Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru

Welcome back to you all. 

Welcome back, everybody. 

Let's move on to this afternoon's business, and item 1, questions to the First Minister. The first question is from Gwyn Williams. 

Well, thank you for the question and, as the Llywydd did, I will welcome everyone back after the summer. I understand that it's been a very busy summer for everyone, but I do hope that everyone had an opportunity to relax too.

Our aim in establishing a Welsh public energy company is to make the best possible use of our energy resources as a nation, ensuring that energy becomes more affordable, cleaner, and that more of it is owned by us here in Wales. This will help communities, businesses and public services to make better use of the energy produced in Wales.

On 7 September, we launched a consultation on that, and I look forward to hearing the views of people on how we can better take advantage of Welsh energy for the benefit of communities and people in all parts of Wales.

A publicly owned energy company based in Swansea, with a focus on supporting community and local ownership would not just positively impact communities across Gŵyr Abertawe, but also across the wider Swansea bay area. The cost-of-living crisis has impacted many thousands of people in my constituency, made worse, of course, by the closure of the furnaces over in Port Talbot, which is not so far away. Swansea has the second biggest tidal range in the world, and the city's proximity to the electric arc furnace across the bay will be an integral part of our transition to net zero. So, if it is based in Swansea, it would also provide a tangible future of sustainable careers that future generations can look forward to. With these exciting points in mind, will Swansea be considered for the potential headquarters of a community public energy company for Wales? Diolch yn fawr. 

I congratulate the Member on a shameless, but very, very well meaning and important plug on behalf of his constituents, and I'm sure many of you are thinking along similar lines right now. What the Member does do, of course, importantly, is reflect on the economic challenges in the area that he represents, and we will always, as a Government, seek to create opportunities for innovation and growth and job opportunities in every single part of our nation. And that will be one of the founding principles of the new development agency that we are in the process of establishing. 

The proposed new company is built around Trydan Gwyrdd Cymru, which is currently headquartered in Merthyr Tydfil. But it also has staff in other areas of Wales, and, crucially, it will be there to serve all parts of Wales and to make gains for communities wherever they are in our nation. 

The UK has the highest industrial electricity prices in the world, north Wales paying the highest electric standing charges in Britain, and south Wales, in my constituency, pays above the average. Politicians trying to control the energy market isn't going to fix this. The problem is the cost of net zero, loaded onto working families through their bills. A combination of green taxes and regulations have led us down this path of rising bills and job losses—just look at Port Talbot, for example. So, First Minister, can you confirm that all forms of energy will be supported by this body? Otherwise, how many more Welsh jobs will have to go before this Government admits its net-zero targets are being paid for by the people who can least afford it?

I think the point I would make is that high energy prices are not as a result of a pursuit of net zero. They're not as a result of the determination that we must have—every one of us—to tackle the scourge of climate change. And we know the cost of not tackling climate change. We saw it in the wildfires that scorched so much of Wales over this summer. I hope I can persuade the Member that what we should be doing is seeking as much control as possible over how we generate electricity in Wales, how we reap the benefits of those projects in Wales, and having energy devolved to Wales as part of our toolkit as a nation to look after businesses and communities alike.

Jane Dodds.

Thank you very much, and good afternoon, First Minister. 

I welcome the emphasis in the consultation on increasing community energy, and I think it's shameful and shameless of Reform UK to abandon—[Interruption.] It's my job—to abandon and just to sideline net zero. The world is on fire. As the First Minister has said, you just needed to look and see and talk to the communities that we represent over the summer just to see how bad it is.

To get back to the very good point raised by Gwyn in relation to the community energy issues, I was lucky enough to visit Hwb y Gors in the Amman valley, where community-owned wind turbines have paid for the renovation of the community centre there. But it took 10 years to secure planning permission, and we need to make it much easier for our communities to be able to own community energy. So, Prif Weinidog, what will you and the Government do to make sure that we accelerate this, so that, actually, communities can own that community energy and ensure that they see the benefits and we stop the world being on fire? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

The Member is quite right, of course, about the need to accelerate our mission here, to make the most of the natural resources that we have and to take seriously our responsibilities when it comes to tackling climate change. This is what it's about—setting up a new organisation that can move more swiftly, that can look at how to work on commercial projects of a larger scale and with community energy, because it's all going to be in the mix. Climate change, and tackling climate change, is a responsibility for every single Minister in this Government. So, yes, it will involve planning, it will involve the energy Minister, it will involve the housing Minister, and so on. Where is she? She's over there. So, this is something that's owned by all of Government.

The Member is quite right, of course, on Reform. In denying climate change, they are acting against the interests of the people of Wales. In denying or wanting to curtail employment rights, they are acting against the interests of workers the length and breadth of our nation. Reform is not a party that has the interests of Wales at heart in any way, shape or form.

I welcome this timely question from the Member, on the same day my Government publishes plans to cut business rates by 30 per cent for pubs, restaurants, cafes, bars, licensed clubs, hotels, gyms and cinemas. More broadly, through Business Wales, we provide advice and growth support to businesses. Targeted investment in local infrastructure and funding is helping to revitalise Bangor city centre specifically. We have also established that town-centre taskforce we promised we would as part of our 100-day commitment to drive investment, increase footfall and support local businesses to grow.

Your Government launched the town-centre taskforce in Bangor. Neither of the co-chairs are from the city and no Bangor trader has been named to it. The £654,000 announced that day is for an event space at Storiel, not for the high street, where shops are empty and the pavement is broken by lorries. How does the taskforce actually support local businesses on Bangor high street?

I know very, very well the challenges faced by Bangor high street. It was my high street growing up, and I'm determined that when we look at Bangor, and all the other high streets throughout Wales, we have a clear focus on using all the tools at our disposal to support them. The town-centre taskforce, I remind him, is for all high streets. There has been specific assistance, to the tune of over £600,000, announced for Bangor in recent months, and I don't imagine that that is something that the people of Bangor are unhappy about. But it's always part of a range of measures that we can take as a Government. That announcement today of the 30 per cent cut in business rates is determinedly targeted at helping high streets like Bangor, through supporting those businesses that bring vibrancy, that bring life to those high streets. This is a Government from the get-go that is showing that we are determined to act on the promises that we made, and Bangor, like many other towns the length and breadth of Wales, will benefit from that.

Small businesses are the backbone of our local economy in Bangor Conwy Môn. A clear example of this in Bangor is Antoniazzi's cafe, which has been a prominent presence on the high street for 92 years now. In recent conversations with a number of businesses recently, the same request often rose, namely a fair deal on business rates, and I look forward to hearing the finance Minister's statement later on this afternoon about that. But does the First Minister agree with me that the Plaid Cymru Government’s commitment to adjust business rates in favour of our independent small businesses will give them the confidence to grow and invest, breathing new life into our town centres in the process?

Thank you for the question. Of course, Antoniazzi's is a well-established business of almost 100 years' standing. What we will see outlined by the Cabinet Minister for Finance this afternoon will be truly significant. SMEs are the backbone of our economy, and we've made it clear, particularly through the Cabinet Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy, that we are determined to support and grow indigenous Welsh businesses and to ensure that successful businesses continue in Welsh ownership, giving them the confidence to invest in their future. The changes to non-domestic rates will be introduced as soon as possible, from the beginning of next year or the next financial year. They will be permanent, which, again, is a step that gives business confidence. I look forward to hearing the details from the Minister later this afternoon.

I thank you, John, for bringing this question, because it's really important that we don't allow Bangor high street to continue suffering as it is. When I was campaigning, and since, residents stated that there just are not enough shops, cafes or restaurants in the area. Now, I welcome the announcement of £654,000 of funding to reinvent struggling high streets in Wales, and in particular in Bangor, but some of the projects are for new street furniture and an amphitheatre. Businesses themselves are concerned as to how they will be involved in the spending. And if anyone's ever looked, when the previous Welsh Labour Government put funding grants into towns, it didn't make any difference whatsoever. Now, I note that I have previously asked, in terms of hospitality businesses, for VAT to come down to 10 per cent, and I'm pleased to say that one of your party members in Parliament is also making that call for VAT on hospitality businesses to drop to 10 per cent. Do you support her calls, and the calls of the Welsh Conservatives, to really help our tourism and hospitality businesses?

It is a call that I have made in the past. What I would say is that we have to engage in what the UK Government could do and balance that against other things that the UK Government could do, because it's the outcome that's important, isn't it? It's not what the measure is, it's how it helps. What I have to do is to look at what I have in my toolkit, and one of the things that we do have are the powers over non-domestic rates. We said that we would use those powers, and we've moved very, very quickly to make sure that we do, with this permanent change, this real vote of confidence in leisure and hospitality—pubs, cafes, things that really bring vibrancy to the high street. So, the UK Government needs to look at its house and see what it can do. We'll put pressure on them to act in a whole host of different ways. We're acting using the powers that we have.

I now call on the party leaders to question the First Minister. First, on behalf of Reform UK, Helen Jenner.

Diolch, Lywydd. Prif Weinidog, despite you repeatedly saying that the election was not about seeking independence, on your first day back from recess you met with the leaders of Sinn Féin and the Scottish National Party to discuss plans to break up the United Kingdom. This is an act for which you have no mandate. Over two thirds of people surveyed recently said that they did not want to see Wales ripped out of the United Kingdom, and this Chamber has a pro-union majority. During the election campaign, you said that you wouldn't be looking to pursue independence, but, clearly, despite there being no appetite for it, you are. First Minister, you recently supported a law to make it an offence for politicians to knowingly mislead the public. So, my question is, to you: did you knowingly mislead voters when you said that this election wasn't about independence?

Do you know what I had a mandate to pursue? What I had a mandate to pursue was the best for Wales, always. So, when I get together with like-minded leaders throughout these islands, looking at how we can work together on childcare, on energy, on the way that we put pressure on the UK Government on funding, I think that that is absolutely standing up for Wales, as the people of Wales put their trust in us to do. And, yes, at the same time, we set our ambition for the nation. I believe that this isn't as good as things can get for Wales. Is Westminster working particularly well for Wales? Two letters and a number: HS2. That's the injustice that we're facing. Is the two-child cap what we really think is in the interest of the people of Wales? And a party like Reform always things that Wales is too small. Where's the ambition? Well, you know what? Matthew Rhys—let's congratulate Matthew Rhys on his historic Emmys win last night and what he said in accepting those two awards:

'We are a small but mighty nation. This is incredible.'

Be more like Matthew.

First Minister, nobody is talking down the people of Wales. Nobody is talking down Wales here. In fact, the people of Wales have returned a pro-union majority to this Senedd. First Minister, the bottom line is you have no mandate for focusing on independence. What you should be focusing on is fixing our broken NHS and our failing education system. You promised, First Minister, to eliminate two-year waits within months, yet you've moved the goalposts and now two-year NHS waits are up around 60 per cent since you entered office.

And, First Minister, speaking as a former teacher, last week's Programme for International Student Assessment results were quite frankly embarrassing. A third of 15-year-olds in Wales aren't capable of basic maths or reading and are around two years behind their counterparts in England. As a former teacher in Wales, I can tell you that what teachers need are not more plans and reviews, they need action. A generation of youngsters are being failed by Plaid and Labour, and frankly you owe them all an apology. First Minister, will you stop focusing on plotting with Sinn Féin and focus on fixing our schools and our NHS?

I tell you what, Llywydd, if the Member thinks you can only do one thing at a time in Government, she should give up her aspirations right now, because it is all about dealing with a host of issues that are in the interests of building our nation. It is about doing the work that we've done over the summer to pump money into health and to change our attitude on how we bring those waiting times down. It is about the numeracy and literacy strategy that is being published today by my Minister for education. And when it comes to this pursuit of more powers, which Reform absolutely rejects, let's remind the Member that it's because of powers taken on around a decade ago over non-domestic rates that we are now able to make a positive decision to help businesses in Wales through a cut of a third in the rates for businesses in hospitality and leisure. We have our eyes on the future of Wales, and I suggest that the Member opposite does the same.

First Minister, it wasn't really a great summer for Plaid Cymru, was it? You couldn't pass your budget, it failed to put Welsh people first, and then you failed to act in time when we faced those wildfires. Like everything else in Wales, you lost control of it.

Then there was the Government alert we all received. Whose idea was it to send an emergency alert in two separate messages, rather than one bilingual message to avoid confusion? You attended a COBRA meeting with the Prime Minister about all this. The alert was meant to avoid disaster, but in and of itself it created disaster. It sent some people into panic and sent some people to ring 999. Why couldn't it have gone out in one bilingual message? Either you were to blame, or, once again, Westminster was ignoring you and not taking you seriously. Which one is it?

I'll tell you what, all the Reform stereotypes are coming out today. There is a UK Government responsibility for the emergency alert. And do you know what, did they get it right? Clearly they didn't get it right. There was a technical issue about the way that it was sent out and that caused anxiety for people. I've spoken with COBRA myself to say, 'You need to sort this out for the future', because this is for the UK Government. But doesn't it say everything about Reform and its attitude towards Wales that your position on this is to blame the Welsh language, which wasn't at fault?

Leader of Welsh Labour, Ken Skates.

Diolch. First Minister, obviously building a progressive alliance means working together in common cause, but signing a memorandum of disunity with those who wish to break up and ruin the United Kingdom will only please people like Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin. It will not please the vast majority of people in Wales, including the many health visitors who are here today. Those health visitors feel snubbed by your Government. Those health visitors are questioning the integrity of your Government after being promised an end to their dispute over pay within days of May's election. First Minister, will you please use powers available to you in law to bring an end to this dispute, an end that was promised before the election?

The Member is right to draw attention to a dispute that causes real frustration. It's certainly something that I feel. It's a dispute that we inherited, of course, from the previous administration. What is clear, as the former Labour First Minister said, is that this is something that can be resolved only by the health service itself. I know the efforts that my health Minister has put into trying to influence the health service to get to that point where we have a resolution. We need this to be resolved for the people served by that health board and for the nurses who want to care for their patients. And I again call today for that resolution to happen as swiftly as possible, because it's not acceptable for this to be pursued this long.  

First Minister, I agree it is not acceptable and health visitors should have had justice within the first 100 days of your Government being elected. Yes, you've inherited this challenge, but during the election many of your Members were telling those health visitors that it would be resolved with direct intervention within days—within days. They now question the integrity of your Government and they say that they voted for your party on the basis of what they now believe was a false promise.

Now, they're not the only people to have been snubbed. Over the summer, a number of organisations, communities and people have been snubbed—you might call it 'summer snubbing'. But it's affected the Prime Minister, it's affected Michael Sheen, it's affected countless communities that were left devastated by the wildfires. All snubbed. But please can I urge you not to snub those who wish to see a £2 bus fare cap introduced in Wales? Andy Burnham has provided you with the consequentials to do so. It was a pledge in Welsh Labour's manifesto, and I do believe that if you implement that policy, it would demonstrate to the people of Wales that common ground that we can occupy to make people's lives better.

There is quite a lot to unpick in that question. There is a reference there to the need to work in a consensual way. I start this term in the way that I started the first term post election in making it very, very clear that this is a Government that wants to reach out and work in a way that serves the people of Wales in a constructive way. So, I make that point.

We're a Government that hit the ground running with a 100-day plan that we were able to deliver on, setting the foundations for what will be the programme for government to be presented in the very near future. This is a Government that takes seriously the faith put in us by the people of Wales, dealing with many different challenges, because the Member knows governing isn't always easy. It is about prioritising, but the more that we can work together, have clarity in what we are trying to achieve for the people of Wales, well, the better our chances of giving them the outcomes that they deserve. It has been a very, very busy summer of working with many, many partners in making sure that we move forward with real purpose.

Leader of the Welsh Conservatives, Darren Millar. 

First Minister, yesterday, while you were plotting the break-up of the United Kingdom with your friends in Sinn Féin and the Scottish National Party, there were people waiting for ambulances for too long, people in our emergency departments for too long on trolleys and not getting the treatment that they need in time, because of a lack of hospital beds around the country. Just last week, Healthcare Inspectorate Wales published a damning report into the emergency department at the Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board's Glan Clwyd Hospital. It cited patients being left in corridors without food or drink or pain relief, out-of-date medicines and equipment not working, and the paediatric area being left unattended while child patients were present. So, instead of hatching plans to break apart the UK, isn't it time that you focused on your day job and showed some urgency to fix our NHS instead?

I reflect today on this cabal of stagnation that Reform, the Conservatives and Labour have when it comes to moving Wales forward. Moving Wales forward and seeking practical answers to our problems means learning from others when it comes to the future of the health service, the future of the education service in Wales, and that's what this Government does. We will find partners where we have common ground always.

On the issues around Glan Clwyd, I absolutely share the concern raised by the leader of the Conservatives. The Cabinet Minister for Health and Care met with the chair and chief executive of the health board recently in Ysbyty Glan Clwyd. He set out his expectations of owning issues and making the improvements required by the people they serve. And yet again, we have further examples of those deep challenges facing Betsi Cadwaladr that affect patients, and that is what should affect every single one of us. That is why we have, since the summer, or at the end of the summer recess, published our plans on how we change the NHS's attitudes towards getting people through the system, not being wasteful in the way that we use our resources, because we are determined to act on our promise in this election to make health the No. 1 priority, because I think that’s the No. 1 priority of the people of Wales. 

You say that it's your No. 1 priority, and you say that you want to co-operate with others in order to improve the NHS. I looked very carefully at the declaration that you signed yesterday alongside those other nationalist leaders, and let me tell you, there was no mention of the health service. There was no mention of the national health service in any way, shape or form whatsoever. There was no mention, either, of our education system, and as has already been pointed out, it's hardly surprising, given that we've got the worst education system in the whole of the United Kingdom, and that Scotland's education system is also tumbling down the PISA scores, as is Northern Ireland’s. Why don't you co-operate on the things for which you're absolutely already responsible instead of having these pie-in-the-sky discussions, grandstanding over the constitution of the United Kingdom rather than pulling your finger out and doing the job that the people of Wales elected you to do?

Let me tell you this, First Minister: the honeymoon is well and truly over. While you were sunning yourself on a beach, presumably burying your head in the sand on it, on the 100-day anniversary of your Government, people in Wales were dying in our hospitals and young people were not getting the education they need. When will they see the change rather than the continuity Labour that we've seen so far?

When will we see a change in the Conservatives from the whingeing that we always hear from their benches on these matters, rather than working constructively? We have an offer here to work constructively, to seek ideas, and that includes from you, as the leader of the Conservatives, on the future of our public services here in Wales.

This Government set out a programme that was given a mandate, not with a majority, but with a clear mandate to deliver for the people of Wales. And that means on health, which is why my health Minister worked so quickly to pump that money in, which will bring down those waiting times as the people of Wales deserve. It’s why we moved quickly to put that national numeracy and literacy scheme in place, which will drive up education standards, because I agree with you: it is scandalous, the way that we have allowed standards to drop here in Wales, with our proud record of educational achievement. We do this at the same time as setting an ambition for having more control over our own future here as a nation in Wales. 

Question 3, Adrian Mason.

How to follow that? A declaration of interest: my wife works for Bangor University, Llywydd.

Tuition fees are set by higher education institutions, and eligible students receive loans to meet the full cost of their tuition. The Welsh Government will consider fees alongside the long-term sustainability of higher education itself in our independent review of higher education, and the Deputy Minister for Skills and Tertiary Education will provide further details later this afternoon. 

Thank you, First Minister. The figures are clear and unambiguous. England has already set its tuition fee cap at just over £10,000. At the same time, Welsh universities are under severe financial pressure. The sector recorded an underlying deficit of more than £79 million according to Medr, while Bangor University alone reported a deficit of nearly £19 million, alongside redundancies. And the number of Welsh students studying at Welsh universities has fallen by about 9 per cent since 2021, the largest percentage fall of any UK nation.

Universities need certainty if they’re to plan staffing, courses and investment responsibly. They are on their beam ends, quite frankly. So, will the First Minister give the sector some certainty today? Will the Welsh tuition fee cap remain in line with England for the rest of the Senedd term, yes or no, please?

I genuinely appreciate the way that the question has been framed, because I align myself with that description of the fragility of the higher education sector in Wales. It's something that should worry us all for the future of education and learning itself, for the impact that that has on the Welsh economy and research, also on the jobs that are supported by our higher education sector. But of course, we also want to support the students who are the future of those jobs, and those jobs in the sector itself. It is a balance, and what we have said is that we need to find that balance, and I'll remind you what Plaid Cymru, the party I lead, has said throughout: this is something that we need consensus on. This is something that's far too important to be allowed to be used as some sort of political ding-dong, because I hope I'm looking at everybody in this Chamber and seeing fellow Members who want to see our students supported appropriately and our higher education institutions survive and prosper.

On the fees cap, no decision has been announced yet on Welsh tuition fee caps or fee loan support for 2027-28. We're considering how best to support students while maintaining the higher education sector in Wales. That is a balance that we all need to think carefully about.

First Minister, over the summer, I met with the Open University, who do brilliant work in ensuring education is accessible to everyone, if that's the path that they wish to pursue. Their fees remain below the maximum borrowing amount, simply because if fee rates were too high, the number of students would decline. With almost a quarter of people in Wales living in relative income poverty, the Open University is a fantastic institution through which education, career development and personal growth are viable opportunities. So, I would like to ask how you will ensure that people in Wales have access to higher education without being held back by ever-increasing loans.

It is an issue that potential students are having to reckon with more and more. I was stopped by a young gentleman yesterday who was excited at seeing a politician and wanted a picture. He was studying for a politics, philosophy and economics degree at the Open University and it was working really well for him. He was working still whilst he was doing his degree. We know that the Open University and other providers of part-time courses play an important role in widening access to higher education and supporting flexible learning opportunities. This review of higher education will look at all aspects of higher education, including access to part-time provision.

First Minister, the Treasury Committee in the House of Commons came forward with a report over the summer that highlighted 28 recommendations to the UK Government, two of which really stood out as very simplistic, but having a big effect. One was around supplying good-quality information to students at the time of accepting their student loan, which you would have thought would be happening already, but isn't happening. And secondly, instead of using the retail prices index, use the consumer prices index, which again would have a significant effect of lowering the interest rates. Would your Government be supportive of adopting these recommendations to make a quick win in a complex field? Obviously, your review is looking at the higher education sector more generally, but students need help today, not in six, 12 or 18 months.

It's not a matter that I have discussed specifically with the Deputy Minister for Skills and Tertiary Education, but it's certainly something that I'm willing to look at and see where our position would be. At the end of the day, I'm really concerned about the impact of the debts that students go into. I have just one student left in our family now, but two ex-students who are living with debt. Many of us either are living with debts ourselves or are parents of those who are, and it's something that really concerns us. In brief, I want every potential avenue to be looked at that could take the pressure off students now or potential students in future. Thank you.

We recognise that people waiting for cataract surgery want treatment as quickly as possible, obviously. That is why we've committed an additional £145 million this year to reduce waiting times, improve access and support clinically led service transformation across Wales. We're also taking forward plans for new surgical hubs, to increase clinical capacity and help more patients receive treatment sooner, including those waiting for cataract surgery.

Diolch, First Minister. Despite your Government's investment, including the use of higher cost private providers, and the appointment of a Deputy Minister for Public and Preventative Health, my constituents still face long waits and last-minute cancellations of cataract operations. What long-term action will the Welsh Government take to train more eye surgeons and increase capacity to meet the growing demand from an ageing population, including patients with glaucoma or diabetic retinopathy and those needing regular eye injections to prevent avoidable blindness?

It's one of those areas where you need rapid treatment in order to avoid more permanent damage. We have two ophthalmologists sitting here in the Senedd Chamber who know far more than I do. The Member referenced the bringing in of private providers. That has a role to play. But the big change in emphasis under this Government is not using that as a backstop and instead building up the kind of capacity that can make reductions in waiting times and a smoother passage of patients through the system more sustainable. I'd point to that as being the main element of what we're trying to do here. Details have been provided by the Minister as we've rolled out these new approaches in the first 100 days. I'm confident that that is the kind of long-term thinking that we need.

I'll refer Members, first of all, to my declaration of interest as a shareholder in a company renting out a domestic property.

Strengthening the private rented sector is a priority for this Government. I think we've made that pretty clear; we set it out in my legislative statement on 14 July. Renters in Wales deserve a safe, warm, secure and affordable home and should feel confident challenging poor conditions. Positive change requires good law, and in the first phase of our legislative programme we'll deliver legislation that protects tenants and tackles poor landlords, making renting, hopefully, more secure.

Thank you. First Minister, we know that immigration increases demand on housing, which, in turn, leads to increased rents. So, can the First Minister confirm that any planned changes to private and social renters' protections will be prioritised for Welsh people over recent arrivals?

As I've pointed out many times in this Chamber, we have many pressures on housing. Those pressures, when we look at the big picture, do not come from recent arrivals from overseas. I think it's important to home in on those facts. But there are pressures, and we will always want to make sure that our housing stock is adequate in numbers, that the housing stock quality is of a decent level, which people should be able to gain confidence from. But also, we need to look at the question of affordability. We have a two-phased approach in terms of legislation, and affordability will very much be a part of our considerations. I've invited Members here to contribute to the development of legislation, and if there's an interest across this Chamber in those affordability issues, let's discuss them.

Prif Weinidog, private renting has become increasingly unaffordable, with many households now spending a really unsustainable amount of their income simply on keeping a roof over their heads. Recent Citizens Advice data has shown that some people are spending up to 70 per cent of their income on rent alone. In Cardiff, there are instances of rents more than doubling now, with just two months' notice. As a consequence, homelessness services are facing increased demand, not only because people are being evicted from their homes, but because council support with rent is also insufficient, placing greater pressure on social housing and temporary accommodation. Does the First Minister agree with me that spending more than two thirds of an individual's income on rent is not acceptable, and that limiting annual rent increases is essential?

