals together and making new relationships in doing that.
So, that is fantastic work, but I think he's absolutely correct to say that, too often, really, this depends on the particular vision and passion of an individual head or an individual member of the senior leadership team, or the willingness of the governing body to engage. I think that is part of the challenge, I do accept that. What we are trying to do is, through the guidance that we are issuing, which builds on good, strong case studies of the sort that Maindee provides on the one hand, and, on the other hand, visibility of the capital investment that we're making over the next two years to encourage schools to engage with that so that they can make the adaptations that, sometimes, they need to make. But I think the next stage now is to look at how we can make this more of an expectation, if you like, of governing bodies to consider this as a mainstream part, not simply to make facilities available to the community, essential though that is, but how the school can be more integrated into the lives of families and parents as well. If you like, I think that's the next stage in developing the policy.
Wel, a gaf i ddim ond adleisio'r pwynt mae John Griffiths wedi ei wneud? Roedd yn ffordd wych o ddechrau'r diwrnod yn ysgol gynradd Maendy, gweld gwaith y dehonglwyr ifanc, sy'n grŵp hynod angerddol o bobl ifanc, sy'n dehongli canllawiau ysgol i rieni a theuluoedd yn eu hieithoedd, ac yn dysgu ieithoedd newydd eu hunain yn ystod hynny, a oedd yn wych i'w glywed, a'u hangerdd yn rhan o hynny. Hefyd, roeddwn i'n meddwl bod hyn yn arbennig o gyffrous. Pan ddês i yn Weinidog addysg, un o'r cyfleoedd, y teimlais i, ym maes ysgolion sy'n canolbwyntio ar y gymuned oedd sut y gallai ysgolion estyn allan at rieni i ddod â nhw i'r ysgol mewn amrywiaeth o wahanol ffyrdd i'w cynnwys, ie, yn nysgu'r plant, ond hefyd i roi hyder iddyn nhw yn, efallai, dysgu sgiliau newydd neu wneud cysylltiadau newydd. Y ddau beth a osodais fel darlun i fy hun o sut y byddai hyn yn gweithio'n dda oedd pobl yn dod i mewn i ddefnyddio'r llyfrgelloedd ac yn defnyddio'r pecyn TG, ond hefyd pobl yn dod i mewn i ddefnyddio ceginau'r ysgol i ddysgu sut i goginio. Dyna a welsom ni y bore yma, ynte—grŵp o oedolion yn dysgu coginio prydau fforddiadwy gyda'i gilydd ac yn meithrin perthnasau newydd wrth wneud hynny.
Felly, mae hynny'n waith gwych, ond rwy'n credu ei fod yn hollol gywir i ddweud, yn rhy aml, mewn gwirionedd, fod hyn yn dibynnu ar weledigaeth ac angerdd penodol pennaeth unigol neu aelod unigol o'r uwch dîm arweinyddiaeth, neu barodrwydd y corff llywodraethu i ymgysylltu. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhan o'r her, rwy'n derbyn hynny. Yr hyn yr ydym ni'n ceisio'i wneud yw, trwy'r canllawiau yr ydym ni'n eu dilyn, sy'n adeiladu ar astudiaethau achos da, cadarn, o'r math y mae Maendy yn eu darparu ar y naill law, ac, ar y llaw arall, amlygrwydd y buddsoddiad cyfalaf yr ydym ni'n ei wneud dros y ddwy flynedd nesaf i annog ysgolion i ymgysylltu â hynny fel y gallan nhw wneud yr addasiadau y mae, weithiau, angen iddyn nhw eu gwneud. Ond rwy'n credu mai'r cam nesaf nawr yw edrych ar sut y gallwn ni wneud hyn yn fwy o ddisgwyliad, os mynnwch chi, o gyrff llywodraethu yn ystyried hyn fel rhan brif ffrwd, nid yn unig i sicrhau bod cyfleusterau ar gael i'r gymuned, er mor hanfodol yw hynny, ond sut y gellir integreiddio'r ysgol yn fwy ym mywydau teuluoedd a rhieni hefyd. Os hoffech chi, credaf mai dyna'r cam nesaf wrth ddatblygu'r polisi.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
I thank the Minister.
Eitem 9 heddiw yw datganiad gan y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol: trefniadau uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrryd. Galwaf ar y Gweinidog, Eluned Morgan.
Item 9 today is a statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services on escalation and intervention arrangements. I call on the Minister, Eluned Morgan.
Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd. When I last updated the Senedd about the escalation of maternity and neonatal services at Swansea Bay University Health Board before Christmas, I said I would make a statement about the arrangements for other NHS organisations in the new year. There's no doubt that the NHS in Wales, just like health services in other parts of the UK, is under intense pressure. Demand for healthcare services has increased massively not just since the end of the emergency phase of the pandemic, but over the last decade. Every month, the NHS has around 2 million contacts with people in Wales. That's an incredible level of activity for a country of 3.1 million people. There were more than 1.4 million referrals for new out-patient appointments in 2022-23, almost a third higher than 10 years ago.
But the NHS hasn’t stood still during that time. It's constantly looking and finding new and improved ways to meet the needs of Wales’s population. The six goals for emergency and urgent care programme is a great example of how health boards are developing new services to prevent people from going to emergency departments, encouraging them to use alternative services where they can be better cared for and treated elsewhere.
Now, it’s part of my job to make sure the health service delivers the best possible care and the best possible outcomes for people in Wales. But I delegate the day-to-day responsibility for delivery of healthcare to health boards who can and do respond to the local needs and circumstances of their populations. As health Minister, a part of my responsibility involves taking serious decisions about whether NHS organisations need additional support and oversight from the Welsh Government, to improve care and outcomes, in line with the escalation and intervention arrangements. Escalating an NHS organisation is an important way of ensuring it understands the problems and challenges it's facing across the organisation or in a particular service. It gives us an opportunity to point out what needs to be done, with our support, to make improvements. It's not a form of punishment, but a recognition we collectively need to work together to make things better. This can be done through increased scrutiny, additional reviews, service interventions from the NHS executive and, if needed, independent support.
Decisions about escalation and de-escalation are matters for the Welsh Government. These are taken after assessing a wide range of evidence and information, including the intelligence shared by the tripartite partners: the Welsh Government, Audit Wales, and Health Inspectorate Wales. My officials then make recommendations to me as the Minister for Health and Social Services about escalation levels. Today, I've published the refreshed NHS Wales oversight and escalation framework. There are now five levels: routine arrangements; areas of concern—which is a new level to prevent further escalation; enhanced monitoring; targeted intervention; and, the highest rate of escalation, special measures. The new framework sets out the process by which the Welsh Government maintains oversight of NHS bodies and gains assurance across the system. It describes the escalation, de-escalation and intervention process in more detail, building on the learning from our experiences with Cwm Taf Morgannwg and Betsi Cadwaladr university health boards.
All health organisations are facing very real financial challenges due to the fact that their budgets are effectively worth less today than they were in the past due to inflation and other factors. But whilst all trusts, including the Welsh ambulance service, Velindre, Public Health Wales and the two special health authorities, Digital Health and Care Wales and Health Education and Improvement Wales, have been able to remain in routine monitoring, Members will remember that, due to the failure of health boards to balance their budgets, they were all placed in enhanced monitoring in relation to planning and finance back in September 2023.
Llywydd, I will now set out the changes I am making.
Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd. Pan roddais y diweddariad diwethaf i'r Senedd am y cynnydd mewn gwasanaethau mamolaeth a newydd-anedig ym Mwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Bae Abertawe cyn y Nadolig, dywedais y byddwn yn gwneud datganiad am y trefniadau ar gyfer sefydliadau GIG eraill yn y flwyddyn newydd. Nid oes amheuaeth bod y GIG yng Nghymru, yn union fel gwasanaethau iechyd mewn rhannau eraill o'r DU, dan bwysau dwys. Mae'r galw am wasanaethau gofal iechyd wedi cynyddu'n aruthrol nid yn unig ers diwedd cyfnod brys y pandemig, ond dros y degawd diwethaf. Bob mis, mae'r GIG yn ymwneud ag oddeutu 2 filiwn o bobl yng Nghymru. Mae hynny'n lefel anhygoel o weithgaredd i wlad o 3.1 miliwn o bobl. Roedd mwy na 1.4 miliwn o atgyfeiriadau ar gyfer apwyntiadau cleifion allanol newydd yn 2022-23, bron i draean yn fwy na 10 mlynedd yn ôl.
