Y Cyfarfod Llawn - Y Bumed Senedd
Plenary - Fifth Senedd
12/06/2019Cynnwys
Contents
Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad am 13:30 gyda’r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair.
The Assembly met at 13:30 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.
Galw'r Aelodau i drefn.
I call Members to order.
Yr eitem gyntaf ar ein hagenda ni'r prynhawn yma yw'r cwestiynau i Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth, ac mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf gan Alun Davies.
The first item on our agenda this afternoon is questions to the Minister for Economy and Transport, and the first question is from Alun Davies.
1. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am gysylltiadau trafnidiaeth â gwasanaethau allweddol ym Mlaenau Gwent? OAQ54016
1. Will the Minister make a statement on transport links to key services in Blaenau Gwent? OAQ54016
Yes, of course. Transport links are vital to our economy, and we are committed to ensuring a modern and integrated transport system with improved links to key services across the whole of Wales, including, of course, Blaenau Gwent.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Mae cysylltiadau trafnidiaeth yn hanfodol i'n heconomi, ac rydym wedi ymrwymo i sicrhau system drafnidiaeth fodern ac integredig gyda gwell cysylltiadau â gwasanaethau allweddol ledled Cymru, gan gynnwys Blaenau Gwent wrth gwrs.
I'm grateful to the Minister for that answer. The Minister will be aware of the record-breaking investment we are seeing in the health service for Blaenau Gwent and the whole of south-east Wales. He will be aware of the £350 million investment in the new Grange University Hospital serving Blaenau Gwent and other parts of south-east Wales. He'll also be aware that, as we deliver these world-class services, we need to ensure that people have strong, robust and reliable transport services to enable them to access the new hospital and the services that it delivers. Can he reassure me and people in Blaenau Gwent this afternoon that the Welsh Government is working collectively—himself as the transport Minister, working with the health Minister, and others—to ensure that, when this new hospital is opened, we will be able to access those services, that there will be the transport links in place, and that we will be able to enjoy the benefits of world-class healthcare, brought to us by this Welsh Labour Government?
Rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Gweinidog am yr ateb hwnnw. Bydd y Gweinidog yn ymwybodol o'r buddsoddiad mwy nag erioed a welwn yn y gwasanaeth iechyd ar gyfer Blaenau Gwent, a de-ddwyrain Cymru i gyd. Fe fydd yn ymwybodol o'r buddsoddiad o £350 miliwn yn Ysbyty Prifysgol Grange, sy’n ysbyty newydd ac sy'n gwasanaethu Blaenau Gwent a rhannau eraill o dde-ddwyrain Cymru. Fe fydd yn gwybod hefyd, wrth i ni ddarparu'r gwasanaethau o'r radd flaenaf, fod angen i ni sicrhau bod gan bobl wasanaethau trafnidiaeth cadarn a dibynadwy, i'w galluogi i gael mynediad at yr ysbyty newydd a'r gwasanaethau y mae'n eu darparu. A all roi sicrwydd i mi a phobl Blaenau Gwent y prynhawn yma fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio’n gyfunol—ef ei hun fel Gweinidog trafnidiaeth yn gweithio gyda'r Gweinidog iechyd ac eraill—i sicrhau, pan fydd yr ysbyty newydd hwn yn agor, y gallwn ddefnyddio’r gwasanaethau hynny, y bydd y cysylltiadau trafnidiaeth yn weithredol, ac y gallwn fwynhau manteision gofal iechyd o'r radd flaenaf, wedi’u darparu ar ein cyfer gan y Llywodraeth Lafur hon yng Nghymru?
Alun Davies makes an incredibly important point—that social infrastructure and transport infrastructure, and the services provided by the NHS, education, and services provided through transport providers, are integrated and planned together. And I am aware of the concern that the local Member has outlined this afternoon. I am already in discussions with the health Minister concerning public transport links to the Grange hospital. And I would also urge the local authority to ensure that it uses the bus services support grant, in addition to its own revenue support grant, wisely, to assist people in getting to and from non-emergency appointments. I'm also pleased to be able to say that we'll be testing innovative forms of integrated responsive bus travel in the Valleys, and the trial will very much focus on non-emergency patient transport.
Mae Alun Davies yn gwneud pwynt hynod o bwysig—fod seilwaith cymdeithasol a seilwaith trafnidiaeth, a'r gwasanaethau a ddarperir gan y GIG, addysg, a gwasanaethau a ddarperir drwy ddarparwyr trafnidiaeth, wedi’u hintegreiddio a'u cynllunio gyda'i gilydd. Ac rwy'n ymwybodol o'r pryder y mae'r Aelod lleol wedi'i amlinellu y prynhawn yma. Rwyf eisoes yn trafod gyda'r Gweinidog iechyd ynghylch cysylltiadau trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ag ysbyty Grange. A buaswn hefyd yn annog yr awdurdod lleol i sicrhau ei fod yn defnyddio'r grant cynnal gwasanaethau bysiau, yn ogystal â'i grant cynnal refeniw ei hun, yn ddoeth er mwyn cynorthwyo pobl i ddod i apwyntiadau nad ydynt yn rhai brys. Rwyf hefyd yn falch o allu dweud y byddwn yn profi mathau arloesol o wasanaethau bws ymatebol integredig yn y Cymoedd, a bydd y treial yn canolbwyntio'n fawr ar gludiant cleifion mewn achosion nad ydynt yn rhai brys.
Minister, I just heard your reply to Alun Davies's question, and it is very encouraging. One of the biggest concerns raised by the people living in the Valleys' communities of my region is the provision or frequency of bus services in their areas. Flexible and accessible community transport services can play an important role in helping people to reach key services, especially when their needs are not met by public transport. Minister, what plan does the Welsh Government have to increase transport support for community transport services, through the bus services support grant to local authorities? Thank you.
Weinidog, clywais eich ateb i gwestiwn Alun Davies yn awr, ac mae'n galonogol iawn. Un o'r pryderon mwyaf a fynegwyd gan y bobl sy'n byw yng nghymunedau’r Cymoedd yn fy rhanbarth yw darpariaeth neu amlder gwasanaethau bws yn eu hardaloedd. Gall gwasanaethau cludiant cymunedol hyblyg a hygyrch chwarae rhan bwysig yn helpu pobl i gyrraedd gwasanaethau allweddol, yn enwedig pan na fydd trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn diwallu eu hanghenion. Weinidog, pa gynllun sydd gan Lywodraeth Cymru i gynyddu cymorth trafnidiaeth ar gyfer gwasanaethau cludiant cymunedol, drwy'r grant cynnal gwasanaethau bysiau i awdurdodau lleol? Diolch.
Well, Mohammad Asghar raises an incredibly important point about the value of community transport, particularly in rural areas. And we're very clear with local authorities, when we issue the bus services support grant, that a degree of that grant should be retained and utilised to support community transport. Mohammad Asghar will also be aware of the package of reforms that we've been consulting on, and the proposals for legislation, and, alongside this, the various trials that are to commence across Wales looking at demand-responsive transport. And it's my view that demand-responsive transport, working in tandem with community transport services, could offer solutions across the length and breadth of Wales that, to date, have not been deployed. But it will require those radical reforms that are outlined in the White Paper.
Wel, mae Mohammad Asghar yn nodi pwynt hynod o bwysig am werth cludiant cymunedol, yn enwedig mewn ardaloedd gwledig. Ac rydym yn glir iawn gydag awdurdodau lleol, pan fyddwn yn dosbarthu'r grant cynnal gwasanaethau bysiau, y dylid cadw a defnyddio rhywfaint o'r grant i gefnogi cludiant cymunedol. Bydd Mohammad Asghar hefyd yn ymwybodol o'r pecyn o ddiwygiadau y buom yn ymgynghori arnynt, a'r argymhellion ar gyfer deddfwriaeth, ac ochr yn ochr â hyn, yr amrywiol dreialon a fydd yn dechrau ledled Cymru i edrych ar drafnidiaeth ar alw. Ac yn fy marn i, gallai'r drafnidiaeth ar alw honno, yn gweithio ar y cyd â gwasanaethau cludiant cymunedol, gynnig atebion ledled Cymru nad ydynt wedi cael eu defnyddio hyd yma. Ond bydd angen y diwygiadau radical a amlinellwyd yn y Papur Gwyn.
Cabinet Minister, is it not true that one cannot speak about transport links to Blaenau Gwent without discussing the rail link of the Ebbw Vale line into Newport? I know that the Member for Blaenau Gwent has dismissed this as unimportant for his constituents, but I see it as a vital part of the overall connectivity of the region. Could the Cabinet Minister, therefore, update us on any progress being made with regard to this link? After all, the people of Blaenau Gwent and the surrounding area have been waiting close to 10 years to see this put in place.
Weinidog y Cabinet, onid yw'n wir na all rhywun siarad am gysylltiadau trafnidiaeth â Blaenau Gwent heb drafod cyswllt rheilffordd Glynebwy i Gasnewydd? Gwn fod yr Aelod dros Flaenau Gwent wedi diystyru hyn fel rhywbeth nad yw’n bwysig i'w etholwyr, ond rwy'n ei weld fel rhan hanfodol o gysylltedd cyffredinol y rhanbarth. A allai Gweinidog y Cabinet roi’r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i ni felly ar unrhyw gynnydd sy'n cael ei wneud mewn perthynas â’r cyswllt hwn? Wedi'r cyfan, mae pobl Blaenau Gwent a'r ardal gyfagos wedi bod yn aros bron i 10 mlynedd i weld hyn yn cael ei roi ar waith.
Can I thank the Member for the question and say that I am acutely aware of the tension that exists across various communities insofar as rail links are concerned on the Ebbw line? And that's why we are committed to taking forward plans to introduce four trains per hour as soon as we possibly can do on the Ebbw Vale line. And it's something that I've been working very closely with the local Member, Alun Davies, on for some time. But I can tell the Member today that we are committed to introduce an hourly service between Ebbw Vale town and Newport from 2021. I'm also pleased to say that brand-new trains will be introduced on the services through Blaenau Gwent during 2022, and this will provide, obviously, increased capacity and level boarding. Those brand-new trains, Llywydd, will provide a massive increase in capacity for passengers, with a total capacity of 425. That compares to today's 292.
A gaf fi ddiolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn, a dweud fy mod yn ymwybodol iawn o'r tensiwn sy'n bodoli mewn gwahanol gymunedau ynghylch cysylltiadau rheilffordd ar reilffordd Glynebwy? A dyna pam ein bod wedi ymrwymo i fwrw ymlaen â chynlluniau i gyflwyno pedwar trên yr awr cyn gynted ag y gallwn ar reilffordd Glynebwy. Ac mae'n rhywbeth y bûm yn gweithio'n agos iawn gyda'r Aelod lleol, Alun Davies, arno ers peth amser. Ond gallaf ddweud wrth yr Aelod heddiw ein bod wedi ymrwymo i gyflwyno gwasanaeth bob awr rhwng tref Glynebwy a Chasnewydd o 2021 ymlaen. Rwyf hefyd yn falch o ddweud y bydd trenau newydd sbon yn cael eu cyflwyno ar gyfer y gwasanaethau drwy Flaenau Gwent yn ystod 2022, a bydd hyn, yn amlwg, yn cynyddu capasiti a threnau ar lefel y platfform. Lywydd, bydd y trenau newydd sbon hyn yn darparu lle i lawer mwy o deithwyr, gyda chyfanswm capasiti o 425, o gymharu â 292 heddiw.
2. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am yr hyn y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i wella gwasanaethau trenau yng ngorllewin Cymru? OAQ53980
2. Will the Minister make a statement on what the Welsh Government is doing to improve train services in west Wales? OAQ53980
Yes, of course. As well as commitments made through the new rail franchise and the development of integrated transport interchanges, we are working with the Secretary of State for Wales to push for additional services to west Wales and investment from UK Government in the rail infrastructure that will, in turn, lead to additional capacity, faster journey times, and, of course, new stations.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Yn ogystal ag ymrwymiadau a wnaethpwyd drwy'r fasnachfraint reilffyrdd newydd a datblygiad cyfnewidfeydd trafnidiaeth integredig, rydym yn gweithio gydag Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru i wthio am wasanaethau ychwanegol i orllewin Cymru a buddsoddiad gan Lywodraeth y DU yn y seilwaith rheilffyrdd a fydd yn ei dro yn arwain at gapasiti ychwanegol, amseroedd teithio cyflymach, a gorsafoedd newydd wrth gwrs.
Minister, I've raised the issue of Milford Haven train station in my constituency on several occasions with successive Welsh Governments over the years. Now, this train station is being used by an ever-increasing number of cruise ship visitors and tourists each year, and although improvements have been promised in recent years, it's currently deteriorating and in a very poor state of repair. Given its strategic importance to Pembrokeshire and, indeed, to west Wales, what plans does the Government have to help to improve Milford Haven train station in the future?
Weinidog, rwyf wedi codi mater gorsaf drenau Aberdaugleddau yn fy etholaeth ar sawl achlysur gyda Llywodraethau Cymru olynol dros y blynyddoedd. Nawr, mae'r orsaf drenau hon yn cael ei defnyddio gan nifer cynyddol o ymwelwyr llongau mordeithio a thwristiaid bob blwyddyn, ac er bod gwelliannau wedi cael eu haddo yn ystod y blynyddoedd diwethaf, mae'n dirywio ar hyn o bryd ac mewn cyflwr gwael iawn. O ystyried ei phwysigrwydd strategol i sir Benfro, ac i orllewin Cymru yn wir, pa gynlluniau sydd gan y Llywodraeth i helpu i wella gorsaf drenau Aberdaugleddau yn y dyfodol?
Paul Davies makes the valuable point that train stations often form the gateway of many communities, particularly tourist destinations, and therefore must be appealing in the way that they are presented and must have modern services contained within them. Of course, investment in rail infrastructure is a responsibility of UK Government, but as a result of the negotiations that took place during the procurement exercise for the new Wales and borders franchise, we were able to agree to a £200 million investment in stations across the network. That £200 million over the next 15 years compares very favourably to the £600,000 that was spent in total by the previous franchise holder in the last 15 years, and that £200 million will go a long way to reintroducing business opportunities into many stations that have rooms that are locked up and closed off. It will enhance the visitor economy through making train stations more appealing, more desirable places in which to invest, and we're also looking, where and whenever possible, alongside Visit Wales, to utilise train stations to promote rural economies and the visitor economy of Wales, and I can assure the Member that the stations that are contained within his area will benefit from investment, and that Milford Haven station will, of course, be a beneficiary of the £200 million that will be invested in stations.
Mae Paul Davies yn gwneud pwynt gwerthfawr fod gorsafoedd trên yn aml yn borth i lawer o gymunedau, yn enwedig cyrchfannau twristiaid, ac felly bod yn rhaid iddynt fod yn atyniadol o ran eu golwg a chynnwys gwasanaethau modern. Wrth gwrs, cyfrifoldeb Llywodraeth y DU yw buddsoddi yn y seilwaith rheilffyrdd, ond o ganlyniad i'r trafodaethau a gynhaliwyd yn ystod yr ymarfer caffael ar gyfer masnachfraint newydd Cymru a'r gororau, llwyddasom i gytuno ar fuddsoddiad o £200 miliwn mewn gorsafoedd ar draws y rhwydwaith. Mae'r £200 miliwn hwnnw dros y 15 mlynedd nesaf yn cymharu'n ffafriol iawn â'r cyfanswm o £600,000 a wariwyd gan ddeiliad blaenorol y fasnachfraint dros y 15 mlynedd diwethaf, a bydd y £200 miliwn yn gwneud llawer i ailgyflwyno cyfleoedd busnes mewn llawer o orsafoedd sydd ag ystafelloedd na chânt eu defnyddio. Bydd yn gwella'r economi ymwelwyr drwy sicrhau bod gorsafoedd trenau yn llefydd mwy atyniadol, mwy dymunol i fuddsoddi ynddynt, ac rydym hefyd yn chwilio am gyfleoedd lle bynnag y bo modd ochr yn ochr â Croeso Cymru, i ddefnyddio gorsafoedd trenau i hyrwyddo economïau gwledig ac economi ymwelwyr Cymru, a gallaf sicrhau'r Aelod y bydd y gorsafoedd yn ei ardal yn elwa o fuddsoddiad, ac y bydd gorsaf Aberdaugleddau, wrth gwrs, yn cael budd o'r £200 miliwn a fuddsoddir yn y gorsafoedd.
Minister, last month I raised with you the issue of frequency of services stopping at request stops like Kidwelly station. I wonder if you've had an opportunity yet to raise some of those questions with the provider. There's also an issue about, where request stops are available, how easy it is for passengers to make that request and how aware passengers are of how to do that. So, can I press you again to have further conversations with Transport for Wales? I'm sure their intentions here are good, but we won't persuade people to use those public transport services unless we make it as easy as possible for them to do so, and the representations that I'm receiving from constituents along that line, particularly where you have got the request stop issue, is that it isn't always easy, that you don't always get the guard coming through quickly enough to be able to make that request, or you may not even know that that's how you can make the request. So, is there something further that we can do with Transport for Wales to make that easier?
Weinidog, y mis diwethaf gofynnais i chi ynglŷn ag amlder y gwasanaethau sy'n stopio mewn arosfannau ar gais megis gorsaf Cydweli. Tybed a ydych wedi cael cyfle eto i drafod rhai o'r cwestiynau hynny gyda'r darparwr. Lle mae arosfannau ar gais ar gael, mae yna gwestiwn hefyd ynglŷn â pha mor hawdd yw hi i deithwyr wneud y cais a pha mor ymwybodol yw teithwyr o sut i wneud hynny. Felly, a gaf fi bwyso arnoch eto i gael trafodaethau pellach gyda Trafnidiaeth Cymru? Rwy'n siŵr fod eu bwriadau'n dda, ond ni lwyddwn i berswadio pobl i ddefnyddio'r gwasanaethau trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus hynny oni bai ein bod yn ei gwneud mor hawdd â phosibl iddynt wneud hynny, ac mae'r sylwadau a gaf gan etholwyr sy'n byw ger y rheilffordd honno, yn enwedig lle mae gennych y broblem gyda'r arosfan ar gais, yn dangos nad yw hi bob amser yn hawdd, nad yw'r gard yn dod drwodd yn ddigon cyflym bob amser i allu gwneud y cais, neu efallai nad ydych yn gwybod mai dyna sut y gallwch wneud y cais. Felly, a oes rhywbeth pellach y gallwn ei wneud gyda Trafnidiaeth Cymru i wneud hynny'n haws?
I'd like to thank Helen Mary Jones for the question, and I'd agree with her that we should be working very closely with Transport for Wales to ensure that all passengers are aware of how to request stops. In addition, we will liaise with community rail partnerships—we're investing more money in those partnerships in this rail franchise period—and we'll also work with station adoption groups as well to ensure that all relevant authorities and passenger groups are aware of how to go about ensuring that they can stop at requested stations
Hoffwn ddiolch i Helen Mary Jones am y cwestiwn, a buaswn yn cytuno â hi y dylem weithio'n agos iawn gyda Trafnidiaeth Cymru i sicrhau bod pob teithiwr yn gwybod sut i wneud cais i stopio mewn arosfannau ar gais. Yn ogystal, byddwn yn cysylltu â phartneriaethau rheilffordd cymunedol—rydym yn buddsoddi mwy o arian yn y partneriaethau hynny dros gyfnod y fasnachfraint reilffyrdd hon—a byddwn hefyd yn gweithio gyda grwpiau mabwysiadu gorsafoedd i sicrhau bod pob awdurdod a grŵp teithwyr perthnasol yn ymwybodol o sut i fynd ati i sicrhau y gallant stopio mewn gorsafoedd ar gais.
Minister, the Tories actually promised to deliver electrification to Swansea, which would definitely have improved services further west than Swansea. Now, we all know they reneged on that promise and as such, services west of Cardiff will not have UK Government support for any infrastructure work and modernisation. Now, that gives the wider impression that anything west of Cardiff is also not open for business and not interested in investors from the UK Government. When the new Prime Minister is elected, whoever that may be, will you therefore make a commitment to actually seek to get them to do another u-turn and actually honour their commitment so that we can see electrification to Swansea, which then improves the links to the west, but also perhaps we ask them to make sure that they also follow Welsh Labour's calls that Wales is open for business to all investors?
Weinidog, fe addawodd y Torïaid ddarparu trydaneiddio i Abertawe, rhywbeth a fyddai'n sicr wedi gwella gwasanaethau ymhellach i'r gorllewin nag Abertawe. Nawr, gŵyr pawb ohonom eu bod wedi torri'r addewid hwnnw ac o'r herwydd, ni fydd gwasanaethau i'r gorllewin o Gaerdydd yn cael cymorth gan Lywodraeth y DU ar gyfer unrhyw waith seilwaith na moderneiddio. Nawr, mae hynny'n rhoi'r argraff ehangach nad yw unrhyw beth i'r gorllewin o Gaerdydd yn agored i fusnes chwaith ac nad oes diddordeb mewn buddsoddwyr gan Lywodraeth y DU. Pan etholir y Prif Weinidog newydd, pwy bynnag y bo, a wnewch chi ymrwymo felly i geisio'u cael i wneud tro pedol arall a chadw eu hymrwymiad mewn gwirionedd er mwyn inni allu gweld trydaneiddio i Abertawe, sydd wedyn yn gwella'r cysylltiadau â'r gorllewin, ond hefyd efallai y gallem ofyn iddynt sicrhau eu bod yn gwrando ar alwadau Llafur Cymru fod Cymru'n agored i fusnes i bob buddsoddwr?
I thank David Rees for his question and I agree with his points. Obviously Wales has been short-changed for some time now and I'll continue to press for fair funding from UK Government, and I'd ask for the support of all Assembly Members in this regard.
I don't think we need to wait until there is a new Prime Minister to demand that we have responsibilities and funding for rail infrastructure devolved, because Keith Williams is carrying out a root-and-branch review of Britain's railways right now and that provides an opportunity to reform the railway system and services across the UK and create a fully integrated public transport network that Wales needs. Our expectation is for the Williams review to set out a very clear pathway for further devolution for Wales, and, as I say, I'd be very grateful for the support of Assembly Members in our call for that.
Diolch i David Rees am ei gwestiwn ac rwy'n cytuno â'i bwyntiau. Yn amlwg, mae Cymru wedi cael cam ers cryn amser bellach a byddaf yn parhau i bwyso am gyllid teg gan Lywodraeth y DU, a hoffwn ofyn am gefnogaeth pob Aelod Cynulliad yn hyn o beth.
Nid wyf yn credu bod angen aros nes y gwelwn Brif Weinidog newydd i fynnu ein bod yn cael cyfrifoldebau a chyllid ar gyfer y seilwaith rheilffyrdd wedi'i ddatganoli, oherwydd mae Keith Williams yn cynnal adolygiad gwraidd a brig o reilffyrdd Prydain ar hyn o bryd ac mae hwnnw'n rhoi cyfle i ddiwygio'r system reilffyrdd a gwasanaethau ledled y DU a chreu'r rhwydwaith trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus cwbl integredig sydd ei angen ar Gymru. Rydym yn disgwyl y bydd adolygiad Williams yn gosod llwybr clir iawn ar gyfer datganoli pellach i Gymru, ac fel y dywedais, buaswn yn ddiolchgar iawn am gefnogaeth Aelodau'r Cynulliad wrth alw am hynny.
Cwestiynau nawr gan lefarwyr y pleidiau. Llefarydd Plaid Cymru, Bethan Sayed.
Questions now from party spokespeople. The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Bethan Sayed.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Given that Wales is currently facing potentially turbulent economic times, as we discussed only yesterday, with the potential closure of Ford, we believe here that we should do as much as possible to diversify the Welsh economy—for example, developing infrastructure so that, as a country, we can offer our businesses the ability to take advantage of emerging global markets. Can the Minister outline what the Welsh Government is doing to diversify the Welsh economy under his leadership?
Diolch yn fawr iawn. O ystyried bod Cymru ar hyn o bryd yn wynebu cyfnod economaidd a allai fod yn gythryblus, fel y trafodasom ddoe ddiwethaf, gyda'r posibilrwydd y bydd Ford yn cau, credwn yn y fan hon y dylem wneud cymaint ag y gallwn i arallgyfeirio economi Cymru—er enghraifft, datblygu seilwaith er mwyn i ni fel gwlad allu cynnig y gallu i'n busnesau fanteisio ar farchnadoedd byd-eang sy'n dod i'r amlwg. A all y Gweinidog amlinellu'r hyn y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i arallgyfeirio economi Cymru o dan ei arweinyddiaeth?
Yes, of course. This is an incredibly important matter to consider as we approach EU exit date. It's absolutely essential that we look at whether we need to turn the dial on the actions contained within the Welsh Government's economic action plan, specifically with regard to decarbonisation and futureproofing businesses. In many respects, Wales has a diverse economy compared to the UK, where manufacturing is at a very, very low level indeed and where there is a very heavy reliance on the service sector, particularly in certain geographical parts of the UK. It's my belief that, given the investment we've made over many years since devolution, the economy is in a strong position.
We will go on ensuring that we grow small and micro-sized firms so that we encourage the growth of medium-sized firms, and that, wherever possible, we encourage businesses to embrace modern technology and modern ways of working. But our actions in the economic action plan were specifically designed to deal with the challenges of the automation industry 4.0 and Brexit. They are there; we are dealing with them. We are delivering on those actions and, as a consequence, we do now have an unemployment rate that is at, or around, record low levels.
Gallaf, wrth gwrs. Mae hwn yn fater eithriadol o bwysig i'w ystyried wrth i ni nesáu at ddyddiad gadael yr UE. Mae'n gwbl hanfodol ein bod yn ystyried a oes angen inni ddwysáu'r camau sydd wedi'u cynnwys yng nghynllun gweithredu economaidd Llywodraeth Cymru, yn benodol mewn perthynas â datgarboneiddio a diogelu busnesau ar gyfer y dyfodol. Mewn sawl ffordd, mae gan Gymru economi amrywiol o gymharu â'r DU, lle mae gweithgynhyrchu ar lefel isel iawn yn wir a lle mae dibyniaeth fawr iawn ar y sector gwasanaethau, yn enwedig mewn rhai rhannau daearyddol o'r DU. O gofio'r buddsoddiad a wnaethom dros flynyddoedd lawer ers datganoli, mae'r economi mewn sefyllfa gref yn fy marn i.
Byddwn yn parhau i sicrhau ein bod yn tyfu cwmnïau bach a microfusnesau er mwyn inni annog twf cwmnïau canolig eu maint, a lle bynnag y bo'n bosibl, ein bod yn annog busnesau i groesawu technoleg fodern a ffyrdd modern o weithio. Ond cafodd ein gweithredoedd yn y cynllun gweithredu economaidd eu cynllunio'n benodol i ymdrin â heriau'r diwydiant awtomeiddio 4.0 a Brexit. Maent yno; rydym yn ymdrin â hwy. Rydym yn cyflawni'r camau hynny ac o'r herwydd, erbyn hyn mae gennym gyfradd ddiweithdra sydd ar lefel is nag erioed, neu o gwmpas hynny.
Thank you very much for that answer, and I recognise the work on decarbonisation, but I wanted to focus on digital, and I think that Wales is unprepared for, potentially, the next industrial revolution. We led the last one, but we are still lagging behind in this regard. Just to give you an example, there are large sections of society that even struggle to get 3G coverage as opposed to coverage in any other shape or form. And, of course, these are many rural areas, but agri-tech is stopped in its tracks by virtue of the fact that they don't even have that basic coverage.
So, we already have a lot of this infrastructure in Wales. The investment packages exist through the city deals, and the UK Government's £200 million rural fibre fund. So, we think that Transport for Wales, believe it or not, can act as an enabler for the creation of interconnected, international 5G fibre and space technologies infrastructure for Wales, and the cost of a national digital infrastructure could be in the region of £110 million, with the potential for half of this being covered by the UK Government's rural fibre fund.
So, this isn't just about the digital infrastructure in and of itself; it's about positioning Wales at the forefront of new industries. So, what steps are you taking in relation to digital infrastructure to facilitate the development of new industries, which, at the moment, are lagging purely because that isn't in existence?
Diolch yn fawr am yr ateb hwnnw, ac rwy'n cydnabod y gwaith ar ddatgarboneiddio, ond roeddwn am ganolbwyntio ar faterion digidol, a chredaf efallai nad yw Cymru'n barod ar gyfer y chwyldro diwydiannol nesaf. Arweiniasom y chwyldro diwydiannol diwethaf, ond rydym yn dal i fod ar ei hôl hi yn hyn o beth. I roi enghraifft i chi, mae rhannau helaeth o'r gymdeithas sy'n ei chael hi'n anodd cael signal 3G hyd yn oed, heb sôn am signal mewn unrhyw siâp neu ffurf arall. Ac wrth gwrs, ceir llawer o ardaloedd gwledig, ond mae technoleg amaethyddol yn cael ei rhwystro'n llwyr yn sgil y ffaith nad oes ganddynt y signal sylfaenol hwnnw.
Felly, mae gennym lawer o'r seilwaith hwn yng Nghymru eisoes. Mae'r pecynnau buddsoddi'n bodoli drwy'r bargeinion dinesig, a chronfa ffeibr gwledig £200 miliwn Llywodraeth y DU. Felly, credwn y gall Trafnidiaeth Cymru, credwch neu beidio, fod yn gyfrwng i greu seilwaith technoleg ffeibr 5G a thechnoleg ofod sy'n rhyngwladol a chydgysylltiedig ar gyfer Cymru, ac y gallai cost seilwaith digidol cenedlaethol fod oddeutu £110 miliwn, gyda'r posibilrwydd y bydd hanner y cyllid hwn yn dod o dan gronfa ffeibr gwledig Llywodraeth y DU.