You don't have to think very hard to work out the poverty that somebody is driven into in real terms when they have so little of their income left after paying their rent. In terms of the issues that cause that, there's a multitude of them. Supply of homes is one of them, and social housing. That's why we are determined to bring in an extra 20,000 additional social homes by 2030. It's about bringing homes into use that are currently not in use. It's about raising the quality of the housing stock as well.

And then there are things, as I've said, that we can do through legislation. Actively exploring different measures for regulating increases in rent, for example, effectively is really important. We can look at what's happening in Scotland. There are learnings from Catalonia too. It's important that we look at what works well, and also look at potential drawbacks. But significant steps need considerable policy development, evidence gathering, and cross-party and cross-sector engagement, which is why we have outlined our ambition to bring forward that second renters Bill as part of a two-phase legislative approach.

There's a shortage of housing available for renting. There's an even greater shortage of housing available at affordable rents. The long-term solution is to build more social housing, especially council housing. I have supported rent controls and the return of rent officers for privately rented properties. But we now have a new, very serious problem, Airbnb, which is taking properties out of the private rented sector. This is not a seaside and holiday resort problem only. It is also a problem in cities. What action is the Welsh Government going to take to limit Airbnb in each council area?

The Member makes a very good point, and it's an international problem. We have seen some big cities take action on Airbnb. We tend in Wales to look at the more popular seaside areas, because that's where the problems are perceived to be more acute. But the Member is absolutely right that this is an issue that can arise anywhere. I (a) agree that it's an issue, and (b) want us to look at all those solutions that can be put in place. Some have been introduced through co-operation between our parties in the last Government—changes that lead to changing behaviour through use of premiums on council tax and so on. But there are also planning changes that we should always be alive to considering, because I agree this is a significant issue. The main purpose of a house, a flat or an apartment is to be a home, and we should always bear that in mind.

These PISA results are, to say the least, deeply disappointing. They underline to me the scale of the challenge that we face. They reinforce this Government’s determination to take a new and rigorous approach to raising standards. We'll be unapologetically ambitious for every learner, setting clear targets, holding ourselves accountable for delivering them, because raising standards has to be a priority. Today, we publish that foundational literacy and numeracy plan that I have previously referenced to accelerate improvement across Wales in every classroom, because our children and families in Wales deserve nothing less.

Thank you for your response, First Minister, but the issues you've outlined are part of the reason why Members in this place and the public at large are so frustrated with your obsessive pursuit of independence when what you should be doing is focusing on these issues in the classrooms to support our children for the best outcomes possible. Wales is falling behind every other UK nation in maths, reading and science, with the gap particularly stark when compared with England. You rightfully want to work with other countries and co-operate and learn from them. Why don't you learn from England as to how they are doing so well with their education outcomes compared with our children here in Wales?

If we're serious about driving up those standards, we have to also address what is happening in our classrooms. We've heard time and time again from Estyn and the teaching unions as to poor behaviour as an issue in our classrooms. We've been clear that teachers need to be properly supported, schools need a stronger approach to discipline, so that teachers can teach and pupils can learn without unnecessary disruption. Given these disappointing PISA results, First Minister, will you accept that improving discipline, supporting teachers and restoring high expectations in our classrooms must be at the heart of any plan to raise educational standards?

Given the importance of education, I'm surprised that he wasted some of his question discussing constitutional issues, frankly. We have a determination as a Government to look to our track record historically as a proud educating nation—one of the first generally literate populations anywhere in the world. That's something that makes me very proud. I was proud to have two parents that were educationalists, two teaching union presidents. I was brought up with the importance of getting education right and giving our children and young people opportunities right there surrounding me at all times.

I'm desperately disappointed at the PISA results. The measures that we are putting in place around numeracy and literacy, supporting teachers, supporting families and children, are all about raising outcomes. I hope that one of the results of that will be increased PISA scores. There's a global downturn in PISA scores, incidentally. Digitalisation and artificial intelligence might be a part of that. But England has bucked the trend and, absolutely, we should be, and we are making plans already to learn from England about what's happening there. My co-operation isn't exclusively with Scotland and Northern Ireland. I point that out—we work with Ministers in UK Government and internationally too, and on this one, it's because we need to raise standards. And the outcome that we need, of course—better PISA scores would be good—would be raised educational standards: numeracy, literacy, the basics, the foundations of successful lives and careers for our young people. That's what we're aiming for, and we're confident that we're putting the building blocks in place.

Now, we're doing well, but at the risk of disappointing some Members, we're going to see how far we can get down the order paper and get to the questions that are here, so—.

We move now to question 7, Elyn Stephens. 

Supporting the steel industry and the communities across Wales that depend on it is a priority for this Government. Ahead of the Prime Minister's recent visit to Port Talbot, the Deputy First Minister spoke publicly about the need for Wales to receive its fair share of the UK Government's steel fund. There was a meeting between the two. That, of course, would help workers and communities through the transition period, and we will continue to make that case as strongly as possible in ongoing discussions with the UK Government.

Diolch. Prif Weinidog, as you mentioned, the Prime Minister came to Port Talbot last month, promising re-industrialisation and good, secure jobs. The UK's own steel strategy says that Wales is expected to account for around half of the UK's steel-making capacity, yet just days after the Prime Minister's visit, his Government was asked two very straightforward questions: how much of its £2.5 billion steel commitment had been spent or allocated and how much of that had been spent in Wales? It could provide a figure for neither. So, I have to ask the question: what will actually change for Port Talbot since Andy Burnham's visit? And I'm sure I know part of the answer, but will you press him for a firm commitment that Port Talbot receives its fair share of that £2.5 billion?

The Member is right to voice frustrations about what did or didn't come out of that investment. The purpose of it was changed at one point, but one thing we made clear from our position—we still make it clear from Government—is that we must get our fair share of that. We have taken a massive hit to the steel industry here in Wales because UK Governments took their eyes off the ball and didn't act when they should have done.

Welsh Government will work with companies, UK Government and the national wealth fund, which now has control over that £2.5 billion, to explore how support can be maximised and must be maximised for our steel communities across Wales. Let me be clear, if there is investment being made in the steel sector, UK Government must set out clearly how they plan to support the Welsh steel industry, which is what is important to us here.

I know that this will have been a particularly upsetting time for those affected. The immediate workforce issue affecting the service has now been resolved—that's the positive news—enabling planning to start for the resumption of the service, on a phased basis, from 22 September. It is important to note that patients already receiving treatment also were unaffected by the pause and continued their treatment in the usual way. But this has been a difficult time for a number of people. 

Thank you for your answer, First Minister. It is positive that the system is being started again, but a lot of those people who said their treatment wasn't affected were actually affected, because if you were waiting for frozen embryo transfer, people were told that their treatment was not starting. So, there was miscommunication there from the health board that did cause a lot of upset for a number of families right the way across the country, because, as you know, that centre covers a huge geographical area, all the way from west Wales, east Wales, south Wales and all the way up to Llandrindod Wells.

First Minister, we never want to be in this situation again, because it is a traumatic time, not just for the mothers and the fathers, but for everyone going through a fertility journey. So, what can the Welsh Government do to make sure there is resilience in this service, to make sure people are not waiting years and years and years—which people are—for their fertility journey, because people have a body clock, and if we cannot get this system started soon enough, a lot of people across this country will never have the families that they hope to start?

That word 'resilience' is important. We use 'sustainability'. They mean very much the same when it comes to something like this: having services that are stable. In this particular case, the pause was necessary in order to comply with the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority licensing requirement. So, a clinical issue, but the impact, of course, is a very human issue. We will do what we can to build resilience across those services. For the individuals affected here, the health board has now started contacting patients, I understand, to confirm the next steps in their treatment pathway. The Wales Fertility Institute is continuing to work on the wider workforce challenges, working with the joint commissioning committee to explore possibilities for, perhaps, interim support options to comply with those licensing requirements, which are a must; these aren't optional. Work is also ongoing to strengthen, as you say, the resilience and sustainability of the service, both within the health board itself and in conjunction with that relationship that it has with the joint commissioning committee. That work will continue. Yes, there are short-term things to do, but that will continue beyond the short term too.

This Government is committed to pressing the case for a fairer funding settlement for Wales. That means a number of different things. When I met the Prime Minister in Glasgow in July, I emphasised the need for the historic underfunding of Wales to be addressed. On Thursday, we will be hosting the Finance: Interministerial Standing Committee, bringing together finance Ministers from right across the UK, if that's okay with everyone.

Funding reform is a key priority for the Cabinet Minister for Finance, and in her bilateral meeting with the Chief Secretary to the Treasury that day she will raise a number of priorities, which include delivering the £14 billion promise on rail, a formal review of the fiscal framework and the Barnett formula. I will also make this case directly to the Prime Minister when we meet again in October. 

I funded businesses for over 40 years. To succeed, a business needs two things, essentially: the ability to borrow and the ability to save. Running a country is no different. Without the financial tools to construct a functioning economy, Wales will continue to be poor. Is this the Wales that we all want for our children? Wales is being pickpocketed. You mentioned about rail. HS2: we're footing the bill for infrastructure projects in England whilst ours crumble. And why? The Barnett formula gives us less per head than our Northern Irish and Scottish counterparts. Why? Demanding fair funding is not us taking the begging bowl to London, nor is it grievance politics. It's common sense and the bare minimum to stop ingrained, intergenerational poverty, which plagues Wales. It doesn't have to be this way. We have the entrepreneurs, we have the people, the skills and the resources. Wales can be prosperous.

First Minister, following your meeting yesterday with the Ministers of Northern Ireland and Scotland, would you please outline your long-term vision of what a real Government can achieve economically in Wales with the right economic levers?

I'm grateful for the question. Right across the UK, we should be—. There is an interest in making sure that when the Treasury makes decisions on spending they are made fairly. It relates to Scotland, it relates to Northern Ireland, it also relates to regions of England. What I will do as the First Minister of Wales, with my team, with your backing here hopefully, is make the case always for us to get that fair funding package.

That does include all those different elements: giving us the borrowing powers; giving us the right to be able to draw down from our reserves; making sure that the overall package under Barnett actually works for us; making sure that where there is a lack of powers—on rail, for example—that that doesn't mean we end up £5 billion out of pocket on HS2. There are fundamental unfairnesses right across the board. The Cabinet Minister for Finance will reinforce those points with the UK Treasury later this week. We look forward to working positively with them in helping them to recognise the value of devolution and giving us the tools to do the job that we're here to do.

Strengthening the governance of the NHS is very, very important for my health team and all of us in Government, with actions having already been undertaken as part of the first 100 days plan. This includes ensuring patients have full confidence that concerns will be heard, that they'll be investigated quickly and used, crucially, to improve care. A new national clinical governance framework to improve clinical governance across NHS Wales will be published early in 2027, bringing together those issues of safeguarding, patient safety, quality improvement and organisational learning to support safer services and greater accountability too.

Thank you. The Welsh Gender Service has been subject to an independent clinical review because NHS Wales commissioners identified concerns about the appropriateness of referrals and the robustness of clinical governance and patient safeguards, yet 26 of your own backbenchers have publicly objected to the clinically led pause. There is not a modicum of evidence that this Welsh Government and Plaid Cymru have demonstrated that patient safety comes before ideology. So, if the independent review concludes that the Welsh Gender Service's current assessment process must fundamentally change or that some referrals should not have proceeded, will you guarantee—'yes' or 'no'—that your Government will accept the clinicians' conclusions in full, without political interference from Ministers, backbenchers or campaign groups, even if those conclusions are politically inconvenient? 'Yes' or 'no'?

We've made it very, very clear that, yes, this will be judged on clinical evidence. That's what this is about. This hasn't been about Ministers making decisions, this has been the joint commissioning committee. There's a real irony, though, isn't there, about this throwing of an accusation of behaving in an ideological way when we have extreme ideology from the Reform benches here, not interested at all in the anxiety caused by this pause in services for some very, very vulnerable people, many of whom have been ably represented by Members of my party and, no doubt, others too.

Let's remember who is at the heart of issues like this—people who are feeling that they are paying the price for the failure of a health system. What we need to make sure is that we have a review to understand exactly what has happened based on clinical evidence. That's what everybody wants to see happening, whilst supporting the trans community in the process.

In our first 100 days, our national support programme for curriculum and assessment design has provided expert coaching and learning through national events to, I understand, over 250 schools and 340 practitioners across Wales. We have committed to reviewing the curriculum for Wales so that we can be clear that it ensures every learner benefits from high standards and excellent teaching always.

First Minister, relationships and sexuality education, RSE, is mandatory for every learner aged three to 16, and, bizarrely, no Government opt-out is available for parents wishing to withdraw their children. That places an exceptional duty on your Government to ensure it is delivered consistently, sensitively and by properly trained staff. Yet Estyn's review found limited specialist development, lower staff confidence in teaching sensitive aspects of RSE and inconsistent local authority support, while schools remain responsible for designing their own RSE curriculum within the Government's mandatory code. If RSE is too important for parents to opt out, surely the Government cannot opt out of its duty. Estyn's findings represent a serious failure to fulfil that duty. The Government's failure to fulfil its duty to parents and children needs immediate rectification. As you cannot guarantee consistent provision, will you give responsibility back to parents to allow an opt-out, particularly for very young children?

I think it's always important, where there are contentious issues or issues of concern to parents, that they are given reassurance at all times. The first thing to say is that whilst, yes, RSE is mandatory for three to 16-year-olds, it's not the same relationship and sexuality education for pupils from three to 16. RSE is legally required to be developmentally appropriate. That is the point—helping our children and young people through their lives, at the right time, to learn about the world around them, the relationships that they have with others. It must be factual. It must be pluralistic. It means that schools must present a range of views held in society, not push a particular view. These are the reassurances that are important for parents to hear, and the Government will always make sure that the information is available to them. If not, we'll up our game.

And finally, First Minister, question 12, Lis McLean. 

Congratulations on getting to the end of the question list. It's incredible. Thank you.

[Inaudible.]—question 12, you don't prepare.

I honestly didn't expect it. [Laughter.]

It's a lesson. [Laughter.] In 2026–27, we are providing £9.1 million to Third Sector Support Wales, helping organisations access support on volunteering, governance, sustainable funding and engagement.

The voluntary sector and volunteers themselves will be critical in delivering the Government's priorities. This will include preventative healthcare, tackling child poverty, providing access to childcare, play provision, supporting young people into work. It's a long list. 

Thank you very much. When I worked in the third sector before coming here, I was fortunate enough to be part of consultations on community policy by the Building Communities Trust, and I have to say that that consultation with our communities was excellent, and I felt that I'd really had an opportunity to have an input into that. Can you just confirm that the Welsh Government will listen to that important input that communities have provided to that consultation?

I am very happy to confirm that. When we look across the range of the Government's work, we're looking at partnership. All of the ideas and all of that understanding doesn't just come from the Government's benches; it comes from engaging with others and listening to what works well, what doesn't work well, and what the frustrations or barriers are and so on.

When it comes to voluntary action, that includes all of our communities, and it's important that we do show that we are always a Government that listens. That doesn't always, of course, mean being able to give people exactly what they're asking for, but what you're looking for is that understanding from communities—and through that, voluntary organisations—about why we make the decisions that we make, and that they are always intended to be decisions that support community engagement in every way that we can. 

Diolch, Brif Weinidog. We got through quite a few questions there. My apologies to those I wasn't able to call, but we got a lot of questions in there, so diolch yn fawr iawn. 

We will now move on to item 2, the business statement and announcement. And I call on the Trefnydd, Heledd Fychan. 

Thank you, Llywydd. You will see that there are a number of statements that have been added to today's agenda. Following a request in the Business Committee today, the First Minister's statement has been extended to 60 minutes rather than the 45 previously stated. Draft Plenary business for the next three weeks is shown on the business statement, which is available to all Members electronically. 

Thank you very much. Llŷr Powell. 

Diolch, Lywydd. Trefnydd, may I ask for a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Rural Resilience and Sustainability on historic PCB dumping in Wales? In my own constituency, toxic waste was dumped in the Ty Llwyd quarry in Ynysddu, and, decades later, there's no formal determination that the site is contaminated land, and nothing has been published on the long-term plan, despite the fact that PCBs have been found on the site.

Last week, Michael Sheen told Parliament that the First Minister didn't take him up on his offer, but I know that Members here would be grateful if the Government could provide us with an opportunity to find out what plan the Welsh Government has for dealing with toxic waste dumping across Wales, because constituents of all of us have been living with this for too long now.

May I thank the Member for raising this important issue? I should state that I, for many years, have been involved with constituents in my own constituency in dealing with this issue, and I continue to do that as an individual Member. I'm sure that each and every one of us who saw that documentary, Buried, if they weren't aware of this previously, will have been shocked by the impact that this has had. And certainly, as you heard the First Minister stating earlier, in terms of Michael Sheen too, there will be further discussions happening. But this is a problem that has been known for a while and many people have been campaigning for many years. It is important that we as a Government do tackle and address this issue, and I'm pleased to be able to confirm that it is a priority of ours. We are now developing a pan-Wales strategy to restore post-industrial land, so that communities no longer face those possible risks. And I would ask every Member who has examples in their own constituency to become involved in that work with us.

Prynhawn da, Weinidog. Can I thank the Cabinet Minister for Rural Resilience and Sustainability for the statement he issued during recess on the issue I raised previously regarding pollution in the River Tawe? Constituents continue to contact me, raising concerns regarding the need to tackle pollution in our rivers, seas and lakes. I would therefore be grateful if the Minister would provide us with an update on the creation of the new Welsh water regulator, in giving Wales greater control over how our water and natural resources are managed and regulated. Diolch.

I thank the Member for raising an issue that's very important for many of our constituents and for many Members here. I would like to remind all Members that the Green Paper, 'Shaping the Future of Water Governance in Wales', which responds to recommendations made by the Independent Water Commission, has now, and that consultation, concluded. A summary of responses was published on 14 September, so very recently. We are considering the evidence and the views expressed carefully before making a decision on the next step of reform. Our aim, of course, is to ensure a regulatory framework that complies with the requirements of Wales, strengthens accountability and supports better outcomes for customers, communities and the environment. We will of course update all Senedd Members as that work proceeds.

Trefnydd, can I ask for a statement from the Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy on the funding of the Jobs Growth Wales+ programme? I've been made aware of some significant funding pressures in the programme, affecting, in particular, year 11 school leavers. Now, while this is part of the employability policies, it is part of the landscape of post-16 education and training. I know you'll agree with me that it's absolutely crucial that we support all young people to prevent them from becoming NEET—not in education, employment or training. I would welcome a statement from the Cabinet Minister setting out the funding position and details of any pressures. Diolch.

Thank you very much. Evidently, what the Member raised is an issue that is discussed regularly by the Cabinet. This is a priority for all of us as elected Members, I would hope. Certainly, I will make the Cabinet Minister aware of your request. We will of course be updating the Senedd in terms of the work that's proceeding as well.

I'd like to call for a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Education and the Welsh Language on education provision in mid Wales in light of the release of the latest Programme for International Student Assessment results. These results should be a wake-up call for the Welsh Government. Wales is the worst-performing nation in reading, mathematics and science, and, this year, Welsh pupils fell even further behind their peers across the UK and internationally. Those national failures are reflected locally, with Estyn judging Powys County Council's education services to be causing significant concern. While confidence in state education is declining, Labour's VAT raid on private schools has forced the closure of seven Welsh independent schools in the past year alone, driving a further divide and an increase in education inequality. Since the Welsh Government's election in May, there's been very little action on state education. So, when will the Government change course? Can the Minister commit to prioritising a genuinely results-driven approach, where success is measured by whether Welsh children are actually achieving better outcomes?

I thank the Member for raising this issue. I don't know whether you were in the Chamber to hear the First Minister's response and have had an opportunity to see that there is a statement later this afternoon by the Minister with responsibility for education on the publication of the foundational literacy and numeracy plan. I think that the First Minister's statements were unambiguous about this how we consider these results, and, of course, I would encourage every Member, if there are specific issues within your constituency that are causing you concern, to engage with the Minister for education directly. 

Trefnydd, I'd like to request a statement from the Welsh Government on the availability of non-emergency hospital transport. I've received significant representations from constituents over the summer who have been left without transport to take them to important hospital appointments. Now, some of my constituents have had their transport cancelled at very short notice and, as a result, they've had to spend a small fortune on taxis to get them to their appointments. Now, some of these constituents, as you can imagine, are elderly, with limited mobility and little support. And, as I'm sure you can imagine, these cancellations have left many patients frustrated, anxious, and, quite frankly, this is not how the Welsh NHS should be operating in the twenty-first century. Therefore, I'd be grateful if we could have a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care on the performance of patient transport across Wales so that we can understand what the Welsh Government is doing to improve this vital service.

Well, may I thank you as a Member for raising this important issue? I'm terribly sorry to hear about that impact on your constituents. We're also aware of what that means in terms of missed appointments, with many people having to wait a long time for such appointments. Certainly, I will make the Minister aware of what you've raised this afternoon. I do hope that, if you do have specific examples too, that you raise those with the health board directly, and certainly with the Minister too. So I will feed that back to him following this session.

As has already been referred to, you'll be aware that a documentary titled Buried was broadcast over the summer, looking into allegations around the burying of PCBs, toxic chemicals that don't break down but build up in the environment, animals, fish and people over time. These chemicals were buried in at least 12 sites in Wales, including near Ruabon, Cefn Mawr and the Llwyneinion toxic lagoon near Rhos, which is a terrible site, to say the least. It claimed that the chemical company Monsanto, which produced 98 per cent of all PCBs in the UK, dumped, and I quote,

'huge amounts of industrial chemicals all around Wales'.

This is one of the worst examples of large international corporations taking advantage of our communities. In light of this, could the Minister share a statement with us about this unsatisfactory situation?

Well, thank you for raising this. The fact that you're the second Member to do so does demonstrate how much concern there is. A local authority survey held by NRW noted in 2015 that there were over 9,000 possible sites that need further investigation. Although not every one of those sites poses a risk to human health or the environment, this figure does show the scale of the problem facing regulators in Wales. As you heard earlier, tackling contaminated land is a key priority of this Government, and we will be developing a pan-Wales strategy to restore post-industrial land so that communities aren't facing possible risks. We, as I also reached out to Llŷr Powell, would ask you and every other Member that is concerned about this issue to work with us as a Government.

Trefnydd, I would like to call for a Welsh Government statement that clearly outlines how it will balance its renewable energy objectives. Parts of my constituency are deeply affected by large-scale windfarm developments. I have written questions on this issue and I note your manifesto commitment for undergrounding. I wish to put on record my constituents' huge ongoing concerns about the visual and economic impact of wind turbines. The impact of extensive windfarm developments on Wales's natural landscape could be potentially catastrophic. As part of that statement, will the Government also include a comprehensive impact statement examining the economic, environmental and social consequences of planned wind energy developments across Wales? Such an assessment would help provide transparency on the long-term implications for rural communities, tourism and energy infrastructure. Diolch.

The Member will have heard previous statements by the Cabinet Minister for Enterprise, Connectivity and Energy. As the work proceeds, there will, of course, be further updates to the Senedd and an opportunity for Members to scrutinise and provide further input on the matter.

Prynhawn da, Drefnydd. I'd like to request a statement, please, on the future of community hospital services in Powys. Earlier this month, Powys Teaching Health Board published proposals confirming the scale of change that's now on the table. Hospitals from Ystradgynlais to Llandrindod Wells could lose their in-patient beds entirely, leaving Powys with as few as 60 physical health beds across just two hospitals. Minor injury units and x-ray services would also disappear from several sites. You cannot plan healthcare for Powys as though we were in an urban area with another hospital only 10 minutes away. Geography matters for our population, which is ageing, as well. Families' ability to reach loved ones also matters, particularly those needing palliative care. There's also a serious question about the consultation itself, with the option of protecting our existing network of community hospitals discounted before residents even had a chance to respond. May I ask you what the Welsh Government would do to intervene and stop these proposals? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

I thank the Member for raising this issue. It's important to note that the health board hasn't made any decision on its clinical services plan. They are still developing that plan and possible options, before a proposed consultation later this year. So, I would hope that those points have been raised directly with the health board too. As with any change in services or strategy development, the Welsh Government expects health boards to engage openly with people in a transparent manner, in accordance with national guidance. The Welsh Government also expects the health board to make any decision based on evidence, supported by a robust options evaluation and impact assessments to ensure that the future of these services is sustainable, fit for purpose, which is the point that you made, and safe for the local population. Given that this work is ongoing at the moment, it would be inappropriate for me to comment further.

We've already heard about historic dumping from my colleagues here today. I want to ask the Trefnydd for a statement about ongoing illegal waste dumping taking place across Fflint Wrecsam. Unlawful waste dumping has been taking place in at least 16 sites across the constituency, centred on locations in and around Coedpoeth. Natural Resources Wales has the powers, under section 59 of the Environmental Protection Act 1990, to address unlawful waste disposal and require remediation. However, despite enforcement action reportedly being taken by NRW to date, residents remain deeply concerned about the situation and about the apparent lack of progress in halting the dumping and protecting the surrounding environment. How is the Welsh Government working with NRW to help tackle this issue and its impacts on local communities?

Thank you for raising this issue. You're talking about issues that are going on now, evidently, and I will make the Cabinet Minister aware of your comments. I'd also ask you to make him aware of these sites so that we can explore this issue further. We have been pressing for environmental justice by raising directly with the Treasury how important it is to have UK Government funding to strengthen our joint efforts to tackle the legacy of Wales's industrial heritage, including restoring coal tips and contaminated land. It's important also that local authorities and NRW do proceed with that regulatory role. So, I will take this further with the Minister. Diolch.