Ond nid yw'r GIG wedi sefyll yn llonydd yn ystod y cyfnod hwnnw. Mae wastad yn ystyried ac yn canfod ffyrdd newydd a gwell o ddiwallu anghenion poblogaeth Cymru. Mae'r chwe nod ar gyfer rhaglen gofal brys ac mewn argyfwng yn enghraifft wych o sut mae byrddau iechyd yn datblygu gwasanaethau newydd i atal pobl rhag mynd i adrannau brys, gan eu hannog i ddefnyddio gwasanaethau eraill lle gellir gofalu amdanyn nhw a'u trin yn well mewn mannau eraill.
Nawr, mae'n rhan o'm swydd i sicrhau bod y gwasanaeth iechyd yn darparu'r gofal gorau posibl a'r canlyniadau gorau posibl i bobl yng Nghymru. Ond rwy'n dirprwyo'r cyfrifoldeb beunyddiol am ddarparu gofal iechyd i fyrddau iechyd a all ac sy'n ymateb i anghenion ac amgylchiadau lleol eu poblogaethau. A minnau'n Weinidog Iechyd, mae rhan o'm cyfrifoldeb yn cynnwys gwneud penderfyniadau difrifol ynghylch a oes angen cymorth a goruchwyliaeth ychwanegol ar sefydliadau'r GIG gan Lywodraeth Cymru, i wella gofal a chanlyniadau, yn unol â'r trefniadau uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrryd. Mae uwchgyfeirio un o sefydliadau'r GIG yn ffordd bwysig o sicrhau ei fod yn deall y problemau a'r heriau y mae'n eu hwynebu ar draws y sefydliad neu mewn gwasanaeth penodol. Mae'n rhoi cyfle i ni dynnu sylw at yr hyn sydd angen ei wneud, gyda'n cefnogaeth, i wneud gwelliannau. Nid yw'n fath o gosb, ond cydnabyddiaeth y mae angen i ni weithio gyda'n gilydd i wella pethau. Gellir gwneud hyn drwy fwy o graffu, adolygiadau ychwanegol, ymyriadau gwasanaeth gan weithrediaeth y GIG ac, os oes angen, cefnogaeth annibynnol.
Mae penderfyniadau am uwchgyfeirio ac isgyfeirio yn faterion i Lywodraeth Cymru. Gwneir y penderfyniadau hyn ar ôl asesu ystod eang o dystiolaeth a gwybodaeth, gan gynnwys yr wybodaeth a rennir gan y tri phartner: Llywodraeth Cymru, Archwilio Cymru, ac Arolygiaeth Iechyd Cymru. Yna mae fy swyddogion yn gwneud argymhellion i mi fel y Gweinidog Iechyd a Gwasanaethau Cymdeithasol ynghylch lefelau uwchgyfeirio. Heddiw, rwyf wedi cyhoeddi fframwaith trosolwg a chynnydd newydd GIG Cymru. Erbyn hyn mae pum lefel: trefniadau arferol; meysydd sy'n peri pryder—sy'n lefel newydd i atal gwaethygu pellach; monitro uwch; ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu; ac, y gyfradd uchaf o uwchgyfeirio, mesurau arbennig. Mae'r fframwaith newydd yn nodi'r broses o ran sut mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn goruchwylio cyrff y GIG ac yn cael sicrwydd ar draws y system. Mae'n disgrifio'r broses uwchgyfeirio, isgyfeirio ac ymyrryd yn fanylach, gan adeiladu ar y dysgu o'n profiadau gyda byrddau iechyd prifysgol Cwm Taf Morgannwg a Betsi Cadwaladr.
Mae pob sefydliad iechyd yn wynebu heriau ariannol gwirioneddol oherwydd y ffaith bod eu cyllidebau i bob pwrpas yn werth llai heddiw nag oedden nhw yn y gorffennol oherwydd chwyddiant a ffactorau eraill. Ond er bod pob ymddiriedolaeth, gan gynnwys gwasanaeth ambiwlans Cymru, Felindre, Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru a'r ddau awdurdod iechyd arbennig, Iechyd a Gofal Digidol Cymru ac Addysg a Gwella Iechyd Cymru, wedi gallu parhau yn y categori monitro arferol, bydd yr Aelodau'n cofio, oherwydd methiant byrddau iechyd i gydbwyso eu cyllidebau, eu bod i gyd wedi'u gosod yn y categori monitro uwch o ran cynllunio a chyllid yn ôl ym mis Medi 2023.
Llywydd, byddaf nawr yn nodi'r newidiadau yr wyf yn eu gwneud.
Fel pob bwrdd iechyd arall, mae Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Hywel Dda yn wynebu heriau o ran cyllid a chynllunio, ond mae hyn bellach yn effeithio ar ei berfformiad. Mae angen i'r bwrdd wneud rhai penderfyniadau anodd am ei strategaeth a’i gynllun ar gyfer gwasanaethau clinigol er mwyn sicrhau gwelliannau cynaliadwy. Dwi’n credu y byddai’r bwrdd yn elwa o gymorth ychwanegol wedi’i dargedu ac, felly, dwi wedi penderfynu rhoi’r sefydliad cyfan o dan statws ymyrraeth wedi’i thargedu.
Like all other health boards, Hywel Dda University Health Board is facing challenges relating to finance and planning, but this is now impacting on its performance. The health board needs to take some difficult decisions relating to its clinical services strategy and plan to support sustainable improvements. I believe that the board would benefit from additional targeted support, and I have therefore decided to place the entire organisation in targeted intervention.
I will be placing the whole of Hywel Dda University Health Board in targeted intervention.
Byddaf yn gosod Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Hywel Dda gyfan mewn ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu.
Fe fydd hyn yn ein galluogi i’w gefnogi’n briodol ac i sicrhau ei fod mewn sefyllfa i ddatblygu a gweithredu'r gwelliannau sydd eu hangen.
Cyn y Nadolig, mi wnes i godi gwasanaethau mamolaeth a newyddenedigol Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Bae Abertawe i statws monitro uwch, ond dwi hefyd yn poeni nad ydym ni wedi gweld cynnydd digonol o ran gofal wedi’i gynllunio a gofal heb ei gynllunio. Mae heriau o ran amseroedd aros ac mae oedi annerbyniol wrth drosglwyddo cleifion o ambiwlansys. Er mwyn helpu’r bwrdd i wella, dwi wedi penderfynu codi’r bwrdd i statws ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu ar gyfer perfformiad a chanlyniadau, ond fe fydd yn aros o dan statws monitro uwch ar gyfer cynllunio a chyllid.
This will enable us to support the entire organisation appropriately, and to ensure that it is in a position to develop and implement the necessary improvements.
Before Christmas, I escalated maternity and neonatal services at Swansea Bay University Health Board to enhanced monitoring status, but I'm also concerned that we have not seen sufficient progress in terms of planned and unscheduled care. Waiting lists are challenged and there are unacceptable ambulance handover delays. So, to support further improvement, I have decided to escalate performance and outcomes to targeted intervention, but the health board will remain in enhanced monitoring for planning and finance.
I'll be increasing the escalation level of Swansea Bay University Health Board to targeted intervention for performance and outcomes, but it will remain in enhanced monitoring for budget and planning.
Byddaf yn cynyddu lefel uwchgyfeirio Bwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Bae Abertawe i ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu ar gyfer perfformiad a chanlyniadau, ond bydd yn parhau i fod yn y categori monitro uwch ar gyfer cyllideb a chynllunio.
Mae gan Fwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Aneurin Bevan fwlch ariannol cynyddol, a dyw’r bwrdd heb gynllunio’n ddigonol i gynilo’r diffyg ariannol ar gyfer y flwyddyn ariannol yma. Mae angen ymateb cryfach ar y sefydliad a chymorth ychwanegol i'w galluogi i wneud hynny. Felly dwi wedi penderfynu i godi eu statws ymyrraeth wedi’i thargedu ar gyfer chynllunio a chyllid.