Felly, nid ymwneud yn unig â'r seilwaith digidol y mae hyn; mae'n ymwneud â lleoli Cymru ar flaen y gad mewn diwydiannau newydd. Felly, pa gamau rydych yn eu cymryd mewn perthynas â seilwaith digidol i hwyluso datblygiad diwydiannau newydd sydd ar hyn o bryd yn llusgo ar ei hôl hi a hynny'n unig am nad yw'r seilwaith hwnnw'n bodoli?
When we were developing the economic action plan, we looked at how best we could drive innovation across Wales in order to drive up productivity rates. And we found that, in similar-sized countries with an economy similar to Wales, it's the diffusion of innovation rather than the development of new innovation that will enable an economy to advance. Therefore, we designed specifically the calls to action around the need for businesses to embrace digitisation. And it's through the prism of the calls to action that businesses now draw down funding. In addition to this, there is, of course, a digital exploitation endeavour that is being led by my deputy, Lee Waters, and I think the Member makes a really valuable point about the potential role of Transport for Wales as well. We've already tasked Transport for Wales to look at how it can encourage the market, the private sector, to deploy electric charging points across Wales, utilising the public asset of railway stations. And I think, moving forward, as we transfer more functions to Transport for Wales, we'll be able to look at them working in even more innovative spaces.
I think I should point out as well, though, that in terms of digital infrastructure and the exploitation of it, the north Wales growth deal—I know the Member mentioned growth deals and city deals as a vehicle for this purpose—has as its priority intervention a major digital programme, and I think that should be welcomed.
Pan oeddem yn datblygu'r cynllun gweithredu economaidd, edrychasom ar y ffordd orau o hybu arloesedd ledled Cymru er mwyn hybu cyfraddau cynhyrchiant. Ac mewn gwledydd o faint tebyg gydag economi debyg i Gymru, gwelsom mai tryledu arloesedd yn hytrach na datblygu arloesedd newydd sy'n mynd i alluogi economi i symud ymlaen. Felly, rydym wedi cynllunio'n benodol y galwadau i weithredu ar yr angen i fusnesau groesawu digideiddio. A thrwy brism y galwadau i weithredu y mae busnesau bellach yn hawlio cyllid. Yn ogystal â hyn wrth gwrs, mae yna ymdrech ddatblygu digidol sy'n cael ei harwain gan fy nirprwy, Lee Waters, ac rwy'n credu bod yr Aelod yn gwneud pwynt gwerthfawr iawn am rôl bosibl Trafnidiaeth Cymru hefyd. Rydym eisoes wedi gofyn i Trafnidiaeth Cymru ystyried sut y gall annog y farchnad, y sector preifat, i leoli pwyntiau gwefru trydan ledled Cymru, gan ddefnyddio ased cyhoeddus gorsafoedd rheilffordd. Ac rwy'n credu, wrth symud ymlaen, wrth i ni drosglwyddo mwy o swyddogaethau i Trafnidiaeth Cymru, y gallwn edrych arnynt yn gweithio mewn mannau mwy arloesol byth.
Er hynny, rwy'n meddwl y dylwn nodi hefyd, o ran seilwaith digidol a'r defnydd ohono, fod rhaglen ddigidol bwysig yn ymyrraeth flaenoriaethol i fargen twf gogledd Cymru—gwn fod yr Aelod wedi sôn am fargeinion twf a bargeinion dinesig fel cyfrwng at y diben hwn—a chredaf y dylid croesawu hynny.
Yes, thank you, and we are welcoming of that. I think the next steps are going to be vital, and there's no doubt about that. For us, I think, in Wales, and its partners, we will be able to deliver sectoral opportunities in health, autonomous vehicles, as you've mentioned, with electric vehicles, but not only that but hydrogen, as was mentioned yesterday, big data, artificial intelligence, manufacturing and aerospace. I think they're all part of the reason why the digital landscape needs to be enhanced upon.
According to the UK Government's research, the impact of 5G is estimated at £198 billion per annum by 2030, with a 10-year gross domestic product impact of £173 billion between 2020 and 2030. So, we must have an ambition to take a portion of that, and it's been suggested that Wales aims for a 10 per cent share of this, which would mean an uplift in GDP of £17.3 billion from 2020 to 2030. Will the Minister commit to working on a cross-party basis to pool together resources so that we can come up with new ideas in all of the areas that I mentioned earlier in my question, so that we can achieve these aims for Wales together? Because I think what's important is that we jump upon the opportunity to enhance upon the wealth of our nation with the skills that they have, but putting the infrastructure in place to allow them to do that.
Ie, diolch, ac rydym yn croesawu hynny. Rwy'n credu bod y camau nesaf yn mynd i fod yn hanfodol, ac nid oes amheuaeth am hynny. I ni yng Nghymru, a'i phartneriaid, credaf y gallwn ddarparu cyfleoedd sectoraidd mewn iechyd, cerbydau awtonomaidd, fel y crybwylloch chi, gyda cherbydau trydan, ond nid yn unig hynny ond hydrogen, fel y soniwyd ddoe, data mawr, deallusrwydd artiffisial, gweithgynhyrchu ac awyrofod. Rwy'n credu eu bod i gyd yn rhan o'r rheswm pam fod angen gwella'r tirlun digidol.
Yn ôl ymchwil Llywodraeth y DU, amcangyfrifir y bydd effaith 5G yn £198 biliwn y flwyddyn erbyn 2030, gydag effaith cynnyrch domestig gros 10 mlynedd o £173 biliwn rhwng 2020 a 2030. Felly, rhaid inni gael uchelgais i gymryd cyfran o hwnnw, ac awgrymwyd bod Cymru'n anelu at gyfran o 10 y cant o hyn, a fyddai'n golygu cynnydd o £17.3 biliwn yn y cynnyrch domestig gros rhwng 2020 a 2030. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ymrwymo i weithio ar sail drawsbleidiol i gyfuno adnoddau er mwyn inni allu cyflwyno syniadau newydd ym mhob un o'r meysydd a grybwyllais yn gynharach yn fy nghwestiwn, fel y gallwn gyflawni'r amcanion hyn ar gyfer Cymru gyda'n gilydd? Oherwydd credaf mai'r hyn sy'n bwysig yw ein bod yn neidio ar y cyfle i ehangu cyfoeth ein gwlad gyda'r sgiliau sydd ganddynt, ond gan roi'r seilwaith yn ei le i ganiatáu iddynt wneud hynny.
I'd like to welcome Bethan Jenkins's offer and say, yes, that is something that I'd like to proceed with. We certainly have no monopoly on good ideas, and I think it's important that we do recognise that Members across this Chamber have innovative ideas, energy and determination to influence Government policy for the better. So, I would like to take forward that offer. And I'd also say, as the Member has highlighted, that digital transcends all of those traditional sectors; it's part and parcel of all of the traditional sectors that we were prioritising until we developed the digital action plan, and we took digital and we made that a key enabler that crosses over all of the work that we do in terms of supporting business growth.
Hoffwn groesawu cynnig Bethan Jenkins a dweud, ydy, mae hynny'n rhywbeth yr hoffwn fwrw ymlaen ag ef. Yn sicr, nid oes gennym fonopoli ar syniadau da, ac rwy'n credu ei bod yn bwysig ein bod yn cydnabod bod gan Aelodau ar draws y Siambr hon syniadau arloesol, egni a phenderfyniad i ddylanwadu ar bolisi'r Llywodraeth er gwell. Felly, hoffwn fwrw ymlaen â'r cynnig hwnnw. Ac fel y mae'r Aelod wedi nodi, hoffwn ddweud bod y sector digidol yn bwysicach na phob un o'r sectorau traddodiadol hynny; mae'n rhan annatod o'r holl sectorau traddodiadol roeddem yn rhoi blaenoriaeth iddynt nes inni ddatblygu'r cynllun gweithredu digidol, a chymerasom y sector digidol a'i wneud yn alluogwr allweddol sy'n croesi'r holl waith a wnawn ar gefnogi twf busnesau.
Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Russell George.
Conservatives spokesperson, Russell George.
Diolch, Presiding Officer. Minister, can I ask how confident you are that this new commission that you have established to look at the M4 relief road will come to a conclusion in the space of just six months, after, of course, spending £140 million on the project over the last six years? Given that the public inquiry has already looked at 28 different alternatives, what is there new to consider and how confident are you that this new commission's recommendations won't simply be put in the bin by the First Minister if it doesn't conform with his view?
Diolch, Lywydd. Weinidog, a gaf fi ofyn pa mor hyderus ydych chi y bydd y comisiwn newydd a sefydlwyd gennych i edrych ar ffordd liniaru'r M4 yn cwblhau ei waith mewn chwe mis yn unig, ar ôl gwario £140 miliwn ar y prosiect dros y chwe blynedd diwethaf wrth gwrs? O gofio bod yr ymchwiliad cyhoeddus eisoes wedi edrych ar 28 dewis gwahanol, beth sydd i'w ystyried o'r newydd a pha mor hyderus ydych chi na fydd argymhellion y comisiwn newydd hwn yn cael eu rhoi yn y bin gan y Prif Weinidog os nad yw'n cydymffurfio â'i farn?
Can I thank Russell George for his questions? I have every confidence in the commission looking at this important subject matter, and developing not just the proposals that are put forward potentially into a combination, a package, of interventions, but also in looking at potential new innovations and interventions that were not considered back in 2010 to 2014, when the black route emerged as the favoured option. There were, of course, more than 20 alternatives recommended to the planning inspector, but, in addition to that, the Welsh Government had considered 200 or so solutions back in 2010 to 2014. We're in the process of providing technical briefings to the chair of the commission. We're also in the process of identifying and appointing additional commission members. They'll have support from Welsh Government in scrutinising all of the traffic modelling, all of the data that exists, and I do have confidence in them reporting back in six months with strong recommendations that this Government will be able to take forward.
I recognise that the figure attached to the development cost of the proposed black route is significant, but it does represent something in the order of just 6 per cent of the overall project cost that was estimated, and that, as I've said in this Chamber, compares very favourably to other projects. You only need to look at development costs of projects such as HS2 to appreciate that you cannot deliver a major infrastructure project in the western world without incurring significant development costs.
A gaf fi ddiolch i Russell George am ei gwestiynau? Mae gennyf bob ffydd yn y comisiwn sy'n edrych ar y pwnc pwysig hwn ac sy'n datblygu nid yn unig y cynigion a gyflwynir yn gyfuniad, yn becyn, o ymyriadau o bosibl, ond sydd hefyd yn edrych ar ddatblygiadau ac ymyriadau newydd posibl na chawsant eu hystyried yn ôl yn 2010 i 2014, pan ddaeth y llwybr du i'r amlwg fel yr opsiwn a ffafriwyd. Wrth gwrs, roedd mwy nag 20 o ddewisiadau amgen wedi'u hargymell i'r arolygydd cynllunio, ond yn ogystal â hynny, roedd Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ystyried 200 neu fwy o atebion yn ôl yn 2010 i 2014. Rydym wrthi'n darparu briffiau technegol i gadeirydd y comisiwn. Rydym hefyd yn y broses o nodi a phenodi aelodau ychwanegol i'r comisiwn. Byddant yn cael cefnogaeth gan Lywodraeth Cymru i graffu ar yr holl fodelu traffig, yr holl ddata sy'n bodoli, ac mae gennyf ffydd y byddant yn adrodd yn ôl mewn chwe mis gydag argymhellion cryf y bydd y Llywodraeth hon yn gallu bwrw ymlaen â hwy.
Rwy'n cydnabod bod y ffigur sydd ynghlwm wrth gost ddatblygu'r llwybr du arfaethedig yn un sylweddol, ond mae oddeutu 6 y cant yn unig o holl gost amcangyfrifedig y prosiect, ac mae hynny, fel y dywedais yn y Siambr hon, yn cymharu'n ffafriol iawn â phrosiectau eraill. Nid oes ond angen ichi edrych ar gostau datblygu prosiectau fel HS2 i ddeall na allwch gyflawni prosiect seilwaith mawr yn y byd gorllewinol heb wynebu costau datblygu sylweddol.
Thank you for your answer, Minister. In many ways, it demonstrates how much time and resource the Government has spent on looking at alternative routes already, which is the basis, really, of my question.
Turning to the public inquiry itself, obviously, Members and I have had time to digest the public inquiry report. In his statement, the First Minister said that he would not have gone ahead with the Government's own proposals, even if he felt they were affordable, on the grounds of impact on the environment. So, if I can just explore that for a moment: the Welsh Government's own evidence, provided by Natural Resources Wales and advocated by your own Welsh Government barristers said that the scheme would be carbon neutral over time and compatible with the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. The inspector agreed with your, the Welsh Government's, own opinion and said it was sound and also agreed that the proposed extensive mitigation for the impact on the Gwent levels, developed alongside NRW, could certainly be considered as taking reasonable steps to comply with the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981. Now, the point I would make here, Minister, is that if you now disagree with your own Welsh Government proposals, do you believe that the legislation contained within the Environment (Wales) Act 2016 and the well-being of future generations Act is sufficient? And how does this decision throw into doubt other transport schemes in Wales, such as the Deeside corridor scheme and, of course, other areas where there needs to be much improvement, along the A40, the A55 and the A470? Does this decision by the First Minister represent a fundamental change to Welsh Government transport policy on environmental grounds?
Diolch ichi am eich ateb, Weinidog. Mewn sawl ffordd, mae'n dangos faint o amser ac adnoddau y mae'r Llywodraeth wedi'u rhoi i edrych ar lwybrau amgen eisoes, sef sail fy nghwestiwn mewn gwirionedd.
I droi at yr ymchwiliad cyhoeddus ei hun, yn amlwg, mae'r Aelodau a minnau wedi cael amser i ystyried adroddiad yr ymchwiliad cyhoeddus. Yn ei ddatganiad, dywedodd y Prif Weinidog na fyddai wedi bwrw ymlaen â chynigion y Llywodraeth ei hun, hyd yn oed pe bai'n teimlo eu bod yn fforddiadwy, ar sail yr effaith ar yr amgylchedd. Felly, os caf edrych ar hynny am eiliad: dywedai tystiolaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ei hun, a ddarparwyd gan Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru ac a gefnogwyd gan fargyfreithwyr Llywodraeth Cymru, y byddai'r cynllun yn garbon niwtral dros amser ac yn gydnaws â Deddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015. Cytunai'r arolygydd â'ch barn chi fel Llywodraeth Cymru a dywedodd fod y farn honno'n gadarn a chytunai hefyd y gellid ystyried bod y mesurau lliniaru helaeth arfaethedig ar gyfer yr effaith ar wastadeddau Gwent, a ddatblygwyd ar y cyd â Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, yn rhoi camau rhesymol ar waith i gydymffurfio â Deddf Bywyd Gwyllt a Chefn Gwlad 1981. Nawr, y pwynt yr hoffwn ei wneud yma, Weinidog, yw os ydych chi fel Llywodraeth Cymru yn anghytuno â'ch cynigion eich hun erbyn hyn, a ydych yn credu bod y ddeddfwriaeth a geir yn Neddf yr Amgylchedd (Cymru) 2016 a Deddf llesiant cenedlaethau'r dyfodol yn ddigonol? A sut y mae'r penderfyniad hwn yn bwrw amheuaeth ar gynlluniau trafnidiaeth eraill yng Nghymru, megis cynllun coridor Glannau Dyfrdwy ac ardaloedd eraill lle mae angen llawer o welliant wrth gwrs, ar hyd yr A40, yr A55 a'r A470? A yw'r penderfyniad hwn gan y Prif Weinidog yn arwydd o newid sylfaenol i bolisi trafnidiaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar sail amgylcheddol?
No. The First Minister was very clear in stressing that this project is absolutely unique in terms of the scale and in terms of the impact on the site of special scientific interest and that, therefore, it had to be considered in its own right. The First Minister was also very clear when he said that he disagreed with the inspector in terms of where the bar should be laid on environmental consequences of infrastructure, and it's his belief in terms of mitigation that you cannot mitigate the loss of, for example, an SSSI and attempt to then develop a similar environment elsewhere, and that there is a big difference between mitigation and compensation. Since we presented I think a very compelling case, of course, there's been a declaration of climate emergency, a greater understanding and appreciation that we need to act now, that we need to be more responsive and responsible and, therefore, the bar has been raised. Whilst I don't think that the legislation that the Member has pointed to requires amending, I do think it necessitates a very careful consideration within Government of how we take forward, not just transport infrastructure but all infrastructure—social infrastructure, for example, hospitals, schools—to guarantee that the development of buildings, roads and rail systems do not have an adverse impact on the environment, if it's at all possible to avoid it.
The Member, I think, rightly identifies a number of schemes that many might fear will be lost as a consequence of this being seen as having set a precedent. That is not the case. All of those programmes will go ahead. Indeed, we are proceeding with consultations on improvements to the A483 this month, work on the Flintshire corridor, the A494/A55, will be proceeding this summer with further modelling and Welsh transport appraisal guidance work and further consultations and meetings with local stakeholders. Other road projects across the length and breadth of Wales are still in the pipeline to be delivered. This does not shift our position on those.
Nac ydy. Pwysleisiodd y Prif Weinidog yn glir iawn fod y prosiect hwn yn gwbl unigryw o ran ei faint ac o ran ei effaith ar safle o ddiddordeb gwyddonol arbennig ac felly, roedd yn rhaid ei ystyried ar ei ben ei hun. Roedd y Prif Weinidog yn glir iawn hefyd pan ddywedodd ei fod yn anghytuno â'r arolygydd o ran lle dylid gosod y bar ar ganlyniadau amgylcheddol seilwaith, ac mae'n credu o ran mesurau lliniaru na ellir lliniaru effeithiau colli SODDGA, er enghraifft, a cheisio datblygu amgylchedd tebyg mewn man arall wedyn, a bod gwahaniaeth mawr rhwng lliniaru a digolledu. Wrth gwrs, ers i ni gyflwyno achos a oedd yn un cymhellol iawn yn fy marn i, cafwyd datganiad o argyfwng hinsawdd, gwell dealltwriaeth o'r angen inni weithredu yn awr, fod angen inni fod yn fwy ymatebol a chyfrifol ac felly mae'r bar wedi'i godi. Er nad wyf yn credu bod angen diwygio'r ddeddfwriaeth y cyfeiriodd yr Aelod ati, rwy'n credu bod hyn yn golygu bod angen i'r Llywodraeth ystyried yn ofalus iawn sut y dylem symud ymlaen, nid yn unig ar y seilwaith trafnidiaeth ond yr holl seilwaith—seilwaith cymdeithasol, er enghraifft, ysbytai, ysgolion—i sicrhau nad yw datblygu adeiladau, ffyrdd a systemau rheilffyrdd yn cael effaith andwyol ar yr amgylchedd, os oes unrhyw fodd o osgoi hynny.
Credaf fod yr Aelod yn gywir i nodi nifer o gynlluniau y byddai llawer yn ofni y cânt eu colli os gwelir bod hyn yn gosod cynsail. Nid yw hynny'n wir. Bydd y rhaglenni hynny i gyd yn mynd rhagddynt. Yn wir, rydym yn bwrw ymlaen ag ymgynghoriadau ar welliannau i'r A483 y mis hwn, bydd gwaith ar goridor sir y Fflint, yr A494/A55, yn parhau yr haf hwn gyda gwaith modelu pellach a gwaith ar yr arweiniad ar arfarnu trafnidiaeth Cymru ac ymgynghoriadau a chyfarfodydd pellach gyda rhanddeiliaid lleol. Mae prosiectau ffyrdd eraill ar hyd a lled Cymru yn dal ar y gweill i gael eu cyflawni. Nid yw hyn yn newid ein safbwynt ar y rheini.
Well, you mentioned that the bar has been raised and you mentioned the climate emergency that the Welsh Government has declared in the meantime. That does, of course, bring me back to my question again about the need for changes in legislation. I appreciate the answer that you have given, but it's difficult to understand how a change in those circumstances cannot affect future schemes, and I appreciate the answers you've given.
Now, section 6 of the report of the public inquiry notes that the M4 is the most strategically important road in Wales and is the primary route in and out of the country for the movement of goods, and that capacity constraints are currently imposing costs on economic activity. Now, the inspector also agreed with the Welsh Government's own economic appraisal of the scheme, showing that it would provide good value for money, which shows a cost benefit ratio of 2:1. Now, the economic impact of not proceeding has also been estimated as being £134 million a year to Cardiff and £44 million a year to Newport. Incidentally, the same cost as the public inquiry. Now, given, of course, the uncertainty by recent announcements at Tata Steel and Ford, amongst others, do you not agree with the inspector that the economic impact of further delays for a relief road will strangle the Welsh economy? And, finally, if the First Minister was the decision maker, as he says he was, not you, nor this Assembly, what input did you have into that final decision?
Wel, fe sonioch chi fod y bar wedi'i godi ac fe sonioch chi am yr argyfwng hinsawdd a ddatganwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru yn y cyfamser. Daw hynny â mi yn ôl at fy nghwestiwn eto wrth gwrs ynglŷn â'r angen am newidiadau i'r ddeddfwriaeth. Rwy'n derbyn yr ateb a roesoch, ond mae'n anodd deall sut na all newid yn yr amgylchiadau hynny effeithio ar gynlluniau yn y dyfodol, ac rwy'n gwerthfawrogi'r atebion a roesoch.
Nawr, mae adran 6 o adroddiad yr ymchwiliad cyhoeddus yn nodi mai'r M4 yw'r ffordd fwyaf strategol bwysig yng Nghymru a'r prif lwybr i mewn ac allan o'r wlad ar gyfer symud nwyddau, a bod cyfyngiadau ar gapasiti ar hyn o bryd yn creu costau i weithgarwch economaidd. Nawr, cytunai'r arolygydd hefyd â gwerthusiad economaidd Llywodraeth Cymru ei hun o'r cynllun, gan ddangos y byddai'n darparu gwerth da am arian, sy'n dangos cymhareb cost a budd o 2:1. Nawr, amcangyfrifwyd bod yr effaith ar yr economi o beidio â bwrw ymlaen yn £134 miliwn y flwyddyn i Gaerdydd a £44 miliwn y flwyddyn i Gasnewydd. Yr un gost â'r ymchwiliad cyhoeddus fel mae'n digwydd. Nawr, o gofio'r ansicrwydd wrth gwrs yn sgil cyhoeddiadau diweddar Tata Steel a Ford ymysg eraill, onid ydych yn cytuno â'r arolygydd y bydd effaith economaidd oedi pellach cyn cael ffordd liniaru yn llesteirio economi Cymru? Ac yn olaf, os mai'r Prif Weinidog oedd yn penderfynu, fel y mae'n dweud, yn hytrach na chi na'r Cynulliad hwn, pa fewnbwn a oedd gennych yn y penderfyniad terfynol hwnnw?
The decision was just for the First Minister, and as the promoter of the scheme I could take no part in that. As the First Minister has said, the issue of affordability of major infrastructure projects was discussed at Cabinet, and that helped to inform the First Minister's decision, but insofar as that decision actually being taken, that was something specifically and solely for the First Minister.
I think Russell George makes a very valuable point that doing nothing would have a major impact—a pretty devastating impact on the south Wales economy, and that's why we have to ensure that the recommendations that the commission comes forward with are implemented at speed with sufficient resource, and, in turn, that's why we said that we will utilise part of the money that would have been attributed to the M4 relief road, that original envelope, for, first and foremost, interventions in and around Newport, in order to reduce congestion to an acceptable level.
Penderfyniad i'r Prif Weinidog yn unig oedd hwn, ac fel hyrwyddwr y cynllun ni allwn gymryd unrhyw ran yn hynny. Fel y dywedodd y Prif Weinidog, trafodwyd fforddiadwyedd prosiectau seilwaith mawr yn y Cabinet, ac roedd hynny'n cynorthwyo i lywio penderfyniad y Prif Weinidog, ond o ran gwneud y penderfyniad, y Prif Weinidog yn unig ac yn benodol oedd yn gyfrifol am ei wneud.
Credaf fod Russell George yn gwneud pwynt gwerthfawr iawn y byddai gwneud dim yn cael effaith fawr—effaith go ddinistriol ar economi de Cymru, a dyna pam y mae'n rhaid inni sicrhau bod yr argymhellion y bydd y comisiwn yn eu cyflwyno yn cael eu gweithredu'n gyflym a chyda digon o adnoddau, ac yn ei dro, dyna pam y dywedasom y byddwn yn defnyddio rhan o'r arian a fyddai wedi'i neilltuo ar gyfer ffordd liniaru M4, yr amlen wreiddiol honno, ar gyfer ymyriadau yng Nghasnewydd a'r cyffiniau yn gyntaf oll, er mwyn lleihau tagfeydd i lefel dderbyniol.
Llefarydd Plaid Brexit, David Rowlands.
Brexit Party spokesperson, David Rowlands.
Diolch, Llywydd. Can I return to the theme of rail transport, Minister? Since the announcement of the new rail franchise, there has been a great deal of discussion about the announcements to the schedules and stock of the core Valleys lines, and, indeed, you've just given us some very welcome news about the proposed announcements to the Ebbw Vale line. But could the Minister give us some indication of any such announcements to the rail services serving Pontypool and Cwmbran?
Diolch, Lywydd. A gaf fi ddychwelyd at thema trafnidiaeth rheilffyrdd, Weinidog? Ers cyhoeddi'r fasnachfraint reilffyrdd newydd, mae llawer o drafod wedi bod ar y cyhoeddiadau i amserlenni a stoc rheilffyrdd craidd y Cymoedd, ac yn wir, rydych newydd roi newyddion da iawn inni am y cyhoeddiadau arfaethedig i reilffordd Glynebwy. Ond a allai'r Gweinidog roi rhyw syniad inni am unrhyw gyhoeddiadau o'r fath i'r gwasanaethau rheilffordd sy'n gwasanaethu Pont-y-pŵl a Chwmbrân?
I think it might be beneficial if I was to update all Members on all services across Wales and the acquisition of additional rolling stock in the delivery of new rolling stock, rather than specifying certain services and certain lines, but I'd very gladly do that.
Credaf y byddai'n fuddiol pe bawn yn rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r holl Aelodau am bob gwasanaeth ledled Cymru ac am gaffael cerbydau ychwanegol i ddarparu cerbydau newydd, yn hytrach na nodi rhai gwasanaethau a rhai rheilffyrdd, ond buaswn yn falch iawn o wneud hynny.
I thank you, Minister, for that, but, obviously, it is of concern to us in south-east Wales. This is a prime railway line that leads into Cardiff, as you know, and into Newport. So, can you give us some idea about the proposed announcements to the rolling stock on that line? After all, the metro gives South Wales East very little in the way of structural commitment. So, let's lump that into the structural commitment with regard to South Wales East. Could you give us some—?
Diolch ichi, Weinidog, ond yn amlwg, mae'n peri pryder inni yn ne-ddwyrain Cymru. Dyma brif reilffordd sy'n arwain i mewn i Gaerdydd, fel y gwyddoch, ac i mewn i Gasnewydd. Felly, a allwch roi rhyw syniad inni ynglŷn â'r cyhoeddiadau arfaethedig i'r cerbydau ar y rheilffordd honno? Wedi'r cyfan, nid yw'r metro'n rhoi llawer iawn o ymrwymiad strwythurol i Ddwyrain De Cymru. Felly, gadewch inni gynnwys hynny hefyd yn yr ymrwymiad strwythurol ar gyfer Dwyrain De Cymru. A allech roi—?
Well, I can assure the Member that all trains on the network, including those in the metro area, will be replaced, and that there are new trains, many of which will be built in Wales, that will be up to today's modern standards in terms of disabled access. We're also determined, where possible, to increase capacity on railway lines right now, and that's why we've been able to introduce additional rolling stock onto the core Valleys lines in recent months. We're also looking at how we can improve capacity elsewhere across Wales. So, I can assure the Member that we are doing everything we can to identify where rolling stock can be introduced, albeit on a temporary basis, to alleviate congestion whilst those brand-new trains are being constructed.
Wel, gallaf sicrhau'r Aelod y bydd yr holl drenau ar y rhwydwaith, gan gynnwys y rhai yn ardal y metro, yn cael eu newid, a bod yna drenau newydd, gyda llawer ohonynt yn cael eu hadeiladu yng Nghymru, a fydd yn cyrraedd safonau modern heddiw o ran mynediad ar gyfer pobl anabl. Rydym hefyd yn benderfynol, lle bo modd, o gynyddu capasiti ar reilffyrdd ar hyn o bryd, a dyna pam ein bod wedi gallu cyflwyno rhagor o gerbydau ar reilffyrdd craidd y Cymoedd dros y misoedd diwethaf. Rydym hefyd yn edrych ar sut y gallwn wella capasiti mewn mannau eraill ledled Cymru. Felly, gallaf sicrhau'r Aelod ein bod yn gwneud popeth yn ein gallu i nodi lle gellir cyflwyno cerbydau, er mai ar sail dros dro y gwnawn hynny, er mwyn lliniaru tagfeydd tra bydd y trenau newydd sbon hynny'n cael eu hadeiladu.
3. A wnaiff y Gweinidog gadarnhau a yw Llywodraeth Cymru ar y trywydd iawn o ran cyflawni ei hymrwymiadau mewn perthynas â seilwaith trafnidiaeth yn ystod tymor y Cynulliad hwn? OAQ53994
3. Will the Minister confirm whether the Welsh Government is on target to deliver its commitments in relation to transport infrastructure during this Assembly term? OAQ53994
Yes. Last month, I published our updated national transport finance plan, and that sets out our priorities over the next two years. As these projects are dependent on funding being available and, where necessary, obtaining statutory consents, the planned programme of improvements will be kept under constant review.
Gwnaf. Y mis diwethaf, cyhoeddais ein cynllun cyllid trafnidiaeth cenedlaethol wedi'i ddiweddaru, ac mae hwnnw'n nodi ein blaenoriaethau dros y ddwy flynedd nesaf. Gan fod y prosiectau hyn yn ddibynnol ar fod cyllid ar gael a lle bo angen, ar gael caniatadau statudol, bydd y rhaglen arfaethedig o welliannau'n cael ei hadolygu'n gyson.