Trefnydd, I'd like to bring forward a health statement from the Cabinet Minister for health on a similar issue to what Jane Dodds raised, actually, about what the Minister can do to intervene in Powys health board's plans to close hospitals and beds across our constituencies. We all know a consultation is not a referendum as well, and it does need to follow robust evidence. But one thing we hear time and time again is that Ministers cannot intervene directly in health boards. So, I'd be interested if the health Minister could bring forward a statement on how the law can be changed to give Welsh Ministers the powers to intervene directly in health boards. That's something I would support, and I'm sure a lot of my colleagues would do the same, so that Ministers are actually accountable for the things that they talk about in this Chamber and can't just pass the buck back to to the health board all the time. So, a statement on that would be very welcome.

Well, thank you for raising that issue. I don't know if you have raised that directly with the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care, as the spokesperson, in relation to this issue. I know that the Minister is eager to be meeting with Members of all parties and I would encourage you to have those direct discussions. In terms of what is happening now in Powys, you will have noted my response to Jane Dodds earlier. But in terms of what can happen for the future, I think that is a further discussion for Members to be having, and I will also make the Cabinet Minister aware of the issues that you've raised this afternoon.

Trefnydd, you will be aware that 21 October will mark 60 years since the Aberfan disaster, in which 144 people were killed, including 116 children. It was incredibly moving to be at the launch of a new photographic exhibition to mark this anniversary at Cyfarthfa museum last week, and it was good to see you there also. The Aberfan disaster rocked the communities that we represent and, as the first major disaster seen through the lens of a television camera, it truly reverberated around the world. The depth of the grief felt by the bereaved and the psychological burden borne by survivors is something that is impossible for us to truly comprehend in this Senedd. But I believe that this Senedd needs to pay tribute to the dignity and strength of the community, which has been so apparent as the people of Aberfan have come together to make arrangements to mark this sixtieth anniversary. So, Trefnydd, I'd like to ask for a debate in Government time to mark the significance of this event.

Well, thank you, Vikki, for raising such an important issue. Aberfan, as you say, is a name of a place that people know internationally for all those devastating reasons that you've outlined there. We share a constituency and, as you noted, I was at that launch with you to meet survivors of that tragedy, but also to meet parents who lost children that day who remain with us today. It's important that we remember that long-lasting impact on communities that will be felt for generations to come. In terms of the sixtieth anniversary, I know that we as a Government will take that time to reflect and we do intend to bring a statement forward at that time.

I requested a statement on support for businesses that could be facing the loss of a professional rugby region. The Minister's answer to my written question confirms that the Welsh Government has undertaken no assessment of the economic or community impact, which I find surprising. The justification: the WRU is independent. That does not release this Government from its responsibility to the Welsh economy, businesses and hospitality sector. What is the Government offering the pubs, cafes, hotels and suppliers who stand to lose revenue? They have not bothered to assess the potential damage to local businesses, but perhaps the failure of Plaid's budget and the quest for independence have proved too much of a distraction. The Government did ask the WRU to consider the consequences, but this seems an inept response from an administration that is responsible for the Welsh economy. When will this Government undertake an impact assessment and explain what support businesses can expect, dependent on the final decision? These businesses deserve preparation and leadership. It seems this administration offers neither. Thank you.

Well, I would draw the Member's attention to the statement that will be made later today in terms of the support as regards business rates for a number of the businesses, and so forth, that he referred to. I don't know whether the Member knows the result of the WRU's review. Certainly, I don't know. In terms of making a case study, clearly, the two local authorities have made case studies. I've raised those concerns directly with the WRU, which has conveyed to us—. I have a number of questions tomorrow about rugby and the future of rugby in Wales, when I take questions as Cabinet Minister for Culture and Sport. Certainly, I think that any meeting that I've had with the WRU has left them under no illusions about the strength of feeling among Members in this Senedd who represent those regions, and the strength of feeling in our communities, and the genuine concerns that exist about the economic impact and the impact in terms of social cohesion—impacts of all kinds. So, that has been unambiguous in terms of what I've conveyed and what this Government has conveyed at every opportunity we've had. I will look forward to having more questions on this tomorrow.

I would like to request a statement from the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care on the high number of operations that are now being cancelled due to delays in patients passing the pre-operative assessment clinic assessments. This has been raised with me at a very senior level within the Betsi Cadwaladr health board. Clinicians are reporting that four to five operations a day are being cancelled in Ysbyty Glan Clwyd, despite being fully staffed, despite having the consultants there ready, waiting to do the operations. This means that a normal operating day that often runs from nine to five are seeing some surgeons finishing the day at 11 a.m. It has been noted that a main cause of the delay is due to staff sickness, but the real truth is that admin staff are not being able to book POAC appointments at present without having to go to senior management for an approval to book the POAC. This includes cancer surgery, which means now that cancer patients are waiting considerably longer for their operations that the consultants are wanting to do. At a time when waiting lists are high and there are promises from your Government to get those waiting lists down, will you ask the Cabinet Minister to make a statement on those claims that I've made here today to ensure that the delays that are currently in existence now are seen to and dealt with immediately? Diolch.

Well, I very much hope that the Member has written to the Cabinet Minister—

Just hang on a second. I need to get my—

I'm sorry.

I did ask the question in English.

Yes, and we have two languages here, so I will use the Welsh language to reply to your question. Thank you. Is the interpretation working for the Member now?

It is now, yes.

Excellent. Thank you very much. I very much hope that the Member will have taken the opportunity to write to the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care, providing the evidence that she's outlined here this afternoon, and also providing that evidence to the health board. It's crucially important that that information is available to us so that we can act, so I would ask you to do that.

Sorry, I can't hear it properly.

Trefnydd, would you try again, if you could?

Is there a problem with interpretation?

I think there's a problem with the—. Is there a problem, Janet? Can you hear?

Can we confirm if there is a problem with interpretation?

You can hear now, Janet. It seems to be working now.

Sorry, are you asking me to repeat my answer?

Yes, if possible.

Okay, I'll do that. What I asked of the Member, given the nature of the issue that you've raised, and the gravity of it, and the fact that you said that you have evidence of this, is that I do hope that you will have written to the Cabinet Minister for Health and Care, and also to the health board, providing that evidence, because, certainly, we need to see action if you do have that evidence. 

Thank you, Trefnydd. And finally, Jason O'Connell.

Diolch, Drefnydd. I'd like to request a statement from the Deputy Minister for Transport following the deeply concerning rise in the number of people killed or seriously injured on Welsh roads. Now, every one of these statistics represents a person, a family, in some of those cases, a life tragically lost, so this deserves a serious response. Three years ago, the Welsh public were told that introducing a default 20 mph limit would make our roads safer, yet, last year, the number of people killed or seriously injured on our roads was the highest since before the pandemic. Now, this should force this Government to confront some difficult realities. Labour introduced this policy, Plaid Cymru backed it, millions of pounds of taxpayers' money has been spent implementing it, businesses and motorists have carried the consequences, yet these figures should concern every single one of us. Now there needs to be a proper assessment of what has worked, what has failed and, most importantly, what needs to change.

Trefnydd, residents across Wales deserve a road safety strategy based on evidence and results, not ideology. They deserve dangerous roads, junctions and accident black spots to be properly identified and tackled. They deserve investment, targeted where it will actually prevent serious accidents and save lives. And above all, they deserve honesty about whether the policy they were promised would make them safer is actually working. Diolch.

Can I be very clear that every death on our roads is a tragedy, and road safety remains a priority for this Government? I also would think that the Member would not wish to mislead the public, because the data does show that collisions were 22 per cent lower than in 2022, the most recent full calendar year before the change in default speed limits was implemented. There was a 2 per cent increase in 2024, but may I just emphasise this is the second lowest annual number recorded in Wales, with the lowest being in 2024?

We will always keep every policy under review. That is good government. But I think we also need to look at the statistics and be honest with people in terms of really understanding the impact of a policy over a longer term, which was always the case with this. But I would ask the Member to reflect on the actual data and what it stands for, and be careful in how we present that data.

Thank you, Trefnydd. 

We'll now move to item 3, statement by the First Minister: weather, wildfires, drought and resilience. And I call on the First Minister, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Thank you, Llywydd. Over recent weeks, we have seen first-hand the impact of our changing climate. This summer has been the hottest on record. Wildfires and droughts have left their mark on communities across Wales. They have affected families, farmers and landowners. They have harmed wildlife and damaged precious habitats. They have placed extraordinary demands on our firefighters and emergency services. Our thoughts are with everyone affected.

Today, I want to place on record the thanks of the Welsh Government—and, I believe, the whole Senedd—to everyone who responded in such difficult circumstances, including our firefighters, emergency responders, the armed forces, public services, volunteers and local communities themselves. So, diolch. I know many of us will have seen the remarkable efforts to protect lives, homes, livelihoods and our natural environment. The professionalism and commitment represent public service at its very best.

Wales responded with courage and with a strong sense of community, but these fires also carried a warning that we must not ignore. Our climate is changing. The risks are changing with it and Wales must be ready. We now face flooding this winter. The United Nations is warning of the impacts of a supersized El Niño.

These risks are connected. Climate resilience cannot be the concern for one service, or one part of public services, one organisation or one part of Government only. It is a shared national priority. That's why we have started work on Wales's first climate and nature action plan, which reflects the need for a cross-Government response to a complex set of challenges. We take this responsibility seriously.

From the start of the first wildfire in July, we gave our full support to the fire and rescue services and to wider partners responding to the incidents. We activated the emergency management arrangements of the Welsh Government to provide strategic support. We convened the Wales civil contingencies committee to support co-ordination, and worked alongside the multi-agency co-ordinating groups led by the fire and rescue services.

Those standard, long-established arrangements brought together fire and rescue services, Natural Resources Wales, the military and other partners too. They enabled decisions to be taken quickly, resources to be co-ordinated effectively, and support to be directed to the places where it was needed most. Crucially, operational decisions remained with those who had the expertise and direct knowledge of conditions on the ground.

Our firefighters are among the best trained in the UK to tackle wildfires. Only a few months ago, at the UK Government's request, they helped train their English counterparts. Through using natural firebreaks, creating new firebreaks and targeted offensive firefighting, they deployed the ground-level tactics that remain the most effective method of tackling the fires. Their hard work, expertise and professionalism ensured all outbreaks were successfully and safely contained.

Where additional support was required, it was successfully mobilised through mutual aid arrangements across Wales and England. These arrangements provided access to specialist personnel, equipment and appliances, while helping individual services maintain operational resilience. And we should not forget the many farmers and landowners who made their time and equipment freely available to support the firefighting effort.

The military also played an important role, and I thank army personnel for their contribution. Military assistance can only be used as a last resort when civilian responders have considered all other options and request military aid. That test was met on 14 August and we rapidly responded following the request from South Wales Fire and Rescue Service on the afternoon of 13 August. We processed and authorised it at pace, with military support on the ground in under 24 hours—an exceptionally fast response. 

Understandably, there has been considerable interest in the use of helicopters and wider aerial support, and aerial support can be valuable in particular circumstances, but it forms only one part of a wider response. It is not a panacea. Its use depends on the location of a fire, weather conditions, availability and the assessment of operational commanders. Ground-based tactics remain central to tackling wildfires safely and effectively.

Aerial support was used when it was available and operationally appropriate. However, suitable aircraft across the UK were limited at that point, particularly as wildfires affected many parts of the UK at once. The armed forces do not have aerial firefighting capacity in the UK, and commercial capacity was wholly insufficient to meet the level of UK demand.

This is not an issue for Wales alone. It requires serious consideration and co-ordinated action across the UK, and I raised this issue when I attended the COBRA meeting on 12 August.

In an emergency, Government must act quickly, must act calmly and decisively, and that is what we did. But responding to an emergency is only part of our responsibility. We must also learn and strengthen our readiness for the future. The Cabinet Minister for Local Government, Housing and Planning chaired an immediate operational debrief with responders on 8 September, to help understand what worked well, what could be strengthened and what additional capabilities or arrangements may be required. We do not claim to have all the answers, and Government cannot do this alone.

Together we must strengthen the resilience of our land, our infrastructure and our public services. Prevention must be at the heart of our approach. It's important that we recognise the role we all need to play. The reality is that human activity is the main cause of wildfires. Climate change has increased the fuel, but the spark comes from us. This ranges from deliberate criminal acts through to accidental ignition, as simple as a piece of glass magnifying the rays of the sun or a disposable barbecue setting a hillside alight. Everyone therefore has a part to play in reducing risk, acting responsibly and following emergency service advice.

Individual responsibility is only part of the answer, and we must consider land management, infrastructure resilience, public services preparedness and the support available to communities before, during and after extreme weather events. That is why climate action is a Cabinet-level responsibility that cuts across every Government portfolio. We have committed to publishing a climate risk assessment that is regularly updated. This will provide greater transparency about the risks that Wales faces, the action being taken, and the areas in which further progress is needed. This will support the development of our climate and nature action plan, bringing together action across Government on prevention, preparedness and long-term resilience.

On 22 October, I will convene the Wales climate change and resilience summit, focusing on wildfires. It must be focused on practical action. It will provide an opportunity to learn from the recent wildfires, examine the role of land management and consider the steps needed to reduce the likelihood and consequences of future incidents. The reality is that Wales needs to prepare for the combined risks of our changing climate and ensure that our communities and public services are ready. We cannot prevent every wildfire or every extreme weather event. We can, though, reduce the risks. We can prepare more effectively. And when emergencies happen, we can respond quickly and decisively. Recent weeks have shown us the scale of the challenge. They've also shown us the strength of Wales. They have demonstrated the professionalism of our emergency services and the strength of our communities. We will build on that strength. We will learn from what has happened. And we will take the practical action needed to protect the people, communities and natural environment of Wales, now and for the generations that follow.

Good afternoon, First Minister, and diolch for your statement. Unfortunately, like the rest of your 100-plus days of Government, your response to this emergency was nothing but a complete let-down, and your lack of action since has been an enormous disappointment, causing anguish amongst farming communities across Wales. Your statement screams of 'too little, too late' and begs the question of whether this Government is truly fit for purpose and knows what it's doing. But what is clear is that our farmers deserve better.

I'd like to take a moment to pay tribute to our firefighters and our armed forces personnel who came to our rescue and stood beside our hero farmers, which you do not mention in this speech, who worked day and night—[Interruption.]—who worked day and night to try and contain those fires. However, firefighters felt ill-prepared to deal with the very specific fire that is a peat fire, with apparent calls by the Fire Brigades Union for an emergency summit, which went unnoticed. You yourself, First Minister, didn't attend a COBRA meeting until 12 August, when fires had already been burning for weeks. This crisis has exposed a Government that is not prepared for emergencies whatsoever. The question needs to be asked as to why it took so long to react to the wildfire outbreaks. Why didn't you have more input to ensure that the alert message was bilingual? Those first few hours were crucial, and this Government's failure to act has cost our nation not just a hefty financial cost, but also cost us dearly in an environmental context. It wasn't until 14 August that the military assistance was requested, at which time there were 30 incidents being dealt with across our nation. The list is long. There's just one thing after another, which shows this Government's incompetence.

I'm holding in front of me a map that your Government produced, which shows major incidents in Wales, yet it doesn't even include the Blorenge common, which you stood on hours after I did. You saw the devastation with your own eyes. You know that it was the longest burning fire in the whole of Wales. You called in your armed forces to help there, you called in fire services from all over the country to help there, yet your office produces a map that doesn't even include it. There was no help and no aid for the first important hours there, so instead farmers and landowners were throwing themselves onto the front line, risking their lives with no help. If they on Blorenge mountain weren't included on that map, I really would like to ask you, First Minister, what criteria would make them be declared a major incident?

Now, let's look at what we do know. Bad agricultural policy over the last three decades has done nothing but fuel this crisis. The question on everyone's lips is: First Minister, will you be able to bring that lot behind you to do what is necessary? We need to revert agricultural policy back to common sense and proven farming methods that prevent fires.

It is abundantly clear that the climate-change-obsessed, extreme environmental lobby has dominated policy in Wales for three decades, resulting in the devastation that we've seen over the summer. Livestock have been killed, habitats destroyed and carbon-capturing peatlands lost for decades. We need firebreaks. We need fire ponds, as you've just admitted in your own speech. They are the most effective way of tackling fires in our uplands. We need more livestock on our uplands, not less. They are the natural firebreak makers. We need to control rampant bracken. It's absolutely essential. It's turning our mountains into a tinderbox. Where it can't be eaten, where it can't be safely burned or rolled, we need a way to manage it. First Minister, can you assure us today that you will do all in your power to reduce these fuel loads, create those firebreaks, which you admit are needed, and accelerate new technology to get bracken under control, alongside ensuring that the sustainable farming scheme does everything within it to support our farmers in the rehabilitation of these lands, as they will play an instrumental part in bringing them back?

I've spoken to farmers north and south only this morning who have had complete radio silence from this Government. Where is that support? It's just not good enough. You've announced two summits, but I'm baffled as to why our farmers and commoners won't be sat around that table with you, like you personally promised them on the Blorenge. They're the experts, they know the uplands better than any—[Interruption.] I'm sorry, Minister, I've spoken to them this morning and they are not involved. [Interruption.] No, I'm sorry. They are the experts, they know the uplands better than anyone. It is not just nice to involve them; it is absolutely essential that they are if we're going to get an operational plan in place to truly prevent the scale of devastation that we've seen this summer.

First Minister, will you guarantee today that the farmers and commoners who are on the front line will be sat around that table in the summit? I'd love you to guarantee that. Will you launch an immediate educational awareness campaign targeting arson and human error, instead of hiding behind the excuse of climate change? This is what started the fires, not climate change, coupled with bad agricultural policy. You need to recognise this, and you need to act accordingly. Diolch.

Llywydd, I'm not sure where to begin, to be honest with you. We are responding to challenges that we've faced in many parts of our nation and the multitude of agencies that came together to tackle those, in very difficult circumstances, and the role that the Welsh Government played in that. I don't want to stand here having to correct a series of things that a Member says.

She says that I didn't even thank farmers for their role in the summer. I literally did; it's worth listening to my statements. My own son took part for days in carrying water bowsers to tackle the fires in Suffolk, as it happens. I'm very aware of the role that farmers played in tackling the wildfires this summer. So don’t throw accusations, somehow, at the Government for not understanding who played their part. I've mentioned it right here in the statement today. This was action that was taken on a multitude of different levels, because that is how we respond to emergencies such as the one we responded to this summer.

The Member says that the FBU called for a summit and I didn't respond. It was literally through the FBU writing to me that I said, 'Yes, let's have that summit', and it's happening on 22 October. This is through co-operation—[Interruption.] This is about dealing with the future. I'm not sure if the Member has any idea of the kinds of activities that were happening at that time and that have happened since. The summit is a part, if you like, of the response moving forward, as was the meeting between the Minister and the fire and rescue services and other agencies last week. The fire and rescue services themselves conduct their own analysis and assessment of the way that events were tackled at the time.

The Member throws accusations about not calling in military assistance until it was too late. That's not how it works; it is the fire and rescue services themselves who make the call to ask for the military to come in. They made the call on 13 August. The military were on the ground in 24 hours, and I can't thank the armed forces enough for responding to that call. The rules within which we operate, of course, mean that military assistance came in—the MACA rules within which we operate when civilian efforts have been exhausted. And I tell you what, the fire and rescue services were exhausted, because of the extreme stresses that were on them throughout this.

Now we move forward. We learn lessons. That is precisely what this summit, as well as other activities of Government, are all about. Does it look at the management of land? Does it look at how we control the amount of combustible material and so on on our uplands in particular? Yes, it does. That is what we're trying to do here; we're looking at what lessons can be learned. Do we need to change practices that have been introduced for very good reason over years because of the changing context in which we are operating?

The Member says farmers won't be at that summit. Landowners and farmers are absolutely a part of how we address it through that summit. So, yes, this is about bringing all those partners together who understand the different factors: experts in climate change, absolutely, experts in land management, experts in tackling wildfires. We have some of the best experts in the UK here in Wales. So, let's address what actually happened over the summer months, the amazing efforts that went in in extremely difficult circumstances, and learn lessons moving forward.

I'd like to start by thanking the firefighters, emergency responders, public services, volunteers and local communities affected by the wildfires this summer. While I and my colleagues welcome this statement today, let's be clear, this is far from what the public should expect from a Government. There is no doubt that the wildfires across Wales this summer were a national crisis. Fire and rescue services were pushed to the brink. People were evacuated, homes and farmland destroyed, and large swathes of the country were covered in smoke.

People who were miles away from these fires were impacted by the smoke, and the Government failed to understand the public health concern across the country. It's nearly two months after the first wildfires. The Government will know that those fires were much earlier than we would usually start to see wildfires, and, sadly, they continued across Wales.

As Welsh Labour, we requested that this Senedd should have been recalled for Members to raise questions and for the public to have the opportunity to hear from the Government. In a national crisis, with so much of Wales on fire, I do not believe the Plaid Cymru Government acted quickly and decisively. The lack of information and updates from Government Ministers made it feel like this Government did not grasp the severity of the crisis. The extent of the damage to communities, the economy, the environment and wildlife must not be forgotten because the fires are no longer burning.

I'd like to know what work the Government is undertaking to understand the impact of the wildfires on the Welsh economy in urban and rural areas. The significant pressure on resources arising from the number and complexity of fire incidents was unprecedented. Having been in close contact with the FBU throughout the Senedd recess, they have made it clear to me that the Welsh Government must accept the incidents this summer demonstrated inadequate firefighting resources.

It's also important to highlight the control centre staff, including those at South Wales Fire and Rescue Service, who handled 8,466 calls between 19 July and 1 September. Emergency services worked tirelessly for weeks whilst under relentless pressure. It would be good to know what engagement the Welsh Government has had with relevant unions since July and when the social partnership forum met. 

Further learning will emerge over the coming months, but there are certain aspects that are already evident. I was grateful to you, First Minister, for allowing a briefing with Welsh Government officials during recess. At that briefing on 28 July, I raised the issue of communication. The crisis escalated in the following days, but there appeared to be a lack of continued strategic co-ordination between Government, NRW, local authorities, Public Health Wales, health boards and other partners. It was not communicated effectively or efficiently to the public or Members. There was undoubtedly a public health aspect to the crisis, and I'd like to know what this Government is doing to examine the full extent of this.

With the impact of climate change, extreme weather events are likely to become the norm, not the exception. There is a very real worry that fire and rescue services could find themselves facing a similar crisis situation due to flooding. Preparedness requires leadership and investment at a national level. I welcome the climate and nature action plan. The Welsh Government must work to ensure councils, communities and businesses are as prepared as possible for future significant weather events. This can't fall on individual local authorities. A climate resilience fund is one of the measures suggested for consideration by the FBU. Can the First Minister confirm whether this is something the Government will explore?

Prif Weinidog, I welcome what you have said today, but we need to see outcomes, not just promises. Political leadership is about being present and visible. It's also about learning and listening. I hope the Welsh Government is listening to the communities who watched in terror as flames approached, to the exhausted fire and rescue services, to the farmers whose crops were destroyed, and to the business owners who suffered significant financial losses. Firefighters, communities and businesses need to know that lessons have genuinely been learnt from this unprecedented summer. How will you measure the success of the climate change and reliance summit, and when will the climate and nature action plan be delivered? Diolch.

Thank you very much for those comments and questions.

I certainly associate myself, as I echoed in my opening remarks, with that deep sense of thanks to everybody that was involved in the response through what was a very difficult summer that was challenging in a host of different ways.

The health impact, obviously, is one that was very much considered. How do you make sure that we are, in future, able to prepare for the impact of a greater number, potentially, of fires on health? These are the questions that we must always be engaged with.

On the recall of the Senedd over the summer, it was a perfectly fair request to be made. In the same way, the UK Labour Government didn't recall the UK Parliament, despite the pressures there. What happened there was that COBRA was called. I attended that COBRA meeting. We convened our Wales civil emergencies committee, because that is how we make sure that we take action, because that is the key element.

The Member says that she appreciated having that briefing from Government. We were very happy to provide information. We published a number of written statements, and that scrutiny capability is there throughout that time. It's always about sharing information and communicating. Coming from a communication background, I will always say that we look at how we improve communicating with people. It's something that we should always be eager to do, and it is one of the lessons. When you have more and more events of this kind, the communication challenge becomes more difficult too, just as fighting the fires themselves become difficult.

On the relationship with the unions, as I said, it was good that it was from the FBU themselves that that request came for the summit. It's something that I had discussed with my colleagues in Government a day or two previously, so we were able to call that summit directly in response to that request from the FBU, because it was clear that we were all thinking in the same kind of way. That will have a broad-ranging purpose—to understand the climate change challenge, to recognise the nature of the changing risks that we will face, and look at all those elements, including resource and capability within the fire and rescue services, absolutely, plus those elements of land management that will be so important moving forward.

We know that this summer is unlikely to be a one-off. This summer was a very loud alarm call for us all in how we respond to that. We can't wait for another summer of 2026, which is why we're moving quickly ahead with the kind of assessments that are taking place within the fire and rescue services themselves, the interaction with Government there. Meetings took place all summer between those partners—Natural Resources Wales, Welsh Government, the fire and rescue services. This was a multi-agency approach throughout, and that will be the guiding principle now. There's no one answer here. All of us have to come together to make sure that we are better equipped to deal with emergencies and try to mitigate the risks themselves in future.