Aneurin Bevan University Health Board is experiencing a growing financial deficit, and the board has made insufficient progress in developing plans to deliver target deficit set in this financial year. The organisation needs a strengthened response and additional support to enable its to develop these effective responses. So, I will be placing Aneurin Bevan Health Board in targeted intervention in relation to finance and planning.
I will be placing Aneurin Bevan Health Board in targeted intervention in relation to finance and planning. I'm particularly concerned about the emergency department performance at the Grange University Hospital. The health board will therefore be escalated to enhanced monitoring for performance and outcomes related to emergency care pathways at the Grange University Hospital. Senedd Members representing the area will be pleased to hear that I've made available just over £14 million to extend and reconfigure parts of the Grange University Hospital emergency department, and it's my expectation that this considerable investment will result in improved patient safety, comfort and privacy, and I'm expecting the organisation to respond to ensure further improvements are made.
I'm not making any changes to the escalation levels of the other four health boards. So, Betsi remains in special measures and Cardiff remains in enhanced monitoring for planning and finance, as does Powys and Cwm Taf Morgannwg. Cwm Taf Morgannwg also remains in targeted intervention for performance.
Llywydd, these decisions have not been taken lightly. They're the best way to support these NHS organisations and they will improve the quality of service and care people receive in Wales from the health service in their local area, and, ultimately, improve patients' clinical outcomes. Diolch yn fawr.
Byddaf yn gosod Bwrdd Iechyd Aneurin Bevan mewn ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu o ran cyllid a chynllunio. Rwy'n arbennig o bryderus am berfformiad yr adran frys yn Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor. Felly, caiff y bwrdd iechyd ei uwchgyfeirio i'r categori monitro uwch ar gyfer perfformiad a chanlyniadau sy'n gysylltiedig â llwybrau gofal brys yn Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor. Bydd Aelodau'r Senedd sy'n cynrychioli'r ardal yn falch o glywed fy mod wedi darparu ychydig dros £14 miliwn i ymestyn ac ad-drefnu rhannau o adran frys Ysbyty Athrofaol y Faenor, a fy nisgwyliad yw y bydd y buddsoddiad sylweddol hwn yn arwain at well diogelwch, cysur a phreifatrwydd i gleifion, ac rwy'n disgwyl i'r sefydliad ymateb i sicrhau bod gwelliannau pellach yn cael eu gwneud.
Nid wyf yn gwneud unrhyw newidiadau i lefelau uwchgyfeirio'r pedwar bwrdd iechyd arall. Felly, mae Betsi yn parhau i fod mewn mesurau arbennig ac mae Caerdydd yn parhau i fod yn y categori monitro uwch ar gyfer cynllunio a chyllid, fel y mae Powys a Chwm Taf Morgannwg. Mae Cwm Taf Morgannwg hefyd yn parhau i fod mewn ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu ar gyfer perfformiad.
Llywydd, nid yw'r penderfyniadau hyn wedi'u gwneud ar chwarae bach. Dyna'r ffordd orau o gefnogi'r sefydliadau GIG hyn a byddant yn gwella ansawdd y gwasanaeth a'r gofal y mae pobl yn ei dderbyn yng Nghymru gan y gwasanaeth iechyd yn eu hardal leol, ac, yn y pen draw, yn gwella canlyniadau clinigol cleifion. Diolch yn fawr.
I think there are two aspects to the Minister's statement this afternoon, and I thank the Minister for her statement. I think the first part of the statement is a pretty sobering statement in terms of the state of some of our health boards and the deteriorating state of some of our health boards, I think, across Wales. That's the disappointing part, I think, to the statement today, and I'll come on to some questions in more detail.
The other part to your statement, Minister, is in regard to the oversight in the escalation framework. I think that's very welcome. I think, previously, when a health board went into intervention or had a change of intervention or escalation, then it was unclear about how and why those decisions were being made. I don't think that was appropriate previously, and I think this framework now helps to bring some greater clarity and transparency in that regard. So, I think that bit is certainly welcome in your statement today.
Perhaps I could ask, in terms of developing your framework, Minister, if you can please tell us how you developed that, who you worked with, what feedback you got from health boards, did health boards have sight of the framework prior to it being published, what was their feedback, and what other organisations have you worked with, included elected Members, to develop the framework that you published this morning. How are you going to evaluate the framework, as well, in terms of time frame and its effectiveness? Is there a time in the future when you will—? You set now that you will be looking to update or amend the framework.
In regard to Healthcare Inspectorate Wales, I read with interest that you work with a range of bodies, including HIW, in terms of deciding what is an appropriate level for intervention or escalation. So, in that light and in light of the document you published today, can I ask if there's any further consideration of re-examining the proposed cuts to HIW in the Welsh Government's draft budget? And, in fact, is there now any consideration to increasing the finance available to HIW, given the role it plays in the framework that you published this morning?
Can I ask about capacity within the Welsh Government? Also, if there's an increased level of health boards in intervention and needing monitoring and support, perhaps you can tell us about staffing and financial resource within the Welsh Government. And, of course, we're aware that HIW themselves, back last month, said there was no evidence that Welsh Government initiatives were having any effect on front-line services. So, to that point, I suppose, perhaps the Welsh Government should be in a degree of intervention or special measures. But, how are you going to address, and seek to address, the grave concerns from HIW?
In terms of some of the other points that you've raised in terms of the escalations announced today, Swansea Bay—I was pleased to visit Swansea bay maternity services at Singleton Hospital myself last week, especially following the concerns raised—you're now increasing the intervention there to targeted intervention. Only last month, of course, you put it in enhanced monitoring, so what has changed in those four weeks? Has more information come to light? Has something changed in the last four weeks, or was the decision made four weeks ago wrong and are you now playing catch-up? So, perhaps you could tell us some more in that regard.
And then, in regard to Hywel Dda health board, facing real challenges there in terms of—. You pointed out in your statement today that they need to make some very difficult decisions. Is the cut that you are asking them to make to their deficit—? Do you think that is too extreme?
In regard to Aneurin Bevan health board, you mentioned in your statement a growing financial deficit. Can I ask what level is that deficit at now, and how big does it need to be to go into a higher level of intervention or into special measures, because we know that it's been a long-standing issue for some time? I would probably ask—. The right question is: are we going to be here in four weeks, for example, hearing that the health board is in special measures, or in a different level of intervention?
Finally, Minister, you mentioned that local Members will be pleased about the investment at the Grange hospital. One aspect is, yes, I'm sure they will be, but of course the question is: why are we in this place in the very first place? A brand-new hospital, built only four years ago—. Grange hospital, built only four years ago and opened, is now requiring changes and reconfiguration to parts of its emergency services. So, perhaps you can tell us a little bit more, Minister, about why that was not envisaged during the design stage in terms of making sure that the original plans were appropriate for safety and comfort and privacy, as you've outlined today in your statement.
Rwy'n credu bod dwy agwedd ar ddatganiad y Gweinidog y prynhawn yma, a diolchaf i'r Gweinidog am ei datganiad. Rwy'n credu bod rhan gyntaf y datganiad yn ddatganiad eithaf sobreiddiol o ran cyflwr rhai o'n byrddau iechyd a chyflwr dirywiad rhai o'n byrddau iechyd, rwy'n credu, ledled Cymru. Dyna'r rhan siomedig, rwy'n credu, i'r datganiad heddiw, ac fe wnaf i ateb maes o law rai cwestiynau yn fwy manwl.
Mae'r rhan arall i'ch datganiad, Gweinidog, yn ymwneud â'r oruchwyliaeth yn y fframwaith uwchgyfeirio. Rwy'n credu bod yna groeso mawr i hynny. Rwy'n credu, o'r blaen, pan aeth bwrdd iechyd i gategori ymyriad neu y bu newid yn yr ymyriad neu y cai ei uwchgyfeirio, yna nid oedd yn glir sut a pham roedd y penderfyniadau hynny'n cael eu gwneud. Nid wyf yn credu bod hynny'n briodol yn flaenorol, ac rwy'n credu bod y fframwaith hwn bellach yn helpu i ddod â rhywfaint o eglurder a thryloywder yn hynny o beth. Felly, rwy'n credu bod croeso mawr i'r darn hwnnw yn eich datganiad heddiw.