Thank you, Minister, for that. We now know, obviously, that one of the commitments that was in your manifesto, the M4 relief road, will not proceed, which is to much regret, I have to say, and real anger over the weekend. I appreciate your deputy is from a sedentary position heckling; if he wants to take the question, I'll happily direct the question to him. But it'd be better if you actually listened, Deputy Minister; you might learn something. You might learn something about keeping commitments.
Diolch, Weinidog. Gwyddom yn awr, yn amlwg, na fydd un o'r ymrwymiadau a oedd yn eich maniffesto, ffordd liniaru'r M4, yn mynd rhagddo, sy'n destun gofid mawr, mae'n rhaid imi ddweud, a dicter gwirioneddol dros y penwythnos. Rwy'n gweld bod eich dirprwy yn heclo o'i sedd; os yw am ateb y cwestiwn, rwy'n hapus i ofyn y cwestiwn iddo ef. Ond byddai'n well pe baech yn gwrando, Ddirprwy Weinidog; efallai y dysgwch rywbeth. Efallai y dysgwch rywbeth am gadw ymrwymiadau.
Carry on with the question and no heckling from Ministers, Deputy Minister.
Parhewch â'r cwestiwn a dim heclo gan Weinidogion, Ddirprwy Weinidog.
It is unfortunate that manifesto commitment was broken, but what you have done, Minister, is obviously commit that there will be improvements put in place to make some short-term gains. A lot of people have been anxious why these short-term gains weren't achieved in the shorter period of time when the inquiry was meeting, for example, or when the Government was deliberating over this matter, when a considerable amount of time was lost, I would suggest.
What assurance can you give to people who are disappointed that this decision hasn't been taken in a positive way that these short-term gains will actually alleviate the congestion around Newport, which, as we know, is the entry and exit point for two thirds of the goods in and out of Wales that are so important to our economy?
Mae'n anffodus fod yr ymrwymiad yn y maniffesto wedi'i dorri, ond yr hyn a wnaethoch, Weinidog, yw ymrwymo y bydd gwelliannau'n cael eu rhoi ar waith i sicrhau rhai manteision tymor byr. Mae llawer o bobl wedi bod yn bryderus pam na chafodd y manteision tymor byr hyn eu cyflawni yn y cyfnod byrrach o amser pan oedd yr ymchwiliad yn cyfarfod, er enghraifft, neu pan oedd y Llywodraeth yn ystyried y mater hwn, pan gollwyd cryn dipyn o amser, buaswn yn awgrymu.
Pa sicrwydd y gallwch ei roi i bobl sy'n siomedig nad yw'r penderfyniad hwn wedi cael ei wneud mewn ffordd gadarnhaol y bydd y manteision tymor byr hyn yn lliniaru'r tagfeydd o amgylch Casnewydd, sef y man cyrraedd a gadael ar gyfer dwy ran o dair o'r nwyddau i mewn ac allan o Gymru sydd mor bwysig i'n heconomi fel y gwyddom?
It's not unusual for commitments made by parties and governments to change over time, and often they are changed as a consequence of an evaluation of value for money for those interventions that are promised. The electrification—I don't want to be political, but I must say that the question about the electrification of the south Wales line and the cancellation of that programme was put down to the value for money for that particular project, and the argument made by the Department for Transport that, actually, new technology could offer the same improvements and the same time savings as overhead electrification. So, it's not unusual for manifesto pledges to change over time as new technology and as fuller consideration of value for money is made.
In terms of the M4 around Newport, our proposal was the black route—that was what we were pursuing and promoting. However, now that the decision has been made not to proceed with that particular solution, we are examining all short-term measures that are available to alleviate congestion. I'm pleased that we are able to introduce additional patrol services and breakdown recovery services. These will not come without cost; these are expensive services, but they are tried and tested. They were deployed first on the A55 as part of the A55 resilience programme, and they are proven to work. That's why I was able to say last week, when the decision was made by the First Minister, that we would be able to deploy that particular solution with immediate effect.
Nid yw'n anarferol i ymrwymiadau a wnaed gan bleidiau a llywodraethau newid dros amser, ac yn aml cânt eu newid o ganlyniad i werthusiad o werth am arian ar gyfer yr ymyriadau a addawyd. Y trydaneiddio—nid wyf am fod yn wleidyddol, ond rhaid imi ddweud bod y cwestiwn ynghylch trydaneiddio rheilffordd de Cymru a chanslo'r rhaglen honno yn seiliedig ar werth am arian ar gyfer y prosiect arbennig hwnnw, a'r ddadl a gyflwynwyd gan yr Adran Drafnidiaeth y gallai technoleg newydd gynnig yr un gwelliannau a'r un arbedion amser â thrydaneiddio llinellau uwchben. Felly, nid yw'n anarferol i addewidion maniffesto newid dros amser wrth i dechnoleg newydd gael ei llunio, ac wrth ystyried gwerth am arian yn llawnach.
O ran y M4 o amgylch Casnewydd, ein cynnig oedd y llwybr du—dyna'r llwybr yr aethom ar ei drywydd a'i hyrwyddo. Fodd bynnag, gan fod y penderfyniad wedi'i wneud bellach i beidio â bwrw ymlaen â'r ateb penodol hwnnw, rydym yn archwilio'r holl fesurau tymor byr sydd ar gael i liniaru tagfeydd. Rwy'n falch ein bod yn gallu cyflwyno gwasanaethau patrolio ychwanegol a gwasanaethau adfer cerbydau sydd wedi torri. Bydd y rhain yn costio; mae'r rhain yn wasanaethau drud, ond maent wedi'u profi. Cawsant eu defnyddio yn gyntaf ar yr A55 fel rhan o raglen gydnerthedd yr A55, a phrofwyd eu bod yn gweithio. Dyna pam y gallais ddweud yr wythnos diwethaf, pan wnaethpwyd y penderfyniad gan y Prif Weinidog, y byddem yn gallu defnyddio'r ateb penodol hwnnw ar unwaith.
O ran isadeiledd trafnidiaeth, un mater sy’n bwysig yn fy etholaeth i ar hyn o bryd ydy bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn mynd i’r eithaf ar yr hyn y gellir ei wneud i ymestyn y system rheilffordd. A allwch chi roi sicrwydd i fi y byddwch chi’n fy nghefnogi i yn fy nghais ar Network Rail i fuddsoddi mewn ailosod pont rheilffordd Glanhwfa yn Llangefni ar ôl iddi gael ei tharo gan lori'r llynedd?
In terms of transport infrastructure, one issue that's important in my constituency at the moment is that the Welsh Government should be doing as much as it can to extend the rail system. Can you give me an assurance that you will support me in my bid to Network Rail to invest in putting in place the railway bridge in Glanhwfa Road, Llangefni after it was struck by a lorry last year?
Yes, of course. Any network improvements, any improvements to rail infrastructure that can be made in Wales will have this Welsh Government's support, and I'd support the Member's endeavours in this regard. It does concern me how little investment has been made in the Wales route network and in our stations and in the services that have operated in Wales. But this is something that we're determined to see resolved; that's why we've made a very powerful submission to the Williams review and why I hope that Keith Williams will be making the case for devolution of responsibility for infrastructure, and for fair funding over it, so that we directly can intervene in those sorts of problems that the Member for Ynys Môn has identified today.
Wrth gwrs. Caiff unrhyw welliannau i'r rhwydwaith, unrhyw welliannau i seilwaith rheilffyrdd y gellir eu gwneud yng Nghymru, gefnogaeth Llywodraeth Cymru, a buaswn yn cefnogi ymdrechion yr Aelod yn hyn o beth. Mae'n peri pryder i mi cyn lleied o fuddsoddiad a wnaethpwyd yn rhwydwaith llwybrau Cymru ac yn ein gorsafoedd ac yn y gwasanaethau sydd wedi bod ar waith yng Nghymru. Ond mae hyn yn rhywbeth rydym yn benderfynol o'i weld yn cael ei ddatrys; dyna pam y gwnaethom gyflwyniad grymus iawn i adolygiad Williams a pham y gobeithiaf y bydd Keith Williams yn dadlau'r achos dros ddatganoli'r cyfrifoldeb dros seilwaith, ac am ariannu teg ar ei gyfer, fel y gallwn ymyrryd yn uniongyrchol yn y mathau o broblemau y mae'r Aelod dros Ynys Môn wedi'u nodi heddiw.
4. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am ddyfodol gwasanaethau bysiau ar draws Gorllewin De Cymru? OAQ54018
4. Will the Minister make a statement on the future of bus services across South Wales West? OAQ54018
Yes. Can I thank the Member for his question? Transport for Wales is reviewing how bus services could be delivered in the future to ensure that urban and rural communities across Wales benefit from a modern, integrated public transport service. This work will support proposals being taken as a result of the 'Improving public transport' White Paper that has recently been consulted on.
Gwnaf. A gaf fi ddiolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn? Mae Trafnidiaeth Cymru yn adolygu sut y gellid darparu gwasanaethau bws yn y dyfodol er mwyn sicrhau bod cymunedau trefol a gwledig ledled Cymru yn cael budd o wasanaeth trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus integredig a modern. Bydd y gwaith hwn yn cefnogi'r argymhellion a wneir o ganlyniad i'r Papur Gwyn 'Gwella trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus' yr ymgynghorwyd yn ei gylch yn ddiweddar.
I thank the Minister for his answer, and obviously it is important that we get that White Paper going as fast as we can so that we can get some further action on our bus services across south-west Wales, because it is buses mainly that deliver most of the public transport in that area, rather than trains.
Last Friday, I met with Andrew Sherrington, the managing director of First Cymru, and following that meeting members across the region had a letter from him identifying the fact that, no matter what happened on the sale of First Cymru, he would be looking to ensure that services are maintained and continue to a high standard. But, there are still problems. He confirmed that where there are buses that are not commercially viable, they will be at risk, because clearly it is a commercial system without public support.
Two examples of those are obviously in the Afan valley—I've raised this with you many times—where buses in the Afan valley are every other hour in Glyncorrwg and in Blaengwynfi, which means that if you have a 9.30 a.m. appointment in the hospital, you have to catch the 7.30 a.m. bus in the morning from Glyncorrwg to be able to attend that, and who knows what time you'll get back home? It is important, therefore, that those bus services in the Afan valley and other Valleys areas in South Wales West are actually supported to ensure that people who don't have cars, who do rely upon public transport, are able to use them on a more frequent basis than they currently can. One every two hours is not sufficient for people to actually carry on their daily lives. They can't get to work efficiently, on time, they can't get home on time and they can't go to appointments on time. Will you therefore look at working with the sector to ensure that buses, when there are non-viable commercial routes, are supported through public funding to ensure that people who need those services can actually access them?
Diolch i'r Gweinidog am ei ateb, ac mae'n amlwg ei bod yn bwysig inni sicrhau bod y Papur Gwyn hwnnw ar waith mor gyflym ag y gallwn er mwyn inni allu cyflawni camau pellach ar ein gwasanaethau bysiau ledled de-orllewin Cymru, gan mai bysiau'n bennaf sy'n darparu'r rhan fwyaf o'r drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn yr ardal honno, yn hytrach na threnau.
Ddydd Gwener diwethaf, cyfarfûm ag Andrew Sherrington, rheolwr gyfarwyddwr First Cymru, ac yn dilyn y cyfarfod hwnnw cafodd aelodau ar draws y rhanbarth lythyr ganddo yn nodi, ni waeth beth a ddigwyddai gyda gwerthiant First Cymru, y byddai'n ceisio sicrhau bod gwasanaethau'n cael eu cynnal ac yn parhau i weithredu i safon uchel. Ond mae yna broblemau o hyd. Lle ceir bysiau nad ydynt yn fasnachol hyfyw, cadarnhaodd y byddant mewn perygl, oherwydd mae'n amlwg mai system fasnachol yw hi heb gymorth cyhoeddus.
Mae dwy enghraifft o'r rheini yn amlwg yng nghwm Afan—rwyf wedi dwyn hyn i'ch sylw droeon—lle mae bysiau yng nghwm Afan bob dwy awr yng Nglyncorrwg ac ym Mlaengwynfi, sy'n golygu os oes gennych apwyntiad 9.30 a.m. yn yr ysbyty, rhaid i chi ddal y bws 7.30 a.m. yn y bore o Lyncorrwg i allu mynychu hwnnw, a phwy a ŵyr pa amser y byddwch yn cyrraedd adref? Mae'n bwysig, felly, fod y gwasanaethau bysiau hynny yng nghwm Afan a Chymoedd eraill yng Ngorllewin De Cymru yn cael eu cefnogi mewn gwirionedd i sicrhau bod pobl nad oes ganddynt geir, pobl sy'n dibynnu ar drafnidiaeth gyhoeddus, yn gallu eu defnyddio'n amlach nag y gallant wneud ar hyn o bryd. Nid yw un bob dwy awr yn ddigon i bobl allu parhau â'u bywydau bob dydd. Ni allant gyrraedd y gwaith yn effeithlon ar amser, ni allant gyrraedd adref ar amser ac ni allant fynd i apwyntiadau ar amser. A wnewch chi edrych felly ar weithio gyda'r sector i sicrhau bod gwasanaethau bysiau ar lwybrau masnachol anhyfyw yn cael eu cefnogi ag arian cyhoeddus i sicrhau bod y bobl sydd angen y gwasanaethau'n gallu eu cael?
The Member makes a number of important points. In many parts of Wales, it's not just that people can't get to where they wish to go on time, they can't get to places at all by bus service operations because they don't exist, or people can't afford them. I've said in this Chamber before that there's one part of Wales, the north-east, the Mersey Dee Alliance area—and this data was presented by Growth Track 360—where I think it's astonishing that 20 per cent of people can't get to job interviews in that area because they don't have access to appropriate and affordable bus services. That has to be addressed, and it will be addressed through reforms and through legislation. The system is broken. It's not fit for purpose.
Dai Rees points to the very significant role that bus services play in society. They carry 100 million passengers a year—that's more than three times as many passengers as our rail network carries. So, they're hugely important in terms of ensuring that people can get to and from work and to and from services, but also, importantly, in terms of ensuring that people remain social and connected to other human beings. In our attempt to address social isolation, the role of public transport will be incredibly important.
With specific regard to First Cymru, they have assured us that it will be business as usual for its bus network, but we will be keeping a very close eye on the implications for bus services of First Group's proposals for reorganising its business, including any potential sale of its bus arm.
Llywydd, we're already allocating annually £25 million to local authorities as part of the bus services support grant. And I really must stress that this money should not be used to supplement local authorities' revenue support grant spending on non-commercially viable services; it should be used in addition to. It's absolutely vital that local authorities take careful consideration of the impact that the removal of their own subsidies would have on vulnerable people.
I can say today, Llywydd—I'm very pleased to be able to tell Members—that I've allocated £2.5 million to undertake network reviews in specific areas of Wales, and this work will identify potential improvements in services alongside the investment infrastructure that is required for new interchanges, new bus stops and so forth. Llywydd, we're going to use this funding to plan for future investment, and Transport for Wales has been commissioned to lead on this work and will look to target areas in south-west Wales. I can assure Members that I'll be making a statement before summer recess that will provide more detail about this work, as well as four pilot schemes that are going to be taking place across Wales.
Mae'r Aelod yn gwneud nifer o bwyntiau pwysig. Mewn sawl rhan o Gymru, nid yn unig na all pobl gyrraedd y mannau y maent yn dymuno'u cyrraedd ar amser, ni allant gyrraedd lleoedd o gwbl drwy ddefnyddio gwasanaeth bws am nad ydynt yn bodoli, neu ni all pobl eu fforddio. Rwyf wedi dweud yn y Siambr hon o'r blaen fod un rhan o Gymru, y gogledd-ddwyrain, ardal Cynghrair Mersi a'r Ddyfrdwy—a chyflwynwyd y data hwn gan Growth Track 360—lle mae'n arswydus fod 20 y cant o bobl yn methu cyrraedd cyfweliadau am swyddi yn yr ardal honno am na allant fanteisio ar wasanaethau bws priodol a fforddiadwy. Rhaid mynd i'r afael â hynny, ac fe eir i'r afael â hynny drwy ddiwygio a thrwy ddeddfu. Mae'r system wedi torri. Nid yw'n addas i'r diben.
Mae Dai Rees yn tynnu sylw at y rôl sylweddol iawn y mae gwasanaethau bysiau yn ei chwarae mewn cymdeithas. Maent yn cludo 100 miliwn o deithwyr y flwyddyn—mae hynny'n fwy na theirgwaith cymaint o deithwyr ag y mae ein rhwydwaith rheilffyrdd yn eu cludo. Felly, maent yn eithriadol o bwysig ar gyfer sicrhau bod pobl yn gallu mynd i'r gwaith ac i wasanaethau ac oddi yno, ond hefyd, yn bwysig, ar gyfer sicrhau bod pobl yn parhau'n gymdeithasol ac mewn cysylltiad â phobl eraill. Yn ein hymdrech i fynd i'r afael ag unigedd cymdeithasol, bydd rôl trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus yn eithriadol o bwysig.
Mewn perthynas â First Cymru yn benodol, maent wedi ein sicrhau y bydd ei rwydwaith bysiau'n gweithredu fel arfer, ond byddwn yn cadw llygad barcud ar oblygiadau argymhellion First Group ar gyfer ad-drefnu ei fusnes i wasanaethau bysiau, gan gynnwys unrhyw bosibilrwydd y bydd ochr bysiau'r cwmni'n cael ei werthu.
Lywydd, rydym eisoes yn dyrannu £25 miliwn yn flynyddol i awdurdodau lleol fel rhan o'r grant cynnal gwasanaethau bysiau. A rhaid imi bwysleisio'n na ddylid defnyddio'r arian hwn i hybu gwariant grant cynnal refeniw awdurdodau lleol ar wasanaethau nad ydynt yn fasnachol hyfyw; dylid ei ddefnyddio yn ychwanegol ato. Mae'n gwbl hanfodol fod awdurdodau lleol yn ystyried yn ofalus yr effaith y byddai cael gwared ar eu cymorthdaliadau eu hunain yn ei chael ar bobl agored i niwed.
Gallaf ddweud heddiw, Lywydd—rwy'n falch iawn o allu dweud wrth yr Aelodau—fy mod wedi dyrannu £2.5 miliwn i gynnal adolygiadau o'r rhwydwaith mewn rhannau penodol o Gymru, a bydd y gwaith hwn yn nodi gwelliannau posibl i wasanaethau ochr yn ochr â'r seilwaith buddsoddi sydd ei angen ar gyfer cyfnewidfeydd newydd, arosfannau bysiau newydd ac yn y blaen. Lywydd, rydym yn mynd i ddefnyddio'r cyllid hwn i gynllunio ar gyfer buddsoddi yn y dyfodol, ac mae Trafnidiaeth Cymru wedi cael eu comisiynu i arwain y gwaith hwn a bydd yn ceisio targedu ardaloedd yn ne-orllewin Cymru. Gallaf sicrhau'r Aelodau y byddaf yn gwneud datganiad cyn toriad yr haf a fydd yn darparu rhagor o fanylion am y gwaith hwn, yn ogystal â phedwar cynllun peilot sy'n mynd i gael eu cynnal ledled Cymru.
Thank you for those remarks just then, I thought they were very useful, and I'm also looking forward to the White Paper. In the meantime though, in 2016 you announced a five-point plan to support bus routes, offering all bus companies in Wales assistance through Business Wales and Finance Wales, and, at the same time, you called upon—as you've done again today—local authorities to make every effort to protect the funding for bus services.
You may be aware that Bridgend county borough councillors have recently called in a decision by their cabinet to stop subsidising public transport, full stop. Bearing in mind you've got additional moneys, they must have had some of that, and you were expecting it to be used additionally to their own bus subsidies, it doesn't sound like even that's getting to the bus companies in this case. I wonder if you could tell me whether you know whether bus operators in the Bridgend area knew about the offer of Business Wales and Finance Wales help and whether, in fact, the local authority knew about that as well, because they could have encouraged operators to take up that offer, thereby avoiding what is a very, very harsh cabinet decision.
Diolch i chi am y sylwadau hynny, roeddwn yn meddwl eu bod yn ddefnyddiol iawn, ac rwy'n edrych ymlaen at y Papur Gwyn hefyd. Yn y cyfamser, fodd bynnag, yn 2016, fe gyhoeddoch chi gynllun pum pwynt i gefnogi llwybrau bysiau, gan gynnig cymorth i bob cwmni bysiau yng Nghymru drwy Busnes Cymru a Cyllid Cymru, ac ar yr un pryd, fe alwoch—fel rydych wedi'i wneud eto heddiw—ar awdurdodau lleol i wneud pob ymdrech i ddiogelu'r cyllid ar gyfer gwasanaethau bysiau.
Efallai eich bod yn ymwybodol fod cynghorwyr bwrdeistref sirol Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr wedi galw am edrych eto ar benderfyniad gan eu cabinet i roi'r gorau i sybsideiddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus. O gofio bod gennych arian ychwanegol, mae'n rhaid eu bod wedi cael rhywfaint o hwnnw, ac roeddech yn disgwyl iddo gael ei ddefnyddio'n ychwanegol at eu cymorthdaliadau bysiau eu hunain, nid yw'n swnio fel pe bai hwnnw hyd yn oed yn cyrraedd y cwmnïau bysiau yn yr achos hwn. Tybed a allech ddweud wrthyf a ydych yn gwybod a oedd gweithredwyr bysiau yn ardal Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr yn gwybod am y cynnig o gymorth gan Busnes Cymru a Cyllid Cymru ac a wyddai'r awdurdod lleol am hynny hefyd, gan y gallent fod wedi annog gweithredwyr i fanteisio ar y cynnig hwnnw, ac osgoi penderfyniad cabinet llym iawn trwy wneud hynny.
I can assure the Member that we've held a series of bus summits and local authorities from across Wales have been invited and encouraged to attend those summits. We've been working with partners such as Business Wales and the Development Bank of Wales to ensure that bus operators have the support necessary to see them through what is a very difficult transition period, as we move to a new, more sustainable base for operating bus services. I won't dictate to local authorities how they should use their RSG, particularly given that austerity is continuing, but I would make that case again for local authorities to be very careful when they consider what services to remove as a consequence of difficult budget decisions. Bus services for many people in this country are absolutely vital.
Gallaf sicrhau'r Aelod ein bod wedi cynnal cyfres o uwchgynadleddau bysiau a bod awdurdodau lleol o bob rhan o Gymru wedi cael eu gwahodd a'u hannog i fynychu'r uwchgynadleddau hynny. Buom yn gweithio gyda phartneriaid megis Busnes Cymru a Banc Datblygu Cymru i sicrhau bod gweithredwyr bysiau'n cael y cymorth angenrheidiol i'w cynnal drwy gyfnod pontio anodd iawn, wrth inni symud tuag at sylfaen newydd, fwy cynaliadwy ar gyfer gweithredu gwasanaethau bysiau. Ni fyddaf yn dweud wrth awdurdodau lleol sut y dylent ddefnyddio eu grant cynnal refeniw, yn enwedig o gofio bod cyni'n parhau, ond buaswn yn dadlau'r achos eto dros sicrhau bod awdurdodau lleol yn bod yn ofalus iawn pan fyddant yn ystyried pa wasanaethau i'w dileu o ganlyniad i benderfyniadau cyllidebol anodd. I lawer o bobl yn y wlad hon, mae gwasanaethau bysiau'n gwbl hanfodol.
5. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi diweddariad am gefnogaeth a ddarparwyd yn dilyn y cyhoeddiad i gau ffatri Rehau yn Amlwch? OAQ53996
5. Will the Minister provide an update on support provided following the announcement to close the Rehau factory in Amlwch? OAQ53996
We are continuing to provide full support. Four all-day staff sessions have been held, the most recent being on 3 June. Feedback from the company and from staff has been very positive. They are being proactive in engaging across all options, including staff with professions considering setting up their own businesses.
Rydym yn parhau i ddarparu cefnogaeth lawn. Cynhaliwyd pedair sesiwn un-dydd i staff, a chynhaliwyd y sesiwn ddiweddaraf ar 3 Mehefin. Mae adborth gan y cwmni a'r staff wedi bod yn gadarnhaol iawn. Maent yn rhagweithiol wrth ymgysylltu ynglŷn â phob opsiwn, gan gynnwys staff gyda phroffesiynau'n ystyried sefydlu eu busnesau eu hunain.
Diolch yn fawr iawn. Gaf i ddiolch am y llythyr gan y Gweinidog ar 5 Mehefin yn ateb e-bost gen i o 9 Mai ynglŷn â chefnogaeth i economi gogledd Môn? Mae yna gyfeiriad yn hwnnw at y tasglu sydd wedi cael ei sefydlu yn dilyn cyhoeddiad Rehau. Ddoe, yng nghyd-destun y cyhoeddiad am ffatri Ford, mi glywsom ni'r Gweinidog yn dweud y byddai fo am fynd ymhellach na'r model tasglu arferol oherwydd maint y bygythiad yna ym Mhen-y-bont, a dwi'n cytuno â hynny yn sicr. Mi fyddwn i'n dadlau bod cyhoeddiad Rehau ar ben y cyhoeddiadau negyddol diweddar ynglŷn ag economi gogledd Ynys Môn hefyd yn arbennig o ddifrifol, yn enwedig o ystyried maint y boblogaeth, yr elfen wledig ac yn y blaen. Felly, mi fyddwn i'n croesawu addewid i edrych ar fynd ymhell tu hwnt i'r model tasglu yn achos gogledd Ynys Môn hefyd ac i chwilio i wneud buddsoddiadau arbennig mewn datblygu'r economi yno.
Mi hoffwn i ymateb a sylw ar hynny gan y Gweinidog, ond hefyd ar y cwestiwn penodol o beth fydd yn digwydd i safle Rehau, mi hoffwn i glywed gair o gefnogaeth i'r syniad y byddai'r safle yn sicr yn cael ei adael fel gwaddol i'r economi leol er mwyn sicrhau bod beth fu yn hyb economaidd pwysig yn gallu parhau felly yn y dyfodol.
Thank you very much. May I say thanks for the letter from the Minister on 5 June in reply to an e-mail from me on 9 May regarding support for the economy of north Anglesey? There is a reference there to the taskforce that has been established following the announcement from Rehau. Yesterday, in the context of the announcement about the Ford factory, we heard the Minister say that he would want to go further than the taskforce model because of the size of the threat there in Bridgend, and I agree with that, certainly. I would argue that the Rehau announcement on top of the negative announcements recently regarding the economy of northern Anglesey is also especially serious, considering the population and the rural element and so forth. So, I would welcome a promise to look at going further than the taskforce model in the case of north Anglesey as well, and to look at special investments in developing the economy there.
I would like to respond to a comment by the Minister on that, but also, on the specific question of what will happen to the Rehau site, I'd like to hear a word of support for the idea that the site would be left as a legacy to the local economy in order to ensure that what was an important economic hub can continue in the future.
Can I address that point first and say that we are continuing to discuss with Rehau what future plans there may be for the site? It is an incredibly important site, and if it cannot be used for other employers or manufacturers as a key location, then we wish to ensure that it is used for alternative use and that we get agreement from the company to use it in a way that serves the interests of not just the people who have been employed there, but also the wider community.
With regard to the place-based intervention in Bridgend, I took this decision to expand on the normal working practice when decisions of this nature are taken because of the huge financial contribution that Ford makes to the surrounding community—a £3.3 billion contribution per decade. The scale of that investment, of that amount of resource being lost, means that many businesses—many, many businesses—will have their futures hanging in the balance, and therefore a place-based approach is absolutely vital, alongside the other taskforce operations. I would happily speak with the Isle of Anglesey council about introducing a specific place-based focus in the work of the taskforce. I think it is absolutely essential—and I've said this to the local authority serving Bridgend, that it's absolutely essential that the local authority comes forward with proposals for both stimulating the local economy, the community economy, and also for ensuring that it is stabilised through the difficult period of jobs being lost. It can't just be left to Welsh Government. We have to work in collaboration and in partnership across all Governments if we are to get the best outcomes for the people we all serve.
A gaf fi fynd i'r afael â'r pwynt hwnnw yn gyntaf a dweud ein bod yn parhau i drafod gyda Rehau pa gynlluniau a allai fodoli ar gyfer y safle yn y dyfodol? Mae'n safle anhygoel o bwysig, ac os na ellir ei ddefnyddio ar gyfer cyflogwyr neu weithgynhyrchwyr eraill fel lleoliad allweddol, yna dymunwn sicrhau y caiff ei ddefnyddio at ddefnydd amgen a'n bod yn cael cytundeb gan y cwmni i'w ddefnyddio mewn modd sy'n gwasanaethu buddiannau nid yn unig y bobl sydd wedi'u cyflogi yno, ond y gymuned ehangach hefyd.
O ran yr ymyriad yn seiliedig ar le ym Mhen-y-bont ar Ogwr, gwneuthum y penderfyniad hwn er mwyn ehangu arferion gweithio arferol pan wneir penderfyniadau o'r math hwn oherwydd y cyfraniad ariannol enfawr y mae Ford yn ei wneud i'r gymuned gyfagos—cyfraniad gwerth £3.3 biliwn y degawd. Mae maint y buddsoddiad hwnnw, y swm o adnoddau a gollir, yn golygu y bydd dyfodol llawer o fusnesau—llawer iawn o fusnesau—yn y fantol, ac felly mae ymagwedd sy'n seiliedig ar le yn gwbl hanfodol, ynghyd â gweithgarwch arall y tasglu. Buaswn yn falch o siarad â chyngor Ynys Môn ynglŷn â chyflwyno ffocws penodol yn seiliedig ar le yng ngwaith y tasglu. Rwy'n credu ei fod yn gwbl hanfodol—ac rwyf wedi dweud hyn wrth yr awdurdod lleol sy'n gwasanaethu Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr, ei bod yn gwbl hanfodol fod yr awdurdod lleol yn cyflwyno argymhellion ar gyfer ysgogi'r economi leol, yr economi gymunedol, a hefyd ar gyfer sicrhau y caiff ei sefydlogi drwy'r cyfnod anodd o golli swyddi. Ni ellir ei adael i Lywodraeth Cymru yn unig. Rhaid inni weithio ar y cyd ac mewn partneriaeth ar draws pob Llywodraeth os ydym am sicrhau'r canlyniadau gorau i'r bobl a wasanaethwn.