Thank you, First Minister, for your statement today. I think it's absolutely right that we're discussing this on the first day back in the Senedd after what was a devastating summer for many people affected by these wildfires. I also want to put on record my thanks to those firefighters, other emergency responders, and indeed the farming community, that stepped up when they were needed to try and get to grips with the situation, which was, at one point, looking like it was getting completely out of control because of the exceptionally dry weather and wind that we were experiencing.

I took a moment to have a look at the Wales resilience framework earlier on, last updated in 2025. It mentions flooding 21 times, the word 'pandemic' 17 times, but there's only one reference to wildfires, and that's in a foreword at the start of that document. So, it's quite clear that we haven't paid sufficient attention to the risk posed by wildfires in Wales in the past, neither the previous Government, nor, probably, the whole of the Senedd, if we're honest; I don't recall many debates or discussions on wildfires in the past, and, clearly, we need to focus on this issue more in the future. It's something that clearly requires an update, and I hope you'll commit to updating that resilience framework in response to me today. I'm glad that you've just registered the fact that you will.

I was interested to hear your point about the test that is required to be met before you're able to request the military support to come in, because many people had a perception that the military should have been called in earlier and that there was no real explanation afforded to people because of that. You've suggested that someone has a test in place. I don't know what the thresholds are in terms of that test. You said it's where the civilian efforts can't go any further and there's a need to call in extra support. But I would just like to know a little bit more about that test, who deems whether it's been met or not, so that we can better understand and scrutinise the decision-making process. Clearly, it does seem that you acted pretty rapidly once you were told that that test had been met. But I personally would have liked to have seen the military's intervention much sooner, and I think we would have perhaps been able to get things under control much sooner. 

It was very alarming to hear that the capacity for air support is very limited across the United Kingdom. That's clearly something that needs to be addressed on a UK-wide basis, so that those resources can be called in very quickly where they are needed. And I'd be interested to know what discussions you've had with the UK Government about addressing that gap in the resilience infrastructure around the country, so that we can make sure that we have access to that air support—the choppers coming in and tipping the water where necessary.

And if I can just refer to a few other points, if I may. Obviously, reference has been made to the way that we manage land in the countryside these days, and it seems to me that there is an increased risk as a result of allowing some of the scrub, bracken and other vegetation to build up, because that in itself then creates the fuel for wildfires. We know that, historically, farmers and other landowners have tried to manage that in a sustainable way, by creating those barriers to stop fire spreading when it starts. And I do think that we need to review land management practices. It's good to see the Cabinet Secretary here responsible for rural affairs, and I know that he understands these things, but I do think that if we managed our land in a different way, then we could perhaps help to reduce some of these risks.

We've also seen, of course, a big fall in livestock numbers in Wales, and we are probably going to see a further fall in livestock numbers in Wales in the future. I don't know. But, certainly, if the previous Government's policy was being pursued, that's what we would see. Now, clearly, if animals are grazing, then there's less risk of that land being full of fuel for a wildfire to be able to spread. So, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts, First Minister, on what we can do to make sure that we protect our livestock numbers to make sure that they can help to manage these things.

In addition to that, the National Farmers Union Cymru and other people working in the farming industry have called for funds to help the establishment of small reservoirs on farms, in order that there's more readily accessible water close to places that might combust. And I wonder whether that's something that you and your Government will consider.

And finally, I did hear earlier on the exchange about the need for bilingual alerts to go out at the same time when national emergency alerts go out. I appreciate that it's a UK Government responsibility, but, obviously, there needs to be joined-up thinking across the UK on these matters. That did cause a lot of confusion, and I'd be grateful to know what assurances you've received from the UK Government that, in future, those alerts will go out at the same time to make sure that people have the best opportunity of being able to respond quickly. Thank you. 

Thank you for that series of really constructive questions, I think. Yes, our thanks to the emergency services made again very, very clearly, and I hope they genuinely do hear that, because I know there were some very exhausted women and men out there through the summer who were doing their best.

I agree on not having identified this enough as a risk. One of the elements of the work that I have engaged with very, very positively since coming into this role is the resilience work. I've tried to make sure that I am kept very, very well briefed on the broad range of resilience engagement that Welsh Government either leads or is a part of. I chair the Wales resilience forum, which brings together the whole raft of organisations that are involved in this thing called resilience, making sure that we are fit to face the challenges of the future, from health boards to policing to the military to all, you know, fire and rescue. It's something that I take very, very seriously indeed. And absolutely, our register of risks is updated regularly, and there will be, clearly, a reflection on the scale of the risk that we face through fire, and that is only right.

On military assistance, MACA—military aid to the civil authorities—and the rules, I'm happy to write to you, to share with you details of how it works. But, essentially, the call isn't made by Welsh Government, it is made, as I was explaining earlier, by those who are responsible for the response on the ground. The call was made, in this case, on 13 August, and it was agreed to. So, that the systems work is the key element, and the systems worked in a way that led to very rapid deployment, which was very, very important. But on those rules on engagement, we'll share as much information with you as we can. And the military, of course, is very much a part of, as I say, the Wales resilience forum.

On air support, we see the pictures, don't we, of planes on the continent dumping fire-retardant material or water on fires, and we can all be guilty of jumping to a conclusion that that must be the best way of fighting fires. I've learnt a lot as First Minister, in my engagement, working closely with the operations over the summer, that, actually, it's not always the best answer, that, often, it is containing, putting those breaks in place, letting a fire burn itself out and so on. But there is a place for developing and looking at how we make sure that we have more capability in future for air support. It is something that I raised specifically during the COBRA meeting on 12 August, and something that I understand will be looked at: what role can UK Government play in providing resource that is available for use across the UK? But we've at least been able to raise that issue. Also, the fire and rescue services are already developing a proposal to have some sort of framework in place for rapid access to civilian firefighting helicopters, which doesn't make any more such support available, but it does simplify, potentially, the process of contracting for aerial support. They don't need Welsh Government's permission to do this, by the way, but they would have our full support in doing so. So, we learn. It's an important part of it; it's not perhaps the silver bullet that some people think it is.

On physical elements on mitigating risks, yes, land management is clearly a potential part of that. It will be a part of the mix when it comes to that forum on 22 October. Livestock numbers absolutely can play a part in those discussions. I still say that any changes introduced in practices, driven at times by various Government policies, I am convinced have been driven by the right reasons—the right motives and motivations have been there. It's just that the context changes, and we need to make sure that we aren't creating unnecessary risks for ourselves, whilst, at the same time, being really determined to play our part in terms of the climate and nature emergency.

On the request for funds for small reservoirs, it's not something that I've had specific discussions about, but I know we are looking at how support can be provided for agriculture in light of what they have experienced this summer.

I'll end on the alert. I was in a restaurant at the time, when the alarm went off. It was frightening for many, I know, and the bilingual aspect did, without doubt, cause anxiety. This wasn't a Welsh Government issue. This was a UK Government issue. The question asked was: what engagement will we have? 'We will help', is the answer to that. It's important that the message gets through to people. But as I was saying earlier, bilingualism is not the problem, it's how we make sure that we have the outcome that we seek, which is to give people a warning of an impending risk, and that we also consider the fact that we're a bilingual country. We're very good at doing things bilingually here in Wales. We have expertise in making sure that we are able to support UK Government in reflecting on what happened with that emergency alert this summer.

This is a very important issue, but we've only got 20 minutes left, so we're going to move to shorter contributions and questions from Members. If they can help us along, we'll try and get through everybody if we can. First, Niamh Salkeld.

Diolch, Lywydd. Over the summer, I actually witnessed first-hand the devastation that wildfires caused across Blaenau Gwent Caerffili Rhymni. A wildfire actually broke out in my own village. When you see those flames outside of your window—. It's really difficult to understand the fear that they bring until you see it first-hand. You lie awake at night wondering whether, at any moment, you might have to actually leave your home because of how intense the fire gets. But thanks to the brilliant work of the fire and rescue service, the military, local communities, farmers and so many others, the fires were brought under control. These wildfires are a stark reminder to us all of the risks that Wales is facing from a changing climate. Climate change might not always light the match, but it's turning our countryside and our terrain into kindling.

So, I welcome this summit, but can I have some reassurance, please, that local voices, including farmers and community groups, will be around the table, alongside key organisations as well, like National Gas, who are sometimes the unsung heroes but play a really important role as well, so that their experience can help shape how we prepare for the future? Diolch.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. The Member speaks of her experience in her community. Thanks to all Senedd Members of all parties who responded to concerns in their own communities. We are there. We are able to share information and provide support in all sorts of different ways. 

Climate change—yes, absolutely, we are seeing the impacts of climate change here now. Who will be part of that response? It will be as many people as we possibly can get. There is a physical table for that summit, and we'll get as many people around it as possible, but there's also a metaphorical table, isn't there? And around that, absolutely, communities the length and breadth of Wales will need to be heard, their concerns heard, as we move forward to facing up to the risks in the future. In terms of landowners, farmers—absolutely, they will be there.

First, I'd like to thank you, First Minister, for the advance notice of your statement. I'd like to associate myself with your remarks in respect of the thanks that we owe to our fire and rescue services, emergency workers and, in my constituency as well, our farmers, which we've all discussed previously, who all played a crucial role in battling the wildfires and supporting our fellow citizens. Had it not been for their bravery and skills, the damage could have been a lot, lot worse.

First Minister, I was not alone in being frightened by the intensity and proximity of wildfires during the summer in my constituency of Gwynedd Maldwyn, including one which was a very short distance from my own home. Again, I saw the flames. The fear was felt by many of my fellow citizens all over Wales, from Corwen in the north, Pembrokeshire, Carmarthen, down to category 3 blazes in Blaenavon, Ferndale, Ebbw Vale, just to name a few. Our thoughts are really with them at this time.

First Minister, as you have acknowledged, homes were evacuated, and scientists have described the impact of the wildfires across Wales as absolutely catastrophic. Can you reassure my constituents, please, that your Government will share the lessons that have been learnt, and can you tell us what practical measures you propose so that they can be subject to proper scrutiny?

Thank you very much for that. The Member makes the case that this isn't something that we can now view as something happening over there, you know, in another part of the world. And we all watched in—. It was frightening seeing what was happening in Bordeaux, and France and other parts of Europe. This was happening here in Wales as well, and it does frighten. The key thing is that we do learn. That is what we're trying to do here. The summit is a very prominent part of that learning. But, as I've tried to explain, that learning is happening right across Government.

We absolutely will be reporting back on what the steps are that will come out of that summit and different measures, so that we can be held to account over it. People need to know that we don't go into summer 2027 in the same way as we did in summer 2026. But there's also a longer term element to this too. When we look at tackling climate change and some of the longer term changes that we need to put in place, we will try to be as open as we can about the responses that we and our partners think are necessary as a result of our experience.

May I thank you for that statement from you, First Minister? It shows just how important this issue is and the events that we experienced over the summer. So, thank you very much for making this statement and for listening to our comments today. 

I also want to pay tribute to all of those firefighters, farmers, landowners, moorland managers, the army as well, for the work that they did. In my constituency this August, a wildfire in Glascwm just showed the importance of those people coming together and being resilient as a community. They brought tractors, bulldozers, water bowsers to a rapidly spreading fire over 30 hours. Machinery was pushed to its limits. One landowner has told me that he spent £4,500 on diesel tackling three wildfires in the space of that time. So, I really would like to know from you who will be brought together. It would be really good for some clarification, and Laura Anne has asked for that. Will that include moorland managers and farmers and people with the National Trust, for example, who are land managers as well?

And moving forward, we know that climate change is going to be worse again next year. So, we really do need a plan in place and we'd love to know what your timescale is going to be, particularly for 2027, to make sure we've got things in place to make sure that we tackle this as well as we can. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, and I'm glad you recognise that by me making the statement that we hold this at the very highest level of importance in Government. I can assure you that I was very much at the heart of the Government response alongside other Ministers over what was a very, very difficult summer indeed.

I am happy to—. Obviously, the work we're doing now is putting together that list of individuals and organisations that will be represented around that physical table. We want it to be comprehensive. This is about multi-agency working. We need to make sure that the partners who have knowledge across the whole breadth of areas that are relevant to this field will be there. I will share that information as much as I can. There has to be a sense that this is a project for us as a nation now. When we look at issues of national resilience, they genuinely do matter to all of us. And where there are ideas and suggestions put forward by people who, for whatever reason, aren't around that table, we will absolutely take them seriously as we put together a plan now to respond to what the Member and I recognise as being the threat of our generation, which is the threat of climate change.

Thank you very much for this afternoon's statement, and thank you to everyone who tackled the fires over the summer. 

The danger posed by mountain fires was brought home starkly by the devastating blaze at the Pantside estate in Newbridge, where homes were destroyed. This summer showed that these fires are becoming more ferocious, more complex and more dangerous as our climate changes. We were fortunate that no lives were lost this time.

I recently met with the Fire Brigades Union and thank firefighters for their extraordinary work keeping our communities safe, but it's clear that the risk has changed, and therefore our response must change with it. In reviewing and adapting the future plan, I know of members of the Welsh diaspora with direct experience of wildfire preparedness who would be willing to share that experience with the Welsh Government. Are you therefore actively seeking international advice from people and places with far greater experience of fires on this scale to add to the experts that we have here in Wales? Diolch.

'Absolutely' is the short answer. I forget the name of the summit—it was held in London last week—where representatives of 70 nations were there specifically looking at wildfires and how Governments and the public services and fire and rescue services should be responding. So, yes, very much a part of an international response to what is an ever more emerging threat. Where there are members of the Welsh diaspora who have specific reason to help us with their knowledge, please, Welsh Government is always interested in hearing from them.

I would like to declare an interest, having worked for South Wales Fire and Rescue Service for over 20 years. First Minister, I thank our firefighters, control staff and support teams. On 13 August, joint fire control handled over 1,000 calls. At one point, south Wales crews faced 14 wildfires simultaneously. Afan Ogwr Rhondda needs well-trained crews, the right equipment and reliable water supplies, even in drought. On 23 July, your Cabinet Minister announced a review of firefighting capability and costs. Will you publish a costed plan by 31 October, agreed with all three fire services, identifying what must improve, who is responsible, and what will be delivered before next spring? Your Government extended the intervention in south Wales, where commissioners set the levy paid by local councils. Will your draft budget fund those improvements so councils are not left to meet the additional costs? Diolch.

Thank you very much for those questions. The Member is right: we thank the whole team in fire and rescue, and it is those behind the scenes, those control staff and support teams. He's also right in pointing to the cumulative nature of the threat that we faced this summer being perhaps the biggest issue. Don't get me wrong, some of the fires individually were very, very serious and caused a significant challenge for the fire and rescue services, but it was at that point—and I think it was 14 that was the highest number at one point—it was the sheer stress of that on not just our capability to fight those fires, but our resilience to deal with other potential emergencies that was genuinely stretched.

I don't think I can give an assurance to publish that plan by 31 October, not least in that we have a programme for assessing capability needs, resources, the threats, through a summit that is being held on 22 October. So, we're trying to move as quickly as we can here, making sure we have the right people, taking the right attitude to finding the solutions that we need, but I can give an assurance that we will work as quickly as we can to provide a guide to what will be different in the future.

You're right that there are issues with costs related to the stresses this summer, and Welsh Government has made the decision that fire services and local authorities will be able to apply for funding under our emergency financial assistance scheme because of the specific pressures that were placed upon them this summer because of the wildfires.

Thank you, First Minister, for this important statement.

It really is unbelievable seeing the party opposite continue to deny the cause of this issue affecting our rural communities. I believe a big part of being a politician is actually listening to what's being said, and I really wish Members had done that today.

Having recently met with a farmer in the Llangynidr area of my constituency seriously impacted by the recent wildfires, he spoke about the fact that Welsh Water infrastructure was unmaintained and hindered efforts to tackle the fires. Can we have assurances that the Welsh Government will put pressure on agencies like Welsh Water to ensure the inspection, clearance and ongoing maintenance of their infrastructure, especially across rural parts of the country that have been impacted so much by the wildfires? Diolch.

Thank you very much for the question. The Minister will have heard the question too. There are a whole host of considerations that we will need to look at when it comes to our resilience, and water supply, absolutely, is one of those. The water supply companies were very much a part of the joined-up response during the course of this summer, assessing their needs for firefighting, their needs for making sure that those pressures didn't impact on drinking water supplies and so on. But, yes, we will need to make sure that, if there were problems that came to light during this summer, everything possible is done to make sure that we are mitigating or minimising those risks as we face a situation where the risks will only get higher.

First Minister, as you're aware, the fire in Blaenavon burned for weeks and weeks, and the efforts of the firefighters and the landowners and graziers who worked alongside them were absolutely extraordinary. I welcome the fact that there's going to be a summit, but you've indicated in your statement that there's already been an initial debrief with some suggestions. I think it would have been helpful to have had some detail on that in the statement today. What I haven't heard from you so far today is any commitment to provide funding to those areas worst affected. It is undoubtedly the case that Blaenavon will need a very significant sum of money to restore the common, but also to prevent the reoccurrence of such a fire in the future. Is it your intention for the summit to look at funding issues?

And you've given assurances today that the voices of local people will be heard in the summit. Now, I know how difficult it is to organise a Welsh Government summit, but I think it is crucial that it's not just the representative bodies or the national bodies, but that we do actually have a voice for those people who were there day in, day out, fighting the fires in places like Blaenavon.

Thank you. It's a really important point, because everybody needs to be a part of the solution, but neither can they literally be a part of a summit. And whilst I clearly can't say that there will be representatives of every community affected at one summit on 22 October 2026, what we need to make sure is that their interests are served at that summit and that we have means always of making sure that they are able to feed into the decision-making process that we have.

Now, it strikes me that there are things that we can do as a Parliament that help people make their voice heard. As Members, we are all voices for the people that we represent. I will give some thought about how, actually, that happens from a Welsh Government point of view, but the crucial thing for us is that their interests are served at that table, and that—. I was in Blaenavon; I visited and I saw the fire for myself and it was devastating. I was speaking to those who had been grazing on the common and they were facing significant impacts on their livelihoods.

In terms of the impact on farming and so on, I have indicated today that active consideration is being given to what assistance can be made available, and no doubt we'll hear from the rural resilience and sustainability Minister on that. But, yes, voices must be heard—and, in fact, I would argue that they already are, through the actions of all of us here. But, really, what people want to know is, 'What's the action going to be?' We will be very open about the results of that summit, plus the meetings that have taken place. Speaking with the Minister, it was an update on 8 September—I see it very much as setting up, then, the work of the summit, and it appears that there are elements already shaping up. So, it would have been about organisation, the physical environment, already being looked at by the fire and rescue services as part of their debriefs. That will be fed, then, into that national summit. This isn't going to be a one-off; this is going to be a process of making sure we're ready for the changing risks in the future.

Thank you for your statement, First Minister. I think two things that haven't quite been raised yet by Members are that, actually, a lot of these fires were being brought under control and they were restarted because of arson. That was because of a TikTok sensation of young people going and setting gorse bushes on fire because they think it's cool. And actually, one thing that we need to do is make sure the Department for Culture, Media and Sport come down hard on these companies that are not taking down this content straight away, which is fuelling this sort of online sensation. So, I'd like to hear from you, First Minister, what conversations you're having with other UK Government departments, and social media companies, about bringing these things under control quicker, because that will also help to get some of these situations under control.

Also, what we are going to see is an increased cost for our farmers as well. A lot of people have lost a lot of grazing up on the upland areas, which is going to put huge cost burdens onto them. So, I'd be interested to know whether the Welsh Government is thinking of bringing forward any payment window, so farmers can be paid early in their support to make sure they can buy fodder through the winter. 

Thank you. I'm also deeply concerned about copycat arson attacks, potentially. Just speaking here with my Minister for culture who is willing to take this forward as a question with UK Ministers in a meeting soon, because we do need to be looking at these threats that are absolutely things that we have in common across the whole of the UK.

One thing that I have learnt is that our fire and rescue services have, over a period of years, become very, very effective at communicating messages around safety, reducing the risk of fire in homes dramatically over the years. They have also been doing a lot of engagement work with young people, talking about the risks, the dangers of fire setting and so on. I'm eager to see that kind of work being promoted more, and no doubt that will be a part of the prevention agenda as we move forward. Because human behaviour is, as I said earlier, a big part of the threat that we are facing here.

Again, on agriculture, we're very, very aware of the challenges that have been caused to agriculture by the fires this summer. I know that discussions have been going on involving the rural resilience Minister. We want to make sure, within the confines of financial constraints and so on, that we're able to help, either in practical terms or, where we can, in financial terms too. Those considerations are very active. We will report back when we're able to do so.

And finally, Matthew Jones.

Thank you, Llywydd, and thank you very much, First Minister.

The wildfire on Mynydd Garnclochdy near Blaenavon in Sir Fynwy Torfaen was devastating, and the effects were felt far and wide. I'd like to thank you again for coming to visit Blaenavon and meeting with the common land graziers; for listening to them and thanking them personally for everything that they did, including James Bourne, a farmer who has documented the fire's devastating impact on the land and its livestock throughout. At the height of the fire, the experience and the knowledge of James and his fellow Blorenge graziers was essential. They put themselves at great personal risk in helping firefighters navigate the land and tackle the blaze. Their experiences will be vital in learning lessons from these fires, but questions remain as to where their flocks will now graze and the support that they will receive for the recovery. So, my question is: how will the Government engage with these common land graziers to make sure that their experiences are given a fair hearing and their expertise considered in any decisions made in the wake of the summit? Diolch.

Yes, I was very grateful to a number of the graziers on the land above Blaenavon for making time to speak with me. It was good that we were able to speak as Welsh Government, and with Senedd Members there too, about the stresses that had been placed on them. You could sense that there was a real tiredness after such a long period of the fire burning.

I am really keenly aware of the impact of the wildfires on Welsh farming and those grazing on common land. Welsh Government is exploring opportunities to bring together those relevant stakeholders in the coming months, as well as the summit itself, to consider how the resilience and recovery, of our commons specifically, to such events, can be strengthened. And as I signified, we're looking at all elements of the kinds of assistance that might be made possible through Government action.

Thank you, First Minister. Before we move on, I would like to remind the Chamber that Members have the right to speak in English or in Welsh at any time during our proceedings. 

Questions asked in English may be answered in Welsh, just as questions asked in Welsh may be answered in English. 

Where there is a technical problem with interpretation equipment, we will of course always pause proceedings until the problems are resolved. 

I hope that's a helpful clarification. 

We will now move to item 4. Item 4, a statement by the Cabinet Minister for Finance: rebalancing the non-domestic rates system. 

Thank you, Llywydd. Today, I'm pleased to announce changes the Welsh Government will make to reflect our manifesto commitments to rebalance the non-domestic rates system, and level the playing field for high-street businesses. We recognise the importance of vibrant retail, hospitality and leisure sectors, and these are central to our ambition to regenerate town centres and to breathe new life into our high streets.

Our work of rebalancing the rates system will be delivered through changes to the existing differential multipliers, improving support for selected hospitality and leisure businesses. An expanded scope for the lower multiplier will be funded by a marginal increase to the higher multiplier, applicable to the highest value properties in the tax base across all sectors.

From 2027-28, selected small to medium-sized hospitality and leisure properties will be subject to the lower multiplier currently applied to retail shops. This will bring eligible hospitality and leisure businesses in line with the permanent support introduced for retailers from this year. Eligible properties with rateable values below £51,000 will attract a 30 per cent reduction in their non-domestic rates bills.

This permanent support will replace and exceed the temporary discretionary relief of 15 per cent for food and drink hospitality properties that is currently being provided. It will mean that a wider range of hospitality and leisure businesses will get the long-term certainty that they need to invest and to grow.

The eligible food and drink hospitality properties are pubs, restaurants, cafes, bars, food courts, licensed clubs and live music venues. The eligible visitor accommodation properties are hotels, guest houses and hostels. And in the leisure sector, the eligible properties are cinemas, theatres, libraries, museums and gyms.

These businesses play important and complementary roles in vibrant high streets and town centres. Along with retailers, ratepayers for around 20,000 properties will therefore benefit from the expanded lower multiplier. Over 12,500 more properties of the relevant types already attract full relief, and that means that they therefore do not pay any non-domestic rates. Ratepayers for a majority of properties across Wales, particularly small businesses, will also continue to benefit from a range of permanent reliefs currently worth more than £200 million per year.

There is a balance to strike between the broader support that is provided through the lower multiplier and the resulting impact on the value of the higher multiplier. The higher multiplier will be set at just over 4 per cent above the standard multiplier from 2027-28 onwards. This is a small increase to the existing difference, and it's a fair way to redistribute liability so that we can better support the businesses that are at the heart of our high streets and town centres.

These changes to the differential multipliers are linked with the broader work of the town centres taskforce. This taskforce will take account of national policy frameworks, as well as considering the more tailored support that may be needed in individual town centres. Our approach recognises that needs will vary between places that may be facing different challenges that might go beyond the rate system. 

I'll bring forward the regulations required to implement the changes to the differential multipliers in the coming weeks. The regulations will specify the properties that will be subject to the lower multiplier, and amend the value used to calculate the higher multiplier relative to the standard multiplier for any given year. Subject to the approval of this Senedd, the changes will take place on 1 April 2027.

The values of the multipliers for next year will be determined as part of our budget preparations for 2027-28, following the UK Government's autumn budget. I'm proposing to make these changes at the earliest opportunity in this Senedd, to prioritise the improvements that are deliverable and affordable in the short term. The Welsh Government will continue to consider further reforms to the non-domestic rates system that reflect our broader ambitions for Wales. I know that Members across the Chamber are interested in this matter, and ideas for further measures on non-domestic rates will receive a listening ear from me. Diolch.