Efallai y gallwn ofyn, o ran datblygu eich fframwaith, Gweinidog, a allwch chi ddweud wrthym ni sut y gwnaethoch chi ddatblygu hynny, gyda phwy y buoch chi'n gweithio, pa adborth a gawsoch chi gan fyrddau iechyd, a gafodd byrddau iechyd olwg ar y fframwaith cyn ei gyhoeddi, beth oedd eu hadborth, a pha sefydliadau eraill rydych chi wedi gweithio gyda nhw, yn cynnwys Aelodau etholedig, i ddatblygu'r fframwaith a gyhoeddoch chi y bore 'ma. Sut ydych chi'n mynd i werthuso'r fframwaith, hefyd, o ran amserlen a'i effeithiolrwydd? Oes amser yn y dyfodol pan fyddwch chi'n—? Rydych chi'n dweud nawr mai eich bwriad yw diweddaru neu ddiwygio'r fframwaith.
O ran Arolygiaeth Gofal Iechyd Cymru, darllenais gyda diddordeb eich bod yn gweithio gydag ystod o gyrff, gan gynnwys AGIC, o ran penderfynu beth sy'n lefel briodol ar gyfer ymyrraeth neu uwchgyfeirio. Felly, yn y goleuni hwnnw ac yng ngoleuni'r ddogfen a gyhoeddwyd gennych chi heddiw, a gaf i ofyn a oes unrhyw ystyriaeth bellach o ail-edrych ar y toriadau arfaethedig i AGIC yng nghyllideb ddrafft Llywodraeth Cymru? Ac, mewn gwirionedd, a oes unrhyw ystyriaeth bellach i gynyddu'r cyllid sydd ar gael i AGIC, o ystyried ei swyddogaeth yn y fframwaith a gyhoeddwyd gennych chi'r bore 'ma?
A gaf i ofyn am gapasiti yn Llywodraeth Cymru? Hefyd, os oes mwy o fyrddau iechyd yn destun ymyrraeth ac angen monitro a chymorth, efallai y gallwch chi ddweud wrthym ni am staffio ac adnoddau ariannol yn Llywodraeth Cymru. Ac, wrth gwrs, rydyn ni'n ymwybodol bod AGIC eu hunain, yn ôl fis diwethaf, wedi dweud nad oedd tystiolaeth bod mentrau Llywodraeth Cymru yn cael unrhyw effaith ar wasanaethau rheng flaen. Felly, o ran y sylw yna, mae'n debyg, efallai y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru fod yn destun rhywfaint o ymyrraeth neu fesurau arbennig. Ond, sut y byddwch chi'n mynd i'r afael, a cheisio mynd i'r afael, â phryderon difrifol AGIC?
O ran rhai o'r pwyntiau eraill rydych chi wedi'u codi o ran y cynnydd a gyhoeddwyd heddiw, Bae Abertawe—roeddwn yn falch o ymweld â gwasanaethau mamolaeth Bae Abertawe yn Ysbyty Singleton yr wythnos diwethaf, yn enwedig yn dilyn y pryderon a godwyd—rydych chi bellach yn cynyddu'r ymyrraeth yno i ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu. Dim ond y mis diwethaf, wrth gwrs, fe roesoch chi'r ysbyty yn y categori monitro uwch, felly beth sydd wedi newid yn y pedair wythnos hynny? Oes mwy o wybodaeth wedi dod i'r amlwg? A yw rhywbeth wedi newid yn ystod y pedair wythnos diwethaf, neu a oedd y penderfyniad a wnaed bedair wythnos yn ôl yn anghywir ac a ydych chi nawr yn ceisio dal i fyny? Felly, efallai y gallech chi ddweud ychydig mwy wrthym ni yn hynny o beth.
Ac yna, o ran bwrdd iechyd Hywel Dda, sy'n wynebu heriau gwirioneddol yn hynny o beth o ran—. Fe wnaethoch chi nodi yn eich datganiad heddiw bod angen iddyn nhw wneud penderfyniadau anodd iawn. Ydy'r toriad rydych chi'n gofyn iddyn nhw ei wneud i'w diffyg—? Ydych chi'n meddwl bod hynny'n rhy eithafol?
O ran bwrdd iechyd Aneurin Bevan, fe sonioch chi yn eich datganiad am ddiffyg ariannol cynyddol. A gaf i ofyn faint yw'r diffyg hwnnw ar hyn o bryd, a pha mor fawr y mae angen iddo fod i fynd i lefel uwch o ymyrraeth neu i fesurau arbennig, oherwydd fe wyddom ni y bu'n fater hirsefydlog ers peth amser? Mae'n debyg y byddwn i'n gofyn—. Y cwestiwn cywir yw: ydym ni'n mynd i fod yma ymhen pedair wythnos, er enghraifft, yn clywed bod y bwrdd iechyd mewn mesurau arbennig, neu mewn lefel ymyrraeth wahanol?
Yn olaf, Gweinidog, fe wnaethoch chi sôn y bydd Aelodau lleol yn falch o'r buddsoddiad yn ysbyty'r Faenor. Un agwedd yw, ydw, rwy'n siŵr y byddan nhw, ond wrth gwrs y cwestiwn yw: pam rydym ni yn y sefyllfa hon yn y lle cyntaf un? Ysbyty newydd sbon, a adeiladwyd dim ond bedair blynedd yn ôl—. Mae ysbyty'r Faenor, a adeiladwyd dim ond bedair blynedd yn ôl ac a agorwyd, bellach yn gofyn am newidiadau ac ad-drefnu i rannau o'i wasanaethau brys. Felly, efallai y gallwch chi ddweud ychydig yn fwy, Gweinidog, pam na ragwelwyd hynny yn ystod y cam dylunio o ran sicrhau bod y cynlluniau gwreiddiol yn briodol ar gyfer diogelwch a chysur a phreifatrwydd, fel yr ydych chi wedi'i amlinellu heddiw yn eich datganiad.
Diolch yn fawr, Russell. Gosh, you had lots of questions there, so I'll see how many I can get through, if that's okay.
Just in terms of financial challenges, it's well known that our budget is £1.3 billion of value less than it was when it was first set out. Inflation has had a huge impact on all aspects of Government, including the NHS, and there has, of course, been a massive increase in demand since the pandemic, although, as I set out in my statement, the demand was increasing significantly prior to that as well.
And just to close off the Grange issue, you were asking about why is it that we have to do this so early after it's just been opened; well, part of that reasoning is because we have seen demand increase like we hadn't projected. Now, I don't think we can apologise for the huge increase that we've seen, which we couldn't have foreseen at the time—as I stated in my statement, a third higher than 10 years ago. Nobody would have foreseen that. That's why I think—I hope—that people will welcome the fact that what we do have—. There is a state-of-the-art hospital, but we recognise that we do have to expand the accident and emergency department. I'm sure you're happy to see that very significant additional investment going in.
Just in terms of the clarity and transparency in the framework, thank you for recognising that. I think it's probably worth contrasting that with the way that they do escalation in England, which is all very cloak and daggers and nobody knows quite why it's being done. We have set out that framework. We've worked with the NHS and the health boards. It is really important that it's not seen as a punishment, the escalation framework. It's about giving support. What we don't want is a postcode lottery for people around Wales. If we see one part of Wales looking like it's not doing as well as the other, then we have a responsibility as a Government, centrally, to make sure that that area comes up, and what we can do now is to put that support in place.
Just in terms of evaluation, I'll tell you what success looks like. Success will be evaluated by whether the health boards come down the escalation ladder in terms of improvement. So, it's going to be very easy to evaluate whether this framework actually works.
Just in terms of re-examining cuts to HIW, I think it's probably worth pointing out that what we saw in HIW was a flat budget, not a budget cut. It was a flat budget. But obviously we recognise that, when most of the funding that goes on HIW is on staff, it obviously is very difficult for them to deal with that particular situation.