When I questioned you at the end of January, after Rehau's initial announcement that they may be closing the site in Amlwch, you replied that you were looking at diversifying to other products within the group that could be diverted temporarily or permanently to the site, or indeed third parties. You also said that this would require a degree of investment, which was what Welsh Government was specifically working on with the company at that point. When the chief executive of Rehau announced the closure on 23 April, it said: 'Careful consideration at board level' had been given to
'proposed alternatives put forward by employees',
but they would be not sufficient to secure the long-term future of the facility. Putting all that together—the reference to your talking to third parties, your then declaration that you were considering investment, and the proposals by employees themselves—what consideration is being given to bringing all those factors together as this moves forward?
Pan ofynnais i chi ddiwedd mis Ionawr, ar ôl cyhoeddiad cyntaf Rehau y gallent fod yn cau'r safle yn Amlwch, fe ateboch chi eich bod yn ystyried arallgyfeirio i gynhyrchion eraill o fewn y grŵp y gellid eu dargyfeirio dros dro neu'n barhaol i'r safle, neu drydydd partïon yn wir. Fe ddywedoch chi hefyd y byddai hyn yn galw am rywfaint o fuddsoddiad, sef yr hyn roedd Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio arno'n benodol gyda'r cwmni ar y pryd. Pan gyhoeddodd prif weithredwr Rehau fod y safle'n cau ar 23 Ebrill, dywedodd fod 'ystyriaeth ofalus wedi'i rhoi ar lefel y bwrdd' i
ddewisiadau amgen arfaethedig a gyflwynwyd gan y gweithwyr,
ond ni fyddent yn ddigonol i sicrhau dyfodol hirdymor y ffatri. Gan roi hynny i gyd at ei gilydd—y cyfeiriad at y ffaith eich bod yn siarad â thrydydd partïon, eich datganiad ar y pryd eich bod yn ystyried buddsoddi, a'r argymhellion gan y gweithwyr eu hunain—pa ystyriaeth a roddir i ddod â'r holl ffactorau hynny at ei gilydd wrth i hyn symud ymlaen?
I do regret that the company chose not to diversify, because I'd restate the position that we took earlier in the year, that we were ready and willing and enthusiastic about supporting the business. The decision has now been made, and we are keen, through the taskforce, through the regional economic development unit, led by the chief regional officer, Gwenllian Roberts, to examine all alternative options for employment of the people who are going to be affected and alternative uses for the site. We're working—. I should say we are working very well with the company in identifying alternative opportunities. Trying to find alternative major employers in a semi-rural area is very difficult, and therefore it requires additional attention to be given to the potential of supporting workers in starting up their own businesses, and that's why Business Wales are playing an integral part in the support that's given to them.
Mae'n ofid i mi fod y cwmni wedi dewis peidio ag arallgyfeirio, oherwydd hoffwn ailddatgan ein safbwynt yn gynharach yn y flwyddyn, sef ein bod yn barod ac yn fodlon ac yn frwdfrydig ynglŷn â chefnogi'r busnes. Mae'r penderfyniad wedi'i wneud bellach, ac rydym yn awyddus, drwy'r tasglu, drwy'r uned datblygu economaidd ranbarthol, dan arweiniad y prif swyddog rhanbarthol, Gwenllian Roberts, i archwilio'r holl ddewisiadau eraill ar gyfer cyflogi'r rhai yr effeithir arnynt a dulliau amgen o ddefnyddio'r safle. Rydym yn gweithio—. Dylwn ddweud ein bod yn gweithio'n dda iawn gyda'r cwmni i ganfod cyfleoedd amgen. Mae ceisio dod o hyd i gyflogwyr mawr amgen mewn ardal led-wledig yn anodd iawn, ac felly mae angen rhoi sylw ychwanegol i'r posibilrwydd o gefnogi gweithwyr i ddechrau eu busnesau eu hunain, a dyna pam y mae Busnes Cymru yn chwarae rhan annatod yn y cymorth a roddir iddynt.
6. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am bwysigrwydd economaidd busnesau bach yng nghymunedau gwledig Cymru? OAQ54021
6. Will the Minister make a statement on the economic importance of small businesses in Wales’s rural communities? OAQ54021
Yes, of course. A thriving rural economy is fundamental to help sustain viable communities and to provide quality employment opportunities. Our current programmes are delivering wide-ranging support to encourage economic development and prosperity, including through Business Wales, ICT and transport improvements, as well as the support provided through the rural development plan.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Mae economi wledig lewyrchus yn hanfodol er mwyn helpu i gynnal cymunedau hyfyw a darparu cyfleoedd cyflogaeth o safon. Mae ein rhaglenni presennol yn darparu cymorth eang i annog datblygu economaidd a ffyniant, gan gynnwys drwy Busnes Cymru, TGCh a gwelliannau trafnidiaeth, yn ogystal â'r cymorth a ddarperir drwy'r cynllun datblygu gwledig.
Thank you, Minister. One such business is the Welsh Hawking Centre within my region—an attraction that's been on Barry's Five Mile Lane for the last 40 years. It's been recently reported that the business may be in danger of closing, after visitor numbers have halved in the last year. According to Jamie Munro, who runs the centre, this has largely been caused by the works ongoing on the A4226, which have resulted in a reduction in the footfall dramatically. I think anyone who knows the area will realise how impacted the business has been—that part of the road in particular, and the partial closure of it that has been required so that the improvements can be made. It's a niche business. It's been very, very successful in the past—extremely popular. It provides excellent educational facilities as well, and is an attraction we can be proud of. I just wonder, when these major works go ahead, whether there's a better way for the Welsh Government and the local council to work through the impact it may have for a short period on businesses. But these businesses don't necessarily have the resilience to take a bad year or two, especially in terms of visitor attractions.
Diolch yn fawr, Weinidog. Un o'r busnesau hyn yw Canolfan Heboga Cymru yn fy rhanbarth i—atyniad sydd wedi bod ar Five Mile Lane y Barri ers 40 mlynedd. Nodwyd yn ddiweddar y gallai'r busnes fod mewn perygl o gau, ar ôl i nifer yr ymwelwyr haneru yn ystod y flwyddyn ddiwethaf. Yn ôl Jamie Munro, sy'n rhedeg y ganolfan, mae hyn wedi'i achosi i raddau helaeth gan y gwaith sy'n mynd rhagddo ar y A4226, ac sydd wedi arwain at leihad dramatig yn nifer yr ymwelwyr. Credaf y bydd unrhyw un sy'n adnabod yr ardal yn sylweddoli cymaint o effaith a fu ar y busnes—y rhan honno o'r ffordd yn enwedig, a'r cau rhannol y bu'n rhaid ei wneud er mwyn gallu gwneud y gwelliannau. Mae'n fusnes arbenigol. Mae wedi bod yn llwyddiannus iawn yn y gorffennol—yn hynod o boblogaidd. Mae'n darparu cyfleusterau addysgol ardderchog hefyd, ac mae'n atyniad y gallwn ymfalchïo ynddo. Pan fydd gwaith mawr o'r fath yn mynd rhagddo, tybed onid oes ffordd well i Lywodraeth Cymru a'r cyngor lleol weithio drwy'r effaith y gallai ei chael ar fusnesau am gyfnod byr. Ond nid yw'r busnesau hyn o reidrwydd yn ddigon cadarn i allu dioddef blwyddyn neu ddwy wael, yn enwedig o ran atyniadau i ymwelwyr.
I thank David Melding for his question. I'll ensure that we deploy officials from the regional unit to the business to assist in any way we can. I think that we need to, first of all, appreciate whether the halving of visitor numbers can be attributed solely to just one factor and, if so, even though it may be at a late stage, how we may be able to alleviate the impacts that roadworks are having. Of course, we issue notices. We engage directly through our transport department wherever and whenever possible with businesses. I think that this particular example is relatively unique in terms of the halving of visitors or, if you like, customers. So, I think it's going to be essential that my officials work speedily with the company to address the challenge that they face.
Diolch i David Melding am ei gwestiwn. Byddaf yn sicrhau ein bod yn anfon swyddogion o'r uned ranbarthol at y busnes i helpu mewn unrhyw ffordd y gallwn. Yn gyntaf, rwy'n credu bod angen inni ddeall a ellir priodoli haneru nifer yr ymwelwyr i un ffactor yn unig ac os felly, er y gallai fod yn hwyr yn y broses, sut y gallwn liniaru'r effeithiau y mae'r gwaith ar y ffordd yn eu cael. Wrth gwrs, rydym yn cyhoeddi hysbysiadau. Rydym yn ymgysylltu'n uniongyrchol â busnesau drwy ein hadran drafnidiaeth ble bynnag a phryd bynnag y bo'n bosibl. Credaf fod yr enghraifft benodol hon yn gymharol unigryw o ran haneru nifer yr ymwelwyr, neu gwsmeriaid os hoffech. Felly, rwy'n credu y bydd yn hanfodol fod fy swyddogion yn gweithio'n gyflym gyda'r cwmni i oresgyn yr her sy'n eu hwynebu.
Minister, small businesses in rural communities in north Wales play an important role in the economic development in the region. A regular issue brought to me from small and medium-sized businesses is the movement of online payments and transactions—that the internet connection isn't sufficient. Can you reassure my constituents that Welsh Government will prioritise the internet and broadband in any economic development plans for north Wales?
Weinidog, mae busnesau bach mewn cymunedau gwledig yng ngogledd Cymru'n chwarae rhan bwysig yn natblygiad economaidd y rhanbarth. Un mater sy'n cael ei ddwyn i fy sylw yn rheolaidd gan fusnesau bach a chanolig yw symud taliadau a thrafodion ar-lein—nad yw'r cysylltiad â'r rhyngrwyd yn ddigonol. A allwch sicrhau fy etholwyr y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn rhoi blaenoriaeth i'r rhyngrwyd a band eang mewn unrhyw gynlluniau datblygu economaidd ar gyfer gogledd Cymru?
Yes, I can. I mentioned earlier, in response to Bethan's questions, that the north Wales growth deal has a digital project at the heart of the vision for developing a stronger and more resilient economy in the north. I'm confident that, through the course of the challenge sessions that are to come, we will be able to ensure that that particular programme does reach all businesses across Wales and addresses the challenges that the Member has just identified.
Gallaf. Soniais yn gynharach, wrth ymateb i gwestiynau Bethan, fod gan fargen twf gogledd Cymru brosiect digidol sy'n ganolog i'r weledigaeth ar gyfer datblygu economi gryfach a chadarnach yn y gogledd. Drwy gydol y sesiynau her sydd i ddod, rwy'n hyderus y gallwn sicrhau bod y rhaglen benodol honno'n cyrraedd pob busnes ledled Cymru ac yn mynd i'r afael â'r heriau y mae'r Aelod newydd eu nodi.
7. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am gynlluniau Llywodraeth Cymru i leddfu tagfeydd traffig o amgylch Casnewydd? OAQ53993
7. Will the Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's plans to relieve traffic congestion around Newport? OAQ53993
Yes, of course. I published a written statement on 5 June outlining our next steps for the M4 corridor around Newport.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Cyhoeddais ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ar 5 Mehefin yn amlinellu ein camau nesaf ar gyfer coridor yr M4 o amgylch Casnewydd.
You also published a manifesto that said:
'We will deliver a relief road for the M4'.
Is it not the case that this commission and any proposals that it comes out with, which may relieve congestion at the margin, will be a very small impact compared to what was promised in your manifesto?
Gwnaethoch hefyd gyhoeddi maniffesto a oedd yn dweud:
Byddwn yn darparu ffordd liniaru ar gyfer y M4.
Onid yw'n wir na fydd y comisiwn hwn ac unrhyw gynigion a gyflwynir ganddo, a allai liniaru tagfeydd ar yr ymylon, yn cael fawr o effaith o gymharu â'r hyn a addawyd yn eich maniffesto?
There's an irony here in that I was the person who wrote the manifesto that proposed the black route and, of course, Mark Reckless was a member of a political party that was responsible for writing a manifesto pledge opposing the black route. Look, I stand by the proposal that we made. However, I do recognise that times have changed since the black route was conceived. It's only responsible for Governments to accept—when times change, when new challenges are presented, to respond accordingly and to act in a nimble way, and that's precisely what we've done.
But I can assure all Members that we recognise that this challenge has to be addressed; 'do nothing' is simply not an option. The question for us is whether we are able to respond, packaging some of the alternatives in a way that will reduce or eliminate congestion—but also, at the same time, do so with less cost to the public purse. I believe that we can achieve a reduction in congestion on the M4 through Newport in a way that offers value for money and minimises cost to the public purse. Now, the commission's work has already begun. I have had an incredibly constructive discussion with Lord Burns about the work that's been undertaken to date by the Welsh Government, and how he and his commission will take it forward.
Mae eironi yma gan mai fi oedd y person a ysgrifennodd y maniffesto ac a argymhellodd y llwybr du ac wrth gwrs, roedd Mark Reckless yn aelod o blaid wleidyddol a oedd yn gyfrifol am ysgrifennu adduned maniffesto yn gwrthwynebu'r llwybr du. Edrychwch, rwy'n glynu wrth y cynnig a wnaethom. Fodd bynnag, rwy'n cydnabod bod pethau wedi newid ers i'r llwybr du gael ei lunio. Mae'n gyfrifol i Lywodraethau dderbyn—pan fydd pethau'n newid, pan geir heriau newydd, i ymateb yn unol â hynny ac i weithredu mewn ffordd fwy hyblyg, a dyna'n union a wnaethom.
Ond gallaf sicrhau pob Aelod ein bod yn cydnabod bod yn rhaid mynd i'r afael â'r her hon; nid yw 'gwneud dim' yn opsiwn. Y cwestiwn i ni yw a allwn ymateb, pecynnu rhai o'r dewisiadau amgen mewn ffordd a fydd yn lleihau neu'n dileu tagfeydd—ond gwneud hynny hefyd ar yr un pryd am lai o gost i'r pwrs cyhoeddus. Credaf y gallwn gyfyngu ar dagfeydd ar yr M4 drwy Gasnewydd mewn ffordd sy'n cynnig gwerth am arian ac yn lleihau'r gost i bwrs y wlad. Nawr, mae gwaith y comisiwn eisoes wedi dechrau. Rwyf wedi cael trafodaeth eithriadol o adeiladol gyda'r Arglwydd Burns am y gwaith sydd wedi'i wneud hyd yma gan Lywodraeth Cymru, a sut y bydd ef a'i gomisiwn yn ei ddatblygu.
Ac, yn olaf, cwestiwn 8—Llyr Gruffydd.
And, finally, question 8—Llyr Gruffydd.
8. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am wariant cyhoeddus ar rwydwaith trenau Cymru? OAQ54010
8. Will the Minister make a statement on public spending on the rail network in Wales? OAQ54010
Yes, of course. The UK Government is responsible for funding rail infrastructure in Wales, as we are all aware, and it is an unfortunate fact that we must rely on it to provide an equitable investment programme. We continue to press the case for devolution so that we can develop a Welsh network, catering for the journeys that people need to make.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Mae Llywodraeth y DU yn gyfrifol am ariannu'r seilwaith rheilffyrdd yng Nghymru, fel y gŵyr pawb ohonom, ac mae'n ffaith anffodus fod yn rhaid inni ddibynnu arni i ddarparu rhaglen fuddsoddi deg. Rydym yn dal i ddadlau'r achos dros ddatganoli fel y gallwn ddatblygu rhwydwaith i Gymru, sy'n darparu ar gyfer y teithiau y mae pobl angen eu gwneud.
Well, thank you for your answer. I was quite struck by the letter that you shared with Assembly Members—the letter that you sent to David Lidington on 22 May—where you highlight under-investment in Welsh rail infrastructure. You say in the letter that there is a history of sustained and chronic under-investment in the Welsh network when compared with England, based on an approach that prioritises UK Government objectives, using a system that systematically favours investment in London and the south-east of England. So, that's highlighting once again, isn't it, how poorly Wales is being treated by the UK Government. We are clearly not getting our fair share. Indeed, Plaid Cymru has always said that the UK is an unequal union of nations. Having read your letter, I presume that you now agree with Plaid Cymru.
Wel, diolch am eich ateb. Cefais fy nharo gan y llythyr a rannoch chi gydag Aelodau'r Cynulliad—y llythyr a anfonoch chi at David Lidington ar 22 Mai—lle rydych yn tynnu sylw at danfuddsoddi yn seilwaith rheilffyrdd Cymru. Dywedwch yn y llythyr fod hanes o danfuddsoddi parhaus a chronig yn rhwydwaith Cymru o'i gymharu â Lloegr, yn seiliedig ar ddull gweithredu sy'n blaenoriaethu amcanion Llywodraeth y DU, gan ddefnyddio system sy'n systematig yn ffafrio buddsoddi yn Llundain a de-ddwyrain Lloegr. Felly, mae hynny'n amlygu unwaith eto, onid yw, pa mor wael y mae Cymru yn cael ei thrin gan Lywodraeth y DU. Yn amlwg, nid ydym yn cael ein cyfran deg. Yn wir, mae Plaid Cymru wedi dweud erioed fod y DU yn undeb anghyfartal o wledydd. Wedi darllen eich llythyr, rwy'n cymryd eich bod yn cytuno â Phlaid Cymru yn awr.
The problem is that—and we're addressing it here in Wales, and I hope that the UK Government will follow suit—. The problem is that, through the Treasury Green Book, decisions are often made in a way that benefits those areas of the UK that are already intensely urbanised and where there is already a high concentration of people who are high earners. And, of course, south-east London is the obvious case in point. What we're doing in Wales, and it forms part of the economic action plan, is developing a regional approach to rebalance the Welsh economy. And, just as I've set up the regional economic development units and appointed the chief regional officers, before recess, I will be presenting an oral statement to the Chamber concerning the publication of regional indicative budgets to ensure that, when we talk about fair funding, we don't just talk about fair funding for Wales, we talk about fair funding for the constituent parts of Wales. And I think that's something that Members across this Chamber recognise is absolutely essential if we are to drive prosperity across all communities, rather than just have it concentrated in the most urban areas.
Y broblem yw—ac rydym yn rhoi sylw iddi yma yng Nghymru, ac rwy'n gobeithio y bydd Llywodraeth y DU yn gwneud hynny hefyd—. Y broblem yw, drwy lyfr gwyrdd y Trysorlys, caiff penderfyniadau eu gwneud yn aml mewn ffordd sydd o fudd i'r ardaloedd hynny o'r DU sydd eisoes yn drefol tu hwnt a lle mae crynodiad uchel eisoes o bobl sy'n ennill llawer o arian. Ac wrth gwrs, de-ddwyrain Llundain yw'r enghraifft amlwg o hyn. Yr hyn a wnawn yng Nghymru, ac mae'n rhan o'r cynllun gweithredu economaidd, yw datblygu dull rhanbarthol o ailgydbwyso economi Cymru. Ac fel y sefydlais yr unedau datblygu economaidd rhanbarthol a phenodi prif swyddogion rhanbarthol, cyn y toriad, byddaf yn cyflwyno datganiad llafar i'r Siambr ynghylch cyhoeddi cyllidebau dynodol rhanbarthol i sicrhau, pan fyddwn yn siarad am ariannu teg, nad sôn yn unig am ariannu teg i Gymru a wnawn, ond ein bod yn sôn am ariannu teg i rannau cyfansoddol Cymru. Ac rwy'n credu bod hynny'n rhywbeth y mae'r Aelodau ar draws y Siambr hon yn cydnabod ei fod yn gwbl hanfodol os ydym am ysgogi ffyniant ar draws pob cymuned, yn hytrach na'i fod wedi'i grynhoi yn yr ardaloedd mwyaf trefol yn unig.
Diolch i'r Gweinidog.
Thank you to the Minister.
Y cwestiynau nesaf felly i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol a’r Gweinidog Brexit mewn perthynas â'i gyfrifoldebau fel Gweinidog Brexit. Ac mae'r cwestiwn cyntaf gan David Rees.
The next questions, therefore, to the Counsel General and Brexit Minister in respect of his Brexit Minister responsibilities. And the first question is from David Rees.
1. Pa asesiad y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'i wneud o'r effaith a gaiff Brexit ar strwythur Cydbwyllgor y Gweinidogion? OAQ54019
1. What assessment has the Counsel General made of the impact that Brexit will have on the structure of the Joint Ministerial Committee? OAQ54019
We said in 'Brexit and Devolution' that the JMC structures are not adequate for the new challenges we face as we leave the EU. We published 'Brexit and Devolution' two years ago, and our view remains unchanged.
Roeddem yn dweud yn 'Brexit a Datganoli' nad yw strwythurau'r Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion yn ddigonol ar gyfer yr heriau newydd a wynebwn wrth inni adael yr UE. Cyhoeddasom 'Brexit a Datganoli' ddwy flynedd yn ôl, ac nid yw ein safbwynt wedi newid.
Thank you for that answer, Minister. What you've just then highlighted has been echoed around this Chamber by Members and by various committees of this Assembly. Clearly, the JMC is not working. It is very much dependent upon individuals within Westminster as to how they see it, and whether they want to see it work or not. There is no formal structure. There is no stature underpinning it.
There was a JMC review, which was initiated by Westminster, but that's going over 12 months ago now, and we're still waiting for that outcome. Surely, it's time for us, with other nations in the UK, to actually start saying to UK Government, 'This structure must change. It must be underpinned by statute. We need to have a structure which treats each nation equally, each Government equally, within these discussions' and therefore it's underpinned to ensure that no one individual may decide whether it's a good thing or a bad thing.
Diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw, Weinidog. Adleisiwyd yr hyn rydych newydd ei danlinellu o amgylch y Siambr hon gan Aelodau a phwyllgorau amrywiol y Cynulliad. Yn amlwg, nid yw'r Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion yn gweithio. Mae'n dibynnu'n fawr ar sut y mae unigolion yn San Steffan yn ei weld, ac a ydynt am ei weld yn gweithio ai peidio. Nid oes strwythur ffurfiol. Nid oes unrhyw statws yn sail iddo.
Cafwyd adolygiad o'r Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion, a gychwynnwyd gan San Steffan, ond mae dros 12 mis ers hynny bellach, ac rydym yn dal i ddisgwyl ei ganlyniad. Yn sicr, mae'n bryd i ni, gyda gwledydd eraill y DU, ddechrau dweud wrth Lywodraeth y DU, 'Rhaid i'r strwythur hwn newid. Rhaid iddo fod yn seiliedig ar statud. Mae angen i ni gael strwythur sy'n trin pob gwlad yn gyfartal, a phob Llywodraeth yn gyfartal, o fewn y trafodaethau hyn' ac felly fe'i tanategir er mwyn sicrhau na all unrhyw unigolyn benderfynu a yw'n beth da neu'n beth drwg.
Well, I think the Member hits the nail on the head with his supplementary question, and I share his disappointment. It's now coming up to 15 months, actually, since the review of inter-governmental relations was commissioned. And the truth is that it's certainly not in the interest of Wales, but it's actually not in the interest of any part of the UK for the JMC structures to continue trying to bear the weight that is now placed upon them by Brexit in particular. I should say that the truth is that the First Minister has required more progress to happen than has happened. So, we are very disappointed with the level of—lack of progress, rather. The truth is there are—the constitutional ambitions, if I can put it like that, of the different Governments involved are different. There is no political leadership in Northern Ireland at the moment, and there has been the effort put into 'no deal' preparations. Official-level working has been good, but it's absolutely the case that not sufficient progress has been made. I would say that we've seen very little progress. I'm hoping to meet David Lidington later this week, and I'll be making the point to him that I'm concerned that there is no real commitment on the part of the United Kingdom Government to progress this.
He mentioned the principle of parity of participation in his question, which is absolutely fundamental to this. We've also talked about a mechanism for resolving disputes that introduces an independent element, so that, as his question implies, it isn't simply a matter for one part of the UK to determine the outcome.
On the question of statutory underpinning, I think that could be usefully explored. I'm not sure myself that it is the panacea—what we need is robust structures. If it's also underpinned by statute, then that would be an advantage, but I think the key thing is to have in place structures that, frankly, work. I will also say that the format of the JMC, which is able, ultimately, to resolve this is the one between First Ministers and the Prime Minister. So, obviously, in light of the fact that the Conservative leadership is contested at the moment, that clearly is going to delay the point at which that format of the JMC is going to be able to meet to address this. But the next format of the JMC, on which I represent the Government, is intending to look at this point, at our instigation.
Wel, rwy'n credu bod yr Aelod wedi taro'r hoelen ar ei phen gyda'i gwestiwn atodol, ac rwy'n rhannu ei siom. Mae bron 15 mis bellach mewn gwirionedd ers comisiynu'r adolygiad o gysylltiadau rhynglywodraethol. Ac yn sicr, y gwir amdani yw nad yw er budd Cymru, nac unrhyw ran o'r DU mewn gwirionedd fod strwythurau'r Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion yn parhau i geisio cynnal y pwysau a roddir arnynt bellach gan Brexit yn benodol. Dylwn ddweud mai'r gwir amdani yw bod y Prif Weinidog wedi gofyn am fwy o gynnydd nag a fu. Felly, rydym yn siomedig iawn â lefel—y diffyg cynnydd, yn hytrach. Y gwir yw bod—mae uchelgeisiau cyfansoddiadol, os caf ei roi felly, y gwahanol Lywodraethau'n wahanol. Nid oes arweinyddiaeth wleidyddol yng Ngogledd Iwerddon ar hyn o bryd, ac ymdrechwyd i roi paratoadau 'dim bargen' ar waith. Mae'r gwaith ar lefel swyddogion wedi bod yn dda, ond mae'n sicr na wnaethpwyd digon o gynnydd. Buaswn yn dweud mai ychydig iawn o gynnydd a welsom. Rwy'n gobeithio cyfarfod â David Lidington yn ddiweddarach yr wythnos hon, a byddaf yn dweud wrtho fy mod yn pryderu nad oes ymrwymiad go iawn ar ran Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig i fwrw ymlaen â hyn.
Soniodd am yr egwyddor o gyfranogiad cyfartal yn ei gwestiwn, sy'n gwbl hanfodol i hyn. Rydym hefyd wedi siarad am fecanwaith i ddatrys anghydfodau sy'n cyflwyno elfen annibynnol, fel nad yw'n fater syml, fel y mae ei gwestiwn yn awgrymu, o un rhan o'r DU yn penderfynu'r canlyniad.
Ar gwestiwn sail statudol, credaf y byddai'n fuddiol ymchwilio i hynny. Nid wyf yn siŵr fy hun mai dyna'r ateb i bob problem—yr hyn sydd ei angen arnom yw strwythurau cadarn. Os yw hefyd yn seiliedig ar statud, byddai hynny'n fantais, ond credaf mai'r peth allweddol yw cael strwythurau ar waith sy'n gweithio. Hoffwn ddweud hefyd mai'r fformat Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion sy'n gallu datrys hyn yn y pen draw yw'r un rhwng Prif Weinidogion y gwledydd a Phrif Weinidog y DU. Felly, yn amlwg, yng ngoleuni'r ffaith bod yna ras am arweinyddiaeth y Ceidwadwyr ar hyn o bryd, mae'n amlwg y bydd hynny'n peri oedi cyn y gall fformat y Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion gyfarfod er mwyn mynd i'r afael â hyn. Ond mae fformat nesaf y Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion, lle rwy'n cynrychioli'r Llywodraeth, yn bwriadu edrych ar y pwynt hwn, ar ein hanogaeth ni.
Mae yn hynod o bwysig, dwi'n credu, bod strwythur Cyd-bwyllgor y Gweinidogion yn cael ei gryfhau yn y dyfodol, a dwi hefyd yn credu y dylem ni ddiwygio'r pwyllgor, a gosod y pwyllgor ar lefel statudol, i sicrhau bod llais Cymru yn glir mewn unrhyw drafodaethau yn y dyfodol. Dwi'n credu, mewn ateb i'r Aelod dros Aberafan, eich bod chi wedi dweud dŷch chi ddim yn ffafrio rhoi'r pwyllgor ar lefel statudol. Allwch chi esbonio i ni pam dŷch chi ddim yn ffafrio hynny? Oherwydd dyna'r ffordd ymlaen, yn fy marn i.
It is crucially important, I think, that the JMC structure is strengthened for the future, and I also feel that we should reform the committee, and place it on a statutory level, to ensure that the Welsh voice is clearly heard in any future discussions. I think that, in response to the Member for Aberavon, you said that you don't favour placing the JMC on a statutory level. Could you explain why that's the case? Because I do believe that that's the way forward.
Diolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn, a'r cyfle i ateb y pwynt penodol hwnnw. Nid cwestiwn o ddim ffafrio hynny yw hyn—buasai hynny yn fantais. Yr hyn rwy'n ei ddweud yw nid panacea yw hynny am gael system o weithredu sydd, a dweud y gwir, yn cefnogi'n gwaith ni yma yng Nghymru ac ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig.
I thank the Member for the question, and for the opportunity to respond to that specific point. It's not a matter of not favouring that—that would certainly be an advantage. What I'm saying is that that isn't a panacea for having a system that truly supports our work here in Wales and across the UK.
2. A wnaiff y Cwnsler Cyffredinol roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am drafodaethau Brexit gyda Llywodraeth y DU? OAQ54000
2. Will the Counsel General provide an update on Brexit discussions with the UK Government? OAQ54000
I continue to have regular discussions with the UK Government on a number of Brexit-related issues. I met the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union most recently in Cardiff on 16 May, and a meeting of the Joint Ministerial Committee on EU negotiations is scheduled for the end of this month.