I'd first like to thank the finance Minister for taking the time out of her busy day to join us here in the Senedd, but if I'm truthfully honest, I'm not sure what the point was, given you'd already announced to the press in writing what you were going to do over 24 hours ago. I'm reminded of that excellent phrase from the former Plaid Cymru leader and current Government Minister, Adam Price, who said, when Labour did exactly the same thing, 'government by press briefing'. He also said it was disrespectful to the Llywydd and that, quote,

'it undermines this institution and our roles as elected Members'.

Strong words. Can the Minister confirm whether she aims to continue governing by press briefing?

Now, coming on to the content of your press release, I'd also like to thank the finance Minister for taking a policy straight out of Reform's manifesto. In it, we said,

'We will introduce a permanent lower multiplier for pubs, hotels and hospitality venues'.

Something that was not specified in Plaid Cymru's own manifesto. Look, if Reform provides the policy and Plaid Cymru delivers it, I won't complain. However, sadly, there must have been some misreading of our manifesto because, to afford the tax cut, you didn't end international spending or find savings in Government efficiencies; you just sent the bill directly to Wales's big businesses. As you were quoted in the press release, the

'burden will fall on the bigger businesses',

bigger businesses like Admiral, Wales's only FTSE 100 company; Airbus, one of Flintshire's biggest employers; and Tata Steel, providing an essential and strategic resource for the whole nation.

But of course, although the bill for the tax goes on the business's accounts, businesses don't pay taxes, in the same way as a house doesn't pay council tax, the same way this flooring doesn't pay VAT, and the same way this speech doesn't pay income tax. Do you know who pays taxes? People pay taxes. So, when you tax business, it has to be paid by somebody. Either it's paid by the owners or the customers or the workers. There is no other option. So, when Admiral's insurance premiums go up for its customers, and pay rises for Airbus's employees don't happen, and investment for Tata Steel's electric arc furnace dries up, will you take the blame? And will you correct your press release statement, Minister, to say that the burden falls on the millions of Welsh people associated with bigger businesses?

And the situation for them is even worse because, just across the border, businesses can run a factory or rent office space or use any other premises a large successful company needs for lower business rates, discouraging future businesses from an opportunity to come to Wales.

My final point on this press release is this: is this it? Plaid Cymru in their manifesto said business rates needed real reforms, and after eight weeks over the summer, all you could come up with was moving some industries into the eligibility for the lower threshold category that already existed. Minister, when will we see the real reforms of business rates promised in your manifesto? Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd.

Well, I'm sure I could have made this statement at any point during the summer term. The statement was ready to be made. I chose in particular to wait for the first day of the Senedd being back in session to make the statement, and I'm making it on the floor of the Senedd in order to receive questions from other parties and from Members here to see how they respond to the statement, and what else they think that this system should deliver. After that five minutes from the Reform representative, I'm not sure whether Reform are going to support this reduction of 30 per cent in business rates for this sector, which is a really important sector for our town centres, or not. It wasn't clear to me, from what you said, whether you would support it or not. But you'll have to decide on that, of course, before the voting happens on the floor of this Senedd one way or another on a change of this kind. 

But may I say why Plaid Cymru decided to take this initial step? Members across this Senedd continuously talk about the need to strengthen our town centres. Our town centres are important to the communities that we represent, whether that is in our industrial areas, in our Valleys, or in more rural areas. Providing support to those businesses that are, in their broad range, existing in town centres has been a manifesto commitment from Plaid Cymru, and today it is a commitment that we are delivering within Government. I hope that that strikes a chord that will be supported by people across the Senedd who represent communities all across Wales and of all political backgrounds as well.

You have been a bit too busy reading that press release, I think, rather than listening to what I said in my statement 5 ft away from you this afternoon. You asked the question, 'Is this it?', and I responded to that today in front of you. I responded when I said that this is an initial first step, and I'm keen to hear the views from other Members on what more this Government could be able to deliver in order to support those businesses. So, spend a bit less time reading the press releases and judging those press releases, and use a bit more of your time standing up in this Chamber listening to what's being said. 

I don't know if I need to say this, but Cai made reference to Airbus, and I have a family member working for that company.

Welsh Labour has been clear that we at least intend to be a constructive opposition. That's why we do welcome the principles of today's announcement, recognising the permanent reduction of 30 per cent, providing valuable support and assurances to businesses in accommodation, hospitality and leisure that qualify for this reduction. This announcement, of course, builds on the policies of the previous Welsh Labour Government that provided over £1 billion of rate support for hospitality and leisure businesses since 2020-21.

But we do have to pay for this reduction, don't we? The Minister says that the proposals are cost neutral and that the burden will fall on the largest businesses. But we also have to recognise that non-domestic rates are based on the value of property, not the turnover of a company, its profit or its ability to pay. A business that has a high rateable value as a site isn't necessarily a large business or necessarily a very profitable business.

The Federation of Small Businesses says that some higher value hospitality and leisure premises have already faced increases of up to 70 per cent following revaluation. Some hotels could now be excluded from the 30 per cent reduction and made to pay the higher multiplier instead.

I'm also concerned about the unintended consequences of today's announcements. Few in this Chamber would, I think, challenge the notion of raising business rates on large out-of-town retailers, but these proposals will likely also impact valuable sites employing hundreds of workers each in places like the city centres of Cardiff, Swansea, Newport and Wrexham.

I was speaking earlier with Gwyn, regretting the loss of Marks and Spencer in Swansea. Will there be more retailers of that kind that are likely to take decisions to close their stores in the middle of our cities?

I'd point out here that Cardiff alone makes a net contribution of around £100 million to the Welsh national non-domestic rates pot. Will the Minister therefore share, in advance of the budget—today, if possible—the intended threshold for the higher multiplier, the number, type and location of the properties that will pay more, the average and largest expected increases, and her assessment of the effect on jobs, investment and prices? Can she also set out how she will avoid a cliff edge for businesses whose rateable value is just above £51,000?

What these questions demonstrate, I think, Minister, is that what's actually needed is wholesale reform of the business rates system in its totality. There was a commitment to that effect in Welsh Labour's manifesto, just as there was in Plaid Cymru's manifesto. I know that this new Government loves a review, it loves a commission. I wonder, Minister, if you could explain why your announcement today—welcome though it broadly is—is simply making tweaks at the margins and not getting into the more comprehensive changes that your party promised before the election. Our offer, as Welsh Labour, is to work with you so that we can make the system fair and so that we can incentivise businesses and local authorities to grow the value of NDR receipts and to drive wider economic growth. Thank you.

Thank you for those comments and the welcome and the challenges that you set out there in your contribution. Of course, one of the advantages, hopefully, that the businesses that are eligible for this support will see is that it will be a 30 per cent reduction that will be permanent for them. The reduction that's in place for pubs at the moment is discretionary and is only 15 per cent, and therefore, this will excel compared to that and it will be automatic for those businesses. It will allow those businesses that are eligible to be able to plan on the basis of the guarantee that they will have that, if the regulations on this measure pass, this will be something that they can plan for ahead of time. Of course, we are adding to the system that's already in place for shops, that system that was introduced by the previous finance Minister under the Labour Government, so the use of the multiplier, the different multipliers, was introduced by my predecessor in that context. So what I'm doing is expanding the number of businesses that are eligible for this cut in non-domestic rates.

And it is a first step, as I mentioned, as we start to think about how we can go further with the town centre taskforce that has been set up in terms of developing the high street and supporting the high street as the heart of a number of communities. But also the challenge you set forward is a challenge that is about the system as a whole, of course. You speak particularly about city centres, which have large shops and have important anchor stores in the middle of those cities. It is important, of course, that we think about striking the right balance in terms of supporting the smaller businesses, which is a continuous call coming from Members in this Chamber, but with an eye to not disadvantaging the larger businesses too much. So striking that balance is important. In terms of publishing the exact multipliers that will be operational for 2027, that will have to wait until we have the budget for next year, when that is introduced. That is when that will become operational, will become known. 

And then on the point about the full reform of this system that is needed, I think, as a Senedd—. I hear it from different parties and from different Members: rather than making small changes here and there and sometimes making them in a reactive way, reacting to whatever issue is affecting the economy, we need to look at this area as a whole, in its entirety. I would hope, as we discuss and test out more of the ideas relating to business rates, we will come to a consensus across this Chamber with regard to the political appetite that there is to address this work. I would be happy to be part of that discussion.

On these cliff edges you mentioned—when £51,000 is the limit and if you're one side or the other of that, it's a 30 per cent difference in how much tax you pay—this is one of the considerations certainly that needs to be looked at in the future. So, there are further changes that I think the Government could look into making, with support from this Chamber, and then there is a broader question about addressing and reforming the system as a whole. I'm sure that the discussion on that will continue.

Cabinet Minister, thank you for your statement today. I do share some of the concerns raised by our Reform colleague in terms of the way in which this information has been disseminated to Members of the Senedd. I think it is right and proper that in the vast majority of instances, information is shared in this Chamber first before being released to the press, just to show some respect to the Chamber itself and the Members within it.

But in terms of the meat of this statement, I certainly welcome the direction of travel from the Government on this and recognise that business rates represent a significant cost for businesses across Wales at a time when many are already under considerable pressures. Cabinet Minister, you'll be aware that our high streets have been struggling to adapt to changing consumer behaviour and the continued growth of online retail. The Welsh Conservatives have consistently argued that the tax burden on those businesses is far too high. We also need to be honest about the wider pressures that businesses are facing, dealing with taxation of all types alongside employee pressures and rising energy costs. Of course, business rates are only one part of a wider cost of doing business.

Colleagues have already raised a couple of questions I was interested in. I will point to three issues and questions, though. Respectfully, Cabinet Minister, I'm not sure if you fully responded to Huw Thomas's question, particularly around the cliff edge. You acknowledged it in your response, but, of course, there has potentially been the introduction of a new cliff edge here. I wonder what assurances you can give those businesses that they won't feel the pain of that, potentially, and that there may be some tapering that could take place so businesses aren't falling foul one way or the other. What confidence can you give to businesses that that is properly understood and recognised in terms of a potential tapering of this relief beyond that £51,000? A broader discussion you mentioned in regard to business rates, I think, does need to take place. I'd expect Welsh Government to lead on that.

There was one specific issue I'd be grateful for you to consider in this discussion, and that's one around the particular challenges faced by businesses who are just starting out. Business rates will ordinarily apply as soon as they start up, meaning firms can face a tax bill very soon after opening their doors without necessarily generating real income at that point. I wonder what consideration you might give to our proposal for business rate free periods for new retail businesses and others on the high street to give those entrepreneurs the opportunity to establish themselves before facing this additional cost.

Another consideration on which I'd be interested in your response is the role of local authorities in business rates. Of course, many people think that councils set those business rates, but they merely collect them on behalf of the Welsh Government. But I wonder if there's an opportunity to incentivise our local authorities by allowing them to retain an element of any non-domestic rates growth in their area, to allow our councils to invest in our town centres or incentivise our councils perhaps to invest in those town centres more than they currently do.

Finally, Minister, I'm interested—and it's back to this particular announcement today—in how it's going to impact businesses that offer mixed services. In my own constituency, Banana Ben's play centre and cafe may be impacted by this. They've been refused food and drink hospitality rate relief in the past, despite food and drink accounting for 60 per cent of their floor space and 61 per cent of their turnover. Companies House classify it as an unlicensed restaurant and cafe. The business provides indoor play alongside food and drink for families, and the two, of course, are not mutually exclusive, yet it will not, it seems, qualify for the equivalent relief. Businesses of a similar nature in England absolutely do. So, I wonder whether you could respond to that and what you might seek to do to address this disparity to ensure that Welsh businesses are not disadvantaged simply because they operate in Wales, perhaps offering more than one service to their customers. Diolch yn fawr iawn. 

Thank you for the contribution. 

I was obviously too keen to go to the pub to prepare for this statement, so I'll reflect on what everybody has united upon in thinking about the timing of statements. But just very genuinely from me, I could have made this statement during the summer recess, in the peak of the tourism season, but I quite deliberately left it until the first day back. But, yes, I'll consider the timing, and getting back in to the rhythm of the work of this place is something that I need to do.

Yes, just on the issue around a cliff edge, I do recognise that this is a very difficult issue for some businesses who fall the wrong side of a support package of this kind, and only very closely. So, the tapering issue is something that I will be interested in looking at, but I didn't want to delay the simplicity and the ability to make this statement and to move on this level of support of 30 per cent reduction for the hospitality and leisure sectors in this way by trying to do everything at the same time in one go. So, these are issues that I will be returning to, and they are issues, of course, that the high-street taskforce will also want to look at, I'm sure, as are many of the issues that you raise. The issue around whether new start-ups on the high street should be given a holiday period for that first six months to a year of trading as a kind of incentive for them to take up, quite often, empty shops, making local authorities more proactive in their local area to support business growth as well by incentivising growth of businesses and growth of business rate collection, with some payback back to local authorities—. I'm always interested in how we can make these systems include more incentives to do better all the time and to have more economic activity. So, those are some things that I hope the town-centres taskforce will look at, but also that we do in response to the issues that are raised in the Chamber here today and at other times.

On mixed businesses, I've come across this as an issue in my own constituency at different times as well, so I'm aware that it's an issue in the system and a tension. I will need to go back to my officials and see whether there is anything in the greater extent of the categorisation that we're now bringing into the 30 per cent reduction that will enable mixed businesses of the kinds you've described to qualify for this. But I can't give a guarantee on the floor here in any individual case or generally on mixed businesses, but I will look at it to see what is possible.

As we know, high streets are at the heart of our communities, and the Cabinet Minister's announcement today to cut business rates by 30 per cent for hospitality and leisure businesses across Wales is a very welcome step to rebalance the non-domestic rate system. In addition to today's announcement, can you confirm whether any consideration has also been given to the small business rates relief threshold and, as Sam has already mentioned and you've touched upon, business rates holidays for new businesses, both of which would be a boost for our local entrepreneurs?

Whilst there would be a cost to such measures, one way to cover this, perhaps, would be to consider different valuation methods or multipliers for certain types of property, for example, data centres, which do not currently have their own classification. This way, some of the extractive profit generated from these properties could be retained and instead used to benefit local communities.

I look forward to working with the Cabinet Minister on longer term reforms that fall outside today's scope of this announcement.

Thank you for your contribution, and thank you for stretching the discussion to other areas that this Senedd will be interested in over the next months and years. As I've said, this is very much a first step to support businesses on our high street. It's a reasonably straightforward support package that we can offer at this time. But there are very many aspects of business rate support that need to be looked at and many ideas here this afternoon. The use of differential multipliers, as you've suggested, is new to the way we do our business rate support in this context. It was first introduced on retail properties and on shops by the predecessor Government; we're extending that today. But we need to, again, think about extending the categorisation and possibly categorising some for the first time, as new businesses and new properties develop within our economy. So, there is much still to do on this. This is a first step. For those businesses that will benefit from this, it is most definitely welcome in very challenging times. But there are an array of different measures that the Government currently works on to support businesses, and there is much that both this Government and the UK Government can do to support businesses in what is a very challenging time.

Thank you. Finally, Art Wright.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. First, I'd like to thank the Minister for the statement. Newport and Islwyn have seen a worrying number of pub and hospitality closures in the past few years. These businesses are at the heart of our communities, yet they continue to face mounting pressure from rising costs. Their closure results in lost jobs, reduced economic activity, lower footfall in our town centres and the loss of valuable community spaces. It also reduces the opportunity for young people to gain vital first-job experience and develop the skills needed to enter the wider workforce.

Whilst the Welsh Government's 30 per cent reduction in business rates is welcome, many hospitality businesses continue to face significant financial pressures. As David Chapman, and I'll quote, from UKHospitality Cymru has observed, running a hospitality business in this current climate is like

'plate spinning when you're riding an exercise bike'.

It's a good start, but we must go further. Given the continued loss of jobs in community pubs across Newport and Islwyn, does the Cabinet Minister believe that a 30 per cent reduction in business rates goes far enough? And what further action will the Welsh Government take to support the sector to prevent further closures? Diolch.

The points you've made and the illustrations you've given as to how important the hospitality sector is in our various communities, and how important it is for different aspects of the economy, how many of our young people have their first jobs in pubs—. I had my first job in a pub, and I pulled my last pint in a pub in 1987. So, I hadn't done it until I pulled a pint just recently, and it showed that 30 years and more had passed since I pulled a pint.

But to be serious and to respond to the points that you've made, this will be a contribution that alleviates some of the pressure on our hospitality and leisure sector. It is more than just pubs, it is cafes and restaurants, and it is gyms and museums and libraries. So, it's the widest possible array, and when you add that to shops as well, it's the widest possible array of many of the businesses that feature in our town centres and some of our villages as well. So, it goes further than Government has done before in Wales. So, that's the important contribution of today. But I'm sure, as some have said already, that there are a myriad of different other issues that face our hospitality and leisure sectors. There are many pressures in our economy. The inflationary pressure that we are feeling today and will possibly be increasing again is something that puts particular pressure on so many of our high-street businesses. There are actions that the UK Government as well as the Welsh Government can take. But, hopefully, today will have been a strong signal that this Government and this Senedd believe that our small businesses that are trying to work so hard to keep going in our communities right throughout Wales in difficult times—this Government has their back and will try and take all initiatives that it can to support them in these testing times.

Thank you, Minister.

We will now move on to item 5, a statement by the Deputy Minister for Skills and Tertiary Education: review of higher education. I call on the Deputy Minister for Skills and Tertiary Education, Cefin Campbell. 

Thank you very much, Dirprwy Lywydd. I'm pleased to confirm the launch of the independent review of higher education in Wales, following the publication of the terms of reference on 4 August at the Garreg Las National Eisteddfod, in accordance with our commitment to do so within 100 days of the creation of this Government. This review forms part of our wider mission to build a stronger, fairer and more prosperous Wales through education, skills, research and opportunity.

Higher education is one of Wales's most important national assets. Our universities are educating future generations, driving research and innovation, supporting public services, strengthening communities and are making a significant contribution to our culture and language. They help create the skills, ideas and opportunities on which Wales's future prosperity depends.

But whilst our universities continue to transform lives and contribute to our economic, social and cultural life every day, they are currently, like universities across the United Kingdom, under significant financial pressure, caused by a range of complex and connected challenges. These include their funding model, the domestic and international student markets, looming demographic changes, the challenge created by artificial intelligence, a changing economy and new directions in UK research and innovation policy. Together they risk creating a perfect storm, one that our universities may not be able to navigate without fundamental reform.

The Welsh sector reported a collective underlying deficit of £82 million in 2024-25. Forecasts published by Medr suggest that financial pressures are likely to continue, raising significant questions about the long-term sustainability of parts of the sector. Total student enrolments at our universities declined by 11 per cent between 2022-23 and 2024-25. International enrolments also fell by around a third during that period, while enrolments of Welsh-domiciled students fell by 8 per cent. The Universities and Colleges Admissions Service data from the past two recruitment cycles show that these enrolment challenges have continued. Total research grants and contracts income to Welsh universities fell by £35 million between 2022-23 and 2024-25, primarily due to the final withdrawal of European Union structural and regional development funding.

Alongside these challenges, our student finance system has reached the limits of affordability within the spending controls imposed by UK Treasury. We must consider how to best target support for learners where it's most needed, whilst also ensuring the long-term sustainability of the system to the Government and without overburdening graduates with their loan repayments. The scale and complexity of these challenges mean that doing nothing is not an option.

All these challenges are interconnected and require a strategic response. Incremental adjustments alone will not be sufficient. We need a clear view of how higher education can continue to serve Wales in a changing world, while remaining financially sustainable and delivering the greatest possible benefit for learners, communities and the Welsh economy. That is why we are establishing this review. Its central purpose will be to recommend how Wales can secure a sustainable higher education sector and student finance system for future generations. We want public investment to deliver the strongest possible economic, social and cultural return for Wales, and for Wales to be a destination of choice for learners.

The review will take a comprehensive view of the higher education system. It will examine student support, institutional funding, research and innovation, participation, graduate outcomes, and the organisation and resilience of the sector in Wales. But it will not limit itself to traditional full-time undergraduate study; it will also consider part-time provision, higher education delivered through colleges at level 4 and level 5 study, higher and degree apprenticeships, and postgraduate education. The review will also consider the commitments set out in our programme for government and election manifesto, including how we can increase the proportion of Welsh Government student support expenditure that benefits Wales, how to incentivise more Welsh students and graduates to study, work and train here and increase participation in Welsh-medium and bilingual higher education. Supporting the Welsh language will be a core consideration. We want to expand opportunities for learners to develop and use Welsh throughout their studies, and ensure that Welsh-medium and bilingual provision continues to flourish as part of a modern and inclusive tertiary education system.

The review will be conducted independently, because, as sector representatives have argued, a review of this significance should be evidence-led, objective and capable of taking a long-term view. As a Government, we have set out the challenge and the terms of reference, but the chair and panel will assess the evidence independently and develop their recommendations accordingly.

Dirprwy Lywydd, I am therefore delighted to announce that the review will be chaired by Professor Patrick Prendergast, former provost and president of Trinity College Dublin and the current chair of South East Technological University in Ireland. Professor Prendergast brings extensive experience of higher education leadership and institutional transformation in Ireland. He will be supported by a small panel of experts with experience across higher education policy, student finance, institutional sustainability, governance, and the intersection between universities and businesses. I will be confirming the full membership of the panel in the very near future and expect it to meet for the first time in early October.

Stakeholder engagement will be central to the review's work, and I want to remind Members that the sector itself has called for and has welcomed this review. University students, staff, employers, Medr, trade unions and wider partners will have opportunities to contribute evidence and perspectives throughout the process. We will be inviting key stakeholders to join a stakeholder advisory group to ensure a broad range of voices are heard while preserving the independence of the review. I will also ask the chair to engage with opposition parties in the Senedd and keep them informed of progress and emerging findings. I myself will be meeting with vice-chancellors once again in the autumn.

So, given the tight time frame for this review, I expect it to build upon the substantial evidence gathered through the previous Government's call for submissions on the future of tertiary education, as well as its published evaluation of the Diamond reforms, whilst also seeking further evidence, where required, on the specific issues identified in the terms of reference. I can today confirm that a summary of those submissions has been published on the Welsh Government website.

The work of this review will not be easy. Difficult choices and trade-offs will need to be considered, and recommendations must be both ambitious and realistic. They will need to operate within the financial constraints facing Welsh Government and the wider public sector. However, I believe, and I am encouraged from the conversations I've had with Professor Prendergast that he shares this view, that this review represents an important opportunity. It starts from a position of confidence in what higher education can and does contribute to Wales, whilst recognising that the status quo is not sustainable.

To close, Dirprwy Lywydd, I saw this potential myself at last week’s European Association for International Education conference in Glasgow. There I met representatives from all our universities, and I had productive meetings with them and with international partners who are eager to work with them. I also heard about how rejoining Erasmus+ will provide new opportunities to students, staff and institutions for international study, work placements, exchanges, training and research in other countries.

Fundamentally, the aim of this review is to ensure that we have a higher education system that is financially resilient, that is internationally respected, that is rooted in communities, that is supportive of the Welsh language, and that is capable of helping to build a more prosperous Wales. I look forward very much to following the panel's progress and working with the sector and across the Senedd to shape a sustainable future for higher education in Wales. 

I thank the Minister for the advance notice of today's statement, and I agree with the fundamental premise behind the review. We know that higher education in Wales at the moment is in an incredibly difficult position, and we all want to see it being in the best and strongest place it possibly can be. I declare an interest as somebody who has just finished a Master's degree from a Welsh educational institution, but I'm still awaiting award of the qualification so I can't quite use it for bragging rights just yet.

But one of the things that I found pertinent when speaking to some of my fellow students on the course is their perception around value for money when it comes to higher education at the moment. We know that tuition fees and student debt are incredible burdens for students going to university at the moment. My own level of student debt stands at just over £60,000 for an undergraduate and then a one-year Master's degree. I currently pay about £600 a month in student loan payments, and I'm one of the lucky ones, thanks to being in this job. But the average student who does graduate will work potentially for a decade—10 years or more—before they even begin to pay back more than just the interest on their student loans.

When it comes down to value for money for university graduates, that's one of the things that they consider when looking to go. When we look at the average earnings for university graduates after five years of graduating from their course, they were, in 2023-24, £31,500 for graduates from Welsh institutions. That compares to £33,000 from English institutions and £35,100 from Scottish ones. So, when we're asking the question about why should students choose universities in Wales, we also need to address the employability, the reward for that employment and the return on their investment into their education that they get when moving forward into Wales.

I'm glad that the review as well will consider the impact of AI as a crucial factor. I think that it's definitely contributing to the current graduate recruitment crisis that is ongoing across the UK, and it's clear to me that there needs to be at least some aspect of education in terms of AI in teaching our university students and our young people how to use it effectively, as it's likely going to be an embedded part of the modern economy for all graduates going forward.

I also think it's important that we look at how our university system can engage with technical education alongside. We know that there are certainly noises being made by the UK Government, and I think there is sentiment shared across the Chamber about the importance of technical education and education in trades and skills, and we should look at whether there is a part that our universities can play in bringing that technical education to bear for our young people.

Research and innovation is also an incredibly important aspect of our tertiary education system. We've seen the result of research and innovation. The AI craze that's going on in the economy at the moment has delivered incredible amounts of investment and value to the economy, and that's as a direct result of research undertaken by universities and recent graduates. So, I fundamentally support the objective of the review to see how we can strengthen our research and innovation in Wales.