Just in terms of capacity, what we've got now is the NHS executive, which is, as you know, the new organisation established as a kind of arm’s-length, semi-part of Welsh Government. And what we did there was to bring together a lot of experts. So, Improvement Cymru, for example, became a part of that institution, and those are the kinds of trouble shooters who go in now, and we've got real experts there, many of them who are clinical leaders, to go in and to give support where necessary. And they've done a lot of that in relation to Betsi already—a huge amount of support's been put into working with Betsi.
Just in terms of what HIW said, I've got to say, I'll take a little bit of issue with HIW. I'm probably not supposed to as a health Minister, but I'm going to anyway. Saying that there's no effect on front-line services—I just don't accept that. The fact that 70,000 people are now, every month, able to phone the NHS 111 line, 20,000 patients are diverted from accident and emergency because they go to urgent primary care centres. That is innovation, taking people away from the front line, so I think there is an effect on the front line, and I'm not sure how anyone can argue against that.
Just in terms of Swansea, as you're aware, we've put that into enhanced monitoring, but that was particularly for maternity. This now is looking at what is happening in relation to Swansea in terms of performance and outcomes, which is slightly different, and that's going into targeted intervention. I am very concerned, in particular, about the handover times in A&E at Swansea. I'm also concerned about long waiting lists. So, there's going to be a real focus on working with them to help to support them to correct those particular challenges they're facing.
Are the cuts too extreme? Ask your Government that. Ask your Government if you think it's a good idea to talk—even whisper—about tax cuts when you know the kinds of pressures that our public services are under. There's a reason why health boards are under these kinds of challenges. It's because, frankly, you have not only taxed higher than we've seen in 70 years, but also we're in a situation where you're cutting public service expenditure, and for you to ask whether the cuts are too drastic—well, I think you should go and ask your own Government that.
So, I hope that, Dirprwy Lywydd, has covered off some of those questions.
Diolch yn fawr, Russell. Bobl bach, roedd gennych chi lawer o gwestiynau yn y fan yna, felly byddaf yn gweld faint y gallaf eu hateb, os yw hynny'n iawn.
O ran heriau ariannol, mae'n hysbys bod ein cyllideb werth £1.3 biliwn yn llai nag yr oedd pan gafodd ei amlinellu gyntaf. Mae chwyddiant wedi cael effaith enfawr ar bob agwedd ar y Llywodraeth, gan gynnwys y GIG, ac wrth gwrs, bu cynnydd enfawr yn y galw ers y pandemig, er, fel y dywedais i yn fy natganiad, roedd y galw yn cynyddu'n sylweddol cyn hynny hefyd.
A dim ond i gau pen y mwdwl ar fater y Faenor, roeddech chi'n holi pam mae'n rhaid i ni wneud hyn mor gynnar ar ôl iddo gael ei agor; wel, rhan o'r rhesymu hwnnw yw oherwydd ein bod ni wedi gweld galw'n cynyddu fel nad oeddem wedi'i ragweld. Nawr, nid wyf yn credu y gallwn ni ymddiheuro am y cynnydd enfawr yr ydym ni wedi'i weld, na allem ni fod wedi'i ragweld ar y pryd—fel y dywedais i yn fy natganiad, traean yn uwch na 10 mlynedd yn ôl. Ni fyddai neb wedi rhagweld hynny. Dyna pam rwy'n credu—gobeithio—y bydd pobl yn croesawu'r ffaith bod yr hyn sydd gennym ni—. Mae yna ysbyty o'r radd flaenaf, ond rydyn ni'n cydnabod bod yn rhaid i ni ehangu'r adran ddamweiniau ac achosion brys. Rwy'n siŵr eich bod yn hapus i weld y buddsoddiad ychwanegol sylweddol hwnnw.
Dim ond o ran eglurder a thryloywder yn y fframwaith, diolch i chi am gydnabod hynny. Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n werth cyferbynnu hynny gyda'r ffordd y maen nhw'n uwchgyfeirio yn Lloegr, sydd i gyd yn ddirgelwch mawr a does neb yn gwybod yn iawn pam mae'n cael ei wneud. Rydym ni wedi nodi'r fframwaith hwnnw. Rydym ni wedi gweithio gyda'r GIG a'r byrddau iechyd. Mae'n bwysig iawn nad yw'n cael ei ystyried yn gosb, y fframwaith uwchgyfeirio. Mae'n ymwneud â rhoi cefnogaeth. Yr hyn nad ydym ni ei eisiau yw loteri cod post i bobl ledled Cymru. Os gwelwn un rhan o Gymru yn edrych fel nad yw'n gwneud cystal â'r llall, yna mae gennym ni gyfrifoldeb fel Llywodraeth, yn ganolog, i sicrhau bod y maes hwnnw'n codi, a'r hyn y gallwn ni ei wneud nawr yw rhoi'r gefnogaeth honno ar waith.
Dim ond o ran gwerthuso, fe ddywedaf wrthych chi sut beth yw llwyddiant. Caiff llwyddiant ei werthuso o ran a yw'r byrddau iechyd yn dod i lawr yr ysgol uwchgyfeirio o ran gwella. Felly, bydd yn hawdd iawn gwerthuso a yw'r fframwaith hwn yn gweithio mewn gwirionedd.
O ran ail-edrych ar doriadau i AGIC, rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n werth nodi bod yr hyn a welsom ni yn AGIC yn gyllideb wastad, nid toriad yn y gyllideb. Roedd yn gyllideb wastad. Ond yn amlwg, rydym ni'n cydnabod, pan fydd y rhan fwyaf o'r cyllid a gaiff AGIC yn talu am staff, ei bod hi'n amlwg yn anodd iawn iddyn nhw ymdrin â'r sefyllfa benodol honno.
Dim ond o ran capasiti, yr hyn sydd gennym ni nawr yw gweithrediaeth y GIG, sef, fel y gwyddoch chi, y sefydliad newydd a sefydlwyd fel math o led-ran, hyd braich o Lywodraeth Cymru. A'r hyn a wnaethom ni yn hynny o beth oedd dod â llawer o arbenigwyr ynghyd. Felly, daeth Gwelliant Cymru, er enghraifft, yn rhan o'r sefydliad hwnnw, a dyna'r mathau o ddatryswyr problemau sy'n mynd i mewn nawr, ac mae gennym ni arbenigwyr go iawn yno, llawer ohonyn nhw sy'n arweinwyr clinigol, i fynd i mewn ac i roi cymorth lle bo angen. Ac maen nhw wedi gwneud llawer o hynny mewn perthynas â Betsi eisoes—mae llawer iawn o gefnogaeth wedi cael ei roi i weithio gyda Betsi.
O ran yr hyn a ddywedodd AGIC, mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, rwy'n anghytuno braidd gydag AGIC. Mae'n debyg na ddylwn i, gan fy mod i'n Weinidog iechyd, ond fe wnaf i beth bynnag. Dweud nad oes unrhyw effaith ar wasanaethau rheng flaen—dydw i ddim yn derbyn hynny. Mae'r ffaith bod 70,000 o bobl erbyn hyn, bob mis, yn gallu ffonio llinell 111 y GIG, mae 20,000 o gleifion yn cael eu dargyfeirio o unedau achosion brys oherwydd eu bod yn mynd i ganolfannau gofal sylfaenol brys. Mae hynny'n arloesi, gan dynnu pobl o'r rheng flaen, felly rwy'n credu bod effaith ar y rheng flaen, a dydw i ddim yn siŵr sut y gall unrhyw un ddadlau yn erbyn hynny.
Dim ond o ran Abertawe, fel y gwyddoch chi, rydym ni wedi rhoi'r bwrdd yna yn y categori monitro uwch, ond roedd hynny'n arbennig ar gyfer mamolaeth. Mae hyn nawr yn edrych ar yr hyn sy'n digwydd mewn perthynas ag Abertawe o ran perfformiad a chanlyniadau, sydd ychydig yn wahanol, ac mae hynny'n mynd i gategori ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu. Rwy'n pryderu'n fawr, yn arbennig, am yr amseroedd trosglwyddo mewn adrannau damweiniau ac achosion brys yn Abertawe. Rwy'n pryderu hefyd am restrau aros hir. Felly, bydd pwyslais gwirioneddol ar weithio gyda nhw i helpu i'w cefnogi i gywiro'r heriau penodol hynny y maen nhw'n eu hwynebu.