Rwy'n parhau i gael trafodaethau rheolaidd gyda Llywodraeth y DU ar nifer o faterion yn ymwneud â Brexit. Cefais gyfarfod â'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Adael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd yn fwyaf diweddar yng Nghaerdydd ar 16 Mai, ac mae cyfarfod o'r Cyd-bwyllgor Gweinidogion ar negodiadau'r UE wedi'i drefnu ar gyfer diwedd y mis hwn.
Counsel General, thank you for that answer. There is a growing fear that the national health service is going to become the sacrificial lamb on the altar of a 'no deal' Brexit. When Donald Trump said that the NHS would be a service that would be part of a UK-US trade deal, when Theresa May stood next to him and refused to deny that, when the US have refused to change their negotiating objectives, which include all services as part of a deal, where we have a situation where international trade deals that could override and implement measures in devolved areas without the consent of this place, when the health Minister wrote a year or so ago to Theresa May asking for assurances and guarantees about the protection of the NHS, which she refused to give, and in a situation where we have a potential new Tory First Minister in support of privatisation of the national health service and a supine trade deal with the US, what steps is the Welsh Government taking to protect the national health service from a 'no deal' Brexit?
Gwnsler Cyffredinol, diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw. Mae ofn cynyddol fod y gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol yn mynd i fod yn aberth ar allor Brexit 'dim bargen'. Pan ddywedodd Donald Trump y byddai'r GIG yn wasanaeth a fyddai'n rhan o gytundeb masnach rhwng y DU a'r UDA, pan safai Theresa May yn ei ymyl a gwrthod gwadu hynny, pan fo'r UDA wedi gwrthod newid eu hamcanion negodi, sy'n cynnwys yr holl wasanaethau fel rhan o gytundeb, pan fo gennym sefyllfa lle mae cytundebau masnach ryngwladol a allai ddiystyru a gweithredu mesurau mewn meysydd datganoledig heb ganiatâd y lle hwn, pan fo'r Gweinidog iechyd wedi ysgrifennu at Theresa May flwyddyn neu ddwy yn ôl yn gofyn am sicrwydd a gwarantau ynghylch amddiffyn y GIG, rhywbeth y gwrthododd eu rhoi, ac mewn sefyllfa pan fo gennym Brif Weinidog Torïaidd newydd posibl sy'n cefnogi preifateiddio'r gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol a chytundeb masnach unochrog gyda'r UDA, pa gamau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd i ddiogelu'r gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol rhag Brexit 'dim bargen'?
I thank the Member for that question. I too also saw the press conference to which he refers in his question, and it made the blood run cold to hear the NHS being talked about as an asset for commercial sale in that way. I will be absolutely clear: the Welsh NHS is a public service and, under the Welsh Government, will remain so. The Minister for international relations, Eluned Morgan, has made absolutely clear to her counterpart, Liam Fox, the international trade Secretary, that the devolution settlement must be respected in relation to trade deals, and that would include trade deals of the sort the Member is referring to. And it must respect the fact that the Welsh Government is determined to make sure the NHS is preserved as a public service here in Wales. There is absolutely no prospect of us allowing the Welsh NHS to be part of any negotiation. But I think the Member is right to highlight this issue, which I think shines a light on the consequences of the kind of trade policy that the UK Government might seek to pursue in a 'no deal' Brexit scenario.
In relation to the NHS more generally, we are of course working with the NHS in Wales in relation to robustness and resilience to face the challenges that would be faced in the context of any kind of Brexit, but particularly a 'no deal' Brexit. Some of that is around medicine supply, medical devices—as the Member will know—and around workforce planning, which, as we discussed in the Chamber yesterday in our migration debate, could seriously come under pressure in the context of the UK Government's new migration policies.
Diolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn hwnnw. Gwelais innau hefyd y gynhadledd i'r wasg y mae'n cyfeirio ati yn ei gwestiwn, ac aeth fy ngwaed yn oer wrth glywed y GIG yn cael ei drafod fel ased ar gyfer gwerthiant masnachol yn y ffordd honno. Rwyf am fod yn gwbl glir: gwasanaeth cyhoeddus yw GIG Cymru ac o dan Lywodraeth Cymru, bydd yn parhau felly. Mae'r Gweinidog dros gysylltiadau rhyngwladol, Eluned Morgan, wedi dweud yn gwbl glir wrth ei haelod cyfatebol, Liam Fox, yr Ysgrifennydd masnach ryngwladol, fod yn rhaid parchu'r setliad datganoli mewn perthynas â chytundebau masnach, a byddai hynny'n cynnwys cytundebau masnach o'r math y mae'r Aelod yn cyfeirio ato. A rhaid iddo barchu'r ffaith bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn benderfynol o sicrhau bod y GIG yn cael ei gadw'n wasanaeth cyhoeddus yma yng Nghymru. Nid oes perygl o gwbl y caniatawn i GIG Cymru fod yn rhan o unrhyw negodiad. Ond rwy'n credu bod yr Aelod yn iawn i dynnu sylw at y mater hwn, sy'n taflu goleuni ar ganlyniadau'r math o bolisi masnach y gallai Llywodraeth y DU geisio'i ddilyn mewn senario 'dim bargen' yn fy marn i.
Mewn perthynas â'r GIG yn fwy cyffredinol wrth gwrs, rydym yn gweithio gyda'r GIG yng Nghymru mewn perthynas â chadernid a gallu i wrthsefyll yr heriau y byddid yn eu hwynebu yng nghyd-destun unrhyw fath o Brexit, ond Brexit 'dim bargen' yn enwedig. Mae rhywfaint o hynny'n ymwneud â chyflenwadau o feddyginiaethau, offer meddygol—fel y gŵyr yr Aelod—ac ynghylch cynllunio'r gweithlu, a allai ddod o dan bwysau difrifol, fel y trafodasom yn y Siambr ddoe yn ein dadl ar fudo, yng nghyd-destun polisïau mudo newydd gan Lywodraeth y DU.
The most recent Brexit discussion with the UK Government has of course been around the First Minister's use, or non-use, of a Foreign Office car in Brussels today. However, on the NHS issue, it is not commercially traded. Surely, when something is a public service, it is not something that is part of a trade deal in the way that is suggested. Of course, if you have public procurement, you will want to procure cheaply and effectively and get good value, and if you enter into a contract with an overseas provider, it is quite reasonable that that contract should be respected and that should be insured either through the British courts or through investor dispute resolution. Is that not all that we're talking about here?
Wrth gwrs roedd y drafodaeth Brexit ddiweddaraf gyda Llywodraeth y DU yn ymwneud â defnydd, neu ddiffyg defnydd, y Prif Weinidog o gar y Swyddfa Dramor ym Mrwsel heddiw. Fodd bynnag, ar fater y GIG, ni chaiff ei fasnachu. Pan fydd rhywbeth yn wasanaeth cyhoeddus, nid yw'n rhywbeth sy'n rhan o gytundeb masnach yn y ffordd a awgrymir. Wrth gwrs, os oes gennych gaffael cyhoeddus, fe fyddwch am gaffael yn rhad ac yn effeithiol a chael gwerth da, ac os ymrwymwch i gontract gyda darparwr tramor, mae'n eithaf rhesymol disgwyl i'r contract hwnnw gael ei barchu ac y dylid ei yswirio naill ai drwy lysoedd Prydain neu drwy drefn ddatrys anghydfod i fuddsoddwyr. Onid dyna'r cwbl sydd dan sylw yma?
I have absolutely no confidence in the commitment of the Brexit Party to the NHS. The leader of the party has been absolutely categorical that he does not believe in a publicly funded NHS and believes in an insurance system. So, the Member will have to forgive me if I take that with a pinch of salt. [Interruption.]
Nid oes gennyf hyder o gwbl yn ymrwymiad Plaid Brexit i'r GIG. Mae arweinydd y blaid wedi bod yn gwbl bendant nad yw'n credu mewn GIG a ariennir yn gyhoeddus ac mae'n credu mewn system yswiriant. Felly, bydd yn rhaid i'r Aelod faddau imi os cymeraf hynny â phinsiad o halen. [Torri ar draws.]
Alun Davies.
Alun Davies.
I'm grateful to you, Presiding Officer. Minister, you, like me, will have seen the rather astonishing press reports this morning that the First Minister has not been provided with diplomatic support during his visit in Brussels. Now, like yourself and myself—we've both enjoyed the support of the diplomatic service of the United Kingdom, and I remember negotiating and discussing with David Lidington and William Hague and others how that can be strengthened. Whilst Ministers here are not Ministers of the United Kingdom Government, they are United Kingdom Ministers, and in Brussels, we are part of the United Kingdom ministerial team, and we have agreements with the United Kingdom Government that we do enjoy the support of the United Kingdom Representation to the European Union and of the foreign office. I would place on record my gratitude to UKRep and to civil servants in the foreign office for the excellent support that I received, both within the European Union and elsewhere, whilst travelling as a representative of the Welsh Government. Will you then take up this issue with David Lidington when you meet him later this week, and say to him that we expect all our Ministers to be treated with the respect that the electoral mandate gives them, and that we are here to represent the Government here and the people of Wales, and we are not expected to ask permission from any member of the UK Government as to how we do that?
Rwy'n ddiolchgar ichi, Lywydd. Weinidog, fe fyddwch chi, fel finnau, wedi gweld adroddiadau rhyfeddol braidd yn y wasg y bore yma na ddarparwyd cymorth diplomyddol ar gyfer y Prif Weinidog yn ystod ei ymweliad â Brwsel. Nawr, fel chi a fi—rydym ein dau wedi mwynhau cymorth gwasanaeth diplomyddol y Deyrnas Unedig, ac rwy'n cofio trafod a negodi gyda David Lidington a William Hague ac eraill sut y gellir cryfhau hynny. Er nad yw Gweinidogion yn y fan hon yn Weinidogion Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig, Gweinidogion y Deyrnas Unedig ydynt, ac ym Mrwsel, rydym yn rhan o dîm gweinidogol y Deyrnas Unedig, ac mae gennym gytundebau â Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig sy'n dynodi ein bod yn cael cymorth Cynrychiolaeth y Deyrnas Unedig i'r Undeb Ewropeaidd a'r swyddfa dramor. Hoffwn gofnodi fy niolch i UKRep ac i weision sifil yn y swyddfa dramor am y gefnogaeth ardderchog a gefais, o fewn yr Undeb Ewropeaidd ac mewn mannau eraill, wrth deithio fel cynrychiolydd ar ran Llywodraeth Cymru. A wnewch chi godi'r mater hwn gyda David Lidington pan fyddwch yn ei gyfarfod yn ddiweddarach yr wythnos hon, a dweud wrtho ein bod yn disgwyl i'n holl Weinidogion gael eu trin â'r parch a roddir iddynt gan y mandad etholiadol, a'n bod yma i gynrychioli'r Llywodraeth yma a'r Cymry, ac nid oes disgwyl inni ofyn caniatâd unrhyw aelod o Lywodraeth y DU ynglŷn â sut y gwnawn hynny?
I thank the Member for his question. As he indicates in it, our relationship with the UK Representation to the EU is very good, so we were particularly puzzled and disappointed, if I can put it like that, by the unprecedented decision that the Foreign and Commonwealth Office appear to have taken. I should say, as context, that we have been provided as a Welsh Government with high-quality support by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office on every previous occasion when Ministers have visited Brussels, as he himself in the question indicates. I can confirm that the FCO informed the Government that they'd only provide support while the First Minister was in Brussels today, including access to the car pool service, if we gave assurances that the First Minister would not undermine UK Government policy. We made it clear that the First Minister and Welsh Ministers take seriously, in their capacity as Ministers of the United Kingdom, their duties to the United Kingdom when abroad on official business, but that is not out of deference to the UK Government and it certainly isn't in consideration of getting access to car services. So, we refused to give any assurance that would fetter or inhibit the entitlement of the First Minister to speak up for Wales's national interest. Ultimately, as it happened, car facilities were then offered, but the First Minister is travelling using public transport throughout his visit to Brussels today.
Diolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn. Fel y mae'n nodi ynddo, mae ein perthynas â Chynrychiolaeth y DU i'r UE yn dda iawn, felly roedd y penderfyniad digynsail yr ymddengys bod y Swyddfa Dramor a Chymanwlad wedi'i wneud yn peri penbleth a siom i ni, os caf ei roi felly. Fel cyd-destun, dylwn ddweud ein bod wedi cael cymorth o ansawdd uchel gan y Swyddfa Dramor a Chymanwlad fel Llywodraeth Cymru ar bob achlysur blaenorol pan fu Gweinidogion yn ymweld â Brwsel, fel y nododd yn y cwestiwn. Gallaf gadarnhau bod y Swyddfa Dramor a Chymanwlad wedi hysbysu'r Llywodraeth na fyddent yn darparu cymorth tra oedd y Prif Weinidog ym Mrwsel heddiw, gan gynnwys defnydd o'r gwasanaeth ceir, oni bai ein bod yn rhoi sicrwydd na fyddai'r Prif Weinidog yn tanseilio polisi Llywodraeth y DU. Gwnaethom yn glir fod y Prif Weinidog a Gweinidogion Cymru o ddifrif ynglŷn â'u dyletswyddau, yn rhinwedd eu swydd fel Gweinidogion y Deyrnas Unedig, i'r Deyrnas Unedig pan fyddant dramor ar fusnes swyddogol, ond nid yw hynny'n golygu eu bod yn ymostyngol i Lywodraeth y DU ac yn sicr nid yw cael defnydd o wasanaethau ceir yn rhan o'r ystyriaeth. Felly, fe wnaethom wrthod rhoi unrhyw sicrwydd a fyddai'n llyffetheirio neu'n llesteirio hawl y Prif Weinidog i siarad dros fuddiannau cenedlaethol Cymru. Yn y pen draw, fel y digwyddodd, fe gynigiwyd cyfleusterau ceir wedyn, ond mae'r Prif Weinidog yn teithio gan ddefnyddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus drwy gydol ei ymweliad â Brwsel heddiw.
Cwestiynau nawr gan lefarwyr y pleidiau. Llefarydd y Ceidwadwyr, Darren Millar.
Questions now from party spokespeople. Conservative spokesperson, Darren Millar.
Thank you, Presiding Officer. Will the Minister make a statement on the Welsh Government's strategy for its discussions with the European Commission today?
Diolch, Lywydd. A wnaiff y Gweinidog ddatganiad am strategaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer ei thrafodaethau â'r Comisiwn Ewropeaidd heddiw?
At the moment, we are anticipating the change of Commission personnel in future. The First Minister is today in Brussels planning to meet with a number of our partners there, including Michel Barnier.
Ar hyn o bryd, rydym yn rhagweld newid personél y Comisiwn yn y dyfodol. Mae'r Prif Weinidog ym Mrwsel heddiw gyda'r bwriad o gyfarfod â nifer o'n partneriaid yno, gan gynnwys Michel Barnier.
Thank you for that answer. I have to say I do find it astonishing that Welsh Labour Ministers seem to be more interested in chauffeur-driven cars than they do in the real issue of the day. I am sure that the Welsh Government would not want to allow its resources to be used to support activities that undermine its policy objectives either, and I think Ministers frankly should grow up and listen up to the people of Wales who voted to leave the EU in 2016. You didn't refer in your answer then to the negotiating strategy that the First Minister may or may not be employing in Brussels today. But will you tell us whether he will be reiterating the will of the people of Wales, who voted to leave the EU in 2016, and if not, why not?
Diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw. Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud fy mod yn rhyfeddu ei bod yn ymddangos bod gan Weinidogion Llafur Cymru fwy o ddiddordeb mewn ceir sy'n cael eu gyrru gan chaffeurs nag sydd ganddynt mewn materion go iawn. Rwy'n siŵr na fyddai Llywodraeth Cymru am ganiatáu i'w hadnoddau gael eu defnyddio i gefnogi gweithgareddau sy'n tanseilio ei hamcanion polisi hithau chwaith, ac a dweud y gwir rwy'n credu y dylai Gweinidogion dyfu fyny a gwrando ar bobl Cymru a bleidleisiodd dros adael yr UE yn 2016. Ni chyfeirioch chi yn eich ateb yn awr at y strategaeth negodi y gallai'r Prif Weinidog fod yn ei defnyddio, neu beidio, ym Mrwsel heddiw. Ond a wnewch chi ddweud wrthym a fydd yn ailadrodd ewyllys pobl Cymru a bleidleisiodd dros adael yr UE yn 2016, ac os na fydd, pam ddim?
I think that's a curious question from the Member. I had finished my answer to the previous question by saying that the First Minister was using public transport in Brussels today, which seems to me to indicate a complete lack of interest in the use of Government cars. So, I think he should reflect on the fact that the First Minister is in Brussels dealing with matters of substance rather than matters of presentation and headlines as his question suggests. The First Minister will be describing what is in the best interests of Wales and the position of the Welsh Government on behalf of the people of Wales in his discussions in Europe, as he does at every other opportunity.
Rwy'n credu bod hwnnw'n gwestiwn rhyfedd gan yr Aelod. Gorffennais fy ateb i'r cwestiwn blaenorol drwy ddweud bod y Prif Weinidog yn defnyddio trafnidiaeth gyhoeddus ym Mrwsel heddiw, sydd i'w weld i mi yn dynodi diffyg diddordeb llwyr yn y defnydd o geir y Llywodraeth. Felly, credaf y dylai ystyried y ffaith bod y Prif Weinidog ym Mrwsel yn ymdrin â materion o sylwedd yn hytrach na materion yn ymwneud â chyflwyniad a phenawdau fel y mae ei gwestiwn yn awgrymu. Bydd y Prif Weinidog yn disgrifio beth sydd er lles gorau Cymru a safbwynt Llywodraeth Cymru ar ran pobl Cymru yn ei drafodaethau yn Ewrop, fel y mae'n gwneud ar bob cyfle arall.
Isn't the reality, Minister, that you're still playing politics with Brexit? There was a clear manifesto commitment from the Labour Party in 2017 to deliver Brexit and it's quite clear now to the people of Wales that Labour cannot be trusted to deliver on that particular manifesto commitment. Now, you've already done a u-turn in terms of your position on a second referendum, and you've said that there needs to be an option to remain on a ballot paper in a future referendum. But the reality is, of course, that the one thing that the people of Wales didn't vote for is any kind or version of 'remain'. You keep going on about kinds or versions of 'leave', but one thing that the people of Wales did not endorse—and absolutely did not endorse—was any kind of remaining in the European Union. How can you justify ignoring the outcome of the 2016 referendum, which rejected 'remain' on the ballot paper, and what guarantees can you give to the people of Wales that if there is a second referendum—and I very much hope that there will not be—that you won't ignore that one either?
Onid y gwir amdani, Weinidog, yw eich bod yn dal i chwarae gwleidyddiaeth â Brexit? Cafwyd ymrwymiad maniffesto clir gan y Blaid Lafur yn 2017 i gyflawni Brexit ac mae'n eithaf clir yn awr i bobl Cymru na ellir ymddiried yn y Blaid Lafur i gyflawni'r ymrwymiad maniffesto penodol hwnnw. Nawr, rydych eisoes wedi gwneud tro pedol o ran eich safbwynt ar ail refferendwm, ac rydych wedi dweud bod angen opsiwn i aros ar bapur pleidleisio mewn refferendwm yn y dyfodol. Ond y gwir amdani, wrth gwrs, yw mai'r un peth na phleidleisiodd pobl Cymru drosto yw unrhyw fath neu fersiwn o 'aros'. Rydych yn dal i siarad am fathau neu fersiynau o 'adael', ond yr un peth nad oedd pobl Cymru'n ei gymeradwyo—ac nid oeddem yn ei gymeradwyo o gwbl—oedd unrhyw fath o aros yn yr Undeb Ewropeaidd. Sut y gallwch gyfiawnhau anwybyddu canlyniad refferendwm 2016, a wrthododd 'aros' ar y papur pleidleisio, a pha sicrwydd y gallwch ei roi i bobl Cymru, os bydd ail refferendwm—ac rwy'n mawr obeithio na fydd—na fyddwch yn anwybyddu hwnnw chwaith?
There are very few things, If I may say, that I admire about the Conservative Party, but his ability to chastise me for playing politics with a straight face, having asked the two questions he's just asked, is really quite admirable in its own way.
On the question of a referendum, I do not recall at any point hearing anybody advocate for a 'no deal' Brexit in 2016. Quite the opposite—everybody was telling us how straightforward it would be, how people would be falling over to reach terms with us. The Prime Minister, Theresa May, has completely failed to live up to those promises made.
We are now facing a situation where there is absolutely no mandate for a 'no deal' Brexit, which seems to be where the Conservative Party is careering us towards with the stampede of support like panicked bisons from the Conservative benches in Parliament towards Boris Johnson, who could joyfully be taking us towards a 'no deal' Brexit. In that situation, there is only one way that we can prevent the damage that that would cause to Wales and that is by putting the question back to the people, which is fundamentally a democratic principle.
Os caf ddweud, prin iawn yw'r pethau rwy'n eu hedmygu am y Blaid Geidwadol, ond mae ei gallu i fy ngheryddu am chwarae gwleidyddiaeth gydag wyneb syth, ar ôl gofyn y ddau gwestiwn y mae newydd eu gofyn, yn eithaf clodwiw yn ei ffordd ei hun.
Ar gwestiwn refferendwm, nid wyf yn cofio clywed neb ar unrhyw adeg yn dadlau dros Brexit 'dim bargen' yn 2016. I'r gwrthwyneb yn llwyr—roedd pawb yn dweud wrthym pa mor syml y byddai, sut y byddai pobl yn baglu dros ei gilydd i drafod telerau gyda ni. Mae'r Prif Weinidog, Theresa May, wedi methu'n llwyr â chyflawni'r addewidion a wnaethpwyd.
Rydym bellach yn wynebu sefyllfa lle nad oes mandad o gwbl ar gyfer Brexit 'dim bargen', sef yr hyn yr ymddengys y mae'r Blaid Geidwadol yn carlamu tuag ato yn debyg i ruthr o gefnogaeth fel bustych ofnus oddi ar feinciau'r Ceidwadwyr yn y Senedd i Boris Johnson, a allai ein hebrwng yn llawen tuag at Brexit 'dim bargen'. Yn y sefyllfa honno, nid oes ond un ffordd y gallwn atal y niwed y byddai hynny'n ei achosi i Gymru, sef drwy roi'r cwestiwn yn ôl i'r bobl, sy'n egwyddor ddemocrataidd sylfaenol.
Llefarydd Plaid Cymru, Delyth Jewell.
Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Delyth Jewell.
Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, Donald Trump has said that he'd want the NHS to be on the table in any future UK-US trade deal negotiations. He later rowed back on this, but the fact that his ambassador to the UK, Woody Johnson, has also said the same thing indicates clearly what US priorities will be if and when trade negotiations begin.
The Welsh Government's international relations Minister has said that there is no prospect whatsoever of the Welsh NHS being sold off in this way and the health Minister said that the Welsh NHS would not be up for sale. And you've spoken today already in answer to Mick Antoniw about workforce planning and the need to work with the NHS.
While I applaud your passion in favour of keeping NHS services publicly run and free at the point of need, can you explain to me exactly—and I would press you on this—what steps Welsh Government could take to prevent the Welsh NHS from being sold off if the Westminster Government were to trade it away during negotiations with the US?
Diolch, Lywydd. Weinidog, mae Donald Trump wedi dweud y byddai am i'r GIG fod ar y bwrdd mewn unrhyw drafodaethau yn y dyfodol ynglŷn â chytundeb masnach rhwng y DU a'r UDA. Yn ddiweddarach, fe dynnodd yn ôl ar hyn, ond mae'r ffaith bod ei lysgennad i'r DU, Woody Johnson, hefyd wedi dweud yr un peth yn dangos yn glir beth fydd blaenoriaethau'r UDA os a phan fydd trafodaethau masnach yn dechrau.
Mae Gweinidog cysylltiadau rhyngwladol Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dweud nad oes perygl o gwbl y caiff y GIG yng Nghymru ei werthu yn y ffordd hon a dywedodd y Gweinidog iechyd na fyddai GIG Cymru ar werth. Ac rydych chi wedi siarad heddiw eisoes yn eich ateb i Mick Antoniw am gynllunio'r gweithlu a'r angen i weithio gyda'r GIG.
Er fy mod yn cymeradwyo eich angerdd o blaid cadw gwasanaethau'r GIG yn gyhoeddus ac yn rhad ac am ddim lle mae eu hangen, a allwch egluro wrthyf—ac rwy'n pwyso arnoch i wneud hyn—pa gamau'n hollol y gallai Llywodraeth Cymru eu cymryd i atal GIG Cymru rhag cael ei werthu pe bai Llywodraeth San Steffan yn ei fasnachu'n rhan o negodiadau gyda'r UDA?
We have mechanisms in place to ensure that decisions on devolved areas remain our responsibility through the inter-governmental agreement. In relation to discussions relating to the trade negotiations, there are official-level discussions under way in order to give Wales a level of protection in advance of those discussions.
Mae gennym fecanweithiau ar waith i sicrhau bod penderfyniadau ar feysydd datganoledig yn parhau'n gyfrifoldeb i ni drwy'r cytundeb rhynglywodraethol. O ran trafodaethau'n ymwneud â'r negodiadau masnach, mae trafodaethau ar lefel swyddogol yn mynd rhagddynt er mwyn sicrhau lefel o warchodaeth i Gymru cyn y trafodaethau hynny.
Thank you for your answer, Minister. You speak about mechanisms and discussions without much detail there, but I think that's probably because the fact of the matter is there will be very little Welsh Government could do to protect the NHS if the Westminster Government decided to sell it off.
Plaid Cymru would obviously support you if, as the international relations Minister said on Monday, you would wish to take the Westminster Government to court on this. But the fact of the matter is that international trade is a reserved matter and powers over public procurement that could have been used to protect some aspects of our health services were given away as part of the inter-governmental agreement that you've referred to.
I'm sure you've been following the Conservative leadership contest with the same mix of horror and disbelief as I have. We've had candidates admitting to crimes that usually lead to jail sentences, candidates wanting to roll back human rights, and, most frightening of all, the candidate considered to be the favourite in the race, Boris Johnson, indicating clearly his intention to plough ahead on a disastrous path towards a 'no deal' Brexit.
Minister, were the next UK Prime Minister to decide to leave the EU without a deal and were they able to find a way to bypass Parliament, through prorogation perhaps, what steps could Welsh Government take to fully mitigate the disastrous consequences for Wales? These may be hypotheticals, but they are worryingly conceivable.
Diolch ichi am eich ateb, Weinidog. Rydych yn sôn am fecanweithiau a thrafodaethau heb lawer o fanylion yn y fan honno, ond rwy'n credu efallai mai'r rheswm am hynny yw mai ychydig iawn y gallai Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud i amddiffyn y GIG pe bai Llywodraeth San Steffan yn penderfynu ei werthu.
Mae'n amlwg y byddai Plaid Cymru yn eich cefnogi pe baech chi, fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog cysylltiadau rhyngwladol ddydd Llun, yn dymuno mynd â Llywodraeth San Steffan i'r llys ar hyn. Ond y gwir amdani yw bod masnach ryngwladol yn fater a gadwyd yn ôl a bod pwerau dros gaffael cyhoeddus y gellid bod wedi'u defnyddio i ddiogelu rhai agweddau ar ein gwasanaethau iechyd wedi cael eu hildio fel rhan o'r cytundeb rhynglywodraethol y cyfeirioch chi ato.
Rwy'n siŵr eich bod wedi bod yn dilyn y ras am arweinyddiaeth y Ceidwadwyr gyda'r un gymysgedd o arswyd ac anghrediniaeth â mi. Cawsom ymgeiswyr yn cyfaddef i droseddau sydd fel arfer yn arwain at ddedfryd o garchar, ymgeiswyr sydd eisiau cyfyngu ar hawliau dynol, ac yn fwyaf brawychus, yr ymgeisydd yr ystyrir ei fod yn ffefryn yn y ras, Boris Johnson, yn nodi'n glir ei fwriad i fwrw ymlaen ar lwybr trychinebus tuag at Brexit 'dim bargen'.
Weinidog, pe bai Prif Weinidog nesaf y DU yn penderfynu gadael yr UE heb fargen ac yn gallu dod o hyd i ffordd o osgoi'r Senedd, drwy ei rhagderfynu efallai, pa gamau y gallai Llywodraeth Cymru eu cymryd i liniaru'n llawn y canlyniadau trychinebus i Gymru? Efallai fod y rhain yn ddamcaniaethol, ond maent yn boenus o bosibl.
The Member persists in this view that powers were given away in the inter-governmental agreement. I'll invite her, when she asks me her next question, to specify one of those powers, because I've heard none specified in this Chamber, despite the persistence with that line of argument. In fact, each successive report that comes out from the UK Government indicates that it does not intend to use the section 12 powers, which would freeze the competence of this Assembly. I'd invite her perhaps to specify any of the powers she thinks have been given away as a consequence of that inter-governmental agreement.
She is right, of course, that international relations are a matter reserved to the UK Parliament, but she will also know that recently the Supreme Court, in the case in relation to the Scottish continuity Bill, was absolutely clear that domestic implementation of those agreements is a matter that is devolved and it's devolved to this place. I give the assurance that we will not implement a mechanism that enables the NHS to be put up for sale. But she's right to say that that indicates the state of mind and the intentions of certainly the American President. The failure of Theresa May as Prime Minister to challenge that, I thought, was extraordinary, in the press conference that David Rees referred to earlier.
She invites me to tell her that I feel it's possible to fully mitigate the consequences on Wales of a 'no deal' Brexit. I will be crystal clear with her—I do not believe it is possible to fully mitigate, with any level of preparation, either in the short term or the long term, the disastrous consequences for Wales of a 'no deal' Brexit.