I also welcome the overtures made within the review about strengthening the ties between employers and education, whether that is between the private sector and the public sector, and I hope that the review does take evidence from private sector employers in Wales to try and find out where the gaps may lie in between, why the entry-level jobs aren't existing and the opportunities don't exist in the same way as they have done in previous years when compared to the number of graduates.

Finally, I welcome the scope of the review, including colleges and degree apprenticeships, but I'd like to ask: will it also include fully remote university study? That’s something I'm noticing is an increasing trend—people who are studying their courses, whether it's undergraduate or postgraduate, fully remotely. And I note that the full report is due from the review from winter 2027-28, with the aim of measures being introduced for the start of the 2028-29 academic year. Given the funding deficit currently facing universities and the reduction in enrolment numbers, are there any actions planned or mechanisms in place to take shorter term actions if they are necessary? Because there will be some students who are either looking at starting university now or are currently involved in their courses who may be concerned about the future of their education given the funding shortfall, even though the review is not due to conclude for a couple of years yet. Diolch yn fawr.

Well, thank you very much for those questions. 

Thank you. There are so many different aspects there; I'll try to cover as many as I can.

Value for money and tuition fees. We recognise the importance of a fair and sustainable system of student support. I look at it in terms of three aspects, in many ways. The student fees are what keep our universities going. So they need those fees, unless we find other models of funding. There's also the aspect of making it fair for students as well, and you mentioned the burden of the debt that many young people carry. I should maybe also declare an interest. I have three children who went to university and are currently burdened with a huge amount of debt, which they will spend most of their working life repaying. And there are conversations going on amongst young people now as to whether it's worth them going to university or not. So, that is another aspect. And the third aspect, of course, is in terms of Welsh Government support. We want the benefits of that to be the best for Wales. So, when we look at those three aspects, it's a tightrope we have to walk in order to get that balance right.

You mentioned technical education. Now, I'm a firm believer in engaging with young people and educating them around the different pathways that are possible for them, not only the traditional work or university route, but there are other routes as well to further education, to work-based learning, apprenticeship schemes and so on. And in 2027, when we'll be introducing vocational certificates of secondary education as part of the Welsh curriculum, they will be exposed to opportunities to have vocational studies, which will engage a number of learners that are disengaged at the moment, and will open opportunities for them to maybe follow pathways that can lead to skills development and even apprenticeship degrees. I believe that our universities should look at providing more technical education. It's one of the interesting discussions I had with Professor Prendergast, because he is the chair of South East Technological University in Ireland. So I'm looking forward to him bringing his experience to bear on the work of the panel.

Research and innovation. We need to support our universities to have a greater share of that UK Research and Innovation funding. They currently only get about 2 per cent, whereas the Barnett consequential would be something around 5 per cent. So we need to support them to compete better for that funding.

And finally, you mentioned short-term actions. The panel will report back in about 18 months' time, but there will be a preliminary report in about six to nine months' time, especially around the financial support for students. Medr are keeping a close eye on what is going on in every university in Wales, and they feed that information back to me. So, if we need to step in and support, we will, but, at the moment, it's just a matter of monitoring the situation, keeping a close eye on what is happening and providing the best level of support we can. Diolch.

Can I refer Members to my register of interests and the fact that I am an adult learner at Cardiff and Vale College? I wanted to start—. Thank you for your statement, Deputy Minister. But I think it would be remiss of me to start this statement without asking about what I think is the elephant in the room here, which is: what about further education? When you came into Government, you and the Cabinet Minister said you would take a systemic approach to education, combining higher education and further education, and I think that is the right approach. It runs from early years right the way through people's life course.

However, what we have here is one part of the system hived off, and that is in sharp contrast to the approach taken by the previous Labour Government, where we issued a comprehensive call for evidence on tertiary education. So, I suppose my first question to you is: you are very well aware—I don't need to remind you—of the funding pressures in FE, the participation pressures in FE. You'll have heard from the chief executives and principals in recent months. I know, too, that you are very well aware that FE is where some of our most disadvantaged, most vulnerable learners are educated—the learners who are most likely to have their life chances inhibited by becoming not in education, employment or training. You've said in the statement that there are finite resources and there will have to be trade-offs. Given that this review just looks at higher education, how will you measure any potential trade-offs for FE? How will you consider the pressures on FE, and how will you consider the need to look after those learners?

The statement commits to looking at part-time learners, and I've asked you previously about part-time learners. The Diamond reforms have been a huge success in terms of the numbers of part-time learners studying at our universities. What assurance can you give that the review will protect the interests of part-time learners in higher education?

There's no mention of Seren in this statement today, and when you issued the statement in the summer announcing there would be a review of higher education, there was a reference to Seren. You said there would be a review of Academi Seren, and indeed it's picked up in the Cabinet Minister's action plan on literacy. You said that it would be about bringing together Reaching Wider and the Seren programme. Now, I know that you are very well aware that Reaching Wider is a different kind of programme to Seren. Reaching Wider is participation; Seren is about stretch. It's about ensuring that our most able learners can go to the very furthest point that they can go. It is the only thing that we do in Wales that benefits our more able and talented learners.

So, I'd like to ask you whether this review—and I welcome that there's an independent chair and that we're going to be kept updated—is going to look at the Seren programme as well, or whether that is going to be done separately. Is it your intention, as part of the review of Seren, to engage with Oxford and Cambridge? Because if young people are capable of going to some of the very best universities, not just in the UK, but anywhere in the world, then they should be encouraged to do that.

We on these benches have always viewed Seren as a learner-focused programme designed to ensure that our young people can be the very best that they can be. I want to offer you a gentle warning that we will fight very hard on these benches to protect that aspect of Seren, and I want to ask you whether it is your intention, as part of the work that you're doing on Seren, or as part of this review, to try in any way to discourage young people from studying, whether it's over the border or wherever they want to go, to achieve their education and be the very best that they can be.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. Thank you, Lynne. A number of important points. I'll start off with your first point around the pressures on FE colleges. We absolutely recognise that there are pressures, as there were last year, which is why Medr allocated an additional £6.25 million in this financial year to support those pressures.

In discussions I've had with Medr and ColegauCymru with regard to this academic term, we are seeing the pressures again in terms of increased enrolments, especially around levels 1 and 2. So, we will be considering the situation and making a decision around about November, when numbers will have settled down. We understand that funding pressures are acute on one or two FE colleges, but those discussions are ongoing.

We want to support the FE colleges as best as we can, because, for the reasons you outlined, they do provide opportunities for those young people, especially those at risk of becoming NEET, and we are acutely aware that we can't allow them to fall through the net in any way by not supporting them. So, we will take a considered view when we know the final numbers closer to November. But in terms of your wider point, we are well aware of the financial challenges.

Part-time learners: absolutely, the review will look at this. I believe in lifelong learning as being an opportunity for people to upskill, reskill, and to re-engage with education at any time in their life, and that can be done through part-time provision or through apprenticeship schemes or in-work provision through the trade union movement as well.

Seren: I'm hoping to make an announcement soon about Seren. You're right, I did say back on 11 June, I think it was, when I made a statement, that we are hoping to bring together the strongest elements of Academi Seren and also the Reaching Wider programme. And you're absolutely right to say that they are two different programmes. Academi Seren provides the stretch for the most able and talented pupils and we want to keep that, obviously, because we need to stretch our most academically gifted young people. And it's not a matter of discouraging them from studying wherever they choose. I would just want to flip that on its head: what we want to do as a Welsh Government is to encourage them to stay in Wales and to support our universities here. But it's not about discouragement at all, it's about encouraging them to stay, which is slightly different to what you were possibly alluding to.

The Reaching Wider programme is important as well, because it targets young people from disadvantaged communities, and you know and others know that the number of young people from disadvantaged communities going to universities is lower in Wales than in any of the other home nations. So, we want to encourage, through a cohesive programme, that to happen as well. So, I think that answers the main points, Lynne, and I'd be happy to have a conversation with you about any of these, moving forward. Diolch.

Thanks. Sam Rowlands.

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Apologies for my slight lapse in concentration, things seem to be more lively outside the Chamber today than they have been, perhaps, inside it.

Thank you, Cabinet Minister, for your statement. Tertiary education is, of course, crucial in developing the skills and knowledge that our economy needs now and in the future, and the stakes for the higher education review could hardly be higher at this stage. And the many external reviews of Welsh higher education over recent decades, in my view, have failed to secure the long-term sustainability of the sector and have instead contributed to a cycle of managed decline.

But on this review specifically, you'll be aware, Cabinet Minister, that in Scotland when Ministers have sought to work with universities to develop solutions and secure their commitments to change, before holding them to account for delivery, there's been that close working relationship with those universities. So, I wonder how you will ensure and give assurances to our universities here in Wales that you'll be adopting a similar approach, working seriously with those universities as partners in developing and implementing these reforms, of course within the context of the independent panel that you're seeking to or you will be setting up.

There's already been mention of the central role that universities play in our economy and our growth in the future. We welcome the review's commitment to look at the role that alternative pathways, such as colleges and degree apprenticeships, should play in a wider education landscape. Of course, colleges can provide flexible modes of delivery and be more accessible to learners, and we know the increasing importance of a degree apprenticeship. So, will you direct the review to look specifically at what barriers there are in Wales to prevent our young people from accessing some of those alternative pathways that colleagues have already mentioned, those alternative pathways to higher education.

Within that context of economic growth, universities are important engines of place-based economic growth as well, not just the institution on its own. There are great examples of universities working closely in partnership with colleges and local industry to respond to the skills that are needed. Now, FE is not covered in the review, so how will you make sure there's a joined-up approach to meeting place-based skills requirements and opportunities across the tertiary systems? I appreciate that HE does need to be reviewed, but the context of their place is really important, particularly in a place like Wales.

Deputy Minister, in your terms of reference, you state that the scale and urgency of pressures on universities mean that the underlying funding sustainability of Welsh universities and the Welsh student support system must now be addressed. There's a real sense of urgency in your statements there, but the timeline that you're looking at is looking to make changes in the 2028-29 academic year. That's two years away. It doesn't really feel that urgent, quite frankly. Welsh students starting university in September will be entering the final year of their courses by the time any changes come in. Could you confirm whether you think that a two-year wait for this reform is acceptable to students, universities and businesses under pressure right now?

I just want to follow up on a comment that my colleague Lynne Neagle raised as well, Minister, in relation to this ambition of students seeking an education where it's best for them. Wales is already home to world-class universities. For many students, though, looking elsewhere in the UK or abroad is simply what's best for them and their future pathway. That should be a choice that is equally available to them. Higher education should allow our students to aspire to become the best that they can be, to be supported. They don't want to feel hemmed in by Wales-specific Government support or not. So, will you, on the floor of the Senedd today, commit to not holding back those Welsh student aspirations to study wherever is best for them? Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Sam. Thank you. A number of points and I'll deal with them as you presented them. The first one, working with the university sector: since coming into post, I think I have had more meetings with the university sector than most sectors. I've met with all the vice-chancellors on more than one occasion. I've also had more than one meeting with the chairs of the universities as well, as well as Universities Wales as the umbrella body. In Scotland last week, in the international education conference that I attended, there was a stand where all the universities of Wales were present. I spoke to every one of them about the strengths they had and the offer they could give to students, not only in the United Kingdom but across the whole of the world. So, I'm in constant touch with every one of our university partners.

In terms of the economy and developing skills, skills is the bedrock of growing the economy. If we want a thriving, prosperous economy, if we want to meet the ambitions of this Welsh Government to increase productivity as well, skills is at the heart of that. It's why we are conducting a skills audit at present. The skills audit will end, in terms of inviting people to present evidence, at the end of this month, and hopefully the report will be published around about March or April of next year. That will inform employers, universities, FE colleges and work-based learning providers about emerging sectors, where we think the priorities in terms of skills growth are going to be in the future. Because we know that sectors like AI, advanced manufacturing, semiconductors and green energy are moving rapidly, so we need to recognise the skills pipeline that we need to meet those job opportunities coming down the line.

In terms of that skills development, we are holding a skills summit on 8 October in the Swansea.com Stadium. We’re hoping to get between 150 and 170 representatives from universities, FE and, crucially, employers as well. As it happens, this afternoon I had a meeting with organisations representing the biggest employers in Wales. I had an opportunity to tell them about this skills audit. I told them that their role in developing the Welsh economy with the Welsh Government, with HE, with FE, with apprenticeship providers, is absolutely crucial, and they were on board with that message.

On the final point you made, similar to Lynne, about curtailing choice, there's absolutely no intention to curtail choice. But it's incumbent on a Welsh Government to support our Welsh universities. What we want to do is to strengthen the offer that our Welsh universities are providing so that they can get more students from Wales and from the UK to come here to Wales to study and, potentially, to work as well. Diolch.

I'd also like to refer you to my register of interests, please. Until May, I used to work at a university in Wales, and I still have family members who work in the HE sector in Wales.

Minister, this review comes at a vital time for higher education in Wales. The remit of the review is exciting and provides an opportunity to think boldly and creatively about how we want higher education to operate and, ultimately, deliver for Wales.

One of the issues that we have faced for some time now is the employability of graduates and, specifically, how we ensure that the skills and opportunities that are developed through our higher education system lead to successful careers in Wales. I believe that this review will bring those aspects together.

Often, SMEs face more challenges in terms of attracting and recruiting graduate talent. How does the Minister see the review helping us to better connect our graduates with the needs and opportunities of Welsh businesses, particularly SMEs, so that we can retain more graduate talent here in Wales, while also supporting the growth of our economy? Thank you.

Thank you very much, Sera. The role of SMEs and small businesses is entirely crucial. I think around 95 per cent of all businesses in Wales are small and medium-sized enterprises. As it happens, in the meeting that I had with representatives from Wales's largest employers earlier this afternoon, this was an issue that was raised: how can this review, and how can our universities and colleges support SMEs by providing employment for graduates and those who have qualified in other ways too. What was clear to me was that, for example, the idea of establishing a development body such as a new WDA here in Wales will provide support for SMEs to grow, and when they have that opportunity to grow, they will look to employ more people. That's where the opportunity arises for graduates to access work. But I think the important thing is to make that link between employers and universities in particular to ensure that they understand what the needs are in terms of future skills, and that they then understand at a regional level what opportunities are available for people to access employment in that particular area.

I'd like to thank the Deputy Minister for sight of his statement. Deputy Minister, you quite correctly referred to prosperity a few times in the economy, and indeed there's a lot of evidence that the success of the economy is linked to education. We've had well-rehearsed arguments about PISA results at secondary level, but at a higher education level, I'll point to some evidence from around the world. We know that, for example, in terms of the top 100 universities, we have between nine and 14 from England, two in Scotland, with one just outside of the top 100, but alas none in Wales, and none close to being in the top 100 in Wales. Our top university comes in just above 200. Professor Prendergast has successfully run a top 100 university in Ireland, and I'm wondering whether you'd be prepared to ask this group to look at a strategy for creating a top 100 university in Wales, because we should have a top 100 university in Wales, and we need a top 100 university in Wales.

I couldn't agree more. We only have one of the eight universities as part of the Russell Group of universities, and I would want all of our universities to develop in terms of their offer and their standing in the United Kingdom and across the world. That is why the panel is being set up, to look at ways of making them more viable and sustainable, while also trying to support our students as best we can. We can't kill the goose that lays the golden egg. Without students, universities don't exist, so we have to get that balance right, which is why we're asking the panel to undertake this important work. But I absolutely understand where you're coming from. We need all of our universities to succeed and to improve as well.

Deputy Minister, fear of debt is a growing reason for many young people opting out of studying for a degree. I recall the days as recently as two years ago when the money-saving expert Martin Lewis advised students who were eligible for plan 2 loans to take them even if they didn't need them, and invest them, because the interest rates in those days were so low. All of that has changed very quickly with the hiking of interest rates on plan 2 loans and the UK Government's education Secretary calling these egregious and at the top of her in-tray. That's why, in our manifesto for the Senedd election as Welsh Labour, we included a plan to decouple our plan 2 loans from the English system so that Wales can set fair and affordable interest rates, ensuring all young people who may wish to go to university do not feel cost is a barrier. That's also why when I held your position I rejected the freezing of the repayment threshold, ensuring graduates on lower incomes were not drawn into repayments at a time when they might not be able to afford it. In your review, will you commit to working with the UK Government on the issue of plan 2 student interest rates, exploring the importance of continuing to reject a freeze of that repayment threshold, and, perhaps most importantly, exploring the decoupling of plan 2 to create a Wales-only fair system that students and graduates can have faith in over the long term?

Thank you, Vikki. You've hit upon one of the most difficult decisions we will have to make as a Welsh Government. You will know the UK Government has indicated its intention to proceed with a freeze to the plan 2 repayment threshold at the current rate of £29,385 in England for the next three financial years. You, as a previous Government, decided to put that on hold, and it's a decision we now have to make. Again, it comes back to the balance between what we expect our students to repay in terms of loans and the burden on them over most of their working life, but also the finances that come from tuition fees as well.

You will have heard a lot of noise in the press across the UK over recent days—the weekend in particular—putting pressure on the Prime Minister to rethink this freeze. I think it's wise for us in Wales to wait to see what the UK Government does first, because many of the regulations around UK Treasury involvement with our plan 2 tie in very closely indeed. I think we will wait to see what the UK Government does before we come to a final position.

Thank you. And finally, Kiera Marshall.

Diolch, Weinidog, for the update today. I want to see more opportunities for learners—not only in Cardiff, but across Wales—who are from the most disadvantaged backgrounds. Since 2020, we haven't seen any meaningful movement in closing the gap between the amount of young people from the most affluent areas going to university compared to those from the most disadvantaged areas. Growing up in Townhill in Swansea, I saw the impact of this gap first-hand on my friends and my neighbours and I'm really keen to support the Government to ensure that the next generation from similar areas across the whole of Wales are given fair opportunities into education. We must have more ambition in providing opportunities to communities that need it most, and at the same time tackling the widening inequality that's happening across the UK. What will this review do to support widening participation across higher education? I think one way we'll agree that we could do this is through degree apprenticeships, but the pathways and the general awareness of degree apprenticeships haven't helped close this gap as of yet. So, how could this review look at furthering the use of degree apprenticeships to help close the widening participation gaps?

Diolch. That's a really good question to finish off with. It relates to some of the answers I've given previously, but this Welsh Government is absolutely committed to widening participation. The fact that we have, as I mentioned earlier on, a lower number of our Welsh young people going to university than any other part of the United Kingdom is disappointing. We need to raise their ambitions, work closely with schools in those kinds of areas, to make university a destination for those young people.

But I also want to make it known that going to university isn't the only pathway available to our young people. There is a degree apprenticeship scheme that we are happy to support—and I would like to see more young people going along that pathway—but FE colleges, work-based learning, all of that, give different opportunities and options to our young people. I want to get away from the traditional 'work or university' options; there are so many other options as well. I think it's incumbent on our teaching profession, our careers advice people as well, to give as much information about all the options available to our young people, because we want to upskill them and make them as ready as possible for the world of work. Diolch.

Thank you, Deputy Minister.

We will move on now to item 6, statement by the Cabinet Minister for Education and Welsh Language, the foundational literacy and numeracy plan. I call on the Cabinet Minister, Anna Brychan.

Diolch yn fawr, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Following the results of PISA tests taken last year and reported last week, I am today publishing our foundational literacy and numeracy plan. This plan represents an important first step in the development of an equitable system that works for all. It is integral to our PISA response, but it is not just a response to PISA. Our own data is telling us that we are not where we need to be. Our own teachers, leaders and the wider education system want greater clarity, consistency of expectation and greater support to make a difference in the classroom. We have been here before, and successive PISA rounds have highlighted significant and deep-seated issues that have been many years in the making, and that's precisely why we are taking decisive action now.

In many ways, these results reinforce what we already knew: standards of literacy and numeracy in particular require significant and sustained focus, and we must do more to ensure our highest achieving learners reach their full potential. I'm encouraged that our most disadvantaged learners compare well internationally, but data shows that many of our learners could and should be doing better.

Let me be clear: this is not the fault of schools or teachers or support staff. We have inherited a system that lacks clarity, coherence and direction, and literacy and numeracy have been lost in the noise of significant reform. Schools are also responding to increasingly complex learner needs. Demand for specialist support, intervention and wider services continues to grow. We also recognise continued funding challenges. We see the same picture across all our public services as a consequence of an extremely difficult financial settlement. We know too that many of these concerns are shared across this Chamber. These things don't make our ambition to raise standards any easier, but they do demonstrate that educational change is complex and multifaceted, and one that requires a whole-system response. I have long argued that educators, whether teachers, leaders or support staff, are our strongest asset, and it is our responsibility as a Government to ensure that they have the tools to do the job.

Our foundational literacy and numeracy plan is about setting clear expectations for action. It sets out in detail what we will do and when, and it brings together all key stakeholders under the same vision for change. The plan recognises the range of partners that have a role in our shared effort to raise standards. Parents and carers, early years practitioners, teachers and education practitioners, leaders of schools and settings, and support partners all play a pivotal role in literacy and numeracy development across the age range.

We have worked closely with leaders as well as local authorities, Estyn and our supporting bodies, Dysgu and Adnodd, to develop a clear and coherent way forward. Dysgu has a crucial role, as our national professional learning body, in the delivery of high-quality, evidence-based reading and mathematics support to teachers across Wales. This is expert support that is based on a knowledge of our curriculum and our context. We expect all schools and local authorities to engage with Dysgu as its offer to teachers and leaders develops. It is important that educators, wherever in Wales they work, have access to the same level of support and can benefit from that.

None of this means that I am any less committed to the Curriculum for Wales, and I have no intention of moving away from its underlying principles and purpose-driven orientation. I have seen first-hand the difference it can make to learners, but literacy and numeracy are the gateway into the curriculum and the means by which learners can access the full range of opportunities it has to offer. I will also set out in the coming months a targeted review of the Curriculum for Wales, focusing on key areas for refinement and clarification.

Today is about recognising the urgency of the situation and that more immediate action is needed. That's why this plan is so important and sets out the actions, in the short and medium term, to raise standards.

First, it establishes year-on-year expectations that give absolute clarity about what children should learn and when, ensuring greater consistency across Wales. We will publish this detail for consultation shortly, so that it becomes statutory guidance as soon as possible.

We will also be unequivocal in our guidance about systematic synthetic phonics, which is an essential tool in teachers’ armoury when helping children to read, alongside developing other reading skills. We will work with Estyn, local authorities and Dysgu to ensure it is used effectively and consistently. And indeed, I welcome Estyn’s commitment to an enhanced focus on reading and the efforts by support partners, such as the strategic partnership with local government.

Secondly, the plan will strengthen assessment and use of information. We will introduce a baseline assessment when children start school and a new indicator in year 6, so that schools have a clear understanding of where children are and of what support they need. At a Government level, we will establish national indicators to assess our progress overall, driven by clear targets. This will mean that we can monitor progress year on year, and not have to wait for PISA to tell us how we’re performing.

The plan also underlines our commitment to supporting schools to set clear targets for themselves and for their learners. We will work closely with schools and local authorities to make this happen. In addition, we expect more schools to benefit from CAL:ON Cymru, our new national centre of excellence in literacy, which has been well received by teachers and which sits front and centre of our plan.

The plan will also support literacy and numeracy beyond the classroom. We will strengthen parental engagement, promote reading and language development at home, increase access to books through school libraries, and address poverty-related barriers to learning.

By the end of this Senedd term we want to see sustained improvement in literacy and numeracy for all children and young people; more children and young people making good progress from where they start; and more young people leaving education with better qualifications, ready for further study, training or work. 

The next set of PISA results will be focused on learners who will be 15 in 2029, and we will get those results in 2030. Naturally, I’m hoping to see an improvement in Wales’s scores in the next PISA round, but I'm mindful of the need to support learners who are in our system now, and that is precisely why this plan has been developed.

Dirprwy Lywydd, we are a new Government with new ambition and make no apologies for setting the bar high. Wales is a proud educating nation whose rich history has been underpinned by a skillful workforce and a thoughtful civic society.

We owe it to current and future generations to get literacy and numeracy right. This means allowing teachers, leaders and support staff to focus on what matters most: teaching, learning and supporting learners to succeed. But getting us to where we want to be will need to be a team effort, and we are committed to working with parents, carers, educators, schools and support partners to raise standards and, with that, improve the life chances of every child in Wales. Thank you very much.

Thank you, Minister. Helen Jenner.

Diolch, Lywydd. I just want to update my register of interests as well. I now tutor overseas students at GCSE level four hours a week.

Thank you very much for that statement, and may I start by welcoming this new focus on foundational numeracy and literacy? Despite the political differences between you and I, we both agree that every child in Wales should leave school being able to read, write and use numbers confidently. These fundamentals must come first. But, Minister, there are a few significant admissions in your statement today.

You say that the education system has lacked

'clarity, coherence and direction, and literacy and numeracy have been lost in the noise of significant reform.'

So, parents will quite reasonably ask how we were ever allowed to reach that point in the first place. The latest PISA results show Wales scoring 476 in science, 459 in reading and 456 in mathematics. Welsh learners are behind the other UK nations across all three subjects, as we know. On the headline scores, Wales is now closer to Vietnam than to England in both mathematics and science. Gweinidog, I believe we should recognise this for exactly what it is: it’s a national emergency in Welsh education.

I agree, we do need clearer expectations about what children should know and when, earlier identification of those falling behind, a stronger focus on phonics and better use of assessment data. These are all very sensible suggestions. But you've said today that the national indicators will be driven by clear targets, so I would like to ask, what are those targets? What measurable improvement do you expect to see by when, and will those targets be published so that parents, teachers, this Senedd, can judge whether this plan has actually worked? Because saying that standards must improve is not the same as setting out what success looks like.