Ydy'r toriadau'n rhy eithafol? Gofynnwch i'ch Llywodraeth hynny. Gofynnwch i'ch Llywodraeth os ydych chi'n meddwl ei bod hi'n syniad da siarad—hyd yn oed sibrwd—am doriadau treth pan ydych chi'n gwybod y mathau o bwysau sydd ar ein gwasanaethau cyhoeddus. Mae yna reswm pam mae byrddau iechyd o dan y math yma o heriau. Y rheswm am hynny, a dweud y gwir, yw eich bod chi nid yn unig wedi trethu'n uwch nag a welsom ni mewn 70 mlynedd, ond hefyd rydym ni mewn sefyllfa lle rydych chi'n torri gwariant gwasanaeth cyhoeddus, ac i chi ofyn a yw'r toriadau yn rhy llym—wel, rwy'n credu y dylech chi fynd i ofyn i'ch Llywodraeth eich hun hynny.
Felly, rwy'n gobeithio fod hynny, Dirprwy Lywydd, wedi ymdrin â rhai o'r cwestiynau hynny.
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Wel, pan welais i ein bod ni am gael datganiad ar drefniadau uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrryd, mae'n rhaid cyfaddef fy mod i wedi cael fy nghyffroi ychydig. Bydd y Gweinidog yn gwybod ein bod ni yma yn y Blaid wedi bod yn galw am ail-lunio'r trefniadau ers sawl blwyddyn bellach. Roeddwn i'n obeithiol y buasem ni'n cael datganiad i'r perwyl hynny mewn gwirionedd, o ran ail-drefnu llwyr, ond gallwch chi ddychmygu fy siom felly, wrth glywed y datganiad yma heddiw, mai dim mwy, mewn gwirionedd, nag ailddatgan y drefn bresennol, efo un lefel ychwanegol wedi'i hychwanegu at y pedair lefel oedd yn bodoli'n flaenorol, sydd gennym ni.
Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. Well, when I saw that we were to have a statement on intervention and escalation arrangements, I have to say that I was slightly excited. The Minister will know that we in Plaid Cymru have been calling for realignment of these arrangements for some years now. I was hopeful that we would have a statement to that end, if I'm honest, in terms of a full reorganisation, but you can imagine my disappointment, in hearing this statement this afternoon, that it's nothing more than restating the current system, with one additional level added to the existing four levels—that's what we have here.
According to Welsh Government guidance, escalation and intervention measures are classified as any oversight of health boards that goes beyond routine arrangements, but with every major Welsh health board now under a form of targeted intervention, or increased levels, as we heard earlier, the sad reality is that the non-routine has now very much become the routine. We don't dispute the importance of having robust mechanisms in place to monitor the operational performance of health boards and to ensure that any shortcomings are acted upon where necessary. The issue here is whether the framework and the clarity expressed today is actually fit for purpose, given its questionable record of delivering timely improvements in the quality of services. How will adding one new level make a difference? I hope the Minister can explain.
The case of Betsi Cadwaladr, that's been in special measures for a total of six and a half years out of the nine years that the current escalation and intervention framework has been active, clearly stands out in this respect. And Betsi remains in special measures. But its effectiveness across the other health boards leaves plenty to be desired too. For example, the various layers of enhanced monitoring that were in place from 2016 at Swansea bay were not sufficient in preventing serious failings in its maternity services back in November 2020, the fallout of which is only now being belatedly addressed by the Government. The measures to instil fiscal discipline have also been unable to prevent the health boards from racking up a combined deficit of over £150 million, with six of the seven major boards violating their statutory duty to break even during the most recent three-year reporting period.
The issue of accountability is key. You'll be aware that in April last year we raised our concerns about the characterisation by the First Minister and the former health Minister of the tripartite decision-making process that led to the de-escalation of special measures at Betsi in November 2020. Despite the First Minister's attempts to muddy the waters when challenged on this, it's now beyond any doubt that this highly controversial decision was made by the Welsh Government alone, against the advice of both Audit Wales and HIW. This, of course, underlines how the framework is open to politicisation. Even the current tinkering that's mentioned is still open to that same level of politicisation, and the damaging implications were laid bare in February last year when special measures were re-imposed at Betsi.
This updated framework might be an attempt at clarification, but, having read it earlier this afternoon, I must admit that it's not so much clearer as to who contributes and who ultimately takes responsibility for de-escalation. I hope that the Minister can clarify.
We firmly believe that the performance of healthcare in Wales should always be assessed according to rigorously impartial and objective criteria, and the fact that Welsh Ministers can, at present, simply override the advice of Audit Wales and HIW, is compromising this, and doesn't therefore adhere to one of the fundamental principles that underpins the framework—that is, transparency. In the interests of bolstering the confidence of patients and staff alike and the governance of healthcare in Wales, therefore, will the Minister support our call for the decision-making power on the introduction or withdrawal of escalation and intervention arrangements to be placed in the hands of an independent expert body?
Yn ôl canllawiau Llywodraeth Cymru, disgrifir mesurau uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrryd fel unrhyw oruchwyliaeth o fyrddau iechyd sy'n mynd y tu hwnt i drefniadau arferol, ond gyda phob bwrdd iechyd mawr yng Nghymru bellach o dan fath o ymyrraeth wedi'i dargedu, neu lefelau uwch, fel y clywsom ni yn gynharach, y gwirionedd trist yw bod yr anarferol bellach wedi dod yn drefn arferol. Nid ydym ni'n anghytuno â phwysigrwydd bod â dulliau cadarn ar waith i fonitro perfformiad gweithredol byrddau iechyd ac i sicrhau bod unrhyw ddiffygion yn cael eu gweithredu lle bo angen. Y mater yma yw a yw'r fframwaith a'r eglurder a fynegir heddiw yn addas i'r diben mewn gwirionedd, o ystyried ei gofnod amheus o gyflawni gwelliannau amserol yn ansawdd gwasanaethau. Sut bydd ychwanegu un lefel newydd yn gwneud gwahaniaeth? Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Gweinidog yn gallu esbonio.
Mae achos Betsi Cadwaladr, sydd wedi bod mewn mesurau arbennig ers cyfanswm o chwe blynedd a hanner allan o'r naw mlynedd y bu'r fframwaith uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrraeth presennol yn weithredol, yn amlwg yn hyn o beth. Ac mae Betsi yn parhau mewn mesurau arbennig. Ond mae ei effeithiolrwydd ar draws y byrddau iechyd eraill yn bur siomedig hefyd. Er enghraifft, nid oedd yr haenau amrywiol o fonitro uwch a oedd ar waith o 2016 ym mae Abertawe yn ddigonol i atal methiannau difrifol yn ei wasanaethau mamolaeth yn ôl ym mis Tachwedd 2020, y mae'r Llywodraeth dim ond nawr yn mynd i'r afael â'r canlyniad yn hwyr iawn yn y dydd. Nid yw'r mesurau i feithrin disgyblaeth gyllidol hefyd wedi gallu atal y byrddau iechyd rhag cronni diffyg cyfunol o dros £150 miliwn, gyda chwech o'r saith prif fwrdd yn torri eu dyletswydd statudol i gael cyllideb wastad hyd yn oed yn ystod y cyfnod adrodd tair blynedd diweddaraf.
Mae mater atebolrwydd yn allweddol. Byddwch yn ymwybodol, ym mis Ebrill y llynedd, y bu inni sôn am ein pryderon am nodweddu'r broses deirochrog o wneud penderfyniadau gan y Prif Weinidog a'r cyn Weinidog iechyd a arweiniodd at isgyfeirio mesurau arbennig yn Betsi ym mis Tachwedd 2020. Er gwaethaf ymdrechion y Prif Weinidog i gymylu'r dyfroedd wrth gael ei herio ar hyn, mae bellach y tu hwnt i unrhyw amheuaeth bod y penderfyniad hynod ddadleuol hwn wedi'i wneud gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn unig, yn erbyn cyngor Archwilio Cymru ac AGIC. Mae hyn, wrth gwrs, yn tanlinellu sut mae'r fframwaith yn agored i wleidydda. Mae hyd yn oed y tincran presennol y sonnir amdano yn dal yn agored i'r un lefel o wleidydda, a daeth y goblygiadau niweidiol i'r fei ym mis Chwefror y llynedd pan ailosodwyd mesurau arbennig yn Betsi.