Mae'r Aelod yn parhau i gredu bod pwerau wedi cael eu rhoi'n ôl yn y cytundeb rhynglywodraethol. Fe'i gwahoddaf, pan fydd yn gofyn ei chwestiwn nesaf imi, i bennu un o'r pwerau hynny, oherwydd nid wyf wedi clywed yr un yn cael ei nodi yn y Siambr hon, er gwaethaf y dyfalbarhad â'r ddadl honno. Yn wir, mae pob adroddiad olynol a ddaw allan o Lywodraeth y DU yn dangos nad yw'n bwriadu defnyddio'r pwerau adran 12, a fyddai'n rhewi cymhwysedd y Cynulliad hwn. Hoffwn ei gwahodd efallai i nodi unrhyw rai o'r pwerau y mae'n credu eu bod wedi'u hildio o ganlyniad i'r cytundeb rhynglywodraethol hwnnw.
Mae'n iawn, wrth gwrs, fod cysylltiadau rhyngwladol yn fater sydd wedi'i gadw'n ôl i Senedd y DU, ond fe fydd hefyd yn gwybod bod y Goruchaf Lys, yn yr achos yn ymwneud â Bil parhad yr Alban, yn gwbl glir fod gweithredu'r cytundebau hynny yn y wlad hon yn fater sydd wedi'i ddatganoli ac mae wedi'i ddatganoli i'r lle hwn. Rwy'n rhoi sicrwydd na fyddwn yn gweithredu mecanwaith sy'n galluogi'r GIG i gael ei werthu. Ond mae hi'n iawn i ddweud bod hynny'n arwydd o gyflwr meddwl a bwriadau Arlywydd America yn sicr. Roeddwn yn credu bod methiant Theresa May fel Prif Weinidog i herio hynny yn rhyfeddol, yn y gynhadledd i'r wasg y cyfeiriodd David Rees ati'n gynharach.
Mae'n fy ngwahodd i ddweud wrthi fy mod yn teimlo ei bod hi'n bosibl lliniaru canlyniadau Brexit 'dim bargen' i Gymru yn llawn. Fe fyddaf yn hollol glir gyda hi—nid wyf yn credu ei bod hi'n bosibl lliniaru'n llawn, gydag unrhyw lefel o baratoi, naill ai yn y tymor byr neu'n hirdymor, y canlyniadau trychinebus i Gymru a fyddai'n deillio o Brexit 'dim bargen'.
Thank you, Minister, and thank you for turning the scrutiny back on me there, but, as we have made clear in debates in the past in this Chamber, public procurement powers were given away as part of the inter-governmental agreement, and I'd welcome further discussion with you on that.
But, coming back to the question, now we know, and as you've just recognised, there's very little that we could do to mitigate the disastrous impact of a 'no deal' Brexit, to mitigate that on Wales, and we would be powerless, essentially, to defend ourselves. The disrespect shown to Wales by Westminster over the past few years is actually beyond belief. They've taken powers from us, they've refused to let Welsh Ministers see draft plans for replacement schemes for European funding. You told us yesterday, Minister, that they refused to listen to your concerns over plans for immigration, and also that we've had very little input—well, no input at all—into plans for the shared prosperity fund.
The probable future Prime Minister intends to wipe over £400 million from the Welsh budget by giving a tax cut to the very richest in society. And today, as we've already heard, they've refused to allow the First Minister of Wales access to a ministerial car for his visit to Brussels because he refused to agree to sell Welsh interests down the river—an absolutely outrageous break of protocol, unprecedented, as you said, and a disgraceful act of disrespect towards our country.
Minister, this can't go on. We've got to stand up for ourselves and the interests of the people we're duty bound to represent. Will you therefore agree to consider establishing a Welsh constitutional convention to carefully consider the constitutional options available for Wales, including independence? A constitutional convention is something the former First Minister Carwyn Jones called for at a UK level, but it didn't happen, despite tireless efforts over many years on his part. So, we must now do it for ourselves.
We need to know what options are available to us in Wales as the UK constitutional crisis deepens and we need leverage to protect ourselves against a hostile Westminster Government. Our NHS is in danger, our economy stands on the brink of a 'no deal' catastrophe. We must defend our citizens. Will you therefore consider adopting this course of action?
Diolch, Weinidog, a diolch i chi am droi'r craffu arnaf yn ôl arnaf fi yn y fan honno, ond fel yr eglurasom mewn dadleuon yn y gorffennol yn y Siambr hon, cafodd pwerau caffael cyhoeddus eu hildio yn rhan o'r cytundeb rhynglywodraethol, a buaswn yn croesawu trafodaeth bellach gyda chi ar hynny.
Ond i ddod yn ôl at y cwestiwn, ac fel rydych newydd gydnabod, gwyddom bellach nad oes fawr ddim y gallem ei wneud i liniaru effaith drychinebus Brexit 'dim bargen', lliniaru effaith hynny ar Gymru, a byddem yn ddi-rym yn y bôn i amddiffyn ein hunain. Mae'r diffyg parch a ddangoswyd gan San Steffan at Gymru dros yr ychydig flynyddoedd diwethaf yn anghredadwy. Maent wedi cipio pwerau oddi wrthym, maent wedi gwrthod gadael i Weinidogion Cymru weld drafftiau cynlluniau newydd yn lle arian Ewropeaidd. Fe ddywedoch chi wrthym ddoe, Weinidog, eu bod wedi gwrthod gwrando ar eich pryderon ynghylch cynlluniau ar gyfer mewnfudo, a hefyd nad ydym wedi cael fawr ddim mewnbwn—wel, dim mewnbwn o gwbl—i gynlluniau ar gyfer y gronfa ffyniant gyffredin.
Mae'r darpar Brif Weinidog tebygol yn bwriadu sychu dros £400 miliwn oddi ar gyllideb Cymru drwy roi toriad yn y dreth i'r bobl gyfoethocaf mewn cymdeithas. A heddiw, fel y clywsom eisoes, maent wedi gwrthod caniatáu i Brif Weinidog Cymru gael defnydd o gar gweinidogol ar gyfer ei ymweliad â Brwsel am ei fod wedi gwrthod cytuno i droi cefn ar fuddiannau Cymru—toriad protocol cwbl warthus na welwyd ei debyg o'r blaen, fel y dywedoch, a gweithred warthus o amarch tuag at ein gwlad.
Weinidog, ni all hyn barhau. Mae'n rhaid i ni sefyll drosom ein hunain a buddiannau'r bobl y mae gennym ddyletswydd i'w cynrychioli. A wnewch chi gytuno felly i ystyried sefydlu confensiwn cyfansoddiadol i Gymru i ystyried yn ofalus yr opsiynau cyfansoddiadol sydd ar gael i Gymru, gan gynnwys annibyniaeth? Mae confensiwn cyfansoddiadol yn rhywbeth y galwodd y cyn Brif Weinidog, Carwyn Jones, amdano ar lefel y DU, ond ni ddigwyddodd hynny, er gwaethaf ymdrechion diflino dros flynyddoedd lawer ar ei ran. Felly, rhaid inni ei wneud drosom ein hunain yn awr.
Mae angen inni wybod pa ddewisiadau sydd ar gael inni yng Nghymru wrth i argyfwng cyfansoddiadol y DU ddyfnhau ac rydym angen dull o amddiffyn ein hunain rhag Llywodraeth elyniaethus yn San Steffan. Mae ein GIG mewn perygl, mae ein heconomi ar drothwy trychineb 'dim bargen'. Rhaid inni amddiffyn ein dinasyddion. A wnewch chi ystyried mabwysiadu'r llwybr hwn felly?
We take every opportunity to stand up for the interests of the people of Wales in any engagement we have with any part of the UK, including most directly the UK Government. We will all, as Ministers, continue to do that. We take every possible opportunity to describe and to fight for the interests of the people of Wales. On the last supplementary, in relation to the question of preparations, I should say that the fact that I don't believe it is possible to fully mitigate the consequences of a 'no deal' Brexit does not mean that, as a responsible Government, we should not and do not take measured and proportionate preparations in order to anticipate the worst impact, and seek to do what we can to deal with them. We are, as I know that she's aware, taking a significant suite of steps across all portfolios in order to do that. Indeed, in the last few weeks, we've taken stock of what further steps we might be able to take with the prospect of a deferred exit date into the autumn. It remains important for us to do that, not withstanding our view that the damage ultimately can't be fully mitigated, to say the least.
She makes the point about independence. Of course, we know that our colleagues in the Scottish Government advocate for that position there. The difference there is they stood on a manifesto arguing the case for independence and won, and therefore have claimed the entitlement to bring forward that legislation. That isn't the case here in Wales.
Rydym yn manteisio ar bob cyfle i sefyll dros fuddiannau'r Cymry mewn unrhyw ymgysylltiad rhyngom ag unrhyw ran o'r DU, gan gynnwys Llywodraeth y DU yn fwyaf uniongyrchol. Fel Gweinidogion, bydd pawb ohonom yn parhau i wneud hynny. Manteisiwn ar bob cyfle posibl i ddisgrifio ac i frwydro dros fuddiannau'r Cymry. Ar y cwestiwn atodol olaf, mewn perthynas â pharatoadau, dylwn ddweud nad yw'r ffaith nad wyf yn credu ei bod yn bosibl lliniaru canlyniadau 'dim bargen' yn llawn yn golygu na ddylem ni ac nad ydym ni, fel Llywodraeth gyfrifol, yn gweithredu paratoadau pwyllog a chymesur er mwyn rhagweld yr effeithiau waethaf, a cheisio gwneud yr hyn a allwn i ymdopi â hwy. Fel y gwn ei bod yn gwybod, rydym yn rhoi cyfres o gamau sylweddol ar waith ar draws pob portffolio er mwyn gwneud hynny. Yn wir, dros yr ychydig wythnosau diwethaf, rydym wedi bod yn ystyried pa gamau pellach y gallem eu cymryd o ystyried bod y dyddiad ymadael wedi'i ohirio tan yr hydref. Mae'n bwysig o hyd ein bod yn gwneud hynny, er ein bod o'r farn na ellir lliniaru'r difrod yn llawn yn y pen draw, a dweud y lleiaf.
Mae hi'n gwneud y pwynt am annibyniaeth. Wrth gwrs, gwyddom fod ein cymheiriaid yn Llywodraeth yr Alban yn dadlau dros y safbwynt hwnnw yn y fan honno. Y gwahaniaeth yno yw eu bod wedi sefyll ar faniffesto'n dadlau'r achos dros annibyniaeth ac wedi ennill, ac felly maent wedi ennill yr hawl i gyflwyno'r ddeddfwriaeth honno. Nid yw hynny'n wir yma yng Nghymru.
3. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'u cynnal ynghylch rôl porthladdoedd Cymru ar ôl Brexit? OAQ54001
3. What discussions has the Counsel General held regarding the role of Welsh ports after Brexit? OAQ54001
Welsh ports are a critical international gateway and source of high-quality jobs. This could easily be preserved if we remain in the single market and the customs union. Facing the risk of a catastrophic 'no deal', we are working closely with local partners to mitigate the damage to our ports.
Mae porthladdoedd Cymru yn borth rhyngwladol hollbwysig ac yn ffynhonnell swyddi o ansawdd uchel. Gellid gwarchod hyn yn hawdd os arhoswn yn y farchnad sengl a'r undeb tollau. Gan wynebu'r risg drychinebus o 'ddim bargen', rydym yn gweithio'n agos gyda phartneriaid lleol i liniaru'r niwed i'n porthladdoedd.
Thank you very much for that. As you know, there are a fair few ports in my region, and one of the opportunities for Wales if we leave the EU could be the development of free ports, as they would allow for goods to be imported to parts of Wales, stored or manufactured into finished products, and then exported, all without taxes and tariffs. Of course, we have free ports in the UK already. Last year, the economy Minister said he'd asked Haven Waterway enterprise zone to look at creating a free port. However, in February this year you told Adam Price that it's difficult to see how free ports or free zones could exist within a customs union. Now, your Government's now confirmed that it will campaign to stay within the EU. So, does that mean that the development of free ports in Wales is off the table?
Diolch yn fawr iawn am hynny. Fel y gwyddoch, mae cryn dipyn o borthladdoedd yn fy rhanbarth i, ac un o'r cyfleoedd i Gymru os gadawn yr UE fyddai datblygu porthladdoedd rhydd, gan y byddent yn caniatáu i nwyddau gael eu mewnforio i rannau o Gymru, eu storio neu eu cynhyrchu'n gynnyrch gorffenedig cyn eu hallforio heb drethi a thariffau. Wrth gwrs, mae gennym borthladdoedd rhydd yn y DU yn barod. Y llynedd, dywedodd Gweinidog yr economi ei fod wedi gofyn i ardal fenter Dyfrffordd y Ddau Gleddau ystyried creu porthladd rhydd. Fodd bynnag, ym mis Chwefror eleni, fe ddywedoch chi wrth Adam Price ei bod hi'n anodd gweld sut y gallai porthladdoedd rhydd neu ardaloedd rhydd fodoli mewn undeb tollau. Nawr, cadarnhaodd eich Llywodraeth y bydd yn ymgyrchu i aros o fewn yr UE. Felly, a yw hynny'n golygu na ellir ystyried datblygu porthladdoedd rhydd yng Nghymru?
We recognise the potential benefits of free ports generally, but there are practical challenges, which is what I was referring to in my earlier response, I think, which is around loss of tax revenue, displacement, sustainability, and so on. Decisions on free ports and customs arrangements more generally, obviously, are in the hands of the UK Government. From our point of view, the economic interest of our ports and of our economy at large is best protected by remaining part of a customs union, and if that comes at the cost of being able to develop particular free port discussions, then I think that is a price worth paying in the overall picture in terms of the overall impact on our economy.
Rydym yn cydnabod manteision posibl porthladdoedd rhydd yn gyffredinol, ond ceir heriau ymarferol, sef yr hyn y cyfeiriais ato yn fy ymateb cynharach, rwy'n credu, sy'n ymwneud â cholli refeniw treth, dadleoli, cynaliadwyedd, ac yn y blaen. Yn amlwg, mae penderfyniadau ynghylch porthladdoedd rhydd a threfniadau tollau yn fwy cyffredinol yn nwylo Llywodraeth y DU. O'n safbwynt ni, y ffordd orau i ddiogelu buddiannau economaidd ein porthladdoedd a'n heconomi yn gyffredinol yw drwy aros yn rhan o undeb tollau, ac os digwydd hynny ar draul gallu datblygu trafodaethau penodol am borthladdoedd rhydd, credaf fod hwnnw'n bris gwerth ei dalu yn y darlun cyffredinol o'r effaith lawn ar ein heconomi.
Yn syml iawn, mae porthladd Caergybi yn fy etholaeth i yn un o'r prif borthladdoedd rhwng Prydain a'r Undeb Ewropeaidd. Ydy'r Gweinidog yn cytuno â fi y byddai Brexit o unrhyw fath yn siŵr o osod heriau difrifol i'r porthladd ond y byddai gadael heb gytundeb yn sicr o arwain at golli masnach drwy'r porthladd hwnnw?
Quite simply, the port of Holyhead in my constituency is one of the major ports between the UK and the EU. Would the Minister agree with me that a Brexit of any kind is bound to pose significant challenges to the port but that leaving without a deal would certainly lead to the loss of trade through that port?
Diolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn. Fues i lan yng Nghaergybi yn ddiweddar yn trafod y cwestiwn hyn gyda'r bobl yn y porthladd. Maen nhw'n gwneud cynlluniau, wrth gwrs, ar gyfer pob mathau o Brexit yn y porthladd yng Nghaergybi. Rydym ni, fel Llywodraeth, wedi bod yn paratoi, fel bydd yr Aelod yn gwybod, cynlluniau wrth gefn ar gyfer yr impact ar drafnidiaeth o adael mewn unrhyw ffordd, a gadael heb gytundeb yn benodol. Allwn ni ddim dibynnu ar gynlluniau isadeiledd yn Dublin a Rosslare o ran amseru hynny i sicrhau bod trafnidiaeth yn gallu symud yn rhwydd ar ôl i ni adael, os gwnawn ni adael. Felly, mae wedi bod yn bwysig i ni wneud cynlluniau wrth gefn ar gyfer hynny, ond wrth wraidd cwestiwn yr Aelod mae'r syniad a fyddai unrhyw Brexit yn well nag aros fel aelod o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd, a'r ateb i'r cwestiwn hwnnw, wrth gwrs, yw 'na'.
I thank the Member for the question. I was in Holyhead recently, discussing this question with the people in the port there. They have plans, of course, for all sorts of Brexit scenarios. As a Government, we have been preparing, as the Member will know, back-up plans, contingency plans, regarding the impact on transport of any form of exit, and specifically of leaving without a deal. We cannot rely on infrastructure schemes in Dublin and Rosslare in terms of timing that to ensure that transport will be able to move easily post Brexit, if we leave the EU. So, it's important that we have contingency plans for that, but the core of the Member's question is whether any kind of Brexit is better, and the answer, of course, is 'no'.
Counsel General, news yesterday highlighted that the EU Commission is in fact working on a plan to use IT solutions to help goods cross the Irish border after Brexit. Similar plans have been put into place by the French Government in Calais. Indeed, as far as back as 2016, the EU Parliament itself compiled a report that showed how a smart border can be used between the EU and the UK. What assessments has the Welsh Government done on IT solutions, and could you publish any such preparation, if we have any?
Gwnsler Cyffredinol, yn ôl y newyddion ddoe, mae Comisiwn yr UE yn gweithio ar gynllun i ddefnyddio datrysiadau TG i helpu nwyddau i groesi'r ffin Wyddelig ar ôl Brexit. Rhoddodd Llywodraeth Ffrainc gynlluniau tebyg ar waith yn Calais. Yn wir, cyn belled yn ôl â 2016, lluniodd Senedd yr UE ei hun adroddiad a ddangosai sut y gellir defnyddio ffin glyfar rhwng yr UE a'r DU. Pa asesiadau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'u gwneud o atebion TG, ac a allech gyhoeddi unrhyw baratoadau o'r fath, os oes rhai gennym?
Our view is that the sort of IT solutions that the Member is describing in her question are essentially long-term solutions to this. Of course, we know that there are IT activities under way to seek to ameliorate some of the consequences of a Brexit of any sort. Those are matters that are obviously, as she will be aware, driven principally by HMRC, which is reserved to the UK Government. But the prospect that that is a solution to the level of disruption that could easily be caused by a Brexit of any sort, and in particular a 'no deal 'Brexit, I think is something of a fantasy.
Ein barn ni yw bod y math o atebion TG y mae'r Aelod yn eu disgrifio yn ei chwestiwn yn atebion hirdymor i hyn yn y bôn. Wrth gwrs, gwyddom fod yna weithgareddau TG ar y gweill i geisio lleddfu rhai o ganlyniadau Brexit o unrhyw fath. Fel y bydd yn gwybod, mae'r rheini'n faterion sy'n amlwg wedi'u hysgogi'n bennaf gan Cyllid a Thollau ei Mawrhydi, sy'n fater a gadwyd yn ôl i Lywodraeth y DU. Ond rwy'n credu bod y posibilrwydd fod hwnnw'n ateb i'r lefel o aflonyddwch a allai'n hawdd gael ei achosi gan Brexit o unrhyw fath, ac yn arbennig Brexit 'dim bargen', yn ffantasi braidd.
4. A wnaiff y Cwnsler Cyffredinol ddatganiad am gefnogaeth cronfeydd strwythurol yr UE i brentisiaethau a hyfforddiant sgiliau yng Nghymru? OAQ54014
4. Will the Counsel General make a statement on EU structural funds support for apprenticeships and skills training in Wales? OAQ54014
The current EU structural funds programmes are investing £206 million to support a total of 159,000 apprenticeships across Wales between 2015 and 2023. This is part of the overall investment of £861 million that the EU programmes are making in skills and in employability in Wales.
Mae rhaglenni cronfeydd strwythurol cyfredol yr UE yn buddsoddi £206 miliwn i gefnogi cyfanswm o 159,000 o brentisiaethau ledled Cymru rhwng 2015 a 2023. Mae hwn yn rhan o'r buddsoddiad cyffredinol o £861 miliwn y mae rhaglenni'r UE yn ei wneud mewn sgiliau a chyflogadwyedd yng Nghymru.
During yesterday's debate on the shared prosperity fund, Nick Ramsay said that there are unanswered questions about the future of the shared prosperity fund, which led me once again to question why on earth he's a Tory. He surely too nice and intelligent for that kind of activity. [Laughter.] I think the future—[Interruption.] Well, let me get to the question. The future of the structural funds has a huge impact for skills and development and training in my constituency. In Caerphilly town, ACT Training have benefited from European social fund support, which delivers Government apprenticeship, traineeship and Jobs Growth Wales programmes. In Ystrad Mynach, Educ8 benefited from the same and, of course, Coleg y Cymoedd have built into their work ESF-funded programmes too. So, would you agree with me—and perhaps with Nick Ramsay—that the shared prosperity fund needs to be clearly directed towards these programmes and that the UK Government needs to make a commitment on that fund and that that direction needs to be put towards particularly those kinds of educational programmes too?
Yn ystod y ddadl ddoe ar y gronfa ffyniant gyffredinol, dywedodd Nick Ramsay fod yna gwestiynau heb eu hateb am ddyfodol y gronfa ffyniant gyffredinol a'm harweiniodd unwaith eto i holi pam ar y ddaear y mae'n Dori. Mae'n sicr yn rhy neis a deallus i'r math hwnnw o weithgaredd. [Chwerthin.] Rwy'n credu bod dyfodol—[Torri ar draws.] Wel, gadewch i mi ofyn y cwestiwn. Mae dyfodol y cronfeydd strwythurol yn effeithio'n enfawr ar sgiliau a datblygiad a hyfforddiant yn fy etholaeth. Yn nhref Caerffili, mae ACT Training wedi elwa ar gymorth cronfa gymdeithasol Ewrop, sy'n cyflwyno prentisiaethau'r Llywodraeth, hyfforddeiaeth a rhaglenni Twf Swyddi Cymru. Yn Ystrad Mynach, elwodd Educ8 o'r un peth ac wrth gwrs, mae Coleg y Cymoedd wedi cynnwys rhaglenni a ariennir gan gronfa gymdeithasol Ewrop yn eu gwaith hefyd. Felly, a fyddech yn cytuno â mi—ac efallai â Nick Ramsay—fod angen cyfeirio'r gronfa ffyniant gyffredinol yn glir tuag at y rhaglenni hyn a bod angen i Lywodraeth y DU wneud ymrwymiad mewn perthynas â'r gronfa honno a bod angen ei chyfeirio hefyd tuag at y mathau hynny o raglenni addysgol yn arbennig?
Well, I thank the Member for his supplementary question, which I think illustrates, doesn't it, in a very real way, in his constituency, the beneficial impact that EU programmes have had in the lives of individual constituents and that, sometimes, the debates we have around EU programmes are at a level of generality, and he's brought that down to the connection with individual communities and constituencies. I absolutely would echo the sentiment in his question that it is absolutely vital for the UK Government now to provide those concrete assurances, which will enable us to continue to make use of those funds here in Wales, to make use of them differently perhaps—align them better with our priorities here—and to deliver on the ground the sorts of advantages those funds have delivered over many, many years. It's incumbent now on the UK Government to put us in Wales in that position. Those decisions should be taken by the Welsh Government, as they have been, and the funds should be made available to the fullest extent that they are currently available. We are, as the Assembly in passing its motion yesterday made clear, very concerned that the UK Government is dealing with an issue of such vital importance to Wales in a way that is apparently so disrespectful of the devolution boundary. I know that he will join me in calling on the UK Government to reflect on that and under, perhaps, a new Prime Minister to change course, to make real the commitments that we will have not a penny less and not a power taken away.
Wel, hoffwn ddiolch i'r Aelod am ei gwestiwn atodol y credaf ei fod yn dangos, onid yw, mewn ffordd real iawn, yn ei etholaeth ef, yr effaith lesol y mae rhaglenni'r UE wedi'i chael ym mywydau etholwyr unigol ac weithiau, fod y dadleuon a gawn am raglenni'r UE yn gyffredinol eu natur, ac mae ef wedi dod â hynny i lawr i'r cysylltiad â chymunedau ac etholaethau unigol. Buaswn yn bendant yn adleisio'r teimlad yn ei gwestiwn ei bod yn gwbl hanfodol i Lywodraeth y DU roi'r sicrwydd pendant hwnnw yn awr a fydd yn ein galluogi i barhau i ddefnyddio'r cronfeydd hynny yma yng Nghymru, i'w defnyddio'n wahanol efallai—eu halinio'n well â'n blaenoriaethau ni yma—ac i sicrhau ar lawr gwlad y mathau o fanteision y mae'r cronfeydd hynny wedi'u darparu dros lawer iawn o flynyddoedd. Mae'n ddyletswydd ar Lywodraeth y DU yn awr i'n rhoi ni yng Nghymru yn y sefyllfa honno. Dylai'r penderfyniadau hynny gael eu gwneud gan Lywodraeth Cymru, fel y maent wedi arfer cael eu gwneud, a dylai'r cronfeydd fod ar gael yn llawn fel y maent ar gael ar hyn o bryd. Fel y gwnaeth y Cynulliad yn glir wrth basio ei gynnig ddoe, rydym yn bryderus iawn fod Llywodraeth y DU yn ymdrin â mater mor hanfodol bwysig i Gymru mewn modd sydd, yn ôl pob golwg, mor amharchus o'r ffin datganoli. Gwn y bydd yn ymuno â mi i alw ar Lywodraeth y DU i ystyried hynny ac i newid trywydd, efallai, o dan Brif Weinidog newydd, er mwyn gwireddu'r ymrwymiadau na fyddwn yn cael yr un geiniog yn llai ac na fydd pŵer yn cael ei gipio oddi wrthym.
The Minister will know that the youth opportunity index consistently shows that young people growing up in deprived areas have the least access to opportunities. The index ranks each local authority in Wales by levels of educational attainment and employment outcomes for young people, including a range of measures from GCSE performance to participation in higher education and apprenticeships. We also know that one of the best economic levers that Government has is to improve the level of skills training and availability of things like apprenticeships. This has been the consistent policy of the UK and the Welsh Government, in fairness. In any new structure, whatever we call it, the UK prosperity fund or whatever, it's going to be important that parts of the United Kingdom that need particular assistance receive that above and beyond their current block grant. Now, that would properly emulate what currently happens in the EU, where certain areas get vast levels of assistance, and that's basically transferred from the wealthier parts of the European Union. That's what we want, and we can only have that if it's constructed on a UK basis, and, of course, it's got to be informed by the priorities at the level of subsidiarity where this operates, and it would be for the Welsh Government held accountable to this place that would be the key level in Wales. But it is a partnership, and we need to start to reach out and offer solutions to our colleagues in Westminster as well about how we want to see this constructed. It shouldn't be a zero-sum game, where one side wins out over the other.
Bydd y Gweinidog yn gwybod bod y mynegai cyfle ieuenctid yn dangos yn gyson mai pobl ifanc sy'n cael eu magu mewn ardaloedd difreintiedig sy'n cael y lleiaf o gyfleoedd. Mae'r mynegai'n graddio pob awdurdod lleol yng Nghymru yn ôl lefelau cyrhaeddiad addysgol a chanlyniadau cyflogaeth ar gyfer pobl ifanc, gan gynnwys amrywiaeth o fesurau o berfformiad TGAU i gymryd rhan mewn addysg uwch a phrentisiaethau. Gwyddom hefyd mai un o'r ysgogiadau economaidd gorau sydd gan y Llywodraeth yw gwella lefel hyfforddiant sgiliau ac argaeledd pethau fel prentisiaethau. Mae hyn wedi bod yn bolisi cyson gan y DU a Llywodraeth Cymru, a bod yn deg. Mewn unrhyw strwythur newydd, beth bynnag y byddwn yn ei alw, cronfa ffyniant y DU neu beth bynnag, mae'n mynd i fod yn bwysig fod rhannau o'r Deyrnas Unedig sydd angen cymorth penodol yn cael hwnnw uwchlaw a thu hwnt i'w grant bloc presennol. Nawr, byddai hynny'n efelychu'n briodol yr hyn sy'n digwydd yn yr UE ar hyn o bryd, lle mae rhai ardaloedd yn cael lefelau enfawr o gymorth, ac mae hwnnw yn y bôn yn cael ei drosglwyddo o rannau cyfoethocach o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd. Dyna rydym ei eisiau, ac ni allwn ei gael oni bai ei fod wedi'i lunio ar sail y DU, ac wrth gwrs, mae'n rhaid iddo gael ei lywio gan y blaenoriaethau ar lefel sybsidiaredd lle mae'n weithredol, a mater i Lywodraeth Cymru yn atebol i'r lle hwn fyddai'r lefel allweddol yng Nghymru. Ond mae'n bartneriaeth, ac mae angen inni ddechrau estyn allan a chynnig atebion i'n cymheiriaid yn San Steffan yn ogystal ynglŷn â'r ffordd rydym am weld hyn yn cael ei lunio. Ni ddylai fod yn gêm swm sero, lle mae un ochr yn ennill dros y llall.
The Member started referring to the benefits that young people have received as a consequence of some of this support, and he's absolutely right to do that. A number of the EU-funded programmes have specifically been targeted on getting young people into employment, improving their skills, and so it's hardly a surprise, is it, that younger people can see more clearly, perhaps, some of the benefits of continued participation in EU programmes than, perhaps, other parts of society?
He talks about providing solutions to the question of how the shared prosperity fund can be designed. I wish there had been an opportunity to do that. The truth of the matter is, when I spoke with the Secretary of State for Wales, I specifically offered the support of the Welsh Government in designing a consultation that would work for Wales and would reflect the principles that we feel are echoed in all parts of Welsh society, economy and public services, and that has not been taken up. It is absolutely essential that we here, as the Welsh Government, are able to design a system that best supports the young people that he refers to in his question across Wales, particularly in disadvantaged communities. And until we get the realisation of those commitments by the UK Government, we're not going to be in a position to do that.
