Y Pwyllgor Cyfrifon Cyhoeddus a Gweinyddiaeth Gyhoeddus

Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee


Aelodau'r Pwyllgor a oedd yn bresennol

Committee Members in Attendance

Cefin Campbell AS
Mark Isherwood AS Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor
Committee Chair
Mike Hedges AS
Natasha Asghar AS
Rhianon Passmore AS

Y rhai eraill a oedd yn bresennol

Others in Attendance

Adrian Crompton Archwilydd Cyffredinol Cymru
Auditor General for Wales
Matthew Mortlock Archwilio Cymru
Audit Wales

Swyddogion y Senedd a oedd yn bresennol

Senedd Officials in Attendance

Claire Griffiths Dirprwy Glerc
Deputy Clerk
Fay Bowen Clerc
Joanne McCarthy Ymchwilydd
Martin Jennings Ymchwilydd
Tom Lewis-White Ail Glerc
Second Clerk

Cofnodir y trafodion yn yr iaith y llefarwyd hwy ynddi yn y pwyllgor. Yn ogystal, cynhwysir trawsgrifiad o’r cyfieithu ar y pryd. Lle mae cyfranwyr wedi darparu cywiriadau i’w tystiolaeth, nodir y rheini yn y trawsgrifiad.

The proceedings are reported in the language in which they were spoken in the committee. In addition, a transcription of the simultaneous interpretation is included. Where contributors have supplied corrections to their evidence, these are noted in the transcript.

Cyfarfu'r pwyllgor drwy gynhadledd fideo.

Dechreuodd y cyfarfod am 14:00.

The committee met by video-conference.

The meeting began at 14:00. 

1. Cyflwyniad, ymddiheuriadau a dirprwyon
1. Introduction, apologies and substitutions

Thank you. Prynhawn da, croeso. Good afternoon and welcome to the first meeting of the Senedd's Public Accounts and Public Administration Committee, in this, the Senedd's sixth term. Can I start by welcoming members of the committee to the meeting, and take this opportunity to ask you all, please, to introduce yourselves and advise in your introduction which constituency or region you represent for the record? We'll perhaps start with Cefin, as the newest member. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Cadeirydd. Ie, Cefin Campbell. Dwi'n cynrychioli Plaid Cymru yn rhanbarth Canolbarth a Gorllewin Cymru.

Thank you very much, Chair. Yes, I'm Cefin Campbell. I represent Plaid Cymru in the Mid and West Wales region.

I represent Plaid Cymru on the regional list for Mid and West Wales.

Diolch, Cefin. Perhaps Natasha, as also the equally newest member.

Thank you so much, Chair. Good afternoon, everybody. My name is Natasha Asghar. I am the Welsh Conservative Member for South Wales East. I'm very happy to be here amongst all of you today and I look forward to working with you over the next five years. 

Thank you very much, Chair, and it's a delight to be able to sit back on the newly mandated former Public Accounts Committee, and I'm sure we will work very productively together to examine the finances throughout the mandate of this committee. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Rhianon. And last but very much not least, an old colleague, Mike Hedges.

Mike Hedges, Labour Member for Swansea East and a long-term member of this committee, with only a small interruption.

Thank you very much, Mike. I'd like to place on record how honoured I am to have been elected to chair this influential committee, the duty of which is to ensure that the billions of pounds of tax paid by our hard-working public are not wasted, and to hold to account all those responsible for spending that money. Our key audience is the public, the people of Wales, and we have a vital role in instilling public confidence in how public money is being spent and in securing better value for money. So, I look forward as Chair of this committee to fulfilling these responsibilities with its members.

No apologies for absence have been received for this meeting. Do Members have any declarations of registerable interests they wish to declare at this point? I'll take silence as 'no interests to declare'.

Before we begin, can I just check finally that everyone understands how to indicate if they wish to speak? Again, I'll take silence as confirmation. Diolch. Thank you. Simultaneous interpretation is available from Welsh into English, using the downloaded Zoom application. Interpretation does not work when accessing the meeting through an internet browser. Attendees who want to hear the English interpreter when Welsh is spoken should ensure that 'English' is selected from the interpretation menu option at the bottom of the Zoom application window. Attendees who do not require interpretation should ensure that 'off' is selected from the interpretation menu.

2. Sefydlu pwyllgorau a’u cylchoedd gorchwyl
2. Establishment and remits of committees

I move to item 2 on our agenda today, to discuss the committee remit. Members should have had a supporting paper. The committee was established on 23 June to carry out the functions set out in Standing Orders 18.2 and 18.3 to consider any other matters that relate to the economy, efficiency and effectiveness with which resources are employed in the discharge of public functions in Wales. The committee may scrutinise any other matter relating to the machinery of government, including the quality and standards of administration provided by the Welsh Government civil service and Welsh Government-sponsored bodies. Do Members at this point have any comments or questions? I can't see any indications of comments or questions, so I thank Members for that. And then, formally, are Members therefore content to note the committee's remit? Diolch. Thank you very much indeed.

3. Cynnig o dan Reol Sefydlog 17.42 i benderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o’r cyfarfod
3. Motion under Standing Order 17.42 to resolve to exclude the public from the meeting


bod y pwyllgor yn penderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o weddill y cyfarfod yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 17.42(ix).


that the committee resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix).

Cynigiwyd y cynnig.

Motion moved.

Well, that takes us to item 3 on the agenda, which is a motion under Standing Order 17.42 to resolve to exclude the public from the meeting for item 4 of today's business. I propose, therefore, in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix), that the committee resolves to meet in private for item 4 of today's meeting. Are all Members content? Thank you. Well, I see that all Members are content. The motion, therefore, will be deemed agreed by the committee. If we could go into private session, please.

Derbyniwyd y cynnig.

Daeth rhan gyhoeddus y cyfarfod i ben am 14:05.

Motion agreed.

The public part of the meeting ended at 14:05.