Gallai'r fframwaith diweddaru hwn fod yn ymgais i gael eglurhad, ond, ar ôl ei ddarllen yn gynharach y prynhawn yma, rhaid imi gyfaddef nad yw'n gymaint cliriach o ran pwy sy'n cyfrannu a phwy yn y pen draw sy'n cymryd cyfrifoldeb am isgyfeirio. Rwy'n gobeithio y gall y Gweinidog egluro.
Credwn yn gryf y dylid asesu perfformiad gofal iechyd yng Nghymru bob amser yn unol â meini prawf diduedd a gwrthrychol trwyadl, ac mae'r ffaith y gall Gweinidogion Cymru, ar hyn o bryd, anwybyddu cyngor Archwilio Cymru a AGIC, yn peryglu hyn, ac felly nid yw'n cadw at un o'r egwyddorion sylfaenol sy'n sail i'r fframwaith—hynny yw, tryloywder. Er mwyn cryfhau hyder cleifion a staff fel ei gilydd a llywodraethu gofal iechyd yng Nghymru, felly, a wnaiff y Gweinidog gefnogi ein galwad am roi'r pŵer i wneud penderfyniadau ar gyflwyno neu dynnu'n ôl y trefniadau uwchgyfeirio ac ymyrryd yn nwylo corff arbenigol annibynnol?
Yn olaf, i droi at y datganiadau rydyn ni wedi'u clywed y prynhawn yma, ddaru'r Gweinidog sôn bod Hywel Dda wedi mynd mewn i ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu, sef yr haen newydd, y bedwaredd haen bellach sydd gennym ni o'r pum haen. Beth ydy'r gwahaniaeth, felly, rhwng yr haen yma a mesurau arbennig? Pam nad ydy Hywel Dda, felly, mewn mesurau arbennig, a pham mae'r Gweinidog wedi penderfynu, ar sail y lefelau newydd yma, fod Hywel Dda yn lefel ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu? Rydym ni'n clywed bod bae Abertawe ac Aneurin Bevan wedi cael eu cynyddu—fod rhai elfennau wedi cynyddu—i ymyrraeth wedi'i thargedu, ac, yn achos y Grange, fod yna £14 miliwn wedi'i neilltuo. Faint yn fwy o bres sydd yn mynd i gael ei neilltuo ar gyfer y byrddau eraill yma er mwyn iddyn nhw fedru gwella eu perfformiadau nhw?
Ac yna mae'r Gweinidog yn sôn bod yna gefnogaeth wedi'i dargedu ar gyfer lefelau 4 a 5. Beth ydy'r gefnogaeth yma mewn termau go iawn? A fedrith y Gweinidog ymhelaethu, os gwelwch yn dda? Diolch yn fawr iawn, Dirprwy Lywydd.
Finally, to turn to the statements that we've heard this afternoon, the Minister mentioned that Hywel Dda had gone into targeted intervention, which is the new, fourth level that we have. So, what's the difference between this level and special measures? Why isn't Hywel Dda in special measures, and why has the Minister decided, on the basis of these levels, that Hywel Dda should be placed in targeted intervention? We hear that Swansea bay and Aneurin Bevan have been escalated—or some elements have been escalated—to targeted intervention, and, in the case of the Grange, that £14 million has been allocated. How much money will be allocated for these other health boards so that they can make improvements in their performance?
And the Minister mentioned that there's targeted support for levels 4 and 5. What is this support in real terms? Can the Minister expand on that? Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. I think that it's the adoption of the new framework today, the fact that we have it all set out, the fact that we've discussed it with the health boards—and, crucially and significantly, the real difference is that now we have the NHS executive to come in and to support the health boards, so we're able to go in with troubleshooters. So, the mechanics of how we support the health boards out of their predicaments are there for us to help them with that situation.
So, there is a reason, of course, for the fact that we are in a situation where all of the health boards have some level of intervention beyond routine arrangements, and that, of course, is because of the financial challenges they're facing. I'm not going to apologise for that; that is a fact. You've seen the state of the finances across the Welsh Government; I've just explained why that situation is at it is, but there are consequences to that, and part of the consequence is that, actually, we're asking health boards to do more with—. We are giving them more money, significantly more money—we've been all around the Cabinet table to get more money to support and secure the health boards—but they are still going to be very, very challenged financially, and they do, however, have to come in according to what we've told them they need to do in order to balance the overall Welsh budget. That's why we do have to keep breathing down their necks and we will do so until they're able to get to a situation where we get that financial balance. We’re confident that three health boards are on target to do that, and we hope that that will be a situation that will mean that we’ll be able to de-escalate them.
So, just in terms of the time of making a decision, I’ve got to take issue with you in relation to Betsi. Taking them out of special measures—I’ve got to be absolutely clear—the Welsh Government takes advice from HIW, Audit Wales and officials in the Welsh Government. That’s what happened. It is the Minister who makes the decision, that is true, but that is the system, and that is a system we stand by for going into special measures and also coming out of special measures. You asked about an opportunity for that to be wholly independent of Government and Welsh Ministers. Well, that’s what happens in England, and there is no accountability. There is no accountability. In England there are 19 trusts in the equivalent of special measures and there is never a question on the floor of Westminster on that situation, because it wasn’t the Government who put them into that situation. So, if you want that, you’ve got to be very clear about the consequence of that, and that is that you won’t be able to haul me in here week after week to explain the way I do, and have the kind of transparency and accountability that you also insist on. So, I do think it’s important that people understand that there’s a reason for how we’re doing it.
There is an accountability and governance review that is being undertaken at the moment, and we’ll see what they come out with. But I’ve got to tell you that you can’t have them both. You can’t have them both. What they’ve got in England is a situation where it is independent, it’s separate, the NHS executive is separate, it’s independently decided who goes into what level of escalation, and the Government does not have the scrutiny that we get here in Wales. Now, that may be something you want to consider. It is something that I’m sure is being considered in the context of that governance and accountability review. I don’t know where that’s going to end up, but you can’t have it both ways.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Rwy'n credu mai mabwysiadu'r fframwaith newydd heddiw, y ffaith bod gennym ni bopeth wedi'i nodi, y ffaith ein bod ni wedi ei drafod gyda'r byrddau iechyd—ac, yn hollbwysig ac yn sylweddol, y gwir wahaniaeth yw bod gennym ni nawr weithrediaeth y GIG i ddod i mewn ac i gefnogi'r byrddau iechyd, felly rydym ni'n gallu mynd i mewn gyda phobl sy'n gallu datrys problemau. Felly, mae'r dulliau o ran sut rydym ni'n cefnogi'r byrddau iechyd i ddod allan o'u trafferthion yno i ni eu helpu gyda'r sefyllfa honno.
Felly, mae yna reswm, wrth gwrs, am y ffaith ein bod ni mewn sefyllfa lle mae gan bob un o'r byrddau iechyd ryw lefel o ymyrraeth y tu hwnt i drefniadau arferol, ac mae hynny, wrth gwrs, oherwydd yr heriau ariannol maen nhw'n eu hwynebu. Ni fyddaf yn ymddiheuro am hynny; mae hynny'n ffaith. Rydych chi wedi gweld cyflwr y cyllid ar draws Llywodraeth Cymru; rwyf newydd egluro pam fod y sefyllfa honno'n bodoli, ond mae 'na ganlyniadau i hynny, a rhan o'r canlyniad ydy, mewn gwirionedd, ein bod ni'n gofyn i fyrddau iechyd wneud mwy gyda—. Rydym ni yn rhoi mwy o arian iddyn nhw, llawer mwy o arian—rydym ni wedi bod yr holl ffordd o gwmpas bwrdd y Cabinet i gael mwy o arian i gefnogi a sicrhau'r byrddau iechyd—ond maen nhw'n dal i fynd i wynebu heriau ariannol sylweddol iawn, ac maen nhw, fodd bynnag, yn gorfod ymateb i'r hyn rydym ni wedi dweud wrthyn nhw bod angen iddyn nhw ei wneud er mwyn cydbwyso cyllideb gyffredinol Cymru. Dyna pam mae'n rhaid i ni ddal ati i roi pwysau arnyn nhw a byddwn yn gwneud hynny nes eu bod yn gallu cyrraedd sefyllfa lle mae gennym ni'r cydbwysedd ariannol hwnnw. Rydym ni'n hyderus bod tri bwrdd iechyd ar y trywydd iawn i wneud hynny, ac rydym ni'n gobeithio y bydd honno'n sefyllfa a fydd yn golygu y byddwn yn gallu eu hisgyfeirio.