Dechreuodd yr Aelod gyfeirio at y manteision y mae pobl ifanc wedi'u cael o ganlyniad i rywfaint o'r cymorth hwn, ac mae'n llygad ei le i wneud hynny. Mae nifer o'r rhaglenni a ariennir gan yr UE wedi cael eu targedu'n benodol ar gyfer helpu pobl ifanc i gael gwaith, a gwella eu sgiliau, ac felly nid yw'n syndod fod pobl iau yn gallu gweld rhai o'r manteision a ddaw yn sgil parhau i gyfranogi yn rhaglenni'r UE yn gliriach na rhannau eraill o'r gymdeithas o bosibl.
Mae'n sôn am ddarparu atebion i'r cwestiwn ynglŷn â sut y gellir llunio'r gronfa ffyniant gyffredin. Hoffwn pe bai cyfle wedi bod i wneud hynny. Y gwir amdani yw, pan siaradais ag Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru, cynigiais gefnogaeth Llywodraeth Cymru yn benodol i'r gwaith o lunio ymgynghoriad a fyddai'n gweithio i Gymru ac a fyddai'n adlewyrchu'r egwyddorion y teimlwn eu bod yn cael eu hadleisio ym mhob rhan o gymdeithas, economi a gwasanaethau cyhoeddus Cymru, ac ni fanteisiwyd ar hynny. Mae'n gwbl hanfodol ein bod ni yma, fel Llywodraeth Cymru, yn gallu cynllunio system sy'n rhoi'r gefnogaeth orau i'r bobl ifanc y mae'n cyfeirio atynt yn ei gwestiwn ar draws Cymru, yn enwedig mewn cymunedau difreintiedig. A hyd nes y gwelwn yr ymrwymiadau hynny'n cael eu gwireddu gan Lywodraeth y DU, ni fyddwn mewn sefyllfa i wneud hynny.
5. Pa drafodaethau y mae'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol wedi'u cael ar y cwestiwn i'w ofyn pe bai ail refferendwm yn cael ei chynnal ar aelodaeth Prydain o'r Undeb Ewropeaidd? OAQ54003
5. What discussions has the Counsel General held on the question to be asked in the event of a second referendum on Britain's membership of the European Union? OAQ54003
I have pressed the UK Government Ministers to prepare for a second referendum in meetings with both the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and the Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union. I have not so far discussed with them or other stakeholders what the question or questions might be.
Rwyf wedi pwyso ar Weinidogion Llywodraeth y DU i baratoi ar gyfer ail refferendwm mewn cyfarfodydd gyda Changhellor Dugiaeth Caerhirfryn a'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Adael yr Undeb Ewropeaidd. Nid wyf wedi trafod gyda hwy na rhanddeiliaid eraill hyd yma beth fyddai'r cwestiwn neu'r cwestiynau.
Can I thank the Counsel General for that reply? In the course of the last three years, he's moved from a position of saying that he respected the result of the referendum now to giving a full-throated clarion call to reversing it. Can I suggest to him, therefore, the sort of question he would like to see on the ballot paper is, 'Do you want to remain in the EU or do you want to stay in the EU?', and that this would be fully consistent with the views of Mr Juncker, expressed in 2015, that there can be no democratic choice against the European treaties, and what he said at the time of the French referendum on the Lisbon treaty that, 'If it's a "yes", on we go, if it's a "no", we continue'—the EU is fundamentally an anti-democratic body that has no interest in the views of the people, and it's a disgrace that the Labour Party, which likes to thinks of itself as the party of the people, is going along with the Euro elite when the majority of its own members voted against it?
A gaf fi ddiolch i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol am yr ateb hwnnw? Yn ystod y tair blynedd diwethaf, mae wedi symud o safbwynt o ddweud ei fod yn parchu canlyniad y refferendwm i wneud galwad uchel ac eglur yn awr am ei wrthdroi. A gaf fi awgrymu iddo, felly, mai'r math o gwestiwn yr hoffai ei weld ar y papur pleidleisio yw, 'A ydych am barhau yn yr UE neu a ydych am aros yn yr UE?', ac y byddai hyn yn gwbl gyson â barn Mr Juncker, a fynegwyd yn 2015, nad oes modd cael dewis democrataidd yn erbyn y cytuniadau Ewropeaidd, a'r hyn a ddywedodd ar adeg y refferendwm yn Ffrainc ar gytuniad Lisbon sef, 'Os yw'n "ie", awn ymlaen, os yw'n "na", fe fyddwn yn parhau'—mae'r UE yn ei hanfod yn gorff gwrth-ddemocrataidd nad oes ganddo unrhyw ddiddordeb yn safbwyntiau'r bobl, ac mae'n warth fod y Blaid Lafur, sy'n hoffi meddwl amdani ei hun fel plaid y bobl, yn cyd-fynd â'r elît Ewropeaidd pan fo'r mwyafrif o'i haelodau ei hun wedi pleidleisio yn ei erbyn?
Well, I do regret that the Member chooses to take such a facile approach to such an important question. It's absolutely the case that there's no mandate for the sort of 'no deal' Brexit that he advocates, and that is now what we are careering headlong towards. In that situation, as I said to Darren Millar earlier, it is fundamentally irresponsible not to put the question back to the people. He will well know that the position that I have advocated here on behalf of the Government was an attempt to see if we could find a form of Brexit reflecting the principles agreed with Plaid Cymru in 'Securing Wales' Future'. Because of the intransigence of the Conservative Party in Parliament, that has been impossible, and it's clear the country's divided on the question of how we resolve this matter, and in those circumstances, a referendum is the means of resolving that question.
Wel, mae'n ofid i mi fod yr Aelod yn dewis mabwysiadu agwedd mor arwynebol at gwestiwn mor bwysig. Mae'n gwbl wir nad oes mandad ar gyfer y math o Brexit 'dim bargen' y mae ef yn ei gefnogi, a dyna rydym yn carlamu tuag ato yn awr. Yn y sefyllfa honno, fel y dywedais wrth Darren Millar yn gynharach, mae'n gwbl anghyfrifol inni beidio â rhoi'r cwestiwn yn ôl i'r bobl. Bydd yn gwybod yn iawn fod y safbwynt rwyf wedi'i argymell yma ar ran y Llywodraeth yn ymgais i weld a allem ddod o hyd i ffurf o Brexit a adlewyrchai'r egwyddorion y cytunwyd arnynt gyda Phlaid Cymru yn 'Diogelu Dyfodol Cymru'. Oherwydd anhyblygrwydd y Blaid Geidwadol yn y Senedd, mae hynny wedi bod yn amhosibl, ac mae'n amlwg fod y wlad wedi'i rhannu ynglŷn â sut y datryswn y mater hwn, ac yn yr amgylchiadau hynny, refferendwm yw'r ffordd o ddatrys y cwestiwn hwnnw.
6. A wnaiff y Cwnsler Cyffredinol amlinellu'r mesurau paratoadol ychwanegol o ran dim bargen, y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cymryd mewn perthynas ag iechyd a gwasanaethau cymdeithasol cyn 31 Hydref 2019? OAQ53998
6. Will the Counsel General outline what additional 'no deal' preparatory measures the Welsh Government is undertaking in relation to health and social services prior to 31 October 2019? OAQ53998
Yes. Significant work has been undertaken across health and social care to prepare for a 'no deal' Brexit. A review of the sector’s preparedness has recently been undertaken, which provided considerable assurance about preparations. Work will continue to ensure preparatory measures are as robust as possible.
Gwnaf. Mae gwaith sylweddol wedi'i wneud ar draws iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol i baratoi ar gyfer Brexit 'dim bargen'. Cynhaliwyd adolygiad o barodrwydd y sector yn ddiweddar, a darparodd gryn sicrwydd ynglŷn â pharatoadau. Bydd gwaith yn parhau i sicrhau bod mesurau paratoadol mor gadarn â phosibl.
Thank you. According to the 'Managing Brexit/EU withdrawal in health and social care in Wales' document produced by the NHS Confederation for all health and social care professionals in Wales, health boards and trusts have been working to ensure robust plans are in place to manage any public health scenario. It is noted, however, that existing systems have been tested and have led to the finding that they are robust enough to withstand 'no deal'-related disturbances. This is positive news, of course. However, I would be grateful if you could provide an update on your workings with the pharmaceutical sector and UK Government so to help ensure that there is not a medicine shortage should we leave without a deal in October.
Diolch. Yn ôl y ddogfen 'Managing Brexit/EU withdrawal in health and social care in Wales' a gynhyrchwyd gan Gydffederasiwn y GIG ar gyfer pob gweithiwr iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol proffesiynol yng Nghymru, mae'r byrddau iechyd a'r ymddiriedolaethau wedi bod yn gweithio i sicrhau bod cynlluniau cadarn ar waith i reoli unrhyw senario iechyd cyhoeddus. Fodd bynnag, nodir bod y systemau presennol wedi cael eu profi a'u bod wedi arwain at y canfyddiad eu bod yn ddigon cadarn i wrthsefyll aflonyddwch sy'n gysylltiedig â 'dim bargen'. Mae hwn yn newyddion cadarnhaol, wrth gwrs. Fodd bynnag, buaswn yn ddiolchgar pe gallech roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf am eich gwaith gyda'r sector fferyllol a Llywodraeth y DU er mwyn helpu i sicrhau nad oes prinder meddyginiaethau os ydym yn gadael heb gytundeb ym mis Hydref.
I thank the Member for that question. I recently met with Public Health Wales to discuss, in particular, the impact of Brexit. The review that we have been undertaking proposed a small number of actions that we're taking forward, including clinical input into decision making around some of the steps that would flow from a Brexit scenario, improving the robustness of some of the procurement that we have in relation to stock that is usually purchased by health boards, other than that which is held centrally by NHS Wales's shared services, and also maintaining, or improving, the awareness of various stakeholders in the health sector of the processes that we've already put in place to manage circumstances where certain supplies might come under pressure.
She will know that we have purchased warehouse capacity in south Wales to maintain stocks of medical supplies, which continues, and we work with the UK Government to maintain the arrangements currently in place in relation to the buffer for medical supplies. Our advice to people in Wales and to health boards and to practitioners is that they should not be stockpiling and they should not be seeking or issuing longer prescriptions than otherwise would be the case.
Diolch i'r Aelod am y cwestiwn hwnnw. Yn ddiweddar, cyfarfûm ag Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru i drafod effaith Brexit yn benodol. Mae'r adolygiad a gynhaliwyd gennym yn argymell nifer fach o gamau gweithredu rydym yn bwrw ymlaen â hwy, gan gynnwys mewnbwn clinigol i benderfyniadau ynghylch rhai o'r camau a fyddai'n deillio o senario Brexit, gan wella cadernid peth o'r gwaith caffael sydd gennym mewn perthynas â stoc a brynir fel arfer gan fyrddau iechyd, heblaw'r hyn a ddelir yn ganolog gan gydwasanaethau GIG Cymru, gan gynnal, neu wella, ymwybyddiaeth rhanddeiliaid amrywiol yn y sector iechyd o'r prosesau rydym eisoes wedi'u sefydlu i reoli amgylchiadau lle gallai cyflenwadau penodol ddod o dan bwysau.
Fe fydd yn gwybod ein bod wedi prynu capasiti warws yn ne Cymru i gynnal stociau o gyflenwadau meddygol, ac mae hynny'n parhau, ac rydym yn gweithio gyda Llywodraeth y DU i gadw'r trefniadau sydd ar waith ar hyn o bryd mewn perthynas â'r byffer ar gyfer cyflenwadau meddygol. Ein cyngor i bobl yng Nghymru ac i fyrddau iechyd ac i ymarferwyr yw na ddylent fod yn pentyrru ac na ddylent fod yn gofyn am, nac yn rhoi presgripsiynau hwy nag y byddai eu hangen fel arall.
Ac yn olaf, cwestiwn 7—Siân Gwenllian.
Finally, question 7—Siân Gwenllian.
7. A wnaiff y Cwnsler Cyffredinol roi diweddariad ar bolisi Llywodraeth Cymru ynglŷn â phleidlais y bobl? OAQ54020
7. Will the Counsel General provide an update on the Welsh Government's policy regarding a people's vote? OAQ54020
Diolch am y cwestiwn. Yn fwyaf diweddar, fe roddais i ddiweddariad yn fy ymateb i ddadl Plaid Cymru yr wythnos diwethaf. Trwy gefnogi’r cynnig ar refferendwm cadarnhau ymadael â’r Undeb Ewropeaidd, fe wnaethon ni fynegi ein safbwynt polisi yn eglur.
Thank you for that question. Most recently, I provided an update in my response to the Plaid Cymru debate last week. By supporting the motion on a confirmatory European Union referendum, we made our policy position clear.
Rydyn ni'r ochr yma, wrth gwrs, yn croesawu’r safiad newydd yma gan eich Llywodraeth chi, ond yn ogystal â geiriau, beth rydyn ni ei angen rŵan ydy gweithredu. A wnaiff eich Llywodraeth chi, felly, gydweithio efo fy mhlaid i er mwyn rhoi pwysau ar Lywodraeth Cymru i gynnal pleidlais y bobl ac i weithio efo ni i gynllunio ynglŷn â sut i wneud hynny? Pan wnes i ofyn hyn ichi cyn etholiad Ewrop, mi ges i ymateb ychydig yn llugoer, os dwi’n cofio’n iawn. Gobeithio y gallwch chi fod yn fwy cadarnhaol heddiw.
On this side, of course, we welcome this new position from your Government, but as well as words, what we need now is action. Will your Government, therefore, work with my party in order to put pressure on the Welsh Government to hold a people's vote and to work with us to plan on how to do so? When I did ask this before the European elections, I had quite a lukewarm response, if I'm right. I hope you can be more positive today.
Rwy'n cofio, yn fy ymateb y tro’r diwethaf, wnes i ddweud fy mod i'n hapus iawn i gydweithio ar y mater hwn, ac mae hynny’n dal yn wir, a buaswn i’n hapus cael trafodaethau ynglŷn â sut allwn ni orau wneud hynny. O’n safbwynt ni fel plaid, rwy'n teithio i Lundain yn hwyrach yr wythnos yma i drafod y cwestiwn hwn gyda’r Blaid Lafur yn San Steffan, i ddwyn perswâd arnyn nhw ynglŷn â sut allwn ni gymryd camau penodol i ddwyn y cwestiwn yma o refferendwm o flaen y Senedd yn San Steffan.
I recall that in my response last time I said that I was very happy to collaborate on this issue, and that's still the case. I would be happy to have discussions as to how best we can do that. From our perspective as a party, I'll be travelling to London later this week to discuss this question with the Labour Party in Westminster, to bring pressure to bear on them as to how they can take specific steps to bring this question of a referendum before Parliament in Westminster.
Diolch i'r Cwnsler Cyffredinol. Pwynt o drefn—David Rees.
Thank you, Counsel General. Point of order—David Rees.
Diolch, Llywydd. I ask this point of order because whilst the Brexit Minister was answering a question to her party leader, the Brexit Party Member for north Wales shouted from a sedentary position, quite clearly, because I'm on the opposite side of the Chamber, and I could hear it, 'You liar'. Now, that is unacceptable behaviour or language for any Member in this Chamber. Whilst there may be differences of opinions, calling someone a liar is something completely different and unacceptable in this behaviour. I therefore ask you to consider this position and ask for a withdrawal of that statement and an apology to the Member.
Diolch, Lywydd. Rwy'n gofyn y pwynt o drefn hwn oherwydd, pan oedd y Gweinidog Brexit yn ateb cwestiwn i arweinydd ei phlaid, gweiddodd yr Aelod o Blaid Brexit dros ogledd Cymru o'i sedd, yn gwbl glir, oherwydd rwyf ar yr ochr arall i'r Siambr, a gallwn glywed, 'Celwyddgi'. Nawr, mae hwnnw'n ymddygiad neu'n iaith annerbyniol gan unrhyw Aelod yn y Siambr hon. Er y gall fod gwahaniaeth barn, mae galw rhywun yn gelwyddgi yn ymddygiad hollol wahanol ac annerbyniol. Felly, gofynnaf ichi ystyried y safbwynt hwn a gofyn i'r datganiad hwnnw gael ei dynnu'n ôl ac ymddiheuriad i'r Aelod.
Thank you for the point of order and for giving me advance notice of it, and allowing me to reflect on the accusation that was made by a Brexit Party Member today, but also, last week, a similar accusation using the same term by a Plaid Cymru Member against a Brexit Party Member. In general, too many of you are too keen to be disrespectful to other Members in this place, and I don't want to be spending all my time policing the use of language by Members in this place. I want to listen to the quality of your debate. But, obviously, an accusation of 'liar' is not acceptable by one Member to another Member and will need to stop. Given last week's incident and this week's incident, I'm now going to consider this a 1-1 draw. And I am going to say that it's the end of the game, and accusations of 'liar' and disrespectful language is not going to be tolerated further. I want you all to reflect on that in all your contributions, both from a sedentary position and when you're on your feet. And I thank David Rees for giving me the opportunity to make that clear from today.
Diolch ichi am y pwynt o drefn ac am roi rhybudd ymlaen llaw i mi yn ei gylch, a chaniatáu i mi fyfyrio ar y cyhuddiad a wnaethpwyd gan Aelod o Blaid Brexit heddiw, ond hefyd, cyhuddiad tebyg yr wythnos diwethaf yn defnyddio'r un term gan Aelod o Blaid Cymru yn erbyn Aelod o Blaid Brexit. Yn gyffredinol, mae gormod ohonoch yn rhy awyddus i fod yn amharchus wrth Aelodau eraill yn y lle hwn, ac nid wyf eisiau treulio fy holl amser yn plismona'r defnydd o iaith gan Aelodau yn y lle hwn. Rwyf am wrando ar ansawdd eich dadl. Ond yn amlwg, nid yw i un Aelod gyhuddo'r llall o fod yn 'gelwyddgi' yn dderbyniol a bydd angen i hynny ddod i ben. O ystyried y digwyddiad yr wythnos diwethaf a'r digwyddiad yr wythnos hon, rwy'n ystyried hon yn gêm gyfartal 1-1. Ac rwy'n mynd i ddweud mai dyna ddiwedd y gêm, ac ni fydd cyhuddiadau o fod yn 'gelwyddgi' ac iaith amharchus yn cael eu goddef rhagor. Rwyf am i bob un ohonoch ystyried hynny ym mhob un o'ch cyfraniadau, ar eich eistedd a phan fyddwch ar eich traed. A diolch i David Rees am roi'r cyfle imi wneud hynny'n glir heddiw.
We will now move on to the topical questions—[Interruption.] I need no support from one of the Members at the back, and he knows who he is. The topical questions—and the first topical question is by Mick Antoniw.
Symudwn ymlaen yn awr at y cwestiynau amserol—[Torri ar draws.] Nid oes arnaf angen unrhyw gefnogaeth gan un o'r Aelodau yn y cefn, ac mae'n gwybod pwy ydyw. Y cwestiynau amserol—a daw'r cwestiwn amserol cyntaf gan Mick Antoniw.
3. A wnaiff y Dirprwy Weinidog ddatganiad mewn ymateb i'r cyhoeddiad bod nifer o ddinasyddion yng Nghymru yn debygol o golli eu hawl i gael trwydded deledu am ddim? 321
3. Will the Deputy Minister make a statement in response to the announcement that a number of citizens in Wales are likely to lose their entitlement to a free television licence? 321
Daeth y Dirprwy Lywydd (Ann Jones) i’r Gadair.
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Ann Jones) took the Chair.
Diolch yn fawr am y cwestiwn. Fe gytunwyd ar y setliad ariannol ar gyfer 2015 rhwng Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig a’r BBC oedd yn cynnwys terfynu’r cyllid ar gyfer y consesiwn i bobl dros 75 oed, heb unrhyw ymgynghori na chraffu gan Senedd y Deyrnas Unedig na’r Senedd hon, na’r gweinyddiaethau datganoledig. Mi fydd y penderfyniad yn effeithio ar y bobl fwyaf agored i niwed ac ynysig yn ein cymdeithas.
Thank you for that question. The financial settlement for 2015 was agreed between the UK Government and the BBC, and that included bringing an end to the funding for the concession for those over 75 years of age, without any consultation or any scrutiny by the UK Parliament or this Parliament or the devolved administrations. The decision will impact on the most vulnerable and isolated people in our society.
I thank you for that answer, Minister. For many older people, free tv licences are absolutely vital. Tv often offers companionship and an escape from loneliness, it provides entertainment and access to information, and for many, it is their window on the world. Now, the UK Government knows this, which is why they have passed the buck to the BBC to do their dirty work for them. Would the Minister agree that this is a shameful, a mean and a despicable way to treat our senior citizens—the generation that has given so much service to our country? And does he join me in calling on all the Tory party leadership candidates to pledge to provide the BBC with the funding needed so that all of those over the age of 75 years can continue to receive this benefit?
Diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw, Weinidog. I lawer o bobl hŷn, mae trwyddedau teledu am ddim yn gwbl hanfodol. Yn aml mae teledu'n cynnig cwmnïaeth a dihangfa rhag unigrwydd, mae'n darparu adloniant a mynediad at wybodaeth, ac i lawer, dyma'u ffenestr ar y byd. Nawr, mae Llywodraeth y DU yn gwybod hyn, a dyna pam y maent wedi taflu'r baich ar y BBC i wneud eu gwaith budr drostynt. A fyddai'r Gweinidog yn cytuno bod hon yn ffordd gywilyddus, grintachlyd a ffiaidd o drin ein dinasyddion hŷn—y genhedlaeth sydd wedi rhoi cymaint o wasanaeth i'n gwlad? Ac a yw'n ymuno â mi i alw ar holl ymgeiswyr yn ras arweinyddiaeth y blaid Dorïaidd i addo rhoi'r cyllid angenrheidiol i'r BBC fel y gall pawb dros 75 oed barhau i gael y budd hwn?
Mae'n rhaid imi ddweud fy mod i yn cytuno â sylwadau'r Aelod, a bod y pwysau sydd wedi cael ei roi ar y BBC a'r sefyllfa mae'r BBC wedi cael ei gosod ynddi yn gwbl annerbyniol. Yn wir, mi fyddwn i'n mynd yn bellach na hyn: dwi'n meddwl ei fod o'n amarch ar y berthynas sefydlog sydd wedi bod yn y Deyrnas Unedig rhwng cyrff darlledu cyhoeddus megis y BBC a Llywodraethau o bob plaid.
Dyw darlledu ddim wedi'i ddatganoli, ac mae'r BBC yn gweithredu'n annibynnol ar y Llywodraeth. Nid lle Llywodraeth Cymru, felly, yw dweud wrth y BBC am barhau, diwygio neu derfynu’r consesiwn, ond dwi'n meddwl ei bod yn hanfodol inni ddweud wrth Lywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig nad ydyn ni'n credu bod y modd y maen nhw wedi gweithredu yn gyfiawn o gwbl. A dwi'n cytuno, yn arbennig, ei bod hi'n bwysig bod pobl, ble bynnag maen nhw'n byw yn y Deyrnas Unedig, yn gallu derbyn, o ran hawliau democrataidd, wybodaeth am faterion y dydd a newyddion lleol, ac mae hyn yn arbennig o bwysig, wrth gwrs, i ni yma yng Nghymru.
I must say that I do agree with the Member's comments, and that the pressure that has been placed on the BBC and the position that the BBC has been placed in is entirely unacceptable. Indeed, I would go further and say that it is disrespectful of the stable relationship and the established relationship that has existed in the UK between public broadcasters such as the BBC and Governments of all hues.
Broadcasting is not devolved, and the BBC operates independently of Government. It's not the role of the Welsh Government, therefore, to tell the BBC to continue to reform or to scrap the concession, but I do think that it's crucial that we do tell the UK Government that we do not believe that the way that they have operated is just in any way whatsoever. And I would agree particularly that it's important for people, wherever they live in the UK, to be able, in terms of their democratic rights, to receive information on issues of the day and local news, and this is particularly important, of course, for us here in Wales.
Minister, I think your colleague Lord Hall, who is the chairman of the BBC—I would be grateful if you let him know what the people of Wales, especially the over-75s—. I know it's a totally different legal entity, the BBC, but the people in my region over the age of 75—they're living singly, some with medical conditions, no relations living with them, and they're living in the areas that certainly need help, and this was a minor help—[Interruption.] Can you listen, please? This is a little help to them while they're of the age after 75, which is an age when people need it. Some are war veterans; some of those served, worked and helped this nation tremendously, not within the United Kingdom—all over the world. So, we need to help them out. Some have a medical condition. So, Minister—[Interruption.] No, no. Minister—I am talking to the Minister because he's got to speak to his colleague Lord Hall, who is the chairman of the BBC. Please let this gentleman know what the—[Interruption.]
Actually, this was given as an incentive by the Conservative Party. Why don't you understand? It was not given by Labour; this facility was given by the Tory Party. [Interruption.] Listen.
So, I would like, Minister, to speak—[Interruption.] Let me speak, please. Presiding Officer, there is something very strange in this Chamber. I would like to give a message that we are all as one on this position, at this stage we are all together, and we're not talking—. I'm not saying a different thing to what the BBC has said. I am trying to work it out. We would like to help the people over the age of 75 to have the same facility carry on forever. Thank you.
Weinidog, rwy'n meddwl bod eich cyd-Arglwydd, yr Arglwydd Hall, sy'n gadeirydd y BBC—buaswn yn ddiolchgar pe baech yn rhoi gwybod iddo beth y mae pobl Cymru, yn enwedig y rhai dros 75 oed—. Rwy'n gwybod ei fod yn endid cyfreithiol hollol wahanol, y BBC, ond mae'r bobl yn fy rhanbarth i sydd dros 75 oed—maent yn byw ar eu pen eu hunain, mae gan rai ohonynt gyflyrau meddygol, a heb berthnasau'n byw gyda hwy, ac maent yn byw yn yr ardaloedd sy'n sicr angen help, ac roedd hwn yn help bach—[Torri ar draws.] A wnewch chi wrando, os gwelwch yn dda? Mae hwn yn help bach iddynt tra maent dros 75 oed, sy'n oed pan fydd pobl ei angen. Mae rhai yn gyn-filwyr rhyfel; mae rhai o'r bobl wedi gwasanaethu, wedi gweithio ac wedi helpu'r wlad hon yn aruthrol, nid yn unig yn y Deyrnas Unedig ond ym mhob cwr o'r byd. Felly, mae angen inni eu helpu. Mae gan rai gyflwr meddygol. Felly, Weinidog—[Torri ar draws.] Na, na. Weinidog—rwy'n siarad â'r Gweinidog oherwydd mae'n rhaid iddo siarad â'i gyd-Arglwydd, yr Arglwydd Hall, sy'n gadeirydd y BBC. Rhowch wybod i'r gŵr bonheddig hwn beth yw'r—[Torri ar draws.]
Mewn gwirionedd, cafodd hyn ei roi fel cymhelliad gan y Blaid Geidwadol. Pam nad ydych chi'n deall? Ni chafodd ei roi gan Lafur; y blaid Dorïaidd a roddodd y cyfleuster hwn. [Torri ar draws.] Gwrandewch.
Felly, Weinidog, hoffwn siarad—[Torri ar draws.] Gadewch imi siarad, os gwelwch yn dda. Lywydd, mae rhywbeth rhyfedd iawn yn y Siambr hon. Hoffwn roi neges ein bod i gyd yn unedig ar y safbwynt hwn, ar hyn o bryd rydym i gyd gyda'n gilydd, ac nid ydym yn siarad—. Nid wyf yn dweud rhywbeth gwahanol i'r hyn y mae'r BBC wedi'i ddweud. Rwy'n ceisio'i ddatrys. Hoffem helpu pobl dros 75 oed i gael yr un cyfleuster i barhau am byth. Diolch.
Roeddwn i'n meddwl fy mod i wedi esbonio'r sefyllfa yn glir ar y dechrau. Does gen i na neb arall yma y locws i fynegi barn ynglŷn â beth ddylai'r BBC ei wneud, ond beth sydd wedi digwydd yn y fan hyn, fel y ceisiais i esbonio, ydy bod y setliad ariannol wedi cael ei gytuno rhwng Llywodraeth Geidwadol y Deyrnas Unedig a'r BBC. Nid penderfyniad a oedd hwnnw sydd wedi bod â chyfle o gwbl i neb ohonom ni yn y fan hyn nag unrhyw Dŷ o Senedd y Deyrnas Unedig ychwaith i fynegi barn arno fo.
Ac felly, fy mhwyslais i fyddai dweud hyn: dylem ni baratoi yn ofalus achos cadarn i gefnogi diwygio'r drwydded a cheisio dod â'r drwydded yn ôl i'w gwerth gwirioneddol fel ag yr oedd hi pan oedd y BBC yn derbyn cyllid digonol am y gwasanaethau, oherwydd y sefyllfa amhosib mae'r BBC wedi cael eu rhoi ynddi hi, fel y gwyddoch chi oddi wrth y datganiadau a wnaed gan y BBC ar y pryd, a dwi'n cyfeirio at y nodyn a dderbyniwyd gan BBC Cymru ar 10 Mehefin, sef bod y BBC wedi cael eu gosod mewn sefyllfa lle'r oeddyn nhw'n bygwth torri nôl ar ystod eang o wasanaethau—BBC Two, BBC Four, sianel newyddion y BBC, sianel y BBC yn yr Alban, Radio 5 Live, a 5 Live Sport Extra, sef y ddwy donfedd radio dwi'n eu mwynhau mwyaf a nifer o orsafoedd radio eraill. Wel, nawr, mae honno'n sefyllfa amhosib lle mae'r BBC ddim yn cael eu cyllido yn ddigonol i ddarparu ystod y gwasanaethau sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd. Ond penderfyniad Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig, a'r BBC wedyn, dwi'n cymryd, wedi gorfod cytuno gan nad oedden nhw ddim yn gallu cael unrhyw gyllid ychwanegol.