I also want to understand what this plan means for teachers on the front line of an education system in distress. You're proposing a new baseline assessment, a year 6 indicator, national indicators and greater target setting. You and I both know that teachers are under enormous pressure. I've raised before that retaining good teachers is every bit as important as recruiting them. So, what additional time, training and resources will schools receive to deliver this plan? And importantly, Minister, what are you taking away? Because if every new initiative simply means more assessments, more data collection and an increase in teacher workload, then we risk adding fuel to the fire by pushing people out of the profession.

I also want to turn to additional learning needs. You acknowledge today that schools are dealing with increasingly complex needs, growing demand for specialist support and, ironically, continued funding pressure. That is exactly why Reform argued in favour of greater funding for ALN here in Wales. But the supplementary budget you published did not provide additional funding specifically for ALN. Only when securing support for that budget became critical did the Government begin making additional offers to local authorities and schools at the coalface of ALN. So, when you say today that children will be identified earlier and receive appropriate intervention, the obvious question is: intervention from whom, and paid for by what? Identifying that a child is struggling is only the first step. Schools and councils then need teaching assistants, specialist teachers, educational psychologists and appropriate provision to actually help that child. So, do you still believe it was the right decision not to direct more money towards ALN in the supplementary budget?

When the pressures you describe in today's statement are already being felt in classrooms across Wales, your Government had the opportunity to do something about it. The funding was there, arising from greater special educational needs and disability spending in England. I'd be interested to know what representations, if any, you made during the broader negotiation stages of that budget.

And finally, Minister, accountability—atebolrwydd. You say in your statement that you are hoping to see an improvement in Wales's scores in the next PISA round. I think we need something firmer than hope. The next cohort will sit PISA, as you said, in 2029, with the results published in 2030. So, will you commit today that, when those results are published, Wales will have improved on its current scores in reading, mathematics and science? That is a straightforward measure against which this Government can be judged. Parents, teachers and indeed the children themselves deserve clarity. What does success look like? When will we see it? And who will take responsibility if it's not delivered? Will it be you, Gweinidog? Diolch yn fawr iawn i chi.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. I will try and answer as many of those questions as I can. In terms of the delivery, I want this to demonstrate progress in Wales before the end of this Senedd term. In order to do that, I think we need to be clear what delivery means, and that's why I've undertaken to set up a delivery board that will be expressly responsible for this. It will bring together all the key partners who have a stake and a responsibility in relation to this plan. I intend to chair it myself, and it will meet in the autumn term for the first time. So, I expect you to be asking me for the progress that has been made well before the next PISA round.

The workload question you raised is obviously a pertinent one, and we've discussed this before. We have undertaken a workload assessment against this plan, and I'm very keen to keep an eye on whether this is adding, because my hope and intention is that the increased clarity around the expectations will actually be helpful in that regard. Because some of the feedback—well, quite a lot of the feedback, in fact—that I regularly have from teachers and headteachers is that that lack of clarity is in itself problematic in terms of workload. But workload, as you will know too, is part of a separate piece of work that we are doing, looking in detail at that and linked to behaviour and other issues in schools that are making that engagement with learners difficult. So, that is a discrete piece of work that I'm happy to update on at another time, but I am still considering these things in the round.

In terms of identifying early intervention, I've already had conversations with the Deputy Prime Minister—First Minister, sorry—[Laughter.]—I translated in my head, didn't I—the Deputy First Minister, and the health Minister as well, because the key thing about this is that our childcare offer and health services, health visitors, and all the people who have key information about families and learners already exist in our system. The bringing together of that data and information to inform schools is a piece of work that we are doing. And interestingly—sorry, I've been waiting to share this all day—interestingly, one of the things we will need to identify is that baseline when learners are entering school, because a lot of the feedback from school is a concern around this. We are dealing with issues and needs that perhaps we haven't seen before. So, a clear understanding of that is a priority for us. So, we are looking to establish that baseline now for piloting then next year, as you will see in the planned timeline.

I have, following PISA last week, also had conversations with the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development. And this one is of particular interest for jurisdictions across the world, because doing this well, in a way that isn't too onerous for the professionals that have to engage at a school level, but does give you an early insight into the support that that child needs and from whom—. But also it's a method, particularly in our primary schools, for them to be able to demonstrate, across that school, that pupil's journey, the value they have added. And the start—. It's important to understand the starting point if you have expectations of the end point. So, that will be key, and there's a clear timeline around that, as there is about the national indicator at year 6, for, essentially, the same reason: where are we now at the end of primary school education? These, though, are going to—. It brings us back to the workload point in a way. I want to develop these measures using data and information that is in the system already. We have a lot of data. Teachers are used to the personalised assessments, for example. These are familiar structures, familiar data that we can use and draw down to inform these baselines. That means no new things, because that was a key consideration as well, because these have been developed with our system in mind and with a workforce that is familiar with them in mind.

You mentioned local authorities as well, and I have deliberately built this plan around five foundations. This is a way of bringing together, for the first time for nought to 16, all those who have a responsibility and knowledge of these children: families, parents and carers, local authorities, schools, support services—all those people who are part of our system, working together through a delivery board to show that we can make a difference to the learners in our system now. We can use data better. We will have targets that show us that our system is going in the right direction.

I've already had many conversations, even before I started in this new role, with leaders and teachers in our education system. This will be not unfamiliar for them, but it will also give them the clarity that they seek and that they are asking for increasingly, for them to have the confidence and for us to have the confidence, that there is a consistent understanding of what our expectations are across all local authorities across Wales.

When the detailed statutory guidance on those expectations is published later this term, you will see the level of detail in there, which I trust that people will find helpful. We will consult on that, because I intend it to be statutory guidance, but that is a significant piece of work that has been undertaken over the last four months, with the intention that it gives us as a system an understanding of the direction we're going in, what we need to see in classrooms across Wales, how do we give ourselves, all of us, confidence that we are going in the right direction, and bring teachers with us too. Diolch yn fawr.

Can I thank the Cabinet Minister for her statement today? I was very keen to be positive this afternoon, which I think is a good thing, because I can see many things in this plan that were begun during my time in Government under the last Labour Government: for example, the changes to personalised assessments, the development of age-related expectations, the clear prioritisation of literacy and numeracy, and the £20 million that we invested in grants for literacy and numeracy, including the CAL:ON programme, which I see you are remaining committed to in your plan. I'm very happy to see some of these initiatives repackaged into a plan under the new Government. What matters is that the work happens to benefit children and young people.

I do have some questions. My first is on the targeted review of Curriculum for Wales. I just wanted to ask if you could say a little bit more about what 'targeted review' means. I'm obviously very conscious that, towards the end of our time in Government, one of the areas Estyn flagged up as being a concern was the humanities. Is it your plan to pick off certain areas in order to review the curriculum in relation to that?

I took the decision to take Wales into TIMSS, the trends in international mathematics and science study, and PIRLS, the progress in international reading literacy study, the international primary school tests. I thought that that was the right thing to do, to do that international benchmarking. There was some resistance from some trade unions, but I was very clear that these would be a test of the Government rather than of schools. So, I just wanted to ask where TIMSS and PIRLS fit into this. Is it your intention to remain committed to TIMSS and PIRLS, and how will they inform the work that you are doing?

You've talked about setting targets for schools, and that's fine. Is it your intention to set a target for the Government? The statement refers to 'sustained improvement'. What is that going to look like? Are you going to be more concrete than that? Obviously, I'm conscious that you are discussing targets at a time when industrial relations are quite difficult with the teaching unions. As we know, the NAHT is out to ballot at the moment. What discussions have you had with trade union partners on these measures?

I wanted to ask specifically about mental health. As you know, it's something I'm particularly passionate about. Your plan includes a commitment to roll out the wraparound mental health support, starting from autumn 2026. I'm not at all opposed to new ways of supporting learners and families, but I do want to point out again that the school counselling toolkit, which was commissioned previously from the British Association for Counselling and Psychotherapy and which was designed to improve our counselling offering in Wales, which we already invest a huge sum of money in, and make that more consistent, has not been published. Is there an update on that? Because we really have to get the basics right in schools in terms of school counselling before looking to build on those.

And then my final point: in the plan, it says you've made a commitment to review the pupil development grant policy to improve how we allocate and fund it, monitor its use and impact and how we evaluate the success of grant funding, and the work on that starts in autumn 2026. That did come as a bit of a surprise to me, because I announced a review of the pupil development grant in December 2025, and the work on that was proceeding. So, is this a departure from that work? Is it a continuation of this work? And can I have an assurance that this work is not new, because it was meant to be under way from 2025? Thank you.

Thank you very much. Yes, a target for Government, that is what my intention is in establishing some of these expectations around, particularly, the year 6 indicator—that it is for us as a Government to assume the responsibility of Government around leadership of that improvement and be able—. We need to establish that baseline and then plot from there what a trajectory of progress will look like. And yes, I will be very happy to share that.

On a school level, what I expect to happen is professional conversations between the schools and local authorities and that they draw as well on support by organisations like CAL:ON, using this plan to understand how the learners in their care are improving their skills. I'm not returning to standard assessment tests or league tables or any—. I know some people find them deeply attractive; I find them replete with unintended consequences. What we want is to make a genuine difference in classrooms across Wales and hold ourselves as a Government to account for the progress we are making.

On TIMSS and PIRLS, yes, we are remaining in TIMSS and PIRLS at this point, and I'm looking forward to seeing what they show us when we have data from that. Because, obviously, if there is any data anywhere that will usefully inform us to do this better, then I'm very keen to interrogate that and use it. But I am also keen on intelligent accountability in our system and I'm sure that will resonate with a lot of the partners we have worked with over the years. Saying a thing doesn't make it so—you need to make it work at school level, you need to make it intelligently accountable, from their point of view and also from ours. We are trying to address issues in the Welsh system; importing things and applying them without thought does not work in that context. We need to make improvements here in our own context with our own learners.

You asked about mental health, and I will have to come back to you on the update, because I can't quite remember. But mental health is a key priority, because we know this is one of the reasons that impacts, for example, attendance. So, if we are to make a difference to these learners around literacy and numeracy, they will need to be in school to be able to access that. They will need the support to be able to engage with the curriculum. So that remains, we know, a pressing priority. And particularly post COVID, some of these issues are very—what's the word—profound for a lot of learners and that support will need to be there, if they are to be well supported and benefit from the plans we have.

There was a question then about reviewing the pupil development grant. I have made no decisions about that. But I am looking that everything we do supports the aims of this plan, and supports our workforce and every part of our education system to effect these improvements and to support them as individuals in it as well. Thank you.

Diolch.

Oh, targeted review. Sorry, I knew there was something else. Sorry. It was the curriculum review. It will be targeted. I am very keen that nobody in the system hears any intent on my part to depart from Curriculum for Wales and start with a new clean sheet of paper and involve us in another 15 years of a new curriculum. I don't think we need that. I have seen Curriculum for Wales make a genuine difference. It's an engaging curriculum, it's appropriate in that it values the widest possible range of educational competencies. Including putting the same value on humanities and expressive arts and numeracy is important, I think, particularly now. Somebody mentioned AI earlier on; the human development aspect of education is important, and we want to preserve that. Having said that, literacy and numeracy is the gateway into doing well in all of these areas and I think there is a genuine call for a greater element of clarity around some aspects of the curriculum, and that's what I'm discussing, as I'm going to put together a group of experts—I've spoken to 12 so far and I'm going to select a smaller group than 12, otherwise we'll be at it for five years—to look at a targeted review that will be helpful in the system without breaking the intent of Curriculum for Wales, and that's what I'm asking them to undertake. Diolch yn fawr.

Cabinet Minister, I'm sure you'd be fascinated to hear that I had a very interesting start to my day today, because I had the privilege of formally welcoming Logos Hope to Cardiff Bay, the ship that's docked here for three weeks. I would encourage all Members of the Chamber to take a visit, if you get a chance. It's the world's largest floating book fair. Now, I'm not sure how many floating book fairs there are, but this is the biggest one in the world. On that ship, there are around 350 volunteers of 50 different nationalities going around the world supporting children particularly with their literacy and education, and they do an incredible job.

But the reason I mention it now is that, in one of the contributions by the managing director on the ship today, he invoked the spirit of Griffith Jones and pointed out the literacy heritage that we have here in Wales and, of course, his work on the circulating schools in the eighteenth century, and the global reputation. There are over 50 nationalities on this ship and they recognise the heritage we have here in Wales around literacy in particular. It struck me, as I sat there, where we, sadly, find ourselves at the moment. You opened your statement by pointing to the fact that it's not all about PISA, but clearly the OECD are pointing to our downward trend at the moment in particular on reading and maths, and I know it's a wake-up call for you, but, in particular, it's a concern that parents have of children in schools and they recognise that far too many children are leaving school without the strong foundations that they need.

So, I wonder, as my first question to you, after years of promises to raise standards—and parents have heard this before and teachers have heard this before—what confidence can you give to parents and teachers that this plan will finally deliver the improvement that they've been waiting for? And let me point out, Cabinet Minister, the things that I am really supportive of on this here, in particular the focus on the nought-16 approach, I think that's very helpful; literacy and numeracy don't suddenly start when a child walks through the school gates, and we need to understand where children are starting from, track that progress and identify where support is needed before problems become entrenched. That goes back to that point around the parental involvement. I was really pleased to see, in your actual plan, foundation 1, which is the role of parents and carers, and let me encourage you to push as strongly as possible in that area, because we know the huge difference that good parenting and support at home can make to those children in their first few years. I also welcome the proposed year 6 indicator. If a child is struggling with reading and numeracy at the end of primary school, the secondary school needs to know that as best as possible, but good information sharing can make a real difference to that transition and to the support that children receive. So, I wonder if you would outline more clearly how the Welsh Government will ensure that this information actually leads to earlier and better support.

I do have some concerns, as I'm sure you'd expect, and some of those are around how this works in practice. I think colleagues have already mentioned the existing workload that teachers have, and I know you've responded to some of that. They don't want more paperwork, they don't want more bureaucracy, they don't want more sand in the system; they want this to work as smoothly as possible. So, I wonder, in your response to me, if you can give those reassurances that you recognise that again, and that, whilst we're asking schools to set ambitious targets, they'll be given the resources, training and support to be able to achieve this.

I also noticed in the opening of your plan document, Cabinet Minister, that you point out, and I'll quote here, that

'A sustained period of reform has taken its toll, and literacy and numeracy have been lost in the noise.'

You go on, though, to say that the new plan is deliberate—I can't say the word; my literacy skills need to be improved—

'deliberately iterative and will be subject to ongoing review and evaluation'.

Now, those two things, perhaps, seem to fight each other, and I wonder what assurances you can give to our schools that—. You pointed out that all this reform has taken a lot of energy in the system, but then go on to say that they'll be subject to ongoing review and evaluation. So, I think schools would want to know how are you going to get that tension right. How are you going to ensure that, whilst those reviews are important, actually, they need to be getting on with the job in hand?

I believe time is up, Deputy Presiding Officer, so I look forward to the response, but perhaps I have one moment. We cannot, of course, decouple literacy and numeracy outcomes from some basic expectations in schools. I questioned the First Minister earlier around how we're going to address classroom behaviours, because, for children to gain those literacy and numeracy skills, they need to be in the best place possible in the classroom around behaviours as well. So, I'd appreciate any response on that as well. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

Diolch yn fawr. I put 'deliberately iterative' in there just to trip people, probably including myself. It comes back to an earlier point that you made. It is important to keep an eye on the data that feeds our system. That's not quite the same thing as introducing new, big policy areas and the scale of reform, perhaps, we've had over the last 15 years. 

The previous education Minister mentioned PIRLS and TIMSS. We would be missing an opportunity if, as, say, a delivery board, we didn't, when they came, think about whether they might inform what we are doing. But to give us more information and more data, rather, because the planning itself, the expectations year-on-year—I think that has already been drafted with our literacy expert panel, for example—will be quite clear. But we want to keep an eye on this as time goes on and feed information into the system appropriately and well in order that we can make the progress we want to during this Senedd term. Education is a complex field, and we need to keep that conversation going. But I do think that understanding data, gleaning information from the system to inform our plan will be helpful rather than otherwise. If it proves unhelpful, I'm sure somebody will ask me about it at a later date, but that's certainly my intention.

Behaviour was touched on previously as well. Behaviour and support for learners are a key part of what we, as a Government, have prioritised in education. There is continued work that I can return to at a later date, perhaps, on the behaviour framework that seeks to bring services together to support schools as well, because some of those challenges can be difficult when you are also trying to focus on literacy and numeracy. So, that certainly will go hand in hand with this work as well.

Parents, yes, I agree, are part of this as well. Education, the schools system, cannot do this on its own. But I think it's also important to support parents with teaching reading and reading with their children. People are very pressurised. It can be difficult to find the time, but giving parents support around that is a key part of this plan as well. I think, frankly, I and others probably could do a better job at modelling our own reading. I'm very conscious that I read now less than I did, perhaps, 10 years ago—well, I know I do—so, I think there is a social element to this as well and how we model to other parents, but also to children that we too can read a book and put our phones aside occasionally.

Griffith Jones—coming back to Griffith Jones—is always a good thing. Catherine the Great, I think, took up his plans, didn't she, and exported them to Russia. A repeat of that would be really quite unsettling now. But I think this is an attempt as well to recharge. This is a social thing too. Everybody in our society needs to put a value on education if we're going to make a real difference. And I think allocating this responsibility just to schools, or just to parents, or any part of this system, is not going to be as powerful as everybody accepting that education is important—it is the thing that makes the difference to everybody in our society in Wales, and we all have a part to play in that. And we can thank Griffith Jones for showing us the way. Diolch yn fawr.

Minister, I warmly welcome the more central and clear role that the Government has identified for systematic synthetic phonics, and that won't be a surprise to you, I'm sure. I believe that there is a shared ambition across the Senedd to see this approach ensuring the best possible outcomes for our learners. If we want to embed systematic synthetic phonics effectively throughout Wales, as you've said, we also need to ensure that the conditions are right for it to succeed. And again, as you've mentioned, that means ensuring that the teachers have the confidence, the training and the professional development that they need, and that schools have access to high-quality resources, and that there is sufficient consistency in the way the approach is implemented across the system.

We heard in your response to Sam earlier about this, but I'd like to hear more, please, if I could, Minister, about how the Government intends to support schools and the teaching workforce in implementing the plan, particularly in terms of the expectations that the Government will set out in the guidelines and the support that will accompany those new guidelines, as well as the workforce impact assessment outlined in the documents received today. Thank you.

Thank you very much. I'm pleased that you focused on systematic synthetic phonics, because it is an opportunity to emphasise again that we do expect this to be an approach that will be adopted in our schools. I've discussed this with Estyn, who acknowledge that this approach is an important part of the way that learners do learn to read, and their particular focus on reading is also in place now. We are also looking at the curriculum guidance to ensure that there is clarity, because there has been some lack of clarity in terms of the use of this, and then we will put national guidance in place to explain that.

In terms of the support, that is also crucially important, and that is why one of the five elements that come together here focuses specifically on the support provided to teachers and to the system more broadly. So, there will be resources available through CAL:ON, who are specialists in this area. We will also continue to draw on the expertise of the expert literacy panel that we have. Adnodd is also working closely with Dysgu in order to create the resources required to support this programme. I think it has been encouraging that all of these organisations have made statements in support of this approach. So, it will be important that that support is in place. We do have the organisations in place as one of the five elements that have committed to working to ensure that that support is available. But also, as a Government, we're eager to get clarity in terms of those expectations within the system so that some of the ongoing arguments that we've had recently are less prominent, perhaps.

And finally, Catherine Cullen.

Diolch, Deputy Presiding Officer. I need to declare an interest: I was a teacher, and I have a close relative that is still one.

I'd like to thank the Cabinet Minister today, and I agree with many of the things in this statement, including raising standards within schools, considering the PISA results recently. What concerns me about the plan, though, is that it does not address the underlying problems of the Curriculum for Wales, which partly generated the problem to begin with. The teaching profession in Wales is racked by teacher retention problems, with 24.9 per cent—almost a quarter—of new teachers from the 2021 cohort no longer registered after five years. The Curriculum for Wales places immense pressures on newly trained teachers to generate their own bespoke lesson plans, to divert their already squeezed time away from the fundamentals of literacy and numeracy to immeasurable and abstract themes. So, when teachers are already under immense pressure, staying afloat by working unpaid hours into the evening, how do you expect teachers to find the time to deliver the foundational literacy and numeracy plan without scrapping the unnecessary excesses of the Curriculum for Wales?

Thank you very much for your question. I think that you would find that there are other views of the Curriculum for Wales also in the system and expressed by teachers. And I don't think, in terms of the workload either—. Even if I weren't wedded to it, and I am, even if I weren't, I think that beginning again with a new curriculum would create a whole host of other workload problems over time that we would find equally unpalatable, because you can't proceed without one at all. 

I would say, though, that there are elements, which is why I've announced a review, that require greater clarity and more focus, and that is a lesson that has clearly come back from the system. But, having said all of that, I think—. And this is interesting in the PISA conversation as well, because I have tried to interrogate the OECD a little bit more deeply about what this tells us about what we should do next, and answer came there none to say, 'Abandon your curriculum', because there is genuine interest, particularly now, and again with AI and thinking about how we prepare learners for what will be a requirement to be curious and learning for the entirety of their lives. Gone, if ever they existed, are, 'I am now a finished product at 21; I've gone through university and I have all of the qualifications I will ever need.' That's not the position that our learners are in now, so a curriculum that encourages them to see a value in expressive arts and humanities alongside mathematics, numeracy, language, literacy, reading—. All of these things are really important. We haven't, perhaps, supported our workforce enough to be able to work confidently with this curriculum, and that's why I want a review, but I'm afraid I don't agree with you that starting again would be a better answer. Diolch yn fawr.

Thank you, Cabinet Minister. 

Item 7 is next, a statement by the Deputy Minister for Social Care, Mental Health and Women's Health on putting women, babies and families at the heart of safety: the implementation of Call 4 Concern in maternity and neonatal services. I now call on the Deputy Minister for Social Care, Mental Health and Women's Health, Delyth Jewell. 

I want to begin by setting out clearly the Welsh Government’s ambition, and my ambition as Minister. We want every woman, baby and family in Wales to receive care that is safe, that is timely, that is compassionate and that is responsive to their needs. We want maternity and neonatal services that act early when concerns are raised. Above all, we want women and families to know that their voices matter. That ambition underpins the implementation of Call 4 Concern across maternity and neonatal services. I will explain briefly what this means for women, parents and families.

Call 4 Concern is a patient and family escalation system that gives people a clear way to raise urgent concerns if they believe their own health, or the health of a loved one, is deteriorating and they feel those concerns have not been fully addressed.

We know that women and families can often identify early signs or changes in behaviour that indicate something might be wrong. They might know when a mother is becoming increasingly unwell. They might see when a baby is behaving differently—perhaps it's feeding differently, or appearing unusually sleepy, or showing other concerning changes. Often, they will know when something doesn't feel right, and their concerns about a patient's deteriorating health must matter. When their concerns are raised, they must be heard, respected and acted on. That principle is at the centre of Call 4 Concern.

Patients and families can raise those concerns with staff and, if they remain worried, request further review through the escalation process. The same applies to women who are concerned about their own health during pregnancy, birth or the postnatal period.

This is an important milestone, Llywydd, in our journey to improve safety and strengthen maternity and neonatal care, ensuring women, babies and families are at the heart of decisions about their care. Call 4 Concern gives patients, parents and families that clear route to seek urgent help when they're worried. It gives them a stronger voice, and it's being introduced across adult, paediatric, maternity and neonatal in-patient services, so that this support is clear and consistent across the NHS in Wales.

Wales already has strong clinical tools to help staff to identify deterioration rapidly, through early warning scores such as the all-Wales maternity early warning score, the neonatal early warning trigger and track tools. Call 4 Concern provides an additional safeguard: that direct route for patients and families again.

The Welsh approach draws on lessons from pilots across the NHS in Wales, and it reflects international approaches like Ryan's rule in Australia, and aligns with the principles that underpin Martha's rule in England. It has two interconnected elements. Firstly, the patient wellness score, question or concern gives patients and families a structured way to say how they think someone is if they're worried. Secondly, patient and family initiated escalation gives them a way of escalating and further asking for clinical review if they remain concerned. Together, they will help to make sure that those concerns are not just heard, but they lead to action.

This is particularly important within maternity and neonatal services. Pregnancy, birth and the neonatal period should be positive experiences. They should be safe experiences for every family. And every day—it's important to say—dedicated NHS staff provide that safe and compassionate and high-quality care to women, babies and families across Wales. But when things go wrong, the impact can be devastating. That is why there can be no room for complacency. We have to keep learning from reviews, from inspections, from investigations and, above all, from women and families themselves.

Call 4 Concern reflects that commitment. It supports our wider programme of maternity and neonatal safety improvement, and it reinforces the principle that women and their families should be active partners in care.

This is not simply about introducing a telephone number or changing documentation. It's about culture. It's about creating an NHS where women feel that they have been empowered to raise concerns about their own health, where parents feel confident to speak up when they are worried about their baby's health, and where staff see those concerns as vital information for safer care.

Progress is already being made. Health boards and trusts are establishing local pathways, training staff and raising awareness, supported by the NHS Wales Performance and Improvement acute physical deterioration implementation network. Several organisations have already introduced key components of the programme.

Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board have already embedded patient wellness questions within existing early warning systems. This month, they will implement Call 4 Concern after further development of local communications and staff awareness materials, and they will be carrying out an audit to measure how consistently it’s being implemented.