Felly, dim ond o ran yr amser o wneud penderfyniad, mae'n rhaid i mi anghytuno â chi o ran Betsi. Eu tynnu nhw allan o fesurau arbennig—mae'n rhaid i mi fod yn hollol glir—mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn cymryd cyngor gan AGIC, Archwilio Cymru a swyddogion yn Llywodraeth Cymru. Dyna beth ddigwyddodd. Y Gweinidog sy'n gwneud y penderfyniad, mae hynny'n wir, ond dyna'r system, ac mae honno'n system rydym ni'n gwbl gefnogol iddi o ran mynd i mewn i fesurau arbennig a hefyd dod allan o fesurau arbennig. Fe wnaethoch chi holi am gyfle i hynny fod yn gwbl annibynnol ar Weinidogion Cymru a'r Llywodraeth. Wel, dyna sy'n digwydd yn Lloegr, a does dim atebolrwydd. Nid oes unrhyw atebolrwydd. Yn Lloegr mae 19 o ymddiriedolaethau yn yr hyn sy'n cyfateb i fesurau arbennig a does byth cwestiwn ar lawr San Steffan ynglŷn â'r sefyllfa honno, oherwydd nid y Llywodraeth a'u rhoddodd yn y sefyllfa honno. Felly, os ydych chi eisiau hynny, mae'n rhaid i chi fod yn glir iawn ynglŷn â chanlyniad hynny, a hynny yw na fyddwch chi'n gallu fy llusgo i mewn yma wythnos ar ôl wythnos i esbonio'r ffordd rydw i'n gwneud pethau, a chael y math o dryloywder ac atebolrwydd rydych chi hefyd yn ei fynnu. Felly, rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig bod pobl yn deall bod rheswm dros sut rydym ni'n gwneud hyn.
Mae yna adolygiad atebolrwydd a llywodraethu yn cael ei gynnal ar hyn o bryd, ac fe welwn ni beth yw eu canlyniadau. Ond mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud wrthych chi na allwch chi gael y ddau beth. Allwch chi ddim cael y ddau beth. Yr hyn sydd ganddyn nhw yn Lloegr yw sefyllfa lle mae'n annibynnol, mae'n wahanol, mae gweithrediaeth y GIG ar wahân, penderfynir yn annibynnol pwy sy'n mynd i ba lefel o uwchgyfeirio, ac nid yw'r Llywodraeth yn craffu fel yr ydym ni yma yng Nghymru. Nawr, efallai bod hynny'n rhywbeth yr hoffech chi ei ystyried. Mae'n rhywbeth rwy'n siŵr ei fod yn cael ei ystyried yng nghyd-destun yr adolygiad llywodraethu ac atebolrwydd hwnnw. Nid wyf yn gwybod beth fydd pendraw hynny, ond allwch chi ddim ei gael y ddwy ffordd.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
I thank the Minister.
Yr eitem olaf heddiw yw'r Rheoliadau Gwin (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2024, a galwaf ar y Gweinidog Materion Gwledig a Gogledd Cymru i wneud y cynnig—Lesley Griffiths.
The final item today is the Wine (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2024, and I call on the Minister for Rural Affairs and North Wales to make the motion—Lesley Griffiths.
Cynnig NDM8455 Lesley Griffiths
Cynnig bod y Senedd, yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 27.5, yn cymeradwyo bod y fersiwn ddrafft o Reoliadau Gwin (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2024 yn cael ei gwneud yn unol â’r fersiwn ddrafft a osodwyd yn y Swyddfa Gyflwyno ar 12 Rhagfyr 2023.
Motion NDM8455 Lesley Griffiths
To propose that the Senedd, in accordance with Standing Order 27.5, approves that the draft The Wine (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2024 is made in accordance with the draft laid in the Table Office on 12 December 2023.
Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
Diolch, Deputy Presiding Officer. And I move the motion to approve the Wine (Amendment) (Wales) Regulations 2024.
The regulations have been subject to consultation in 2023, which found widespread industry support for the changes made by the regulations. The changes include a range of technical production matters, which permit wine businesses to adopt methods agreed by the latest internationally agreed standards. The regulations also include a provision about ice wine that is required by the UK signing the comprehensive and progressive agreement for trans-Pacific partnership treaty. The regulations would come into force on 15 July 2024.
The Welsh wine industry is relatively small compared to the wider Welsh food and drink industry and is very small-scale compared to English wine businesses. However, the industry has further potential, and making the regulations enables our wine businesses to operate on equal terms with English and European businesses in the market. Without these changes, our businesses would be at a competitive disadvantage.
These amendments would align with legislation being introduced by both the UK and Scottish Governments, limiting any divergences between how the laws apply in Wales and the rest of Great Britain. I'm grateful to the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee for its consideration of the regulations, and I ask Members to approve the regulations today. Diolch.
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Ac rwy'n cynnig cymeradwyo Rheoliadau Gwin (Diwygio) (Cymru) 2024.
Mae'r rheoliadau wedi bod yn destun ymgynghoriad yn 2023, a ganfu gefnogaeth eang yn y diwydiant ar gyfer y newidiadau a wnaed gan y rheoliadau. Mae'r newidiadau'n cynnwys amrywiaeth o faterion cynhyrchu technegol, sy'n caniatáu i fusnesau gwin fabwysiadu dulliau y cytunwyd arnyn nhw gan y safonau diweddaraf cytunedig rhyngwladol. Mae'r rheoliadau hefyd yn cynnwys darpariaeth am win iâ sy'n ofynnol drwy i'r DU lofnodi cytundeb partneriaeth gynhwysfawr a blaengar y Môr Tawel. Bydd y rheoliadau yn dod i rym ar 15 Gorffennaf 2024.
Mae diwydiant gwin Cymru yn gymharol fach o'i gymharu â'r diwydiant bwyd a diod ehangach yng Nghymru ac mae'n un raddfa fach iawn o'i gymharu â busnesau gwin Lloegr. Fodd bynnag, mae gan y diwydiant botensial pellach, ac mae gwneud y rheoliadau yn galluogi ein busnesau gwin i weithredu ar yr un telerau â busnesau Lloegr ac Ewrop yn y farchnad. Heb y newidiadau hyn, byddai ein busnesau dan anfantais gystadleuol.
Byddai'r diwygiadau hyn yn cyd-fynd â deddfwriaeth sy'n cael ei chyflwyno gan Lywodraethau'r DU a'r Alban, gan gyfyngu ar unrhyw wahaniaethau rhwng sut mae'r deddfau'n berthnasol yng Nghymru a gweddill Prydain Fawr. Rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Pwyllgor Deddfwriaeth, Cyfiawnder a'r Cyfansoddiad am ystyried y rheoliadau, a gofynnaf i'r Aelodau gymeradwyo'r rheoliadau heddiw. Diolch.
Nid oes unrhyw siaradwyr eraill. Felly, y cwestiwn yw: a ddylid derbyn y cynnig? A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? Nac oes, felly derbynnir y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
I have no other speakers. So, the proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No, the motion is therefore agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
Derbyniwyd y cynnig yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.36.
Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.
A daw hynny â thrafodion heddiw i ben.
And that brings today's proceedings to a close.
Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 18:34.
The meeting ended at 18:34.