I thought I had explained the situation clearly at the outset. Neither I nor anyone else here has the locus to express a view on what the BBC should do, but what has happened here, as I tried to explain, is that the financial settlement was agreed between the Conservative Government of the UK and the BBC. That wasn't a decision that provided an opportunity for any of us in this place or in any House of the UK Parliament to express a view on.
Therefore, my emphasis would be to say this: we should prepare carefully a robust case to support the reform of the licence and try and bring the licence back to its actual value as it was when the BBC received adequate funding for the services it provided, because the impossible situation that the BBC has found itself in and been placed in, as you will know from the statements made by the BBC at the time, and I refer to the note received from BBC Cymru Wales on 10 June, namely, that the BBC had been placed in a position where they were threatening to cut back on a range of services—BBC Two, BBC Four, BBC News, the BBC's channel in Scotland, Radio 5 Live and 5 Live Sports Extra, which are the two radio stations that I enjoy most, and many other radio stations. Now, that is an impossible situation where the BBC isn't sufficiently funded to provide the range of services that is currently available. But it was a decision taken by the UK Government, and the BBC, I assume, had to agree because they couldn't receive any additional funding.
Yn bellach i'r hyn sydd newydd gael ei ddweud, roedd penderfyniad Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Gyfunol i drosglwyddo'r baich o ddarparu trwyddedau am ddim i bobl dros 75 yn gwbl sinigaidd. Canlyniad hyn oedd rhoi'r cyfrifoldeb ar y BBC i weithredu ymrwymiad a wnaeth y Torïaid yn eu maniffesto eu hunain. Roedd y BBC wedyn mewn sefyllfa anodd iawn o orfod dewis torri nôl ar y trwyddedau am ddim, neu dorri swyddi a gwasanaethau.
Rwy'n cydymdeimlo'n llwyr â phawb sydd yn gwrthwynebu'r penderfyniad, yn enwedig y bobl hynny a fydd yn cael eu heffeithio gan weithredoedd afresymol y Llywodraeth Dorïaidd. Fy mhryder i yn awr yw y bydd pensiynwyr sydd ddim yn gefnog yn canfod eu hunain yn ysgwyddo baich ychwanegol gwbl annheg. Y rheswm am hyn yw mai'r rheini sy'n derbyn credyd pensiwn fydd yn parhau i dderbyn y drwydded am ddim, a dim ond 60 y cant o'r rheini sydd yn gymwys i dderbyn credyd pensiwn sydd yn ei dderbyn ar hyn o bryd. Golyga hyn fod 40 y cant o'r rheini sy'n gymwys am gredyd pensiwn ond ddim am ei dderbyn yn wynebu gorfod talu £154 y flwyddyn i dderbyn gwasanaeth angenrheidiol o ran cadw blaidd unigrwydd i ffwrdd o'r drws.
Hoffwn ofyn i'r Gweinidog pa gamau all ei Lywodraeth ef eu cymryd, efallai'n cydweithio â'r BBC, felly, er mwyn cynyddu'r gyfradd o bobl sy'n gymwys ar gyfer credyd pensiwn. Rwy'n derbyn nad yw hwn yn fater datganoledig, ond a oes mesurau y gallwch chi eu cymryd o ran cynnal ymgyrch i gynyddu ymwybyddiaeth o hawliau pobl hŷn, er enghraifft, fel mae'r BBC wedi sôn efallai byddan nhw yn ei wneud, er mwyn atal pensiynwyr rhag cael eu taro gan faich ariannol annheg? Ac a fyddwch chi'n rhoi pwysau ar Lywodraeth San Steffan i wneud tro pedol a darparu'r sybsidi hwn eu hunain unwaith yn rhagor?
Further to what's already been said, the decision taken by the UK Government to transfer the burden for providing free licences for people over 75 was entirely cynical. The upshot of this was to place the responsibility on the BBC to implement a commitment made by the Tories in their own manifesto. The BBC was then in the very difficult position of having to choose to cut back on the free licences or to cut services and jobs.
I sympathise entirely with everyone who opposed the decision, particularly those people who will be affected by the unreasonable actions of the Conservative Government. My concern is that pensioners who are not wealthy will find themselves shouldering an additional burden that is entirely unfair. The reason for this is that those who receive pension credits will continue to receive free licences, but only 60 per cent of those qualified for pension credit actually claim it at the moment. This will mean that 40 per cent of those who would qualify for pension credit but don't receive it will face having to pay £154 per annum to receive an entirely necessary service in order to keep isolation and loneliness away from the door.
I ask the Minister what steps he and his Government could take, perhaps in collaboration with the BBC, in order to increase the percentage of people who claim pension credit. I accept that this is non-devolved, but are there any steps that you could take in terms of a campaign to raise awareness of the rights of older people, for example, as the BBC has mentioned that they might do in order to prevent pensioners from being hit by an unfair financial burden? Will you put pressure on the Westminster Government to make a u-turn and provide this subsidy themselves once again?
Dwi'n cytuno â'r ysbryd tu ôl i'r sylwadau yna, ac yn eu croesawu nhw, ond a siarad yn hollol blaen, dwi ddim yn credu mai fy swydd i fel un o Weinidogion Cymru ydy lobio San Steffan. Fy swydd i ydy dangos eu rhagrith nhw, a dweud bod eu hymddygiad nhw yn gwbl annerbyniol ac yn anghyfiawn i bobl hŷn yng Nghymru ac yng ngweddill y Deyrnas Unedig. Mae'r ffordd y maen nhw wedi derbyn a defnyddio—[Torri ar draws.] Esgusodwch fi. Dwi ddim yn credu bod modd i chi—[Torri ar draws.] Thank you.
Ac felly, rydw i o'r farn bod y modd y maen nhw wedi defnyddio'r drefn nawdd cymdeithasol, sef credyd cyffredinol, fel adfer math o brawf moddion—rhywbeth rydym ni wedi'i feirniadu yn y lle hwn yn y gorffennol—fel ffordd o brofi bod henoed yn haeddu gallu cael y darlledu heb eu bod nhw'n gorfod talu am drwydded yn ychwanegol, ac yna, wrth wneud hynny, maen nhw wedi tanseilio'r rhyddid oedd i'w gael ar gyfer darlledu cyffredinol ac wedi pwysleisio bod yna ryw berthynas newydd wedi cael ei sefydlu rhwng nawdd cymdeithasol a haeddu gwasanaethau darlledu. Dwi'n meddwl bod hwnnw, hefyd, yn fater y mae angen i ni ei ddatgelu a'i wrthwynebu yn glir.
I agree with the spirit behind those comments and I welcome them, but talking plainly here, I don't think that my job as one of the Ministers of Wales is to lobby Westminster. My job is to show their hypocrisy, and to say that their behaviour is completely unacceptable and unjust to older people in Wales and in the rest of the United Kingdom. The way that they have accepted and used—[Interruption.] Excuse me. I don't think that you may—[Interruption.] Thank you.
Therefore, I'm of the opinion that the way that they have used the benefits system, namely credits in general, as a way of restoring some sort of means test—something that we've criticised in this place in the past—as a way of proving that older people deserve being able to receive a broadcasting service without having to pay for a licence fee in addition, and then, in doing so, they have undermined the freedom that was available for general broadcasting and have emphasised that there's some sort of new relationship being established between the benefits system and deserving a broadcasting service. I think that that also is an issue that we need to reveal and oppose clearly.
Would the Minister agree with me that this decision is a complete breach of faith by the BBC? On its own website on 6 July 2015, referring to a deal the BBC had made with the Government in the run-up to the renewal of the BBC charter in 2017, it said that the BBC would,
'cover the cost of providing free television licences for over-75s',
in return for the licence fee rising in line with inflation, which it has done. Therefore, it's the BBC's decision that here is to be criticised.
Would he also agree with me that funding an organisation like the BBC by means of a poll tax on owners of television sets is an absurd way of going about things in the twenty-first century? It might have been allright at the time the BBC was founded, when it was the only channel, or indeed up to the 1950s when it was one of only two. But now that there is such a multiplicity of forms of entertainment that are available, it is a ridiculous way for people to fund an organisation that they may not have any interest in watching. I, for one, have no interest in contributing towards Gary Lineker's £1.8 million-a-year pay packet from the BBC for talking balls rather than kicking them.
A fyddai'r Gweinidog yn cytuno â mi fod y penderfyniad hwn yn dor-addewid ar ran y BBC? Ar eu gwefan eu hun ar 6 Gorffennaf 2015, wrth gyfeirio at gytundeb a wnaeth y BBC gyda'r Llywodraeth yn y cyfnod cyn adnewyddu siarter y BBC yn 2017, dywedai y byddai'r BBC,
yn talu'r gost o ddarparu trwyddedau teledu am ddim i bobl dros 75 oed,
yn gyfnewid am godi ffi'r drwydded yn unol â chwyddiant, ac mae wedi gwneud hynny. Felly, penderfyniad y BBC sydd i'w feirniadu yn hyn o beth.
A fyddai'n cytuno â mi hefyd fod ariannu sefydliad fel y BBC drwy gyfrwng treth y pen ar berchnogion setiau teledu yn ffordd hurt o fynd ati i wneud pethau yn yr unfed ganrif ar hugain? Efallai ei bod hi'n ffordd iawn o'i wneud ar yr adeg y sefydlwyd y BBC, pan oedd yn unig sianel, neu'n wir hyd at y 1950au pan oedd yn un o ddwy yn unig. Ond gan fod cymaint o fathau o adloniant ar gael erbyn hyn, mae'n ffordd hurt i bobl ariannu sefydliad nad oes ganddynt unrhyw ddiddordeb yn ei gwylio. Yn bersonol, nid oes gennyf unrhyw ddiddordeb mewn cyfrannu tuag at becyn cyflog Gary Lineker o £1.8 miliwn y flwyddyn gan y BBC am siarad am beli yn hytrach na'u cicio.
Dwi ddim yn siŵr a ydw i i fod i gymryd y cwestiynau yna fel cyfraniad difrifol i'r mater hwn, oherwydd roeddwn i'n meddwl fy mod i wedi'i gwneud yn hollol glir ar y dechrau mai trafodaeth oedd hon rhwng y BBC yn gorfforaethol, bwrdd y BBC yn ganolog, a Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig, ac felly nad oedd gennym ni, ac yn sicr nad oedd gen i fel Gweinidog â throsolwg dros ddarlledu, unrhyw gyfle i fynegi barn ynglŷn â hyn. Dyna pam rydym ni wedi'i gwneud hi'n gwbl amlwg, yn y sylwadau rydym ni wedi eu gwneud ar yr ymgynghoriad a fu, ein gwrthwynebiad i'r hyn sydd wedi ei osod gerbron.
Ac yna, mae'n rhaid i mi bwysleisio, cyn belled ag yr ydw i yn y cwestiwn, mai'r hyn rydym ni'n galw amdano fo ydy ein bod ni'n annog Llywodraeth y Deyrnas Unedig a'r BBC i wneud ymdrech i gyflwyno mecanwaith di-dor cyn gynted ag y bo modd, yn hytrach na bod yna opsiwn ar gyfer prawf moddion yn cael ei roi ar waith, fel sy'n digwydd ar hyn o bryd.
I'm not sure if I'm to take those questions as a serious contribution on this issue, because I thought I'd made it entirely clear at the very outset that this was a discussion between the BBC at a corporate level, the board of the BBC centrally, and the UK Government, and therefore that we, and certainly I, as Minister with an overview of broadcasting, didn't have any opportunity to express a view on this issue. That's why we have made entirely apparent, in the comments that we have made on the consultation, our opposition to what has been put forward.
Therefore, I have to emphasise that, as far as I am concerned, what we are calling for is that we encourage the UK Government and the BBC to seek to introduce a seamless mechanism as soon as possible, rather than an option of a means test being implemented, as is happening at the moment.
Thank you very much, Deputy Minister. The next topical question this afternoon is a question by Andrew R.T. Davies, to be answered by the Minister for Economy and Transport. Andrew R.T. Davies.
Diolch yn fawr iawn, Ddirprwy Weinidog. Y cwestiwn amserol nesaf y prynhawn yw cwestiwn gan Andrew R.T. Davies, i'w ateb gan Weinidog yr Economi a Thrafnidiaeth. Andrew R.T. Davies.
2. Yng ngoleuni adroddiad gan y Pwyllgor Materion Cymreig, sy'n nodi y dylai toll teithwyr awyr gael ei datganoli'n llawn i Gymru, a wnaiff y Gweinidog amlinellu cynlluniau Llywodraeth Cymru ar gyfer diddymu neu ostwng y gyfradd os trosglwyddir y pŵer i Gymru? 322
2. In light of a report by the Welsh Affairs Committee stating air passenger duty should be fully devolved to Wales, will the Minister outline the Welsh Government's plans for abolishing or reducing the rate if the power is transferred to Wales? 322
Yes, of course. Our intention would be to use APD to secure optimal growth for both the airport and for Wales, working with the other levers available to us. Ultimately, this means giving serious consideration to reducing APD rates. Any proposed changes to APD would be impact assessed and, of course, subject to full consultation with businesses and, importantly, the public.
Gwnaf, wrth gwrs. Ein bwriad fyddai defnyddio'r doll teithwyr awyr i sicrhau'r twf gorau posibl i'r maes awyr ac i Gymru, gan weithio gyda'r dulliau eraill sydd ar gael i ni. Yn y pen draw, mae hyn yn golygu rhoi ystyriaeth ddifrifol i leihau cyfraddau'r doll teithwyr awyr. Byddai unrhyw newidiadau arfaethedig i'r doll teithwyr awyr yn cael eu hasesu o ran eu heffaith ac wrth gwrs yn amodol ar ymgynghoriad llawn â busnesau, ac yn bwysig, â'r cyhoedd.
Thank you for that answer, Minister. I am a little concerned by your pronouncements over the last couple of days where you said that APD, if transferred, could go up, in light of the former First Minister's comments, in particular on long haul, where he said,
'yes we start from the position of looking to get rid of it, certainly not to increase it.'
You, yourself, are on record as saying that if APD was transferred and lowered, potentially an extra 0.5 million passengers could use Cardiff Airport. I'm unaware of a consumer tax that, if it's raised, actually incentivises people to use it. So, can you clarify your comments, and in particular some of the remarks of the finance Secretary, that, given some of the pronouncements that have been made by the Welsh Government over the last couple of weeks, actually instead of decreasing APD if it was to be transferred, you as a Government might well be looking to increase it to meet your environmental goals?
Diolch ichi am yr ateb hwnnw, Weinidog. Rwy'n poeni ychydig am eich cyhoeddiadau dros yr ychydig ddyddiau diwethaf pan ddywedoch y gallai'r doll teithwyr awyr godi, os caiff ei throsglwyddo, yng ngoleuni sylwadau'r cyn-Brif Weinidog, yn enwedig ar deithiau hir, a dywedodd,
rydym yn dechrau o'r safbwynt o geisio cael gwared â hi, yn sicr i beidio â'i chodi.
Rydych chi'ch hun wedi dweud ar goedd pe câi'r doll teithwyr awyr ei throsglwyddo a'i gostwng, y gallai 0.5 miliwn o deithwyr ychwanegol ddefnyddio Maes Awyr Caerdydd. Nid wyf yn ymwybodol o dreth defnyddwyr sydd, o'i chodi, yn cymell pobl i'w defnyddio mewn gwirionedd. Felly, a allwch egluro eich sylwadau, a rhai o sylwadau'r Ysgrifennydd cyllid yn enwedig, o ystyried rhai o'r datganiadau a wnaed gan Lywodraeth Cymru dros yr ychydig wythnosau diwethaf, yn hytrach na gostwng y doll teithwyr awyr pe bai'n cael ei throsglwyddo, ei bod yn ddigon posibl y byddwch chi fel Llywodraeth yn ystyried ei chodi er mwyn cyrraedd eich nodau amgylcheddol?
No, I don't believe that I have suggested that it could be increased. I think I said that any consideration of varying APD would have to be set against the environmental impact, and we'd have to vary APD in line also with our obligations and requirements under the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. We've always been clear in saying that we would use APD to make Cardiff Airport and Wales more competitive.
Now, I believe—based on emerging technology and the way that the aerospace industry is going and the new fuel systems that are being adopted by aircraft carriers—that we would be able to increase passenger numbers utilising APD and potentially reducing it or abolishing it in a way that would have a net carbon benefit for the environment. I think that that would have to be tested, of course, against a thorough environmental impact assessment, but in no way have I said that I would be raising—or that the Government would be raising—APD. Quite the opposite. Our position is still that our preference would be for the removal or reduction of APD.
Na, nid wyf yn credu fy mod wedi awgrymu y gellid ei chodi. Credaf i mi ddweud y byddai'n rhaid gosod unrhyw ystyriaeth ynglŷn ag amrywio'r doll teithwyr awyr yn erbyn yr effaith ar yr amgylchedd, a byddai'n rhaid i ni amrywio'r doll teithwyr awyr yn unol â'n rhwymedigaethau a'n gofynion o dan Ddeddf Llesiant Cenedlaethau'r Dyfodol (Cymru) 2015. Rydym bob amser wedi dweud yn glir y byddem yn defnyddio'r doll teithwyr awyr i wneud Maes Awyr Caerdydd a Chymru yn fwy cystadleuol.
Nawr, yn seiliedig ar dechnoleg sy'n datblygu a'r ffordd y mae'r diwydiant awyrofod yn mynd a'r systemau tanwydd newydd sy'n cael eu mabwysiadu gan gwmnïau awyrennau, rwy'n credu y gallem gynyddu nifer y teithwyr sy'n defnyddio'r doll teithwyr awyr a'i gostwng neu ei diddymu o bosibl mewn ffordd a fyddai'n sicrhau budd carbon net i'r amgylchedd. Credaf y byddai'n rhaid profi hynny wrth gwrs yn erbyn asesiad trylwyr o'r effaith amgylcheddol, ond nid wyf wedi dweud mewn unrhyw ffordd y buaswn—neu y byddai'r Llywodraeth—yn codi'r doll teithwyr awyr. I'r gwrthwyneb. Ein safbwynt o hyd yw y byddai'n well gennym ddileu neu ostwng y doll teithwyr awyr.
It can be a bit frustrating sitting on these benches. I very much welcome the report from the Welsh Affairs Select Committee. We're pleased that the argument and that opinions from politicians and other political parties are catching up with us, whether it’s on the devolution of policing, or the pop tax, or now air passenger duty. It can be frustrating waiting for others to come on board with our ideas, but we are there.
I was looking back at a vote in 2014, when Jonathan Edwards was talking in a debate on the Finance Bill. All Conservative Members of Parliament voted against the devolution of air passenger duty. None of the Labour Members turned up for that one. But, we are where we are today. My question, quite simply, to the Minister is how will he now use this report as an additional lever in order to try to get the UK Government to change its mind.
Gall eistedd ar y meinciau hyn fod yn rhwystredig braidd. Rwy'n croesawu'n fawr yr adroddiad gan y Pwyllgor Dethol ar Faterion Cymreig. Rydym yn falch fod y ddadl a bod barn gwleidyddion a phleidiau gwleidyddol eraill yn dal i fyny â ni, boed hynny ar ddatganoli plismona, neu'r dreth bop, neu ar y doll teithwyr awyr yn awr. Gall fod yn rhwystredig aros i eraill gefnogi ein syniadau, ond rydym yno.
Roeddwn yn edrych yn ôl ar bleidlais yn 2014, pan oedd Jonathan Edwards yn siarad mewn dadl ar y Bil Cyllid. Pleidleisiodd pob Aelod Seneddol Ceidwadol yn erbyn datganoli'r doll teithwyr awyr. Nid oedd yr un o'r Aelodau Llafur yno ar gyfer honno. Ond dyma'r sefyllfa rydym ynddi heddiw. Fy nghwestiwn i i'r Gweinidog yn syml iawn yw sut y bydd yn defnyddio'r adroddiad hwn yn awr fel ysgogiad ychwanegol i geisio cael Llywodraeth y DU i newid ei meddwl.
Well, I think that, first and foremost, the UK Government need to respond speedily to this report. As the Chair of the committee himself said, he doesn't always favour the devolution of powers, but he recognises how important this could be in helping Cardiff Airport and Wales become far more competitive. There are, of course, two questions. On whether to devolve it, in all fairness to politicians on all sides, I think that many politicians have had a consistent, long-held view about whether to devolve it. Some have opposed it. Some have been in favour of it. But, I think that all Members have held their positions for quite some time and, in all generality, Dirprwy Lywydd, Members have been consistent in their approach.
The second question is what to do with it. We've always been clear that we wish to use it as an additional tool to make Cardiff Airport more competitive, to drive up passenger numbers, to reduce the number of car journeys that are undertaken—in our view, unnecessarily—from the catchment area of Cardiff Airport to airports such as Gatwick, such as Bristol. And, if you can take cars and other vehicles, and particularly freight, off the motorway network, you are in turn reducing carbon emissions. And, as I said in answer to Andrew R.T. Davies, technological changes are occurring at great pace within the aerospace industry. We are at the forefront of supporting Airbus in capturing the wing of tomorrow, in developing new composite materials, because energy efficiency, fuel efficiency, is the name of the game, in terms of how to become competitive in the aerospace sector. And, of course, just recently, Virgin Atlantic operated a flight from Orlando to Gatwick using, incredibly, waste carbon dioxide from a steelworks. That demonstrates how the sector, how aircraft transport, is becoming far more responsive to environmental concerns.
Wel, yn gyntaf oll, credaf fod angen i Lywodraeth y DU ymateb yn gyflym i'r adroddiad hwn. Fel y dywedodd Cadeirydd y pwyllgor ei hun, nid yw bob amser yn ffafrio datganoli pwerau, ond mae'n cydnabod pa mor bwysig y gallai hyn fod i helpu Maes Awyr Caerdydd a Chymru i ddod yn llawer mwy cystadleuol. Wrth gwrs, mae yna ddau gwestiwn. O ran a ddylid datganoli'r doll, a bod yn deg â gwleidyddion ar bob ochr, credaf fod llawer o wleidyddion wedi arddel barn gyson a hirsefydlog ynglŷn ag a ddylid ei datganoli. Mae rhai wedi'i wrthwynebu. Mae rhai wedi bod o blaid gwneud hynny. Ond credaf fod pob Aelod wedi arddel eu safbwyntiau ers cryn dipyn o amser ac yn gyffredinol, Ddirprwy Lywydd, mae'r Aelodau wedi bod yn gyson yn eu hymagwedd.
Yr ail gwestiwn yw beth i'w wneud â'r doll. Rydym bob amser wedi bod yn glir ein bod am ei defnyddio fel offeryn ychwanegol i wneud Maes Awyr Caerdydd yn fwy cystadleuol, i gynyddu niferoedd teithwyr, i leihau nifer y teithiau ceir sy'n cael eu gwneud—yn ddiangen yn ein barn ni—o ddalgylch Maes Awyr Caerdydd i feysydd awyr fel Gatwick, fel Bryste. Ac os gallwch dynnu ceir a cherbydau eraill, yn enwedig cerbydau cludo nwyddau, oddi ar y rhwydwaith traffyrdd, rydych yn lleihau allyriadau carbon hefyd. Ac fel y dywedais wrth ateb Andrew R.T. Davies, mae newidiadau technolegol yn digwydd yn gyflym iawn o fewn y diwydiant awyrofod. Rydym ar flaen y gad yn cynorthwyo Airbus i hedfan tua'r dyfodol, a datblygu deunyddiau cyfansawdd newydd, gan mai effeithlonrwydd ynni, defnydd effeithlon o danwydd, yw'r hyn sy'n bwysig o ran sut i ddod yn gystadleuol yn y sector awyrofod. Ac wrth gwrs, yn ddiweddar, roedd Virgin Atlantic yn gweithredu awyren o Orlando i Gatwick gan ddefnyddio carbon deuocsid dros ben o waith dur, sy'n anhygoel. Dengys hynny sut y mae'r sector, sut y mae awyrennau, yn dod yn llawer mwy ymatebol i bryderon amgylcheddol.
Is the Minister suggesting the devolution of APD as an alternative to the M4 relief road? I'm not sure it would be on the same scale in terms of impact on congestion. I wonder, though, could he clarify, because he's used this word 'varying APD', and I think Andrew R.T. Davies has, entirely understandably, considered that might reflect a change of policy from the previous First Minister saying 'reducing', since varying may mean either increasing or reducing. The Minister has also said that he wants to consider this decision in light of environmental impact assessments, and I've heard some people—at least from a sedentary position on the Plaid side—suggesting that APD might need to go up in order to reduce the climate change impact.
Can I also just ask for clarity on the legal situation here? You said just now that the well-being of future generations Act requires these environmental impact assessments. If so, why wasn't this realised or at least spoken about previously? And why didn't he take the opportunity of the 2017 York—sorry, the York Aviation report was 2014, but the Northpoint study in 2017 that his Government commissioned, that looked into quite a lot of these issues around where traffic was going to go? Why didn't that also consider the environmental impact? You also mentioned just now that it could lead to an increase of up to 500,000 passengers from Cardiff Airport. The York Aviation report said it might reduce Bristol by a million, and even his own Northpoint report said it might reduce Bristol by 600,000. So, why that discrepancy?
A yw'r Gweinidog yn awgrymu datganoli toll teithwyr awyr fel dewis amgen yn lle ffordd liniaru M4? Nid wyf yn siŵr y byddai ar yr un raddfa o ran yr effaith ar dagfeydd. Er hynny, tybed a allai egluro, oherwydd mae wedi defnyddio'r gair 'amrywio' toll teithwyr awyr, a chredaf fod Andrew R.T. Davies, yn gwbl ddealladwy, wedi ystyried y gallai hynny ddynodi newid polisi o'r Prif Weinidog blaenorol yn dweud 'lleihau', gan y gallai amrywio olygu naill ai gynyddu neu leihau. Mae'r Gweinidog hefyd wedi dweud ei fod am ystyried y penderfyniad hwn yng ngoleuni asesiadau o effaith amgylcheddol, ac rwyf wedi clywed rhai pobl—o'u seddau ar ochr Plaid Cymru o leiaf—yn awgrymu y gallai fod angen i'r doll teithwyr awyr godi er mwyn lleihau'r effaith ar newid hinsawdd.
A gaf fi hefyd ofyn am eglurder ar y sefyllfa gyfreithiol yma? Fe ddywedoch chi yn awr fod Deddf llesiant cenedlaethau'r dyfodol yn ei gwneud yn ofynnol i'r asesiadau hyn o'r effaith amgylcheddol gael eu cynnal. Os felly, pam na sylweddolwyd hynny neu o leiaf, pam na siaradwyd am hynny'n flaenorol? A pham na fanteisiodd ar gyfle adroddiad York Aviation 2017—mae'n ddrwg gennyf, yn 2014 y cafwyd adroddiad York Aviation, ond astudiaeth Northpoint yn 2017 a gomisiynwyd gan ei Lywodraeth ef, ac a edrychodd ar gryn dipyn o'r materion hyn yn ymwneud â lle roedd traffig yn mynd i fynd? Pam na wnaeth hwnnw ystyried yr effaith amgylcheddol hefyd? Fe sonioch chi hefyd yn awr y gallai arwain at gynnydd o hyd at 500,000 o deithwyr o Faes Awyr Caerdydd. Dywedodd adroddiad York Aviation y gallai olygu miliwn yn llai o Fryste, ac roedd hyd yn oed ei adroddiad Northpoint ei hun yn dweud y gallai arwain at 600,000 yn llai o Fryste. Felly, pam yr anghysondeb hwnnw?
Well, I think, first of all, the Northpoint Aviation report, which was peer-reviewed, Dirprwy Llywydd, presented evidence that showed there'd be reduced carbon impacts as a result of shorter road journeys to Cardiff Airport if APD was devolved and the rates were subsequently reduced. And that's why we've always held the position that our preference would be to reduce or abolish APD. That position has not changed. But it is only right and proper and responsible to ensure that a decision on whether to vary downward, in this case, APD, is acceptable for businesses and the people through a consultation, and is in line not just with—and I think the Member may be conflating two pieces of legislation—not just with the well-being of future generations Act, but also, crucially, with the environment Act as well.
But, as I've said, it's my view, based on the evidence that's been presented, that reducing or abolishing APD, and therefore attracting more passengers to Cardiff Airport away from more distant airports, would lead to carbon reduction on the whole.
Wel, yn gyntaf oll, Ddirprwy Lywydd, credaf fod adroddiad Northpoint Aviation, adroddiad a adolygwyd gan gymheiriaid, wedi cyflwyno tystiolaeth a ddangosai y byddai llai o effeithiau carbon o ganlyniad i deithiau ffordd byrrach i Faes Awyr Caerdydd pe bai toll teithwyr awyr yn cael ei datganoli a bod y cyfraddau'n lleihau yn sgil hynny. A dyna pam ein bod bob amser wedi bod o'r farn y byddai'n well gennym leihau neu ddiddymu'r doll teithwyr awyr. Nid yw'r safbwynt hwnnw wedi newid. Ond mae'n iawn ac yn briodol ac yn gyfrifol i sicrhau bod penderfyniad a ddylid amrywio'r doll teithwyr awyr, yn yr achos hwn, yn dderbyniol i fusnesau a'r bobl drwy ymgynghoriad, a'i fod yn unol nid yn unig â—a chredaf y gallai'r Aelod fod yn cyfuno dwy ddeddfwriaeth—nid yn unig â Deddf llesiant cenedlaethau'r dyfodol, ond hefyd, yn hollbwysig, â Deddf yr amgylchedd yn ogystal.
Ond fel y dywedais, yn seiliedig ar y dystiolaeth a gyflwynwyd, yn fy marn i byddai lleihau neu ddiddymu'r doll teithwyr awyr, a denu mwy o deithwyr i Faes Awyr Caerdydd felly o feysydd awyr pellach, yn arwain at leihau allyriadau carbon ar y cyfan.