And Cardiff and Vale University Health Board have implemented a neonatal standard operating procedure and have updated their documentation in that field, so that parental concerns about their baby’s health can be recorded. Staff education is also being delivered across perinatal services.

Cwm Taf Morgannwg University Health Board have undertaken extensive preparation work ahead of implementation, including the development of escalation pathways, operational procedures and staff awareness activities. Swansea Bay University Health Board have launched Call 4 Concern in maternity services, and have progressed implementation within neonatal services.

Llywydd, across Wales, multidisciplinary teams are working together to ensure how this is implemented reflects local service arrangements, and this is being supported by clear national expectations and ongoing engagement through national improvement networks. By July of this year, health boards and trusts were expected to implement their arrangements for documenting patient self-reported wellness, and to establish patient and family escalation systems within their acute in-patient settings. Further milestones will require organisations to demonstrate how they are reliably documenting patients' concerns about their health, and how they are embedding these arrangements consistently across services during the remainder of this year.

Importantly, the all-Wales maternity, neonatal and paediatric early warning systems already provide mechanisms to address patient and family concerns. This means the infrastructure for listening to women, parents and families is increasingly becoming part of routine clinical care. But this will build on that. It will provide better reassurance to mothers and families, and could ultimately help save lives.

Now, I recognise that this has to be implemented successfully, and it will therefore require strong clinical leadership. It will require multidisciplinary collaboration, and it will require a sustained focus, because safe care depends not only on professional expertise, but on effective partnerships between professionals, women and families. Women and their families have to be aware that the system is there. They have to feel empowered to use it if they need to. Call 4 Concern is aimed at ensuring that the voices of women, parents and families are recognised as an essential part of safe care, and that NHS organisations have systems in place to respond quickly.

This will not replace clinical judgment, or strong leadership, or safe services. That is not its purpose. But rather, it adds that vital safeguard, and gives women and families a clearer voice when they are worried. It strengthens our shared ambition for safer, more responsive and more compassionate care for women, babies and families across Wales. Diolch.

Thank you, Minister. I welcome the introduction of the Call 4 Concern for maternity and neonatal services. At its heart, this is actually a very, very simple principle. When a woman says something is wrong, we listen. When a family says something has changed, we listen. And when they remain concerned, there must be somewhere else for them to turn. As a woman, a mother of three children, and somebody who's also experienced the loss of a pregnancy, I know just how vulnerable a woman can feel when something does not feel right. And sometimes a woman cannot explain medically what is wrong, she just simply knows. Her partner or her family may notice something, that she just doesn't look right, or isn't behaving normally, or is becoming more unwell. Those concerns should never be dismissed simply because observations on a chart have not yet sounded the alarm. 

That is why I support the principle of Call 4 Concern. But, Minister, the success of the programme cannot simply be measured by whether every maternity unit has a telephone number or a poster on the wall. We have to measure what happens after somebody makes that call. Did somebody respond? How quickly did they respond? Was the woman seen by another member of her medical team? Did they find that her condition had got worse? Did her treatment change? And, most importantly, did that action prevent serious harm? Because those are the results that will tell us whether this policy is actually making women and babies safer.

We already know from the use of Call 4 Concern elsewhere in the Welsh NHS, as you've mentioned, that concerns raised by patients and families can lead to further medical checks and changes in this care. That demonstrates why listening matters. But it also raises another issue—we cannot have a postcode lottery in patient safety. Call 4 Concern has been introduced at different speeds across Wales, so I would ask the Minister today for a very clear commitment: by what date will every woman using in-patient maternity services and every family with a baby receiving neonatal care in Wales have access to the same Call 4 Concern service? And when that service is available across Wales, will the Welsh Government publish information for every health board showing the number of calls, how quickly they were answered, what action was taken, and what the outcome was? Because without that information, we simply cannot judge whether this is working.

There is another part of this that I believe is equally important—the way we treat people when they speak up. Call 4 Concern must never make a woman feel that she is being difficult, questioning a professional or causing trouble. A mother should never have to think twice about saying, 'Something isn't right with me. Something isn't right with my baby'. Staff, therefore, need to understand that a call for concern isn't an accusation against them, it's just another safety net. And sometimes the people sitting beside the hospital bed know better than anybody what that patient is feeling.

We continually hear that maternity and neonatal care should put families at its heart, and that the voices of women and families must be heard. Call 4 Concern gives us an opportunity to turn those words into something practical. But the service must be the same across Wales and have enough staff to run it properly. And we must check whether it is actually working. That's our jobs.

Minister, I welcome this initiative, but I would ask you to give us three things today: a clear date for when this will be available across Wales; a clear standard for how quickly a call for concern must receive a response; and a commitment to publish the results health board by health board. Because, ultimately, this isn't about another NHS initiative or another document—this is about something much more fundamental. If a woman tells us she is worried, we listen. If a family tells us something is wrong, we listen. And if they believe somebody is becoming more unwell, we must make it absolutely certain that somebody acts. Diolch.

Diolch, Claire. Firstly, I am so sorry for the experience that you have had. Thank you for sharing that, and I'm so sorry. There will be so many women who will have had similar experiences, too many women, and I am very sorry for that.

On what you said about there being a very simple principle at play here, I agree entirely. We have to listen to women and their families. Let's hope that there will be many occasions when something is raised and it's escalated, and then there isn't anything wrong. Fantastic. But it's about giving that reassurance, to be able to ensure that women and families are feeling listened to, that they are being believed, and that that is acted on quickly. No woman, no family, should ever feel that their concerns are being ignored or downplayed. gain,A I repeat that there are fantastic clinicians across our NHS who get this right every day. But any woman or family not getting that care in the way that they should is too many. So we need to be looking at how we can improve this.

I do agree with you as well that success can't ever be just about having posters up. It can't just be about a phone number existing. Success for this won't be measured by whether this exists—it's about whether it is used effectively, whether lessons are learned from those concerns that are raised when they are escalated, and that we learn as an NHS. There are lots of investigations that have happened, not just within Wales but across the UK, that we need to be continuously learning from, and we need to be learning from women and families' experiences too.

In terms of how we will be making sure that health boards learn those lessons and to make sure that it's being implemented effectively, all health boards and trusts are expected to meet the requirements that are set out in the Welsh health circular, and they will need to demonstrate that the arrangements are embedded and used reliably. We're going to be measuring progress against established NHS improvement governance and assurance mechanisms, and it will be made clear to health boards that if they are not meeting these, there will be clear remedial action. Absolutely, this can't be a postcode lottery.

In terms of the question you asked about—. By July of this year, this process was meant to have started, and it has in many of these health boards. In terms of whether that information can be published, whether people can be tracking this in real time, that's a very good question, and I'll take that away to see what is possible. There may well be reasons why, because of the sensitivity of the cases, things could not be published, but it's a good question, and I will take that away. Certainly, when I have more clarity about when we can give a final date about when everything is implemented consistently across Wales, I'll be able to update you. Diolch, thank you, for the tone and the openness that you brought to that, Claire. Diolch yn fawr iawn.

I'd like to thank the Deputy Minister for her important statement today. Care provided during pregnancy, birth and the first few weeks of a baby's life is critical for not only the babies and mothers, but also for the well-being of entire families. When women do not receive the care they need and deserve during this time, then the outcome is often very tragic. Call 4 Concern is an important system to ensure that people's voices are front and centre of their care, and this has a particular importance in maternity and neonatal services. As the Deputy Minister has pointed out, women and families are often the first to identify that something might be wrong.

Of course, Call 4 Concern only works if the workforce and services are able to act upon it. Last year, the previous Welsh Labour Government commissioned an all-Wales assurance assessment of maternity and neonatal services to assess the safety and quality of services. The voices and experiences of women and families were at the centre of that assessment, as they should be. It is their perspectives that are key to understanding the quality, safety and culture of these services. So, can the Deputy Minister provide an assurance today that the recommendations of the 'Path to Safer Beginnings' report will be fully implemented, supported by clear delivery timelines and transparent reporting?

Alongside identifying areas for essential improvement in maternity and neonatal services in Wales, the report highlighted the dedication and professionalism of the workforce. The Royal College of Midwives has identified workforce capacity as the most pressing challenge currently facing maternity services in Wales. This includes ensuring sufficient opportunities for newly qualified midwives, as well as improving the retention of experienced staff. These pressures will continue to impact the safety, quality and accessibility of care for women and families if action is not taken. Targeted investment in midwifery staffing, alongside improvements in workforce planning and retention, is an intervention that supports both immediate services and longer term sustainability.

Access to perinatal mental health and parent-infant services are vital for mental health and women's health. So, will the Deputy Minister confirm today the delivery and full funding of the perinatal workforce plan? In addition, maternity services also play a central role in supporting wider women's health. Ensuring maternity services are fully integrated into the delivery of the women's health plan will maximise the impact of both workforce investment and service improvement.

The preventative impact of maternity and neonatal services cannot be overstated. In recent decades, they have had to adapt to changing demands of care and shifting demographics. Women in Wales are generally giving birth at older ages, with around 55 per cent aged 30 or over, compared with 42 per cent in 2011. There's also been an increase in the number of pregnant women classed as being obese, as well as having a mental health condition. A strengthened partnership between the NHS, unions, patients and local government will be absolutely critical to meeting the shared challenges ahead. Mothers, babies and families should be in no doubt that they will receive the highest possible standard of maternity and neonatal care regardless of where they live in Wales.

Today, women and babies living in Cwm Taf Morgannwg University Health Board are not receiving visits and support from health visitors because they have been forced to go on strike. I know this comes under the Cabinet Secretary for health, but it's important to mention it here today when we're talking about listening to the concerns of women and families. I once again want to implore the Welsh Government to help resolve this dispute, as Plaid Cymru said they would do in opposition. Without staff, the Call 4 Concern system cannot work as intended across maternity and neonatal services. Medical interventions during birth have increased rapidly in recent years, and the proportion of caesareans has reached record levels. This increase has changed the demands being placed on maternity services, so I'd like to know what work the Government is doing to examine how services need to be adapted to respond to this changing demand. Diolch.

Diolch, Jayne. I agree with the point that you made in opening there, about the first few weeks of a baby's life being of essential importance in terms of not just their welfare, but the welfare of everyone around that baby, about the entire family. I know, from the role that you previously played, this is something very close to your heart as well, and I commend you for everything that you did in that role. I know it's something that is still really important to you.

In terms of the assurance assessment of neonatal services that women helped shape, as you're saying, yes, I'm very happy to confirm that the recommendations of 'The Path to Safer Beginnings' are indeed going to be implemented. I'm very happy to confirm that. Again, I know that there will be people who will be watching this who will say, 'Oh, yes, but they have reports and they have recommendations and they're accepted, but not enough changes'. We cannot get this wrong. This is something that transcends politics. This is about ensuring that more babies get the care that they need when they need it, and making sure that we learn from when things have gone so horrifically wrong. So, yes, that is something of absolute essentialness, if that's a word.

In terms of midwifery—and of course, the point you make is absolutely true—none of this will be possible without the fantastic staff who are helping women and families every day. I do recognise the pressures on the midwifery workforce with maternity services. They play that vital role in delivering safe and sustainable maternity care, of course. The Welsh Government does continue to invest in the education, the training, the retention of the workforce. As I've said, we are committed to delivering the recommendations on that as well from 'The Path to Safer Beginnings', and that includes developing a workforce acuity tool that reflects the current requirements in maternity services and a workforce model that's fit for the future. In the meantime, health boards have to plan, they have to deploy their workforce effectively using the current Birthrate Plus workforce planning tool, to ensure that those services are staffed safely and sustainably.

On the situation of midwifery graduates, I recognise the ongoing uncertainty that's facing so many of our newly qualified midwives. That, of course, is a situation that we inherited. But from the graduate summit that my colleague the health Minister had convened earlier in the summer, we're making sure that we are maximising employment opportunities, that we're working with Health Education and Improvement Wales and with NHS Wales to make sure that we are providing that practical support, that we're ensuring the lessons from this year's recruitment cycle can inform future workforce planning. But crucially, that every opportunity is maximised for those young people, and my thoughts are with them, absolutely.

Finally, the workforce plan is being developed. This will be part of the consideration in terms of perinatal mental health. This was something that was really important to my predecessor in this role, Steffan Lewis. I know, again, it's something that is really important to you. If ever it would be helpful—and I'd extend this to Members, to spokespeople, across the Chamber—to have a further meeting to discuss that in greater depth, I'd be really happy to do that. Diolch, Jayne. Thank you for that.

Can I thank you, Minister, for bringing forward this statement? Your passion about this subject is clearly evident, and it's something that is important to all of us. Every family has the right to expect that if they raise concerns at any stage, those concerns will be listened to, they'll be taken seriously and acted upon. The principle behind Call 4 Concern is therefore one that I think every Member in this Chamber can support.

However, with so many of these NHS initiatives, success will ultimately depend on the practical reality of implementation, hence the various similar questions we're all going to be asking of you. Minister, you have set out plans to roll out Call 4 Concern across Wales, and outlined work already under way across a number of health boards. That is a welcome ambition, but families expect the same standards of care regardless of where they live. Now, I wonder, Minister, can you explain how the Welsh Government will independently assess whether women and families are receiving that same experience of Call 4 Concern in every health board? I think you've partly answered that in an earlier question. It's so important that there is access to that same level of care, and it's important that there is a process put in place to measure that.

Minister, you've spoken about empowering women and families to raise concerns when they believe something is wrong, and that's absolutely the correct approach. But empowerment only exists if people know that the system is there in the first place. Too often, families have spoken about not knowing how to escalate concerns or challenge decisions at the time they were most worried. Simply creating a process does not guarantee that it will be used. Minister, you have acknowledged the importance of ensuring women and families are aware of the system and feel confident enough to use it. Can you therefore tell us how the Government intends to measure awareness amongst patients and families, rather than simply assume that the information has been provided?

Whilst I recognise your emphasis on culture change, culture alone does not provide rapid clinical reviews. If concerns are escalated and additional assessments are required, who will undertake those reviews? What additional workforce capacity has been made available to support this programme and what specific funding has accompanied its implementation? Staff across our maternity and neonatal services already work under considerable pressure, as we know. They continue to do an outstanding job in difficult circumstances, but patient safety initiatives cannot operate on goodwill alone.

Llywydd, whilst I welcome the introduction of Call 4 Concern, it is important that we do not lose sight of the wider context. The reason such measures are necessary is because recent reviews have revealed serious concerns about maternity services across Wales. The review into services in Swansea bay identified repeated failings in care, governance and culture, while the national maternity assessment found that further improvements remain necessary across Wales. The Welsh Conservatives support measures that strengthen patient safety and amplify the voices of women and families. However, today's announcement will ultimately be judged not by its intentions, but by its outcomes. Families from across Wales deserve to know that, wherever they give birth, whoever is providing their care and whatever concerns they have, their voice will be heard, their concerns will be acted on and their safety and that of their baby will always come first. Diolch.

Diolch, Peter. I think that there is an awful lot where there will be, I would hope, agreement across the Chamber on this, and that's come out in the fact that I think that it does no harm to be reinforcing those same questions, because it is something so important for us to be repeating things like this, in terms of the point you made that success is, again, in the implementation. It isn't about whether a system exists, it's about whether the system works, whether it is going to lead to further empowerment and improvements in safety, which, again, could even mean lives being saved. So, it's something of fundamental importance.

You asked about ensuring that we need to make sure that there isn't a postcode lottery. Absolutely. In terms of how we stop that from happening, the Welsh health circular sets out that clear national expectation for health boards and trusts. Of course local arrangements will need to reflect individual services, but that core requirement has to be the same across Wales. And in terms of how we monitor that progress, it's going to be supported through national improvement networks. It's going to be monitored through established NHS governance and assurance arrangements as well.

You talked about empowering women, and, again, I agree entirely with you. In terms of—and it's an interesting point—how we can make sure that they know that this is available, which is something that Claire raised as well, so, practically, the things that we can do, there's going to be information provided by health boards during care—information leaflets, posters, bedside information, discussions with staff. Because, again, we can't just put a poster on the wall and think, 'Oh, well, it's there now, people will have to read it.' This is a very stressful time in someone's life, and they're not necessarily going to be looking at the poster on the wall. That's why it has to be embedded in the culture of the NHS. And that's something that, again, we're going to have to keep under continual review to see how well that is working.

In terms of how we assess how well it's working, I've laid that out. But in terms of the question that you raised, which is a really good question: how can we measure awareness levels? Of course, to a certain extent, how often it is used will be that, but that's a very crude way of looking at it. I'm going to speak to officials about what else could be possible, because I think that's a really good question.

And you mentioned staff pressures. Now, I do recognise, and this is something that Jayne alluded to as well, that there are huge pressures facing staff. Of course, and I'm sure that they would agree, patient safety has to be the priority. And so that's why it's intended to strengthen existing deterioration escalation arrangements; it's not meant to create a separate service that runs alongside them. Health boards will have to ensure, of course, that those local pathways are practical, that they're understood clearly, that they're supported by appropriate clinical leadership. But again, we need to keep this under review.

And finally, Llywydd, Peter, you asked, I suppose, why this is happening now, in a way, in terms of the wider context that we need to be aware of. Call 4 Concern isn't a response to any single review or investigation. It forms part of a wider programme to improve maternity and neonatal safety. But, of course, this doesn't exist in a vacuum. This is very timely today with the news that's coming out from England. We have to learn from reviews. We have to learn from inspections, investigations. Most importantly, we have to learn from the experiences of women and the experiences of families and make sure that, as you say, outcomes and making sure that people's lives are better—. That's the ultimate test.

I really welcome today's statement on the expansion of the Call 4 Concern into maternity and neonatal services. And since being elected, I've heard from far too many families who have raised concerns about their own health or their partner's health, as well as that of their baby, but felt that they weren't listened to or taken seriously, as we've heard multiple times, and, as we know, sometimes with devastating consequences.

In preparation for today's statement, I've been made aware of staff working in adult in-patient wards in Cwm Taf Morgannwg, where Call 4 Concern is already in place, who have never heard of it. And I'm concerned that if staff aren't aware of the service, patients and families may not be either. So, I wonder if I could ask how the Welsh Government is working with health boards, and have a little bit more detail on that, to make sure that everybody involved, from the patient, families and staff, know about Call 4 Concern and have the information and training, and also how we make sure that families feel able to escalate those concerns without worrying that they're being difficult, or that it will affect their care. Diolch.

[Inaudible.]—vitally important. Because of where the microphone is, I'm sorry that I'm having to have my back to you. It's very awkward about the Chamber. No family, no parent should ever be made to feel that they are being difficult when they are worried about the health or the condition of their baby, or indeed a mother about her own health, as we're talking about here as well. But again, if we are going to be embedding this and changing the culture of areas and pockets—and this is pockets, of course, but any pockets are too many pockets with this—then we have to make sure that women feel— 

that they are being empowered—

—that women feel that they are truly empowered to be able to use their voice, and to feel more certain that their voice is going to be listened to.

I am concerned—. Okay, I will take that away, the point that you said about the lack of awareness among some members of the workforce. As I say, this is being rolled out at different timetables slightly over a period of weeks with different health boards, but would you mind writing to me with some of those specifics so I can look into that? That would be really—. Obviously, this is something for local health boards to do, but it would just be useful for me to get a flavour of where, perhaps, we need to be aware of what might be happening. So, that would be really useful for me.

But again, just to say that our ambition isn't simply for people to know about Call 4 Concern, but for them to feel confident in using it, and safe in the knowledge that their concerns are going to be taken seriously. That should never prejudice their care. Thank you so much for raising that. Diolch, Sara.

Thanks, Deputy Minister. It's a really serious thing that you've brought to our attention with postpartum. The maternity and birth statistics for 2025 show that 35 per cent of pregnant women in Wales report a mental health condition at initial assessment. Cwm Taf Morgannwg health board had the highest rate in Wales at 39 per cent. Deterioration in mental health during pregnancy or the postnatal period can be extremely rapid. One of the main clinical messages from MBRRACE-UK, in the report last year, was that it's important to recognise and act on red flags in maternal mental health, including significant change in mental state, thoughts or acts of violent self-harm, expression of incompetence as a mother, or estrangement from the infant. Could a call for concern in maternity services be made where the concern is psychiatric deterioration, including postpartum psychosis, acute suicide ideation, or a sudden change in behaviour?

Diolch, Gareth. I know the expertise that you bring to this area as well, so thank you for sharing that. Certainly we need to be learning from MBRRACE-UK on this. My understanding is that acute psychiatric problems, like what you've set out, would be covered by this. Again, it's making sure that this supplements and complements the support that is already there, that it doesn't look to sit alongside it. If a family member in the kind of situation that you are outlining notices something about the mother, that their mental health is deteriorating, they will be with them possibly every day, they will be with them hour after hour. They will see that deterioration in a way that a clinician might not, because they haven't seen them for as long. So, this is vitally important and this is something that I'm really passionate about. And I know that you're not just passionate about this, but you have an awful lot of expertise in this area as well. I really appreciate the fact that you've raised this because, absolutely, we can't afford to get this wrong. This is about women's lives. So, thank you for raising that.

Diolch yn fawr to the Deputy Minister for her statement today. I'd like to start by sharing a constituent's experience. Megan Lewis is a recent midwifery graduate from the University of South Wales, and despite graduating with a first-class honours degree, Megan and 62 other graduates have been told that there are no band 5 vacancies for them. In her own words, Megan says, ‘We are being told we are not needed, but we are needed. I see it with my own eyes. The staff see it, the women and the families—we all see it.’

Safe staffing is not optional. I recently wrote to Cardiff and Vale health board who told me that they do not anticipate any vacancies in the near future, and are currently over-established by around 20 whole-time equivalent midwives. It feels like there's a disconnect between the experience on the ground and the staffing levels that health boards are required to maintain. The upcoming national workforce plan announced by the Government does present a valuable opportunity to shape the future of the workforce, so I wondered if the Deputy Minister could just give some clarity on how this will improve the way staffing demand and the commissioning of training courses will be aligned with each other.

Diolch, Zaynub, and thank you for your advocacy with this issue as well. This has come up already and I'll say again that I know that there are concerns about how reported staffing levels don't always reflect the pressures that are being experienced on the ground, and as you've alluded to, the 2026 student streamlining process has highlighted how vitally important it is that we ensure workforce planning, education commissioning and service requirements are closely aligned. Now, of course we need to learn lessons from that for future cohorts, but we vitally need to be supporting those graduates today—Megan and her fellow graduates. They are needed. Of course they are needed, and as a Government, we are doing everything that we can to maximise those employment opportunities, working again with HEIW and NHS Wales. I can only begin to imagine how difficult this time will be for Megan and for her fellow graduates. It is something that we absolutely are taking incredibly seriously. And, of course, this is feeding into the workforce plan.

In terms of our response to ‘The path to safer beginnings in Wales’ report, we're already working with NHS organisations to develop the future maternity workforce security tool that I mentioned earlier, which reflects better the complexity of care, where the future service demands are going to be, workforce requirements. And in that meantime period, health boards have to, of course, deploy their workforce effectively with the existing mandated planning tool Birthrate Plus. But, look, this is something that is hugely, hugely important, and the thoughts of everyone in this Chamber are going to be with that cohort, and I thank you, and other Members as well, for raising their concerns. They are needed. Thank you.

Finally, Francesca O'Brien.

Diolch, Lywydd. And thank you, Deputy Minister, for your statement. I have to give my own personal experience, which is somewhat a little bit different to many families. It was a really positive one and a really precious one, the way it should be. I gave birth in Singleton Hospital to two healthy boys in what they describe as a giant hot tub, but I have reminded them that it's not quite as relaxing as they do make out. But that to one side, I wish all mums and families had that same experience, but I can't ignore what other families do go through.

In May last year, Llais found that 76 per cent of women and families who used the same maternity services as I did at Singleton reported a negative experience or failures in their care. Two months later, families published their own review because, in their words, their trust in the health board had broken down completely. They identified failures in escalation, which we've discussed this afternoon. The independent review, published the very next day, found repeated failures in care, and complaints handling that simply wasn't good enough. Those services are still in level 4 intervention. So, Deputy Minister, what specific actions will you take to ensure escalation routes will work, when the last one failed? Because I'd love more women, families and babies to have the same experience as I did—maybe not always in the hot tub, but a better experience. Thank you.

Thank you for raising that. Look, I'm really glad that you had that positive experience. It should, like you say, be a precious experience for every family or every individual, and, too often, it isn't, of course, and I feel that we need to keep repeating that, for the vast majority of families, they will have a wonderful experience and life-changing in a fantastic way. For too many families, they have a life-changing experience in another way, and not just our thoughts, our action here has to be making sure that we are helping them. We have to learn from every investigation, whether that's in our own health boards, whether that's from investigations that are happening that are commissioned on a greater level, nationally, sometimes in other countries as well.

In terms of, as I've said, how we make sure that the escalation processes are followed, this has to sit alongside the tools that already exist, to complement them as that safeguard, so that it is yet another check and balance, and, crucially, it's a platform to make sure that women get their voice heard, that families get their concerns raised. As I've said, existing governance assurance arrangements are going to be used to make sure that we are monitoring this properly. But if I could say finally, Dirprwy—. Forgive me, I downgraded you then, sorry. If I can say finally, Llywydd—it's the first day back—that every family, every woman deserves to have the fantastic care that you've just set out. I can only imagine that this will have been a difficult statement for many families to listen to, and you are going to be in our thoughts as well. We have to get this right. And I really welcome the tone that everyone in the Chamber has taken this afternoon. Diolch. Diolch, Lywydd.

Thank you very much, Deputy Minister. That brings today's proceedings to a close. Thank you, all.